North Carolina Teacher Fired for Antiwar Remarks

[Malachi151]

http://www.commondreams.org/news2003/0912-12.htm

WINSTON-SALEM, NC - September 12 - Carolina teacher Elizabeth Ito has appealed her firing from Forsyth Technical Community College, which came after she made remarks critical of the conduct of the war in Iraq. Her firing, which has been widely criticized by local anti-war activists and free speech advocates, is seen as part of a larger crack-down on dissent and academic freedom. "It is clear that Elizabeth didn't lose her job because she expressed a personal opinion in the classroom," said Liz Seymour, a member of the Ito Defense Coalition. "She lost her job because of the opinion she expressed."
On Friday, March 28, 2003 Elizabeth, a first-year English teacher at Forsyth Tech, spent ten minutes at the beginning of her business writing class voicing her concerns about the war in Iraq. During this time the US military was encountering much unanticipated resistance in its push toward Baghdad and the previous night's news had reported that 30,000 more troops were being called up, a figure that by the next morning had risen to 120,000. Elizabeth wrote these numbers on the board and asked the students what they would do if the government had to start drafting. After class had ended two students complained to Elizabeth's supervisor Susie Keener, Chair of the Department of Humanities/Communication, that Elizabeth had criticized the war in class.

[Occasional Chemist]

Originally posted by Malachi151
http://www.commondreams.org/news2003/0912-12.htm



Hotbeds of liberalism, these college campuses are!

Now should this teacher have taken up ten minutes of a business writing class talking about Iraq? No - unless the students were doing a writing assignment about it. The class, after all, is likely to be only fifty minutes long.

Firing, though, for a first offense of something like this? Bah! The college is out of line. Nothing will come of it, because the faculty member was probably on "probation" - which means they can get rid of you for anything or nothing.

(The article's sketchy on the details, so I'm assuming that this was on class time.)

[Furious]

http://www.communityforpeace.net/elizabethito.htm (In her own words)

We're just getting her side of the issue at the moment, as the OP's article is simply rehashed from her own story.

Getting into a shouting match with your students is unprofessional when it is on the student's dime, regardless of the reason.

I don't know if she should have gotten fired for one incident, but my guess is that there is more to this story.

[Kodiak]

No right is absolute, and employers often put restrictions on our rights as a condition of employment.

Is the school overreacting? Probably, but that is their right.

Besides, it sounded less like an educational debate or discourse and more like a ranting diatribe.

[Agammamon]

Originally posted by Occasional Chemist
Hotbeds of liberalism, these college campuses are!


How old was that issue of Time?

[Trollbane]

Atleast according to that I could think of a few other reasons to fire a teacher in May, almost two months after the incident and pretty close to summer vacation. Maybe she was a temporary just hired to help out on a busy spring or something.

[boooeee]

Originally posted by Agammamon
How old was that issue of Time?

Look, midget hippies. Let's skin 'em.

[DanishDynamite]

Kodiak:No right is absolute, and employers often put restrictions on our rights as a condition of employment.

Is the school overreacting? Probably, but that is their right.Overreacting? To what? Suppose she had spent 10 minutes discussing the latest advances in space science. Would you feel likewise? What does her 10 minutes discussing current events have to do anything? Her dismissal is ridiculous.
Besides, it sounded less like an educational debate or discourse and more like a ranting diatribe. Hard to tell without a transcript. And if it was a "diatribe", so what? How does that reflect on her ability to teach her course?

[ssibal]

Originally posted by DanishDynamite
Kodiak:Overreacting? To what? Suppose she had spent 10 minutes discussing the latest advances in space science. Would you feel likewise? What does her 10 minutes discussing current events have to do anything? Her dismissal is ridiculous.
Hard to tell without a transcript. And if it was a "diatribe", so what? How does that reflect on her ability to teach her course?

The problem is that the students are paying money for whatever course it was. If talking about Iraq or advances in space science was off topic, the school has every right to take disciplinary action. Perhaps she should have gotten a warning instead.

[Malachi151]

Originally posted by ssibal


The problem is that the students are paying money for whatever course it was. If talking about Iraq or advances in space science was off topic, the school has every right to take disciplinary action. Perhaps she should have gotten a warning instead.

That's obviously an absurd, typical justification response. Anyone can justify anythign if they want to try hard enough.

Maybe you have never been to school, I dunno, but onbiously taking 10 minutes out of a day for year to discuss something is no grand waste of time. I had teachers spend more time then that talking about sports in class sometimes.

Its apparent that the TOPIC is what was at issue, not the time spent.

Firstly, this is a school, and place of learning. Heaven forbid that teachers actually engage their students in thought on... the most important topic in the world at the time...

"I remember when I was in school" when something really important happened, like the explosion of the space shuttle Discovery, we talked about it as a class for quite some time. Heaven forbid that our math teacher talked to us about that!

Are these students not going to be prepared for life because they missed 10 minutes of business lecture?

We are all human beings, and a school is a forum for communication and expression of ideas. The war in Iraq is the most important thing that has happened in the world in arguably the past 20 or 30 years ti expect teachers not to discuss it is absolutely absurd.

Horrible to think that we may have people commnicating with each other on a personal level huh?

This is real life we are talking about, the "real world". If a teacher, no matter his or her course is in, cannot take 10 minutes out of a day to express their views on a subject as important to life and humanity itself as war then what F*ing good is any school or any class?!

People really need to get their priorities straight. :(

[ssibal]

Originally posted by Malachi151
People really need to get their priorities straight. :(

Maybe you should get your priorities straight. This is not high school or elementary school we are talking about, it is college. Students usually have to pay for their classes in college. When you pay for a calculus class, the teacher better spend their time teaching you calculus and not what they think about sports or Iraq or whatever else. If a college student wants to hear a teacher speak about Iraq then they should take a political science course. And yes, the topic was the issue because it was OFF-TOPIC!

[Jessica Blue]

The best teachers encourage their students to think, whether it's in a business writing or philosophy class. It depends on whether she was actually imposing her views or merely raising points and issues and throwing them out for discussion.

Business writing sounds very dull...what does it involve? "Dear Sir Madam, Thankyou for your shipment of paper clips...?"

It said in the link she was a first year English teacher, so perhaps the discussion was to stimulate interest and thought, not indoctrinate.

Elizabeth wrote these numbers on the board and asked the students what they would do if the government had to start drafting?

That's a fair question for an English teacher to ask.


It was also mentioned that "she had been commended for her teaching in a series of official reviews throughout the year"...so whether her war discussion was relevent or not, the dismissal was heavy handed to say the least.

[peptoabysmal]

I get the feeling that Ms. Ito was on about this whenever she had an audience.


Ito, who was in her first year as a full-time instructor, never tried to hide her opposition to the war. She wore a black armband to class. As class sessions were winding up or winding down, students occasionally engaged her in discussion about it.

Then, on March 28, angered by news reports that the United States planned to send more soldiers to Iraq, Ito walked into her business-writing class, closed the door and said, "I guess we're going to liberate the Iraqis even if it means killing every damned one of them."

"You could call it a rant, you could call it in an invective," Ito acknowledges. "I admitted I didn't do a good job. That's not a point of contention."

Two students walked out of class that day and complained to Susan Keener, the chairman of the humanities and communication department. At least one said that Ito had shouted down any student with a viewpoint different from her own.

School officials met with Ito and said their concern centered on her use of class time for unrelated discussion.


Story (http://www.wral.com/news/2457779/detail.html)

[Rayn]

That doesn't sound like encouraging discussion ...

[shuize]

Ah, a hard-core business writing teacher. That must make for an incredibly boring combination. I'd be at a loss to say which would be worse ... more stupid politics in an unrelated business class or more instruction on how to write really catchy business memos from a wanna-be radical ...

And speaking of nutball Japanese, here's a story that ought to make you puke up your lunch: http://209.157.64.200/focus/f-news/977404/posts

But hey, like they say, "You're only as young as you look ..." No, I mean, "You're only as ugly as you act ..." Wait, how does that go? Here it is, "You're only as dumb as a drunk Frog would have to be to want to cut the clothes off a 70 year-old has-been."

[Kodiak]

Originally posted by ssibal


The problem is that the students are paying money for whatever course it was. If talking about Iraq or advances in space science was off topic, the school has every right to take disciplinary action. Perhaps she should have gotten a warning instead.

Exactly. Thank you for clarifying/expanding on my point.

[RCNelson]

I noticed this from the article (http://www.wral.com/news/2457779/detail.html):
According to Ito, officials wanted her to pledge never to bring up the war in class again. She said she told John Slade, the dean of arts and sciences, that she had no intention of revisiting the topic, but she was not willing to make a promise.

[pgwenthold]

The litmus test here is whether she would have received the same treatment had she spoke in favor of the war effort.

Suppose she wore a flag pin on her lapel, and would spend ten minutes at the beginning of class praising the war effort? Would she have been asked to stop?

[DavidJames]

"Suppose she wore a flag pin on her lapel, and would spend ten minutes at the beginning of class praising the war effort? Would she have been asked to stop?"

I don't know but if they had, I wonder if we would be hearing about rampant liberalism in our colleges and squashing of conservative free speech. Of course, not by those defending these actions in this thread ;)

[Occasional Chemist]

Originally posted by pgwenthold
Suppose she wore a flag pin on her lapel, and would spend ten minutes at the beginning of class praising the war effort? Would she have been asked to stop?

Given my experience in the South Carolina college system, I'd have to answer that one "no".

Ditto for the microbiology instructor that tests his students on the "evidence" against evolution (e.g. Behe's book, a supposed lack of transitional fossils, etc.).

Southern two-year colleges are not exactly known for their liberalism. For that matter, neither are Southern four-year colleges.

[Occasional Chemist]

Originally posted by DavidJames
I wonder if we would be hearing about rampant liberalism in our colleges and squashing of conservative free speech.

I'll consult my Magic 8 Ball...

"Signs point to Yes"

[Leroy]

Now should this teacher have taken up ten minutes of a business writing class talking about Iraq? No - unless the students were doing a writing assignment about it. The class, after all, is likely to be only fifty minutes long.


When I was in school we had a math teacher who used at least ten minutes a day to talk about the Cincinnatti Reds, yes, the reds! We had an english teacher that talked about music and his love of Patsy Cline, he even played some of his favorite songs :rolleyes:

Our Science teacher often spent class time talking about our football team and ways to improve their game :rolleyes:

Our Social Studies teacher spent a lot of time in class talking about "the good ol days" his farm, how his crop was doing, etc.

College wasn't any different.

She was discussing Current Events, where is the crime in that?

[Leroy]

Originally posted by pgwenthold
The litmus test here is whether she would have received the same treatment had she spoke in favor of the war effort.

Suppose she wore a flag pin on her lapel, and would spend ten minutes at the beginning of class praising the war effort? Would she have been asked to stop?

I'd be willing to bet a hugh sum of money that she would not have been asked to stop. If she had openly condemned war protestors with the same passion she used to condemn this war, I would wager a hugh sum of money that she would never have been scolded, and never filed.

[Trollbane]

What is actually the connection between getting fired and her outburst? Should critisizing the government give you immunity from getting sacked for a certain period of time and what that time should be? For all I can see from that article is that she was fired nearly two months after the incident for something.. Maybe the class/course she was teaching was discontinued or maybe the school had to cut spending.