So where/when does this all end?

[cludgie]

Something got me thinking tonight. So i'm going to ramble on for a bit now but i'll be asking a question at the end...

I've been chipping into 9/11 threads for a good few years now on another board as well as occasionally chipping into ones on here. I think its safe to say that in the last 12 months especially that the loons have lost a wee bit of interest. Now I find myself answering the same old tired crap like its almost some kind of purgatory. No new wild ideas anymore, just the same old rubbish. The last anniversary of 9/11 seemed to signal alot of nutters dropping out of the game. So who is left on the side of woo?

Now given that Bush's tenure at the White House is nearing an end I think we're going to lose a fair chunk of the 'anyone but Bush' brigade at that point.

The people riding the gravy train are a funny case. It seems like the LC crowd (Avery especially) are slowly backing out of it as the cash dries up. I suppose the likes of Griffin and Alex Jones might be around for a bit longer and Steven Jones is rapidly moving towards the status of 'remember him?' territory. Gage too seems well into his death throes. Suffice to say though there isn't a whole lot new coming out of any of the 'movement leaders' and frankly there hasn't been for a while now. Those involved are either standing still or backtracking.

I expect the nutters who see Israel/Jews behind all evil in the cosmos will keep running with it, probably forever. After all, some of them are still going on about how the Holocaust never happened 60 years on so I doubt this one will get dropped anytime soon either. After all, when you're preaching the religion of 'stupid' then who needs fresh evidence?

So I see the overall crowd for this kind of thing dwindling further. However, there will (like pretty much any conspiracy theory you can name) always remain that small hardcore banging on about it for a long time yet.

So I ask, at what point do you think you'll turn round and say "sod this, I can't be bothered with talking to these morons anymore"?

[tomwaits]

Jim Garrison was selling books until the day he died, despite making a complete fool of himself and ruining innocent peoples' lives.

[cludgie]

Jim Garrison was selling books until the day he died, despite making a complete fool of himself and ruining innocent peoples' lives.

Well exactly. What i'm asking though is do you intend to keep supplying the other side of the argument until that point or do you think "bugger it, i'll leave the idiots to it"?

[tomwaits]

Well exactly. What i'm asking though is do you intend to keep supplying the other side of the argument until that point or do you think "bugger it, i'll leave the idiots to it"?

Sorry, I didn't read the OP close enough.

I basically have already made that decision. Years ago, it was important to debunk the CTs because there were many people who were falling for it. However it didn't take long before the grand majority learned that the claims were unfounded and that the leaders of the movement were charlatans or mentally ill. But nowadays, arguing with them is a lesson in futility.

However, I still like to read it as entertainment. Seeing someone back themselves into a corner and refuse to accept defeat despite having all their arguments crushed is pure fun, especially when they have to keep coming up with secret or magical reasons why none of the evidence is on their side.

But let's face it. The only recent incident involving trutherism that people paid attention to was "don't taze me bro!" and it certainly wasn't for the reason that truthers would like.

[stateofgrace]

Will it ever end?

In my opinion, no it will not. It will certainly dwindle, but it will never end. As long as there is money to be made from exploiting the gullible it will continue. As long as people are prepared to buy into it , with not only their time but cash there will always be a market for this type of exploitation and ultimately that is all it is. It is simply cashing in on peoples genuine questions, twisting it all and sucking the gullible into their cause. It is tantamount to cultism, whereby once you are drawn into it is almost impossible to escape. It simply fuels itself by those who really want it to be true, irrespective of anything that simply destroys their beliefs.

It may die down, as Bush leaves office or maybe as troops withdrawn from Iraq, but sadly I feel that it will never go away because as long as there is a demand for this rubbish people will cash in on that demand and provide it.

It is simply demand and supply.

[Stellafane]

I used to liken the end-stage of CT movements to white dwarves, stars that have used up all their primary fuel and now exist as small, dense, dim shadows of their former selves, and that although tiny and insignificant will exist for a long time. I now think that neutron stars are a more apt analogy to CTers -- both are made of degenerate matter (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degenerate_matter).

[Tweeter]

The last anniversary of 9/11 seemed to signal alot of nutters dropping out of the game. So who is left on the side of woo?

You must live a sheltered life. Its growing! Nutters like the Japanese Parliament are starting to ask questions. Films are being shown in the heartland of America. Go to youtube and read some of the remarks. Its at least ten to one for the nutters. Most against sound like the same exact person with multiple accounts IMO. Anyways keep up the good work, its funny to see yall getting clowned by the majority.

[tomwaits]

It's growing, eh? How do you figure?

[HereticHulk]

If impeachment hearings would start against Cheney, I think there would be A LOT of people that would come forward with some stories that would never see the light of day otherwise.

Wexler wants hearings ya know. He even has a website set up to have people sign his petition.

[stateofgrace]

You must live a sheltered life. Its growing! Nutters like the Japanese Parliament are starting to ask questions. Films are being shown in the heartland of America. Go to youtube and read some of the remarks. Its at least ten to one for the nutters. Most against sound like the same exact person with multiple accounts IMO. Anyways keep up the good work, its funny to see yall getting clowned by the majority.

Are they?

The entire Parliament?

[tomwaits]

If impeachment hearings would start against Cheney, I think there would be A LOT of people that would come forward with some stories that would never see the light of day otherwise.


Can I read this as a prediction that witnesses will start coming out with truther stories as soon as bush and cheney leave office?

Wexler wants hearings ya know.

What does this have to do with 9/11?

He even has a website set up to have people sign his petition.

yep, online petitions. They really mean something. :rolleyes:

[beachnut]

You must live a sheltered life. Its growing! Nutters like the Japanese Parliament are starting to ask questions. Films are being shown in the heartland of America. Go to youtube and read some of the remarks. Its at least ten to one for the nutters. Most against sound like the same exact person with multiple accounts IMO. Anyways keep up the good work, its funny to see yall getting clowned by the majority.
only idiots are growing
no facts
no evidence
just stupid, pure nut cases like Jones make up thermite
you have no evidence
so you are saying idiots are taking over like the NAZIs did?

[T.A.M.]

If impeachment hearings would start against Cheney, I think there would be A LOT of people that would come forward with some stories that would never see the light of day otherwise.

Wexler wants hearings ya know. He even has a website set up to have people sign his petition.

I think even on the remote chance that Cheney gets impeached, it will make no difference on 9/11 truth. There are no people to come forward on this issue, because there is no great conspiracy that people are afraid to come out about...don't delude yourself.

As for the OP, Cludgie,

I am getting close to the point you mention. Really, the last 6 months I have been staying mainly because (A) I enjoy conversations with others here, (B) it is amusing to see the latest twirp try to push the same tired old snake oil, and then watch he/she get trashed. There are so few new people who actually are in doubt now, coming over asking LEGITIMATE questions, that I think the general public, for the most part has said...

"Ya saw that, been there, and concluded that the truthers are FOS..." and moved on.

As a result, even the original reason I got into this, to keep the general public (lurkers etc...) informed, is not as needed...fewer ask questions, and fewer still give a rats ass.

TAM:)

[Drudgewire]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I'll be amazed if this doesn't end with one of those pyschos attempting to assassinate somebody.

[Stellafane]

You must live a sheltered life. Its growing! Nutters like the Japanese Parliament are starting to ask questions. Films are being shown in the heartland of America. Go to youtube and read some of the remarks. Its at least ten to one for the nutters. Most against sound like the same exact person with multiple accounts IMO. Anyways keep up the good work, its funny to see yall getting clowned by the majority.


Hi Tweeter. You don't know me, and I don't know you. But simply as one human being to another, I must ask you for a favor: please stop this crap. For your own sake, just stop it. I'm not sure what's attracting you to the 9/11 CT community, but whatever it is isn't healthy.

We at JREF often goof on CTers as teenage boys living in their moms' basements, but of course they actually come from all walks of life. But they do all have one thing in common, they all possess at least one of the following flaws: stupid, insane, ignorant, illogical, unreasonable, immature. That's a very harsh thing to say, but in my experience I have not seen a single exception. We all laugh at the stupid and insane elements among CTers, but by far the most common problems are ignorance, immaturity, and unreasonableness. For some reason, those three traits often go hand in hand. It's a debilitating combination, because it makes you think you're onto something when you first discover some Truther site making a claim that's been debunked a million times. But in your ignorance of all the evidence to the contrary, you embrace the claim as nothing short of life-altering revealed truth. Perhaps this makes you feel important or smart, or special among your peers. But it's a massive mistake.

Of course, there's nothing wrong with being ignorant, all of us are in some form or another. But if you're too unreasonable to accept answers to your questions, or too immature to admit that you could be wrong, your ignorance becomes a fatal flaw. At that point, you have ceased to be a fully functioning intellect. Instead, you have embarked upon a path that will waste your precious time, that will isolate you from friends and family and bring you ever deeper into a community where real stupidity and insanity -- and very possibly danger -- are lurking. Is this really how you want to squander your life?

So forget trying to "win" arguments here or sound cool or convince youself that you've done something important today by posting some regurgitated idiocy in this forum. Go back to the real world, and rejoin life. I make no assumptions whatsoever about your personal situation before you became enamoured of 9/11 CTs. But whatever it was, it was infinitely more worthwhile than what you're doing now. Like the old saying goes, "No matter how far down the wrong road you're gone -- turn back."

[Brainache]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, I'll be amazed if this doesn't end with one of those pyschos attempting to assassinate somebody.

I guess, knowing Truthers, that the psycho would probably try to assassinate Barak Obama or Hillary Clinton. The psycho will not succeed and only manage to shoot himself in the foot.

[Drudgewire]

I guess, knowing Truthers, that the psycho would probably try to assassinate Barak Obama or Hillary Clinton. The psycho will not succeed and only manage to shoot himself in the foot.
It'll look a little more graceful on the doctored youtube video though. :D

[eromitlab]

It's entirely possible that a lone nut tr00ther will go that far; after all, it only took one deranged nut to get John Lennon and make an attempt on Reagan, but I doubt it will happen based on several other things I observe in the tr00thers I come across.


Hard to have both a weapon and a video camera going at the same time, much less a bullhorn
No experience with weapons
Most don't have the balls to take the radical actions they often speak of; their big balls are Internet-exclusive
Most troofers are scared of what will happen to them in prison
The moovement has created so many targets that it will be impossible to figure out which one to target
Grounded or can't stay out after curfew
Radical actions would involve leaving the computer and going outside
Inability to comprehend the "call to action"

[Alt+F4]

You must live a sheltered life. Its growing!

If you have ever been to New York City then you would know what you are saying is WRONG.

[Garb]

You must live a sheltered life. Its growing! Nutters like the Japanese Parliament are starting to ask questions. Films are being shown in the heartland of America.

I'm sure films are still being shown for the JFK assasination but that doesn't mean it is growing.

Go to youtube and read some of the remarks. Its at least ten to one for the nutters.

That is because the primary source of information for those in the TM is youtube videos. That isn't anything to be proud of.

Most against sound like the same exact person with multiple accounts IMO. Anyways keep up the good work, its funny to see yall getting clowned by the majority.

Assertions. You have no proof.

[jhunter1163]

Like TAM, I mainly come here for the camaraderie now, plus the humor factor. To that, I would add the educational factor; I'm certainly better informed now on a wide variety of topics than I was before I came to JREF, and I thank all the posters here for that.

The Truth movement is dying. There's no doubt about that. Bush's departure from office will hasten its demise even further; Americans are notoriously apathetic about the actions of former Presidents. When was the last time you wondered, "I wonder what ol' Jimmy Carter is doing?"

There may be a small surge of interest in conjunction with the 10th anniversary, but after that the Truthers will be relegated to the dusty corners of the Internet, still shouting pathetically into the void, "WTC7! Squibs! Faster than free-fall! Pull it! Rosie believes us...."

[cisco]

It's too bad so many intelligent critical thinkers are on the brink of giving up. That's exactly what the Trooth has been fighting for; that's what the repetitive arguing, moving the goal posts, sticking their fingers in the ears and shouting LALALALA is all about. They want us to go away so they can have their spoils of war, their new recruits who hear no argument from the rational side because we've all thrown in the towel.

It worked for the Kennedy CTers. A majority of Americans believe that one now.

[R.Mackey]

So I see the overall crowd for this kind of thing dwindling further. However, there will (like pretty much any conspiracy theory you can name) always remain that small hardcore banging on about it for a long time yet.

So I ask, at what point do you think you'll turn round and say "sod this, I can't be bothered with talking to these morons anymore"?

Good OP, and fair question. I agree with your observation that the Truth Movement is basically dead, and there's nothing new -- I threw down that gauntlet (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=66969) fourteen months ago, and since then, nada. Sure we see new people pop up once in a while, the Mike the EMT's and the mystery Citizens Investigation Team aircraft mechanic mole, Rosie O'Donnell, etc. But it's just a rehash of the same old con.

Anyway, I've stopped bothering talking to the real morons for some time. But I stay involved so long as there's something for rational folks to learn, or something for me to learn. To be perfectly honest, if it wasn't for the insanity of the Truth Movement, the odds I'd have read NIST cover-to-cover would have been pretty low. I certainly understand it better having defended and criticized it, and having explained its reasoning to others. Structural engineering is not my field, neither is fire modeling, but I have a much deeper appreciation of them now.

Obscured by the ridiculous charges of the Truth Movement, and those who fantasize about magical aircraft or ninja explosives, there is actually a heated and sometimes even nasty scientific debate simmering. There's still much more to learn. NIST isn't right. Neither is Arup, nor Dr. Quintiere, nor Dr. Greening... I've spent considerable time in my posts and whitepapers trying to examine the pros and cons of each approach, and synthesize some common understanding and possibilities for the future.

This is why it's called "Science." If we knew all of the answers, it would be called "fact." This is a discussion that I wish more people knew about and understood. It's so much more interesting (and useful) than fantasies about thermite and laser cannons. If you want that, go rent a movie. The real world is still more interesting than anything dreamed in the minds of humans.

As long as there's something for us to learn, I'll still be around. The Truth Movement will merely be late to the party.

[DarkMagician]

You must live a sheltered life. Its growing!

In the opposite direction, even.

Nutters like the Japanese Parliament are starting to ask questions.

No, Nutters in the Japanese Parliament are starting to ask questions.

Films are being shown in the heartland of America.

And most of the time, its a mostly-empty house.

Go to youtube and read some of the remarks. Its at least ten to one for the nutters.

It's more like there are videos attracting the troothers than there being more troothers.

Most against sound like the same exact person with multiple accounts IMO.

That's because their sources aren't making crap up.

Anyways keep up the good work, its funny to see yall getting clowned by the majority.

That's a funny definition for the word "majority".

[cludgie]

I used to liken the end-stage of CT movements to white dwarves, stars that have used up all their primary fuel and now exist as small, dense, dim shadows of their former selves, and that although tiny and insignificant will exist for a long time. I now think that neutron stars are a more apt analogy to CTers -- both are made of degenerate matter (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degenerate_matter).

Quite possibly one of the most amusing analogies i've seen.

[Brainster]

While I will be happy to err, dance on the grave of the 9-11 Truth Movement, it's not in the ground yet. The traffic figures at 9-11 Blogger for November, December and January (projected out) indicate growth of about 13% to 20% per annum. While that is a substantial slowing from the growth rates experienced in 2006 and early 2007, it is still indicative of a movement that is not yet in its death throes. They may have limited ability to amuse us any more, but the cult is still bringing new members in every day.

[cludgie]

You must live a sheltered life. Its growing!

Well it sure is doing a good job of looking like dwindling to nothing.

Nutters like the Japanese Parliament are starting to ask questions.

You mean 'a nutter in the Japanese Parliament asked questions'

Films are being shown in the heartland of America.

Yes, and I believe both people who went to see them said they enjoyed it.

Go to youtube and read some of the remarks. Its at least ten to one for the nutters. Most against sound like the same exact person with multiple accounts IMO. Anyways keep up the good work, its funny to see yall getting clowned by the majority.

Its a sign of the times that you're having to reference the strength of the troof movement in youtube remark postings.

[T.A.M.]

It's too bad so many intelligent critical thinkers are on the brink of giving up. That's exactly what the Trooth has been fighting for; that's what the repetitive arguing, moving the goal posts, sticking their fingers in the ears and shouting LALALALA is all about. They want us to go away so they can have their spoils of war, their new recruits who hear no argument from the rational side because we've all thrown in the towel.

It worked for the Kennedy CTers. A majority of Americans believe that one now.

Cisco,

I think for me personally (call me an intelligent critical thinker or not), I will never completely leave, or "give up". I think "pulling back" or "passing the torch" might be a better way of describing it.

You are right, the truthers intentionally wear you down. Despite their decline as a group, they do out number us debunkers by a long shot, and they know it. Their joining JREF is likened to cannon fodder (which they have in abundance), but this gunner is getting a little tired of the repetition.

That is why people like yourself, and other debunkers/critical thinkers can keep it going.

Perhaps approaching their nonsense in shifts, taking turns would be better...lol

Even the offense needs to sit on the bench for a few minutes, while the defense kicks their ass.

TAM;)

[Crazy Chainsaw]

It ends in death, we all die of old age while sitting at a key board, posting messages on the INTERNET.
JERFers, TRUTHers, we all die eventually in a few thousand years it will all be forgotten.:D

[negativ]

So I ask, at what point do you think you'll turn round and say "sod this, I can't be bothered with talking to these morons anymore"?

About 4 months ago, unless I run into one in REAL LIFE, which just about almost never happens.

[Tweeter]

Hi Tweeter. You don't know me, and I don't know you. But simply as one human being to another, I must ask you for a favor: please stop this crap. For your own sake, just stop it. I'm not sure what's attracting you to the 9/11 CT community, but whatever it is isn't healthy.

We at JREF often goof on CTers as teenage boys living in their moms' basements, but of course they actually come from all walks of life. But they do all have one thing in common, they all possess at least one of the following flaws: stupid, insane, ignorant, illogical, unreasonable, immature. That's a very harsh thing to say, but in my experience I have not seen a single exception. We all laugh at the stupid and insane elements among CTers, but by far the most common problems are ignorance, immaturity, and unreasonableness. For some reason, those three traits often go hand in hand. It's a debilitating combination, because it makes you think you're onto something when you first discover some Truther site making a claim that's been debunked a million times. But in your ignorance of all the evidence to the contrary, you embrace the claim as nothing short of life-altering revealed truth. Perhaps this makes you feel important or smart, or special among your peers. But it's a massive mistake.

Of course, there's nothing wrong with being ignorant, all of us are in some form or another. But if you're too unreasonable to accept answers to your questions, or too immature to admit that you could be wrong, your ignorance becomes a fatal flaw. At that point, you have ceased to be a fully functioning intellect. Instead, you have embarked upon a path that will waste your precious time, that will isolate you from friends and family and bring you ever deeper into a community where real stupidity and insanity -- and very possibly danger -- are lurking. Is this really how you want to squander your life?

So forget trying to "win" arguments here or sound cool or convince youself that you've done something important today by posting some regurgitated idiocy in this forum. Go back to the real world, and rejoin life. I make no assumptions whatsoever about your personal situation before you became enamoured of 9/11 CTs. But whatever it was, it was infinitely more worthwhile than what you're doing now. Like the old saying goes, "No matter how far down the wrong road you're gone -- turn back."

Thanks for your concern stellafane, but why address me personally? I was only making a comment on the OP, which by my observations is untrue. Also id like to say im not here to "win" any argument or (this is the funny part) convince myself ive done something important, unlike some of us here.

[DGM]

Thanks for your concern stellafane, but why address me personally? I was only making a comment on the OP, which by my observations is untrue. Also id like to say im not here to "win" any argument or (this is the funny part) convince myself ive done something important, unlike some of us here.
You know that you've just described yourself as a pointless waste of time? So what's your point anyway?

[cisco]

You know that you've just described yourself as a pointless waste of time?
That's what they want you to think. (http://forums.randi.org/showpost.php?p=3351749&postcount=22)

[cludgie]

As for answering my own question, I said to myself I was going to give it up on the internet message boards side of things at New Year. Suffice to say I haven't, although i'm probably doing it a little less than I used to. I have to admit in reality I won't be giving it up completely any time soon.

I don't think I could ever resist chipping in if I met one in real life but thats not actually ever happened yet.

As for 9/11 ending up like the JFK thing, I don't quite see that being the case. The JFK argument was largely one-sided as alot of it was hearsay, myth and through books. Not many people I suspect would buy a historically accurate account of the JFK assassination. However, there will always be a market for a bit of pulp talking about dark conspiracies that presents a wholly one-sided argument. Scandal and controversy sells, and thats as true in literary circles as anywhere else. In the internet world there isn't that entry barrier of getting stuff published so it will always be that bit easier to present both sides of the story.

[cisco]

As for 9/11 ending up like the JFK thing, I don't quite see that being the case. The JFK argument was largely one-sided as alot of it was hearsay, myth and through books.How is the Trooth any different?

In the internet world there isn't that entry barrier of getting stuff published so it will always be that bit easier to present both sides of the story.
But the Trooth-noise:Debunker/realist ratio has got to be something like 50:1. There's an attitude among debunkers that "no one else is going to buy into this crap" [Trooth movement grows] "ok, now no one else with buy into it" [the Trooth grows] "ok, now no one else will be dumb enough to buy into it" [Trooth gains more new recruits] [debunker sighs and walks away]

That seems to be exactly how the JFK realists wound up in the minority. I don't see the difference.

[CHF]

You must live a sheltered life. Its growing! Nutters like the Japanese Parliament are starting to ask questions. Films are being shown in the heartland of America. Go to youtube and read some of the remarks. Its at least ten to one for the nutters. Most against sound like the same exact person with multiple accounts IMO. Anyways keep up the good work, its funny to see yall getting clowned by the majority.

Ah so that's why you think you're in the majority: comments on youtube.

Well here's a question for you Tweeter: why doesn't this "majority" of yours seem to have such trouble making itself heard and felt outside of the internet?

Why do your street rallies draw a few dozen people if it isn't raining? Why can't you get anyone elected?

A pack of single white 25-year old males posting messages from their mom's basement is simply not what revolutions are made of.

[Stellafane]

Thanks for your concern stellafane, but why address me personally? I was only making a comment on the OP, which by my observations is untrue. Also id like to say im not here to "win" any argument or (this is the funny part) convince myself ive done something important, unlike some of us here.

Hi Tweeter. I addressed it to you personally because you happen to be in this thread. I'd have addressed it to any other newcomer who looks like they're falling for the 9/11 CT idiocy. And the tenor of your post -- that you've concluded that the CTers are in the majority based on some YouTube comments -- is just so depressingly typical of the mistakes truthers always seem to make.

Surely your experience with the real world can't be so limited that you think YouTube comments mean anything at all? Is your view so narrow that it excludes newspapers, television, radio, and society in general? Because if what you say is true, and a majority of people believe Bush and his administration are mass murderers of innocent American civilians, how can you rationally explain why no one of any importance whatsoever seems to be doing anything about it? Clinton lied about oral sex and got impeached, but Bush kills his own people and gets a free pass? Do you have any idea how totally insane that sounds?

Again, I don't know what your motivations are. I'm just pointing out -- take it or leave it as you choose -- that any time and effort spent on behalf of 9/11 CTs is an utter, unnecessary waste of life.

[chris lz]

I don't follow the TM closely enough to notice. My impression, though, is that it didn't ignite in a big way until 2004-5. Is that accurate? Or maybe I was just late noticing it. Even if all their basic arguments are on the table, I'm under the impression such groups as A&E for truth, and Patriots Q911, were quite small or non-existent just 12-18 months ago, and are still growing. I heard Gage on the radio here in Boston for the first time last month. I think his group also had a convention here. So my impression has been this mvt isn't exactly dying from the public promotion stand point. But I do hope I'm mistaken.

[BenBurch]

Short answer is never. One of the unrecognized laws of the Universe is the Law of The Conservation of Stupidity; If stupidity disappears in one place, it springs up again in another.

[Brainache]

So is there a Stupidity Constant, like the amount of stupid in the universe is always pi/c x m2?

[Cl1mh4224rd]

If impeachment hearings would start against Cheney, I think there would be A LOT of people that would come forward with some stories that would never see the light of day otherwise.


Wow. You're hanging your hat on the hope that impeachment hearings based on things that would be significantly less despicable than the alleged murder of 3,000 of their own citizens would be the one thing to get people to finally speak out about said alleged murders?

Really?

[Cl1mh4224rd]

While I will be happy to err, dance on the grave of the 9-11 Truth Movement, it's not in the ground yet. The traffic figures at 9-11 Blogger for November, December and January (projected out) indicate growth of about 13% to 20% per annum. While that is a substantial slowing from the growth rates experienced in 2006 and early 2007, it is still indicative of a movement that is not yet in its death throes. They may have limited ability to amuse us any more, but the cult is still bringing new members in every day.


I'm wondering if the still-increasing numbers for 9/11 Blogger are less an indication of the truth movement's growth in general and more of an indication of its convergence on a single site.

If the same pattern is seen across a number of truther websites, that maybe indicate growth. If not, well...