Persecution: How Liberals Are Waging War Against Christianity

[a_unique_person]

This Limbaugh family has a lot to answer for.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0895261111/002-9448883-3026406?v=glance

Obviously time to feed the lions.



They may not get thrown to the lions any more, but today's Christians endure subtler forms of martyrdom, argues this strident manifesto. Limbaugh (Absolute Power: The Legacy of Corruption in the Clinton-Reno Justice Department) recites a litany of abuses and insults perpetrated, he claims, by separation-of-church-and-state absolutists and the forces of secular humanism. Most of them are familiar complaints of the Christian Right: school children are forbidden to pray before football games; nativity scenes are banned from municipal property; the media ridicule Christian politicians, and Hollywood caricatures Christians as Bible-thumping yahoos or axe-wielding fanatics. At universities where Darwinism, relativism and "sexuality studies" hold sway, Limbaugh says, vocal Christians get packed off to the psych ward. Most insidiously, Christians are continually subjected to sensitivity training-which often promotes a "homosexual agenda"-and silenced when they object.

[UnrepentantSinner]

I just love people who aren't skeptical. :rolleyes:

From the book description:

* A Georgia school board, after being threatened with a suit by the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU), deleted the word "Christmas" from the school calendar.

I never ever ever trust anecdotes that refer to "some person" or "some entity." If the story has any validity to it, they would reference "specific person" or "specific entity."

A Google search turned up only retellings of a quote from James Trafficant.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=georgia+school+board+christmas+removed+aclu

[Lord Kenneth]

Gosh darnit, I ain't be likin' none of this anti-christ stuffs, next you knowit, they gonna be sayin we can't burn none o' dem heathens...!

[evildave]

Or crosses.

[Zep]

RANT RANT RANT

yadda yadda yadda...

[c4ts]

What an idiot.

[ceo_esq]

Originally posted by UnrepentantSinner
I just love people who aren't skeptical. :rolleyes:

From the book description:

* A Georgia school board, after being threatened with a suit by the American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU), deleted the word "Christmas" from the school calendar.

I never ever ever trust anecdotes that refer to "some person" or "some entity." If the story has any validity to it, they would reference "specific person" or "specific entity."

A Google search turned up only retellings of a quote from James Trafficant.
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&q=georgia+school+board+christmas+removed+aclu This story turns out to have been true, however. I found an AP wire piece about it. The same story also ran in the Atlanta Journal & Constitution and a few other newspapers.The school board voted Tuesday to erase the word "Christmas" from its school calendars next year, bowing to pressure from the American Civil Liberties Union, which called the calendar "an endorsement of a particular religion".

Last year, the board voted 3-2 to get rid of the generic term "winter holidays" commonly used by public school systems to refer to the two-week break at the end of the year.

...

ACLU lawyer Craig Goodmark said there probably would have been no problem if school employees had changed the wording behind the scenes. But because the board took a public vote to designate the holiday for Christmas, the change effectively endorsed Christianity in violation of the U.S. Constitution, Goodmark said.

...

Board member John Douglas, who initiated the pro-Christmas move last year, cast the lone vote against the change Tuesday. He also accused the ACLE of using "bullying and intimidation".

Goodmark took exception to the charge.

"The ACLU only asked Newton to comply with the constitutional standards," Goodmark said. "The ACLU does not bully. The ACLU only asks that government bodies comply with the Constitution of the United States."Source: "Newton County school board changes reference to winter holiday break again", The Associated Press State & Local Wire (Nov. 22, 2000).


I can understand why one would approach such an anecdote skeptically, however. Similar anecdotes have turned out to be invented or progressively distorted through multiple retellings. I believe Jerry Falwell has been caught a couple of times repeating "news stories" that turned out to be essentially legends.

Although I acknowledge that this particular anecdote is true, I think it's interesting that the "backstory" was ignored in the retelling - that is, that the school board was really just changing the calendar back to what it had been prior to an ostentatiously Christian (and arguably objectionable) PR move the previous year.

[Professor Frink]

Sometimes I think the ACLU goes a little overboard about some of this stuff. But then I remember my high school graduation, where the beginning contained a prayer from a local minister. The end of the prayer ended "In the name of the Father, Son, and the Holy Spirit, Amen."

I remember thinking about my jewish friends and my only (as far as I knew) Muslim friend who were there to celebrate their acomplishments having to listen to someone pray on their behalf to dieties they didn't believe in. Furthermore, it is interesting to note that some christian sects don't like the term "spirit" and prefer "ghost" instead. So this might have even been somewhat offensive to them. How anyone gets away with this is beyond me.

It's okay to have religion in school as long as it's yours.

Frink

[UnrepentantSinner]

Originally posted by ceo_esq
I can understand why one would approach such an anecdote skeptically, however. Similar anecdotes have turned out to be invented or progressively distorted through multiple retellings. I believe Jerry Falwell has been caught a couple of times repeating "news stories" that turned out to be essentially legends.

Although I acknowledge that this particular anecdote is true, I think it's interesting that the "backstory" was ignored in the retelling - that is, that the school board was really just changing the calendar back to what it had been prior to an ostentatiously Christian (and arguably objectionable) PR move the previous year.

Thanks ceo_esq, I knew I could count on you on church/state issues. :)

From a purely personal standpoint, I don't consider Christmas to be an inherently religious holiday any more. Too many years of shopping, Santa Claus and "family time" have fully secularized it to the point that I take no offense. I really don't care what the winter school break is called as long as it's not "solstice" thereby infusing a pagan influence.

From a layman's viewpoint on the church/state issue an attempt to "reinfuse" Christ into the "Christmas break" is clearly crossing the line.

I am glad that Trafficant's anecdote has some semblance of validity, but, as usual, I'm saddened that hyperbole and incitement has replaced an actual rational discussion of the issue.

[pgwenthold]

Originally posted by ceo_esq
Although I acknowledge that this particular anecdote is true, I think it's interesting that the "backstory" was ignored in the retelling - that is, that the school board was really just changing the calendar back to what it had been prior to an ostentatiously Christian (and arguably objectionable) PR move the previous year.

Interesting. Once again, christians are claiming persecution because they are not allowed to use public domain to promote their religion.

The ACLU objected to the _addition_ of the word "Christmas." When you think about why the word was included in the first place, the ACLU's objections become a lot more clear (and justified).

They didn't just "object to the word Christmas." They objected to the addition of Christmas to make the document more christian. Poor, persecuted christians...

[Marvel Frozen]

I love persecuting christians, it's my favorite activity.

[Chaos]

Originally posted by Marvel Frozen
I love persecuting christians, it's my favorite activity.

Really? I just get sick every time they prepare to become martyrs...

[LawnOven]

hahaha

poor christians.

[Prospero]

Originally posted by a_unique_person

At universities where Darwinism, relativism and "sexuality studies" hold sway, Limbaugh says, vocal Christians get packed off to the psych ward.


Wow, really!? How do I sign people up?

[evildave]

Of course, every law cuts *both* ways. The same kinds of laws and rulings that prevents one from establishing various kinds of religious requirements and/or barriers for employment can be applied to unreligious requirements and/or barriers.

A law that can be used to sue over fundies pressuring church attendance at work could equally be applied to pressing non-attendance.

It's simply a pity so many people choose to walk around with a "chip" on their shoulders.

Don't bring up religion at all at the office, and you won't get an earfull, one way or the other. Many will take it as if you had grabbed their @$$ and whispered something dirty in their ear. There are plenty of hot-button people on either side who'll sue your pants off over the slightest mis-step in any direction.