Realizing a Shadow or Reflection of Yourself Is Just You

[INRM]

Okay, a few mammals including us can realize a reflection of them is just them and not another creature like them. They can also identify their shadow is theirs. Humans can even the shadow cast by an object their riding in (car, plane)

What enables the brain of a creature to realize that the shadows and reflections are just them and not something else?

Do these brain-activities possibly explain consciousness itself? Or is there more to that?


INRM

[m_huber]

Oh! That dark thing is just me! I get it now!

[Complexity]

I dare say there's more to it than that.

[Modified]

I've had several dogs who wouldn't look in a mirror. If there was a mirror in the room, they would look anywhere but there. It seemed to make them uncomfortable. I guess that is one step up from a parakeet, who thinks its reflection is another parakeet.

[Molinaro]

I once read that dogs don't get fooled by mirrors because there is no smell associated with what they see.

[Spektator]

Our dog used to think her reflection was another dog. She'd bark, then try to run behind the mirror to catch the other puppy off-guard. Eventually she wised up and now she ignores mirrors.

[Modified]

I once read that dogs don't get fooled by mirrors because there is no smell associated with what they see.

Dogs get pretty exited when there is a cat on the other side of a window, and I don't think they can smell through windows.

[Myshkin]

We humans are accustomed to seeing a 2D object like a picture, and instantaneously identifying it as a symbol of a real object. So much so that when shown a picture of a dog, we usually say "it's a dog" rather than "it's a picture of a dog". A picture really is only a splotchily-colored flat object, the fact that we can link it to another physical object is amazing. I think we forget what a wonderful skill this is. I'd guess that if there are any other critters that can do it, they would probably be mammals. It probably exists in varying degrees, and may have evolved independently in various lineages (hominids, canids).

My hunch is that dogs can't reliable recognize pictures of dogs as "pictures of dogs", but I'm not sure why I have that hunch. Maybe they do the same as we. They see a picture of a bowl of food and they recognize it as only a picture of a bowl of food .

They can be taught pattern recognition and categorization of images (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/11/071128105543.htm), but "the experiment cannot tell us whether they recognized the dog pictures as actual dogs".

What kind of experiment could tell if an animal can recognize that a picture of something is a picture of that very thing? Or better yet, a picture of one member of a class of those very things (e.g. a picture of dog linked with "organism that needs its butt sniffed").

[Myshkin]

Double. That darn firefox "working" wheel keeps spinning even after (apparently) it has already worked.

[Pup]

What kind of experiment could tell if an animal can recognize that a picture of something is a picture of that very thing? Or better yet, a picture of one member of a class of those very things (e.g. a picture of dog linked with "organism that needs its butt sniffed").

This seems so obvious I know there's either a major flaw or it's already been done, but...

Isn't it possible to train a dog to retrieve a particular object out of several, by showing him the object first? In other words, show a specific object to a dog, toss it into a pile of other objects while the dog isn't watching, then ask the dog to retrieve the specific object.

Okay fine. Do it by showing the dog a picture of the object. Or a picture of an object similar to the object.

[Shoogar]

Our dog, Patty, uses the mirror to keep an eye on us. We have a large mirror at one end of the bedroom. When laying on the floor, by the bed, she can't see us directly, but by watching the mirror she can monitor us. Sort of unnerving.

She also watches TV. Has to be very simple images and something moving. Horses tend to get her attention. Now whether she sees it as a horse, I have no idea.

[sts60]

Our dog was once watching a movie where a man was eating snacks and periodically throwing one to the dog next to him. She tracked the motion of the thrown snacks, then finally attempted to catch one herself. She's also watched birds on television, sniffed the speaker where the bird sounds were coming out, and then walked around to the back of the "window" to look for the birds. (Hey, where'd they go?) So, clearly, some dogs can readily process 2D, "anolfactory" (is that a word?) images.

[rocketdodger]

Do these brain-activities possibly explain consciousness itself?

Yes.

Or is there more to that?

Is there more to computer software than ones and zeros?

[dogjones]

Ah, an apt time for some Steve Wright jokes:

Lots of comedians have people they try to mimic. I mimic my shadow.

I got a new shadow. I had to get rid of the other one... It wasn't doing what I was doing.

I tried to draw my shadow once, but I couldn't... My arm kept moving.

Huzzah!

[Loss Leader]

Dogs get pretty exited when there is a cat on the other side of a window, and I don't think they can smell through windows.


Don't be so sure about that.

[Stitch]

This seems so obvious I know there's either a major flaw or it's already been done, but...

Isn't it possible to train a dog to retrieve a particular object out of several, by showing him the object first? In other words, show a specific object to a dog, toss it into a pile of other objects while the dog isn't watching, then ask the dog to retrieve the specific object.

Okay fine. Do it by showing the dog a picture of the object. Or a picture of an object similar to the object.

Well you can certainly get a dog to pick out a coloured ball from a selection by showing it a rag of the same colour.

[Modified]

Well you can certainly get a dog to pick out a coloured ball from a selection by showing it a rag of the same colour.

The rag might be the same color as the ball to you, but the same color as a different ball or several balls to the dog. Even if you stick to pure hues, green, orange, and yellow all look the same to a dog, and they can't tell blue-green from gray.