Nothing is real and thoughts are meaningless

[becomingagodo]

How do you know if something is real?
You cannot be sure this is reality?
Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?
Descartes does not exist?
Isn't reality a illusion?
Logic is not real?
Physics is made up?
Mathematics is a fictional?

[Jimbo07]

How do you know if something is real?

I don't. I just assume.


You cannot be sure this is reality?

This? I'm not sure. It doesn't matter.


Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?

We don't know that thoughts aren't objects. Maybe they are the effects of objects.


Descartes does not exist?

Not anymore he doesn't! :p


Isn't reality a illusion?

Yes, but an inescapable one.


Logic is not real?

No.


Physics is made up?

Yes.


Mathematics is a fictional?

Yes.

...

These last three have just shown themselves to be useful in understanding whatever this intersubjective experience happens to be...

I call it reality, for short.

[Gate2501]

How do you know if something is real?
You cannot be sure this is reality?
Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?
Descartes does not exist?
Isn't reality a illusion?
Logic is not real?
Physics is made up?
Mathematics is a fictional?

If you really thought these things, I find it hard to believe that you would survive in the "reality" of our world, filled with "real cars" driving down the road "real fast" that you could "really walk in front of and die".

Or perhaps this post was all in jest and I am being a jerk ;)

[Darth Rotor]

How do you know if something is real?
Drop it on your foot.
You cannot be sure this is reality?
This is the JREF R & P forum. It's as real as you want it to be.
Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?
Being an object is not a requirement for having meaning.
Descartes does not exist?
He did, now he doesn't. His writings live on, so far.
Isn't reality a illusion?
Reality is for those who cannot handle their drugs.
Logic is not real?
It's a tool.
Physics is made up?
For a reason: there was a human need for it.
Mathematics is a fictional?
Are you stating or asking this?

DR

[billydkid]

How do you know if something is real?
You cannot be sure this is reality?
Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?
Descartes does not exist?
Isn't reality a illusion?
Logic is not real?
Physics is made up?
Mathematics is a fictional?This is a leg pulling thread, right? Pretending for a moment it is authentic. This is the kind of thing that typically comes out of the mouths of freshman philosophy students. The old "is anything real?" routine has always driven me up the wall. It suggests that there is some notion of reality which transcends our everyday notion of reality. We have assigned the term "real" to things that have an effect on us. By definition, the world and everything it and certainly thoughts are all real. Typically people have the whole thing backward - we don't have a preexisting concept called reality and see if the world fits that definition. We have the world and what the world is, and that is what we call reality.

[fromdownunder]

It does not have to be real. It just has to be consistent with how I understand reality as it exists for me. The day I throw something into the air and it keeps going straight up I may consider the OPs question to be more than just mental masturbation.

Norm

[gdtbiker]

If reality is an illusion, then nothing really matters - why continue with an illusion by being in illusion yourself? There is no point, no meaning, no nothing - they're all illusion. But if for some silly reason, you don't want to cease to exist, even in an illusory manner, then you must assume that reality is real and continue to "exist" As If reality is real. :D

[blobru]

How do you know if something is real?
If by "real" you mean not illusion, usually experience is enough. Waking experience we take to be of a persistent, sensible, external [and internal] world. Waking experience has a routine. Where experience breaks drastically from routine, we often doubt whether it is real. So we look for the source of the break: something wrong with the world, or with us? Real, or illusion?

You cannot be sure this is reality?
Not perfectly sure, no. But most often, such doubt is merely "philosophical", not 'real'. :)

Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?
Thoughts are categories of 'objects' (items, events, qualities, etc.) of experience. Objects in themselves have no meaning until we think about them [experience them]. Thoughts aren't physical, but they are real (part of our normal waking experience).

Descartes does not exist?
Depends on whether his thoughts about God were right or not. While thinking them, he existed.

Isn't reality a illusion?
If it is, then what is illusion (defined negatively, as "that which is not real")?

Logic is not real?
It is very real. It is a set of instructions: how to categorize arguments. "Do a, do b, do c..." Just as the world defines our experience of it, thought defines our actions in it. Logic then is a collection of thoughts that define the activity of logic.

Physics is made up?
Physics is discovered.

Mathematics is a fictional?
Mathematics is thoughts about quantity and order, and relations between those thoughts.

[Jimbo07]

if for some silly reason, you don't want to cease to exist, even in an illusory manner, then you must assume that reality is real and continue to "exist" As If reality is real. :D

I have yet to meet the mystic

(shaman, priest, rabbi, monk, adept, witch, magick-user, psychic, astral traveller, homeopath, sollipsist, alien abductee, messiah, lunatic, pothead, freshman philosophy student, kabbalist, druid, New Age musician, astrologer, cryptozoologist, postmodernist, 9/11 truther, breatharian, yogic flyer, guru, swami, elder, cultist... whew... etc.)

who doesn't need groceries!

:D

[Marquis de Carabas]

How do you know if something is real?
You cannot be sure this is reality?
Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?
Descartes does not exist?
Isn't reality a illusion?
Logic is not real?
Physics is made up?
Mathematics is a fictional?
Hmmm. You've really given me some things to think about.

Good thing thought is meaningless so I can safely ignore it.

[Loss Leader]

How do you know if something is real?

You cannot, but must act as though reality exists for fear of the consequences.

You cannot be sure this is reality?

Is that a question?

Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?

If objects do not exists, why would thoughts only have meaning if they are objects? Both thoughts and objects do not exist. They are equal.

Descartes does not exist?

Not anymore, he doesn't.

Isn't reality a illusion?

Maybe, but the only information we have is that effect follows cause. Thus, we should act as though we expect the effects that follow from our actions.

Logic is not real?
Physics is made up?
Mathematics is a fictional?

If it is, the fact that you are not very good at any of the three is excusable. Isn't that what you're really looking for? An excuse as to why you're not as great as you like to imagine yourself?

[Tricky]

How do you know if something is real?
You cannot be sure this is reality?
Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?
Descartes does not exist?
Isn't reality a illusion?
Logic is not real?
Physics is made up?
Mathematics is a fictional?
Sounds like you are gathering data for your upcoming book, Solipsism for Dummies.

[Jimbo07]

Not anymore he doesn't! :p


Not anymore, he doesn't.


Hey!

:p

This is an illusion of reality I choose to ignore...

:D

[alfaniner]

Been watching The Matrix again?

[Cactus Wren]

As Ed Abbey suggested, take the self-proclaimed solipsist out and throw a rock at his head. If he ducks, he's a liar.

[dglas]

How do you know if something is real?
You cannot be sure this is reality?
Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?
Descartes does not exist?
Isn't reality a illusion?
Logic is not real?
Physics is made up?
Mathematics is a fictional?

Lost in absolutes, are we?

[facetious mode]
Are we talking about (real), (rilly real) or (rilly, rilly real)?
What makes you think that meaning is meaningful?
Reality is not illusion, by definition.
Physics is made up? Rock is good. I grew up on rock.
[/facetious mode]

You can't...
Win Powerball!!!
...if you don't play.

[Ichneumonwasp]

How do you know if something is real?
You cannot be sure this is reality?
Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?
Descartes does not exist?
Isn't reality a illusion?
Logic is not real?
Physics is made up?
Mathematics is a fictional?

Put in a nice refrain and add a good beat and you've got yourself a garunteed gold record there.

[uruk]

How do you know if something is real? It doesn't matter We have no choice but deal with those things as if they are real
You cannot be sure this is reality? Right. but what else have you got?
Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning? Because they mean something to us. And there is: thoughts give rise to actions, actions give rise to effects, effects give rise to anger, anger gives rise to hate, hate give rise to pain, or something to that effect Obi Wan.
Descartes does not exist? Well, not now. But his words still exists. That we give them meaning measn that they still carry some effect.
Isn't reality a illusion? Again, so what? We don't really have any other choice do we?
Logic is not real? It seems to work pretty well in this illusion/reality. And as mentioned before, what other reality/illusion is there?
Physics is made up? It's not if it effects us against our will or knowledge. Physics are the rules of this reality/illusion they're as real as it's going to get. Is there any other illusion or reality we have access to?
Mathematics is a fictional? ditto above

[dglas]

Put in a nice refrain and add a good beat and you've got yourself a garunteed gold record there.

Sounds like >shudder< Sting lyrics...


Win!
Win it all.
Win today.
Win Powerball!!
Don't worry if you're not "wow!" enuff,
to get through the tricky wall.
Just win...
Powerball!!

[AkuManiMani]

How do you know if something is real?

The more pertinent question:

How accurate is our perception and understanding of a thing?

You cannot be sure this is reality?

Again, all perceptions are real. Its the accuracy and interpretations of perceptions that vary. For instance, a dream has an objective reality as a sensory experience, but if one believes that it is the physical waking experience then their belief would be false. What we want to know is the true nature of our experiences. Reality is not an illusion. Our perceptions of reality can be "illusory" to varying degrees, tho.

Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?

Thoughts ARE objects. They just aren't [I]material objects.

Descartes does not exist?

Hes dead now.

Isn't reality a illusion?

Only in the sense that our perceptions of it are imperfect.

Logic is not real?

You're doing some heavy violence to the word "real".

Physics is made up?

No.

Mathematics is a fictional?

No.

[Bob Klase]

Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?

Yet you spent all that time expressing your meaningless thoughts.

[gdtbiker]

Yet you spent all that time expressing your meaningless thoughts.And the rest of us spent all this time expressing our meaningless thoughts in meaningless reply to the OP's meaningless thoughts.

Have a very meaningless day, everyone! :)

[KarlG]

Well i for one have trouble believing BAG is real.

KarlG

[Vox Humana]

Sounds like you are gathering data for your upcoming book, Solipsism for Dummies.

Shouldn't that be Solipsism for Dummy? ;)

[Crossbow]

How do you know if something is real?
You cannot be sure this is reality?
Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?
Descartes does not exist?
Isn't reality a illusion?
Logic is not real?
Physics is made up?
Mathematics is a fictional?

Some weeks ago, I, and several others, urged you most strongly to see a doctor because we were quite concerned about your physical health.

Just to reiterate, I still strongly urge you to see a doctor because I believe that your health is in serious danger.

Please get help as soon as possible.

[Darth Rotor]

Well i for one have trouble believing BAG is real.

KarlG
I never underestimate the potential for Teh Stupid.

DR

[pchams]

Shouldn't that be Solipsism for Dummy? ;)
That was my thought.
Tricky's statement was a lot wittier than at first blush :D

[Dancing David]

Thoughts ARE objects. They just aren't material objects.





The biochemical waves and neurotransmitters are materail, so I am not sure if this is too fine a point.

A car moving at 500 kph is moving very fast. It is a description of a property assigned to a physical object.

In the same way thoughts are material, they are interactions in material objects.

[AkuManiMani]

The biochemical waves and neurotransmitters are material, so I am not sure if this is too fine a point.

A car moving at 500 kph is moving very fast. It is a description of a property assigned to a physical object.

In the same way thoughts are material, they are interactions in material objects.

Thoughts are patterns in a material medium. They are not material themselves anymore than a word is material -- it is informational in nature. Though, by the same reasoning, matter could be considered patterns of energy.

[rocketdodger]

This is the kind of thing that typically comes out of the mouths of freshman philosophy students.

I could be wrong but I think godo is exactly this (or else a freshman mathematics student... I forget which).

[Soapy Sam]

All thoughts are meaningless, but some are more bazonka than dridlepee.

[slingblade]

Hey, you got your dridlepee in my bazonka!

[JonnyFive]

Becomingagodo is a fictional?

[Almo]

Nice hit-and-run troll. :rolleyes:

[JonnyFive]

Nice hit-and-run troll. :rolleyes:

Welcome to every thread becomingagodo makes, ever.

[DARK LORD XENU]

Reality is for those who cannot handle their drugs.
[/QUOTE]

Yes thats what I need more drugs to deal with reality!
Damn white coats holding me back!

[KingMerv00]

Shouldn't that be Solipsism for Dummy? ;)

Uh...Who's the author?

[Foster Zygote]

Uh...Who's the author?

You are. No wait, I am.

[KingMerv00]

You are. No wait, I am.

Can't be you. You don't exist.

[maatorc]

How do you know if something is real?
You cannot be sure this is reality?
Thoughts are not objects, so how can they have meaning?
Descartes does not exist?
Isn't reality a illusion?
Logic is not real?
Physics is made up?
Mathematics is a fictional?

If thoughts are meaningless, and all the above is true, where does this leave your above thoughts and your thoughts whiich constitute your world?