Looks like we have a new Franklin case

[JHarrow]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/jersey/7268244.stm

160 people have reported being abused at this childrens home. One childs body has been found and they are expecting to find more. Nothing was done when the children complained and there are 40 suspects.

Politicians are trying to claim it wasn't an organised padophile ring. Yeah right....a home just happened to unluckily hire 40 paedophiles who were able to kill kids and put them in a bricked up cellar with noone noticing and coincidentally the entire judicial system of Jersey turned blind eye.

We have another Franklin case. Which skeptic will be the first to call the 160 witnesses liars?

[Architect]

JHarrow

So, the Police are crawling all over the building. There seems no doubt that further bodies will be found. There has been no public suggestion that the witnesses have been lying.

What, as they say, is your point?

[funk de fino]

Which sock puppet will be the first to accuse the NWO?

Hows the weather in the manchester area today?

[Liszt]

this is disturbing.


By the way, US district court judge Warren Urbom ordered L.E. King to pay Franklin victim Bonacci one million dollars on Feb 27 1999. He wrote

"King continually subjected the plaintiff to repeated sexual assults, false improsonments, infliction of extreme emotional distress, organized and directed satanic rituals..." it goes on, unpleasantly, for quite a bit longer.

This fact is normnally overlooked by people claiming the Franklin case to be a hoax.

[Architect]

Hows the weather in the manchester area today?

?I'm out and about and will not be in Manchester until lunchtime?

[Sword_Of_Truth]

I heard of another judge who claims that a pair of pants is worth 52 million bucks.

What's your point?

[Undesired Walrus]

More than a third of the calls were made in the last two days

There is also a little thing called 'holding off until enough evidence to prosecute is found'.

It's a bit like when police officers wait until some carjackers actually jack a car before going in on them. Not a nice, but vital.

Seeing how you are reading about local news.. are you perhaps from England? The North perhaps?

[Architect]

Seeing how you are reading about local news.. are you perhaps from England? The North perhaps?


I don't think that Jersey counts as England, never mind the so-called "north"......

;)

[JHarrow]

this is disturbing.


By the way, US district court judge Warren Urbom ordered L.E. King to pay Franklin victim Bonacci one million dollars on Feb 27 1999. He wrote

"King continually subjected the plaintiff to repeated sexual assults, false improsonments, infliction of extreme emotional distress, organized and directed satanic rituals..." it goes on, unpleasantly, for quite a bit longer.

This fact is normnally overlooked by people claiming the Franklin case to be a hoax.

Yes it is overlooked.

Some argue that it was a default judgement but that doesn't explain why he gave 1,000,000 damages.

The Franklin scandal is a disgrace and so are the people who deny it occured.

I think this Jersey thing is going to be something similar. There are rumours that high ranking establishment people are involved and victims are talking of parties where they were selected by their abusers.

Jersey only has 90,000 people!

[Dave Rogers]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/jersey/7268244.stm

160 people have reported being abused at this childrens home. One childs body has been found and they are expecting to find more. Nothing was done when the children complained and there are 40 suspects.

Politicians are trying to claim it wasn't an organised padophile ring. Yeah right....a home just happened to unluckily hire 40 paedophiles who were able to kill kids and put them in a bricked up cellar with noone noticing and coincidentally the entire judicial system of Jersey turned blind eye.

We have another Franklin case. Which skeptic will be the first to call the 160 witnesses liars?

Nice reasoning in advance of the data there, JHarrow. 40 suspects <> 40 perpetrators.

I'm not going to argue that there wasn't abuse going on at this children's home, and quite likely murder as well; there have been too many revelations of abuse at children's homes in Britain for this to be considered even unlikely, and the inaction over complaints is part of a classic pattern. I also suspect it's highly unlikely that such things could possibly have been carried out by a single person undetected; at the very least there must have been people who knew something was going on and decided not to talk, although it could be relatively few.

But when you state that 40 suspects means that there were 40 paedophiles involved, all you're demonstrating is an ignorance of police procedure that would shame a twelve-year-old.

Dave

[funk de fino]

?I'm out and about and will not be in Manchester until lunchtime?

This was aimed at the OP poster

[Undesired Walrus]

There are rumours that high ranking establishment people are involved and victims are talking of parties where they were selected by their abusers.


Source?

[funk de fino]

Yes it is overlooked.

Some argue that it was a default judgement but that doesn't explain why he gave 1,000,000 damages.

The Franklin scandal is a disgrace and so are the people who deny it occured.

I think this Jersey thing is going to be something similar. There are rumours that high ranking establishment people are involved and victims are talking of parties where they were selected by their abusers.

Jersey only has 90,000 people!

bingo

NWO responsible

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Source?

Image from JHarrow sitting on a scanner with his pants down in 3... 2... 1...

[JHarrow]

There is also a little thing called 'holding off until enough evidence to prosecute is found'.

It's a bit like when police officers wait until some carjackers actually jack a car before going in on them. Not a nice, but vital.

Seeing how you are reading about local news.. are you perhaps from England? The North perhaps?

How much more evidence do you need? We have 160 victims, a dead body, a bricked up torture chamber, and several former staff members charged with paedophilia in the recent past.

[Liszt]

I heard of another judge who claims that a pair of pants is worth 52 million bucks.

What's your point?


you seriously couldn't work out my point? Seriously? Perhaps you should stop trusting the hat so much.

[JHarrow]

Source?


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2008/02/27/njersey627.xml

[JHarrow]

How many of the witnesses in the OP case can read their oppressors tattoo's when they are moving at 450MPH?

Infact, how many phoned up and gave exact details and names of their oppressors? Could you give me a link to where they explicitly state that? How many gave facial features and exact names?

You wouldn't be asking for one level of scrutiny for one story and one level for the other would you?

He made a claim, he needs to back it up or retract it.

[funk de fino]

How much more evidence do you need? We have 160 victims, a dead body, a bricked up torture chamber, and several former staff members charged with paedophilia in the recent past.

Considering the crux of the truth movement is now to get a new investigation you are a bit premature in stating the outcomes of this one and that to go further is a waste of time.

Hypocritical much?

We need the youtube videos man.........

[Sword_Of_Truth]

He made a claim, he needs to back it up or retract it.

I did back it up. I provided the website where such information can be found, probably quite quickly with just a few minutes of effort.

JHarrow, however is a classic example of cult indoctrination. It's as though he is psychologically allergic to anything which would cast down upon his cults teachings, so he avoids it like a vampire does garlic.

That JHarrow won't spend a few minutes perusing the website is all his fault. I'm not responsible for it.

EDIT: Ah, it looks like he did manage to get over at least some of his programming.

[JHarrow]

I did back it up. I provided the website where such information can be found, probably quite quickly with just a few minutes of effort.

JHarrow, however is a classic example of cult indoctrination. It's as though he is psychologically allergic to anything which would cast down upon his cults teachings, so he avoids it like a vampire does garlic.

That JHarrow won't spend a few minutes perusing the website is all his fault. I'm not responsible for it.


Lol look at the post above yours.

[Architect]

Lol look at the post above yours.

(cough)

[Undesired Walrus]

How many of the witnesses in the OP case can read their oppressors tattoo's when they are moving at 450MPH?

Infact, how many phoned up and gave exact details and names of their oppressors? Could you give me a link to where they explicitly state that? How many gave facial features and exact names?


JHarrow, I demand you give me this evidence.

[Liszt]

how many derails?

Anyway, look out for the False Memory Foundation. They are an organisation who protect people accused of child molestation.

Ralph Underwager, one of the founders (in 1992) of the FMF gave an interview to Paidika magazine the following year.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paidika

That is the (amazingly) peer reviewed journal that promotes pedophilia.

Underwager said this...

"Paedophiles need to become more positive and make the claim that paedophilia is an acceptable expression of God's will for love and unity among human beings. This is the only way the question is going to be answered, of whether or not it is possible. Does it happen? Can it be good? That's what we don't know yet, the ways in which paedophiles can conduct themselves in loving ways. That's what you need to talk about. You need to get involved in discourse, and to do so while acting. Matthew 11 talks about the wisdom of God, and the way in which God's wisdom, like ours, can only follow after. Paedophiles need to become more positive and make the claim that paedophiles is an acceptable expression of God's will for love and unity among human beings."

He resigned shortly afterwards. And yet people still take the FMF seriously.

[peteweaver]

Whats this got to do with conspiracy theories ?

Or are you trying to say the abuse didn't happen and its just a psyop to scare people ?

[funk de fino]

He is trying to goad someone on here to say the witness in this case are liars.

Its like pulling girls hair at junior school, totally pathetic

Obviously 911 truth has little else to show us

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Whats this got to do with conspiracy theories ?

Or are you trying to say the abuse didn't happen and its just a psyop to scare people ?

this is a sad attempt by Harrow to rehash the whole Franklin Hoax (http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/2007/07/real-franklin-coverup-story.html) debacle all over again, this time by callously abusing the apperantly real tragedy unfolding in the UK.

[Furi]

Which sock puppet will be the first to accuse the NWO?

Hows the weather in the manchester area today?

How long till life energy sapping shape shifting paedophillic reptilians and the royal family is mentioned?

Dunno 'bout Manchester (*hawwwwwk Spit*), but Darlington's quite nice at the mo'

[maccy]

this is disturbing.


By the way, US district court judge Warren Urbom ordered L.E. King to pay Franklin victim Bonacci one million dollars on Feb 27 1999. He wrote

"King continually subjected the plaintiff to repeated sexual assults, false improsonments, infliction of extreme emotional distress, organized and directed satanic rituals..." it goes on, unpleasantly, for quite a bit longer.

This fact is normnally overlooked by people claiming the Franklin case to be a hoax.

It was a default judgement in a civil claim for damages, it doesn't prove that King was guilty of a criminal act. King didn't show up to defend himself.

Your quote, above, is badly out of context. This is what the judge actually said:

Between December 1980 and 1988, the complaint alleges, the defendant King continually subjected the plaintiff to repeated sexual assaults, false imprisonments, infliction of extreme emotional distress, organized and directed satanic rituals, forced the plaintiff to "scavenge" for children to be a part of the defendant King's sexual abuse and pornography ring, forced the plaintiff to engage in numerous sexual contacts with the defendant King and others and participate in deviate sexual games and masochistic orgies with other minor children. The defendant King's default has made those allegations true as to him. The issue now is the relief to be granted monetarily.http://www.whale.to/b/aq3.html

The Judge is offering no opinion about the truth or otherwise of the allegations, he is merely stating how the law stands in this case.

Even if you think that King was a child abuser, it is a big stretch to include the White House, Bohemian Grove and Jeff Gannon. There's a thread about it here:

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=64252

Child abuse does not necessarily mean a conspiracy to cover up satanic government elites. Attempting to tie the paranoid Franklin fanatsies to an onging case it Jersey is, quite frankly, disgusting. JHarrow should be ashamed.

I'm reporting this thread as off-topic for the CT forum and requesting its removal to AAH.

[Dave Rogers]

JHarrow, you've claimed that several former members of staff have been charged with paedophilia, that victims talk of parties where they were selected for abuse, and that a paedophile ring is almost certainly involved. To back this up, you've pointed to a source that states that one former member of staff has been charged with paedophilia, that the police don't think a paedophile ring is involved, and says nothing about these parties. I have no doubt that a serious crime has been committed here, but do you really think lying about it is any help to anyone?

Dave

[krelnik]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/jersey/7268244.stm

160 people have reported being abused at this childrens home. One childs body has been found and they are expecting to find more. Nothing was done when the children complained and there are 40 suspects.

Politicians are trying to claim it wasn't an organised padophile ring. Yeah right....a home just happened to unluckily hire 40 paedophiles...

Whoa, whoa, whoa! Wait a second there, cowboy.

I've read your linked story, and the several related stories it links to. I read the two anonymous case self-reports sent directly to the BBC by victims. Where did you reach the conclusion that this is a paedophile ring?

I see allegations that children were treated very harshly, that there was severe corporal punishment, and indeed abuse. This may have gone as far as murder or manslaughter, as there appear to be bodies. So yes, crimes were committed.

But "abuse" is not the same thing as "paedophilia". I see NOBODY in any of the stories being accused of being a paedophile.

If you have a better link then post it, but I think you are leaping to conclusions here, based solely on your misinterpretation of the word "abuse".

[jhunter1163]

Image from JHarrow sitting on a scanner with his pants down in 3... 2... 1...

We have a Golden Guffaw winner!

[Dave Rogers]

I see allegations that children were treated very harshly, that there was severe corporal punishment, and indeed abuse. This may have gone as far as murder or manslaughter, as there appear to be bodies. So yes, crimes were committed.

But "abuse" is not the same thing as "paedophilia". I see NOBODY in any of the stories being accused of being a paedophile.

To be fair, the Daily Telegraph story linked by JHunter makes it clear that there are allegations of sexual as well as physical abuse, so it's not such a leap to paedophilia. That's not to say he isn't speculating far beyond the information available, just not quite that far.

Dave

[jhunter1163]

To be fair, the Daily Telegraph story linked by JHarrow makes it clear that there are allegations of sexual as well as physical abuse, so it's not such a leap to paedophilia. That's not to say he isn't speculating far beyond the information available, just not quite that far.

Dave

Fixed that for you. I didn't link it.

[krelnik]

To be fair, the Daily Telegraph story linked by JHunter makes it clear that there are allegations of sexual as well as physical abuse, so it's not such a leap to paedophilia. That's not to say he isn't speculating far beyond the information available, just not quite that far.

Thanks, I didn't see the second link in amidst all the millions of off-topic posts about Flight 77.

I would point out that the only mention of paedophilia in that story is worded as follows:


...he dismissed suggestions of an organised paedophile ring...


So I maintain that the OP is leaping to conclusions.

[Sword_Of_Truth]

EDIT: You're right, Krelnik.

[krelnik]

(post moot, deleted)

[Undesired Walrus]

This thread is an epic fail.

[chillzero]

Flight 77 stuff moved out to CT Forum, after Current News Event posts moved to Social Events section.

[Mobyseven]

Jersey only has 90,000 people!

Er...I'm honestly confused. What does Jersey only having 90,000 people have to do with anything?

[Unsecured Coins]

We have a Golden Guffaw winner!


I concur! nice find, Sidekick!

[krelnik]

By the way, for any reading this thread who were confused (as I was) by the reference to "Franklin" in the title, I believe the OP is referring to this:

The Real Franklin Coverup Story (http://screwloosechange.blogspot.com/2007/07/real-franklin-coverup-story.html)

As described in the link, the "pedophile ring" aspects of that case turned out (after very detailed investigation) to be a hoax. There are at two threads on that debunked story here "Child Sex Slave Ring at the White House? (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=61801)" and "Conspiracy of Silence (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=64252)"

I at first thought he was referring to the George Franklin (http://www.cnn.com/US/9607/02/repressed.murder/) case, which I associated with this because it involved a child victim. It was also a recovered memory (http://www.religioustolerance.org/rmt_reli.htm) case and that sometimes turns up in pedophile accusations. My mistake.

[Dave Rogers]

Fixed that for you. I didn't link it.

oops, sorry. Who's the semi-literate now?

Dave

[krelnik]

Anyway, look out for the False Memory Foundation. They are an organisation who protect people accused of child molestation.

Ralph Underwager, one of the founders (in 1992) of the FMF gave an interview to .... [a] peer reviewed journal that promotes pedophilia.

He resigned shortly afterwards. And yet people still take the FMF seriously.

Classic guilt by association fallacy (http://www.fallacyfiles.org/guiltbya.html) there, Liszt. Nice work.

I think you are also jumping to a conclusion (as I did, admittedly) that this case has anything to do with false memories. I see no evidence of this in the news stories I've read.

[Liszt]

Classic guilt by association fallacy (http://www.fallacyfiles.org/guiltbya.html) there, Liszt.

I think you are also jumping to a conclusion (as I did, admittedly) that this case has anything to do with false memories. I see no evidence of this in the news stories I've read.


you are correct, but it is always giving the FMF twits a slap every now and then for the sake of it.

[krelnik]

Why do you call them twits? Do you think inducing false memories does not occur?

[Liszt]

Much of their research was based on the "work" of Underwager, who turned out to be a pervert. They should have reevaluated their whole approach ofter that scandal, but they did not. I think "twits" is not really the correct word to describe this disgusting organisation.

It has nothing to do with the subject of false memories. They can, of course, be created - psychosis is when someone confuses reality with imagination. I have studied this to a degree (literally).

But the FMF is still sourced, and I even saw one of the little ***** on TV defending someone recently (it was a 20 something girl, desperately trying to explain something she clearly did not understand)