Toronto truthers get told off at an anti-war rally

[CHF]

I can't help but feel sorry for anti-war activists. Just imagine....you're holding a rally in support of your cause, trying to make a difference....and along come the clueless dolts of the "truth" movement to crash the party because they think they're your de-facto ally.

This is a common tactic of the loons these days: latch on to other demonstrations in an attempt to pretend that they have friends.

Quite often this is not appreciated, as was the case last October when the Toronto chapter of the TM showed up at a small rally organized by the "war-resisters" movement. Those are the US soldiers who left the army (deserted, if you will) and are now seeking asylum in Canada.

I might not agree with every position of the anti-war crowd, but in this classic exchange they absolutely nail the kooks to the wall! :D

Remember: this video was shot, edited and posted by the truthers, so on some level they must think it made them look good.

EQlMFIsr46Y

My favorite parts were at 3:45 when the war-resister himself weighs in on Loose Change, at 6:00 when the losers are told the difference between activism and just talking, and at 7:20 when the losers are told exactly what they are.

I suppose this ties in to the question I asked here (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=107677): Why do the loons keep making these videos???

Is it to make us laugh? If so, mission accomplished.

:dl::dl::dl:

[Drudgewire]

I suppose this ties in to the question I asked here (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=107677): Why do the loons keep making these videos???
These guys are like Jackass Lite. All the proudly embarrassing stupidity without the crotch damage. :p

[Normal Dude]

These guys are like Jackass Lite. All the proudly embarrassing stupidity without the crotch damage. :p

Or the paper cuts.

[timhau]

How many truthers are there in that clip? Those two whiny asshats and a guy who has a camera?

[Tolls]

"Have your own demonstration and see if anyone comes."

hehehehehe.

[Pardalis]

I don't agree with the anti Afghanistan war proponents, but I must say that this is very encouraging that they don't allow these idiot twoofers to divert the attention away from their cause.

I have so much more respect for them now, that corpulent guy was pretty rational with them. Good for them.

[CHF]

How many truthers are there in that clip? Those two whiny asshats and a guy who has a camera?

Yup. Looks like 3-4 of them, which shows you why they crash the demonstrations of others.

"Have your own demonstration and see if anyone comes."

hehehehehe.

They've tried that. The biggest one I've seen had about 12 of them show up.

[The Silver Shadow]

Wow, this is getting more and more interesting. Why don't these guys ever show up at the university? I practically live there, I'd love to chat with them...

[CHF]

Wow, this is getting more and more interesting. Why don't these guys ever show up at the university? I practically live there, I'd love to chat with them...

They'll probably be making fools of themselves somewhere in the downtown core next Tuesday (11th).

As for universities, I imagine they'd stay away. Heaven forbid, they might run into an engineer or something.

[The Silver Shadow]

They'll probably be making fools of themselves somewhere in the downtown core next Tuesday (11th).

As for universities, I imagine they'd stay away. Heaven forbid, they might run into an engineer or something.
I would expect them to show up at York if they wanted to be at a university :D (Little University of Toronto joke...)

[Gord_in_Toronto]

I would expect them to show up at York if they wanted to be at a university :D (Little University of Toronto joke...)

I understand that they have visited Ryerson. :eek:

(a TO joke for those of us who live here)

[Walter Ego]

Apparently the 9-11 'kooks' have been irritating the Toronto war resisters group for some time by horning in on their rallies.


At every War Resister Support Campaign event I've attended - and, I'm told, at every peace rally and progressive event in Toronto - people from the local 9/11 Truth Movement are present. Normally, I would be inclined to think this was a good thing. 9/11 is the singular event from which so much that we object to has flowed, and there is so much we don't know about it. Links between what really happened leading up to the attacks and what is happening today are crucial to our understanding, and should be crucial to the peace movement.

However... what actually happens is not at all a good thing. The Toronto 9/11 Truth folks hold a huge banner reading "9/11 Was An Inside Job," which, in my opinion, is extremely off-putting. I don't know what their slogan is shorthand for, but its implication is, to put it mildly, not a good starting point.

And that's the least of it. There's one guy who shows up at every event. He holds a megaphone and walks around shouting "Nine-eleven Was An Inside Job" over and over. He does not engage in discussion; he only hides behind his megaphone and shouts. When asked to stop, he will often point his megaphone directly into someone's face and chant his slogan at them. He contributes nothing. He educates no one. The sole effect of his show, as far as I can see, is to turn people off the idea that there is anything substantial about the 9/11 Truth Movement.

Every movement has its share of kooks. I've been an activist for most of my life, and I've never been involved in a cause that didn't attract at least a few nuts. Some are people whose hearts are in the right place, but because of social ineptitude or control issues or who knows what, they are unable to participate in a group dynamic. Some don't even seem to have their hearts in the right place, and one can only wonder why they're there at all.

So the kooks are always there. But I've never seen a movement whose public face is the kooks themselves.

http://wmtc.blogspot.com/2008/01/911-truth-kooks-and-obstruction.html

[jaydeehess]

So the kooks are always there. But I've never seen a movement whose public face is the kooks themselves.


That puts it about as succinctly as it gets.

Not that I ever get to Ottawa anymore but do these guys or a similar group ever show up at Carleton U.?

[The Silver Shadow]

The thing about 9/11 truthers in Toronto is that they're at every big event. During the "Taste of the Danforth (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taste_of_the_Danforth)" weekend this past August, a group of truthers were holding a banner just outside the entrance from the subway station. There was only 3 or 4 of them, but as I went on down the street, there were a couple of people holding a "Google WTC 7" sign, to which I had quite the comical conversation with them...

That was one of them, about a month and a half after that, I was in Downtown near the Much/City/Chum building on Queen & Richmond, and there were some 9/11 truthers present standing nearby where the Foo Fighters were being interviewed. So overall, they go to anywhere where there's a presence of media of any type...

[Walter Ego]

The thing about 9/11 truthers in Toronto is that they're at every big event. During the "Taste of the Danforth (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taste_of_the_Danforth)" weekend this past August, a group of truthers were holding a banner just outside the entrance from the subway station. There was only 3 or 4 of them, but as I went on down the street, there were a couple of people holding a "Google WTC 7" sign, to which I had quite the comical conversation with them...

Did they get you in their video?

k59bR_NcxXc

The MO for this group seems to be to let somoene else draw a crowd then they show up and exploit it.

[X]

They go seeking confrontation, and have the audacity to play the victim.

Disgusting.

[WildCat]

Less than 400 views and they already disabled comments on the video, and nearly all the comments that were there were negative to the asshats.

And this thread is the #1 linking site to the video! :D

[The Silver Shadow]

Did they get you in their video?

k59bR_NcxXc

The MO for this group seems to be to let somoene else draw a crowd then they show up and exploit it.
Unless my name is Jack Layton, I wasn't caught on camera!

Quite surprised that there was even a video for this, but I had a chat with one fellow that was holding up a sign saying "Google WTC7" that day from that "movement" around dusk, when most of them had gone home and it went something like this:

Me: Are you saying that Google has an office in WTC 7?
Him: No, I'm saying that WTC7 was an inside job by the US government.
Me: So are you saying that the US government blew up WTC 7 (his hopes go up here, but then I add...), but with the help of Google?
Him: NO! Google had nothing to do with WTC7?
Me: Then why are you accusing a search engine of destroying a building?
Him: I'm not saying that Google destroyed WTC7, I'm saying the US government did...
Me: ...but with the help of Google, right?

That's the best of my recollection, and he just started walking away and not bothering to talk anymore. It's quite rare that you find a single truther, but I kind of exploited this one...

[Davidlpf]

These guys are like Jackass Lite. All the proudly embarrassing stupidity without the crotch damage. :p

Darn i need them out of the gene pool.

[Cincinnatus]

If they stalked me like that shouting with a bull horn in my ear; 9/11 was inside job, though I told them i'm not interested, someones getting punched in the face. Arrest me.

They really think they're neo.

[eromitlab]

Darn i need them out of the gene pool.

They're already taking care of that by carrying themselves in a manner which repels the opposite sex.

[Davidlpf]

If they stalked me like that shouting with a bull horn in my ear; 9/11 was inside job, though I told them i'm not interested, someones getting punched in the face. Arrest me.

They really think they're neo.

Something like this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?tv=TmH-N65R-lg&feature=related
that is Buzz Aldrin hitting good old Bart Sibrel.
(do not know how to put youtube warning)

[leftysergeant]

Oh rats! Somebody must have gotten to them and told them what utter morons they looked like. the video has been pulled, apparently.

[padragan]

Oh rats! Somebody must have gotten to them and told them what utter morons they looked like. the video has been pulled, apparently.

And when you say "pulled" you mean someone demolished the video using cables?

[MarkyX]

Too funny. 9/11 Deniers are reduced to leeching.

[Wildy]

Unless my name is Jack Layton, I wasn't caught on camera!

Quite surprised that there was even a video for this, but I had a chat with one fellow that was holding up a sign saying "Google WTC7" that day from that "movement" around dusk, when most of them had gone home and it went something like this:

Me: Are you saying that Google has an office in WTC 7?
Him: No, I'm saying that WTC7 was an inside job by the US government.
Me: So are you saying that the US government blew up WTC 7 (his hopes go up here, but then I add...), but with the help of Google?
Him: NO! Google had nothing to do with WTC7?
Me: Then why are you accusing a search engine of destroying a building?
Him: I'm not saying that Google destroyed WTC7, I'm saying the US government did...
Me: ...but with the help of Google, right?

That's the best of my recollection, and he just started walking away and not bothering to talk anymore. It's quite rare that you find a single truther, but I kind of exploited this one...

They must be in on it. They've even covered their tracks (http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-GB%3Aofficial&hs=NBv&q=%22Google+destroyed+WTC+7%22&btnG=Search&meta=).

[Alan G]

What was the earliest point in the video where they were told they were not welcome, cos they still hadn't got the message by the end of it.

[VespaGuy]

A few comments:

In the very beginning the main truther continues to say "I just want to extend an invitation". Shouldn't he be asking for THEM to extend the invitation? It seems like strange wording... maybe I'm missing something.

About halfway through, it says "...the War Resistors continued to engage our members after the rally". To which I would ask, "What the [rule10] were the truthers stil ldoing there?" They were told over and over that the WRs didn't want any part of them, and yet they continued to stick around. Who was doing the engaging?


I have to admit that the Truthers are masters of this type of passive-aggresiveness. They continue to pretend to be innocent and play coy knowing full well they are being disruptive.

[Horatius]

Unless my name is Jack Layton, I wasn't caught on camera!

Quite surprised that there was even a video for this, but I had a chat with one fellow that was holding up a sign saying "Google WTC7" that day from that "movement" around dusk, when most of them had gone home and it went something like this:

Me: Are you saying that Google has an office in WTC 7?
Him: No, I'm saying that WTC7 was an inside job by the US government.
Me: So are you saying that the US government blew up WTC 7 (his hopes go up here, but then I add...), but with the help of Google?
Him: NO! Google had nothing to do with WTC7?
Me: Then why are you accusing a search engine of destroying a building?
Him: I'm not saying that Google destroyed WTC7, I'm saying the US government did...
Me: ...but with the help of Google, right?

That's the best of my recollection, and he just started walking away and not bothering to talk anymore. It's quite rare that you find a single truther, but I kind of exploited this one...



Excellent work! There will be a little extra in your NWO pay packet this month....Assuming you remember all your NWO vote fixing training, that is. (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=3502433#post3502433)

[VespaGuy]

What was the earliest point in the video where they were told they were not welcome, cos they still hadn't got the message by the end of it.

I believe it was some where around the 0:01 mark.

[VespaGuy]

;3501506']They go seeking confrontation, and have the audacity to play the victim.

Disgusting.

I agree.

I've always wanted to use a similar technique on them. I'd love to join their ranks (sport the t-shirt and all), grab a bullhorn and walk amongst them, shouting "We're all retarded", "We have no idea what we're talking about", "We are a disgrace".

Of course, when confronted by the truthers, you can just reply "It's a public street", or use any of the other comments truthers love to fall back on when they are confronting people.

(If I ever do this, I'll be sure to tape it)

[Drudgewire]

I agree.

I've always wanted to use a similar technique on them. I'd love to join their ranks (sport the t-shirt and all), grab a bullhorn and walk amongst them, shouting "We're all retarded", "We have no idea what we're talking about", "We are a disgrace".

Of course, when confronted by the truthers, you can just reply "It's a public street", or use any of the other comments truthers love to fall back on when they are confronting people.

(If I ever do this, I'll be sure to tape it)
The twoofers need this guy at one of their rallies:

http://www.lethalwrestling.com/upload/we-are-idiots.jpg

:dl:

[Hawk one]

Something like this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?tv=TmH-N65R-lg&feature=related
that is Buzz Aldrin hitting good old Bart Sibrel.
(do not know how to put youtube warning)

Just giving you today's little forum tip:

To add a Youtube video directly to your post, you copy out the part of the url that is between the "=" and the "&". THen you put in the tags and put them inside there.

In your case, the code should be this:
TmH-N65R-lg

And the end result should look like this:
TmH-N65R-lg

So, there you are, a nice smackdown from Buzz Aldrin, right in the post. ;)


(And in case you wonder, I used another code called "noparse" to make the other codes appear "raw".)

[ktesibios]

Unless my name is Jack Layton, I wasn't caught on camera!

Quite surprised that there was even a video for this, but I had a chat with one fellow that was holding up a sign saying "Google WTC7" that day from that "movement" around dusk, when most of them had gone home and it went something like this:

Me: Are you saying that Google has an office in WTC 7?
Him: No, I'm saying that WTC7 was an inside job by the US government.
Me: So are you saying that the US government blew up WTC 7 (his hopes go up here, but then I add...), but with the help of Google?
Him: NO! Google had nothing to do with WTC7?
Me: Then why are you accusing a search engine of destroying a building?
Him: I'm not saying that Google destroyed WTC7, I'm saying the US government did...
Me: ...but with the help of Google, right?

That's the best of my recollection, and he just started walking away and not bothering to talk anymore. It's quite rare that you find a single truther, but I kind of exploited this one...

Silver Shadow, that's truly priceless. If you could work "is.. is he dead?" (http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/etcbin/toccer-new2?id=TwaInno.sgm&images=images/modeng&data=/texts/english/modeng/parsed&tag=public&part=27&division=div1) in somewhere, you would achieve perfection. ;)

Oh rats! Somebody must have gotten to them and told them what utter morons they looked like. the video has been pulled, apparently.

The link in the OP seems to be working for me. :confused:

[jaydeehess]

It seems that the guy on the bullhorn shouts the 'trooth' message but half the time when they talk to someone personally they bring up some other unrealted topic such as the N.A.Union.

That is certainly all they had to say to Jack Layton. For the benfit of those who do not know Canadian politics, Layton is a member of Parliament and the leader of the leftist, New Democratic Party (NDP) of Canada.

[Ateius]

So, there you are, a nice smackdown from Buzz Aldrin, right in the post.

"Did you get that on camera?"

Lowest scum in the room right there. Insult an man to his face until he strikes you and then play the victim.

And as to the OT - I imagine that police officer at the rally was wishing he had any pretext at all to throw those twoofers in a cell.

[The Silver Shadow]

Excellent work! There will be a little extra in your NWO pay packet this month....Assuming you remember all your NWO vote fixing training, that is. (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=3502433#post3502433)

Silver Shadow, that's truly priceless. If you could work "is.. is he dead?" (http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/etcbin/toccer-new2?id=TwaInno.sgm&images=images/modeng&data=/texts/english/modeng/parsed&tag=public&part=27&division=div1) in somewhere, you would achieve perfection.
Thanks for the compliments, but this is the best of my recollection from that day, it was too long ago!

[MarkyX]

Just watched a bit further, they reallllly hate Loose Change and Dylan.

That's funny stuff right there.

[CHF]

For anyone in need of a laugh, the Toronto twoofers are planning to make fools of themselves this Sunday (http://e3s.ca/t911truth/index.php?option=com_events&task=view_detail&agid=11&year=2008&month=03&day=09&Itemid=44) at Dundas Square.

Then on March 15 they plan on crashing another peace rally (http://e3s.ca/t911truth/index.php?option=com_events&task=view_detail&agid=10&year=2008&month=03&day=15&Itemid=44).

[Heynow]

Well in the video i can definitely see Canada turning into a police state but only if Toronto 911 truth movement becomes a political party.

[Walter Ego]

What was the earliest point in the video where they were told they were not welcome, cos they still hadn't got the message by the end of it.

The video in the OP was actually 'Part Two.' The confrontation began before the rally was even over here in pt.1. (at the 4:10 mark).

vdBXkNDRY4E

If you have the stomach for it, there's even 'Part Three' where an 'olive branch' is extended to the war resisters.

iDqpSohec_g

(Is it just me or does the whiny voice guy look like Ed Grimley from SCTV?)

[Cincinnatus]

LMAO@ war resister. that guy volunteered for the tour of duty.
It's funny he went to canada though he volunteered. If he had
to then he had too. I just hope he promises to stay there.

As for the turthers. They sound smart but they just aren't.

[Cincinnatus]

Something like this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?tv=TmH-N65R-lg&feature=related
that is Buzz Aldrin hitting good old Bart Sibrel.
(do not know how to put youtube warning)

LMAO.

Exactly like that.

[alex04]

Quote from the first youtube vid - (caption by the truther author)


and then debate turned into accusations



i don't think my irony meter can handle much more

[MarkyX]

For anyone in need of a laugh, the Toronto twoofers are planning to make fools of themselves this Sunday (http://e3s.ca/t911truth/index.php?option=com_events&task=view_detail&agid=11&year=2008&month=03&day=09&Itemid=44) at Dundas Square.

Then on March 15 they plan on crashing another peace rally (http://e3s.ca/t911truth/index.php?option=com_events&task=view_detail&agid=10&year=2008&month=03&day=15&Itemid=44).

Maybe we should mass mail them about 9/11 deniers showing up? The site is http://www.nowar.ca/

[CHF]

Maybe we should mass mail them about 9/11 deniers showing up? The site is http://www.nowar.ca/

I'm sure they know to expect them.

Apparently the kooks show up at almost any sort of protest event.

[Walter Ego]

AEt8yA0h2ts

From the YouTube 'About This Video.'

This was at the Columbus Pride Parade 2007 on Comfest weekend. We handed out over 6000 flyers inviting people to our Truth Film Festival, and also 600 DVDs with 9/11 Press For Truth and 911 Mysteries on them. columbus911truth.org has been in 2 parades so far, and we are doing a third on July 4'th. Our first parade was the Powell Memorial Day Parade. We encourage other truth groups to do these events. It is a good way to legitimize the movement to the general public.

Read: We can't draw a crowd so let's expolit those who can.

Here's a Columbus truther 'relating' (i.e. being ignored) at another gay event.

YttiRZ9hHXw

[VespaGuy]

AEt8yA0h2ts

From the YouTube 'About This Video.'

Read: We can't draw a crowd so let's expolit those who can.

Here's a Columbus truther 'relating' (i.e. being ignored) at another gay event.

YttiRZ9hHXw

From the video, a truther explaining the reaction of the crowd:
There was a lot of "huh? What's this doing here?"

No kidding.

[VespaGuy]

Here's a Columbus truther 'relating' (i.e. being ignored) at another gay event.

YttiRZ9hHXw

From the truther in the video speaking to gays and lesbians. (emphasis mine)

Thank you so much. We are so, so proud to be a part of this amazing parade. In the past nine months, once I became convicted [sic] that 9/11 was not what they had told us it was and i found enormous discrepencies in the 9/11 commision report I immediately went form being a socailite to being an outcast and being labeled as a conspiracy theorist. So I can relate to all of the struggles, some of the struggles that you have endured.

No. She did not just say that, right? She did not just compare the 9/11 truth movement to gay rights, did she?

[CHF]

No. She did not just say that, right? She did not just compare the 9/11 truth movement to gay rights, did she?

Hey, these people have compared themselves to Rosa Parks, Nelson Mandella and Winston Churchill.

So they might as well be just like gay-rights crusaders as well.

[The Silver Shadow]

Considering the homosexual population as being one of the very educated groups, their attitude was quite humble towards the truthers. Kudos to them for not kicking the truthers where it hurts...

PS: A couple of my professors in the past were homosexuals, and one was even transgendered, so I have a lot of respect for them and the predicament they're in when it comes to old-school types...

[WildCat]

Here's a Columbus truther 'relating' (i.e. being ignored) at another gay event.
She became "convicted" that 9/11 was not what they had told us it was?

Truthers even have typos when they speak!

[Horatius]

AEt8yA0h2ts

From the YouTube 'About This Video.'







Is it just my misunderstanding, or does the girl at about 1:36 make a homophobic comment about some of the guys in the parade? The Gay Pride Parade?

Please tell me I misunderstood!

ETA: In listening again, I may have misunderstood it, but it's still up in the air....

[Walter Ego]

Hey, these people have compared themselves to Rosa Parks, Nelson Mandella and Winston Churchill.

So they might as well be just like gay-rights crusaders as well.


I was at a gay pride event in Chicago some years ago (pre 9-11) and a female from the Socialist Workers Party or some such outfit who invited herself to speak informed everyone assembled that it was ‘capitalism’ that was oppressing gay people. She went over like a lead balloon.

In radical politics this is known as ‘co-opting’ (i.e. trying to draw people from another political group into your group). The truthers are tired of having ‘events’ with the same four or five people showing up every time so they will exploit any political group they can latch onto in 'solidarity.' It’s desperation time in Truthville.

[Walter Ego]

Is it just my misunderstanding, or does the girl at about 1:36 make a homophobic comment about some of the guys in the parade? The Gay Pride Parade?

Please tell me I misunderstood!

ETA: In listening again, I may have misunderstood it, but it's still up in the air....

Sounded like "I'm so glad hearing the word of the Lord and I'm so glad those men are over there." Notice the boasting about how many DVDs and flyers were handed out? I wonder how many ended up in the trash?

[Drs_Res]

Sounded like "I'm so glad hearing the word of the Lord and I'm so glad those men are over there." Notice the boasting about how many DVDs and flyers were handed out? I wonder how many ended up in the trash?

I wonder how many they actualy brought with them. Two bags=600 DVDs?

[Slayhamlet]

Is it just my misunderstanding, or does the girl at about 1:36 make a homophobic comment about some of the guys in the parade? The Gay Pride Parade?

Please tell me I misunderstood!

ETA: In listening again, I may have misunderstood it, but it's still up in the air....

Most likely she's referring to a counter-protester's sign which demands that homosexuals "hear the word of the Lord" or something else along those lines. Sounds fairly typical. She's "glad those men are over there" because the counter-protesters aren't allowed in the parade itself. Nothing homophobic.

[Slayhamlet]

Sounded like "I'm so glad hearing the word of the Lord and I'm so glad those men are over there." Notice the boasting about how many DVDs and flyers were handed out? I wonder how many ended up in the trash?

No, she says, "I think I'm not hearing the word of the Lord and I'm so glad those men are over there".

[Pardalis]

Here's a Columbus truther 'relating' (i.e. being ignored) at another gay event.

YttiRZ9hHXw

OMG, the image of that girl alone on that podium is so pathetic.

I had to:

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a154/perdalis/7.png

[fuelair]

These guys are like Jackass Lite. All the proudly embarrassing stupidity without the crotch damage. :p

Surely someone should be able to add the crotch damage to this.

[CHF]

Well today's Toronto 9/11 protest was canceled because it snowed last night. Even though lots of people were downtown today, it was too cold for the truthseekers.

But not to worry....they switched it to Tuesday. So far only the organizer has agreed to show up (http://9-11.meetup.com/282/calendar/7427012/), but on the bright side they've apparently decided to get political!

The one and only Doug Plumb has announced on the same site...

Next time I'll be there. We have an all Candidates meeting at the St Laurence Centre. For those that do not know, I am running against Bob Rae for Toronto Centre. We are getting 20 000 fliers late - Monday. Anyone want to help deliver ? email do

That election campaign is gonna be awesome!

:dl: