South Face of North Tower Damage?

[Mr.Herbert]

Is anyone aware of pictures or statements by anyone that saw the damage to the south face of the North tower caused by the South Tower collapse?

I found one statement in Marks paper from a police officer. That's about it.

Thanks,

Mr. Herbert

[ElMondoHummus]

To answer your question directly: I'm afraid I'm not aware of any such imagery or testimony. But, are we sure that any of the WTC 1 south face damage was caused by WTC 2 debris to begin with? The only damage to the south face of WTC 1 that NCSTAR 1-2 noted happened to be from Flight 11's landing gear detaching and exiting. This diagram (http://www.nysm.nysed.gov/wtc/wtcimages/airplanedebrislg.gif) graphically represents the path of that debris. Although to be fair, that part of the NCSTAR really only concerned itself with damage from the impacts of the jets; I can see an argument being made that says that chapter would not have reported damage from WTC 2 debris.

However, I can't get past the fact that the FEMA 403 report (http://www.fema.gov/rebuild/mat/wtcstudy.shtm), chapter 2 says that the size of the openings in the south face of WTC 1 were the smallest of the four (409 square feet; contrast that to nearly 4000 sqft for the West wall, and over 6400 sqft for the North). If I presume that the landing gear's exit accounted for much of that 409 sqft, then I have an argument that little from WTC 2 damaged the south side. But, that's a pretty big assumption, so take it with a grain of salt. There's a good chance I'm wrong about that. It may well be that WTC 2 debris damaged WTC 1's south face on the way down. After all, damage was done to buildings well outside the WTC complex - 90 West, for example, or the Verizon Building - so it's very possible. But again, "only" 409 sqft; because of that, I'd argue that whatever damage WTC 2 may have caused, it caused to the West face instead, not the South.

Meh... I'll definitely have to defer to those with more knowledge. I may be using the info out of the NIST and FEMA reports to make that argument, but I'm still speculating here. If anyone else knows better than me, please speak up.

[Alferd_Packer]

from Mike Peroraro's account:
The building was just bouncing and bouncing, the floor was bouncing. I figured another plane already hit the building". Mike related. "I'm looking ahead and I see all the windows, either three story tall windows or four story tall windows, 10 feet wide; shatter. All of them broke at the same time. All the glass flew over my head. I'm looking up, on my knees, with my hands on the floor, and I saw all that glass. You're talking glass three inches thick, go right over our heads. I saw that some of the firemen who was standing on the perimeter (mezzanine) was blown right off the top. They just flew over the top. I can't put a number on it, maybe ten. Bunch of firemen were guarding doors there. They got blown off. Don't know where they went. I saw pieces of debris as big as cars go right over my head without stopping. Like a line drive right over my head," he said, raising his hand to indicate an approximate 4 foot level.

[Mr.Herbert]

thank you guys. So far I have come up empty handed. The "discussion" I am having with the twoofers is, they can't see how a building so far away as WTC7 is...that the South Tower didn't recieve extensive damage.

I would have loved some serious photographic evidence.

Mr. Herbert

[bonavada]

Is anyone aware of pictures or statements by anyone that saw the damage to the south face of the North tower caused by the South Tower collapse?



IIRC the naudet bros video effectively illustrates the damage caused when the first tower collapsed.

BV

[Pato2747]

I don't think a lot of people could have seen it, that was a tight, tight spot for anyone. There was a lot of flaming debris which couldn't let people pass through that. And FDNY wasn't precisely carrying cameras around.

I bet that the damage was significative, and probably made the other tower to finally collapse (In case if the planes, the fuel and the weakened steel wasn't enough)

[Mangoose]

No image I know of clearly shows the lower South Face of WTC1 at ground level, as the whole area where it would have been clearly visible was covered with debris from the South Tower collapse and other vantage points had either the Marriott or other buildings blocking the view. This is best I could find, from CBS:

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/7228/sfacejo7.jpg

There is however a ground-level view of the South Tower collapse (from CBS, aired before the North Tower collapse) from the north a block up West and it looks to me like you can see debris striking the South Face at the southwest corner around the 25th-30th floor. I doubt that was of any significance tho.