Dashiell Hammett

[a_unique_person]

Goddam, just spent about 20 minutes writing up my opinion of how good an author he is, and clicked on the "X" in Firefox and lost it all.

"Glass Key" is a great book, better than any French existentialist managed to come up with, and well before they set pen to paper.

[Gregory]

Dashiell Hammet was some sort of genius. His Continental Op stories are the first hard-boiled detective fiction I ever read, and I don't think they've ever been surpassed.

[zooterkin]

As someone similarly gifted, can I just point out that it's Dashiell Hammett.

Agreed on the books, though.

[dudalb]

Great Detective writer. He pretty much created the "Hard Boiled" detective story.
I think that Chandler might have been overall better,but Hammet created the genre and is a close second.
Certainly one of the Genre's greats, along with Conan Doyle,Dorothy Sayers and Chandler.

[SDC]

Dudalb, odd combination; where you trying to cover the proverbial waterfront? Hammett and Chandler are often yoked together, and Conan Doyle and Sayers, but not all 4 together.

Anyhow, Hammett is a great one, though his Continental Op stories to me are too much padded punch-'em-up. He was, after all, paid by the word.

Recently got a DVD copy of the first "Maltese Falcon" family, made I think in 1931. Dreadful, absolutely dreadful.

[a_unique_person]

He wrote a few potboilers in his time. When he tried to write something worthy, he succeeded.

[SDC]

Dudalb, odd combination; where you trying to cover the proverbial waterfront? Hammett and Chandler are often yoked together, and Conan Doyle and Sayers, but not all 4 together.

Anyhow, Hammett is a great one, though his Continental Op stories to me are too much padded punch-'em-up. He was, after all, paid by the word.

Recently got a DVD copy of the first "Maltese Falcon" family, made I think in 1931. Dreadful, absolutely dreadful.

Sometimes I wonder about typos. I meant first "MF" film. Recently reissued on DVD.

[NoZed Avenger]

Agreed on almost all of the above.

And as much as I love Chandler, I personally found the Hammett stories more compelling reading.

He and Rex Stout are two of my favorites in the mystery area; Chandler and Erle Stanley G. are in there, as well.

[Lisa Simpson]

I named my youngest son after him.

[zigaretten]

I'll just pop in to say that if you're a Hammett fan, then "Miller's Crossing" is an absolute "must see."

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0100150/

[SDC]

I named my youngest son after him.

Which "him"?

"Dashiel Hammett Simpson"?
"Rex Stout Simpson"?
"Erle Stanley Simpson"?
"Raymond Chandler Simpson"?

This raises more questions than it answers.

[NoZed Avenger]

Sir Arthur Conan Simpson?

[dudalb]

Dudalb, odd combination; where you trying to cover the proverbial waterfront? Hammett and Chandler are often yoked together, and Conan Doyle and Sayers, but not all 4 together.
Conan Doyle and Sayers are from a different school of detective fiction then Chandler and Hammett,but I think they are probably the 4 masters of the genre.

And I put Rex Stout and his Nero Wolfe stories not too far behind.
Of the more modern writers, I think that Elizabeth Peter's Amelia Peabody novels and Tony Hillerman's Joe Leaphorn/Jim Chee novels stand out.

[a_unique_person]

I'll just pop in to say that if you're a Hammett fan, then "Miller's Crossing" is an absolute "must see."

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0100150/

I think they made a good movie while completely missing the point of "The Glass Key".

[zigaretten]

It's been a while since I've read them, but I seem to remember that "Miller's Crossing" is more "Red Harvest" than "Glass Key." But it doesn't pretend to follow any of the novels exactly. Just the overall aura. (For me, half the fun of the movie was trying to figure out which part came from which story.)

Let me also add the name of Chester Himes to those already mentioned. Especially "A Rage in Harlem." He seems to be largely forgotten these days and that is unfortunate.

[Lisa Simpson]

Which "him"?

Obviously the him that is the subject of the thread.

My son's name is Dashiell.

[NoZed Avenger]

I think they made a good movie while completely missing the point of "The Glass Key".

And on a tangental note, I lenjoy the Thin Man movies, but. . . and given that it's the title of the book and a kind of important point . . .


The "THIN MAN" was NOT the detective, you MORON MOVIE-MAKERS."




Ahem.

Sorry. Just needed to get that off my chest.

[SDC]

Obviously the him that is the subject of the thread.

My son's name is Dashiell.

Let me guess... As a pet you keep a Maltese Falcon. Your front door takes a glass key... How far can we take this?

[a_unique_person]

It's been a while since I've read them, but I seem to remember that "Miller's Crossing" is more "Red Harvest" than "Glass Key." But it doesn't pretend to follow any of the novels exactly. Just the overall aura. (For me, half the fun of the movie was trying to figure out which part came from which story.)


More "Glass Key" for me. :cool:

I just looked up the IMDB on Millers Crossing, and someone has asked the perfect question for the book, and the film, so maybe they didn't screw up as much as I thought they did.

Why did Reagan do what he did? It's the whole point of the book.

[SDC]

For some years there has been a fashion to mudwrestle US cities into having a mass reading of a particular book. I think it's a crock of Kumbaya-ness (and I'm a librarian), and I'm proud NYC, where I work, has always ignored it. But now we seem to be having a mass reading of "Maltese Falcon," funded by the Nat'l Endowment for the Humanities. I'm in a quandary. So I'm rereading MF, always great, but I feel manipulated into it.

Help.

[fuelair]

And on a tangental note, I lenjoy the Thin Man movies, but. . . and given that it's the title of the book and a kind of important point . . .


The "THIN MAN" was NOT the detective, you MORON MOVIE-MAKERS."




Ahem.

Sorry. Just needed to get that off my chest.The movie makers knew that - the audiences were (still are) the problem. Or at least perceived that way by the movie-makers.

[pastime]

I could never figure out why anyone would think William Powell was the Thin Man, anyway. I mean, just look at him.

[Thinking in CT]

Dashiel Hammett - "Maltese Falcon" quiz:

In both the original novel and the John Houston/Humphrey Bogart movie, Sam Spade refers to Wilmer (Gutman's henchman) as a "gunsel". What's a "gunsel"?

(Hint: This term forms part of the rather, for its time, unusual sub-text of TMF)

[NoZed Avenger]

Dashiel Hammett - "Maltese Falcon" quiz:

In both the original novel and the John Houston/Humphrey Bogart movie, Sam Spade refers to Wilmer (Gutman's henchman) as a "gunsel". What's a "gunsel"?

(Hint: This term forms part of the rather, for its time, unusual sub-text of TMF)

Being also an Erle Stanley Gardner fan (who noted this in an essay dealing with the origins of several words used in detective fiction (esp Hammett)); I will recuse myself from the quiz.

[NoZed Avenger]

The movie makers knew that - the audiences were (still are) the problem. Or at least perceived that way by the movie-makers.


The latter must be it, because the movie-makers did everything that they could to make a casual watcher think that Powell was the Thin Man for the sequels:

After the Thin Man; Another Thin Man; Shadow of the Thin Man . . .

You could make arguments about the movie being "after" the first one or that "another" thin man is merely another corpse, but "The Thin Man Goes Home" involves the detective . . . going home. Along with the titles and movie posters, it certainly gives the impression that the detective is the Thin Man (IMO, of course).

[NoZed Avenger]

As an aside:


Myrna Loy. Grrrroooowwwwwl.

[SDC]

I am relying on my memory, since looking it up is cheating. Gunsel, if I recall correctly, refers to older boy/ young man available for sexual purposes; comes from Yiddish, something like gansele, little goose.

How about Spade's asking the Gunsel if he was in California because of getting the Baumes rush?

(I could ask, which Yiddish phrase appears in an Elvis hit, but I won't.)

ETA: actually, since the book appeared in the late 1920s, it wasn't such an unusual subtext except in its openness to Jewish slang -- which wasn't unusual in the gang world of the day. Also the case in countries where the Jews had emigrated from -- Poland and Russia had a lot of Yiddish-derived slang in criminal argot.

[Thinking in CT]

Kudos to you SDC. ( Although NoZed was, I'm sure, in the know, as he correctly identifies my source for the "Gunsel" definition.

The subtext I was referring to, in TMF, was the concept of a "gay" underworld. All of the bad guys in the story, Gutman, Joel Cairo, and poor Wilmer, are rather clearly depicted (in the book at least) as of that ilk, and are involved in the stolen antiques trade. I understand from reading a biographical piece about Hammett, that he modeled Cairo on an individual he busted when he was a private detective in San Franciso.

[SDC]

Thanks. And now for my acceptance speech... Just kidding.

There is also a related Jewish subtext. The descriptions of Gutman and Cairo draw on stereotypes -- "Levantine" (Cairo) was a kind of code of the day for Jews, they are swarthy and fat or at least plump (Cairo), display low cunning etc. At one point Cairo is referred to as "Greek" but to me he seems a Jewish ... ex-gunsel. Gutman is both a common German and Jewish name.

Maybe I'm seeing more than is really there but to me it is evident. Oh yeah, the lawyer in the book, at least, Sid Wise... Well, he's obvious. Oy.

How about the Elvis reference?

ETA: I may be wrong. I remember "Makes nix," = "macht's nichts," not important. But Elvis may have said "nix nix."

[fuelair]

As an aside:


Myrna Loy. Grrrroooowwwwwl.Why yes, yes she was!!!:)

[SDC]

Glass Key, Maltese Falcon, Thin man. All great. But I recently got an omnibus ed of all 5 novels Hammett wrote. I've read "Red harvest" and am now churning through "Dain Curse." Both of these are very, very ordinary -- lots of shoot'm'up with heavy cliches. Two thumbs down on these. Any objections? Honest, for those who want to be serious about DH, give them a try. I'd be glad of other views.

[dudalb]

Glass Key, Maltese Falcon, Thin man. All great. But I recently got an omnibus ed of all 5 novels Hammett wrote. I've read "Red harvest" and am now churning through "Dain Curse." Both of these are very, very ordinary -- lots of shoot'm'up with heavy cliches. Two thumbs down on these. Any objections? Honest, for those who want to be serious about DH, give them a try. I'd be glad of other views.


I agree that "Dain Curse" and "Red harvest" are not up to the level of the other three,but they are a lot of good pulp fiction fun.
And "Red Harvest" has been a favorite of many filmmakers. Kurosawa readily admits he borrowed a lot from Red Harvest for "Yojimbo" . WHich meant that Hammett is indirectly responsible for the career of Clint Eastwood.....
Remember,"Dain" and "Red Harvest" were pretty much strung together from short stories that Hammet wrote.
To be fair,though,some of his short fiction is brilliant.

[a_unique_person]

Red Harvest I enjoyed, despite the episodic structure. Dain Curse I found unreadable, and never finished it.

[SDC]

Just officially gave up on Dain Curse and started Glass Key. What a vast relief.