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a_unique_person
2nd October 2003, 07:24 PM
Why the Bush Doctrine is dead

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2003/10/02/1064988339740.html



Even the US President knows his plan is not working. Australia should take heed, writes Hugh White.

Last year, George Bush set out the first really compelling vision of America's global role since the end of the Cold War. It was a tough vision, and immensely ambitious. It committed America to use armed force, if necessary alone and if necessary pre-emptively, not only to protect American interests, but also to promote its values around the world.

It was a vision of stirring energy and simplicity, melding the idealism of Woodrow Wilson and his dreams of world order with the virility of Teddy Roosevelt and his Rough Riders. It was quickly christened the Bush Doctrine. Outside America it was received with enthusiasm by some and with deep disquiet by others, stirring deep debates about the nature of the international order.

.....

Over the past few months, the Bush Doctrine has faced its first tests and it is time to check on how it's holding up. One of those tests is in Iraq, the other is in America. So far it is failing both tests.

The Bush Doctrine asked big things of America - demands on its power and demands on its will. Success depended on America's ability to meet those demands. That was always going to be more critical than rebutting the arcane arguments mounted by opponents of the Bush Doctrine about the legal rights and wrongs of pre-emption and unilateralism.

Iraq has proved to be a telling demonstration both of the extent of American power, and of its limits.

Iraq has proved to be a telling demonstration both of the extent of American power, and of its limits. We saw the extent of that power in March and April as US forces removed Saddam's regime, and we have seen the limits in the months since then. It is important not to overstate the problems America faces in Iraq: this is not another Vietnam. It is still too soon to say that America will fail in its objective to transform Iraq into a durable pro-Western democracy.

But it is not too soon to say that success in Iraq will absorb all America's energy and resources for a long time to come. As long as it needs to sustain - and that means indefinitely - 140,000 troops in the country America will not have the forces to undertake major ground operations elsewhere. And you cannot build democracies with air power.

Even without the weight of its Iraq commitments, America's military capacity to force regime change in places such as Iran and North Korea is very limited. North Korea's forces, for example, are relatively primitive. But their size and position, close to Seoul, means that the first hours and even days of a war with the US would impose huge casualties on South Korea before the US could neutralise them with precision fire. And then there is the question of whether Pyongyang would use its nuclear weapons.

Iran is a different case again, but there can be little doubt that it would be a tougher nut than Iraq - both in the initial conquest and subsequent occupation. So although America is the strongest military power in the world today, it is not omnipotent, and its power has clear limits. It is not sufficient to support the vision of the Bush Doctrine.

In America, meanwhile, I think the people are losing interest. In the northern spring, as the tanks of the Third Infantry Division rolled up the Euphrates, talk of an American empire was in the air. Now in autumn the focus is on job losses, budget deficits, the bizarre politics of California and, of course, the Administration's inability to find Iraq's WMDs.

Most tellingly, as the presidential nomination process gathers steam before next year's election, front-running Democrats oppose the war in Iraq and the Bush Doctrine that underpinned it. That is important, not because a Democrat might win on an anti-Iraq ticket, but because it punctures the idea that after September 11 Americans have forged an unshakable national consensus around the Bush Doctrine. They haven't.
.....

Tellingly, George Bush himself always seems to have doubted the depth of public support for his bold policy. He was not prepared to ask Americans to forgo tax cuts to pay for their empire and never explained to them the depth of the commitment they were taking on in Iraq.

So lacking the military power or domestic support for further major military operations such as Iraq, it seems likely that the Bush Doctrine has already had its day. The powerful idea, appealing in its simplicity, that American exercise of its military power could be the key to making the world a safer and better place, will need to be replaced by something more complex and less satisfying, but, one hopes, more practical and enduring.

We need not fear an American reversion to isolationism: what we should expect is a return to something closer to the mainstream of American strategic policy. The seeds, of course, are already there. While the big ideas of unilateral pre-emption caught the headlines, much of the fine print in Bush's National Security Strategy published late last year read like the policies of Bill Clinton - or indeed of the President's father. And Bush has already adopted a more multilateral approach to many of the key issues on today's agenda: six-party talks on North Korea, the International Atomic Energy Agency on Iran and even going back to the UN on Iraq.

All this is important because, even without the Bush Doctrine, America remains what Madelaine Albright called it. It is the indispensable power, central to global and regional order and unique in its power to keep the world prosperous and stable.

And for Australia the lesson is simple: do not rush to reconfigure our defence posture to fit a new American doctrine whose time has already passed.

Tony
2nd October 2003, 07:29 PM
Can you summarize it?

a_unique_person
2nd October 2003, 07:36 PM
Originally posted by Tony
Can you summarize it?

It's a little hard to summarise something that is so well written and understated. The whole article is a summary.

However,

America can invade, but not necessarily control.
It is now tied up militarily in Iraq, so military options are not available for dealing with other hot spots.
The US public is tired of Iraq now, and wants to change to a different channel. The will to back Bush that was there has now gone.
The 'Bush' doctrine is dead.
America has always wondered how to deal with it's position as the most powerful country on earth. It still hasn't worked that out.
Bush wants to have it both ways with the public, giving them the tax cuts but not wanting to place on them the burden of the obligations he has undertaken. Those obligations will have to be met somehow.
Other countries that were thinking of how to deal with a world with a new doctrine from the US shouldn't worry to much about that task now, the doctrine is dead.

Tony
2nd October 2003, 07:43 PM
Originally posted by a_unique_person

The US public is tired of Iraq now, and wants to change to a different channel. The will to back Bush that was there has now gone.


Thanks AUP, the only thing I want to comment on is the above.

The above quote doesnt really have bearing in reality. The will of the US public doesnt matter. Does the US public support troops in Japan? Korea? Germany? Bosnia? I dont know, but I do know it isnt a major issue. I think the troops deployed in Iraq will eventually be looked at in the same way.

a_unique_person
2nd October 2003, 07:46 PM
Except that Iraq is not a pleasant place to be for troops. Some of them are being killed and injured, as well. Most of those working there would be in a constant state of apprehension and fear.

Supercharts
3rd October 2003, 09:54 AM
Is the Monroe Doctrine dead? No colonies here. Nicaragua is free.
The Truman Doctrine? Greece is still free. Turkey is free.

I think most people would agree that these doctrines are not dead and, in their times, were very successful.

Bush Doctrine? Never heard of it. Must be something like the Roosevelt and Truman Doctrines.

"It is not true that the United States feels any land hunger or entertains any projects as regards the other nations of the Western Hemisphere save such as are for their welfare. All that this country desires is to see the neighboring countries stable, orderly, and prosperous. Any country whose people conduct themselves well can count upon our hearty friendship. If a nation shows that it knows how to act with reasonable efficiency and decency in social and political matters, if it keeps order and pays its obligations, it need fear no interference from the United States. Chronic wrongdoing, or an impotence which results in a general loosening of the ties of civilized society, may in America, as elsewhere, ultimately require intervention by some civilized nation, and in the Western Hemisphere the adherence of the United States to the Monroe Doctrine may force the United States, however reluctantly, in flagrant cases of such wrongdoing or impotence, to the exercise of an international police power. "
http://www.uiowa.edu/~c030162/Common/Handouts/POTUS/TRoos.html

Granted, this was expressed in terms of nations of the Western Hemisphere - but times change. We were last to help out Europe during WWII. But the Truman Doctrine extended the Roosevelt Doctrine.

Iraq under Saddam was a totalitarian state. It is in the process of moving from a totalitarian state to a democratic one.
Currently there is chaos because of this transition. So what? Were people so naive that they thought the transformation would occur in one or two weeks?
The Ba'athist party was, and in some cases still is, a major influence in Iraqi politics.
Things take time. Lives will be lost. But the transformation of Iraqi society and government from a mafia-controlled state to a democracy is worth it for the sake of real mid-east peace and the culture and independence of Iraq.
Too bad the fellow travelers of anarchy don't realize this. Those people look to chaos as an expression of 'freedom' regardless of the cost to the lives and well being of the people.

fhios
3rd October 2003, 11:25 PM
Originally posted by Tony


Thanks AUP, the only thing I want to comment on is the above.

The above quote doesnt really have bearing in reality. The will of the US public doesnt matter. Does the US public support troops in Japan? Korea? Germany? Bosnia? I dont know, but I do know it isnt a major issue. I think the troops deployed in Iraq will eventually be looked at in the same way.

On the other hand, Gen. Harry S. Sumner, in his critique of American war conduct in Vietnam On Strategy pointed to Nixon's failure to gain support for the war in S. E. Asia as a reason for the victory of the North. War is a continuation of the actions of politicians (according to the Anatole Rappaport translation of Von Clausewitz), and at least in this country, politicians act in whatever way gains them the most popularity. An unpopular war, therefore, will be an exploitable issue for anyone with nothing to lose by supporting it. Heck, the Dems are already planning this very tactic. Have you not noticed?

fhios
3rd October 2003, 11:38 PM
Originally posted by Supercharts
Iraq under Saddam was a totalitarian state. It is in the process of moving from a totalitarian state to a democratic one.

So far, it's only moved from peace to war. Have we permitted the Iraqis elections?

Currently there is chaos because of this transition. So what? Were people so naive that they thought the transformation would occur in one or two weeks?

So then you agree with me that the one fool quoting the alleged poll of Iraqis that claimed they wanted an invasion was meaningless? No organization could have taken such a poll and lived to tell about it, but we had people on this site quoting it as gospel.

The Ba'athist party was, and in some cases still is, a major influence in Iraqi politics.

Even if they are, that's irrelevent to the fact that many of the irregulars in Iraq are simply trying to get us out, and will continue to do so until we leave.

Things take time. Lives will be lost. But the transformation of Iraqi society and government from a mafia-controlled state to a democracy is worth it for the sake of real mid-east peace and the culture and independence of Iraq.

Agreed, but it's not like we're seeing liberty and democracy there in any form. We're seeing a people that, to judge from current actions, were in fact capable of waging war to assert their political will, and who therefore must've accepted Saddams
's regime, but who have oppossed us by actually killing our suppossed liberators

Too bad the fellow travelers of anarchy...

Who? These words do not identify any specific people or groups.

...don't realize this. Those people look to chaos as an expression of 'freedom' regardless of the cost to the lives and well being of the people.

And therefore, they may be a little too dangerous for us to cope with!

a_unique_person
4th October 2003, 02:01 AM
Originally posted by fhios


On the other hand, Gen. Harry S. Sumner, in his critique of American war conduct in Vietnam On Strategy pointed to Nixon's failure to gain support for the war in S. E. Asia as a reason for the victory of the North. War is a continuation of the actions of politicians (according to the Anatole Rappaport translation of Von Clausewitz), and at least in this country, politicians act in whatever way gains them the most popularity. An unpopular war, therefore, will be an exploitable issue for anyone with nothing to lose by supporting it. Heck, the Dems are already planning this very tactic. Have you not noticed?

Which is what the article claims. The American public was after regenge for 9/11 in the war with Afghanistan. With Iraq, it is clearly a different matter. There is not the will to sacrifice it's own people for that ongoing conflict to achieve nothing. Democracy, if it came now, would only produce a theocracy. The possiblity of creating a democracy suitable to the victors may be unachieveable. It cannot be achieved with superior firepower.

a_unique_person
4th October 2003, 02:12 AM
Originally posted by Supercharts
Is the Monroe Doctrine dead? No colonies here. Nicaragua is free.
The Truman Doctrine? Greece is still free. Turkey is free.

I think most people would agree that these doctrines are not dead and, in their times, were very successful.

Bush Doctrine? Never heard of it. Must be something like the Roosevelt and Truman Doctrines.



Iraq has certainly hear of it, as has the rest of the world. It is the doctrine of using military force to achieve your own aims. Not clearly spelt out at home, as such, but most clearly understood around the rest of the world.



"It is not true that the United States feels any land hunger or entertains any projects as regards the other nations of the Western Hemisphere save such as are for their welfare. All that this country desires is to see the neighboring countries stable, orderly, and prosperous. Any country whose people conduct themselves well can count upon our hearty friendship. If a nation shows that it knows how to act with reasonable efficiency and decency in social and political matters, if it keeps order and pays its obligations, it need fear no interference from the United States. Chronic wrongdoing, or an impotence which results in a general loosening of the ties of civilized society, may in America, as elsewhere, ultimately require intervention by some civilized nation, and in the Western Hemisphere the adherence of the United States to the Monroe Doctrine may force the United States, however reluctantly, in flagrant cases of such wrongdoing or impotence, to the exercise of an international police power. "
http://www.uiowa.edu/~c030162/Common/Handouts/POTUS/TRoos.html



You may be naive enough to believe this view of the world, many others aren't. Even if you really do believe it is true, that is not how the rest of the world percieves it.



Granted, this was expressed in terms of nations of the Western Hemisphere - but times change. We were last to help out Europe during WWII. But the Truman Doctrine extended the Roosevelt Doctrine.



The US only joined the war after it was directly attacked. Hitler was in the process of dreaming up the nuclear bomb and the America bomber.



Iraq under Saddam was a totalitarian state. It is in the process of moving from a totalitarian state to a democratic one.
Currently there is chaos because of this transition. So what?



How many tanks does it take to impose the democracy you want?



Were people so naive that they thought the transformation would occur in one or two weeks?
The Ba'athist party was, and in some cases still is, a major influence in Iraqi politics.
Things take time. Lives will be lost. But the transformation of Iraqi society and government from a mafia-controlled state to a democracy is worth it for the sake of real mid-east peace and the culture and independence of Iraq.
Too bad the fellow travelers of anarchy don't realize this. Those people look to chaos as an expression of 'freedom' regardless of the cost to the lives and well being of the people.

I don't think this essay is making value judgements like that, it is only looking at what is and what may be achieved.