Zeuzzz
28th March 2008, 07:40 PM
Hi all.
I thought it would be a good idea to start a thread about Ball lightning to discuss any theories on how plasma structures such as this can persist for such substantial lengths of time, and how they are seemingly oblivious to gravity. It seems that this question has no concrete answer. I have seen many different models, some electrochemical explanations, nanoparticle Networks, Polymer Composites and plasma physics based explanations, but none seem to be favored, and still no-one seems able to reproduce the ball lightning phenomenon in any experiments
I found a few interesting observations associated with ball lightning, and i'm especially interested in EBL lightning.
Senior Member of the IEEE Dr. VanDevender who has studied plasmaspheres, especially EBL type, and he has made a detailed list of EBL's characteristics, and what damage you would expect to see from it.
The IEEE, Plasma Cosmology and Extreme Ball Lightning (http://www.thunderbolts.info/webnews/ieee_plasma_balllightening.htm)
"VanDevender distinguished extreme ball lightning (EBL) by the following characteristics:
• it glows in air;
• it originates from nothing visible;
• it lasts between 10 and 1200 seconds;
• it floats at about 1 meter/second;
• it is lethal or potentially lethal;
• it causes significant damage;
• it contains energy estimated at 100,000 to 1 billion Joules, far in excess of the energy density attributable to chemicals or electrostatics;
• it penetrates walls, glass and metal, generally without leaving a hole;
• it induces large currents but is in radial force equilibrium;
• it leaves black streaks on corpses without the spasm of electrocution;
• it can excavate tons of earth. "
And i also noted this publication (http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/xpl/freeabs_all.jsp?tp=&arnumber=605182&isnumber=13168), which looks at compact toroidal properties in plasma compared to ball lightning. From their toroidal plasma model they think that increasing the current input would increase the diameter.
Abstract:
Summary for only given, as follows. Long duration higher power pulses have been used to create compact toroids. Pulses of 4800 amperes and up to 200 volts have been generated for 150 milliseconds duration. Pressure is held to 0.01 to 0.001 atmosphere. Compact toroids are observed to last for more than 200 milliseconds in atmosphere after all fields are removed. Their diameter is measured to be >1 cm. Increasing the current appears to increase the diameter. An explanation is proposed that the compact toroids are electron spiral toroids (ESTs). The EST is a hollow toroid of electrons where all electrons travel in parallel paths orthogonal to the toroid circumference, and reside in the thin outer shell of the toroid. The proposed EST explanation quantitatively describes the compact toroids. It explains how the EST can be a stable current ring in high atmosphere with no external magnetic fields, and how the EST can contain many electrons with high energy. Ball lightning (BL) is often reported (15% of sightings) as a ring, and since a spinning ring appears as a sphere or ball, the EST is a candidate for the BL explanation. This paper applies the formulas of the EST to the compact toroids and to ball lightning using reported observations
Also worth a read is The Missing Science of Ball Lightning (http://www.scientificexploration.org/jse/articles/pdf/17.3_turner.pdf) by DAVID J. TURNER, which reviews some of the models proposed so far.
And The fragmented science of ball lightning (http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=1364-503X(20020115)360%3A1790%3C107%3ATFSOBL%3E2.0.CO%3 B2-E)
So what do people think is the most likely explanation for the physics behind ball lightnings many characteristics? From what i've seen it looks like a pretty open question at the moment.
I thought it would be a good idea to start a thread about Ball lightning to discuss any theories on how plasma structures such as this can persist for such substantial lengths of time, and how they are seemingly oblivious to gravity. It seems that this question has no concrete answer. I have seen many different models, some electrochemical explanations, nanoparticle Networks, Polymer Composites and plasma physics based explanations, but none seem to be favored, and still no-one seems able to reproduce the ball lightning phenomenon in any experiments
I found a few interesting observations associated with ball lightning, and i'm especially interested in EBL lightning.
Senior Member of the IEEE Dr. VanDevender who has studied plasmaspheres, especially EBL type, and he has made a detailed list of EBL's characteristics, and what damage you would expect to see from it.
The IEEE, Plasma Cosmology and Extreme Ball Lightning (http://www.thunderbolts.info/webnews/ieee_plasma_balllightening.htm)
"VanDevender distinguished extreme ball lightning (EBL) by the following characteristics:
• it glows in air;
• it originates from nothing visible;
• it lasts between 10 and 1200 seconds;
• it floats at about 1 meter/second;
• it is lethal or potentially lethal;
• it causes significant damage;
• it contains energy estimated at 100,000 to 1 billion Joules, far in excess of the energy density attributable to chemicals or electrostatics;
• it penetrates walls, glass and metal, generally without leaving a hole;
• it induces large currents but is in radial force equilibrium;
• it leaves black streaks on corpses without the spasm of electrocution;
• it can excavate tons of earth. "
And i also noted this publication (http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/xpl/freeabs_all.jsp?tp=&arnumber=605182&isnumber=13168), which looks at compact toroidal properties in plasma compared to ball lightning. From their toroidal plasma model they think that increasing the current input would increase the diameter.
Abstract:
Summary for only given, as follows. Long duration higher power pulses have been used to create compact toroids. Pulses of 4800 amperes and up to 200 volts have been generated for 150 milliseconds duration. Pressure is held to 0.01 to 0.001 atmosphere. Compact toroids are observed to last for more than 200 milliseconds in atmosphere after all fields are removed. Their diameter is measured to be >1 cm. Increasing the current appears to increase the diameter. An explanation is proposed that the compact toroids are electron spiral toroids (ESTs). The EST is a hollow toroid of electrons where all electrons travel in parallel paths orthogonal to the toroid circumference, and reside in the thin outer shell of the toroid. The proposed EST explanation quantitatively describes the compact toroids. It explains how the EST can be a stable current ring in high atmosphere with no external magnetic fields, and how the EST can contain many electrons with high energy. Ball lightning (BL) is often reported (15% of sightings) as a ring, and since a spinning ring appears as a sphere or ball, the EST is a candidate for the BL explanation. This paper applies the formulas of the EST to the compact toroids and to ball lightning using reported observations
Also worth a read is The Missing Science of Ball Lightning (http://www.scientificexploration.org/jse/articles/pdf/17.3_turner.pdf) by DAVID J. TURNER, which reviews some of the models proposed so far.
And The fragmented science of ball lightning (http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=1364-503X(20020115)360%3A1790%3C107%3ATFSOBL%3E2.0.CO%3 B2-E)
So what do people think is the most likely explanation for the physics behind ball lightnings many characteristics? From what i've seen it looks like a pretty open question at the moment.