Clinton 08 Advisor - Indianans are worthless white Ni**ers. On video

[BenBurch]

sN_nQOHj__s

She needs to throw this guy "under the bus" ASAP and in a very public way or Indiana is lost to her.

I think this is MUCH worse for her than Wright was for Obama.

Edit: HMMM... "Video No Longer Available"

[mortimer]

Video no worky.

Here it is.

0LWoJ4Ji1gE

[T.A.M.]

linky not worky...

TAM:)

[T.A.M.]

oh boy....that was not nice...what a creep

[BPSCG]

May well be a hoax (http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0508/Pennebaker_Clip_Doctoered.html).

Plus, there is no such thing as "Indianans." People from Indiana are called "Hoosiers."

Not to be confused with people from Canada...

[T.A.M.]

Listen hoser...

TAM;)

[Undesired Walrus]

It makes entirely more sense that he meant: "It doesn't matter if we win, those people [who are currently losing in the race] are ****". An entire state referred to as "those people" and "****" makes no sense.

It also seems extremely unlikely he'd be using the N word on camera to a well-known reporter during election season.

[skeptical]

v=sN_nQOHj__s

She needs to throw this guy "under the bus" ASAP and in a very public way or Indiana is lost to her.

I think this is MUCH worse for her than Wright was for Obama.

Is this recent? I wasn't aware that Stephanopoulos was on the HC staff? Also, the video looks strange, the camera is right in their face, which seems weird to me, almost like they were anticipating the under the breath slur. It's also very odd that a person who knew they were on film would make such over the top comments. Something just doesn't add up.

I'm calling shenanigans on this until I hear the backstory behind it.

[IchabodPlain]

mmm. I'm not so sure of this video. I could hear the guy saying "Those people are ************, --excuse me, in the white house". But I couldn't catch if the second bit (white n******) was also inaccurate.

[T.A.M.]

Well unlike some RWers here, I will not assume, and push the idea that is real...It may be, in which case it is despicable, but not the candidate herself. If it is a hoax, then shame on the hoaxer.

Remember the "flippin the bird" fiasco...that wasn't.

TAM:)

[skeptical]

May well be a hoax (http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0508/Pennebaker_Clip_Doctoered.html).

Plus, there is no such thing as "Indianans." People from Indiana are called "Hoosiers."

Not to be confused with people from Canada...

Crap, you beat me to it. :)

[BPSCG]

Is this recent? I wasn't aware that Stephanopoulos was on the HC staff? No. It's from 1993 (http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0508/Pennebaker_Clip_Doctoered.html).
I'm calling shenanigans on this until I hear the backstory behind it.Smart call.

[IchabodPlain]

Well unlike some RWers here, I will not assume, and push the idea that is real...It may be, in which case it is despicable, but not the candidate herself. If it is a hoax, then shame on the hoaxer.

Remember the "flippin the bird" fiasco...that wasn't.

TAM:)

Right wingers?!? What are you talking about? BenBurch started this thread. I should allow him to clarify, but from what I've read by him, he is NOT right wing. In fact, myself and BPSCG have both voiced our skepticism on the accuracy of the claims made.

Or was that comment not made about this specific thread, but claims made by others on previous threads? If so, take your baggage to the appropriate thread.

You won't assume, but you'll call the guy a creep? On what credible evidence can you make that assertion?

[BenBurch]

I saved it as a FLV file in case they manage to "memory hole" this one.

[T.A.M.]

Right wingers?!? What are you talking about? BenBurch started this thread. I should allow him to clarify, but from what I've read by him, he is NOT right wing. In fact, myself and BPSCG have both voiced our skepticism on the accuracy of the claims made.

Or was that comment not made about this specific thread, but claims made by others on previous threads? If so, take your baggage to the appropriate thread.

You won't assume, but you'll call the guy a creep? On what credible evidence can you make that assertion?

actually, the comment was in reference to how some RWers a few days ago, were convinced and all afluff because Obama Allegedly flipped Hillary the bird. It was later proven to be wrong. It was poor form, so I am reserving the right to see if this is real or not (the clinton supporter comments) before I start commenting further...if I do at all.

Sorry for the misunderstanding. I know Ben is not an RWer, for sure...lol

As for the rest, you are right it was foul of me to say so before this film was proven real, to call him a creep. It was a gut response to the comments on the tape...they were vile.

TAM:)

[T.A.M.]

I saved it as a FLV file in case they manage to "memory hole" this one.

someone on this site pointed me to a program, called VDownloader. The free version has no limits, and it allows you to download and save youtube videos as AVI files.

TAM:)

[BenBurch]

Found a similar thing for the Mac, T.A.M.

I'll hold onto this until we see if it is debunked or not.

But it does look and sound to me like he's saying that.

I know nobody who reads lips, though, to have them look at it and see if it makes sense.

[BenBurch]

Here is some more information on that;

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/05/02/clinton-adviser-claims-in_n_99810.html

Also here;

http://community.livejournal.com/obama_2008/923511.html

So he at least called them "sh**"

And the bringing up the rest from the noise floor might or might not be accurate...

[Undesired Walrus]

Maybe a thread in conspiracy theories? If anyone can call hoax its the folk in there.

[IchabodPlain]

So he at least called them "sh**"

I listened to the audio a number of times; I distinctly heard an "ing". It helps if you listen to him without reading the words underneath. Doing so is like listening to Led Zepplin backwards, while reading "Oh my sweet Satan". It's a mental trick of your eyes influencing your ears.

The director also maintains that he said sh***ing.

[T.A.M.]

video is down...that did not take long

TAM:)

[BenBurch]

It's on Rapidshare;

http://rapidshare.com/files/112066679/get_video.mp4.html

So people can decide for themselves... I'm still not sure, but I am leaning towards it being misunderstood whispering.

[BPSCG]

It's on Rapidshare;

http://rapidshare.com/files/112066679/get_video.mp4.htmlGone again! :biggrin:

[jj]

So, why does this keep disappearing? "removed by uploader" seems clear, but also very odd.

[BenBurch]

Somebody is on this like white on rice.

[ConspiRaider]

Ben -

You really have to get yourself a life, and you have to stop thinking of yourself as a U.S. Democrat. This is pathetic - even worse than you dreaming up insane hypotheticals about Hillary, then bashing her for what she MIGHT do (like support the twoofers concerning 9/11). I think this: In 6 months to a year, you'll be rather ashamed of yourself for the level of hate-mining to which you have now sunk. Hate-mining is what REPUBLICANS do, have you forgotten that?


Kantor said he was in the process of contacting "the best" libel lawyers to approach YouTube.com about the process of removing the video from its site. He suggested that The Huffington Post, too, should not print even his defense, as it would be an advancement of a non-story.

"I don't need to be defended," he wrote. "When you write it, what you are doing is extended the libel."

While Kantor said he had no idea who was behind the video or what intent he or she might have, he offered that political motives were at play.

"Many people are subject to this kind of being used in a way to try and stir people up," he said. "I can't say it more clearly, but I had never used that word... My parents would come from the grave and kill me if I used that word."



More on the story:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/05/02/clinton-adviser-claims-in_n_99810.html

[BenBurch]

I just report what is, Conspirader.

After 10 or 12 emails linking this video I decided to mention it here.

And I posted the followup stories, shedding doubt on it.

[Tsukasa Buddha]

Ben -

You really have to get yourself a life, and you have to stop thinking of yourself as a U.S. Democrat. This is pathetic - even worse than you dreaming up insane hypotheticals about Hillary, then bashing her for what she MIGHT do (like support the twoofers concerning 9/11). I think this: In 6 months to a year, you'll be rather ashamed of yourself for the level of hate-mining to which you have now sunk. Hate-mining is what REPUBLICANS do, have you forgotten that?

:i:

[T.A.M.]

Ben -

You really have to get yourself a life, and you have to stop thinking of yourself as a U.S. Democrat. This is pathetic - even worse than you dreaming up insane hypotheticals about Hillary, then bashing her for what she MIGHT do (like support the twoofers concerning 9/11). I think this: In 6 months to a year, you'll be rather ashamed of yourself for the level of hate-mining to which you have now sunk. Hate-mining is what REPUBLICANS do, have you forgotten that?




More on the story:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/05/02/clinton-adviser-claims-in_n_99810.html

I agree we should all give this crap up, but perhaps before you and other stone Ben to death, i should remind you about the "Flipping the Bird" incident, and what you had to say about it...

TAM:)

[Brainster]

Yep, I'm leaning towards this being misinterpreted. I don't think Kantor was referring to people from Indiana with the "s--t" word, and the "How would you like to be a white n----r?" part never made any sense even as a rhetorical question. The clip appears to be from The War Room, a documentary focused on Clinton's rapid response team in the 1992 campaign featuring Stephanopolous, Carville and Begala.

ETA: Director of The War Room movie says that the clip has been doctored (http://www.politico.com/blogs/bensmith/0508/Pennebaker_Clip_Doctoered.html) from his original film.

"What he says is he’s surprised Perot’s numbers are holding," said Pennebaker in a brief phone interview. "He says they must be shi**ing in the White House."

The second expletive, he said, appeared to have been entirely fabricated, with new audio dubbed onto the original movie.

Pennebaker appeared surprised and amused by the video.

"A thousand people saw that film in theaters and didn't think" the second expletive had been used, he said. "It's very clearly understandable. It's not like it was in Bulgarian."

So now the obvious question is: Can this be traced back to the Obama camp?

[ConspiRaider]

I agree we should all give this crap up, but perhaps before you and other stone Ben to death, i should remind you about the "Flipping the Bird" incident, and what you had to say about it...

Hey Doc - did you forget already? You HATE the politics of us Yanks, remember? Your high and mighty Canadian political system is just SOOOooooo superior, right?

And as I clearly explained: Obama DID flip the bird to Hillary. Just because you, as a member of the Canadian peanut gallery, LOVES to support Obama within the political dynamic which you HATE, doesn't mean it didn't occur.

If Hillary had done the exact thing that Obama did? Her DNA would no longer exist on this planet. It's what you, as a foreigner, fail to understand: The huge double standard applied to the 2 U.S. Democratic candidates. But then you don't live here, do you. So of course you couldn't comprehend these American political realities.

And what's the "we" crap? YOU are just an observer, not involved in our political process in the least.

[Brainster]

Ruh-roh! Watch this segment of the War Room starting at about 4:00 to get the context:

<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/4_wKOgMNs0U&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/4_wKOgMNs0U&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

Kantor comes in at about 4:38, and what he plainly says is "Look at Indiana. 42-40. It doesn't matter if we win. Those people are shi--ing. (To camera) Oh, excuse me. (To Stephanopolous) The White House. How would you like to be at the White House right now?"

So it's a complete fraud. Can it be tied to Obama? That's the only real question left.

[BenBurch]

Well, that's pretty low. I'd like to get my hands on the fellow who did it.

[T.A.M.]

Hey Doc - did you forget already? You HATE the politics of us Yanks, remember? Your high and mighty Canadian political system is just SOOOooooo superior, right?

And as I clearly explained: Obama DID flip the bird to Hillary. Just because you, as a member of the Canadian peanut gallery, LOVES to support Obama within the political dynamic which you HATE, doesn't mean it didn't occur.

If Hillary had done the exact thing that Obama did? Her DNA would no longer exist on this planet. It's what you, as a foreigner, fail to understand: The huge double standard applied to the 2 U.S. Democratic candidates. But then you don't live here, do you. So of course you couldn't comprehend these American political realities.

And what's the "we" crap? YOU are just an observer, not involved in our political process in the least.

CS:

So you didn't see the stills taken from that speech, from the exact moment when he was allegedly giving her "the bird", that clearly showed he had both his index AND middle finger up to scratch his face...

Is that a new kind of "flipping the bird"?

As for not liking American politics, I do not, but I can still comment on them.

The "We" I was referring to was specific to those of us on this board.

You are making dudalb sound pleasant. I am beginning to think that my like for America and its people is not equally reciprocated now...all of a sudden I am to be belittled and told off because I am a Canadian, a "foreigner" daring to have an opinion?

Well done...

TAM:)

Edit: Oh, and since you seem very offended by my daring to say that I hate American Politics, please do not assume that that equates to hating your democratic process, which I believe is the gold standard in the free world.

[jj]

And as I clearly explained: Obama DID flip the bird to Hillary.


And Gene Ray explains to us the miracle truth of the Timecube. So?


Just because you, as a member of the Canadian peanut gallery, LOVES to support Obama within the political dynamic which you HATE, doesn't mean it didn't occur.


Perhaps if the statement above was backed up with a bit of evidence, it might actually have logical meaning. As it stands, it's nothing but smear-tactics.


If Hillary had done the exact thing that Obama did? Her DNA would no longer exist on this planet.

Now, that appears to be the product of an overactive imagination in need of some careful editing.

[CFLarsen]

Doing so is like listening to Led Zepplin backwards, while reading "Oh my sweet Satan". It's a mental trick of your eyes influencing your ears.

Actually, it's "Oh here's to my sweet Satan" (http://skepticreport.com/videos/satanicmessages.htm).

It's true! :)

[boloboffin]

Hey Doc - did you forget already? You HATE the politics of us Yanks, remember? Your high and mighty Canadian political system is just SOOOooooo superior, right?

I cannot believe this. You really just have latched onto this with the fervor of a CTer. Let me show you an example of how to release your illusions:

Well, that's pretty low. I'd like to get my hands on the fellow who did it.

See how that's done? Go and do likewise.


Ruh-roh! Watch this segment of the War Room starting at about 4:00 to get the context:

<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/4_wKOgMNs0U&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/4_wKOgMNs0U&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

Kantor comes in at about 4:38, and what he plainly says is "Look at Indiana. 42-40. It doesn't matter if we win. Those people are shi--ing. (To camera) Oh, excuse me. (To Stephanopolous) The White House. How would you like to be at the White House right now?"

So it's a complete fraud. Can it be tied to Obama? That's the only real question left.

If anyone sympathizing with a Democratic candidate did this, they are idiots. The fraud is too easily proven. I humbly suggest right-wing mischief. This kind of thing bounces around and sets off fires on both sides of the Democratic fence. But I doubt that it will be anyone closely connected with any of the campaigns.

And if Mickey Kantor has anything to do with it, we will learn the identity of the tamperer. Then we can begin talking motive in earnest.

This experience has really helped me understand the place of motive in hashing out what happened in a given historical event. It might be useful to speculate on, in a way that opens your mind to search for what evidence you need. But in the final analysis, the physical evidence determines what happened and who did it. Only after this is determined can the actual motive be sussed out, if at all. You might be able to construct the most plausible and strongest motive for a certain potential actor in a situation. It is all gossamer. One single piece of physical evidence outweighs it all. It doesn't matter one bit if you had the strongest motive imaginable for an act if you didn't do it (or conspire to have it done).

Any theory of events long on motive and short on facts (especially when reliant on cherry-picked facts and contradicting others) is almost certainly wrong. That's my takeaway from this.

[BPSCG]

I cannot believe this. You really just have latched onto this with the fervor of a CTer. ...okay... and then a few paragraphs down, we get this:

The fraud is too easily proven. I humbly suggest right-wing mischief.Yes, it's easier to see the invisible hand of the nefarious Evil Doctor Karl Rove (bwwWWAAAHHHAAAHAAAHAAA...) in this than a Democrat operative or even just some stupidass lone gunman in the basement of his mom's house with too much time on his hands. Because in the world of the Dem Twoo Believers, Republicans are eeeevil and Dems are goooooood and ony Republicans would do something like this because Dems are good people who only do good things.

Don't call "Conspiracy Theorist!" while you're happily guzzling the Kool-Aid yourself.

[Damien Evans]

Hey Doc - did you forget already? You HATE the politics of us Yanks, remember? Your high and mighty Canadian political system is just SOOOooooo superior, right?

And as I clearly explained: Obama DID flip the bird to Hillary. Just because you, as a member of the Canadian peanut gallery, LOVES to support Obama within the political dynamic which you HATE, doesn't mean it didn't occur.

If Hillary had done the exact thing that Obama did? Her DNA would no longer exist on this planet. It's what you, as a foreigner, fail to understand: The huge double standard applied to the 2 U.S. Democratic candidates. But then you don't live here, do you. So of course you couldn't comprehend these American political realities.

And what's the "we" crap? YOU are just an observer, not involved in our political process in the least.

http://media001.g4tv.com/images/blog/2007/12/06/633325462873135493.jpg

[varwoche]

So you didn't see the stills taken from that speech, from the exact moment when he was allegedly giving her "the bird", that clearly showed he had both his index AND middle finger up to scratch his face... Yup. The notion that Obama flipped the bird is abject nonsense. It's a rorschach for true believers and suckers.

[T.A.M.]

I suspect, and this is just speculation, that it was some over zealous, and clearly idiotic Obama supporter. Despicable for sure.

TAM:)

[Brainster]

If anyone sympathizing with a Democratic candidate did this, they are idiots. The fraud is too easily proven. I humbly suggest right-wing mischief.

I know the classical formulation is that Republicans think Democrats are stupid, and Democrats think Republicans are evil, but I gotta say, Republicans don't think Democrats are this stupid. But I think Kantor is going to find out who did it pretty quickly.

[T.A.M.]

I am betting on it being some mischievous young person, age less than 30, affiliated with no one, but a supporter of Obama.

TAM:)

[Damien Evans]

I am betting on it being some mischievous young person, age less than 30, affiliated with no one, but a supporter of Obama.

TAM:)

I'll second that one.

[BPSCG]

I know the classical formulation is that Republicans think Democrats are stupid, and Democrats think Republicans are evil, That's not quite accurate. Dems think Republicans are evil and stupid, which is quite a trick, when you think about it. I can just imagine the mental gymnastics it takes for your average Democrat to figure out how Repubs can be both evil and stupid at the same time.

Actually, I can't imagine it. It makes my brain hurt too much.

[CFLarsen]

That's not quite accurate. Dems think Republicans are evil and stupid, which is quite a trick, when you think about it. I can just imagine the mental gymnastics it takes for your average Democrat to figure out how Repubs can be both evil and stupid at the same time.

Actually, I can't imagine it. It makes my brain hurt too much.

What would you call Jack Chick, if not those things? ;)

[Shadowdweller]

I suspect, and this is just speculation, that it was some over zealous, and clearly idiotic Obama supporter. Despicable for sure.

TAM:)
FWIW without any evidence whatsoever, I'm inclined to agree. Witness the classic Twoofer line of reasoning vis a vis zealotry and stupidity.

[T.A.M.]

That's not quite accurate. Dems think Republicans are evil and stupid, which is quite a trick, when you think about it. I can just imagine the mental gymnastics it takes for your average Democrat to figure out how Repubs can be both evil and stupid at the same time.

Actually, I can't imagine it. It makes my brain hurt too much.

While classic "evil" might take some smarts, even a fox can be considered CUNNING, and their intellect level is considerably less that humans.

TAM;)

[chipmunk stew]

That's not quite accurate. Dems think Republicans are evil and stupid, which is quite a trick, when you think about it. I can just imagine the mental gymnastics it takes for your average Democrat to figure out how Repubs can be both evil and stupid at the same time.

Actually, I can't imagine it. It makes my brain hurt too much.
You're almost there. Dems think Republicans are evil or stupid. They believe the puppet masters at the top are eeevil, and their millions of minions who vote for them are stooopid.

Of course, Republicans think the same of Dems.

[BPSCG]

You're almost there. Dems think Republicans are evil or stupid. They believe the puppet masters at the top are eeevil, and their millions of minions who vote for them are stooopid.So was Ronald Reagan eeeevil or was he stooopid?

Of course, Republicans think the same of Dems.Evidence?

[chipmunk stew]

So was Ronald Reagan eeeevil or was he stooopid?
According to Dems? Evil.

edit: And they think Bush is stupid, while Cheney & Rove are evil. (See "Bush's Brain")

Evidence?
Bill Clinton murdered people to get into the White House. The liberals want to take away our guns so the feminists, environmentalists, and gays can take over. If we elect a Democrat, they'll make religion illegal, and they'll control our lives with their atheist socialism. Criminals will be set free, and America will descend into immoral chaos.

edit: Oh yeah, and they hate America and can't wait to let the UN take over.

The people who vote for these soulless beasts are irrational dupes who have had their emotions played by victim and identity politics.


I'm intentionally painting with a broad brush here, to echo your declarative: "Dems think Republicans are evil and stupid..."

Evidence?

[Brainster]

Here's some speculation as to who created the video (http://www.mydd.com/story/2008/5/4/03345/32941):

This will be my last diary on this subject, because I am convinced I have solved it completely. I will name the person who did this, in my opinion, based on the research. I will take everyone through the evidence step by step. I'm sorry to say these people are, at the very least, Obama supporters, and not right wing trolls trying to cause trouble.

I don't know about the "detective" work here; the person involved is clearly a Hillary supporter and reportedly a Bev Harris acolyte.

[T.A.M.]

I stand by my earlier prediction on this...wait and see.

TAM:)

[DoubtingStephen]

That's not quite accurate. Dems think Republicans are evil and stupid, which is quite a trick, when you think about it.

Speaking only for one voter, I can say that I believe the Republican party is evil with no reservations at all. I certainly do not consider all people afflicted with Republican values (killing foreigners, bashing fags) evil, most of them simply lack critical thinking skills.

Perhaps if the Republican party had been using you as a scapegoat since their 1992 convention to distract voters from real issues, your sentiments about them might be more like mine.

The Republicans have been doing everything they can to alienate, disenfranchise, and make enemies of every single gay American. I'm only amazed that there are still people who consider themselves gay and Republican. I can not understand these people at all. Maybe they are making the big bucks on some nefarious Republican scheme, like manufacturing patriotic American weapons of mass destruction.

And there certainly are people who self identify as Republican who are completely and thoroughly good people and admirable citizens. This likely includes most voters who are registered in the Party of Jesus (http://partyofjesus.com/).

As far as the Demoncrats are concerned, I think they are up to 4% less evil, they do not enter into conspiracies to start wars of imperialist aggression based on a pack of lies, they just vote in favor of such economic stimulus packages for their many corporate friends.

When we consider the range of possible values included in "up to 4%" it's important to remember that 0% is included.

[BenBurch]

... I don't know about the "detective" work here; the person involved is clearly a Hillary supporter and reportedly a Bev Harris acolyte.

Don't GET me started on Bev Harris. I have nothing nice whatsoever to say about the woman; she hurt a late friend of mine and hurt him badly.

[David Wong]

Speaking only for one voter, I can say that I believe the Republican party is evil with no reservations at all.


Right, because you lack critical thinking skills and need to make those who disagree with you into comic book villains.


I certainly do not consider all people afflicted with Republican values (killing foreigners, bashing fags) evil, most of them simply lack critical thinking skills.


Your laughably simplistic and cartoonish view of Republicans indicates you either make no effort to examine the issues in depth, or are simply of low intelligence. Here's a starting point: Democrat presidents have been "killing foreigners" at a greater rate than Republicans. Gosh, you think there might actually be some legitimate policy decisions there?

In other words, you just did to Republicans what Republicans to do gays. How does it feel to know you're exactly as prejudiced as they are, if not more?

[fishbob]

Right, because you lack critical thinking skills and need to make those who disagree with you into comic book villains.

. . .

Here's a starting point: Democrat presidents have been "killing foreigners" at a greater rate than Republicans. . . .

Question time:
1 - How far back do we need to go for this statement to be accurate?

2 - Do you realize that these statements in the same post make strongly indicate that you lack critical thinking skills?

[boloboffin]

BPSCG: I included that just so I could watch you grab your pearls. Thanks for not disappointing.

[DoubtingStephen]

Your laughably simplistic and cartoonish view of Republicans indicates you either make no effort to examine the issues in depth, or are simply of low intelligence.


What makes you think it is an either/or proposition? Isn't it possible that I could make no effort to examine the issues in depth and have low intelligence?



In other words, you just did to Republicans what Republicans to do gays. How does it feel to know you're exactly as prejudiced as they are, if not more?

Do you mean the ballot measures I sponsored to restrict the civil rights of Republicans?

Or is it the way that I bring up wars of imperialist aggression to distract voters from the real issues, like the Homosexual Agenda?

[T.A.M.]

I think to pigeon hole "Republicans" into some of the far right wing social agenda stances, is to not give them fair review or credit.

For instance, there may be a good portion of "Republicans", gay or straight, who are Republican because of their fiscal views.

TAM:)

[DoubtingStephen]

I think to pigeon hole "Republicans" into some of the far right wing social agenda stances, is to not give them fair review or credit.

For instance, there may be a good portion of "Republicans", gay or straight, who are Republican because of their fiscal views.

TAM:)

I agree completely. it is not persons who are registered Republican voters to whom I object, it is the leadership of the Republican Party itself, and certain Republican (http://larrycraigvideo.com/) legislators (http://sallykern.com/). That is why in an earlier message I referred specifically to the party,
I believe the Republican party is evil

and went on to say I certainly do not consider all people afflicted with Republican values (killing foreigners, bashing fags) evil.

[T.A.M.]

I agree completely. it is not persons who are registered Republican voters to whom I object, it is the leadership of the Republican Party itself, and certain Republican (http://larrycraigvideo.com/) legislators (http://sallykern.com/). That is why in an earlier message I referred specifically to the party,


and went on to say .

Fair enough.

TAM:)

[BenBurch]

BPSCG

"Evil AND stupid" - the average Klansman???

See, they can go together.

I don't think Republicans are stupid. I don't think MOST of them are evil. But I think they are just horribly wrong.

[Pookster]

I know the classical formulation is that Republicans think Democrats are stupid, and Democrats think Republicans are evil, but I gotta say, Republicans don't think Democrats are this stupid. But I think Kantor is going to find out who did it pretty quickly.

I agree. Also, given how easy it is for most anyone with the right software to manipulate vidoes/images, it could just be some dork with too much time on their hands pulling a prank. There are plenty of shopped images out there of Bush and others that have been done just for the humor of it. Unless someone specific in one of the campaigns can be directly tied to this, then making much more of it is really silly, IMO. There will be more of this to come aimed at both party's candidates. Take it for what it is.

[skeptical]

I agree. Also, given how easy it is for most anyone with the right software to manipulate vidoes/images, it could just be some dork with too much time on their hands pulling a prank. There are plenty of shopped images out there of Bush and others that have been done just for the humor of it. Unless someone specific in one of the campaigns can be directly tied to this, then making much more of it is really silly, IMO. There will be more of this to come aimed at both party's candidates. Take it for what it is.

I agree, this is silly. In fact, its beyond silly. First, most people have never even heard of Kantor. Second, it was trivially easy to find the original clip to see that this is doctored. It's hard to see what the point of this is other than to demonstrate the some people have far too much time on their hands and no ethics, which I think most people already knew.

I haven't been paying attention to the news this weekend, has any of the MSM picked this up?

[Pookster]

I haven't been paying attention to the news this weekend, has any of the MSM picked this up?

I've not seen it in the MSM that I typically check a few times a day, at least not on their websites (CNN & MSNBC).