Americans killed by Israel

[Oliver]

Now that pissed me off: After watching "the killing zone", I start to understand why the US Media doesn't show a fair and balanced view about Israel and the Palestinians - because it would piss off a lot more people who are supposed to kiss Israel's ass - no matter what.

While the "communist british production" goes through all the general Palestine Yada Yada, the fact that the foreign Press seems to be threat just like Hamaz and Affiliates itself - including shooting US and other international Reporters, is just disgusting for a modern Democracy:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5863204188744026936
So what are the vindications for this kind of "Freedom of Press"? ... "No matter what"? :confused:

[Darth Rotor]

Now that pissed me off: After watching "the killing zone", I start to understand why the US Media doesn't show a fair and balanced view about Israel and the Palestinians - because it would piss off a lot more people who are supposed to kiss Israel's ass - no matter what.

While the "communist british production" goes through all the general Palestine Yada Yada, the fact that the foreign Press seems to be threat just like Hamaz and Affiliates itself - including shooting US and other international Reporters, is just disgusting for a modern Democracy:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5863204188744026936
So what are the vindications for this kind of "Freedom of Press"? ... "No matter what"? :confused:
Maybe it shows an Israeli disgust or contempt, in some circles, for reporters.

DR

[Oliver]

Maybe it shows an Israeli disgust or contempt, in some circles, for reporters.

DR


Well, I doubt that the Israeli Military can do whatever they want - even if it often seems that way, the report shows that their least policy is to look away. Unless, of course, there is rare international pressure.

[yairhol]

The state to which the Palestinian leadership has brought their people is very disturbing to say the least. But as long as the people choose for their government a terrorist group like Hamas, Israel will keep on getting their (Hamas's) people into Allah's hands much quicker than otherwise would happen naturally (as they would believe). Or is it the 70 virgins that they so wish to meet?
In any case the IDF does not wish to kill Palestinian civilians but will keep trying to pin point the terrorists and take them out one by one although It would be much more easier for the IDF if the terrorists did not surround themselves with women children and innocent civilians.

[Pardalis]

So what are the vindications for this kind of "Freedom of Press"? ... "No matter what"? :confused:

It seems American news outlets have reported these events.

Here, with a quick search, I found two of them:

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/16/rafah.death/
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200508/s1435845.htm

[Brainster]

Well, all I needed to see was Rachel Corrie to know where this one was going. Corrie was a terrorist supporter and general anti-American moonbat. Remember this photo of her teaching Palestinian kids how to burn the flag?

http://forums.randi.org/imagehosting/thum_9777481f339aa45c6.jpg (http://forums.randi.org/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=12045)

Remember the time that some Palestinian terrorists started to kidnap Corrie's parents (http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull&cid=1136361016016)? But they stopped out of professional courtesy.

It's too bad she died, but at least she died defending evil people.

[BenBurch]

Oh, here I thought you meant; http://www.gtr5.com/

[Demigorgon]

Those evil Isralies. They should take up more honorable fighting tactics like those of Hamas.

[firecoins]

I remember when this happaned. It was widely reported in the US. Thats why I knew about it.

[DaChew]

Well, all I needed to see was Rachel Corrie to know where this one was going. Corrie was a terrorist supporter and general anti-American moonbat. Remember this photo of her teaching Palestinian kids how to burn the flag?

I love that photo. She's acting so intense and most of the kids around her aren't even paying attention. Some of them are clearly amused at her clownish behaviour. Great to see the kids not buying the BS.

[WildCat]

Lets see, suppose you're a Palestinian civilian and a vehicle carrying Hamas honchos gets blown up by Israeli helicopters. Do you:

1. Take cover inside you house until all is clear.
<OR>
2. Grab your children and dance around the smoking crater yelling "Allah Akbar" while the helicopters are still circling?

Not really a tough call is it?

[Giggywig]

Lets see, suppose you're a Palestinian civilian and a vehicle carrying Hamas honchos gets blown up by Israeli helicopters. Do you:

1. Take cover inside you house until all is clear.
<OR>
2. Grab your children and dance around the smoking crater yelling "Allah Akbar" while the helicopters are still circling?

Not really a tough call is it?
Depends, can I bring marshmallows?

[a_unique_person]

Well, all I needed to see was Rachel Corrie to know where this one was going. Corrie was a terrorist supporter and general anti-American moonbat. Remember this photo of her teaching Palestinian kids how to burn the flag?

http://forums.randi.org/imagehosting/thum_9777481f339aa45c6.jpg

Remember the time that some Palestinian terrorists started to kidnap Corrie's parents (http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull&cid=1136361016016)? But they stopped out of professional courtesy.

It's too bad she died, but at least she died defending evil people.

Those kids look so evil....

[gtc]

Those kids look so evil....

I don't think anyone has suggested that those kids are the problem.

[Thunder]

how many thousands of jews were gassed to death because the usa refused to open its doors to "Hebrew" immigrants?

[a_unique_person]

I don't think anyone has suggested that those kids are the problem.

They appeared to be who she was defending in that photo.

[WildCat]

They appeared to be who she was defending in that photo.
I don't think she's defending anyone in that photo.

[Normal Dude]

They appeared to be who she was defending in that photo.

Well she sure showed that flag not to mess with the kids!

[Pardalis]

how many thousands of jews were gassed to death because the usa refused to open its doors to "Hebrew" immigrants?

Man, this thread is all over the place. :boggled:

[gtc]

They appeared to be who she was defending in that photo.

The mind boggles.

[a_unique_person]

The mind boggles.

Once again, you only seem to be interested in personal attacks. Have you nothing better to do with our time?

[gtc]

Once again, you only seem to be interested in personal attacks. Have you nothing better to do with our time?

I believe that my comments in this thread have been constructive (certainly more so than your comments) and do not constitute a personal attack on you.

Indeed, this particular post was not a personal attack on you as I am genuinely puzzled by your comments in this thread.

You interjected with:

Those kids look so evil....

Which I can only interpret as a wholely unwarranted suggestion that Brainache Brainster was accusing those children of being evil.

Then you suggest that by torching an Israeli and US flag with a look of absolute hatred on her face in front of young school children she was actually defending them.

My mind does indeed boggle

[a_unique_person]

I believe that my comments in this thread have been constructive (certainly more so than your comments) and do not constitute a personal attack on you.

Indeed, this particular post was not a personal attack on you as I am genuinely puzzled by your comments in this thread.

You interjected with:



Which I can only interpret as a wholely unwarranted suggestion that Brainache was accusing those children of being evil.

Then you suggest that she was defending those children in the photo by torching an Israeli and US flag with a look of absolute hatred on her face.

Brainster made the bald assertion that she was defending evil, when it is quite clear in that picture that there are children involved in this issue, and maybe he should rethink making such sweeping statements. That you choose to interpret it your way is your problem, not mine. So stop trying to get me caught up in your BS.

[Darat]

Personal attacks/bickering moved to AAH. Stop the bickering.

[WildCat]

Brainster made the bald assertion that she was defending evil, when it is quite clear in that picture that there are children involved in this issue, and maybe he should rethink making such sweeping statements. That you choose to interpret it your way is your problem, not mine. So stop trying to get me caught up in your BS.
Brainster clearly differentiated between terrorists and children.You may have noticed he calls terrorists "terrorists" and Palestinian children "Palestinian children".

I know this is very difficult for you to understand, let me know if you're still confused and we can review it once more.

[gtc]

This misunderstanding occurred because AUP misinterpreted Brainster's* post.

Brainster linked to a photo of her at a school to indicate her anti-Americanism. Later in the post he wrote that she died defending evil people.

He did not imply that those children were evil. This is obvious to me as she did not die while burning American and Israeli flags at a primary school.


*I called Brainster the wrong name in my previous post.

[Puppycow]

Now that pissed me off: After watching "the killing zone", I start to understand why the US Media doesn't show a fair and balanced view about Israel and the Palestinians - because it would piss off a lot more people who are supposed to kiss Israel's ass - no matter what.

While the "communist british production" goes through all the general Palestine Yada Yada, the fact that the foreign Press seems to be threat just like Hamaz and Affiliates itself - including shooting US and other international Reporters, is just disgusting for a modern Democracy:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5863204188744026936
So what are the vindications for this kind of "Freedom of Press"? ... "No matter what"? :confused:

Oliver, you are a German. If there is a problem with Israel, it is a result of the actions of your country, perpetrators of the Holocaust. No one in the world ever need be lectured by a German about human rights.

[mrbaracuda]

Oliver, you are a German. If there is a problem with Israel, it is a result of the actions of your country, perpetrators of the Holocaust.

That country was the German Reich, or "Nazi Germany" or even "The Third Reich", not the BRD as of today, thank you. :rolleyes:

No one in the world ever need be lectured by a German about human rights.

Right. :rolleyes:

But seriously, why stoop to such a low level just to get one into Oliver? :(
Bad Puppycow! :mad:

[Travis]

Oliver, you are a German. If there is a problem with Israel, it is a result of the actions of your country, perpetrators of the Holocaust. No one in the world ever need be lectured by a German about human rights.

If Germany were still being run by the Nazi's this argument would have some merit.

[KoihimeNakamura]

Yeah, Oliver doesn't deserve that. He needs to be beat occasionaly about his US politicial views, but not that.

[Darth Rotor]

how many thousands of jews were gassed to death because the usa refused to open its doors to "Hebrew" immigrants?
Who cares? Water under the bridge. You will note the democracies of europe were likewise reluctant to take in eimgres.

DR

[Beerina]

Who cares? Water under the bridge. You will note the democracies of europe were likewise reluctant to take in eimgres.

DR

That doesn't bash the US, however. Palestinian issue: US's fault. So many Jews died in WWII, US's fault.

Like a religionist defending creationism or some funky illogic in the Bible, a US-basher must find a tenuous path into bashing the US, then when one muddled thought path becomes clear, they relax, done for the day.


"God ordered the ancient Jews to kill the women and children, too, except for the virgins, which they can keep as sex slaves? Uhhhh, by killing them, they were doing them a nice favor. Also, they deserved it since every single non-virgin was trying to trick the Jewish males away from the Lord to worship another god.

"Yeah, that's the ticket! Done for the day! I can relax now."

[Darth Rotor]

That doesn't bash the US, however. Palestinian issue: US's fault. So many Jews died in WWII, US's fault.

Like a religionist defending creationism or some funky illogic in the Bible, a US-basher must find a tenuous path into bashing the US, then when one muddled thought path becomes clear, they relax, done for the day.

"God ordered the ancient Jews to kill the women and children, too, except for the virgins, which they can keep as sex slaves? Uhhhh, by killing them, they were doing them a nice favor. Also, they deserved it since every single non-virgin was trying to trick the Jewish males away from the Lord to worship another god.

"Yeah, that's the ticket! Done for the day! I can relax now."
I offer to Jews, Palestine advocates, and anti-Semites of varying stripes the same cynical rejoinder to the garment rending and carping:

It's not all about you. In fact, your little blot of land is rather pathetic.

*Bill Maher voice*

Get over yourselves. You are all soooooo last millenium.

DR

[Oliver]

The state to which the Palestinian leadership has brought their people is very disturbing to say the least. But as long as the people choose for their government a terrorist group like Hamas, Israel will keep on getting their (Hamas's) people into Allah's hands much quicker than otherwise would happen naturally (as they would believe). Or is it the 70 virgins that they so wish to meet?

In any case the IDF does not wish to kill Palestinian civilians but will keep trying to pin point the terrorists and take them out one by one although It would be much more easier for the IDF if the terrorists did not surround themselves with women children and innocent civilians.


How does this relate to the topic? A democratic state shooting at reporters are Terrorists as well [Terrorism = targeting civilians/creating fear[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism#cite_note-4)]. Or did you grow up under a communist-flag? :confused:

It seems American news outlets have reported these events.

Here, with a quick search, I found two of them:

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/meast/03/16/rafah.death/
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200508/s1435845.htm


Uhm, while I don't have to dig into this to come to your conclusion as well, I'm pretty sure that there is always fuss about killed [foreign] reporters, no matter where it happens - and especially if a democratic country does declare them as military targets.

So even if they didn't reported about that in a unvarnished way like "teh evil liberal Palestinelover UK-Media Movie" does, there is no doubt that American outlets reported about it as well.

Nor did anyone claimed something else.
Nor is it related to the question about Freedom of Press or the justification for killing reporters.
Nor did I whine and reported you for that. [Tweak, tweak] :p

t's too bad she died, but at least she died defending evil people.


:confused: Did you even see the british Channel4 Docu - or have any related objective/fair&balanced education about both sides of the story to come to such a non-skeptical statement?

Those evil Isralies. They should take up more honorable fighting tactics like those of Hamas.


Strawmen - and not even a good one. Here's a lousy one of mine: Iran declared the CIA a Terrorist Organisation - Israel supports the US and the CIA. Ergo: Israel = Terrorists. Hey, throwing the Terror-Card as some kind of last [or first] resort is a lot of fun. :)

Anyway: Off-Topic since the OP isn't about Terrorism - unless, of course, you agree that Democracies shooting at Reporters - who identified themselves as such, are Terrorists.

how many thousands of jews were gassed to death because the usa refused to open its doors to "Hebrew" immigrants?


What do you mean by that? :confused:

Oliver, you are a German. If there is a problem with Israel, it is a result of the actions of your country, perpetrators of the Holocaust. No one in the world ever need be lectured by a German about human rights.


While my German Grandparents had to flee White Russia thanks to a Austrian Fritzl during the early 40's - and could be considered as victims of this clown as well, I don't know how this relates to the topic - nor does it relate to my torturing Generation, does it?

[Pardalis]

and especially if a democratic country does declare them as military targets.

Were they targeted as military targets by the state of Israel?

there is no doubt that American outlets reported about it as well.

Nor did anyone claimed something else.
Nor is it related to the question about Freedom of Press or the justification for killing reporters.So what did you mean by this?:

I start to understand why the US Media doesn't show a fair and balanced view about Israel and the Palestinians

snip

So what are the vindications for this kind of "Freedom of Press"? ... "No matter what"? :confused:

[webfusion]

DR -- It's not all about you. In fact, your little blot of land is rather pathetic.

Agreed.

Now, if we were fighting over a paradise like Belize, I would take exception to this comment.
http://www.il-ireland.com/il/promos/orchid_bay/images/Belize-Beach.jpg

[Brainster]

Some more favorite Rachel Corrie moments:

The Rachel Corrie Memorial Committee of Vancouver held a breakfast in her honor. And, no kidding, it was a pancake breakfast (http://moonbattery.com/archives/2006/03/pancake_breakfa.html).

When protests resulted (http://brainster.blogspot.com/2006_04_16_archive.html#114565406695190407) in a Rachel Corrie play having to change its venue, the headline on the article was a tad unfortunate:

Play Pushed Underground

Much like the protagonist.

Here's a good article on some other Rachels (http://www.tomgrossmedia.com/TheForgottenRachels.html) who have not been as celebrated.

RACHEL Thaler, aged 16, was blown up at a pizzeria in an Israeli shopping mall. She died after an 11-day struggle for life following a suicide bomb attack on a crowd of teenagers on 16 February 2002.

Even though Thaler was a British citizen, born in London, where her grandparents still live, her death has never been mentioned in a British newspaper.

[IchabodPlain]

deleted

[Pardalis]

Some more favorite Rachel Corrie moments:

The Rachel Corrie Memorial Committee of Vancouver held a breakfast in her honor. And, no kidding, it was a pancake breakfast (http://moonbattery.com/archives/2006/03/pancake_breakfa.html).

When protests resulted (http://brainster.blogspot.com/2006_04_16_archive.html#114565406695190407) in a Rachel Corrie play having to change its venue, the headline on the article was a tad unfortunate:

Play Pushed Underground

Much like the protagonist.

You may disagree with her and her politics, and may have good reasons to, but to joke about her death with play-on-words is rather distasteful.

Regardless of what she's done or stood for, this was a young woman who died a horrible and needless death. Show some respect please.

[a_unique_person]

Some more favorite Rachel Corrie moments:

The Rachel Corrie Memorial Committee of Vancouver held a breakfast in her honor. And, no kidding, it was a pancake breakfast (http://moonbattery.com/archives/2006/03/pancake_breakfa.html).

When protests resulted (http://brainster.blogspot.com/2006_04_16_archive.html#114565406695190407) in a Rachel Corrie play having to change its venue, the headline on the article was a tad unfortunate:


Maybe the people at the breakfast don't read LGF?

[Daylight]

Israel killing Americans, I’m amazed Darth of all people didn’t bring up the USS Liberty

http://www.gtr5.com/ (http://www.gtr5.com/)

A most disgusting episode.

[jsiv]

Did you even see the british Channel4 Docu - or have any related objective/fair&balanced education about both sides of the story to come to such a non-skeptical statement?
He he.

[Darth Rotor]

Israel killing Americans, I’m amazed Darth of all people didn’t bring up the USS Liberty

http://www.gtr5.com/ (http://www.gtr5.com/)

A most disgusting episode.
I have already commented sufficiently on that topic that I did not think it warranted a derail in this thread. While I thank you for the nod, I do not consider a rich kid who bought the agit prop hook, line and sinker to be worthy of association with the sailors of USS Liberty. Separate issues, and I'd rather it stay that way.

DR

[WildCat]

How does this relate to the topic?
This thread had a topic? It started off wit your ignorant rant about how the US media doesn't report the things in your 50 minute video. Soon thereafter, US news reports about the things in your video were linked to. Your "topic" was proven to be a product of your ongoing ignorance about the US and the US media.

In other words, same old same old from Oliver.

[mrbaracuda]

or stood for

*snicker* She didn't stand too long I guess! :D
Sorry. :(

He he.

Heh indeed.

[Brainster]

You may disagree with her and her politics, and may have good reasons to, but to joke about her death with play-on-words is rather distasteful.

Regardless of what she's done or stood for, this was a young woman who died a horrible and needless death. Show some respect please.

You're right of course, and if you look at my first post on this thread I did say that it was a shame she had to die. But I do get sick of people promoting her as some sort of noble person. She was a terrorist supporter.

[a_unique_person]

You're right of course, and if you look at my first post on this thread I did say that it was a shame she had to die. But I do get sick of people promoting her as some sort of noble person. She was a terrorist supporter.

I thought she was supporting the Palestinian people's cause in their occupation by Israel. That does not make you a terrorist supporter. As I pointed out earlier, she didn't seem to be surrounded by terrorists in that picture.

[a_unique_person]

I have already commented sufficiently on that topic that I did not think it warranted a derail in this thread. While I thank you for the nod, I do not consider a rich kid who bought the agit prop hook, line and sinker to be worthy of association with the sailors of USS Liberty. Separate issues, and I'd rather it stay that way.

DR

I wrote to one of them to see if they had caught up with the latest news. He was very bitter at the personal attacks they had to endure, being branded anti-semites and racists.

[SDC]

That country was the German Reich, or "Nazi Germany" or even "The Third Reich", not the BRD as of today, thank you. :rolleyes:



Right. :rolleyes:

But seriously, why stoop to such a low level just to get one into Oliver? :(
Bad Puppycow! :mad:

While I don't plan to start a "German culpability" thread -- heaven forbid -- I have to point out that the government of the BRD precisely recognized its special responsibility to Israel. Hence the payments to survivors and continued support of Israel.

Which was illustrated for me by the abundance of Mercedes used as taxis, though that was 1989. ETA and maybe not surprising anyhow, in general. Taxi choice is not my specialty.

[SDC]

I wrote to one of them to see if they had caught up with the latest news. He was very bitter at the personal attacks they had to endure, being branded anti-semites and racists.

This thread is somewhat muddled, as several have pointed out. Which class of "one of them"/ "he" are you referring to? That is, not the individual, but the group. Honestly, I'm confused.

[a_unique_person]

This thread is somewhat muddled, as several have pointed out. Which class of "one of them"/ "he" are you referring to? That is, not the individual, but the group. Honestly, I'm confused.

One of the survivors of the Liberty.

[Darth Rotor]

One of the survivors of the Liberty.
Ennes?

The problem with the crew's anger at having been set up, and the cover up, is that parts of that emotion are co-opted by the general "Israel is the source of all evil in the world" meme, and used/abused by persons who consider Liberty a data point in a larger context.

The guys who were actually involved are as pissed at the US government, and their chain of command at the upper levels (Ennes made some pointed critiques of the message traffic gaffes in his book) as they are at the Israelis.

DR

[moon1969]

Do the USA media allso talk about how Hamas fires rockets into city of Sderot in Israel or are you one of those people who kisses Hamas"s ass and sees them as a victim? LOL Oh yeah and media in any country doesn"t talk about Chechnya. Ramzan Kadyrov is a dictator. Just ask Anna Politkovskaya oh no wait you can"t because she is dead. Oh yeah then her is what some russian said about Kadyrov:

"He acts like a medieval tyrant."

-Movladi Baisarov-

[a_unique_person]

QED