[Merged]Is the "truth" movement the real 911 Conspiracy?

[BenBurch]

You know, if I were George Bush, and I didn't want the Really Hard questions about 9/11/01 to even be considered, - the questions like "Why did you allow your attorney general to focus on pornography rather than terrorism when the Clinton transition team had told you what a dire threat it was?" - could I do better than to create the "truth" movement?

Honestly I don't think so.

Discussion?

[twinstead]

One word: COINTELPRO

[Brainache]

I think that was the gist of that South Park 9/11 episode.

[BenBurch]

I think that was the gist of that South Park 9/11 episode.

Not a TV-watcher (except the weather channel and shuttle launches)

What episode? I'll look it up!

[T.A.M.]

yah, don't go down that rabbit hole Ben, a truther waits at the bottom with Koolaid and an Alex Jones DVD Box Set.

TAM:)

[BenBurch]

yah, don't go down that rabbit hole Ben, a truther waits at the bottom with Koolaid and an Alex Jones DVD Box Set.

TAM:)

Maybe! But I'll being my Dachshunds along. Nothing in a rabbit hole can withstand a Wiener Dog.

Scurvy Gherkin Power!!!

[T.A.M.]

The South Park episode is called "Mystery of the Urinal Deuce"

A classic.

TAM:)

[mrbaracuda]

Alex Jones DVD Box Set.

Sounds like a good way of not just killing a couple of brain cells! :p

[Texas]

You know, if I were George Bush, and I didn't want the Really Hard questions about 9/11/01 to even be considered, - the questions like "Why did you allow your attorney general to focus on pornography rather than terrorism when the Clinton transition team had told you what a dire threat it was?" - could I do better than to create the "truth" movement?

Honestly I don't think so.

Discussion?

Uhh was that while the transition team was stealing all of the "w" keys from the computers? :) Aside from that, you have probably started another round of paranoia in truther land. KUDOS

[BenBurch]

The South Park episode is called "Mystery of the Urinal Deuce"

A classic.

TAM:)

Ah hah!

Now, were I a user of illegal file-sharing, I'd be watching that in (looking) 24 minutes...

[BenBurch]

Uhh was that while the transition team was stealing all of the "w" keys from the computers? :) Aside from that, you have probably started another round of paranoia in truther land. KUDOS

Correct! The "w" keys were removed to keep the incoming administration from typing the name "Osama bin Laden!" Oh. Wait...

[BenBurch]

Uhh was that while the transition team was stealing all of the "w" keys from the computers? :) Aside from that, you have probably started another round of paranoia in truther land. KUDOS

NWO Kitty says I get some extra coffee for that one. :)

[Blender Head]

Yes, it is.

Genius, really.

[Grimes]

Ah hah!

Now, were I a user of illegal file-sharing, I'd be watching that in (looking) 24 minutes...

Actually, you can watch all the South Park episodes legally and for free at http://www.southparkstudios.com/episodes/. The one you want is from season 10.

[Drudgewire]

Ah hah!

Now, were I a user of illegal file-sharing, I'd be watching that in (looking) 24 minutes...

You can watch it right now legally. :)

http://www.southparkstudios.com/

SP official site has all the episodes online. Just click season 10 and move your mouse over the episodes to find it.

ETA: CURSE YOU GRIMES!! http://www.lethalwrestling.com/upload/fist4su.gif

[Confuseling]

My first post here was this very question in politics.

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=107415

[Alareth]

Ah hah!

Now, were I a user of illegal file-sharing, I'd be watching that in (looking) 24 minutes...

Why? Every episode of South Park is available to watch for free at http://www.southparkstudios.com/episodes/

Edit: Damn you all!!!!

[Drudgewire]

Hay guys iz there anywhere to watch teh south parkz 4 free??

[BenBurch]

Thanks!

[Brainache]

Why? Every episode of South Park is available to watch for free at http://www.southparkstudios.com/episodes/

Edit: Damn you all!!!!

Note for Aussies: This site won't work for .au web addresses. (I didn't try using a proxy tho') They are apparently sorting out their contract with SBS regarding net access.

[Edmund Standing]

Same for Brits as well:

We are working hard to resolve our pre-existing contractual obligations and bring you Full Episodes as soon as possible.

EDIT:

It's online here: http://www.123video.nl/playvideos.asp?MovieID=215954

[Klimax]

Good to see I am not alone...

Those from TM are doint too big mistakes and making any other theory so bad ,that nobody will take them into consideration...meaning NWO will have a free pass!!!:D

Where I can apply? NWO looks :cool:...


:D :alien001:

[Thunder]

the truth club is one of the greatest stumbling blocks we have to finding the missing elements of 9-11.

the best way to stop a search for truth is to insert loonies and crackpots to make the search for truth seem like the work of insane people and conspiracy theorists.

[Clippy]

It seems, based on Zawahiri's recent statement, that truthers are able to get to high-level al Qaeda in their borderland hideouts. Ok, it's only getting under the skin, but at least there were no civilians killed as collateral damage. Perhaps truthers and debunkers are actually on the same side in the War on Terror... ;)

[Confuseling]

nevermind.

[Axiom_Blade]

I was looking around the 'net the other day, and found this article, "The Truth About the 9/11 Truth Movement": (http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2008/04/07/8126/)

The people who are trying, with some degree of success, to undermine these basic endeavors of the progressive movement and the progressive media need to be exposed for what they are - whether they fall into the category of well-meaning but misguided fanatics or undercover government agents quite purposefully and systematically working to spread disinformation and sow confusion and distrust. And, beyond any reasonable doubt, the “Truth Movement” contains both of these elements.

Ah, yes, it's finally happened.
People are finally starting to point fingers at the 9-11 deniers as being "government shills" themselves!

So, how about it, folks? Do you think it's plausible? Is the real conspiracy that 9/11 Truth and the others are a COINTELPRO-style operation to discredit the left?

(BTW: Somebody named Gravy called, he wants his title (http://polyhelix.org/gravy/911tm/) back!)

[Confuseling]

Sorry buddy, beaten to it

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=113380

[GwionX]

It is my opinion that many of the "twoof leaders" are neo-nazi's. Look no further than Meyssan, Hufschmid, serendipity li, American free press, and Carol Valentine to see where the seeds of conspiracy grew from.. then see what common denominator they all have.

Listen/watch Alex Jones' rants and imagine the words he spews in German.

I think the truth movement is made up of radical libertarians... so far-right, they are very very wrong.

[Thunder]

actual FBI cointelpro? i doubt it.

but they do truly give the anti-war movement a horrible name. every event that that truthers jump into is ruined by their shenanegans and their antics.

[Axiom_Blade]

actual FBI cointelpro? i doubt it.


Me too.
I think the FBI would be much more successful.

[Sword_Of_Truth]

This is similar to something I have wondered about the notorious Westboro Baptists of "God Hates F_gs" fame.

The gay community couldn't ask for a better enemy.

But could they create one?

[BenBurch]

This is similar to something I have wondered about the notorious Westboro Baptists of "God Hates F_gs" fame.

The gay community couldn't ask for a better enemy.

But could they create one?

You know, I have wondered too; Could anybody really be that hateful and insane? But you know, that is a dumb question when the century I was born in had Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot, Mao, et. al.

We're just fortunate these guys never had any real power over anybody.

Applies to truthers, too.

[Axiom_Blade]

We're just fortunate these guys never had any real power over anybody.

Applies to truthers, too.

It's true.
As it is, the 9-11 deniers are just sad, and I kind of feel sorry for them. Every protest I go to, there's a little clique of them, moseying around, passing out flyers. Nobody talks to them. They're just all alone in their crazy paranoid world.

[BenBurch]

It's true.
As it is, the 9-11 deniers are just sad, and I kind of feel sorry for them. Every protest I go to, there's a little clique of them, moseying around, passing out flyers. Nobody talks to them. They're just all alone in their crazy paranoid world.

They are as unwelcome as the Anarchists are. (Sometimes I wish we could bribe the police to look the other way so we can show them what Anarchy really means.)

[Furi]

They are as unwelcome as the Anarchists are. (Sometimes I wish we could bribe the police to look the other way so we can show them what Anarchy really means.)


Your not the only one there, I love that they have organisers for the Anarchist events. and that some Anarchists protest the lack of toilet facilities or that disabled access to the main field was hampered by the rain. :facepalm:

I think I shall start a procrastinators event, is tomorrow good for everyone

[Clippy]

Too simplistic.

Anarchists (the ones I know) oppose (or at least challenge the justification for) authoritarian (those backed by threat of violence) forms of order.

This is a good read:

http://truthaction.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2925

[deep]

the truth club is one of the greatest stumbling blocks we have to finding the missing elements of 9-11.

the best way to stop a search for truth is to insert loonies and crackpots to make the search for truth seem like the work of insane people and conspiracy theorists.


Are you suggesting that all 220 PhDs are "loonies or crackpots"? As well as the 400+ Architects & Engineers who support a new investigation?

If you were allowed to speak with these people before hearing their opinion about 9/11, do you believe you could identify them as "loonies or crackpots"? Or is it just their opinion about 9/11 that defines them as such?

[gtc]

The brainstrust at 911oz (http://www.911oz.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1787) have decided that no-planers are plants to make the truth movement look crazy and to distract people from the truth that WTC7 was demolished to destroy the evidence about Enron.

This is the same group (http://www.911oz.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=1794) who have decided that Screw Loose Change and 911 Myths are both anonymous and treasonous sites.


Note for Aussies: This site won't work for .au web addresses. (I didn't try using a proxy tho') They are apparently sorting out their contract with SBS regarding net access.

Good on them for getting Russ and 'tugger' to let us know.

[BenBurch]

Too simplistic.

Anarchists (the ones I know) oppose (or at least challenge the justification for) authoritarian (those backed by threat of violence) forms of order.

This is a good read:

http://truthaction.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2925



Well, then, they should call themselves Anarcho-syndicalists. But the ones I know think that they are against ALL order. They don't want cops. They don't want property. They WANT Bellum omnium contra omnes.

[Brainache]

Well, then, they should call themselves Anarcho-syndicalists. But the ones I know think that they are against ALL order. They don't want cops. They don't want property. They WANT Bellum omnium contra omnes.

Do they ever say why they think this situation would be desirable? Or are they saying that that is what we have now, but blind sheep like me just don't see it for what it is?

[Clippy]

Well, then, they should call themselves Anarcho-syndicalists. But the ones I know think that they are against ALL order. They don't want cops. They don't want property. They WANT Bellum omnium contra omnes.

I would avoid these people :)

[BenBurch]

Do they ever say why they think this situation would be desirable? Or are they saying that that is what we have now, but blind sheep like me just don't see it for what it is?

I don't think they understand the consequences. Almost to a (wo)man they are immature posterior excretory orifices. And they think they are tough; Well I hung with bikers and worse and those guys will eat them for dinner. If we had REAL anarchy they would be whimpering for the cops to come and save them.

Now this is very different from those who want a very different KIND of order based on a non-hierarchical system, like the anarcho-syndicalists. Of course that kind of system can get abused too; That is sort of how Robespierre was able to become dictator if I recall correctly. (I haven't re-read that bit of history in 35 years.) It works in small-ish communes sometimes, and were the world divided into itty-bitty self-governing units as Rousseau would have had it, might actually be viable. Modern attempts at anarcho-syndicalism seem to concentrate on labor relations exclusively (The IWW) and that might have some hope of working.

[Brainache]

I don't think they understand the consequences. Almost to a (wo)man they are immature posterior excretory orifices. And they think they are tough; Well I hung with bikers and worse and those guys will eat them for dinner. If we had REAL anarchy they would be whimpering for the cops to come and save them.

Now this is very different from those who want a very different KIND of order based on a non-hierarchical system, like the anarcho-syndicalists. Of course that kind of system can get abused too; That is sort of how Robespierre was able to become dictator if I recall correctly. (I haven't re-read that bit of history in 35 years.) It works in small-ish communes sometimes, and were the world divided into itty-bitty self-governing units as Rousseau would have had it, might actually be viable. Modern attempts at anarcho-syndicalism seem to concentrate on labor relations exclusively (The IWW) and that might have some hope of working.

OK. All I know about Anarcho Sydicalism comes from Monty Python. Even so it sounds like something that might work in a small community...
I do know that strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government.