Were Cro-Magnons Biologically Engineered by Extraterrestrials?

[Abdul Alhazred]

A bit of woo-wooism from Pravda, no less:

Were Cro-Magnons Biologically Engineered by Extraterrestrials? (http://english.pravda.ru/science/19/94/378/10931_Voron.html)

Indeed, how to answer this question? Were we or were not? I believe the following answer may be true. Scientists cannot find the "Missing link", i.e. the form that was an immediate ancestor of the original Homo Sapiens, referred to as the Cro-Magnon man; while they found and continue finding remains of many less advanced forms that existed much time before.

In the mean time, the remains of this form, the supposed immediate ancestor that evolved into Homo Sapiens, should be met often enough (just like those of Neanderthal, moreover this form, which was not Homo Sapiens' ancestor, existed approximately at the same time): else how could this form engender the Cro-Magnons? Evolution takes many generations, and next generation has more representatives of a species than the previous one. The probability of finding remains increases with the number of generations and beings lived.

[espritch]

In the old Soviet Union there were two news papers, Pravda (News) and Tas (Truth). The old joke was that there was no truth in News and no news in Truth.

I guess in the new Capitalist Russia, Pravda's decided to go the National Enquirer route.

[Jeff Corey]

I'm sure I'll be corrected if I'm wrong, but aren't Cro-Magnons classified as Homo Sapiens, as we are?

[Loki]

Were Cro-Magnons Biologically Engineered by Extraterrestrials?
No.

[kookbreaker]

Originally posted by Jeff Corey
I'm sure I'll be corrected if I'm wrong, but aren't Cro-Magnons classified as Homo Sapiens, as we are?

The Smithsonian Institute seems to think so.

[pupdog]

Furthermore, Neanderthal is not considered to be ancestral to modern H sapiens. PBS recently aired a show that considered the possibility that the two groups interbred (I guess that helped make up for the earlier airing of Creationist pablum, "Unocking the Mystery of Life").

[Abdul Alhazred]

Originally posted by espritch
In the old Soviet Union there were two news papers, Pravda (News) and Tas (Truth). The old joke was that there was no truth in News and no news in Truth.

I guess in the new Capitalist Russia, Pravda's decided to go the National Enquirer route.

Correction: "Pravda" means "truth", TASS is a wire service (still around) and the name an acronym for something or other neutral in Russian.

Pravda was the Soviet Government paper. The other paper you are thinking of was the Communist Party paper Isvestia.

Isvestia is now (no sh*t) owned by Hearst.

Pravda is still Russian owned and its politics are supposedly "Brown-Red" (Russian Nationalist with Commie nostalgia).

Pravda these days is more like Weekly World News than The Enquirer. Unlike The Enquirer of my youth, which concentrated on the gruesome, The Enquirer of today is more movie star gossip than anything else.

[Chaos]

Originally posted by pupdog
Furthermore, Neanderthal is not considered to be ancestral to modern H sapiens. PBS recently aired a show that considered the possibility that the two groups interbred (I guess that helped make up for the earlier airing of Creationist pablum, "Unocking the Mystery of Life").

As far as I know, the Neanderthal and the Cro Magnon lived at about the same time; they shared common ancestors. You might say the Cro Magnon is today´s humans´ father, while the Neanderthal is the uncle. ;)
And, yes, they did some interbreeding, even for many generations; however, it is not known what ultimately happened with these "mixed" humans.
By the way, both the Neanderthal and the Cro Magnon were Homo Sapiens; all prehistoric humans from a certain point on are Homo Sapiens Whatsoever. We today are Homo Sapiens Sapiens.

[Khonshu]

The distinction between Cro-Magnon and modern humans is mostly based on archeology, not anthropology. The dividing line is based on when modern behavior appeared; biologically there doesn't seem to be much, if any, difference. The differences are more in how they lived - how their social groups were structured, their artwork & tools, how they cared for the dead, etc.

Neanderthalis, on the other hand, was very much physically different than modern man. Shorter & more robust, with little evidence of complex social behavior until near extinction. However, they were very successful in their time & place, being the first primates evolved to survive in cold climates.

And there seems to be very little evidence that the Neanderthals did in fact breed with early modern humans. It's an interesting theory, but there's not a whole lot of evidence supporting it. Doesn't mean it didn't happen, though, there's not a lot of hard evidence of that, either. DNA evidence seems to indicate that we are not descended from Neanderthals, but the number of DNA samples that can be extracted from 35,000 year old Neanderthal skeletons is far too limited to say for certain either way.

[Lord Kenneth]

Originally posted by Abdul Alhazred


Correction: "Pravda" means "truth", TASS is a wire service (still around) and the name an acronym for something or other neutral in Russian.

Pravda was the Soviet Government paper. The other paper you are thinking of was the Communist Party paper Isvestia.

Isvestia is now (no sh*t) owned by Hearst.

Pravda is still Russian owned and its politics are supposedly "Brown-Red" (Russian Nationalist with Commie nostalgia).

Pravda these days is more like Weekly World News than The Enquirer. Unlike The Enquirer of my youth, which concentrated on the gruesome, The Enquirer of today is more movie star gossip than anything else.

Weekly World News, much like The Onion, is satire.

[Abdul Alhazred]

Originally posted by Lord Kenneth


Weekly World News, much like The Onion, is satire.

Quite so. "Hillary has affair with alien. Bill: I thought she was a Lesbian".

My statement about Pravda still stands, even if they take themselves seriously.

[Chaos]

Originally posted by Khonshu
The distinction between Cro-Magnon and modern humans is mostly based on archeology, not anthropology. The dividing line is based on when modern behavior appeared; biologically there doesn't seem to be much, if any, difference. The differences are more in how they lived - how their social groups were structured, their artwork & tools, how they cared for the dead, etc.

I don´t know that much about that. However, I recall reading that "a Cro Magnon, dressed in modern clothes, would not stick out among a crowd of modern-day people".


Neanderthalis, on the other hand, was very much physically different than modern man. Shorter & more robust, with little evidence of complex social behavior until near extinction. However, they were very successful in their time & place, being the first primates evolved to survive in cold climates.

Again, I do not know that much about them.


And there seems to be very little evidence that the Neanderthals did in fact breed with early modern humans. It's an interesting theory, but there's not a whole lot of evidence supporting it. Doesn't mean it didn't happen, though, there's not a lot of hard evidence of that, either. DNA evidence seems to indicate that we are not descended from Neanderthals, but the number of DNA samples that can be extracted from 35,000 year old Neanderthal skeletons is far too limited to say for certain either way.

There are at least a few finding of fossiles that were a mix of both Neanderthal and Cro Magnon traits - a mix that had probably formed over several generations.

[PygmyPlaidGiraffe]

http://www.palantir.net/cgi-bin/image.cgi?thumb/dawn06.jpg

[Bikewer]

They must have seen that old Brit sci-fi movie, the one with "Professer Quatermass", the buried Martian spaceship, and the proto-human remains.

"Five Million Years to Earth", actually, just looked it up. Pretty good flick.

"Like an 'orrible dwarf, it was....."

[kookbreaker]

Originally posted by Bikewer
They must have seen that old Brit sci-fi movie, the one with "Professer Quatermass", the buried Martian spaceship, and the proto-human remains.

"Five Million Years to Earth", actually, just looked it up. Pretty good flick.


Its especially amusing when you realise how much of the storyline the X-files took from that movie for their story arc.

[Bikewer]

Apparently, there were a number of Quatermass films, but I don't recall ever seeing any but the Five Million Years to Earth number.

Probably available on the web somewhere.....

[EdipisReks]

Cro-Magnons were made by the Mi-Go. look, it's obvious! they both have hyphens and everything!

[Correa Neto]

Quatermass and the Pit. Wasn´t this the name?

Von Daniken must have seen this movie also.

[Bikewer]

Yep...According to the Internet Movie Database (great resource) that was the original title, and the one used in the UK. It was titled Five Million Years to Earth for US release.
( I guess nobody on this side of the pond knew Quatermass)

Couple of good scenes in the thing, the Martian insectiod pogrom pulled up as a "race memory", the really nasty-looking decomposing Martians. There was the sort of Lovcraftian searching through the old archives about "Hobbs End" as well.

Several grades above the usual sci-fi flick of the period.

[EdipisReks]

are the quartermass movie and shows worth seeing? i was a big fan of doctor who as a child, so i am not completely ignorant of english science fiction teevee (i'm a huge fan of red dwarf, but i'm not sure that this show really counts).

[Correa Neto]

I like a lot that movie. Saw it on TV when I was an early teenager. Many things on this movie were later "recycled" (and some people think of them as quite original). Just compare the insect necropsy and the dissecation of Alien´s facehugger...

Not to mention Von Daniken...

edited to add
Yes, its worthwile to watch, IMHO. This one has an interesting script (will not enter into any spoliers). But do not expect top-of-the-line FX.

[Loki]

EdipisReks,

... i was a big fan of doctor who as a child ...
The ABC (public broadcaster) here in Australia has just started rescreening Doctor Who from the very first episode. My 3 year old loves the Daleks already!!

[Bikewer]

I always wondered if the Daleks (complete with plumber's helper antennae!) were the prototype for the "Veeger" Star Trek episode.

"Sterilize, Sterilize"......