Mythical Monsters Wanted - Suggestions Please

[H3LL]

My library used to have a good collection of mythical creature reference books but several moves and continents later I no longer have them nor can find replacements.

A new addition to my collection is very typical of the type of material I am after.

The Dictionary of Mythology: An A-Z of Themes, Legends and Heroes (http://www.foulsham.com/product1014.htm)

It contains short passages on various mythical beings and great cross-referencing. Jesus and his other fairy-land creatures are conspicuously missing from the above, although quite comprehensive on Hindu gods and other religions, but I have Big Sky Daddy and co. in the various Bibles, so it doesn't matter much.

I would like something similar that concentrates more on specific areas, such as:


Monsters/Non-Human creatures (Think D&D Monster Manual but more 'factual' - if that makes sense).
Dragons - Looking at the world-wide instances in myths, legends and folklore.
Norse mythology
Celtic mythology
Ancient Greek mythology
Roman mythology
Monsters in literature - e.g. Leiber, Lewis, Lovecraft, Tolkein etc.
Demons and similar worldwide.
Not books on the subject in detail but quick reference material. A-Zs, Dictionaries, encyclopedias etc.

So if I wanted to find out the who/what/where about, say, Fialar I can do so without using the Interweb tubes and have some quick bed-time reading to hand. Duplication of references is not a problem.

So what do you have or recommend?

BTW, if they contain pictures, all for the better. :D





ETA:I have a suspicion that I'm missing out on a whole area of fun beasties from native American and Australian myths - A good quick introduction to them would also be handy - Maybe starting with the web.

[aggle-rithm]

Have you checked out this article? (http://www.skepticreport.com/lighterside/microcrypt.htm)

[H3LL]

Have you checked out this article? (http://www.skepticreport.com/lighterside/microcrypt.htm)

"What other flatworm do you know of that breathes fire?" he asked rhetorically. "What other invertebrate can pass through walls? It has to be this one."

:D :D

Not quite what I'm after but thanks for the smile.

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[ImaginalDisc]

Barlowe's Guide to Extraterrestrials (http://www.amazon.com/Barlowes-Guide-Extraterrestrials-Science-Literature/dp/0894803247) is a classic.

You might want check out the Encyclopedia of Witchcraft and Demonology. Also well illustrated, it focuses on the western phenomenea of "witches" demons, etc. I'd link to it, but this server here blocks searches involving the word "demon."

ETA: Here's a nice springboard, Monstropedia. (http://www.monstropedia.org/index.php?title=Main_Page) I'm deeply dissapointed that they left out The Colour out of Space, though.

[Madalch]

Dragonlore (http://www.dragonlore.co.uk)

[fuelair]

Barlowe's Guide to Extraterrestrials (http://www.amazon.com/Barlowes-Guide-Extraterrestrials-Science-Literature/dp/0894803247) is a classic.

You might want check out the Encyclopedia of Witchcraft and Demonology. Also well illustrated, it focuses on the western phenomenea of "witches" demons, etc. I'd link to it, but this server here blocks searches involving the word "demon."

ETA: Here's a nice springboard, Monstropedia. (http://www.monstropedia.org/index.php?title=Main_Page) I'm deeply dissapointed that they left out The Colour out of Space, though.You mean the first Predator story IIRC (invisible, destroys it's prey/targets, invisible (except for faint wavy light effect as it moves).

[ImaginalDisc]

You mean the first Predator story IIRC (invisible, destroys it's prey/targets, invisible (except for faint wavy light effect as it moves).

Unlike the Predator, it's intangible and even kills by its very presence. It also seems utterly disinterested in humans except as food temporarily.

[Tatsu]

The Flight of Dragons, by Peter Dickenson.

One of my all time favorites on dragon lore and their (speculative) biology. Also made into a movie that combined elements of Dickenson's work with Gordon R. Dick's, The Dragon and the George.

[RobRoy]

Sounds like what you need are the following:

Tobin's Spirit Guide
The Necronomicon, not to be confused with The Necronomicon Ex Mortis which is equally good.
Spates Catalog
The Book of Three

For your specific fields:

Greek and Roman
I am surprised no one has mentioned Bulfinch's Greek and Roman Mythology. He's a secondary source, and archaic in his treatment, but still one of the most oft-cited compendiums.

Celtic
Cath Maige Tuired translated by Elizabeth A. Gray
Lebor Gabala Érenn (http://www.maryjones.us/ctexts/leborgabala.html)

Norse
Since this encompasses a number of different cultures, you'll need a number of different sources, but I've found that:

The Northern European Studies Text (http://www.northvegr.org/lore/main.php) contains just about everything including the The Poetic Edda and The Prose Edda for Iceland and Gesta Danorum for the Danes, which are the two major texts.

Monsters in Literature and Demons
This is gonna be tricky. Almost all monsters come from literature of one sort or another, and evolved from there, so just about every culture has their own set. The same with demons, who sometimes cross over into monster territory or vice-versa. I don't know of any specific single book that provides a comprehensive list of either of these mythic creatures, and while somewhat useful, I don't think you want to get into the nitty-gritty of Pseudomonarchia Daemonum or The Lesser Key of Solomon.

For a decently comprehensive list of monsters in general, I suggest this Wikipedia list (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_monsters).

The same goes for demons using this list (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_demons).

Hope that helps!

[H3LL]

Great suggestions.

My Amazon wish list has grown considerably (and picked a few from "customers also bought"). Luckily several are out of print so cheap second-hand ones in good condition are distinctly possible.

Monstropedia looks like it will steal a good proportion of my life. ;)

I didn't get anywhere with RobRoy's Spirit Guide, Spates Catalogue and The Book of Three (TV show???) on Amazon. The Celtic and Norse sources (and Wiki) should be a great jumping off point for material. Thanks.

[RobRoy]

Spirit Guide, Spates Catalog

Ghostbusters. :D

The Book of Three (TV show???)

I had originally meant Lloyd Alexander's Prydain Chronicles. :D

I had forgotten the TV show [i]Charmed.

The Celtic and Norse sources (and Wiki) should be a great jumping off point for material. Thanks.

Glad those helped. I can cite source books if you'd prefer those as well. Just let me know.

[Tiktaalik]

The Book of Beasts
being a translation from a Latin bestiary of the Twelfth Century

Made and edited by T. H. White

Includes drawings of engravings. Some of the animals are real (the Pard) and some are not (Fenix, Sirenae). Covers what was "known" about the habits of each "beast". There are dragons, winged bulls, etc., plus a long treatise on bees with poetry!!!

Not sure if it's still in print...Dover Pubs, 1984...

[Fiona]

Brewer's Dictionary of Phrase and Fable is good and it is one of those books which distract you from what you originally sought. Great bed time reading. No pictures though

[brodski]

Brewer's Dictionary of Phrase and Fable is good and it is one of those books which distract you from what you originally sought. Great bed time reading. No pictures though

Well, they where originally going to issue a version with full colour photographs, they were going well, they had a picture of an Angel, an Amphiptere and an Amphisbaena, the trouble only started when they got to Basilisk...

[H3LL]

Basilisk! Heheheheh! :D

RobRoy caught me. :p

New suggestions on my wish list.

This is getting expensive. ;)

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[H3LL]

RobRoy - I looked at this:

The Prydain Companion: A Reference Guide to Lloyd Alexander's Prydain Chronicles (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Prydain-Companion-Reference-Alexanders-Chronicles/dp/0805072713/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1212053407&sr=8-4)

and seems to be more in line with what I'm after. Wish listed.

[RobRoy]

RobRoy - I looked at this:

The Prydain Companion: A Reference Guide to Lloyd Alexander's Prydain Chronicles (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Prydain-Companion-Reference-Alexanders-Chronicles/dp/0805072713/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1212053407&sr=8-4)

and seems to be more in line with what I'm after. Wish listed.

Great. I had originally meant it as a joke, but if that helps you out, excellent serendipity.

[UnrepentantSinner]

Not to tangent away from the intent of the OP, but when it comes down to the issues/subjects that skeptics delve into the two of which I am - provisionally - least skeptical are UFOlogy and Cryptozoology, but with a giant caveat. I honestly don't think Earth is being visited by ETs, though I weight such claims high above homeopathy, demonic possession and PSI for example nor do I think Bigfoot, Nessie and Mkele Mbembe exist, but such beings are possible* within current scientific paradigms and most of the claimed Crypids aren't outside of science.

Show me a dragons wing though. Show me the skeleton of a Centaur or Shedu. Show me a photograph of Mothman or a Reptilian. Those are the evidences that would move me from "Meh" to "well, it might exist" in cryptozoology.

* Bigfoot, is problematic for evolutionary theory unless a connection between it and Gigantepithecus can be established.

[H3LL]

US - I hear you but for me I have no expectation that Hobbits, Orcs, Zeus, Succubus, Aslan or Zombie Jesus of the Bible etc. exist, will exist or have ever existed. Visiting ETs? - I'll wait for evidence.

I do, however, love the stories and imagination surrounding such things, with a particular fondness for imaginary creatures and fantastic beasts. (ET stuff is a bit dull IMHO, with a few exceptions like Supervisor Karellen)

One thing that has always puzzled me is that with such a rich panoply of material available so many people have settled on the Bible as actually true when it is dull, sick, repulsive and nasty and about as uplifting as a dose of the clap.

There is plenty that is sick, repulsive and nasty but also exciting, interesting and uplifting. Beowulf and Grendel being a recent popular example in film.

It would be nice if dragons were real - but they're not.

I suspect that if they were they would not be half as good as the ones in our imagination. A bit like finding out about the Komodo Dragon for the first time.

[slingblade]

The Encyclopedia of Things that Never Were (http://www.amazon.com/Encyclopedia-Things-That-Never-Were/dp/0140100083) is all right. I have it. It's ambitious, and covers a lot, but some entries are a bit short. Anyway, you might give it a peek.

[H3LL]

The Encyclopedia of Things that Never Were (http://www.amazon.com/Encyclopedia-Things-That-Never-Were/dp/0140100083) is all right. I have it. It's ambitious, and covers a lot, but some entries are a bit short. Anyway, you might give it a peek.

I used to have that. :mad:

Thanks for the reminder.

I notice it's still quite an expensive tome.

Wish listed.

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[Myriad]

Not to state the obvious or re-re-re-out my own geekiness, but it sounds like the Monster Manual volumes and similar resource books used in AD&D would be right at home in your collection. All of the bullet points in your OP are covered in various books. There's some totally-made-up stuff mixed in, and things like combat stats included that you don't need, but mostly they draw on existing mythologies and fictional sources.

If you're looking for broad and shallow coverage of pantheons, you can't do much better than the first edition "Fiend Folio." It's organized by "mythos" and includes Lovecraft, Elric, Arthurian, and Newhon deities and creatures as well as Greek, Norse, Celtic, North American, South American, Babylonian, Sumerian, Chinese, Japanese, Finnish, Sumerian, and Egyptian.

Respectfully,
Myriad

[H3LL]

Not to state the obvious or re-re-re-out my own geekiness, but it sounds like the Monster Manual volumes and similar resource books used in AD&D would be right at home in your collection. All of the bullet points in your OP are covered in various books. There's some totally-made-up stuff mixed in, and things like combat stats included that you don't need, but mostly they draw on existing mythologies and fictional sources.

If you're looking for broad and shallow coverage of pantheons, you can't do much better than the first edition "Fiend Folio." It's organized by "mythos" and includes Lovecraft, Elric, Arthurian, and Newhon deities and creatures as well as Greek, Norse, Celtic, North American, South American, Babylonian, Sumerian, Chinese, Japanese, Finnish, Sumerian, and Egyptian.

Respectfully,
Myriad

I couldn't agree more. :)


I would like something similar that concentrates more on specific areas, such as:

Monsters/Non-Human creatures (Think D&D Monster Manual but more 'factual' - if that makes sense).

I should have mentioned that, luckily, I still had those. Sorry.

I have Monster Manual I & II, Fiend Folio and Deities & Demi-Gods and I'm still trying to qualify for geekiness. :D

The sources of the creatures mentioned in a bit (but not too much) detail and cross referencing is more of what I need/want.




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[Ixion]

My mother had the complete collection of Time-Life Enchanted World Series (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enchanted_World_Series)

Lots of pictures in each volume and a brief synopsis of creature lore for each. I don't know if they are available anymore or how factual they are, but I always liked them.

I will also suggest:
Faeries (http://www.amazon.com/Faeries-25th-Anniversary-Brian-Froud/dp/0810932741/ref=pd_bbs_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1212779701&sr=8-2) and Gnomes (http://www.amazon.com/Gnomes-30th-Anniversary-Wil-Huygen/dp/0810954982/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1212779758&sr=1-1).

Lots of full-color pictures and in-depth legends.

[Ixion]

Also, I am a Dungeons and Dragons geek and have all of those monster manuals and fiend folios etc (1st through 3.5 editions).

[RobRoy]

One thing that has always puzzled me is that with such a rich panoply of material available so many people have settled on the Bible as actually true when it is dull, sick, repulsive and nasty and about as uplifting as a dose of the clap.

I thought about this some time before deciding to have a go at it. My first question is: compared to what? This seems an unfair characterization if you're really looking at the myths being myths, rather than taking a pot-shot at the Christian fundies.

The Bible has all kinds of mythological creatures in confrontation with real, amalgamated, semi-real or completely legendary humans. There are mentions of unicorns, satyrs, a cockatrice, a dragon, a couple of talking animals, a behemoth and the Leviathan.

That's not even to mention the angels, half-angels, giants, demons and God(s) that show up periodically and perform interesting feats, or are defeated by mere mortals.

Then there is fencing, fighting, torture, revenge, giants, monsters, chases, escapes, true love, miracles . . .

(Pause to reflect on the line from The Princess Bride)

(Pause)
There are certainly portions of the Bible that are quite dull, repulsive and nasty by most standards. But as a mythos, it is no better or worse than any other. As a compendium of the stories of "our god" versus "your god", or "our nation" versus "your nation" it's fairly typical in reflecting strength, power, wrath, vengeance, prowess in battle, etc.

[Madalch]

If you're looking for broad and shallow coverage of pantheons, you can't do much better than the first edition "Fiend Folio." It's organized by "mythos" and includes Lovecraft, Elric, Arthurian, and Newhon deities and creatures as well as Greek, Norse, Celtic, North American, South American, Babylonian, Sumerian, Chinese, Japanese, Finnish, Sumerian, and Egyptian.

You mean "Deities and Demigods". The Fiend Folio was the one with the flumph.

[Myriad]

You mean "Deities and Demigods". The Fiend Folio was the one with the flumph.


I did mean that. I even went and looked it up to make sure I had the title right. Apparently the only thing I didn't get around to was modify the actual text I was typing to match the information I looked up.

Respectfully,
Myriad

[H3LL]

... looking at the myths being myths, rather than taking a pot-shot at the Christian fundies....


That's what they are there for. ;)

Seriously, I was responding briefly to US's post and my comments stand as an opinion.

Just because the Bible contains interesting creatures and scenarios does not make it a good story. It isn't.

The Bible is a mish-mash of unoriginal fireside tales badly linked and internally inconsistent and compares poorly even with older stories, such as the Iliad (even though hampered by the fact the poetry of the original language is somewhat lost in translation).

I'm am also certain that the dull, fragmented nature of the Bible has been of great service to the various churches over time.

However, I will concede that other tales and myths are less close to their original form and perhaps benefit from editing into a story of more interest.

By example, if one should isolate the details of the story of Sampson from the scripture and re-tell it, it is quite good (any Heracles/Hurcules similarities are purely coincidental). In the Bible itself, it isn't.

I will also concede that should I perhaps read the original text/scriptures that, say, a priest of Zeus or Jupiter used for his daily routine, I would find it as crap as the Bible.


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[Kotatsu]

I have a book called "Mythical Monsters" by Charles Gould, which may fit the bill. I haven't read it yet, though. It's originally from 1886, and one of the chapters is apparently a case for the biblical flood: "The Deluge not a myth". It also has chapters on dragons Chinese dragons, Japanese dragons, sea-serpents, the Chinese phoenix, unicorns, and a set of introductory chapters with the titles, "On some remarkable animal forms", "Extinction of species", "Antiquity of man", and, "On the translation of myths between the Old and the New World". It is quite richly illustrated.

[H3LL]

I have a book called "Mythical Monsters" by Charles Gould.....

A little outside the parameters of what I'm looking for but noted that his source material is well documented. For this feature alone I'm interested.

Wish listed.

Thanks

[RobRoy]

I will also concede that should I perhaps read the original text/scriptures that, say, a priest of Zeus or Jupiter used for his daily routine, I would find it as crap as the Bible.

You probably would, depending on what you were looking for. If just fictional reading, then definately. Writing, as an art form, has only in the last couple hundred years become something worthwhile. Almost all myths benefit greatly from being told by contemporary "editors", and thus being spun to suit the needs of that particular audience at that particular time. We've seen this with the Harryhausen Sinbad or any number of new-and-improved Heracles stories, up to and including the "super hero" stories like Batman, Iron Man, Spider-Man, X-Men, etc., which are almost always Heracles or another Greek in one form or another. Even Medea has seen her own modern re-visioning, most recently Jodie Foster's The Brave One.