Pat Buchanan Drinks the Kool-Aid

[Sword_Of_Truth]

I just saw this over at Little Green Footballs: (http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/30301_Pat_Buchanans_Magazine_Suggests_Israel_Was_R esponsible_for_9-11)

I’ve been watching as one cable channel after another trots out Pat Buchanan as a legitimate representative of conservative views. Hannity and Colmes, Glenn Beck, MSNBC, you name it, they’ve all got Buchanan on their short list of guests.

What a disgrace.

Now at Pat Buchanan’s American Conservative magazine, an article that suggests the Mossad had a hand in perpetrating the attacks on 9/11: The Spy Who Loves Us.

And then there are the movers. Urban Moving Systems of Weehawken, New Jersey was largely staffed by Israelis, many of whom had recently been discharged from the Israeli Defense Forces. As has been widely reported, three movers were photographed celebrating in Liberty State Park against the backdrop of the first collapsing World Trade Center tower.

LGF includes a cover of the magazine:

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/weblog/pictures/20080611AmConAntisemitismCover.jpg

I used to support this guy... I think I may be sick. :(

[Profanz]

I just saw this over at

LGF includes a cover of the magazine:

I used to support this guy... I think I may be sick. :(

Well I didn't read the article but what exactly about the quote or the iimplication of the cover do you think is kool-aid drinking?

[JimBenArm]

>ahem<
This part.


As has been widely reported, three movers were photographed celebrating in Liberty State Park against the backdrop of the first collapsing World Trade Center tower.

[Liszt]

>ahem<
This part.


Fox news reported this (I think it was Carl Cameron). They said there were 5, not 3.

Here's another bit of Fox on a similar subject. So much for them being "gatekeepers"!


http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,280172,00.html

Now at Pat Buchanan’s American Conservative magazine, an article that suggests the Mossad had a hand in perpetrating the attacks on 9/11: The Spy Who Loves Us.

No it doesn't - not according to the quote. It suggests that a few Mossad agents were monitoring the real terrorists, and may not have passed on vital info to their superiors.

Anyway, this should be in politics, not in the conspiracy theroies section.

[Profanz]

>ahem<
This part.

They were celebrating weren't they? If not then what brought them to the attention of the police in the first place, and why did they take them in? And where in the article quote does it "suggests the Mossad had a hand in perpetrating the attacks on 9/11"? Does Pat Bucahnan make this claim?

[JimBenArm]

Were they?

Do a search of this forum on the topic "Dancing Jews".

Might educate yourself a bit.

Probably not, but I've been surprised before.

[JamesB]

After reading about his latest book on how we provoked Hitler into WWII. this doesn't surprise me at all.

[JimBenArm]

After reading about his latest book on how we provoked Hitler into WWII. this doesn't surprise me at all.
The only surprise was that he didn't blame the Jews for provoking him.

[Profanz]

This part.

You didn't answer me. Why were they taken in by the police? And does Pat Buchanhan claim the Mossad was behind 9/11?

[JimBenArm]

:dl:Talking to yourself is one thing, demanding that you answer yourself is another!

[Liszt]

You didn't answer me. Why were they taken in by the police? And does Pat Buchanhan claim the Mossad was behind 9/11?


I think they were arrested and questioned for about 70 days. They then went back to Israel. 3 went on Isreali TV saying that they were tracking/documenting Islamic terrorists.


Video here

http://technorati.com/videos/youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DtRfhUezbKLw

[Profanz]

I think they were arrested and questioned for about 70 days. They then went back to Israel. 3 went on Isreali TV saying that they were tracking/documenting Islamic terrorists.


Video here

http://technorati.com/videos/youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DtRfhUezbKLw

Yes but why were they picked up in the first place? Were they doing something different then anyone else video taping the towers that day?

[Drudgewire]

As one who leans right, I've still rarely wished the overused Jonestown reference in the thread title was meant as literally as I did this one.

Just go away Pat, seriously.

[Alferd_Packer]

As one who leans right, I've still rarely wished the overused Jonestown reference in the thread title was meant as literally as I did this one.

Just go away Pat, seriously.


BTW, it was Flavor-Aid, not Kool Aid

[MikeW]

3 went on Isreali TV saying that they were tracking/documenting Islamic terrorists.
They said nothing of the kind. Do you really think making up things like that helps your case?

[Liszt]

They said nothing of the kind. Do you really think making up things like that helps your case?


quote "our purpose was to document the event".

And what do you mean "my case"? I think you are confusing me with a conspiracy theorist.

This clip supports neither MIHOP or LIHOP - actually it shows how intel cannot coordinate with each other - a problem the US government solved shortly after 911.

Edited for civility

[Liszt]

oh yes "Mike", the clip was taken from Marc Levin's film Protocols.

Levin recently finished his new movie, The Protocols, which is about resurgent anti-Semitism following the September 11, 2001 attacks. The film focuses on The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, an anti-Semitic forgery which supposedly describes the Jewish plan for global domination. Although the book has been repeatedly debunked as an obvious forgery, Levin continually discovers various groups presenting it as "proof" for their own anti-Semitic agenda.

Levin is Jewish too.

Wow! I am using terrible sources! To push "my case".

Edited for civility

[MikeW]

quote "our purpose was to document the event".
They were filming (and so documenting) the burning towers. There's no reason to believe they meant anything more than that.

And what do you mean "my cause"? I think you are confusing me with a conspiracy theorist.
I said "case", not "cause". I meant the case that they had foreknowledge of the attacks, which isn't helped by presenting a strained interpretation (that they said they were tracking/documenting Islamic terrorists) as though it were fact.

[Viper Daimao]

quote "our purpose was to document the event".

And what do you mean "my case"? I think you are confusing me with a conspiracy theorist.

This clip supports neither MIHOP or LIHOP - actually it shows how intel cannot coordinate with each other - a problem the US government solved shortly after 911.

Edited for civility.

How does "our purpose was to document the event" = tracking/documenting Islamic terrorists?

And be civil. childish name calling makes you look, well childish.

[dudalb]

ANybody who has been following the career of Pat "Nazi War Criminals Were'nt So Bad" Buchanan will not be surprised by this at all.
I blast the left when they seem unwilling to read the nutcases and the scumbuckets out of their movement so I will do the same for the right: That Buchanan is still considered a "Major Conservative Spokesman" despite his long history of Anti Semetic inferences is a disgrace.
I also think there is bit of a journalist old boys network at work here; Bunchanan's career as TV commentator and reporter does seem to have bought him quite a bit of slack with his brethren.

[Pardalis]

Another paleoconservative twoofer? Didn't see that coming.

[MikeW]

oh yes "Mike", the clip was taken from Marc Levin's film Protocols....Levin is Jewish too.

Wow! I am using terrible sources! To push "my case".
Where did I say I had a problem with the source? I was commenting on this interpretation:

3 went on Isreali TV saying that they were tracking/documenting Islamic terrorists.

As you bought up Levin, this is how he sees it:

I talked to witnesses who saw the 5 Israelis and the NJ police officer who stopped their van. They were taken into custody, questioned and held for 10 weeks. They were eventually cleared by the FBI of any involvement in 9/11 and deported back to Israeli on immigration violations. On Israeli TV, they claimed they were merely taking pictures of a historic event. I included this sequence in the movie because I wanted to show how a real incident that raised legitimate questions could quickly mutate into so called “evidence” that the Israelis were behind the attack and not Al Qaeda. There were even some claiming the 5 Israelis were controlling the planes by remote control from New Jersey.
http://thinkfilm.blogs.com/protocols_of_zion/

A little differently.

[BenBurch]

BTW, it was Flavor-Aid, not Kool Aid

You know why they no longer tell Jonestown jokes, right?

The punch lines are too long!

[Drudgewire]

You know why they no longer tell Jonestown jokes, right?

The punch lines are too long!

http://www.lethalwrestling.com/upload/downsrim.gif

[Viper Daimao]

You know why they no longer tell Jonestown jokes, right?

The punch lines are too long!

a pun that bad has got to be a breach of the membership agreement

[tomwaits]

Buchanan as a political analyst is ok. Buchanan's beliefs, however, are quite crazy. Other conservatives may not like him being labeled as a conservative, but he does represent part of the paleoconservative group along with Lou Dobbs.

[parky76]

The Israelis were arrested because the whole country was paranoid that day and the Israelis were being real jerks. Lots of Arabs were also arrested after 9-11..but no one talks about them.

[Whiplash]

Just go away Pat, seriously.

As someone who also leans right, I agree with this sentiment 100%. I can't stand this guy anymore. He's a buffoon, and gives the rest of us a worse reputation than we deserve.

[Profanz]

So why were they arrested?

[BenBurch]

So why were they arrested?

Because they were arresting EVERYBODY anybody complained about that day.

Weren't you paying attention?

[Profanz]

Because they were arresting EVERYBODY anybody complained about that day.

Weren't you paying attention?

What was the complaint?

[BenBurch]

What was the complaint?

That they looked like terrorists. Lots of innocent people were in that dragnet, my friend. A poor Sikh fellow in my home town was arrested at the train station because he was wearing a turban. He was in jail for almost a week until the feds finally said to let him go.

[Dog Town]

That they looked like terrorists. Lots of innocent people were in that dragnet, my friend. A poor Sikh fellow in my home town was arrested at the train station because he was wearing a turban. He was in jail for almost a week until the feds finally said to let him go.

I believe this is called "the Fog of War".

[Brainster]

As I have often commented, it is an accident of history that the conspiracy theories about 9-11 have propagated on the far left and not the far right. Conspiracy theories find a much more natural home among the paranoid right; think of the John Birchers and fluoridation of the water for an example. Or the Clinton Death List, or Waco, or Ruby Ridge or Oklahoma City.

BTW, anybody care to guess who chaired Pat Buchanan's 1996 run for the presidency in the great state of Arizona?

[JamesB]

BTW, anybody care to guess who chaired Pat Buchanan's 1996 run for the presidency in the great state of Arizona?

Ooh, ooh, I know this one! :teacher:

[Profanz]

That they looked like terrorists. Lots of innocent people were in that dragnet, my friend. A poor Sikh fellow in my home town was arrested at the train station because he was wearing a turban. He was in jail for almost a week until the feds finally said to let him go.

These guys weren't wearing turbans as far as I know. So what is it that made them look like terrorist? They weren't acting happy at the sight of a tragedy were they? Because that would be despicable. And if it all was just a misunderstanding then why were they held for 71 days instead of released after just a week like your friend?

[Cl1mh4224rd]

[OK, seriously... I do find it funny that truthers think it's clever to preregister multiple accounts, then switch to one of those accounts once they've been banned from another one, as if no one would notice an account going from no posting to constant posting over night...]

[zorro99]

quote "our purpose was to document the event".

Edited for civility

I took photos at the Pentagon that day. Does that make me a spy too?

[LordoftheLeftHand]

You know why they no longer tell Jonestown jokes, right?

The punch lines are too long!
:hit:

[MaGZ]

So why were they arrested?

Here are a few links.
http://antiwar.com/justin/?articleid=10528

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/pages/ShArt.jhtml?itemNo=75266&contrassID=2&subContrassID=1&sbSubContrassID=0&listSrc=Y

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/fiveisraelis.html

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines02/0622-05.htm

[Rika]

I'd avoid those links if I were you. (Unless, of course, you LIKE Neonazi propaganda)

[Profanz]

I'd avoid those links if I were you. (Unless, of course, you LIKE Neonazi propaganda)



You mean like the questions that are being avoided? Do you have some better links maybe? Are the police and the FBI Anti-Semitic?

What were they doing that got the attention of the authorities in the first place?

Why were they held for so long?

[Dr Adequate]

What were they doing that got the attention of the authorities in the first place?

Why were they held for so long? If you want to know the answers to those questions, why don't you try to find out the answers in some way, instead of whining about your lack of knowledge on a web forum?

[fuelair]

If you want to know the answers to those questions, why don't you try to find out the answers in some way, instead of whining about your lack of knowledge on a web forum?Because it is more fun to expose one's ignorance to general approbation than to actually work to find out what you really were only trying to get a point(less) across
about. Or something very like that.:)

[Profanz]

If you want to know the answers to those questions, why don't you try to find out the answers in some way, instead of whining about your lack of knowledge on a web forum?

I'm not whining. You are running and hiding.

[MaGZ]

I'm not whining. You are running and hiding.

I have some of the answers concerning the Israelis and 9/11. I have researched the subject.

http://antiwar.com/israeli-files.php

[dudalb]

I see the Neo Nazis are trying to use the anti war movement as a cover for spreading their BS.
And, sad to say, some in the peace movement are falling for it.

[Profanz]

I see the Neo Nazis are trying to use the anti war movement as a cover for spreading their BS.
And, sad to say, some in the peace movement are falling for it.

Well then what's the real story and how do you know?


Why were they picked up in the first place and held for 70 days?

Lots of people were watching the towers that day and video taping it. What were they doing that seemed unusual? Was it that they were acting happy? Now why would they be happy that the towers were attacked?

[Cl1mh4224rd]

If you want to know the answers to those questions, why don't you try to find out the answers in some way, instead of whining about your lack of knowledge on a web forum?


I think it's something along the lines of, "I don't know the answer, but neither do you. You suck! I win!"

[Profanz]

j7T4DhDLPrY

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/events-images/188_spy_ring_map2050081722-8765.jpg
States the Israeli spy ring were known to have operated in, according to a June 2001 Drug Enforcement Administration report (this Fox news graphic was based on information from that report). [Source: Fox News]

September 13, 2001 -- Three men who celebrated as the Twin Towers crumbled are facing deportation, The Post has learned. The men, described as illegal immigrants from the Middle East, were arrested Tuesday afternoon in a white Chevy van near the Meadowlands based on a tip from witnesses who saw them "cheering" and "jumping up and down" in Liberty State Park after the attack, a source said. - NY Post September 13th 2001


Eight hours after terrorists struck Manhattan's tallest skyscrapers, police in Bergen County detained five men who they said were found carrying maps linking them to the blasts. The five men, who were in a van stopped on Route 3 in East Rutherford around 4:30 p.m., were being questioned by police but had not been charged with any crime late Tuesday. - BERGEN RECORD September 12th 2001


PLYMOUTH (PA) -- Two men whom police described as Middle Eastern were detained in the township by federal immigration authorities after being found with detailed video footage of the Sears Tower in Chicago.
The man, who later identified himself as Moshe Elmakias, 30, denied that he did anything and fled the scene, heading west on West Ridge Pike... The manager was able to provide township police with the Florida registration number of the tractor-trailer and said that a sign posted on the side of the vehicle read "Moving Systems Incorporated" police said. - The Mercury, October 17, 2001

WASHINGTON -- As the nation again stands on high alert, the FBI is searching for six men stopped by police in the Midwest last weekend but released -- even though they possessed photos and descriptions of a nuclear power plant in Florida and the Trans-Alaska pipeline, a senior law enforcement official said Tuesday.

In addition to the photographs and other suspicious material, they carried "box cutters and other equipment," the official said. They appeared to be from the Middle East and held Israeli passports. - The Miami Herald Wednesday, October 31, 2001

In January 2001, the security branch of the U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency began to receive a number of peculiar reports from DEA field offices across the country. According to the reports, young Israelis claiming to be art students and offering artwork for sale had been attempting to penetrate DEA offices for over a year. The Israelis had also attempted to penetrate the offices of other law enforcement and Department of Defense agencies. Strangest of all, the "students" had visited the homes of numerous DEA officers and other senior federal officials. - Salon May 7, 2002

ERWIN, Tenn. Two Israeli men who led the Unicoi County sheriff on a high-speed chase in a rented moving truck were placed under arrest and are being investigated by the FBI, local officials said.
Once the men were apprehended, officers also found a "Learn to Fly" brochure in the truck, leading Harris and others to express concern about security at the Nuclear Fuel Services plant in Erwin. - The Associated Press May 9, 2004

ST. MARYS, Ga. -- Two Israeli men working for a moving-and-storage company who attempted Kings Bay Submarine Base Friday are being held for deportation. Neither was able to present valid work permits to security personnel, and one had an expired passport. Base personnel and bomb-sniffing dogs inspected the van, prompting a lockdown of the base. – News 4 Georgia May 25, 2004

Two senior employees of the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, one of Washington's most influential lobbying organizations, have left their jobs amid an FBI investigation into whether they passed classified U.S. information to the government of Israel, a source close to the organization said yesterday. - Washington Post Thursday, April 21, 2005

A Defense Department analyst pleaded guilty yesterday to passing government secrets to two employees of a pro-Israel lobbying group and revealed for the first time that he also gave classified information directly to an Israeli government official in Washington.Lawrence A. Franklin told a judge in U.S. District Court in Alexandria that he met at least eight times with Naor Gilon, who was the political officer at the Israeli Embassy before being recalled last summer. - Washington Post Thursday, October 6, 2005

Iran: The Next War - Even before the bombs fell on Baghdad, a group of senior Pentagon officials were plotting to invade another country. Their covert campaign once again relied on false intelligence and shady allies. But this time, the target was Iran.

Over breakfast at the Ritz-Carlton, Franklin told the two lobbyists about a draft of a top-secret National Security Presidential Directive that dealt with U.S. policy on Iran. Crafted by Michael Rubin, the desk officer for Iraq and Iran in Feith's office, the document called, in essence, for regime change in Iran. In the Pentagon's view, according to one senior official there at the time, Iran was nothing but "a house of cards ready to be pushed over the precipice." So far, though, the White House had rejected the Pentagon's plan, favoring the State Department's more moderate position of diplomacy. Now, unwilling to play by the rules any longer, Franklin was taking the extraordinary—and illegal—step of passing on highly classified information to lobbyists for a foreign state. - Rolling Stone Jul 24, 2006 9:30 AM


So now why is Buchanan out of line?

[Max Photon]

Personally, I find Millipedia ten times better than Centipedia......though both are kind of creepy.

[stilicho]

After reading about his latest book on how we provoked Hitler into WWII. this doesn't surprise me at all.
There is little doubt that, had the French and British refused to honour their alliances, Hitler could have gained 14 nations without firing a shot. He only got 2 without firing a shot as it went.

[Liszt]

The people at Wikipedia removed the article on the Israeli Art Students, but you can find an article on Metapedia .

http://en.metapedia.org/wiki/Israeli_Art_Students

Mad MaGZ has a point here.

Wikipedia has entire articles on minor fictional characters
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stewie_griffin
and old, pointless memes (look up 2 girls 1 cup - wtf is that doing there? NSFW)

And the article on the Israeli spy ring gets deleted? References were from the NY Post, Fox, and other mainstram sources.

There is a strange double standard at work, and I experienced it first hand a few weeks ago.
I was having a usual, drunken, anti-religion rant. "Jesus died for your sins? How does that work? Why are you waiting for his return, when the bible said he already returned, 3 days after he died?" etc.

But the moment I said "There is no God, there is no God's chosen people, and there is no promised land" (all true of course), I was called antisemetic. (When I pointed out that many arabs are semetic, I thought the little **** was going to hit me!)

Sometimes it seems like it is OK to be "skeptical" about all religions apart from Judaism.

This cannot be the reason wikipedia deleted the article - but what is the reason?

The spy ring, according to the sources, had nothing to do with 911. So that's out of the way. However, it is an important bit of history that should not dissapear down the memory hole.

So why the double standard? And why isn't the average JREFer bothered by this, which is clearly a form of censorship?

[Praktik]

paint me a lefty, so there's not much I agree with Buchanan about, especially on social policy. Nonetheless, I subscribe to his magazine because there is an interesting variety of writing and because I'm fascinated by my political opposites.

That being said, none other than Glenn Greenwald has contributed to his magazine, and I'm sure Buchanan doesn't subscribe to all of what the ACLU lovin' Greenwald believes.

Isn't there some fallacy we can refer to when one ascribes the viewpoints of a writer in a magazine to the creator of the magazine without support? As far as I know Buchanan comes in for a 1 pager each issue but most of the editing is done by Taki - not Buchanan...

[Axiom_Blade]

As I have often commented, it is an accident of history that the conspiracy theories about 9-11 have propagated on the far left and not the far right.


Oh, they're popular with the far right, too.
Just look at Stormfront, the Alex Jones crowd, and Mark Dice's "Christian Resistance."

[JEROME DA GNOME]

This thread have taught me a great deal about human psychology.

Thanks all!


:gnome:

[Sword_Of_Truth]

This thread have taught me a great deal about human psychology.

Thanks all!


:gnome:

People are easily fooled by jooos?

[zorro99]

Well then what's the real story and how do you know?


Why were they picked up in the first place and held for 70 days?

Lots of people were watching the towers that day and video taping it. What were they doing that seemed unusual? Was it that they were acting happy? Now why would they be happy that the towers were attacked?

Immaturity

[zorro99]

Another item that makes me seriously doubt that these guys were undercover Mossad agents is this - the guys sued the US Government for their incarceration.

September 14, 2004
Four Israelis arrested in the United States on September 11, 2001, have filed a multimillion-dollar civil lawsuit in the US District Court in New York against United States Attorney-General John Ashcroft and wardens of the Federal Bureau of Prisons.

The suit, filed Monday, alleges that their two-month detention was illegal and that during that time they were physically abused and their civil rights were violated.

Jerusalem Post source

http://web.archive.org/web/20041015025438/http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1095131871508

I have a hard time believing that these guys were undercover Mossad agents because, first, they got caught, and second, they very publicly sued the US Government. Mossad agents would not be suing the government if they were really undercover.

[Liszt]

Another item that makes me seriously doubt that these guys were undercover Mossad agents is this - the guys sued the US Government for their incarceration.



http://web.archive.org/web/20041015025438/http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=JPost/JPArticle/ShowFull&cid=1095131871508

I have a hard time believing that these guys were undercover Mossad agents because, first, they got caught, and second, they very publicly sued the US Government. Mossad agents would not be suing the government if they were really undercover.


The only reference I could find that these people were Mossad was this quote


The FBI came to the conclusion... that the five Israelis arrested in New Jersey last September were conducting a Mossad surveillance mission
and that their employer, Urban Moving Systems of Weehawken, N.J., served as a front. -Forward (A Jewish Magazine) March 15, 2002

http://www.todayscatholicworld.com/mossad-agents-911.htm

(Catholic World? argh!)

Most sites reproduce this quote, without showing the original Forward article. Perhaps it doesn't exist? Anyone know?

Urban Moving Systems recieved a nearly half a million dollars as a loan from the Government

http://www.fedspending.org/faads/faads.php?reptype=r&detail=-1&datype=T&sortby=t&database=faads&recip_id=903577&fiscal_year=2001&record_num=f500

So presumably they don't have to pay it back now! Now there's an idea...


And Zorro - I think you are overestimating Intel agents. It seems that every week, British spooks are getting drunk and leaving thousands of pages of eyes-only files on trains. They appear to be behaving like normal people.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7449255.stm

Anyway - any comments on the Wikipedia removing pages thing?

[zorro99]

The only reference I could find that these people were Mossad was this quote


The FBI came to the conclusion... that the five Israelis arrested in New Jersey last September were conducting a Mossad surveillance mission
and that their employer, Urban Moving Systems of Weehawken, N.J., served as a front. -Forward (A Jewish Magazine) March 15, 2002

http://www.todayscatholicworld.com/mossad-agents-911.htm

(Catholic World? argh!)

Most sites reproduce this quote, without showing the original Forward article. Perhaps it doesn't exist? Anyone know?

Urban Moving Systems recieved a nearly half a million dollars as a loan from the Government

http://www.fedspending.org/faads/faads.php?reptype=r&detail=-1&datype=T&sortby=t&database=faads&recip_id=903577&fiscal_year=2001&record_num=f500

So presumably they don't have to pay it back now! Now there's an idea...


And Zorro - I think you are overestimating Intel agents. It seems that every week, British spooks are getting drunk and leaving thousands of pages of eyes-only files on trains. They appear to be behaving like normal people.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/7449255.stm

Anyway - any comments on the Wikipedia removing pages thing?

I guess you're right about intel agents being normal. However, I still have a hard time believing that undercover Mossad agents would sue the US Government. You'll have to come up with more than an unlinked quote from somebody's webpage to convince me that these guys were undercover Mossad agents. I know, I'm a tough sell.

[Liszt]

Well, I too find that single quote pretty unimpressive.

Do you have a link about the guys suing the US government? Everything google is returning is just a rehash of the (un)orignal stuff.

[Dave Rogers]

And Zorro - I think you are overestimating Intel agents. It seems that every week, British spooks are getting drunk and leaving thousands of pages of eyes-only files on trains. They appear to be behaving like normal people.

There's more than a difference of degree between an error of omission, such as forgetting to pick up your luggage when you get off a train, and a deliberate act like initiating a lawsuit against the US Government. The latter is very hard to do accidentally when you're drunk, for a start.

Dave

[Liszt]

I was refering to the 1st part of Zorro's post...

I have a hard time believing that these guys were undercover Mossad agents because, first, they got caught, and second, they very publicly sued the US Government.

meaning "Spies make mistakes" - i.e. getting caught (sometimes). This does not mean that the Israelis were spies of course, it's just an observation.

The second bit I'm still after a link for.

[MaGZ]

A few more articles on the topic.

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/forget.html

[parky76]

never trust a website called "what really happened.com"

[Liszt]

Before this thread dies...

Does anyone know where to find a link about the Israelis suing the US government?

It is not a trivial point, as it totally debunks the "dancing Israelis were Mossad" story.

[Doctor Evil]

Managed to find link to the abstract of the story http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/jpost/access/695285801.html?dids=695285801:695285801&FMT=ABS&FMTS=ABS:FT&type=current&date=Sep+15%2C+2004&author=TOVAH+LAZAROFF&pub=Jerusalem+Post&edition=&startpage=02&desc=Four+Israelis+sue+Ashcroft.

You will have to pay to get the full article.

[Liszt]

Managed to find link to the abstract of the story http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/jpost/access/695285801.html?dids=695285801:695285801&FMT=ABS&FMTS=ABS:FT&type=current&date=Sep+15%2C+2004&author=TOVAH+LAZAROFF&pub=Jerusalem+Post&edition=&startpage=02&desc=Four+Israelis+sue+Ashcroft.

You will have to pay to get the full article.

thanks!

You're not as evil as they say.

[BenBurch]

thanks!

You're not as evil as they say.

Or as bald!

[Doctor Evil]

Or as bald!

Unfortunately, I seem to be heading there. Its a hard knock life
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oh_ex3VGHIM&feature=related

Hmm, how can I include youtube videos in my posts?

[grmcdorman]

oh_ex3VGHIM ... which gives oh_ex3VGHIM
Not sure if you need the '&feature=related' parameter.

[Doctor Evil]

Thanks. :)

[grmcdorman]

You're welcome. Haven't had time to verify the post, by the way. (Note that the oh_ex3VGHIM is copied from the YouTube URL: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oh_ex3VGHIM&feature=related)

[Drudgewire]

never trust a website called "what really happened.com"

From the first time I went there five years ago, I've never referred to it as anything other than "thejewsdidit.com." :p

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Lots of people were watching the towers that day and video taping it. What were they doing that seemed unusual? Was it that they were acting happy? Now why would they be happy that the towers were attacked?

No one was happy that nearly 3000 innocent people had been murdered save for Osama Bin Laden and some ugly fat cow seen handing out candy in Ramallah on CNN.

The day after the attack on Pearl Harbor, Sir Winston Churchill is reported to have handed out champagne to his cabinet and announced "Gentlemen, we have just won the war!" Does that mean Churchill was behind the bombings and that it was British carriers and planes that launched the attack? Of course not, that's just retarded.

So why would israelis appear to be "happy" on 9/11? Obviously because America was going to be pissed... and the enemies who had their country under a state of siege for its entire existence were at the top of the suspect list.

If you lived every day with the threat of suicide bombers exploding on your street... would you be happy to see a friendly giant come to your aid?

[Sword_Of_Truth]

And Zorro - I think you are overestimating Intel agents. It seems that every week, British spooks are getting drunk and leaving thousands of pages of eyes-only files on trains. They appear to be behaving like normal people.

I think you're pushing a weak position to the point of absurdity. It only takes a minute of absent mindedness to forget ones briefcase on a train. To sue someone in federal court takes days and weeks of deliberate premeditation.

There is absolutely no way a secret agent will publicly sue the government of the country his is operating in.

IT'S... JUST... NOT... GOING... TO... HAPPEN.

Deal with it.

[Praktik]

Just received this issue in the mail today, interesting book review at the end of Patrick's newest effort - and like the New York Review of Books the reviewer in Buchanan's own publication found numerous conceptual flaws.

Just pointing out that the views expressed in TAC are not necessarily Buchanan's, but I do know he's definitely one who thinks America's foreign policy suffers from a "passionate attachment" to Israel... but he's held this view through Democratic and "non neocon" admins too...

[metamars]

Just pointing out that the views expressed in TAC are not necessarily Buchanan's

Of course not. This particular article was written by Philip Giraldi, who used to be in the CIA. Giraldi has a column in antiwar.com (http://antiwar.com/orig/giraldi.php), and is also interviewed by other antiwar.com contributors from time to time.

[JEROME DA GNOME]

I think you're pushing a weak position to the point of absurdity. It only takes a minute of absent mindedness to forget ones briefcase on a train. To sue someone in federal court takes days and weeks of deliberate premeditation.

There is absolutely no way a secret agent will publicly sue the government of the country his is operating in.

IT'S... JUST... NOT... GOING... TO... HAPPEN.

Deal with it.


Argument from Personal Incredulity


Good one, I have not seen that one in a while.

:gnome:

[Klimax]

Argument from Personal Incredulity


Good one, I have not seen that one in a while.

:gnome:

False call,gnome.
He is just stating fact ,that it would be highly illogical to do that.And stupid as well.

To remain secret you have to keep really low profile and suing goverment would be opposite.

:alien001:

[Liszt]

I think you're pushing a weak position to the point of absurdity. It only takes a minute of absent mindedness to forget ones briefcase on a train. To sue someone in federal court takes days and weeks of deliberate premeditation.

There is absolutely no way a secret agent will publicly sue the government of the country his is operating in.

IT'S... JUST... NOT... GOING... TO... HAPPEN.

Deal with it.

Did you even read the thread?

I couldn't find the link, that's all. Dr Evil found it, so problem solved.

However, I do find it amusing that someone who really does believe in fairly tales tells me to "deal with it".

How about this one?

Joseph Smith was a liar - deal with it.

[Profanz]

No one was happy that nearly 3000 innocent people had been murdered save for Osama Bin Laden and some ugly fat cow seen handing out candy in Ramallah on CNN.

That and some despicable excuses for human beings high-fiving each other in Jersey City.



Please source said report because from what I know Hitler declared war on the US and it wasn’t a foregone conclusion that the Allies would win.

And just how many English citizens were celebrating in Hawaii in public during the attacks?

Don’t forget to source your report like this…

Netanyahu says 9/11 terror attacks good for Israel
By Haaretz Service and Reuters
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/975574.html

[QUOTE=Sword_Of_Truth;3792764]So why would israelis appear to be "happy" on 9/11? Obviously because America was going to be pissed... and the enemies who had their country under a state of siege for its entire existence were at the top of the suspect list.

How did the scumbags in Jersey City know who was behind it at that point? It could have been another Timothy McVeigh type deal for all they knew. And were they held for 70 days and then deported just for celebrating the new found alliance against global terrorism? Please.

By the way I didn’t just list the ones rounded up on 9/11. There seems to have been a whole lot more of them both before and after 9/11. And I’m not sourcing Infowars or WhatReallyHappened.

If you lived every day with the threat of suicide bombers exploding on your street... would you be happy to see a friendly giant come to your aid?

I wouldn't be celebrating at the sight of the suicide bombers killing the friendly giants family. What is wrong with some people? I might even be a little suspicious of such a display. Especially if the death of the family benefits the ones celebrating.

[Liszt]

Profanz - you raise some good points. In particular, this one

How did the scumbags in Jersey City know who was behind it at that point? It could have been another Timothy McVeigh type deal for all they knew.

However, if you are looking for a reasonable response from the misnomered "Sword of Truth", you will be dissapointed.

"Sword of Truth" is one of the most dishonest people on this forum. Couple this with a hardwired set of weird, blatantly racist beliefs, you may as well ask your dog for an answer.

The last time SoT misrepresented what I said and went on the attack, I spanked him like a monkey, and yet, like a child who cannot keep his fingers out of the electrical socket, he comes back for more.

Also, if you'd like to know why SoT hates non-white people, I can provide hundreds of sourced quoted from his heros.

Here's one from Joseph Fielding Smith
There is a reason why one man is born black and with other disadvantages, while another is born white with great advantages. The reason is that we once had an estate before we came here, and were obedient, more or less, to the laws that were given us there. Those who were faithful in all things there received greater blessings here, and those who were not faithful received less.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

OK, Liszt... That's a pretty blatant violation of Rules 11 and 12 of your Membership Agreement (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=25744).

[Liszt]

OK, Liszt... That's a pretty blatant violation of Rules 11 and 12 of your Membership Agreement (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=25744).


Yeah, you seem to be right.

Your post also violates rule 12, of course. But now I've done it twice.

(and your sig viloates rule 10 - "You will not swear in your posts. This includes using swear words in a disguised form, for example, by replacing certain letters in the word with another letter, character, or image.")


I just do not like racists, and sometimes anger gets the better of me.

[zorro99]

Profanz - you raise some good points. In particular, this one

How did the scumbags in Jersey City know who was behind it at that point? It could have been another Timothy McVeigh type deal for all they knew.

[/I]

There were 1000s of people besides the "Jersy City scumbags" taking photos that day, (including yours truly in Washington). You need to understand that taking photos of an unforeseen event does not prove some sort of foreknowledge.

[Liszt]

There were 1000s of people besides the "Jersy City scumbags" taking photos that day, (including yours truly in Washington). You need to understand that taking photos of an unforeseen event does not prove some sort of foreknowledge.

btw, "scumbags" was not my word, I was quoting Profanz. (And I do not buy the foreknowledge argument)

The point is that they were happy about it. I bet you were not cheering.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

(and your sig viloates rule 10 - "You will not swear in your posts. This includes using swear words in a disguised form, for example, by replacing certain letters in the word with another letter, character, or image.")


Hah. Touché...

[Profanz]

There were 1000s of people besides the "Jersy City scumbags" taking photos that day, (including yours truly in Washington). You need to understand that taking photos of an unforeseen event does not prove some sort of foreknowledge.

Yes and if you would have bothered to read the entire thread before you responded with your two cents you would know that I already made this exact point.

Now what was different about the ones who got the attention of the police and were taken in for 70 days and then deported from the 1000's of other people taking photos and videos that day? What was there to be so happy about? Were the 1000's of others displaying such happiness?

[Doctor Evil]

Yes and if you would have bothered to read the entire thread before you responded with your two cents you would know that I already made this exact point.

Now what was different about the ones who got the attention of the police and were taken in for 70 days and then deported from the 1000's of other people taking photos and videos that day? What was there to be so happy about? Were the 1000's of others displaying such happiness?


I fail to see your point. So someone saw them and called the police. They were arrested. A lot of people were arrested that day, and like a lot of people, they were released as there was no actual evidence that they did anything.

[Profanz]

I fail to see your point. So someone saw them and called the police. They were arrested. A lot of people were arrested that day, and like a lot of people, they were released as there was no actual evidence that they did anything.


I fail to see any truth in your post including the part where you claim "I fail to see your point". You see it just fine.

List all the people who were arrested on 9/11 for just video taping the attacks, held for 70 days, and then deported.

And one more time. I didn't just list the dirt bags from Jersey City when I pointed out all the Israelis picked-up for being in this country illegally or spying both before and after 9/11. How many did you list and source to support your baseless claim?

[Doctor Evil]

I fail to see any truth in your post including the part where you claim "I fail to see your point". You see it just fine.

List all the people who were arrested on 9/11 for just video taping the attacks, held for 70 days, and then deported.

And one more time. I didn't just list the dirt bags from Jersey City when I pointed out all the Israelis picked-up for being in this country illegally or spying both before and after 9/11. How many did you list and source to support your baseless claim?

Which part of my claim is baseless? Was anyone of them charged with spying?

I was not impressed with your links. Frankly, they seem to refer to unconnected incidents, and some of them repeat themselves.

If we start from your first links, they refer to many arrests after 9/11. While the news report mention a suspicion to a spy network, the story is a few years old. Where is the follow up information? Where are the trials? The story ended there, which leads me to suspect that there was so spying done. My impression is that it was just a group of people working illegally and that is the reason they were deported.

One of the stories from 2004 you mentioned also falls to the working illegally type. I can not see how this is related to spying. Do you expect me to believe that Israeli intelligence would employ people without arranging proper paperwork for them? This is just asking to get caught on any minor incident. Moreover, there were cases where Israeli intelligence agent were caught in other countries. In those cases they have used foreign passports, that is, they were not spying as Israelis. (I vaguely remember Canadian and New-Zealand passports being used.)

You also mentioned the case of the two Aipac employees which were charged with passing secret information. This is a real case which is still unfolding. I have not followed the trial, but I remember that the two employees thought that it was OK to pass that information. They were not operated by Israeli intelligence, and thus this story seems to be unconnected to your other claims.

Note that Israel did have spies in the US in the early eighties. Jonathan Pollard was one. That affair was very damaging to Israel. To minimize the damage the Israeli government promised not to spy in the US.
Foreign Ministry spokesman Arye Mekel issued a response Wednesday, saying "since 1985, a great deal of care has gone into following the guidelines of every prime minister in Israel, which prohibit this kind of activity in the United States."

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/977076.html

What you try to tell me is that Israeli intelligence are willing to risk grave results, for unknown gains, while using people without proper immigration papers? This does not add up. Moreover, the story always dies out since no further information surfaces. To me this is much more likely to be related to networks which employ illegal workers, and not to spy rings. If some further information which is actually useful surfaces I may reconsider my conclusions, but as it stands this is utterly unconvincing.

[Profanz]

Which part of my claim is baseless? Was anyone of them charged with spying?

This part…

A lot of people were arrested that day, and like a lot of people, they were released as there was no actual evidence that they did anything.

Name something that compares to the Jersey City Israelis and the detention they received.

I was not impressed with your links.

You are impressed enough to respond. Do my links bother you? Why?

If we start from your first links, they refer to many arrests after 9/11. While the news report mentions a suspicion to a spy network, the story is a few years old. Where is the follow up information? Where are the trials? The story ended there, which leads me to suspect that there, was so spying done. My impression is that it was just a group of people working illegally and that is the reason they were deported.

Your ignorance is bliss impression counts for nothing. The fact that Fox News removes its series on the “art student spy ring” from its website after only two days, in response to pressure from The Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs (JINSA), the Anti-Defamation League (ADL), the Committee for Accuracy in Middle East Reporting in America (CAMERA) and others supports your case how? Does that mean it didn’t happen? And they removed it they didn’t retract it.

One of the stories from 2004 you mentioned also falls to the working illegally type. I can not see how this is related to spying. Do you expect me to believe that Israeli intelligence would employ people without arranging proper paperwork for them? This is just asking to get caught on any minor incident. Moreover, there were cases where Israeli intelligence agent was caught in other countries. In those cases they have used foreign passports, that is, they were not spying as Israelis. (I vaguely remember Canadian and New-Zealand passports being used.)

I didn’t claim they were all spies I asked what they were doing. No one including you wants to answer. Israeli intelligence and AIPAC I have shown to this day still conducts itself in a very risky manner. Or maybe not so risky. I mean what happens to them even when they are caught red handed? Nothing.

You also mentioned the case of the two Aipac employees which were charged with passing secret information. This is a real case which is still unfolding. I have not followed the trial, but I remember that the two employees thought that it was OK to pass that information. They were not operated by Israeli intelligence, and thus this story seems to be unconnected to your other claims.

How do you know who they were connected to and who they weren’t? They were certainly connected to Douglas Feith the Iraq War cooker of lies of WMD’s weren’t they? Is this irrelevant also?


What you try to tell me is that Israeli intelligence are willing to risk grave results, for unknown gains, while using people without proper immigration papers? This does not add up. Moreover, the story always dies out since no further information surfaces. To me this is much more likely to be related to networks which employ illegal workers, and not to spy rings. If some further information which is actually useful surfaces I may reconsider my conclusions, but as it stands this is utterly unconvincing.

What’s their risk? What happens to them when they are caught? Does it mean they need shell out more donations to more US political campaigns? And still the fact that they work to kill stories like this in our media supports your case exactly how?

Now I do feel this type of behavior from Israel does carry a real risk to them that they seem to be oblivious to. A backlash where they could be set-up for the final final solution. They really need to smarten up, stop being so cocky, and realize that the risk of another holocaust happening isn’t just a cry wolf political strategy. It’s a reality.


http://www.biblestudysite.com/judea%20declares%20war%20-800px.jpg

Do some people never learn?

[Doctor Evil]

So you're argument just consists of picking up the details you like and giving these the worst interpretation. You wont consider counter arguments. And you finish with the claim that if the Jooos cant behave they will be killed again, with the paper from 1933.

You are not worth my time. Welcome to ignore.

[BenBurch]

So you're argument just consists of picking up the details you like and giving these the worst interpretation. You wont consider counter arguments. And you finish with the claim that if the Jooos cant behave they will be killed again, with the paper from 1933.

You are not worth my time. Welcome to ignore.

Is that what he did? I have him on ignore too.

Some people regret the Holocaust, but they regret that it was not finished.

[Profanz]

So you're argument just consists of picking up the details you like and giving these the worst interpretation. You wont consider counter arguments. And you finish with the claim that if the Jooos cant behave they will be killed again, with the paper from 1933.

You are not worth my time. Welcome to ignore.


Ignore or not I'm going to answer you. You brought up that it was risky behavior and you were correct. What if the US were to stop supporting Israel what would happen then? Could they survive? And yes they should behave towards the one who has both saved and protected them for all these years. Years ago some big mouths declared war on Germany and Germany responded by almost declaring them right off the planet. And it wasn't the poor shopkeepers and working stiffs of Poland and Germany and other places all over Europe who declared that war but they were the ones marched off to the trains and their ultimate demise. I'll just bet nothing happen to the actual ones who declared the war. Do you really think it can't happen again?

[Cl1mh4224rd]

http://www.biblestudysite.com/judea%20declares%20war%20-800px.jpg

Do some people never learn?


A British tabloid? ...Seriously?

[Slayhamlet]

Profanz - you raise some good points. In particular, this one

How did the scumbags in Jersey City know who was behind it at that point? It could have been another Timothy McVeigh type deal for all they knew.

However, if you are looking for a reasonable response from the misnomered "Sword of Truth", you will be dissapointed.

"Sword of Truth" is one of the most dishonest people on this forum. Couple this with a hardwired set of weird, blatantly racist beliefs, you may as well ask your dog for an answer.

The last time SoT misrepresented what I said and went on the attack, I spanked him like a monkey, and yet, like a child who cannot keep his fingers out of the electrical socket, he comes back for more.

Also, if you'd like to know why SoT hates non-white people, I can provide hundreds of sourced quoted from his heros.

Here's one from Joseph Fielding Smith
There is a reason why one man is born black and with other disadvantages, while another is born white with great advantages. The reason is that we once had an estate before we came here, and were obedient, more or less, to the laws that were given us there. Those who were faithful in all things there received greater blessings here, and those who were not faithful received less.

It appears Profanz is a disgusting anti-Semite who likes to blame the victims of the Holocaust based on disingenuous misrepresentations (http://www.nizkor.org/features/qar/qar11.html) of history propagated by Holocaust deniers and neo-Nazis. He also seems to relish the thought of a modern day Jewish Holocaust.

Will you be calling him out?

[Liszt]

A British tabloid? ...Seriously?

Yes, but note that the headline is a bit misleading.

The first line goes

"All Israel is uniting in wrath against the Nazi onslaught of the Jews in Germany"

Fair play, Jews!

The rest of the article is also fairly interesting. Someone just let Kelvin McKenzie do the headline.

But the most fascinating thing about that front page is the blank "Late News" section on the right hand side. Readers were obviously expected to fill that bit out as the day wore on.

[Liszt]

It appears Profanz is a disgusting anti-Semite who likes to blame the victims of the Holocaust based on disingenuous misrepresentations (http://www.nizkor.org/features/qar/qar11.html) of history propagated by Holocaust deniers and neo-Nazis. He also seems to relish the thought of a modern day Jewish Holocaust.

Will you be calling him out?


I'd like to. Hovever, I just about escaped a suspension today, and this is only because all the mods have me on "ignore".

I'll be drinking heavily on Monday afternoon, so perhaps that will be the ideal time.

[Sword_Of_Truth]

That and some despicable excuses for human beings high-fiving each other in Jersey City.

The Jewish Anti-Defamation Leauge will be pleased to hear you consider three jews to be "human beings". Now we just need to convince you the other 18 million are humans as well.

Please source said report because from what I know Hitler declared war on the US and it wasn’t a foregone conclusion that the Allies would win.

I'll admit I am uncertain about the champagne, but the fact remains that the British were very pleased to see the Americans finally on board. I'm afraid the fact is that once the USA was in the fight, Allied victory was very much a foregone conclusion.

How did the scumbags in Jersey City know who was behind it at that point? It could have been another Timothy McVeigh type deal for all they knew.

Who else is someone from Israel going to guess that it is? The list of extremist movements that are actively employing suicide tactics today is also rather short.

And were they held for 70 days and then deported just for celebrating the new found alliance against global terrorism?

Yep. That would be why they are suing.

I wouldn't be celebrating at the sight of the suicide bombers killing the friendly giants family. What is wrong with some people? I might even be a little suspicious of such a display. Especially if the death of the family benefits the ones celebrating.

Consider the following:


joo#1: (observing the burning WTC towers) My God... it's horrible.

joo#2: Anyone care to guess who would do such a thing?

joo#3: Do we even need to guess?

joo#2: Man, the Americans are going to be PISSED!

joo#1: Someone's gonna get thier asses kicked for this.

joo#3: And we all know who that's going to be...

j00#2: And it's about bleeping time that they did.

joo#1: Amen to that, brother!

(High fives ensue, old lady across the street calls police)

Your view these events through the lens of your own anti-semitism. The rest of us, however, can easily see how a conversation between these individuals can lead to behavior that would appear to someone not privy to the actual conversation as inappropriate.

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Did you even read the thread?

Yes, I did. You made your "spies can make mistakes" after Zorro informed you they were suing the US government. It's absolutely silly to compare dropping your briefcase with inviting goverment lawyers to actively dig into your past looking for things they can use to impeach your credibility on the witness stand.

If you were referring only to the alleged "dancing", then I'm afraid it's still silly. If in some parallel universe where 9/11 was an "inside job" and MOSSAD deployed a team to observe the attack in progress, they would have been doing so from inside the van or even an apartment and they wouldn't have gotten caught "celebrating".


How about this one?

Joseph Smith was a liar - deal with it.

Of that I have no doubt. But given that the state of Florida has sentenced him to death for the murder of 11 year old Carlie Brucia (http://www.courttv.com/trials/brucia/031506_sentencing_ctv.html), I don't see what worrying what fibs he may have told will gain anyone.

[Liszt]

Jesus wept.

[Liszt]

on a side note...

good reply from Sword of Truth.

Wrong - but still a good reply.

[Profanz]

The Jewish Anti-Defamation Leauge will be pleased to hear you consider three jews to be "human beings". Now we just need to convince you the other 18 million are humans as well.

Anyone laughing at the sight of the towers burning and falling on top of thousands of human beings is a scumbag. I don’t care what their self serving excuse was. Don’t even bother. And anyone who would apologize for them is just as big a scumbag including the anti-defamation league if they were to apologize for the laughing scumbags. By the way did they?

I'll admit I am uncertain about the champagne, but the fact remains that the British were very pleased to see the Americans finally on board. I'm afraid the fact is that once the USA was in the fight, Allied victory was very much a foregone conclusion.

What you should be admitting is that there is no valuable source for your imaginary story. If there was you would list it. You can’t.

Who else is someone from Israel going to guess that it is? The list of extremist movements that are actively employing suicide tactics today is also rather short.

Tell me something. Was it Anti-Semitic for the Israelis in Jersey city or what you like to refer to as “the joo’s” to assume what was happening to the WTC on 9/11 was the "A-rab’s"? Or doesn’t your Anti-Semitic finger pointing work both ways?

Yep. That would be why they are suing.

Really how’s that coming along? Got any information on that? And I mean information not imagination.

Consider the following:

joo#1: (observing the burning WTC towers) My God... it's horrible.

joo#2: Anyone care to guess who would do such a thing?

joo#3: Do we even need to guess?

joo#2: Man, the Americans are going to be PISSED!

joo#1: Someone's gonna get thier asses kicked for this.

joo#3: And we all know who that's going to be...

j00#2: And it's about bleeping time that they did.

joo#1: Amen to that, brother!

(High fives ensue, old lady across the street calls police)

Ok I considered it and I consider it more imagination from you for lack of anything else.

Your view these events through the lens of your own anti-Semitism. The rest of us, however, can easily see how a conversation between these individuals can lead to behavior that would appear to someone not privy to the actual conversation as inappropriate.

Israel doesn’t get a pass on everything they do wrong just because some of their ancestors were persecuted. No one in my family was part of that persecuted by the way. They were fighting in Europe on the American side to stop the holocaust. Before that my ancestors were suffering their own persecution from the British as well as suffering through famine. Can I go rob a bank now? Will you feel sorry for me and come to my defense?

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Anyone laughing at the sight of the towers burning and falling on top of thousands of human beings is a scumbag.

There is no evidence that they were laughing at people dying.

What you should be admitting is that there is no valuable source for your imaginary story. If there was you would list it. You can’t.

I admit I couldn't find a reliable source for the champagne story. But there is no reasonable doubt that Churchill was glad to have America join the fight. Americas factories produced more ships, planes and tanks during WW2 than all the other allies combined.

Tell me something. Was it Anti-Semitic for the Israelis in Jersey city or what you like to refer to as “the joo’s” to assume what was happening to the WTC on 9/11 was the "A-rab’s"?

No, given the history of islamo-fascist terrorism in the post WW2 era, it is not bigoted or prejudicial to believe they are the top suspects in a major terrorist attack.


Really how’s that coming along?

You'll have to ask their lawyers. Though that may involve taking to a jew.

Ok I considered it and I consider it more imagination from you for lack of anything else.

So any time I fail to assume that a group of jews are up to no good, it's just my imagination?

[Profanz]

Israel Prodding U.S. To Attack Iran

White House Weighs Striking Iran's Nuclear Complex, Which Could Trigger 3rd War In Region

Israel's message is simple: If you don't, we will. Israel held a dress rehearsal for a strike earlier this month, but military analysts say Israel can not do it alone. - CBS News June 24th 2008

Is this being up to good or no good?

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Is this being up to good or no good?


Relevance?

[Dr Adequate]

I'm not whining. You are running and hiding. What a strange lie.

Now, let me ask you again: if you want to know the answers to those questions, why don't you try to find out the answers in some way, instead of whining about your lack of knowledge on a web forum?

Go and find out the answers. Then let us know. I'm not hiding and I'm not running anywhere, I'll be right here waiting for you to come back with the answers that prove an Evil Jooish Conspiracy.

But I won't be holding my breath.

[Profanz]

What a strange lie.

Now, let me ask you again: if you want to know the answers to those questions, why don't you try to find out the answers in some way, instead of whining about your lack of knowledge on a web forum?

Go and find out the answers. Then let us know. I'm not hiding and I'm not running anywhere, I'll be right here waiting for you to come back with the answers that prove an Evil Jooish Conspiracy.

But I won't be holding my breath.

What an irrelevant mess you posted there for lack of anything else.

Now, let me ask you again: Why is Buchanan out of line?

Go ahead and try to answer even one thing I asked. Like what was so funny about Americans jumping to their death? What kind of sicko laughs and celebrates at such a sight? Come on let me know. I'm not whining I really want to know, I'll be right here waiting for you to come back and explain how its ok for some to cry about evil A-Rabs behind every corner but it's ant-Semitic to point out hard evidence of real Israeli wrong doing.

[Profanz]

Israel has a year to stop Iran bomb, warns ex-spy
By Carolynne Wheeler in Tel Aviv and Tim Shipman in Washington
Last Updated: 5:08PM BST 29/06/2008

A former head of Mossad has warned that Israel has 12 months in which to destroy Iran's nuclear programme or risk coming under nuclear attack itself. He also hinted that Israel might have to act sooner if Barack Obama wins the US presidential election. - Telegraph

Why? If they are going to do it on their own what's the difference who is president of America? Please.

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Like what was so funny about Americans jumping to their death? What kind of sicko laughs and celebrates at such a sight? Come on let me know.

People who hate jews.

buzRV-t5fLM

Watching that video makes me want to kick jew-haters teeth in. Do you know anyone who hates jews, Profanz? Cuz, boy... I got some frustrations to vent here.

@#$%ing scumbags. :mad:

[Profanz]

People who hate jews.

buzRV-t5fLM

Watching that video makes me want to kick jew-haters teeth in. Do you know anyone who hates jews, Profanz? Cuz, boy... I got some frustrations to vent here.


Oh I'm real sure you do Zohan. I'll bet you're a real bad dude.
Tell me something tough guy would you have kicked any teeth in if you had come upon the scumbags in Jersey City laughing at the WTC burning? Or would you of had to ask them first what their reason for laughing was? Would you have taken any frustrations out that day or is your outrage all relative to your slanted world view?

And please don't talk so tough. You're scaring me. I just might get nightmares.

[applecorped]

Take it outside boys.

[Par]

Watching that video makes me want to kick jew-haters teeth in.You're scaring me. I just might get nightmares.


Oops! You let that slip. You never have the best of luck when you’re defending anti-Semitism:

They falsely accuse people of being holocaust deniers thinking it will scare them off or they just use it to change the subject.The "Holocaust" is a enormous lie invented by the Jews in the early 1970's.

[Profanz]

Oops! You let that slip. You never have the best of luck when you’re defending anti-Semitism:

Say what?

No comprenda gibberish.

[Par]

No comprenda gibberish.


Claro, últimohijo.

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Oh I'm real sure you do Zohan. I'll bet you're a real bad dude.

Actually, my real name is AAron. It means "mountain of strength" in hebrew.

You may use that if you wish.

Tell me something tough guy would you have kicked any teeth in if you had come upon the scumbags in Jersey City laughing at the WTC burning? Or would you of had to ask them first what their reason for laughing was? Would you have taken any frustrations out that day or is your outrage all relative to your slanted world view?

I'm sorry? Were there "scumbags" celebrating the attacks in New York City? I ask because no one has ever provided any proof. At best all we have is anonymous third-hand hearsay testimony, which is effectively the same as zero evidence.

We're all free and clear here to say that the stories of the so called "dancing jews" are all false, that they never danced, celebrated or high-fived at all and you cannot say otherwise.

At the end of the day, it's your world view that is slanted. The only people of whom it has been proven that they were dancing on 9/11 are jew-haters. And your refusal to go after them with the same ferocity that you denounce your purely imaginary dancing jews speaks volumes about your own "slanted world view".

[JEROME DA GNOME]

At the end of the day, it's your world view that is slanted. The only people of whom it has been proven that they were dancing on 9/11 are jew-haters. And your refusal to go after them with the same ferocity that you denounce your purely imaginary dancing jews speaks volumes about your own "slanted world view".

Like this guy?

Wild Dancing Iraqi
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