Pathetic excuse for apologetics in 7/21 USAToday

[Phlebas]

I swear, they aren't even trying anymore. Maybe they feel USAToday readers need to be talked down to.

http://blogs.usatoday.com/oped/2008/07/reconciling-evi.html

Already written my response letter. Come on in, the water's stupid!

[Mr Blue Sky]

It feels really stupid after you just dive in. But eventually it just becomes a nagging disappointment.

From the article:
Besides, the reasons for the overwhelming poverty [a careworker] encountered were not God-made but man-made
*sigh* The point being made was that a God could:
A) Stop this from happening right now
or
B) Create a situation where this never happened

On balance, even with their acute suffering, the poor also feel blessed. They sense the rapture of sunlight flashing across lake or ocean, and soft breezes at sunset, and the great starry sky.I read that as saying sure they're alive, and happy. But 'they're as happy to be poor as they are of being alive' and that seems to be wrong. Correct me if you have another interpretation.

The one good point I saw was this:
Many Christians are poorly educated in their religion
However this soon became an argument for religious indoctrination in schools.

On the plus side, good comments so far.

[Gord_in_Toronto]

And, I would guess that "the sadistic guards at Dachau" all trotted off to church on Sunday and praised the Lord.

Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. —Voltaire

[TheAntiLuddite]

Just added my $0.02 under the nick Rationality.

[Phlebas]

Just added my $0.02 under the nick Rationality.

Good post.

I've posted a couple of things as Phlebas, but my heart's not in it. THese people make me tired all over :)

[UnrepentantSinner]

I tripped on the byline before I was even able to delve into the murky waters of apologia, but is the author Conservative pundit and former Crossfire blowhard Mike Novak? If so, forgive my reticience for signing up to offer a commentary because I believe in the 1st Amendment and the right of opinion writers to make asses of themselves but also because no matter how calmly and cogently I make the case as an atheist that most suffering is due to poop happening, just as surely as it does when we eat a big meal, but that man-made suffering is caused by politics and the unbridled exercise of political power... not atheism, will be lost on the readers and commentators who will read "I'm an atheist but.." and nothing following that.

:mad:

[Dragonrock]

I got almost half way through before I slipped off to scream. The condescending comments about how becoming atheist did not lessen the sorrow were too much for me. I feel that he is being intentionally ignorant when he says it because no one in their right mind believes that anyone says "I'm gonna become an atheist that way there will be no poor people".

[Upchurch]

I tripped on the byline before I was even able to delve into the murky waters of apologia, but is the author Conservative pundit and former Crossfire blowhard Mike Novak?
That'd be...
Robert Novak, Professional Douche Bag

[Phlebas]

USAToday printed my letter to the editor (responding to Novak's twaddle) in today's paper!

The watered it down a good deal, but I suppose it could have come out worse.

[UnrepentantSinner]

USAToday printed my letter to the editor (responding to Novak's twaddle) in today's paper!

The watered it down a good deal, but I suppose it could have come out worse.

I happened accross a copy last night in a break room and thought, though truncated, it was a dense, succint missive that I agreed with completely.

[devnull]

any scans?

[Safe-Keeper]

I got almost half way through before I slipped off to scream.Ditto.

Strawmen, diversion, and non-sequiturs, even the old history revisionist "Communism killed 100 millions because they had no god" bullocks. At least I found a couple gems to run off to FSTDT with:).

[Phlebas]

I happened accross a copy last night in a break room and thought, though truncated, it was a dense, succint missive that I agreed with completely.

Thanks US!

For anyone interested, here's what USAToday printed. Below that is my original:

USAToday:

Commentary writer Michael Novak misrepresented atheism and the problem of evil in his Forum piece “Reconciling evil with faith” (Monday).
Atheism doesn’t claim that belief in no God would rid the world of natural disasters. The problem of evil comes from the concept of a God who is omnipotent, omniscient and omnibenevolent.
Remove that God, and evil in all its forms is easily explainable through science.
I hope that Novak’s daughter’s friend found her determination to help invigorated by the conditions she found in Haiti, despite the loss of her faith. If she went there to truly help others, I’m sure it did. If she went only to earn gold stars from her God, perhaps her noble effort ended.
Suffering is a part of life, regardless of your religious beliefs. Christians turn to their God to help. Atheists turn to each other, believing that if they don’t help their neighbors, no one else will.

Original:

Rarely do you find a single essay like Michael Novak's, which managed to misrepresent atheism, evolution, ethics, and the problem of evil at the same time. The law of averages makes you think he'd get at least one right.

Atheism does not claim that belief in no god would rid the world of hurricanes or earthquakes. Nor does it claim that atheists are automatically altruistic. The problem of evil comes from the Christian conception of a god that is omnipotent, omniscient, and omnibenevolent. Remove that god, and evil in all its forms is easily explainable through science. As usual.

I hope that Novak's daughter's friend found her determination to help invigorated by the conditions she found in Haiti, despite the loss of her faith. If she went there to truly help others, I'm sure it did. If she went only to earn gold stars from her god, her noble effort may have ended prematurely. The other people trying to help there, atheists and otherwise, would have welcomed her aid.

Novak's pointless observation that "ceasing to be a Jew or a Christian does not wipe these evils away" is a poor excuse for Christian apologetics. Suffering is a part of life, regardless of your religious beliefs. Christians turn to their god to help, although his track record has been poor for the last 2000 years. Atheists have no one to turn to but each other, believing that if we don't help our neighbors, no one else will.

[Dragonrock]

Mr. Ottle,

Your letter kicked much in the butt department. You managed to clearly explain why Novak was full of crap in only 1/10th as many words as he used to spread it.

[grayman]

Even the edited version packs a punch.

And it would still make a point if all they printed was this:
Christians turn to their God to help. Atheists turn to each other, believing that if they don’t help their neighbors, no one else will.

Beautifully said.

[Civilized Worm]

Excellent work Ottle!