So apparently fluoride is a mind control drug?

[Jontg]

I think we all know the screed, but I haven't seen a thread on the subject of fluoride. Do the claims about its IQ-lowering properties hold any water, or is the study linked to on Wikipedia the only thing they can dredge up?

[Alareth]

Fluoridation is old school CT. I've heard claims about it for my entire life.

[Drudgewire]

You know when fluoridation first began? Nineteen hundred and forty-six. Nineteen forty-six. How does that coincide with your post-war Commie conspiracy, huh? It's incredibly obvious, isn't it? A foreign substance is introduced into our precious bodily fluids without the knowledge of the individual. Certainly without any choice. That's the way your hard-core Commie works.

I first became aware of it during the physical act of love. Yes, a profound sense of fatigue... a feeling of emptiness followed. Luckily I was able to interpret these feelings correctly. Loss of essence. I can assure you it has not recurred. Women sense my power and they seek the life essence.

I do not avoid women... but I do deny them my essence.

;)

[Mojo]

Have you ever seen a Commie drink a glass of water?

[TjW]

In Communist Russia, glass of water drinks you!

[Jontg]

Yes, yes, I know it's an old, silly idea--but has anyone ever done any good, solid debunking? I understand that anything is dangerous in high enough concentrations, but is there any substantial danger of decreased intelligence from the amount you find in a municipal water supply?

[maxfrost]

Yes, yes, I know it's an old, silly idea--but has anyone ever done any good, solid debunking? I understand that anything is dangerous in high enough concentrations, but is there any substantial danger of decreased intelligence from the amount you find in a municipal water supply?

I suspect not, otherwise people who claim fluoride is a mind control drug would be in the majority.

[Jontg]

True, but that logic isn't really going to work on people who are convinced everybody else is a mindless sheep.

[Elizabeth I]

Yes, yes, I know it's an old, silly idea--but has anyone ever done any good, solid debunking? I understand that anything is dangerous in high enough concentrations, but is there any substantial danger of decreased intelligence from the amount you find in a municipal water supply?

It's my understanding that the fluoride introduced into municipal water supplies is many many parts per million (or however it's measured) less than that which occurs naturally in the water in places such as Lubbock, Texas.

[Old Bob]

This got me into big argument on another thread with a dentist. More than one type of fluoride. Sodium fluoride in my opinion is a dangerous brain damaging substance. A poison left over from industry. Army towns in Australia use it to control the young troops as it is a compliance drug. part of the OWO control. The effects I have noticed is remoteness, fear, compliance, loss of interest in in anything out of mainstream news, perhaps best described as hive mentality. The dis-info dentist will no doubt debunk all this if he reads the thread, his reasons are all fluoride ions (sodium potassium calcium etc fluorides) are the same when dissolved. Just like dog **** tastes the same as human??

[~enigma~]

Just like dog **** tastes the same as human??
Why and how do you know this?

[Old Bob]

Why and how do you know this?

Because I get lots from this forum.

[tsig]

Because I get lots from this forum.

So we have dogs posting here? How do they force you to eat it?

[~enigma~]

Because I get lots from this forum.
Yeah....I was afraid you tasted it although that would explain a few things.

[tsig]

Because I get lots from this forum.

Old Bob have you been drinking the water?

[Magenta]

This got me into big argument on another thread with a dentist. More than one type of fluoride. Sodium fluoride in my opinion is a dangerous brain damaging substance. A poison left over from industry. Army towns in Australia use it to control the young troops as it is a compliance drug. part of the OWO control. The effects I have noticed is remoteness, fear, compliance, loss of interest in in anything out of mainstream news, perhaps best described as hive mentality. The dis-info dentist will no doubt debunk all this if he reads the thread, his reasons are all fluoride ions (sodium potassium calcium etc fluorides) are the same when dissolved. Just like dog **** tastes the same as human??


Evidence for the highlighted claim please? Incidentally, your claim implies that the Gallipoli Barracks (one of the largest Army bases in Australia) in suburban Brisbane has a different water supply than the rest of the city which doesn't have fluoridated water. Which I imagine would come as a surprise to the Brisbane City Council which is responsible for the city's water. How would that work?

[Old Bob]

Evidence for the highlighted claim please? Incidentally, your claim implies that the Gallipoli Barracks (one of the largest Army bases in Australia) in suburban Brisbane has a different water supply than the rest of the city which doesn't have fluoridated water. Which I imagine would come as a surprise to the Brisbane City Council which is responsible for the city's water. How would that work?

That's one I'm not sure of , but others and probably that one, as most have there own water treatment. Had a son in the air wing of the army who was shifted around. The forces can't rely on anyone but them selves. And I think that is good safe guard for in times of conflict it would be a easy to poison the base.

[TheDaver]

Time to add another layer of tinfoil to your hat, Bub. And that’s TIN foil, not that reptilian aluminum crap.

[defaultdotxbe]

his reasons are all fluoride ions (sodium potassium calcium etc fluorides) are the same when dissolved.
since dissolving separates the fluoride (F-) ion from the other ion(s) in the compound, yes, they are the same

so if theres a problem it would come from the sodium/potassium/calcium ions, not the fluoride

[steve s]

I first became aware of it during the physical act of love. Yes, a profound sense of fatigue... a feeling of emptiness followed. Luckily I was able to interpret these feelings correctly. Loss of essence. I can assure you it has not recurred. Women sense my power and they seek the life essence.

I do not avoid women... but I do deny them my essence.

;)


Thank you, Gen. Ripper.

Steve S.

[Elizabeth I]

This is my favorite antifluoridation story, and I tell it whenever I get the chance:

San Antonio had to bring fluoridation up on the ballot several times before it passed. During one of the fights, some know-nothing called one of the local radio talk shows to offer this chemical analysis: "You know what they already put in the water? CHLORINE! Now they want to add fluorine. And you know what you get when fluorine combines with chlorine? CHLOROFORM!"

[Drudgewire]

This is my favorite antifluoridation story, and I tell it whenever I get the chance:

San Antonio had to bring fluoridation up on the ballot several times before it passed. During one of the fights, some know-nothing called one of the local radio talk shows to offer this chemical analysis: "You know what they already put in the water? CHLORINE! Now they want to add fluorine. And you know what you get when fluorine combines with chlorine? CHLOROFORM!"


That's silly, everyone knows what you really get when you combine flouride and chlorine:


http://www.lethalwrestling.com/upload/ColorformGame.jpg


COLORFORM!! And believe me, that's much more sinister. :tinfoil

[Loss Leader]

I think we all know the screed, but I haven't seen a thread on the subject of fluoride. Do the claims about its IQ-lowering properties hold any water, or is the study linked to on Wikipedia the only thing they can dredge up?


It takes about an entire tube of toothpaste to control someone's mind if, by "control someone's mind," you mean, "cause them a horrible, agonizing death."

[Elizabeth I]

That's silly, everyone knows what you really get when you combine flouride and chlorine:


http://www.lethalwrestling.com/upload/ColorformGame.jpg


COLORFORM!! And believe me, that's much more sinister. :tinfoil

Ooooh, Colorforms. I LOVE Colorforms! I had a Walt Disney "Sleeping Beauty" Colorform set. If I recall correctly, Princess Briar Rose/Aurora was in a bustier and pantalettes and you could dress her in various outfits. Strange, I don't remember what the Prince was wearing.

[Loss Leader]

The effects I have noticed is remoteness, fear, compliance, loss of interest in in anything out of mainstream news, perhaps best described as hive mentality.


The flouride ion is, without doubt, a poison that will kill in sufficient doses. If ingested in quantity, it binds to just about everything in the body and disrupts almost every physical process necessary for life.

However, none of the things that you listed are effects of flouride poisoning. You can't take in enough flouride to disrupt your mental processes without killing yourself.

From my research: The fluoride forms hydrofluoric acid in your stomach, eating away at your intestines and causing immediate gastrointestinal distress. It drops your calcium levels and disrupts oxidative phosphorylation, glycolysis, coagulation, and neurotransmission. Fluoride inhibits Na+/K+ -ATPase, which may lead to hyperkalemia by extracellular release of potassium. Fluoride inhibits acetylcholinesterase, which may be partly responsible for hypersalivation, vomiting, and diarrhea. Seizures may result from both hypomagnesemia and hypocalcemia. Severe fluoride toxicity will result in multi organ failure. Central vasomotor depression as well as direct cardiotoxicity also may occur. Death usually results from respiratory paralysis, dysrhythmia, or cardiac failure.

Nothing you said about flouride's effects on the brain is true.

[DoubtingStephen]

Army towns in Australia use it to control the young troops as it is a compliance drug. part of the OWO control.

I guess you could use sodium fluoride as sort of a poor man's date rape drug.

Here dear, I got you a glass of water!

This must be why CIA agents always carry a Brita water filter concealed in the heel of their left shoe.

I guess if the US ever changes their policy on gays in the military it will be necessary to stop fluoridating the water at US military facilities.

Do you think they use fluoridated water during enhanced interrogations at Guantanamo?

[Old Bob]

Well sounds like you know the effects and are way ahead of me, but you did use the word "neuro-transmission". The only effect is the subtle change I have noted in people and I still think it affect behavior. Watched the city of Albury people change as fluoride took hold. Even to the point of picking the out of town visitor by their actions. The 2nd ww courts some statements were made how the prisoners were dosed to control them and making them easy to handle.

[Jontg]

Well sounds like you know the effects and are way ahead of me, but you did use the word "neuro-transmission".
And therefore you're going to cling to the one big word you recognize as "proof" of your lunatic notions.
The only effect is the subtle change I have noted in people and I still think it affect behavior. Watched the city of Albury people change as fluoride took hold. Even to the point of picking the out of town visitor by their actions.
And yet you were just too special to be affected. Ever thought of applying Hanlon's Razor to your ideas? Did it cross your mind, even for a moment, that maybe your community was just getting more insular? If you're a typical citizen, I can understand why.
The 2nd ww courts some statements were made how the prisoners were dosed to control them and making them easy to handle.
Which courts? Please cite a source for your claims. PrisonPlanet doesn't count.

[Old Bob]

And therefore you're going to cling to the one big word you recognize as "proof" of your lunatic notions.

And yet you were just too special to be affected. Ever thought of applying Hanlon's Razor to your ideas? Did it cross your mind, even for a moment, that maybe your community was just getting more insular? If you're a typical citizen, I can understand why.

Which courts? Please cite a source for your claims. PrisonPlanet doesn't count.

Nuremberg Trials. Google them read then, write back with maybe "sorry" As for being affected we have our own water supply. Are you Jewish?

[Jontg]

As a matter of fact, you're almost exactly opposite to the truth. My family's mostly German--we come from old Bavarian stock and can trace our ancestry still further back to the Huguenots, French Protestants who fled to Germany to escape Catholic persecution.

[Old Bob]

O good, we go back to Scott English mix. Have you read the Nuremberg trials yet,? still waiting for "sorry" Wondering why you would say "lunatic notions" when you have not got all the info.

[Loss Leader]

Well sounds like you know the effects and are way ahead of me, but you did use the word "neuro-transmission".


As I have said, by the time the flouride ion has any effect on neuro-transmission, it has already destroyed one's digestive system and prevented normal function of the heart.

And the only thing that it does to neuro-transmission is stop it. There's no subtle changes in personality or anything else. It just makes it impossible for nerves to transmit impulses at all.

There is no dose that will affect the brain in any way that won't also kill you.

You are absolutely wrong.

[Cuddles]

I've never really got the whole mind control thing. Let's assume for a moment that fluoride really is some kind of mind control thingy, it makes you susceptible to suggestion or something. OK, great. So who's doing the suggestion? As far as I can tell, the government or illuminati or giant lizards or whoever aren't in contact with me 24/7. In fact, I have contact with an awful lot of other people. If fluoride really does do something to me, surely every single person I talk to will be controlling my mind? Unless the fluoride is homeopathically programmed to control you itself, the effect of dosing every single person in the world with mind control drugs would be to make every single person in the world be controled by everyone else they come into contact with.

The dis-info dentist will no doubt debunk all this if he reads the thread, his reasons are all fluoride ions (sodium potassium calcium etc fluorides) are the same when dissolved.

Why would the dentist bother debunking it when you've just done so yourself? Will conspiracy nuts ever get tired of self-debunking? Surely it's a lot more fun if you get someone else to do it for you?

[fuelair]

I think we all know the screed, but I haven't seen a thread on the subject of fluoride. Do the claims about its IQ-lowering properties hold any water, or is the study linked to on Wikipedia the only thing they can dredge up?
One of several it shows up in - as fluoridation. http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=11559&highlight=fluoridation

[ktesibios]

Nuremberg Trials. Google them read then, write back with maybe "sorry" As for being affected we have our own water supply. Are you Jewish?

The transcripts of the IMT major war criminals trial amount to over twenty volumes. It's unlikely that anyone save a few dedicated scholars have read them in their entirety.

There is, however, an online version of the proceedings available at http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/imt/imt.htm . It is searchable. Searches on "fluoride" and "fluorine" return zero hits. Just to see if the search function worked I tried searching on the names of witnesses who I knew had testified at the Tribunal, e.g. "Franz Blaha" and "Marie-Claude Vaillant-Couturier" and got back plenty of hits which led directly to their testimony.

Old Bob is pulling the old conspira-loon chestnut of "I can't be arsed to do my own homework- you do it for me".

It's his (specious) claim. Let him come up with supporting evidence- a primary source, not cyber-metastasized fabrications from some hatefreak Web site.

[Elizabeth I]

Nuremberg Trials. Google them read then, write back with maybe "sorry" As for being affected we have our own water supply. Are you Jewish?

[emphasis added]

...Aaaand we've arrived at this long-foreseen point in less than 30 posts! Is this a record?

BTW, Old Bob, you have failed to account for the numerous regions where FLUORIDE OCCURS NATURALLY IN THE WATER. Why aren't all those people zombies?

[Zorglub]

You know when fluoridation first began? Nineteen hundred and forty-six. Nineteen forty-six. How does that coincide with your post-war Commie conspiracy, huh? It's incredibly obvious, isn't it? A foreign substance is introduced into our precious bodily fluids without the knowledge of the individual. Certainly without any choice. That's the way your hard-core Commie works.

I first became aware of it during the physical act of love. Yes, a profound sense of fatigue... a feeling of emptiness followed. Luckily I was able to interpret these feelings correctly. Loss of essence. I can assure you it has not recurred. Women sense my power and they seek the life essence.

I do not avoid women... but I do deny them my essence.

;)
Wich makes me think, CT: s must have a whole different view of Dr Strangelove than me. Gen. Ripper must be their hero, a man to admire, whereas he is a loonie with a gun to me.

[Loss Leader]

...Aaaand we've arrived at this long-foreseen point in less than 30 posts! Is this a record?


I don't know what his point was.

OldBob cited the Nuremberg Trials as evidence that the Nazis added chemicals to the water to make prisoners more compliant.
The 2nd ww courts some statements were made how the prisoners were dosed to control them and making them easy to handle.


This would seem to indicate that he believes the evidence adduced at Nuremberg and that he believes the Nazis were fairly bad people.

So, he may be looking for Jews in the hopes that they will confirm that Nazis drugged the drinking water.

As a Jew, my research indicates that they did not. Nor do I suspect they would have. The preferred Nazi method of pacification was shooting people to death. This is not to say that the Nazi doctors didn't experiment with hypnotic drugs. I just don't think the experiments were ever carried out on anything but an individual scale. Nor do I think the experiments involved pacification - they appear to have been aimed at creating a "truth serum."

Also, it doesn't look like any of this was brought up at Nuremberg.

See: Dr. Kurt Plotner

[dudalb]

Wich makes me think, CT: s must have a whole different view of Dr Strangelove than me. Gen. Ripper must be their hero, a man to admire, whereas he is a loonie with a gun to me.

Nope, a loony with nukes.
Apparently Bill Maher also buys into the floridatiion Woo, which just shows that being an Atheist is no guarantee that you won't jump on to the Woo Train.

[Old Bob]

Nuremberg trials have statements in them that backs my claim, thought anyone Jewish would have a interest and back me up. Nazi Jewish, don't care as the same stuff is still going on under different names. Tell this lot where in the transcripts after they treat me so polite? ( forgot anyway) A leading Nazi was asked why feed prisoners with fluoride? Answer_ "It makes them docile and easy to handle. As for the tin foil hat ever heard of a "Faraday Cage" Here a thought Jewish bankers loaded with sodium fluoride, does Sub Prime crash come to mind. As for Elizabeth 1 back to the old arguement many types of fiuoride calcium nat. ok. sodium fluoride waste from industry, hard to dispose so put it in the water and make money.

[Loss Leader]

A leading Nazi was asked why feed prisoners with fluoride? Answer_ "It makes them docile and easy to handle.


Old Bob, at least one person above and I have searched the transcripts. There is no mention of fluoride at all. It is not in the transcripts. You are wrong.

We've given you a link so that you can search for yourself. But you won't find it because it is not there.

[defaultdotxbe]

Old Bob, at least one person above and I have searched the transcripts. There is no mention of fluoride at all. It is not in the transcripts. You are wrong.

We've given you a link so that you can search for yourself. But you won't find it because it is not there.
make that at least two (and yourself)

i also searched for other topics i knew were discussed, just to see how well the search worked (since it was a google-based search which isnt always that great) but i came up with hits for everything

ETA: heres another place to search, they have a better embedded search (still no hits for fluoride, fluorine, floride, florine, flouride or flourine)

http://nuremberg.law.harvard.edu/NurTranscript/TranscriptSearches/tran_keyword_search.php

[ktesibios]

Purely out of curiosity I tried a Google search on "fluoride + nuremberg".

I got hundreds of hits for sites making the claim that water fluoridation violates the Nuremberg Code (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuremberg_code) of ethics relating to human experimentation. A great many reproduced exactly the same language, a diagnostic sign of cyber-metastasis.

I found only two claims (completely unsourced) that the Germans had administered fluoridated water to POWs for the purpose of keeping them docile.

The "the Nazis did it" meme doesn't seem to be all that current in conspiraloon circles. Given the "Chinese whispers" nature of communication in this milieu, perhaps Old Bob's belief is a mixup with the "Nuremberg Code" meme, which is much more widespread.

[Elizabeth I]

As for Elizabeth 1 back to the old arguement many types of fiuoride calcium nat. ok. sodium fluoride waste from industry, hard to dispose so put it in the water and make money.

That has already been answered:

since dissolving separates the fluoride (F-) ion from the other ion(s) in the compound, yes, they are the same

so if theres a problem it would come from the sodium/potassium/calcium ions, not the fluoride

[Old Bob]

Well I can't find the Nuremberg statement either, but Googled "toxic fluoride" the fist item of many "Australian Fluoridation News" worth a read. If I may deviate a little here, being brought up on a small cattle farm which was fertilized with superphosate, my father used to say the cattle were always short on minerals and try as he did they would eat the bark from trees. The reason, I find out 60 years on is that the fluoride in the fertilizer locks up the minerals in the grass and only the deep rooted trees can bring trace minerals up from below the polluted top soil. Also a chestnut orchard died out from super ph. Another cattle killing agent was bloat caused by fluoride build up in spring rye and clover grass from super. It kills one type of bacteria in the beast digestive system and allows another to proliferate that produce gas to lethal amounts. Thousands of cattle died and still do each spring the antidote being as simple as magnesium and of course stop the fluoride loaded fertilizer. From our health point of view it's fluoride that locks up the minerals we need to stay healthy in much of our foods. The barstards at the top know this, how many hu-mans have they killed.?

[Loss Leader]

If I may deviate a little here, being brought up on a small cattle farm which was fertilized with superphosate, my father used to say the cattle were always short on minerals and try as he did they would eat the bark from trees. The reason, I find out 60 years on is that the fluoride in the fertilizer locks up the minerals in the grass and only the deep rooted trees can bring trace minerals up from below the polluted top soil. Also a chestnut orchard died out from super ph. Another cattle killing agent was bloat caused by fluoride build up in spring rye and clover grass from super. It kills one type of bacteria in the beast digestive system and allows another to proliferate that produce gas to lethal amounts. Thousands of cattle died and still do each spring the antidote being as simple as magnesium and of course stop the fluoride loaded fertilizer. From our health point of view it's fluoride that locks up the minerals we need to stay healthy in much of our foods. The barstards at the top know this, how many hu-mans have they killed.?


Assuming that everything you write is true, do you now concede that nothing about flouride can lead to mind control?

Do you now concede that flouride poisoning is pernicious - attacking multiple organs of the body at once and leading to a painful death?

And, since people aren't dropping dead of fluoride poisoning, do you concede that the number of people killed in this manner is very, very low?

[Old Bob]

Assuming that everything you write is true, do you now concede that nothing about flouride can lead to mind control?

Do you now concede that flouride poisoning is pernicious - attacking multiple organs of the body at once and leading to a painful death?

And, since people aren't dropping dead of fluoride poisoning, do you concede that the number of people killed in this manner is very, very low?

Question 1 No, I think it has a mind effect as I said before,would you concede that some damaging anti fluoride news could be removed from the internet. Question 2 It is a rat poison. Question 3 The blocking of minerals by fluoride leads to sickness and shortens life, and take enough and you will die. And these questions are slanted.

[JimBenArm]

Well, it's all my fault, people. Part of my job is programming the control systems for water plants, and chemical control systems are included. We always include a toggle for "FREE WILL" and "MIND CONTROL" on the fluoridation systems. Defaults to "MIND CONTROL".
Not that you heard this from me...

[Loss Leader]

Question 1 No, I think it has a mind effect as I said before,would you concede that some damaging anti fluoride news could be removed from the internet.


No. That is impossible.


Question 2 It is a rat poison.


That is not a question. However, I would point out that this does not help your case. Fluoride doesn't control the minds of rats. Nor does it lead to some type of chronic sickness. It kills them. That's all fluoride poisoning can do - kill.


Question 3 The blocking of minerals by fluoride leads to sickness and shortens life, and take enough and you will die. And these questions are slanted.


That's not a question, either. However, it still does not support your point. Fluoride poisoning sickens and kills people. It does not control their minds.

You have posted absolutely NO EVIDENCE WHATSOEVER that fluoride can be used as a mind-control drug. Your statements about Nuremburg were found to be untrue. Your latest round of posts only stands for the fact that fluoride poisoning is deadly, which we knew already.

Do you have any evidence of any type that fluoride poisoning can do anything other than sicken and kill people?

[Praktik]

That has already been answered:

since dissolving separates the fluoride (F-) ion from the other ion(s) in the compound, yes, they are the same

so if theres a problem it would come from the sodium/potassium/calcium ions, not the fluoride

Believe it or not there's a discussion on this on another board I frequent. The Sodium Fluoride vs Calcium Fluoride thing came up and the conspiracist came up with this response:

http://www.fluoridedebate.com/question03.html

FROM THE ARTICLE:

In other words, industrial waste (sodium fluoride) is 85 times more toxic than natural calcium fluoride. Both of them contain fluoride, but they are totally different compounds. (Also see 3-2).

Calcium is a well-known antidote for fluoride poisoning. When an antidote accompanies a poison, it makes the poison far less toxic to the body. Soft waters to which fluoride is artificially added lack this calcium which is present in most waters that contain natural fluoride.

"The claim that fluoridation is one of 'nature's experiments' is not valid because the salts put into the water supply, sodium fluoride or silicofluorides, are industrial products never found in natural water or in organisms. They are, furthermore, notoriously toxic, sufficiently so to be used as rat poison or insecticide. Calcium fluoride, on the other hand, which is the form commonly found in natural waters, is not toxic enough for such uses." — Dr. C. G. Dobbs, (Ph.D., A.R.C.S.) Bangor, Wales, England.

So this guy's saying that the freed-up calcium acts as a natural "antidote" to fluoride poisoning and is thus less toxic....

Thoughts from people who know more than me?? ;)

[Thunder]

I had some idiot at a party tell me that the active ingredient in Prozac was sodium flouride. And that sodium flouride was extensively use by the Nazis on the Jews to dumb them down and make them accept their fate.

Prozac is a compound which has I believe 5 different atoms in it, one of them being flourine. There is NO sodium flouride in Prozac.

As for the Nazis using it for mind control..thats also crap. It just aint true.

[Praktik]

I had some idiot at a party tell me that the active ingredient in Prozac was sodium flouride. And that sodium flouride was extensively use by the Nazis on the Jews to dumb them down and make them accept their fate.

Prozac is a compound which has I believe 5 different atoms in it, one of them being flourine. There is NO sodium flouride in Prozac.

As for the Nazis using it for mind control..thats also crap. It just aint true.

Ya - as if they needed that to make them accept their fate (same for the red-scare fluoride stuff).

No, you know what breaks people down? Systemic violence and the threat of violence.

A minority may escape the fate of succumbing to their authority but most people do what the people with guns say.

Guns cause docility, not fluoride....

[Loss Leader]

Thoughts from people who know more than me??

Fluoride ions do most of their damage to the body by binding with calcium. This makes the calcium unavailable to use in biological processes (mostly the transmission of electrical impulses in the heart and brain - leading to seizures and arythmias.

However, fluoride also does a lot of damage by binding with hydrogen, making hydrofluoric acid. This eats away at the intestines, causing massive gastrointestinal damage. It also binds with sodium (causing hyponatremia) and interferes with the processes requiring phosphates.

Administering calcium may help with some aspects of fluoride poisoning but, in general, you're still probably going to die. Too many other systems are affected.

There's probably no reason to ever ingest any fluoride, even in toothpaste. And calcium fluoride (as opposed to, say, sodium fluoride) isn't safer.

Still, no mind control. Just death.

[Praktik]

Fluoride ions do most of their damage to the body by binding with calcium. This makes the calcium unavailable to use in biological processes (mostly the transmission of electrical impulses in the heart and brain - leading to seizures and arythmias.

So - dissolution in water frees the fluoride ions from the calcium before it is ingested.

once ingested, the free fluoride ions bind with calcium - reducing overall calcium levels?

So i guess this happens regardless of whether one drinks water with sodium fluoride or calcium fluoride... could it be said that when drinking a water source with calcium fluoride instead of sodium fluoride that the extra calcium in the water will help since there will be more overall calcium and therefore the effect of calcium reduction in the body will be lowered somewhat?

[dudalb]

To be fair, it seems to me that to argue that Floride might have some bad side effects is wrong but at least it is halfway rational, but to argue it is a mind control drug is just plain crazy.

[Snake_Doc]

Interesting topic, would like to add a few points I have picked up from having the same discussion in work.
Sodium Fluoride is not a rat poison, sodium fluoroacetate is used as a rat posion in some countries.
As for calcium fluoride ment to be better as it's naturally occurring, not exactly, its not soluble in water! So unless one is going to eat it with a spoon out of the bottom of glass of water, I don't see how you would ingest it.

Superphosphate doesn't contain any Fluoride, it's manufactured by adding sulphuric acid to phosphate rock.

Which generates Hydrofluoric acid, from which Sodium Fluoride is made.
Calcium Gluconate is used as a antidote for Hydrofluoric acid poisoning.

(Grrrr, will come back when I have 15 posts to post links and maybe smilies)

[defaultdotxbe]

As for calcium fluoride ment to be better as it's naturally occurring, not exactly, its not soluble in water! So unless one is going to eat it with a spoon out of the bottom of glass of water, I don't see how you would ingest it.
you could shake it up and drink the suspension really quick, might be a bit gritty and you probably wont be able to digest it though, lol

[Elizabeth I]

(Grrrr, will come back when I have 15 posts to post links and maybe smilies)

You can post links - just put spaces in between:

http: // forums. randi. org

And welcome!

And returning to your post, isn't calcium fluoride the naturally occurring form of fluoride - the stuff that's in the water that's naturally fluoridated? (I don't know - just thought that's what I had picked up from this thread.)

[boloboffin]

Well, when you find out that Stanley Kubrick had a relative in the aluminum business...

[Pato2747]

I have been seeing a lot of stuff like this linked to some famous PC games, which got CTs to the conclusion that the game is a "gov. black op in order to MIND CONTROL YOU! AND THEN INSERT YOU TEH CHIP!1"

The most famous one might be Half-Life 2. At the beginning of the game, set in a post-apocalyptic future where a race of aliens dominate the world with a totalitarian dictatorship, some old guy tells you to "Don't drink the water" because it has something "to make people forget". CTs tied this line with fluoride in the water, and then you can imagine the poostorm that came after that.

Although I have heard of plans of massive water fluoridization to keep bucal hygiene at a minimum, I've yet to see someone that got his/her IQ lowered with water.

Which makes me wonder if Alex Jones drinks a lot of tap water. Hmm...

[Snake_Doc]

You can post links - just put spaces in between:

http: // forums. randi. org

And welcome!

And returning to your post, isn't calcium fluoride the naturally occurring form of fluoride - the stuff that's in the water that's naturally fluoridated? (I don't know - just thought that's what I had picked up from this thread.)

The "name" Fluoride applys to the reduced form of Fluorine, the chemical ion F-. Also any compounds containing Fluorine are considered fluorides.

Fluoride occuring naturaly in water is the ion F-. According to http : // www . env . gov . bc . ca / wat / wq / BCguidelines / fluoride / fluoridetoo-03 . html calcium compounds are added to water with too much natural Fluoride in it, as it forms Calcium Fluoride, which is insoluble, and forms a precipitate. So no, calcium fluoride is not the naturally occuring form in water.

[Old Bob]

Any one know what 1080 poison is made from, colourless odourless tasteless and supper deadly, anyone for a nice drink of fluoride.

[defaultdotxbe]

Any one know what 1080 poison is made from, colourless odourless tasteless and supper deadly, anyone for a nice drink of fluoride.
sodium fluoroacetate

NaFC2H2O2

look, its got oxygen in it too, better stop breathing!

[Elizabeth I]

sodium fluoroacetate

NaFC2H2O2

look, its got oxygen in it too, better stop breathing!

Water, too! OH NOES!!!!!111!!!2

[JimBenArm]

Water, too! OH NOES!!!!!111!!!2
Not Dihydrogen Monoxide!!!!!!

[uruk]

I can't stand the crappy taste of tap water so I only drink bottled water.

So I guess that means I'm ok, right?

[Alex Libman]

It doesn't matter if it's effects are positive, negative, or neutral, the government has no legitimate reason to put it in our water! In a free market, whatever company pulled lunacy like that would go out of business pretty darn quick!

[Jontg]

Uruk, move someplace else; the tap water here is great with a bit of ice.
Alex, it's no different from a vaccine; you're free to opt out if you honestly think that fluoride is a tool of the space lizards instead of a good way to prevent tooth decay (have none of the CTs noticed that Americans do have some of the best teeth on the planet?). Just have the utilities shut off your water and buy your own.

[Alex Libman]

The government does not make it as easy as you make it sound. A private water company competing with one subsidized by tax victims (and in control of zoning laws, building permits, etc) doesn't have much of a chance.

[Jontg]

I never said it was easy--it's just the price you pay for paranoia. Well, part of it, anyway.

[Earthborn]

Prozac is a compound which has I believe 5 different atoms in it, one of them being flourine. There is NO sodium flouride in Prozac.The active ingredient of Prozac is fluoxetine. There are more than 5 atoms in it, but indeed of 5 different elements. None of them sodium.

[VespaGuy]

The government does not make it as easy as you make it sound. A private water company competing with one subsidized by tax victims (and in control of zoning laws, building permits, etc) doesn't have much of a chance.

It's extremely easy, Alex.

Step One: Find property in the suburbs without a water supply
Step Two: Purchase land/house
Step Three: Install a well

This is what I did. I don't pay a water bill and I have no flouride in my water.

I know you like to feel opressed by your government, but they aren't forcing you to drink flouridated water.

[Thunder]

i suggest we let conspiracy theorists believe all they want that prozac and other anti-depressants have sodium flouride, a "mind control drug", as their active ingredient. this way, depressed conspriracy theorists will not take their meds, and more of them will commit suicide.

=)

[Cuddles]

It's extremely easy, Alex.

Step One: Find property in the suburbs without a water supply
Step Two: Purchase land/house
Step Three: Install a well

This is what I did. I don't pay a water bill and I have no flouride in my water.

I know you like to feel opressed by your government, but they aren't forcing you to drink flouridated water.

When it comes down to it, step three is optional.:)

[Old Bob]

A careful read of old posts shows that most are affected, sad but true.I know some love to joke and take "the mickey" out of others,and we all have a smile. Ask yourself, have I been feed S.Fluoride. Do I think different to those country hicks? Am I less caring? Do I know the people next door? Do I believe that 911 was caused by a Arab? Do I fear the gov.? Have I prepared for trouble(food fuel)? If you answer yes yes yes no yes yes no. Bingo.

[Elizabeth I]

Does anybody but me ever occasionally feel like participating in this forum is not that far removed from visiting Bedlam to laugh at the lunatics?

[Gord_in_Toronto]

It's extremely easy, Alex.

Step One: Find property in the suburbs without a water supply
Step Two: Purchase land/house
Step Three: Install a well

This is what I did. I don't pay a water bill and I have no flouride in my water.

I know you like to feel opressed by your government, but they aren't forcing you to drink flouridated water.

I think you missed out a step. Don't you have to buy your house in a location that does not have naturally occurring fluorides in the water?

Oops. There does not seem to be such a place.
All water contains naturally occurring fluoride.
http://www.excelwater.com/eng/b2c/fluoride.php

[Mobyseven]

Does anybody but me ever occasionally feel like participating in this forum is not that far removed from visiting Bedlam to laugh at the lunatics?

Oh yeah. It's fun for the whole family.

[Gurdur]

[emphasis added]

...Aaaand we've arrived at this long-foreseen point in less than 30 posts! Is this a record?

BTW, Old Bob, you have failed to account for the numerous regions where FLUORIDE OCCURS NATURALLY IN THE WATER. Why aren't all those people zombies?


No offence, but you left the obvious and essential question unasked. Allow me to improve your post as follows:

...Aaaand we've arrived at this long-foreseen point in less than 30 posts! Is this a record?

BTW, Old Bob, you have failed to account for the numerous regions where FLUORIDE OCCURS NATURALLY IN THE WATER. Why aren't all those people Jewish, circumcized zombies?

[Old Bob]

No offence, but you left the obvious and essential question unasked. Allow me to improve your post as follows:

...Aaaand we've arrived at this long-foreseen point in less than 30 posts! Is this a record?

BTW, Old Bob, you have failed to account for the numerous regions where FLUORIDE OCCURS NATURALLY IN THE WATER. Why aren't all those people Jewish, circumcized zombies?

I didn't know Jews were Zombies,(thought they were quite smart as they own most things) our water has no natural fluoride. We have primery water bore. In spite of what others have said I say only sodium fluoride is harmfull and not natural. Catch 22 drink S.Fluoride and you can't dowse, so how do you find your own underground water.?

[JimBenArm]

I didn't know Jews were Zombies,(thought they were quite smart as they own most things) our water has no natural fluoride. We have primery water bore. In spite of what others have said I say only sodium fluoride is harmfull and not natural. Catch 22 drink S.Fluoride and you can't dowse, so how do you find your own underground water.?
I think I see what the problem is here. You say fluoride is a mind control drug. Since we've all ingested it, our minds are controlled. You, having not ingested it, have an uncontrolled mind. In other words, your mind is out of control, careening wildly all over the place. No wonder your posts don't make a lick of sense. You can't control yourself!

[Old Bob]

JimBenArm, lashing out a bit, must have hit a sore spot. All you can do now is to shield your children from S. Fluoride. Poisoned by your own gov. great to know that they love us.

[Gord_in_Toronto]

JimBenArm, lashing out a bit, must have hit a sore spot. All you can do now is to shield your children from S. Fluoride. Poisoned by your own gov. great to know that they love us.

When you had your water tested for Flourides, what was the limit to what was tested. What was the result in parts per something?

How do you know that the testing company is not part of the conspiracy? :boggled:

[JimBenArm]

JimBenArm, lashing out a bit, must have hit a sore spot. All you can do now is to shield your children from S. Fluoride. Poisoned by your own gov. great to know that they love us.
Ah, I see. Making fun of your foolishness is "lashing out". Got it.

What sore spot do you think you hit? My children are grown, suffer no ill effects, and can actually think and reason for themselves. My government had nothing to do with it. I keep the Kansas City Parks and Recreation Commission away from them at all times. They are the government, right?

Man, you must be a riot at parties. Oh, sorry, I'm sure that's a sore spot for you...

[Cuddles]

Does anybody but me ever occasionally feel like participating in this forum is not that far removed from visiting Bedlam to laugh at the lunatics?

The important difference here is that the inmates are voluntary. It's OK to laugh at people if they're asking you to. Of course, in this case you should replace "asking" with "dancing around naked on a table, painted purple, holding a board saying "Please laugh at me, I'm insane" and singing "Insane people are here to stay" by Crazy McNutter".

[Alex Libman]

It's extremely easy, Alex.

Step One: Find property in the suburbs without a water supply
Step Two: Purchase land/house
Step Three: Install a well

You win this argument, but...

Don't you socialists "care about poor people"? :detongue:

[Jontg]

Actually, we'd rather they didn't exist--but silly jabs aside, there's nothing preventing even a homeless man from buying a bottle of fluoride-free water. It's just that most of them don't have the money to entertain ludicrous notions of mandatory medication. Seriously, Alex, without any real evidence that fluoride has any serious health effects in the amounts we're talking about, the only objection that can be raised to putting it in our water is one borne of mindless adherence to the principle of the matter--and about ninety-nine percent of the population disagrees with the principle in question. It pains me to echo some of my own worst enemies, but if you despise the system so much that you don't wish to be part of it, then remove yourself from it; if you have enough spare time and resources to devote this much to empty posturing on the internet, you have enough to put your money where your mouth is.

[defaultdotxbe]

it should be too hard to build a solar-powered water evaporator, i made one in junior high for a science fair, lol

im pretty sure that will remove any evil fluoride from the water :)

[JimBenArm]

it should be too hard to build a solar-powered water evaporator, i made one in junior high for a science fair, lol

im pretty sure that will remove any evil fluoride from the water :)
But, wouldn't the homeopathic principles make it, you know, even MORE powerful?

[Mobyseven]

I didn't know Jews were Zombies,(thought they were quite smart as they own most things) our water has no natural fluoride. We have primery water bore. In spite of what others have said I say only sodium fluoride is harmfull and not natural. Catch 22 drink S.Fluoride and you can't dowse, so how do you find your own underground water.?

The same way anyone else with a brain finds water. By not dowsing.

[Thunder]

if flouride is a mind control drug, how come i hate george bush?

[JimBenArm]

if flouride is a mind control drug, how come i hate george bush?
A very small percentage of people have that as an aftereffect from the dihydrogen monoxide. Don't worry. It'll pass after January.

[Alex Libman]

if flouride is a mind control drug, how come i hate george bush?

You are expected to hate him. Or Obama. Or to be cynical of the whole process. Just as long as you pay your taxes......

But I do concede the fluoride issue. It's like roads - I'm sure private road owners would still fine / ban people for not following their rules, and privatizing those institutions isn't at the very top of any political libertarian's to-do list. And some private water providers may choose to fluoridate their water - the free market would decide.

(And politically I am a moderate libertarian, will probably even vote for Bob Barr even though all the purists call him "neo-con light". Anarcho-capitalism is my personal philosophy, a religion if you will.)

[Jontg]

Alex, this may be lost on you, but the fact that the system is screwed up does not mean it was designed to screw you over. Government is not inherently evil, it is a system by which humanity survives. Grow up, get a job, and contribute--unless you really are just a kid, which would explain a lot.

[Alex Libman]

Any system that depends on initiating violence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-aggression_principle#Formulations) is inherently screwed up. I would agree that theft, murder, and other thuggery can never be gotten rid of completely, but that doesn't mean I have to like it or suppress my natural desire to speak out against it.

And when you tell an anarcho-capitalist to get a job, the only response you should expect to get is "I already have five" (or so) - and none are among the ~50% of jobs out there that in some way directly depend on government force. I have even higher ethical standards than that, actually, but that's between me and the copy of The Fountainhead that I keep on my bedstand at night.

[dudalb]

Any system that depends on initiating violence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-aggression_principle#Formulations) is inherently screwed up. I would agree that theft, murder, and other thuggery can never be gotten rid of completely, but that doesn't mean I have to like it or suppress my natural desire to speak out against it.

And when you tell an anarcho-capitalist to get a job, the only response you should expect to get is "I already have five" (or so) - and none are among the ~50% of jobs out there that in some way directly depend on government force. I have even higher ethical standards than that, actually, but that's between me and the copy of The Fountainhead that I keep on my bedstand at night.

Why is my BS detector going crazy at the moment?

[dudalb]

Alex, this may be lost on you, but the fact that the system is screwed up does not mean it was designed to screw you over. Government is not inherently evil, it is a system by which humanity survives. Grow up, get a job, and contribute--unless you really are just a kid, which would explain a lot.


I would bet money that Alex is not over the age of 22.

[Elizabeth I]

How can an anarcho-anything be against violence? In a truly anarchistic society, there would be a high level of violence. There are just too many people who can't or won't control themselves.

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Why is my BS detector going crazy at the moment?

Too much FLOURIDE?

[Alex Libman]

Why is my BS detector going crazy at the moment?

Because you went to a government-regulated school and didn't change course since then?


I would bet money that Alex is not over the age of 22.

I am 26 years, 10 months, and 3 days old.

(I don't like to take money from socialists.)


How can an anarcho-anything be against violence? In a truly anarchistic society, there would be a high level of violence. There are just too many people who can't or won't control themselves.

Why is it that people only see the word "anarchy" and not the word "capitalism"? The latter is the ultimate system of conflict resolution. Anarchy merely means lack of centralized hierarchy, and centralized hierarchy can only be maintained by force.

[Old Bob]

I have some good stuff coming, words that Hitler spoke. Hope to get it within a week. Then it will be interesting to see if all the pro fluoride know it all's will agree. This debate is really serious for the mental health of hu-mans, to realize the long term effect is to submit to slavery for the e-lite.

[TjW]

Why? Was Hitler a chemist?

[Thunder]

You are expected to hate him. Or Obama. Or to be cynical of the whole process. Just as long as you pay your taxes......

But I do concede the fluoride issue. It's like roads - I'm sure private road owners would still fine / ban people for not following their rules, and privatizing those institutions isn't at the very top of any political libertarian's to-do list. And some private water providers may choose to fluoridate their water - the free market would decide.

(And politically I am a moderate libertarian, will probably even vote for Bob Barr even though all the purists call him "neo-con light". Anarcho-capitalism is my personal philosophy, a religion if you will.)

so...flouride makes me pay my taxes?

i pay taxes cause i dont want to go to jail..and i respect the power of the people. the people, through their representatives, passed the 19th amendment allowing for federal income taxes.

[Gord_in_Toronto]

I have some good stuff coming, words that Hitler spoke. Hope to get it within a week. Then it will be interesting to see if all the pro fluoride know it all's will agree. This debate is really serious for the mental health of hu-mans, to realize the long term effect is to submit to slavery for the e-lite.

Did you get your current water tested for flourides? What were the results?

You did have your water tested, didn't you?

[Alex Libman]

so...flouride makes me pay my taxes?

Yes, indirectly. The free market doesn't put it in your water, the government does. And its addition has a cost, no matter how minuscule, which has to come from somewhere...


i pay taxes cause i dont want to go to jail..

Do you think the founding fathers of this country wanted to face the wrath of the British Empire over a tiny tea tax? That took testicular fortitude, and that's why there are mountains named after them in New Hampshire. And from the top of Mount Sam Adams I point down at you and call you a coward!


and i respect the power of the people. the people, through their representatives, passed the 19th amendment allowing for federal income taxes.

If "people" told you to jump off a bridge, would you do it? (Not that you'd have a choice...)

[ktesibios]

I have some good stuff coming, words that Hitler spoke. Hope to get it within a week. Then it will be interesting to see if all the pro fluoride know it all's will agree. This debate is really serious for the mental health of hu-mans, to realize the long term effect is to submit to slavery for the e-lite.

With a checkable reference to a primary source, or just some crap that some lying conspira-loon extracted from his nethers?

[Jontg]

Do you think the founding fathers of this country wanted to face the wrath of the British Empire over a tiny tea tax? That took testicular fortitude, and that's why there are mountains named after them in New Hampshire. And from the top of Mount Sam Adams I point down at you and call you a coward!

I'm calling total BS on your claims regarding... well, pretty much your entire background. Anyone who still thinks we went to war with the Brits over taxes never graduated from high school. Remember the other half of their slogan? The whole point was that the colonists were taxed like British citizens without having a voice in Parliament like any citizen should. It wasn't about the freaking money.

[Alex Libman]

And neither is my resistance.

[Old Bob]

Did you get your current water tested for flourides? What were the results?

You did have your water tested, didn't you?

Yes at the Qld Uni, and no fluorides present, as I said it,s primary water associated with ley lines unaffected by drought as it comes up from the depth's. May be new water produced by the earth. Ever heard of the church well? Most big churches are built on a ley line and water often runs with a ley line.

[defaultdotxbe]

May be new water produced by the earth.
is there much hydrogen being combusted under the earths surface?

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Yes at the Qld Uni, and no fluorides present, as I said it,s primary water associated with ley lines unaffected by drought as it comes up from the depth's. May be new water produced by the earth. Ever heard of the church well? Most big churches are built on a ley line and water often runs with a ley line.

"no fluorides present" is absolutely impossible. To how many parts per million was the water tested? What were the exact resulrs? What other "impurities" were tested for? What were these results?

Most ley lines are drawn through churches after they are built. Sometimes water doesn't run with a ley line. :confused:

[Old Bob]

"no fluorides present" is absolutely impossible. To how many parts per million was the water tested? What were the exact resulrs? What other "impurities" were tested for? What were these results?

Most ley lines are drawn through churches after they are built. Sometimes water doesn't run with a ley line. :confused:

Wrong, ley lines are there first the natives had middens on (in) them. I watched a mason temple built in a odd place only to find out it was positioned on a ley line. But you are right about water not always with a ley line. I have lost the water test results. But I can read and remember.

[JimBenArm]

Ley lines? Aren't they all in Hawaii? Aren't they where the natives go to get lei'd?

How convenient you "lost" the water test results. Not that I don't trust your memory. Oh, wait, I forgot! Must be the fluoride in my toothpaste, I don't trust your memory!

[Gord_in_Toronto]

Wrong, ley lines are there first the natives had middens on (in) them. I watched a mason temple built in a odd place only to find out it was positioned on a ley line. But you are right about water not always with a ley line. I have lost the water test results. But I can read and remember.

Who lays out the ley lines?

How do you know that the NWO (aka "The Government") has not gotten to the water testers not to report, incorrectly, that there is no fluoride in your water? :confused:

[Elizabeth I]

The natives put their manure and garbage heaps on the magical ley lines?

[JimBenArm]

I'd like a magical lay. I mean ley, sorry.

[tsig]

Does anybody but me ever occasionally feel like participating in this forum is not that far removed from visiting Bedlam to laugh at the lunatics?

Except when I worry I may be an inmate and I hear the sound of laughter.

[tsig]

I'd like a magical lay. I mean ley, sorry.


Then you'd want to lei a fairy.

[Belz...]

Because you went to a government-regulated school and didn't change course since then?

Government-regulated schools don't give courses in obeying. What's your point ?

(I don't like to take money from socialists.)

So you're a fanatic.

Why is it that people only see the word "anarchy" and not the word "capitalism"?

Because with the first one the other one doesn't work.


Say, Alex. How does the fluoride work ?

[Inertia]

Breach of Rule 4 removed.

[bynmdsue]

mmmmm....flouridated spam

[Inertia]

mmmmm....flouridated spam


Telling you the truth is spam, go back to drinking the kool-aid, you seem to have drank an extra dose of your flouride today. :)

[dudalb]

WHy am I expecting Inertia to start talking about protecting our Precious Bodily Fluids any moment now?

[Gord_in_Toronto]

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Risk/fluoridated-water

[Mobyseven]

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/risk/fluoridated-water (http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/risk/fluoridated-water)

Shill!

[Jontg]

You expect him to do anything but woo out when confronted with a .gov link? Seriously, Inertia, literally everything in your post was addressed earlier in the thread. Go find a militia to preach to.

[Gord_in_Toronto]

You expect him to do anything but woo out when confronted with a .gov link? Seriously, Inertia, literally everything in your post was addressed earlier in the thread. Go find a militia to preach to.

I only post for the LURKERS!

(Not those insain individuels whoes branes have been destroid by compoonds of fluorine) :D

[Jontg]

Seriously, though, Inertia, how do you explain the fact that nearly every scientist on Earth can tell you that Fluoride isn't remotely dangerous in the quantities we're talking about? Are they all agents/shills/sheeple?
EDIT: And yes, I admit I've only read about 70% of your blatant hunk o' copypasta (tm)--but that's more than enough to tell you that it's essentially crap. Osteosarcoma, for example, is among the rarest types of cancer; you're more likely to get it from a dentist's x-ray than from the fluoride rinse, and any indication that it's on the rise is likely an artifact, given the tiny size of the populations being surveyed. Neither myself nor anyone I know has experienced any ill effects from dental fluoride treatments (which, btw, are not illegal), which would be impossible if your figure is right. Anything on Earth, from fluoride to calcium to water to oxygen, will kill you in extreme amounts--and yet we use potentially deadly compounds on ourselves all the time, because the odds of an overdose are extremely low.

[Inertia]

Oh, so evidence is considered trolling? :rolleyes: I am done with this thread, you people are mindless. :)

[JimBenArm]

Oh, so evidence is considered trolling? :rolleyes: I am done with this thread, you people are mindless. :)
Well, you know it's the fluoride...

[1337m4n]

This is the easiest CT in the world to debunk. You can do it at home.

1) Buy a bunch of "juicy" fruits: apples, oranges, watermelons, etc.

2) Record your thoughts and behavior on a normal day (the control).

3) On another normal day, drink about 5 times the amount of tap water you normally drink. Record your thoughts and behavior (the first extreme).

4) On still another normal day, drink no water at all. Use fresh-squeezed fruit juices to hydrate yourself. Record your thoughts and behavior (the opposite extreme).


While doing #3, did you notice yourself suddenly supporting fascism and mysterious men in black whom you've never met? While doing #4, did you notice yourself start believing in Truthy things like thermite, invisible explosives, holographic planes, and space death ray laser beams?

Try it at home!

[Snake_Doc]

Wrong, ley lines are there first the natives had middens on (in) them. I watched a mason temple built in a odd place only to find out it was positioned on a ley line. But you are right about water not always with a ley line. I have lost the water test results. But I can read and remember.

So people built churchs on top of rubbish dumps?

[angelsaramark]

Ummm.... Yes. There is naturally occurring sodium fluoride and other fluorine compounds just like cyano compounds some of which are safe and beneficial. But naturally occurring has nothing to do with safety. Uranium is natural, but I don't suggest ingesting of it. The natural sodium fluoride is responsible for birth defects and premature aging where it occurs in high enough levels. The chronic effects are "unknown" at lower doses but if it will kill a cockroach, then be suspicious.

Rurik C. ROARK, Baltimore, Md.: "Insecticide", US Patent 1,524,884; filed Aug. 6, 1923; granted Feb. 3, 1925 ("The poisonous action of soluble fluorides is well known and has been utilized for the control of injurious insects. For example, sodium fluoride, a salt readily soluble in water, is a very effective roach poison and is a common ingredient of roach powders. Potassium and barium fluorides have been similarly employed ...")

"There is nothing new in the use of sodium fluosilicate as an insecticide. Its use for that purpose was described nearly thirty years ago by HIGBEE (English Patent No. 8236, May 23, 1896). More recently, WILLE has reported tests with sodium fluosilicate against roaches and COBENZL mentions it as a common ingredient of rat and insect poisons" (Roark C., Department of Agriculture: "Fluorides vs. fluosilicates as insecticides", Science 63 (April 23, 1926) 431-2)

[angelsaramark]

Seriously, though, Inertia, how do you explain the fact that nearly every scientist on Earth can tell you that Fluoride isn't remotely dangerous in the quantities we're talking about? Are they all agents/shills/sheeple?
EDIT: And yes, I admit I've only read about 70% of your blatant hunk o' copypasta (tm)--but that's more than enough to tell you that it's essentially crap. Osteosarcoma, for example, is among the rarest types of cancer; you're more likely to get it from a dentist's x-ray than from the fluoride rinse, and any indication that it's on the rise is likely an artifact, given the tiny size of the populations being surveyed. Neither myself nor anyone I know has experienced any ill effects from dental fluoride treatments (which, btw, are not illegal), which would be impossible if your figure is right. Anything on Earth, from fluoride to calcium to water to oxygen, will kill you in extreme amounts--and yet we use potentially deadly compounds on ourselves all the time, because the odds of an overdose are extremely low.

This is not even remotely correct. Yes, the old and tired adage about everything is a poison is true, but the science of toxicology is very different from your example. Trace amounts of NaCl / NaBr and non-toxic compared to NaFl. Oversalting food can give you hypertension, but it goes away once the diet is changed. NaFl has much more serious potential reprocussions. http://www.jtbaker.com/msds/englishhtml/S3722.htm (health 3) NaCl http://www.jtbaker.com/msds/englishhtml/S3338.htm (health 1). By the way, read the back of your toothpaste tube and take a look at some professionals (the link) that are done with fluoride. This is something that's on it's way out.

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/79326.php

[zaphod2016]

You know when fluoridation first began? Nineteen hundred and forty-six. Nineteen forty-six. How does that coincide with your post-war Commie conspiracy, huh? It's incredibly obvious, isn't it? A foreign substance is introduced into our precious bodily fluids without the knowledge of the individual. Certainly without any choice. That's the way your hard-core Commie works.

I first became aware of it during the physical act of love. Yes, a profound sense of fatigue... a feeling of emptiness followed. Luckily I was able to interpret these feelings correctly. Loss of essence. I can assure you it has not recurred. Women sense my power and they seek the life essence.

I do not avoid women... but I do deny them my essence.

;)

For those who haven't seen it (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1KvgtEnABY\)

Well worth a rental (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0057012/)

[zaphod2016]

This is the easiest CT in the world to debunk. You can do it at home.

1) Buy a bunch of "juicy" fruits: apples, oranges, watermelons, etc.

2) Record your thoughts and behavior on a normal day (the control).

3) On another normal day, drink about 5 times the amount of tap water you normally drink. Record your thoughts and behavior (the first extreme).

4) On still another normal day, drink no water at all. Use fresh-squeezed fruit juices to hydrate yourself. Record your thoughts and behavior (the opposite extreme).


While doing #3, did you notice yourself suddenly supporting fascism and mysterious men in black whom you've never met? While doing #4, did you notice yourself start believing in Truthy things like thermite, invisible explosives, holographic planes, and space death ray laser beams?

Try it at home!

A few problems with this experiment:

1. Advocates of the fluoride theory claim that the effects are caused through consistent exposure; a single dose won't do it

2. If the fruit was grown with fluoridated water, it will have absorbed some of the fluoride, thus perverting your control

I think the better way to debunk this claim is similar to the way James Randi debunks homeopathy. I don't have the time to find hard data right now, but this article (http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/120127879/abstract?CRETRY=1&SRETRY=0) opposes bottled water because it does not contain enough fluoride to provide dental benefits.

In other words, just as with homeopathy, an extremely dilute portion of fluoride won't do anything. However, assuming the opposite is also true, how much fluoride is in the water in order to achieve these positive dental effects? How does the % of fluoride compare to, say, mercury?

Speaking from experience, I feel noticeably better when drinking filtered water, as opposed to tap water. However, it is important to note that my water filter does not remove fluoride.

[psy kick]

I almost fell for this one, until I realized that probably everyone who suddenly 'realized' flouride was a mind control drug somehow realized it while using it. Guess it doesn't work that well..

[soylent]

This is what I did. I don't pay a water bill and I have no flouride in my water.

I find that rather unlikely; have you measured the actual fluoride level or are you just guessing?

[RoboTimbo]

I didn't know Jews were Zombies,(thought they were quite smart as they own most things) our water has no natural fluoride. We have primery water bore. In spite of what others have said I say only sodium fluoride is harmfull and not natural. Catch 22 drink S.Fluoride and you can't dowse, so how do you find your own underground water.?


But the underground water you've found by dowsing, it contains fluoride. The only possible conclusion that makes sense is that you're part of the NWO conspiracy.

[TheDaver]

I almost fell for this one, until I realized that probably everyone who suddenly 'realized' flouride was a mind control drug somehow realized it while using it. Guess it doesn't work that well..
Not really.

A lot of conspiracy fantasists seem to have a “hero of my own life story” worldview. Meaning, they’re somehow more clever that the world’s top physicists, chemists and doctors, and have uncanny mutant powers that make them immune to the same chemicals, signals and other influences that keep the rest of mankind under gubbermint/NWO/Reptilian control.

Heck, I’ve even heard conspiracy fantasists ranting about how they obviously have extremely powerful auras because occasionally street lamps black out when they walk by.

[JimBenArm]

Heck, that's nothing. I've had people black out when I walk by.

Of course, this is after a few days without showering...

[Matthew Best]

I have some good stuff coming, words that Hitler spoke. Hope to get it within a week. Then it will be interesting to see if all the pro fluoride know it all's will agree. This debate is really serious for the mental health of hu-mans, to realize the long term effect is to submit to slavery for the e-lite.

Within a week????

How about ten weeks and counting?

[Old Bob]

Within a week????

How about ten weeks and counting?

Sorry, it didn't turn up. Best way I can convience you is for those who doubt sodium floruide is harmfull Google it, plenty to read.

[dafydd]

Originally Posted by Elizabeth I
Does anybody but me ever occasionally feel like participating in this forum is not that far removed from visiting Bedlam to laugh at the lunatics?

I lurk here a lot but rarely post. I hadn't realised it,but that is the reason why I come here,to see what lunacy the credophiles are spouting.Old Bob is a prime example of the species,impervious to reason. The old digger has probably been out under the antipodean sun for too long without his bush hat.

[defaultdotxbe]

Sorry, it didn't turn up. Best way I can convience you is for those who doubt sodium floruide is harmfull Google it, plenty to read.
the best way you can convince us is to let someone else convince us?

[TheDaver]

Sorry, it didn't turn up. Best way I can convience you is for those who doubt sodium floruide is harmfull Google it, plenty to read.
Has it occurred to you that some – if not most – of us have researched it?

“Sodium fluoride” can be beneficial or harmful. It all depends on the quantity. As with many other chemicals.

[Old Bob]

At last , fertilizer is now having the fluoride removed because it ties up the minerals, after crippling thousands of woman with osteoporosis and causing untold misery and sickness some one has finely listened to people who know. My be work health and safety has left them open to litigation. All you deniers can check that out.

[Skeptic]

I think we all know the screed, but I haven't seen a thread on the subject of fluoride. Do the claims about its IQ-lowering properties hold any water?

Oh, you bet. Just look at the IQ of the people who publicly claim to have been damaged by flourinated water.

[Klimax]

Oh, you bet. Just look at the IQ of the people who publicly claim to have been damaged by flourinated water.

One suggestion:compare it before drinking that water,since after that they will just claim,see,we told you so...

[psy kick]

Heck, I’ve even heard conspiracy fantasists ranting about how they obviously have extremely powerful auras because occasionally street lamps black out when they walk by.That happens on the street near me every time my son and i walk by at evening. I know its not auras.