Astrology as a God decree, Million Dollar Challenge

[astroman818]

I am here to get feedback from those who post here. I have worked for 4 years to get good enough to take on the million dollar challenge. By all means I have just barely unlocked the information in astrology. I found the timing code. I also found many special meanings to what it is saying. Kind of like a language. I found death, marriage, divorce. Astrology is a motivator, it has nothing to do with our free will. There are things that happen and we have no choice. There are things that happen and we do have a choice, then we consistently choose what it is saying. It seems to run our feelings and desires. It tells me who are our sex partners and friends. I am here to show people what it is saying and how it really works. I do not blame everyone for feeling so cheated by the current astrology crowd. I do something very different. I find nothing in any of them of note worthiness also.


I am here to collect the Million Dollar Prize. To prove that there is a God and we were created beings. Astrology is a God decree, not a mathematical constant. I would love to heat up the post here so lets start to talk about it. I will try to stay with everyone. This is part of a 15 year study and I do have a business and 4 children.

[drkitten]

I am here to get feedback from those who post here. I have worked for 4 years to get good enough to take on the million dollar challenge.

Have you read the Challenge rules yet? Simply posting on the forums isn't the same thing as applying, and you need to actually apply to be eligible to take on the million dollar challenge.

Perhaps more importantly, what are you "good enough" at? What can you actually demonstrate astrology to be capable of? Vague statements about proving there is a God will not qualify; you need to be able to propose (and pass) a testable claim, such as "Given a list of twenty names and birthdates, I will be able to identify with 80% accuracy which of the people listed are currently married, which are currently divorced, and which have never been married."

Good luck!

[CurtC]

Yep, skip all the stuff about how it works and the vague philosophy. Tell us exactly what you can do to show an observer that it's true. Something measurable.

[Piggy]

I would love to heat up the post here so lets start to talk about it. I will try to stay with everyone.

Rather than heating up the post, I'd suggesting using the forum to cool it down instead, so to speak.

As others have said, you have to take your idea and ask yourself this question: What exactly can I do that will prove what I'm saying?

So you actually want to focus at this point, instead of expand.

One idea has already been suggested, but it might not fit exactly with what you believe can be done with astrology.

There are lots of people here who will be glad to help you figure out how to develop a testable proposition.

[Pixel42]

You might like to look at all the other attempts that have been made to demonstrate that astrology works.

This site is a good place to start: http://rudolfhsmit.nl/index.html

[Theophage]

What is it you think you can do with astrology, astroman? To win the prize, you have to produce a specific effect which can be judged as having happened or not. What effect can you produce?

[Hokulele]

I am here to get feedback from those who post here. I have worked for 4 years to get good enough to take on the million dollar challenge. By all means I have just barely unlocked the information in astrology. I found the timing code. I also found many special meanings to what it is saying. Kind of like a language. I found death, marriage, divorce. Astrology is a motivator, it has nothing to do with our free will. There are things that happen and we have no choice. There are things that happen and we do have a choice, then we consistently choose what it is saying. It seems to run our feelings and desires. It tells me who are our sex partners and friends. I am here to show people what it is saying and how it really works. I do not blame everyone for feeling so cheated by the current astrology crowd. I do something very different. I find nothing in any of them of note worthiness also.


Does this language tell you anything about future events, or does it simply explain what happened in the past?

[astroman818]

Develope a testable proposition. This is why I am here expanding on my work. I did not expect to have all of you here talking to me so fast. I will try to explain what I have found. bare with me. Astrology like I said is only a motivator. It changes us, this is what I will be proving. Yes it does work on the future as well as the past.

Astrology does not work on every one. Because we all make our choices differently. If you are the kind of person that feels it then does it I will cal every major change in your life. I think the most interesting thing is to just go to your changes. The events that are called out in your life and lets see what you all did.

I need your birthdays to do this. I am a researcher. I also did not believe in Astrology myself. I studied it to find answers. I found many. Two divorces made me check it for relationship related stuff. I found out who has sex with who and when. That has been the most interesting thing to know yet. I have kind of been lost in the women for years. Now that I know who is mine. I am only alone by choice.

[Theophage]

bare with me.

W00t! We're all getting naked!

[astroman818]

I find it to be somewhat scrambled, the language. I would love to take a few of you through your life and show you what my research has found. It wouldn't let me give you a url to see what I look at. I will have some of you who are willing call me and we will read what it says.

[wahrheit]

bare with me.

Shouldn't we use a condom? I hardly know you.



As for the rest of your post, if you want I will PM my birthday to you along with a question or whatever you need to test your skills in astrology.


ETA: Damn you, Theophage! ;)

[astroman818]

Don't make too much fun of what I am saying. You may end up feeling like an Idiot when this is said and done. I understand where all of you are coming from. But I don't know how to split an atom but I do know that it happens. You all have at best a preschool knowledge of astrology. I know they bag on it here all over the place. It is fun to throw rocks at a stoning. I am going to take the $1,000,000.00, I just found out last night it goes away in less than two years if I don't claim it now. I thought I had more time. I don't so here we go.

[astroman818]

My Number is 818-787-8111. Mark Du Boise

I would love to meet and talk to any of you as long as you have an open mind. Give me a chance and I will change your life forever.

[Hokulele]

Astrology does not work on every one. Because we all make our choices differently. If you are the kind of person that feels it then does it I will cal every major change in your life. I think the most interesting thing is to just go to your changes. The events that are called out in your life and lets see what you all did.

I need your birthdays to do this. I am a researcher. I also did not believe in Astrology myself. I studied it to find answers. I found many. Two divorces made me check it for relationship related stuff. I found out who has sex with who and when. That has been the most interesting thing to know yet. I have kind of been lost in the women for years. Now that I know who is mine. I am only alone by choice.


Are you saying that if I provide only my birthdate, you can tell me what has happened to me in the past?

If so, an easy way to test this would be for me to send you 3 potential birthdays (one of which is true), and you can then work up a biography for each. I will then reveal which one is closest to the truth, and you can see how accurate you are. Does this sound fair?

[wahrheit]

My Number is 818-***-****. Mark *******

I would love to meet and talk to any of you as long as you have an open mind. Give me a chance and I will change your life forever.

Mark, all kidding aside, I do not think it is a good idea to post your full name and phone number on a public forum. All over the world people - and scammers and whatnot - can see this information.

You are of course free to post your personal information, I just don't think it's a good idea to do so on the internet in general. Has nothing to do with this forum in particular.

[ddt]

I need your birthdays to do this.
Many forum members here have their birthday in their public profile.

What do you need in addition to that? Or what can you derive from someone's birthday alone?

[MrQhuest]

wince.

Post your URL in a broken up format.
Like this
w w w . my web page . com

MrQhuest

[Pixel42]

If so, an easy way to test this would be for me to send you 3 potential birthdays (one of which is true), and you can then work up a biography for each. I will then reveal which one is closest to the truth, and you can see how accurate you are. Does this sound fair?
An alternative would be to do something similar to the online test I once did of a tarot card reader:

1. A few volunteers PM a trusted moderator with their birthdays.

2. The mod assigns each an identifier (subject1, subject2 etc) and then PMs the list of identifiers and birthdays to astroman, who will do readings for each and post them, together with the identifier.

3. Each volunteer picks out the reading they think is theirs, and PMs the mod with its identifier. The mod will post which subject picked which reading when he's received everyone's choice.

We can then see whether the volunteers picked out what is actually their own reading more often than would be expected by chance.

[Loss Leader]

My Number is 818-787-8111. Mark Du Boise

I would love to meet and talk to any of you as long as you have an open mind. Give me a chance and I will change your life forever.


Mark -

I don't see any reason to call you. My birthday is October 3, 1970. Please tell me whatever you can.

I am also a little worried that calling you may skew the results. I am sure that you are familiar with "cold reading." Psychics and astrologers use questions and vague statements to get people to unknowingly verify information about themselves. I would hate for you to be accused of such trickery. So, just post whatever you can about me using my birthday - 10/3/70.

[Nursefoxfire]

For anyone interested, a quick Google search revealed Mark's Myspace blog: http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.ListAll&friendID=7063590

And a Facebook page:
http://www.facebook.com/people/Mark_Du_Boise/536263366

I couldn't be paid enough to read through that horrid green-background text.

[Madalch]

I'll volunteer, either as moderator or test subject.

[Jackalgirl]

Mark --

I'm not a representative of JREF, but let me suggest a protocol to you:

You are given ten (10) birthdates of people who are unknown to you, listed 1 through 10, by a JREF representative. You generate your astrological results (for simplicity's sake, I will call them "readings"). Make sure that you do not reference the actual birthdate in the readings; simply label them 1-10.

You then give these to a different JREF representative (not the one who prepared the original list; rather, someone who will be unaware of which numbers match up to which birthdates and which people). This person distributes copies of all ten to each of the persons in the test pool.

Each person provides that representative a response: "Reading x is my reading" (where "x" is a number 1-10).

The representatives compare their results.

Is this possible, using your methodology? If so, how many out of ten would have to be correct? (In other words, what's your accuracy rate?)

[Third Eye Open]

.....
Astrology does not work on every one......

So in other words, whenever you guess wrong, that is one of the people that astrology doesn't work on. Or is it just the people who don't 'believe' that it doesn't work on?

[Jackalgirl]

I also want to add this:

Like everyone else has said, read the rules. This is really important, so I'll repeat it: read the rules.

Do you have media presence and academic support?

[Ixion]

My mother likes to dabble in astrology, and I constantly point out the errors of her "readings". I don't want to call you, due to the same reasons that LossLeader expressed about cold reading, but I will post my birthdate information if you want to attempt a reading. Post everything here about me you can get.

Birthdate: December, 15, 1976.
Time of Birth: 11:37 am
Location of Birth, Bayshore Memorial Hospital, Pasadena, Texas (approx. 29 degrees 40' N, 95 degrees 10' W) Zip 77501

[Hokulele]

For anyone interested, a quick Google search revealed Mark's Myspace blog:


From the blog:

The Seven day Sabbath or Saturday is a code for Saturn and is Sabbado in Spanish. Saturn brings us change and is here to make us think and bring us to Christ. The Seven days are the seven visible close bodies in the heavens. Sun moon mercury venus mars jupiter saturn = 7. I can see the moons of Jupiter. But I have the eyes of 1 in 10,000 people. The rest of you can only see 7 heavenly bodies.



Oh. My.

[Nursefoxfire]

From the blog:


The Seven day Sabbath or Saturday is a code for Saturn and is Sabbado in Spanish. Saturn brings us change and is here to make us think and bring us to Christ. The Seven days are the seven visible close bodies in the heavens. Sun moon mercury venus mars jupiter saturn = 7. I can see the moons of Jupiter. But I have the eyes of 1 in 10,000 people. The rest of you can only see 7 heavenly bodies.


Oh. My.

Yeah.

I copy/pasted his drivel into a Word document so I could actually READ it. I think Astrology is his venue to attempt to pick up women.

[wahrheit]

Oh. My.

Yeah.

I copy/pasted his drivel into a Word document so I could actually READ it. I think Astrology is his venue to attempt to pick up women.

My eyes still hurt from the green background, but I tend to agree with the two of you. In fact, case closed as far as I am concerned.

[steve s]

Don't make too much fun of what I am saying.

Astrology does not work on every one.

Giving yourself an "out" for when you fail. Smart.




...as long as you have an open mind.

Nope, sorry. You'll have to provide proof that you can really do what you claim.

Steve S.

[steve s]

I think Astrology is his venue to attempt to pick up women.


Yep. From his site...

By asking you to be my friend I'm really the last guy on here that is really hitting on you.

Methinks he really doth protest too much.

Steve S.

[William Smith]

...
I am here to collect the Million Dollar Prize. To prove that there is a God and we were created beings.
...

The JREF does not accept claims like yours for the Challenge because they are not falsifiable.

Also, you will need a media profile and a signed affidavit of an academic person to have your application accepted. Please read this. (http://www.randi.org/joom/content/view/40/32/)

[ddt]

I think Astrology is his venue to attempt to pick up women.
But of course only those with heavenly bodies. :)

[SezMe]

I also did not believe in Astrology myself. I studied it to find answers. I found many. Two divorces made me check it for relationship related stuff. I found out who has sex with who and when. That has been the most interesting thing to know yet. I have kind of been lost in the women for years. Now that I know who is mine. I am only alone by choice.
Let me try my hand at little cold reading. One, or both, your divorces involved your wife cheating with some other guy. You were hurt, but rather than look inside to learn something about yourself, you looked elsewhere to place the blame. You found the answer in astrology. But that "answer" hasn't helped you in the relationship department so you are alone and unhappy about that. To distract you, you taken the astrology stuff way too far and, without any feedback to control your thinking, you've bought into your own schtick full bore and now want to evangalize everyone else.

How am I doing so far, astroman818?

[OnlyTellsTruths]

I wonder how many paying customers this has netted him so far?

[astroman818]

I just have a moment here and I want to thank all of you for being so kind to say hello and give your response to this. I promise this will be interesting as we go. Interesting how you already found me online I have been hiding for years. Just doing my research. Yes I did study people on Myspace.

[alfaniner]

If you haven't come up with a testable protocol by the end of the second (50-post) page of this thread, previous experience tells me you never will.

[Gate2501]

Interesting how you already found me online I have been hiding for years. Just doing my research. Yes I did study people on Myspace.

First rule of hiding online, always use your real name on social networking sites!

The stars are telling me that the JREF forums will leave you in an eviscerated heap. ;)

[Loss Leader]

Saturday is a code for Saturn


It's not really much of a code, is it? I mean, "Saturday" is just a corruption of the phrase "Saturn's Day."

Monday is Moon Day
Sunday is ... um ... Sun Day

The only one that's the least bit difficult to figure out is Tuesday and that's because people are generally unfamiliar with the fact that there was a Norse god named Tyr.

My birthday is 10/3/70, Mark. I'm waiting for you to tell me whatever you can.

[jimtron]

astroman818: welcome to the forum. I'm glad that you want to take the challenge. You may find many of us here skeptical, because many folks have made claims on the forum that weren't backed up with evidence, or the claims were too vague, etc. I would love it if your claims were legit. I would strongly suggest carefully reading the Challenge rules, as well as the forum here.

Good luck!

[Piggy]

I just have a moment here and I want to thank all of you for being so kind to say hello and give your response to this. I promise this will be interesting as we go. Interesting how you already found me online I have been hiding for years. Just doing my research. Yes I did study people on Myspace.

I respectfully suggest that we not get "interesting as we go".

Several posters have pointed out what needs to be done.

First, you must read the challenge rules. Secondly, you must develop a test. People here have offered suggestions.

If you're serious about the challenge, an interesting discussion is just a waste of time. If you want interesting discussion, I'd recommend you post in the paranormal forum.

Please, let's get down to brass tacks and start developing the outlines of a test.

If you're not going to do that now -- not later -- and if you're not going to read the challenge rules, you'll find that people here will become a lot less helpful and friendly because, well, you're just wasting our time.

[Ladewig]

If you haven't come up with a testable protocol by the end of the second (50-post) page of this thread, previous experience tells me you never will.

I wish I had evidence against your assertion, but I don't.

Astroman818, I also am looking forward to a description of what you can do.

[Gord_in_Toronto]

I wonder how many paying customers this has netted him so far?

From this Forum? ZERO.

He is good for a great chuckle however.

:boggled:

[astroman818]

First of all I have spent 4 years thinking about how to face a test with astrology. I haven't read the rules in a while but I must set a test and the test needs to have a percent of accuracy. Astrology is not saying that every Pisces will buy a car on Saturday. That is what all of you are here to say is ridiculous. I could not agree more. Oct 3 rd is my opposite birthday, mine is March 31 st. So we have the same astrology. 10 degrees Aries is the same as 10 degrees Libra. I have so much to explain. This is going to take time it took me 15 years to learn this. It is going to take a few days to explain it.

[Hokulele]

Do it first. Explain it after.

There have been several suggestions for tests in this thread. Do any of these sound reasonable to you?

[Czarcasm]

First of all I have spent 4 years thinking about how to face a test with astrology. I haven't read the rules in a while but I must set a test and the test needs to have a percent of accuracy. Astrology is not saying that every Pisces will buy a car on Saturday. That is what all of you are here to say is ridiculous. I could not agree more. Oct 3 rd is my opposite birthday, mine is March 31 st. So we have the same astrology. 10 degrees Aries is the same as 10 degrees Libra. I have so much to explain. This is going to take time it took me 15 years to learn this. It is going to take a few days to explain it.First.
Read.
The.
Rules.

[Jackalgirl]

First of all I have spent 4 years thinking about how to face a test with astrology. I haven't read the rules in a while but I must set a test and the test needs to have a percent of accuracy. Astrology is not saying that every Pisces will buy a car on Saturday. That is what all of you are here to say is ridiculous. I could not agree more. Oct 3 rd is my opposite birthday, mine is March 31 st. So we have the same astrology. 10 degrees Aries is the same as 10 degrees Libra. I have so much to explain. This is going to take time it took me 15 years to learn this. It is going to take a few days to explain it.

What Hok said. You don't have to explain anything -- you just have to do it. Explanations can come later, after you've shown that you can do what you claim to do.

If you do 10 "readings" (for lack of a better word) on people that do not mention their birthdates, what percentage of people do you think will be able to successfully recognize their reading as theirs? What if those people were all born in the same year -- would you be as successful?

It would be an easy test to set up and execute. Can you do it?

Edited to add: by "do not mention their birthdates", I mean that the "readings" don't mention the birthdates on which they're based. You, of course, will receive the complete birthdates from which to work.

[jimtron]

This is going to take time it took me 15 years to learn this. It is going to take a few days to explain it. Keep in mind, you don't necessarily have to fully explain this, if it's going to be difficult and time consuming to do so. All you need to do is concisely describe a testable claim. IOW, how can you demonstrate your paranormal ability? This particular forum is about the challenge. There are other forums here at JREF where you could get into more involved discussions of astrology.

Also: there's a good reason that people keep encouraging you to read the rules. It's very, very common for people to suggest challenges that don't abide by the rules, which is pointless.

[astroman818]

I have never sold astrology to any person. I own a construction company. The first dollar I will make will be winning this. The sum is really 2.6 million. I could have got 3 Phd's with the time I put into this so please be nice. Also to save your own face be open to other thought. I can't believe all of you are so used to bagging on everyone here. Never judge something till you have given it a chance. This is why I am the top astrologer on the planet and your not. All I can do here is call out the changes or cycles. Astrology works better as an interaction. I need to ask questions. What takes 30 minutes on the phone is going to take 5 days on here.

[Piggy]

First of all I have spent 4 years thinking about how to face a test with astrology. I haven't read the rules in a while but I must set a test and the test needs to have a percent of accuracy. Astrology is not saying that every Pisces will buy a car on Saturday. That is what all of you are here to say is ridiculous. I could not agree more. Oct 3 rd is my opposite birthday, mine is March 31 st. So we have the same astrology. 10 degrees Aries is the same as 10 degrees Libra. I have so much to explain. This is going to take time it took me 15 years to learn this. It is going to take a few days to explain it.

See what I mean?

So far, your posts have not shown any indication of a willingness to set up a test. And a test is the only way to win the challenge.

If you're not ready to discuss a test, then your post is premature (no matter how long you've been studying astrology) and you need to move to other forums if you want to "explain" your idea about astrology and come back when you're ready to get down to business.

You have said what you don't want to do, but not what you want to do.

If you continue to post general comments on astrology, your welcome will wear itself out very rapidly.

[Piggy]

ll I can do here is call out the changes or cycles. Astrology works better as an interaction. I need to ask questions. What takes 30 minutes on the phone is going to take 5 days on here.

That is not testable. You've wasted our time, and yours.

ETA: The test is not performed on this forum. Nothing you post on this forum will win you the prize.

[Hokulele]

Astrology works better as an interaction. I need to ask questions. What takes 30 minutes on the phone is going to take 5 days on here.


Why should it have to take so long? You can start a thread in GSP and interact with one or more people as quickly as you can type. Why does the interaction have to take place over the phone?

If it makes things easier, have a volunteer contact the admins to set up a moderated thread at a particular time when you, the volunteer, and a mod have a half hour available. You can then ask questions, the volunteer can respond, and the mod can ensure that any irrelevant chatter from non-participants won't distract the discussion.

[jimtron]

This is why I am the top astrologer on the planet and your not.

You have evidence to back that up, right? Please put us skeptics in our place. Show us how wrong and closed-minded we are. Make a testable claim. Apply for the challenge.

[John Bentley]

Jimtron,

Thank you for being nice. You are one in a million on this forum.

Astroman,

Some of the people on this forum (and the number has grown a lot even since I joined just a few years ago) either get their kicks or seem to think they'll get ATTABOYS from their fellow mean people by being rude and obnoxious.

Having said that, you are going to have to focus very hard on being specific. So far, your posts tend to ramble a bit. Try answering one simple question without trying to explain any of the theory. Here's one question: Do you need to know any more than a birthday to give someone a reading?

[astroman818]

I understand that this is not where I will win the prize and I just went through the rules again. I really don't have the time to get into this till later tonight 10 pm pst I live in California, but believe me you are going to all learn something if you stay with me.

[astroman818]

I need time to read all the posts. I know this is going to be more like a witch hunt. This is why I have worked on this for 4 years to get that good at it. To take on the people here. It takes a certain type to be here in the first place and you know your a hard group.

[Piggy]

I understand that this is not where I will win the prize and I just went through the rules again. I really don't have the time to get into this till later tonight 10 pm pst I live in California, but believe me you are going to all learn something if you stay with me.

What I am trying to let you know is that this is not the place to teach us something.

If that's what you want to do, then please, start a discussion on the paranormal forum.

And it's fine if you want to do that on another thread, and still discuss the challenge here.

You've had a lot of good feedback and some great suggestions from forum members, but unfortunately, so far you seem to have ignored all that and shown a general unwillingness to discuss testing.

When you return tomorrow, you'll find that lots of folks here are more than willing to help you develop a test which has the potential to win you the prize.

But you have to meet us halfway.

I'm not trying to be dismissive or contrary here. But I do want to be direct and honest.

Please focus on describing specifically what it is you can do.

Once you do that, we're rolling.

If you do not do that, then nothing's happening.

[Piggy]

I need time to read all the posts. I know this is going to be more like a witch hunt. This is why I have worked on this for 4 years to get that good at it. To take on the people here. It takes a certain type to be here in the first place and you know your a hard group.

It's not going to be a witch hunt. That's not how the challenge works.

As a starting point, may I suggest, when you return tomorrow, you focus on answering this question:

What is it, exactly, that you've gotten good at?

What is it, exactly, that you do?

If you answer that, then as I've said, you'll find very helpful people here who can guide you in turning that into a test. (There will be hecklers, but just ignore them.)

However, if you can't answer that, then there's nothing for anyone to help you do.

Sleep well, and we'll see you tomorrow.

[jimtron]

astroman818: You also have the option of telling us to take a flying ****, take the challenge, win it, and come back and gloat. You're free to do whatever you want. But if you choose to stay with this thread, be prepared for a skeptical attitude (this is a skeptic's Web site after all) and tough questions. Read through this forum and see how many people have supposedly had paranormal powers. See how many thought they could win the challenge. See how again and again and again, people make vague and/or untestable claims. Or it turns out they didn't really have the ability they thought they had. Or they knew they didn't have the ability, but they were toying with us. It's happened so many times, that we really are skeptical of any paranormal claims. I'm guessing that's why Randi started this. He likely heard so many claims, and so little evidence, that he thought he'd offer a lot of money for people to put up or shut up (and of course most of us here do not speak for Randi or JREF).

But again, I'd love to see someone really demonstrate paranormal ability under test conditions--that would be super exciting.

The more times you post on this thread without a concise, testable claim, the more of a hard time you're likely to get.

[astroman818]

I take a birthday like Oct. 3 rd and I progress it. By adding a day to their birthday for every year they have been alive. So 1970 means they are 38 years old this year. Then I add 38 days to the birthday this takes me to Nov. 10 1970. Then I read what it says about this year of that persons life. The moon is what changes the fastest, about every two days. I have every sign as commitment or non committal. Aries Libra Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are commitment signs. The others non committal. Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are the Marriage moons.

I met a woman in the parking lot today. She had many tattoos. I know that only someone with Cancer or Capricorn in their birthday would do this. So I asked her birthday. She told me her Moon was in cancer. So I took it from there. I did the fast math and said at 27 years old she is back to Cancer moon. She was 30 years old. The moon is a 27 day cycle.

So lets look at what happened her commitment cycle is as follows at 21 she goes into Aries moon at 23 and a half she goes into Taurus moon at 24 she got married I told her that she Married at 24. i also told her that she cheated on him and the relationship ended at 26 when she went into Gemini moon. She told me she cheated with a Gemini man and that is in fact when it ended. I did all of this without a book just simple Math.

As for Oct 3 1970 The big commitment times were Cancer moon at 17 to 18 years old, 25 to 28 for Libra and Scorpio moon, 31 to 33 for Capricorn moon, they are just entering Aries moon this year. Life is still a choice and some people marry when it is not the tiem for this but most of us do it when we feel the need to be with some one.

The Cardinal moon times are the beginning of the cycle and the end is the mutable moon.
If you want a fast answer to all of this you need to leave now, this is going to take some time. I have 500 times this much to share.

[Susan Gerbic]

I have never sold astrology to any person. I own a construction company. The first dollar I will make will be winning this. The sum is really 2.6 million. I could have got 3 Phd's with the time I put into this so please be nice. Also to save your own face be open to other thought. I can't believe all of you are so used to bagging on everyone here. Never judge something till you have given it a chance. This is why I am the top astrologer on the planet and your not. All I can do here is call out the changes or cycles. Astrology works better as an interaction. I need to ask questions. What takes 30 minutes on the phone is going to take 5 days on here.

Wow! Please be nice?

He is telling us what he can do, "Call out cycles and changes". What that means I have no idea.

Slow down and think.

Imagine someone telling you that they can fly with out any aid. Just run and start flapping their arms and then soar around the sky. That is a claim. It is testable because anyone watching can see this happen. The finer details can be worked out later.

You need to be just this clear. What exactly can you do and how can it be tested? Do you have to have a birthdate? If the only way to do this is by phone, then how do you know you aren't getting the results by using feedback from the person (i.e. cold-reading)? If you are trying to explain how this happens, STOP. As everyone has made very clear, this is not the area for that.

Just be clear and state what is it that you can do. And how can it be tested.

Susan

[Skeptic Guy]

I take a birthday like Oct. 3 rd and I progress it. By adding a day to their birthday for every year they have been alive. So 1970 means they are 38 years old this year. Then I add 38 days to the birthday this takes me to Nov. 10 1970. Then I read what it says about this year of that persons life. The moon is what changes the fastest, about every two days. I have every sign as commitment or non committal. Aries Libra Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are commitment signs. The others non committal. Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are the Marriage moons.

I met a woman in the parking lot today. She had many tattoos. I know that only someone with Cancer or Capricorn in their birthday would do this. So I asked her birthday. She told me her Moon was in cancer. So I took it from there. I did the fast math and said at 27 years old she is back to Cancer moon. She was 30 years old. The moon is a 27 day cycle.

So lets look at what happened her commitment cycle is as follows at 21 she goes into Aries moon at 23 and a half she goes into Taurus moon at 24 she got married I told her that she Married at 24. i also told her that she cheated on him and the relationship ended at 26 when she went into Gemini moon. She told me she cheated with a Gemini man and that is in fact when it ended. I did all of this without a book just simple Math.

As for Oct 3 1970 The big commitment times were Cancer moon at 17 to 18 years old, 25 to 28 for Libra and Scorpio moon, 31 to 33 for Capricorn moon, they are just entering Aries moon this year. Life is still a choice and some people marry when it is not the tiem for this but most of us do it when we feel the need to be with some one.

The Cardinal moon times are the beginning of the cycle and the end is the mutable moon.
If you want a fast answer to all of this you need to leave now, this is going to take some time. I have 500 times this much to share.

This is a nice anecdote that may or may not have happened, but it's not what has been requested. You don't need to tell us how it all works, just demonstrate that it does and then we can get into the details.

[astroman818]

I know here is where the fixed people hang out. Your the ones that give little old ladies parking tickets and love what you do, the hall monitors of life. I am more the drunk with 5 strippers at a dance club.
We are all so different. This is what astrology shows.

If I take the factorial of 360 for each the sun moon rising venus mercury and mars. Just the sun moon and rising give us 46,656,000 possible combinations. Yes I went to College.

We are all such different people is my point. What would you do when faced with the same change as the next guy? When my father got to Cancer moon at 28 he married my mother they are still together after 55 years. My older brother got to Cancer moon at 38 he got married and they are still together for 16 years. I go into Cancer moon this November.

[Piggy]

I take a birthday like Oct. 3 rd and I progress it. By adding a day to their birthday for every year they have been alive. So 1970 means they are 38 years old this year. Then I add 38 days to the birthday this takes me to Nov. 10 1970. Then I read what it says about this year of that persons life. The moon is what changes the fastest, about every two days. I have every sign as commitment or non committal. Aries Libra Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are commitment signs. The others non committal. Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are the Marriage moons.

I met a woman in the parking lot today. She had many tattoos. I know that only someone with Cancer or Capricorn in their birthday would do this. So I asked her birthday. She told me her Moon was in cancer. So I took it from there. I did the fast math and said at 27 years old she is back to Cancer moon. She was 30 years old. The moon is a 27 day cycle.

So lets look at what happened her commitment cycle is as follows at 21 she goes into Aries moon at 23 and a half she goes into Taurus moon at 24 she got married I told her that she Married at 24. i also told her that she cheated on him and the relationship ended at 26 when she went into Gemini moon. She told me she cheated with a Gemini man and that is in fact when it ended. I did all of this without a book just simple Math.

Ok, now we're getting somewhere.

So you're saying that if a complete stranger gives you a birth date, you can make concrete statements about that person's life which will be true and which will be something that could not reasonably be simply guessed or deduced -- such as whether they are married, the year they got married, whether they are divorced, the year they got divorced, and the reason for the divorce.

That's excellent!

It's not rigorous yet, but hey, we're rolling!

If you want a fast answer to all of this you need to leave now, this is going to take some time. I have 500 times this much to share.

Actually, you can relax, because you don't have to share any of your past successes.

Those are irrelevant to the challenge.

That should be a burden off your shoulders and will save everyone a lot of time.

What you have to do now is to work with JREF to set up a test in which you will demonstrate your ability.

Thanks for stepping up to the plate!

[Jackalgirl]

I take a birthday like Oct. 3 rd and I progress it. By adding a day to their birthday for every year they have been alive. So 1970 means they are 38 years old this year. Then I add 38 days to the birthday this takes me to Nov. 10 1970. Then I read what it says about this year of that persons life. The moon is what changes the fastest, about every two days. I have every sign as commitment or non committal. Aries Libra Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are commitment signs. The others non committal. Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are the Marriage moons.

I met a woman in the parking lot today. She had many tattoos. ...

Astroman:

If you are given the birthdays of 10 people, can you do a reading using the birthdays alone?

If you have to ask questions, what do you need to ask? Is there a standard set of questions?

If those 10 readings are given to each of the 10 persons (each person gets a copy of all 10 readings), how many people do you think will be able to successfully pick their own reading?

[jimtron]

She had many tattoos. I know that only someone with Cancer or Capricorn in their birthday would do this.

If you're serious about this, please explain. I'd be willing to bet a lot of money that the above statement is demonstrably false.

[logical muse]

Astroman:

If you are given the birthdays of 10 people, can you do a reading using the birthdays alone?

If you have to ask questions, what do you need to ask? Is there a standard set of questions?

If those 10 readings are given to each of the 10 persons (each person gets a copy of all 10 readings), how many people do you think will be able to successfully pick their own reading?

I've wondered about this type of test. I think there might be a problem with it. Popular culture informs us that there are certain personality traits that apply specifically to certain zodiac signs. For example, Taureans are supposed to be solid, reliable, grounded etc.

All an astrologer has to do is write up a reading with these cliched traits for the zodiac sign of that birth date, and the person to whom it applies might be able to pick up from those traits that it is theirs.

Not from actually having those personality traits, just from knowing they are supposed to. For example, here's what wikipedia has listed as the personality traits for Taurus:

* disciplined / methodical [7][8]
* conservative [9][8]
* traditional [7]
* hard-working
* good sense of humor
* great work ethic
* artistic / creative [9]
* musical
* loving / affectionate [8]
* romantic [9]
* sensual [9][7]
* sexual
* strong
* steadfast [8]
* stubborn / opinionated [9][7][8]
* controlling
* slow to anger, but can become furiously mad [7][8][10]
* getting stuck in ruts
* resentful [8]
* prudent / cautious / careful [9]
* reliable / dependable / trustworthy [8][10]
* calm
* tenacious [7]
* stable / steady
* patient [10]
* loyal / faithful [9][8][7]
* resourceful
* easygoing
* honest
* determined [9][7]
* practical [9][8][7]
* possessive
* overindulgent [9]
* jealous [8]
* self-conscious


And for Libra:
* Diplomatic / compromising [7][4] however possibly manipulative [8]
* Cooperative [7][4][8]
* Fair / balanced / impartial [7][4][8]
* Idealistic (in relationships) [7][4][8]
* Charming [7][4][8]
* Easy-going / sociable [7][4][8]
* Indecisive / changeable [7][4][8]
* Peace loving [7][4]
* Gullible / influenceable [7][4]
* Elegant / graceful [7][4][8]
* Refined / artistic / good taste [7][4][8]
* Pleasure oriented [7][4][8]
* Gentle [7][4]
* Sensitive to others [7][4]
* Kind [7][4]
* Cheerful [7][4]
* Romantic [7][4]
* Flirty / frivolous [7][4] however loyal in marriage [4]


All this astrologer has to do is look at the birthdate, determine which sign applies, and include these traits in the reading. Hand out the readings to the subjects, and if those subjects are knowledgeable about the zodiac, they might easily pick theirs out.

[arthwollipot]

I volunteer to offer my birthdate to Astroman for a reading. I am always amused to see what astrologers have to say about me.

[Susan Gerbic]

I know here is where the fixed people hang out. Your the ones that give little old ladies parking tickets and love what you do, the hall monitors of life. I am more the drunk with 5 strippers at a dance club.
We are all so different. This is what astrology shows.

So we are supposed to be nice, but you can be rude?

Susan

[Jackalgirl]

I've wondered about this type of test. I think there might be a problem with it. Popular culture informs us that there are certain personality traits that apply specifically to certain zodiac signs. For example, Taureans are supposed to be solid, reliable, grounded etc.

I see your point, but I can think of a couple of ways around this. Granted, this would rely on people's truthfulness, but you could pre-screen candidates based on their knowledge. Or get people from cultures that don't use the Western style of astrology.

Plus, I think that so many of these "qualities" are so vague that many people would find (or think) that they apply to them regardless. And they overlap. Take your examples, for example. If I were to describe someone as "pleasure oriented", someone who is "sensual" might take that as a hit. So I still think that this is doable.

[logical muse]

I see your point, but I can think of a couple of ways around this. Granted, this would rely on people's truthfulness, but you could pre-screen candidates based on their knowledge. Or get people from cultures that don't use the Western style of astrology.

This adds a lot of complexity to the test, and truthfulness is hard to assess and control.

Plus, I think that so many of these "qualities" are so vague that many people would find (or think) that they apply to them regardless. And they overlap. Take your examples, for example. If I were to describe someone as "pleasure oriented", someone who is "sensual" might take that as a hit. So I still think that this is doable.

The astrologer only needs to include a couple of traits that are specific to, or at least most commonly associated with, each sign. For example "slow to anger, but can become furiously mad" and "stubborn / opinionated", and voila, taurus and OMG That's so me! :eek:

[Piggy]

The astrologer only needs to include a couple of traits that are specific to, or at least most commonly associated with, each sign. For example "slow to anger, but can become furiously mad" and "stubborn / opinionated", and voila, taurus and OMG That's so me! :eek:

That's why I recommend the kind of test suggested by the OP's most recent post -- making specific, concrete statements about the facts of the person's life, along with dates when the events occurred, and specific statements regarding the material causes of those events.

Since the OP says he has done this before, it sounds like we may have a testable claim there.

Personality traits are probably not testable.

[Rasmus]

Here's a simple challenge idea; easy to test.

Astroman,
If I tell you my birthday, will you be able to tell when I last had sex or whom I had sex with? How about when will I have sex, or whom with?

I can provide you with the date of my birth, but not the time. I was born in Germany, if that is important.

Please also give a brief, clear explanation of what would count as "sex", just to be on the safe side. (e.g. the last interaction i had with someone was when I lend my phone to a girl yesterday who wanted to arrange a lift to be taken home. - so, if your answer should be "yesterday evening" i don't think that such an incidence ought to count as "sex", even tough i might be guilty of mild flirting.)

[Ron_Tomkins]

Someone send me a PM when and if this actually develops into something more or less like a paranormal test.

Unlike Maatorc.... and Mayday...... and Ferj....... and Tim4848.... and Tapman..... and Raptor Witness..... and.... well, you get the picture.

[astroman818]

I could do different reading on all of them. It is more interesting if I am looking for a certain thing. Like a brother died when I was young. Or your first bisexual encounter. I have been studying this everywhere and in every walk in life. After the challenge is done I want to do a radio show. I know they changed it to needing a media presence and an Academic sponsor. I found this out last night. Not a problem.

[astroman818]

Susan I am sorry if I came off rude I am just real. Being drunk with 5 strippers is not a very great thing. I think what I am saying is that we all have things to work on and this is life's challenge. We are all so different. Just your sun and moon say something about you. June 27 1967 I saw your birthday. Your parents were wrong for each other, The angle of your sun and moon is 150 degrees. Usually 8 to 9 times out of ten when I see this the parents were never married, divorced at 3 years old, or one or more parent died young. What it is saying is that the parents were wrong for each other. You carry this imbalance in you.

I wish I had one of you one on one.

I want a birthday to work on of some one that is up. I am alone now and my daughter is in bed.


I thought this would be fun writing in a forum but it really is a job. How do you people have 3000 to 10000 post here, in a year.

[Kimpatsu]

My birthday is 10/3/70, Mark.
Is that October 3, or 10 March?

[arthwollipot]

I want a birthday to work on of some one that is up. I am alone now and my daughter is in bed.I am up for it. My birthday is 12th December 1969. What can you tell me about myself?

[astroman818]

I know it drove me nuts when people would give their birthdays from other countries and I never knew what they were talking about it was Oct 3 rd 1970. a birthday that was given me early on.

Like my birthday is 31/03/1961. We don't do that here in the United States. It is Month day year here.

[SezMe]

Some of the people on this forum (and the number has grown a lot even since I joined just a few years ago) either get their kicks or seem to think they'll get ATTABOYS from their fellow mean people by being rude and obnoxious.
In the context of this thread, that is a load of hooey. Every post I've read directed toward the astrologer has been polite and to the point. Well, except for my tongue in cheek one. Piggy, for one, has gone above and beyond the call of duty to try to get astroman to get down to business. Being direct and purposeful is far, far different than being rude and obnoxious.

In fact, astroman has shown those characteristics. He has not responded the the many proposed protocols. He has not directly responded to questions posted to him. He has rambled through his many posts, some of which contain a fair amount of arrogance. He has not focused on the MDC at all.

Don't paint your labels on the wrong targets.

[astroman818]

Sagittarius and Gemini these are very hard to read. By your own nature you question everything. Have a very hard time making choices. But I will try.

[arthwollipot]

I know it drove me nuts when people would give their birthdays from other countries and I never knew what they were talking about it was Oct 3 rd 1970. a birthday that was given me early on.

Like my birthday is 31/03/1961. We don't do that here in the United States. It is Month day year here.And that's why I spelt mine out in full. Is it enough for you to work with?

[arthwollipot]

...By your own nature you question everything...:D As if that's a great revelation on a skeptic's forum.

But I'm too fast. Take your time.

BTW, that's the secret to getting lots of posts. Type fast. :p

[astroman818]

I am now here with my full attention to all of you I just don't type as fast as some of you. I have had a few minutes earlier to respond to what they are asking. I have a very busy life. Summer with the kids and all. I feel it is time to begin to open this subject up. Are we really looking for truth? I went to astrology for the reason for my divorce. I found much more.

I will be here. Rome wasn't built in one day and I will get to as many questions as I can.

[astroman818]

12 dec 1969

[arthwollipot]

12 dec 1969Yep. BTW, I will be leaving for home in about an hour. I'm all yours until then.

[astroman818]

Your a Sag with a moon in Aquarius. My Brother who lives next door is the same. Dec 11 1953. At 25 and a half you go into Capricorn moon. This is the beginning of your marriage time. It lasted two years, till 4 months before your 28 th birthday.

[astroman818]

Did you marry then or at least fall in love with some one for the first time.

I would love to try to do when everyone married, What age. I have done 17 in a row before
perfect.

[astroman818]

My brother has your same astrology and he didn't marry till 38. You just went into Cancer moon last November. It is time to marry now.

[Jackalgirl]

Astroman818 --

If you were to receive 10 birthdays, could you do 10 readings? If all 10 readings were given to each person whose birthday is included in that list and each person was asked to select the reading that applied to him or her, how many people do you think would be able to select their own reading?

[astroman818]

What looks like a death in your family at age 12. Written as a tragedy in your life then.

[arthwollipot]

Your a Sag with a moon in Aquarius. My Brother who lives next door is the same. Dec 11 1953. At 25 and a half you go into Capricorn moon. This is the beginning of your marriage time. It lasted two years, till 4 months before your 28 th birthday.Did you marry then or at least fall in love with some one for the first time.No. I was already in a long-term relationship at that age. Not a marriage. I am not married and have no intention of ever getting married. But your criterion of "falling in love" which I would redefine as "starting a long-term relationship which is still extant" has still failed, since I was in this relationship when I was 21.

I would love to try to do when everyone married, What age. I have done 17 in a row before
perfect.Well I'm afraid I just broke your winning streak. Sorry.

My brother has your same astrology and he didn't marry till 38. You just went into Cancer moon last November. It is time to marry now.Thanks for the advice, but as I said, I am already in a long-term relationship - we have children - which is not a marriage.

What looks like a death in your family at age 12. Written as a tragedy in your life then.Age 12 would be 1982. My uncle committed suicide in 1983. That's quite close.

[astroman818]

Astrology is very specific. You people are used to traits colors and the flower of the sign. That is not what is really going on in astrology it is a time line with a beginning and an ending. With markers along the way.

Like every six months venus hits our sun opposite or conjunct. My next one is Sept. 7 th 2008. I could list the womens names for every six months for the last 3 years that I started a relationship with when it came around. I know I helped it along but it was already happening before I saw it in my own life.

[Hokulele]

I take a birthday like Oct. 3 rd and I progress it. By adding a day to their birthday for every year they have been alive. So 1970 means they are 38 years old this year. Then I add 38 days to the birthday this takes me to Nov. 10 1970. Then I read what it says about this year of that persons life. The moon is what changes the fastest, about every two days. I have every sign as commitment or non committal. Aries Libra Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are commitment signs. The others non committal. Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are the Marriage moons.

I met a woman in the parking lot today. She had many tattoos. I know that only someone with Cancer or Capricorn in their birthday would do this. So I asked her birthday. She told me her Moon was in cancer. So I took it from there. I did the fast math and said at 27 years old she is back to Cancer moon. She was 30 years old. The moon is a 27 day cycle.

So lets look at what happened her commitment cycle is as follows at 21 she goes into Aries moon at 23 and a half she goes into Taurus moon at 24 she got married I told her that she Married at 24. i also told her that she cheated on him and the relationship ended at 26 when she went into Gemini moon. She told me she cheated with a Gemini man and that is in fact when it ended. I did all of this without a book just simple Math.

As for Oct 3 1970 The big commitment times were Cancer moon at 17 to 18 years old, 25 to 28 for Libra and Scorpio moon, 31 to 33 for Capricorn moon, they are just entering Aries moon this year. Life is still a choice and some people marry when it is not the tiem for this but most of us do it when we feel the need to be with some one.

The Cardinal moon times are the beginning of the cycle and the end is the mutable moon.
If you want a fast answer to all of this you need to leave now, this is going to take some time. I have 500 times this much to share.


Judging by the date listed here, I assume this is the reading for Loss Leader. I will let him comment on the accuracy.

Did you marry then or at least fall in love with some one for the first time.

I would love to try to do when everyone married, What age. I have done 17 in a row before
perfect.


If we give you a list of 20 birthdates, would you predict the age of marriage for all 20 (no names, just birthdates)?

How many do you expect to get right?

[arthwollipot]

I have to log off and go home now. I'll try to check in again later on tonight.

[astroman818]

This is the problem with doing marriage predictions on a saggitarius with a moon in leo or aquarius. Commitment is a very different thing for you people. At 21 you were in scorpio moon on June 12 th 1990. That is when the change took place.
Go back to my old post and look at The marriage moons.

[astroman818]

I take a birthday like Oct. 3 rd and I progress it. By adding a day to their birthday for every year they have been alive. So 1970 means they are 38 years old this year. Then I add 38 days to the birthday this takes me to Nov. 10 1970. Then I read what it says about this year of that persons life. The moon is what changes the fastest, about every two days. I have every sign as commitment or non committal. Aries Libra Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are commitment signs. The others non committal. Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are the Marriage moons.

[arthwollipot]

This is the problem with doing marriage predictions on a saggitarius with a moon in leo or aquarius. Commitment is a very different thing for you people. At 21 you were in scorpio moon on June 12 th 1990. That is when the change took place.
Go back to my old post and look at The marriage moons.Oddly enough, this is exactly the same thing that ferj said when he got it wrong too. "Oh, sags are hard to do astrology on."

But you were close on the death in the family. Let's give you that.

[jimtron]

I take a birthday like Oct. 3 rd and I progress it. By adding a day to their birthday for every year they have been alive. So 1970 means they are 38 years old this year. Then I add 38 days to the birthday this takes me to Nov. 10 1970. Then I read what it says about this year of that persons life. The moon is what changes the fastest, about every two days. I have every sign as commitment or non committal. Aries Libra Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are commitment signs. The others non committal. Scorpio Taurus Capricorn and Cancer are the Marriage moons.

May I ask what source you use? (Regarding "read what it says" in your quote above.)

[astroman818]

go to the time when you were in scorpio moon I skipped over it because I didn't think you marry then. You did start a relationship.

For the record I will put the moons of commitment in a order.
1. Cancer (being by far this)
2. Capricorn
3. Taurus
4. Scorpio
5. Aries
6. Libra

[astroman818]

May I ask what source you use?

[Gmonster2]

Originally Posted by astroman818
I would love to try to do when everyone married, What age. I have done 17 in a row before
perfect.

Sure i'm in! birthdate is 23/feb/1962 what age did i get married?

[astroman818]

For what?

[astroman818]

I said this in an earlier post. Go Back

[astroman818]

ok feb 23 1962

Lets define your moons. Cancer moon starts 3 months before your 19 th birthday. It last till you are 21. I think you would have married then. I was born with the same moon as you and her name was Linda. We broke up when I was 21, ended the engagement. I did marry the other woman I met in this time, a few years later. Astrology points to times when things happen, we dictate how far they go.

[astroman818]

feb 23 1962 the next one was Libra moon at age 27 it also last 27 months.

[Coveredinbeeees]

If we give you a list of 20 birthdates, would you predict the age of marriage for all 20 (no names, just birthdates)?

How many do you expect to get right?

This is a really good question astroman. You would do well to answer it as it could easily form the basis of a test protocol.

[astroman818]

People get married for many reasons. Not just love. There is still free will here. I am just pointing to times when the person would want that more than the alternative.

[Pixel42]

astroman: giving individuals here readings and asking them if they're accurate is not going to produce the kind of results that would be considered meaningful if you go for the JREF challenge, as you've already acknowledged. [Do you know what subjective validation is? If not, read up on it now: http://www.skepdic.com/subjectivevalidation.html ]

If you want to develop and do a run-through of the kind of test protocol you will be doing for JREF you should start to work on that straight away. Otherwise you are going to run out of volunteers who are prepared to give you their birthdates and participate in such a run-through before you get to that point.

Can I suggest that contributors indicate whether they would be willing to participate in a test but not give their birthdates at this point. The list of volunteers starts here:

Pixel42

[astroman818]

Yes I would do a list of people that were actually married. 5, 10, 20 I am game. I have come this far. I am on the home stretch.

[astroman818]

Marriage times are just the beginning of what can be done with astrology. I think I started this to begin to work with people here. They keep telling me that I am in the wrong place but here we are so lets keep going.

[astroman818]

I will be back tomorrow night and we can go as fast as I can type. I think I need some of you to understand what is really going on with astrology so you can help me decide what to
direction to take it in. My knowledge is so vast on the subject. I can't see the forest for the trees at this point.

[Gmonster2]

thanks for replying i note that all psychics like to hedge there bets so its 19-21 or if not 27-29 + 3months as most people marry in the 20-30's gives u a good shot at it by chance.. Although this is not jref defined protocol i see nothing wrong with some of the other posters trying the same thing. So far we have had 2 attempts

Astroman has said he got 17 in a row which is impressive.

I promise to be truthful in answer to your stated guess but for now i will wait till more poeple have submitted their birthdates and then we can look at the outcome after we have a larger data pool...;)

[Hokulele]

Yes I would do a list of people that were actually married. 5, 10, 20 I am game. I have come this far. I am on the home stretch.


If we give you a list of 20 birthdates of people who are married, how many marriage ages do you think you will get right? What would you consider a success?


@ Pixel42 - A list of volunteers will be necessary, but I think it would be best if we do not publish the list in public at this point. There may be a way to do a warm, if not hot, reading. I would recommend having a trusted person (or a moderator) volunteer to hold the list of volunteers and compile a list of birthdates with anonymous IDs. This could then be passed to astroman818 publically, and he can do his work, post it publically, then the list of IDs/user names can be published to determine his accuracy.

If anyone can come up with a more secure protocol, let me know.

[Pixel42]

I think I need some of you to understand what is really going on with astrology so you can help me decide what to
direction to take it in.
If you want to do have such a discussion, please start a thread in the paranormal forum for it. Don't use this thread.

@ Pixel42 - A list of volunteers will be necessary, but I think it would be best if we do not publish the list in public at this point. There may be a way to do a warm, if not hot, reading. I would recommend having a trusted person (or a moderator) volunteer to hold the list of volunteers and compile a list of birthdates with anonymous IDs. This could then be passed to astroman818 publically, and he can do his work, post it publically, then the list of IDs/user names can be published to determine his accuracy.
Yes, that would be better. And if the volunteers have to be (or have been) married, then I can't participate anyway.

[yairhol]

I volunteer to be "read" by astroman818 regarding my marriage year (prediction by year + month would even be cooler no?).

I'm ready to submit my birthdate whenever we get this unofficial test going.

[Hokulele]

Yes, that would be better. And if the volunteers have to be (or have been) married, then I can't participate anyway.


If you cannot participate, would you be willing to hold and assign IDs to the volunteers?

Assuming astroman818 is willing to answer the question as to what constitutes a success? ;)

[yairhol]

If you cannot participate, would you be willing to hold and assign IDs to the volunteers?

Assuming astroman818 is willing to answer the question as to what constitutes a success? ;)

I would also like to know if in the case of failure would astroman818 be willing to question his abilities (if he has been researching this for the last decade I can imagine it being very difficult for him to admit that it has been a waste of time).

[Pixel42]

If you cannot participate, would you be willing to hold and assign IDs to the volunteers?

Assuming astroman818 is willing to answer the question as to what constitutes a success? ;)
Certainly. I'm retired and can check the forum regularly.

PM away :)

[Hokulele]

Certainly. I'm retired and can check the forum regularly.

PM away :)


You're on! :)

Yairhol, if you are still interested in participating, Pixel42 is the one to contact.

[yairhol]

PM sent to Pixel42!

[arthwollipot]

go to the time when you were in scorpio moon I skipped over it because I didn't think you marry then. You did start a relationship.

For the record I will put the moons of commitment in a order.
1. Cancer (being by far this)
2. Capricorn
3. Taurus
4. Scorpio
5. Aries
6. LibraI'm sorry, I have no idea what this means. And I told you that I had started a relationship, not the other way around. You originally told me that I started the relationship when I was 28, which was wrong.

[Hokulele]

PM sent to Pixel42!


:D

OK, for anyone else who may want to play, please just PM Pixel42 without an announcement. The whole point is to keep the names anonymous so astroman818 cannot do a warm/hot read.

ETA: @Pixel42 - When 20 volunteers have PM'd, please let us know and post a list with anonymous ID's here. Just for fun, would it make sense to let other people make guesses as well and see who gets the most correct?

ETA2: @astroman818 - If someone has been married more than once, are you calculating the date of the first marriage, or the most recent? Does it matter?

[MRC_Hans]

I just have a moment here and I want to thank all of you for being so kind to say hello and give your response to this. I promise this will be interesting as we go. Interesting how you already found me online I have been hiding for years. Just doing my research. Yes I did study people on Myspace.Hiding? Online?? And you claim you know profound truths :rolleyes:?

Well, OK. I'll gladly participate in your explorations, but I have a different proposition from those of the other guys here:

I will answer any question (within reason) about my life and character, and you find my birthday.

Hans

[SezMe]

NO, damnit, no. This is not a forum for conducting an informal test of astroman's astrology capabilites. This is a forum for discussing MDC challenges. astroman has done NOTHING in this thread to contribute to that topic. This informal test just lets him off the hook.

[Ravenwood]

I'm willing to add my birth date to the list. May 18th, 1966

[Pixel42]

Just for fun, would it make sense to let other people make guesses as well and see who gets the most correct?
Yes, we need a control. Can someone (or several someones) who is not participating volunteer to receive the list of IDs and birthdates and simply guess the corresponding age at marriage? We can then compare astroman's hit rate with the average random hit rate.

NO, damnit, no. This is not a forum for conducting an informal test of astroman's astrology capabilites. This is a forum for discussing MDC challenges. astroman has done NOTHING in this thread to contribute to that topic. This informal test just lets him off the hook.
I don't see how. If he fails he will presumably not proceed with the challenge and we would save JREF wasting their time, If he succeeds JREF will know they have a genuine challenger. But if a mod thinks these posts are off-topic in this forum, by all means split them off into a thread in the paranormal forum.

[yairhol]

What are the age spans that we are allowed to guess?
does a guess of age 23-26 count or does it need to be a specific age?
why not add a guess for a specific month also? Wouldn't that be more appropriate?
I mean most people (my guess around 65-75%) marry between ages 23 and 33 so being more accurate and saying a specific month is more appropriate. We need to ask astroman818 if he can do that.

[Pixel42]

Five volunteers so far (not counting Ravenwood, who posted his/her birth date instead of PMing it to me).

Most volunteers are giving me their marriage dates as well as birth dates. Strictly speaking I only need the birth date at this stage, though I suppose it means I can confirm that the marriage dates they give after astroman does his stuff are correct. (The down side being that, if I was in cahoots with astroman, I could tip him off).

We still need 15 more married volunteers to PM me their birth dates, and at least one additional volunteer to be the control (i.e. to receive the list of birth dates and randomly guess the corresponding marriage dates).

[Garrette]

"I will take the ring, though I do not know the way."

Erm, I mean I'll be the control.

[Akhenaten]

Five volunteers so far (not counting Ravenwood, who posted his/her birth date instead of PMing it to me).

Most volunteers are giving me their marriage dates as well as birth dates. Strictly speaking I only need the birth date at this stage, though I suppose it means I can confirm that the marriage dates they give after astroman does his stuff are correct. (The down side being that, if I was in cahoots with astroman, I could tip him off).

We still need 15 more married volunteers to PM me their birth dates, and at least one additional volunteer to be the control (i.e. to receive the list of birth dates and randomly guess the corresponding marriage dates).


Yeah, I'd be really, really worried about that. ;)

[arthwollipot]

I'm out, partially because I have already divulged the relevant information and partially because I'm not married anyway.

[JoeEllison]

I predict that this won't have a productive or useful outcome... :)

[William Smith]

NO, damnit, no. This is not a forum for conducting an informal test of astroman's astrology capabilites. This is a forum for discussing MDC challenges. astroman has done NOTHING in this thread to contribute to that topic. This informal test just lets him off the hook.

Well, someone moved the thread to the irrelevance that is the GS subforum. (Snicker.) That's what you get when rookie forumites contribute to a thread. (Snicker².)

Good day, astroman818, spender of 2.6m buckaroos on a busted myth.
(Snicker³.)

[Loss Leader]

I take a birthday like Oct. 3 rd


Is this my entire reading? OK. Let me take out all of your talk about philosophy and process and see exactly what you have said about me, based on my birthday of October 3, 1970:

I met a woman in the parking lot today...


The next two paragraphs have nothing to do with me.


As for Oct 3 1970 The big commitment times were Cancer moon at 17 to 18 years old, 25 to 28 for Libra and Scorpio moon, 31 to 33 for Capricorn moon, they are just entering Aries moon this year. Life is still a choice and some people marry when it is not the tiem for this but most of us do it when we feel the need to be with some one.


That's it? That's all you can tell me about myself?

I'm not sure I understand you because you have a way of putting the point of your paragraphs at the very end. However, it appears you are saying that I got married either when I was 17, 18, 25, 26, 27, 28, 31, 32 or 33.

This is absolutely wrong. I got married when I was 34 (fairly close to my 35th birthday).

But your guesses are very disappointing. Beginning when I was 17, I have lived almost 21 full years. You guessed that I got married in 9 of them. 9 our of 21 is 43%. You guessed almost half the years I've been alive, giving yourself close to a 50/50 chance that you were right.

Surely, Mark, you see that you could have simply said that I got married in an odd-numbered year and you would have had about the same chance of being correct. You must agree that your guess covered a vast amount of territory.

I have used my knowledge of astrology to make the following predictions:

1. Your social security number has either a 1, 3, 6, 8 or 9 in it.
2. So long as you followed your heart, you once saw a concert without your parents' knowledge.
3. You sort of identified with Ferris Beuler in the movie Ferris Beuler's Day Off and you identified with Holden Caulfield in Catcher in the Rye.
4. Before your divorces, the frequency with which you were having sex with your wives decreased dramatically.
5. An influence in your life may have pulled you to gardening unless you ignored it.

Please tell me that you can make more accurate predictions than could be obtained by guessing half of all the possible answers. Please tell me that you can divine exactly what the big changes in my life were in exactly the years that they happened. So far, despite giving yourself a fifty-fifty chance, your score is zero.

[wahrheit]

Before it was moved here, this thread was in Science, Mathematics, Medicine, and Technology if I remember correctly, not in the Challenge forum.

[Pixel42]

Before it was moved here, this thread was in Science, Mathematics, Medicine, and Technology if I remember correctly, not in the Challenge forum.
It started off in SMM&T, then got moved to the Challenge forum, and then got moved to this one.

It's a much travelled thread ;)

Eight volunteers so far.

[wahrheit]

It started off in SMM&T, then got moved to the Challenge forum, and then got moved to this one.

It's a much travelled thread ;)

Well, it could still make it to a fourth forum – AAH or Humor. ;)

Eight volunteers so far.

I would volunteer in this, but with the current game in Community I don't think I need any more PM's right now.

[Susan Gerbic]

Is this supposed to be my birthday?

[Piggy]

Are we really looking for truth?

We're looking for a test.

Then we'll see what the test reveals.

Remember, for the million, you just have to pass a test of your abilities.

I will get to as many questions as I can.

Please try to focus on developing a test. Many of us are here to help.

[Piggy]

Marriage times are just the beginning of what can be done with astrology. I think I started this to begin to work with people here. They keep telling me that I am in the wrong place but here we are so lets keep going.

No no no. Let's not keep going.

If you are going to do that, please take it to another thread.

A polite request to forum members: Please, if you don't mind, stop asking the OP to make deductions on this thread. It is counter-productive.

astroman, the problem with doing an interview format for your test is that it allows the possibility that you're doing a "cold reading" without being aware of it yourself.

So let's break it down to this:

Given birth dates, times, and places, what specific life events are you prepared to say did or did not happen to each person, and are you saying you can provide the years of those events and/or material causes?

What success rate do you predict?

Thanks.

[Piggy]

And if the volunteers have to be (or have been) married, then I can't participate anyway.

It would be a stronger test if there were a mix of volunteers -- married, single, divorced, widowed. But I think it would be strong enough even if marriage years and the years of any subsequent separations, divorces, or deaths were provided by the test subject.

[Ixion]

I posted my birthdate on the first page of this thread. I have not seen any predictions about my life. I guess it is because Saggitarii are hard to read... :rolleyes:

[Pixel42]

A polite request to forum members: Please, if you don't mind, stop asking the OP to make deductions on this thread. It is counter-productive.
I think the simple test we are planning to do might be very productive. It will give astroman an idea of the kind of test he will be required to do for JREF, and the result may even be enough to make him reconsider.

Ten volunteers now. That will probably be enough to demonstrate the basic principles and likely result of a proper test, but I'll give it a couple more hours before posting the list of IDs and birthdates.

[yairhol]

I'll ask again:
What is the time frame that Astroman is allowed to predict for a 'reading'?
does "you were married between the ages 23 to 26" count?
Why doesn't he predict the exact month also?
Statistics show that if he guesses ages 26 or 27 he will most probably be correct without knowing anything about anyone.
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0005061.html

[wahrheit]

I posted my birthdate on the first page of this thread. I have not seen any predictions about my life. I guess it is because Saggitarii are hard to read... :rolleyes:

I offered astroman on the first page of this thread to PM him my birthday and any other info he needs. I never got a reply.

[Piggy]

I think the simple test we are planning to do might be very productive. It will give astroman an idea of the kind of test he will be required to do for JREF, and the result may even be enough to make him reconsider.

Ten volunteers now. That will probably be enough to demonstrate the basic principles and likely result of a proper test, but I'll give it a couple more hours before posting the list of IDs and birthdates.

Oh, I wasn't talking about that test. I agree, it might be a good pre-test to see if it's worth going forward with anything formal.

I was just speaking of the ad hoc requests to make deductions from birth dates and such posted on the thread.

[astroman818]

I think your all missing what astrology really does to our lives.

It is constantly evolving into different changes. We make choices, when we get there. Some of us never marry but we are still effected by the changes. They are the motivator for our lives.

If all of you witch hunters would chill out for a few moments, I will get to it and you will all see what I am saying. It is effecting you, just because you don't know it. Doesn't mean it isn't happening.

Remember I did 15 year on this subject. 60,000 reading I know how it works. Give me a chance to explain here and you will all have to take note.

There are marriage times, astrology cannot predict the day of a marriage. although most Marriages are four months to the day plus or minus 2 weeks from one of the spouses birthday. Like my two marriages I am march 31 st and was married first on Aug 4 and my second marriage was may 26 th that wife was Jan 24 th. But we still have a choice in this. I didn't plan those marriages. I didn't even study astrology till I was ending the second one. These are just the facts.

[jimtron]

...

[jimtron]

I think your all missing what astrology really does to our lives.

It is constantly evolving into different changes. We make choices, when we get there. Some of us never marry but we are still effected by the changes. They are the motivator for our lives.

If all of you witch hunters would chill out for a few moments, I will get to it and you will all see what I am saying. It is effecting you, just because you don't know it. Doesn't mean it isn't happening.

Remember I did 15 year on this subject. 60,000 reading I know how it works. Give me a chance to explain here and you will all have to take note.

There are marriage times, astrology cannot predict the day of a marriage. although most Marriages are four months to the day plus or minus 2 weeks from one of the spouses birthday. Like my two marriages I am march 31 st and was married first on Aug 4 and my second marriage was may 26 th that wife was Jan 24 th. But we still have a choice in this. I didn't plan those marriages. I didn't even study astrology till I was ending the second one. These are just the facts.

Why don't you let us know when you can concisely explain what this has to do with the Million Dollar Challenge. If Astrology is this vague, I don't see how you could use it to win the million.

[astroman818]

I have to run my workers for the next many hours so I will be back. What I need is open minds. I don't seem to have many here. It is just hard to prove what is going on inside of us. That is where astrology is really working, remember it is a God decree. Stop thinking it is 2+2=4. This is why nobody ever figured it out, and all of you think so narrow minded. My big problem with people is to get you all to think out of the box. I am trying. I think it is a fool that judges something before they have done any research on a subject. We call it prejudice. To prejudge something shows your ignorance. I must go for now but I will be back.

So I want to know from any of you who have an opinion how much time you have spent really looking into astrology. That is my question for now. If I hear another person say it is wrong without having done work on it themselves. I am a very intelligent person, I came here to find more of the same. A person that knows nothing reserves their opinion till they have more info. This is hard enough with out all of you saying I am full of it.

When I win the prize you are going to have to pull you foot out of your mouth and run and hide. I am going to win it. Astrology is running our lives.

I will be back later.

[jimtron]

It is just hard to prove what is going on inside of us.

May be true; but the MDC is about proving and testing, not about vague claims.

If I hear another person say it is wrong without having done work on it themselves.
Has anyone on this thread said that? Also, you may not be aware of it, but many of us here have read a great deal about astrology.

For the last time, you don't need to convince us, and you don't need to explain how astrology works, or why it works, etc. The title of your thread mentions the MDC. As I'm sure by now you're read the rules, you know what's eligible and not eligible, and you know how to apply. I'm looking forward to your taking the challenge. But as I said much earlier in this thread, you don't have to talk to us, but this is a skeptical thread, so don't be surprised when you're asked tough questions.

But you're welcome to stop posting here if you don't like it, and take the challenge. And please feel free to come back and gloat after you win.

You did read all of the rules, right?

[JoeEllison]

I think your all missing what astrology really does to our lives.

It is constantly evolving into different changes. We make choices, when we get there. Some of us never marry but we are still effected by the changes. They are the motivator for our lives.

If all of you witch hunters would chill out for a few moments, I will get to it and you will all see what I am saying. It is effecting you, just because you don't know it. Doesn't mean it isn't happening.

Remember I did 15 year on this subject. 60,000 reading I know how it works. Give me a chance to explain here and you will all have to take note.

There are marriage times, astrology cannot predict the day of a marriage. although most Marriages are four months to the day plus or minus 2 weeks from one of the spouses birthday. Like my two marriages I am march 31 st and was married first on Aug 4 and my second marriage was may 26 th that wife was Jan 24 th. But we still have a choice in this. I didn't plan those marriages. I didn't even study astrology till I was ending the second one. These are just the facts.
We don't care about any of that, at all, even a little bit.

What we care about is evidence. Produce some evidence, or stop wasting everyone's time. If I could do something out of the ordinary, I'd just DO IT instead of going on and on about how much you've read. We don't want or need you to explain anything, we want you to show us.

[jimtron]

By the way, if it takes you this long to get to what you can actually do, you won't win the MDC. If I'm not mistaken, they will want a concise, specific, testable claim. If it takes you 10 pages to state your challenge, I have a feeling it might not go through.

Or maybe you don't really have a testable claim?

[Pixel42]

OK, we now have 14 volunteers, which I think is enough to go ahead with a test.

Here are the 14 birth dates I've been sent:

subject 1: 9th October 1972
subject 2: 21 February 1954
subject 3: 20 September 1949
subject 4: 5 May 1975
subject 5: 20 May 1962
subject 6: 16 February 1970
subject 7: 1st April 1971
subject 8: 2nd November 1970
subject 9: 21st October 1974.
subject 10: 8 August 1962
subject 11: 18 November 1947
subject 12: 11 April 1976
subject 13: 22 January 1969
subject 14: 1st june 1956

astroman: do your stuff. I initially understood you to claim that you could predict the age at which someone married, but if you'd like to predict something different from these dates, e.g. which of the twelve months of the year they married in, that's fine. But it needs to be something specific, which the people concerned can say is either correct or incorrect.

[learner]

I have to run my workers for the next many hours so I will be back. What I need is open minds. I don't seem to have many here. It is just hard to prove what is going on inside of us. That is where astrology is really working, remember it is a God decree. Stop thinking it is 2+2=4. This is why nobody ever figured it out, and all of you think so narrow minded. My big problem with people is to get you all to think out of the box. I am trying. I think it is a fool that judges something before they have done any research on a subject. We call it prejudice. To prejudge something shows your ignorance. I must go for now but I will be back.

So I want to know from any of you who have an opinion how much time you have spent really looking into astrology. That is my question for now. If I hear another person say it is wrong without having done work on it themselves. I am a very intelligent person, I came here to find more of the same. A person that knows nothing reserves their opinion till they have more info. This is hard enough with out all of you saying I am full of it.

When I win the prize you are going to have to pull you foot out of your mouth and run and hide. I am going to win it. Astrology is running our lives.

I will be back later.

Wise words, I tried that running with my foot in my mouth once, Not pretty. Don't do it is my advice.

[wahrheit]

Remember I did 15 year on this subject. 60,000 reading I know how it works.

Wow, 60,000 readings in 15 years?

Thats more than 15 readings per day, working from Monday to Friday.

Sounds like a full time job to me. You must be a professional and a celebrity astrologer already!

[GoodGuysEatPie]

Astroman, why do you keep ignoring us every time we say: We don't yet care about how you make your predictions. We are just interested in the predictions themselves.

What is the clear and concise, and testable SINGLE claim that you are making about your predictive power?

We don't care about all that moon and Sun angle stuff and where Cancer was or whatever. At least, not yet. You just need to tell us the answer to the above question. Given a birthdate, what single thing can you ascertain from that using astrology that we couldn't get from just guessing? If it is marriage date, then what do you think your margin of uncertainty is (within 1 year, 2 years, 3 years, etc)? And then, out of 100 people, for example, how many do you think you will be spot on?

Don't give the usual "well, astrology works differently for different people" stuff. Just give us a concise answer to the above.

We are skeptics, so we demand evidence for your claims. If you can really do something extraordinary with astrology, the evidence will speak for itself. Only then will we be interested in the details of your method.

~Good Guy~

[Susan Gerbic]

There are marriage times, astrology cannot predict the day of a marriage. although most Marriages are four months to the day plus or minus 2 weeks from one of the spouses birthday. Like my two marriages I am march 31 st and was married first on Aug 4 and my second marriage was may 26 th that wife was Jan 24 th. But we still have a choice in this. I didn't plan those marriages. I didn't even study astrology till I was ending the second one. These are just the facts.

So.... 4 months "to the day" or "plus or minus 2 weeks" which is it? It is either "on that exact day" or "within two weeks of the 4 months" you can't have both.

4 months plus 2 weeks is about 18 weeks

18 weeks + 18 weeks is 36 weeks

The year has 52 weeks and you have just claimed 36 of those weeks

If my math is correct that is 69% of the weeks are covered. I would like those odds if I were predicting something. I'm sure if that 18 weeks needed to be stretched into 19 weeks or even 20 weeks that would be okay, right?

I didn't plan those marriages

What did you just wake up one day married? Were you in Vegas by any chance? I hear that happens, which is why I try not to drink much at TAM.

Susan

[Jackalgirl]

Astroman --

If you were provided with 10 birthdates and in response you provided 10 readings that don't reference date information*, and if each of the subjects received all 10 readings, how many do you think would correctly identify their reading as theirs?

*by referencing date information, I mean that the readings should say stuff like "as a Scorpio, you..." or otherwise contain information that could be linked back to date information such as a month. Rather, the readings should only include the conclusions -- for example, "you are a sensual person, with a deep appreciation for the beauty of nature" or "your grandmother, who died when you were 8, made a deep impression on your life" etc etc.

Could you do this? How accurate would your readings be?

[yairhol]

who can guess the excuses we'll get IF astroman doesn't get the hit percentage he wants?

[Hokulele]

OK, we now have 14 volunteers, which I think is enough to go ahead with a test.

Here are the 14 birth dates I've been sent:

<snip>

subject 7: 1st April 1971

<snip>


Now I feel very sorry for a forum member. :cool:

[Professor Yaffle]

So.... 4 months "to the day" or "plus or minus 2 weeks" which is it? It is either "on that exact day" or "within two weeks of the 4 months" you can't have both.

4 months plus 2 weeks is about 18 weeks

18 weeks + 18 weeks is 36 weeks

The year has 52 weeks and you have just claimed 36 of those weeks

If my math is correct that is 69% of the weeks are covered. I would like those odds if I were predicting something. I'm sure if that 18 weeks needed to be stretched into 19 weeks or even 20 weeks that would be okay, right?


I *think* what he means here is that most people get married within a 4 week window with an average of 4 months from one of the spouses birthdays (so 3 1/2 to 4 1/2 months away). He didn't seem to specify whether it was before or after the birthday, so I will assume both - with 2 spouses that gives us 4 4 week slots in which most people get married. So that is approx 4/13 or about 31% of the year - assuming that none of the slots overlap with eachother.

[Pixel42]

A person that knows nothing reserves their opinion till they have more info.
I'm sure that everyone who has contributed to this thread would agree with you wholeheartedly about that. I know I do. Where I think we might differ is in what we consider relevant info in this case. I suspect most of us think that the dozens of studies that have been done on astrology (I posted a link to a list of many of them early in the thread), and what has been discovered about phenomena like subjective validation and confirmation bias, are highly relevant information which should be considered before forming an opinion on astrology.

So how much time did you spend looking into the scientific studies that have already been done on astrology, and reading about subjective validation and confirmation bias, before forming your opinion on astrology?

[JoeEllison]

I *think* what he means here is that most people get married within a 4 week window with an average of 4 months from one of the spouses birthdays (so 3 1/2 to 4 1/2 months away). He didn't seem to specify whether it was before or after the birthday, so I will assume both - with 2 spouses that gives us 4 4 week slots in which most people get married. So that is approx 4/13 or about 31% of the year - assuming that none of the slots overlap with each other.
Add to that the fact that most people get married between June and September, and you've eliminated well over half of the year, right?

[volatile]

If you're serious about this, please explain. I'd be willing to bet a lot of money that the above statement is demonstrably false.

I have over a hundred of hours of tattoo work, and I'm an Aeries. The most tattooed man on the planet, Lucky Diamond Rich (over 100% tattoo coverage), was born June 4th, making him a Gemini.

[William Smith]

I think your all missing what astrology really does to our lives.

It is constantly evolving into different changes. We make choices, when we get there. Some of us never marry but we are still effected by the changes. They are the motivator for our lives.

If all of you witch hunters would chill out for a few moments, I will get to it and you will all see what I am saying. It is effecting you, just because you don't know it. Doesn't mean it isn't happening.

Remember I did 15 year on this subject. 60,000 reading I know how it works. Give me a chance to explain here and you will all have to take note.

There are marriage times, astrology cannot predict the day of a marriage. although most Marriages are four months to the day plus or minus 2 weeks from one of the spouses birthday. Like my two marriages I am march 31 st and was married first on Aug 4 and my second marriage was may 26 th that wife was Jan 24 th. But we still have a choice in this. I didn't plan those marriages. I didn't even study astrology till I was ending the second one. These are just the facts.

Astroman818, I dare you to read this. (http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/astrology.html)

...
These are just the facts.

You were given a chance to learn. Will you refuse because you would have to accept that you have wasted 15 years?

[Ron_Tomkins]

What? This has been moved to the General Skepticism and Paranormal Section? No way! You mean there will be no Million Dollar Test? Damn! I'm amazed. This totally caught me by surprise!!!

[Freethinker]

What? This has been moved to the General Skepticism and Paranormal Section? No way! You mean there will be no Million Dollar Test? Damn! I'm amazed. This totally caught me by surprise!!!

It should be moved to Abandon all Sense Hope

[astroman818]

So I am a total moron and should go into the litter box for my lunch, just because a bunch of people who have spent 5 minutes all together as a group studying astrology say all hope of ever proving astrology is lost. Come on people. I thought I would find some some form of intelligent life here.

So when I was at Wall Mart the other night and a girl walked up to me and I told here she was a Sagittarius then I said to her Nov 24 th and she said No nov 23 rd that makes me a moron. I have done that a 1000 times. I get it dead on just by looking at people often. Its a one in 365 chance I get within one day often. But I can not do that because astrology was proven wrong by some person who didn't even know what they were doing in the first place.

I believe that as astrology has been presented to all of you it is false but how do I bring you all up to speed?

I have been here for one day, I can't count the amount of people that have told me I am full of it and all hope is lost in proving anything. Do I get a chance to speak? Can you try to keep your minds open. I have much better things to do than reply to ignorance. YOU ALL ARE JUST AS BAD IF NOT WORSE THAN THE PEOPLE YOU ARE TRYING TO DISCLAIM.

You can move me to the fantasy section of the forum. I know it works. I am looking for intelligence. Is there any of that here?

I asked someone to call me and all of you are afraid to do so. Are you scared I might be right and you will have to come back here and admit it to the people here? I am still here.

I am still making the same claims. I need someone who is willing to call me. I don't bite!!

[Professor Yaffle]

So make us all look stupi and post the marriage dates which match the list of birthdates that are posted in this thread...

[Susan Gerbic]

So when I was at Wall Mart the other night and a girl walked up to me and I told here she was a Sagittarius then I said to her Nov 24 th and she said No nov 23 rd that makes me a moron. I have done that a 1000 times. I get it dead on just by looking at people often. Its a one in 365 chance I get within one day often. But I can not do that because astrology was proven wrong by some person who didn't even know what they were doing in the first place.

I believe that as astrology has been presented to all of you it is false but how do I bring you all up to speed?

I have been here for one day, I can't count the amount of people that have told me I am full of it and all hope is lost in proving anything. Do I get a chance to speak? Can you try to keep your minds open. I have much better things to do than reply to ignorance. YOU ALL ARE JUST AS BAD IF NOT WORSE THAN THE PEOPLE YOU ARE TRYING TO DISCLAIM.

You can move me to the fantasy section of the forum. I know it works. I am looking for intelligence. Is there any of that here?

I asked someone to call me and all of you are afraid to do so. Are you scared I might be right and you will have to come back here and admit it to the people here? I am still here.

So do you often approach young women at Walmart? If so I'm surprised that you haven't been arrested yet. People are more likely to agree with what you just said so you will move on. Did she show you her ID proving her birth date? Women are especially uncomfortable with strange men talking to them about personal information.

Now after rereading your message you say that the young girl walked up to you and told you she was a Sagittarius, are you wearing some kind of sign that says, "tell you your birth sign" or what? You said that you had a chance of 365 possible days, but the last time I checked a month is equal to +/- 30 days.

I don't want some odd man talking to me on the phone, which is one main reason I don't want to call you up. We have also made it very clear that when you have feedback you are doing what is called "cold-reading" which is NOT science.

I don't understand why you are not getting this, you are in a skeptic forum, you walked in here all by yourself, you are talking to intelligent people who are CLEARLY asking you to state your claims in a way that can be tested. You keep talking about how long you have been working on this, and how you are going to rub our noses in it after you win, but no where are you actually trying to get a testable claim.

Personally I think you have problems. You do not sound like someone who really is interested in proving anything, otherwise you would have already done so. I think you are just someone getting his jollies yanking some skeptic's chains.

If I am wrong, then prove me wrong by telling us exactly what you can do in a way that is testable. Some great suggestions have already been made but you seem to be skipping these posts. Go back and re-read these and make suggestions why they will or won't work. The test has to be one that you totally agree with, you need to be comfortable with it. But we can't even begin to do that if you won't be clear about what your claim actually is, you are rambling (as I probably am as well at this moment)

Susan

[Jackalgirl]

I am still making the same claims. I need someone who is willing to call me. I don't bite!!

No. You need to distinguish what you do from cold reading (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_reading). From your descriptions of what you do, it looks like this is largely what you have been doing. It is not particularly difficult to give someone what appears to be a very accurate "psychic" or "astrological" reading when you're able to talk with them and solicit feedback. People are naturally pattern-seeky individuals.

To help demonstrate that you are not engaging in cold reading, you may not receive feedback from your target subject(s). This is a GOOD THING, because it elminates cold reading from the list of possible explanations for what you do, and gets you closer to a situation in which astrology is the only possible explanation left.

What information, besides a person's birthdate, do you need in order to do a reading? Please provide a list of typical questions you ask.

[jimtron]

So I am a total moron and should go into the litter box for my lunch, just because a bunch of people who have spent 5 minutes all together as a group studying astrology say all hope of ever proving astrology is lost. Come on people. I thought I would find some some form of intelligent life here.No one has said anything remotely like that here. If I'm wrong, please quote a post on this thread. The main thing we keep saying over and over, is we don't need a long explanation--just tell us your testable claim. We're not saying "all hope of ever proving astrology is lost." On the contrary, I've encouraged you to take the challenge. But if you want to take the challenge, you MUST make a specific testable claim. If you don't want to state a specific claim, that's fine, but then forget about the challenge.

You've read the rules, right?

YOU ALL ARE JUST AS BAD IF NOT WORSE THAN THE PEOPLE YOU ARE TRYING TO DISCLAIM.
Please prove us wrong. Please take the challenge, win the million, and come back here and gloat. PLEASE! But keep in mind, you'll need a testable paranormal claim. You seem to be evading that important point.

[wahrheit]

Astroman, with all due respect, you have posted nothing but blah blah blah about the way you think astronomy works, about women you met at Walmart parking lots and how many years you spent doing a gazillion readings (all of them spot on, of course!).

What you have not posted, however, is any tiny weeny little bit of anything that even hints at you being a genuine astrologer who can blow us away with his predictions or knowledge about past events which you could not possible guess, such as the wedding dates and other stuff regarding the 14 volunteers who submitted their birthday in this thread.

Let me tell you why you didn't post any of that information. It's because you do not have the slightest idea when, if, why, how and where these folks married. It's as simple as that. Just like me, you simply do not know it. Titan mooning Uranus will not give you the answers either.

[TheDoLittle]

Now I feel very sorry for a forum member. :cool:

No fool like a JREF fool... 8-)

[Hokulele]

I am still making the same claims. I need someone who is willing to call me. I don't bite!!


No, now you are making different claims. Can you predict someone's age when they were married based only on their birthdate?

If you are dropping the marriage age claim and are now requiring that someone call you, are you willing to have the call recorded and analyzed publically?

[jimtron]

A little recap. From the original, first post of this thread:
I am here to collect the Million Dollar Prize. To prove that there is a God and we were created beings.Maybe the astrology stuff is too difficult or ambiguous to test? That seems to be the case from what I've read here so far (if not, please feel free to specify your testable astrology claim as described in the rules). So how about proving "that there is a God" which you mentioned in the OP. Prove that, and enjoy your million.

From post #2:

Have you read the Challenge rules yet? Simply posting on the forums isn't the same thing as applying, and you need to actually apply to be eligible to take on the million dollar challenge.

Perhaps more importantly, what are you "good enough" at? What can you actually demonstrate astrology to be capable of? Vague statements about proving there is a God will not qualify; you need to be able to propose (and pass) a testable claim, such as "Given a list of twenty names and birthdates, I will be able to identify with 80% accuracy which of the people listed are currently married, which are currently divorced, and which have never been married."

Good luck! See, right from your very first response, you were wished luck, and given information on how to take the challenge. We're not saying your claim is wrong--on the contrary, we're asking for you to describe to us how your claim is testable, and we're encouraging you to take the challenge. And it was pointed out right here at your first response, that vague statements won't qualify; that you'll need a testable claim. No testable claim: no challenge. It's that simple. And you haven't provided a testable claim yet.


Post #3:

Tell us exactly what you can do to show an observer that it's true. Something measurable. See? Right from the beginning, we told you we needed something measurable--tell us exactly how you can demonstrate that your claim is true. Again, we're not denying your claim, we're asking for you to demonstrate it. Do you see the difference? Vague, meandering explanations are not measurable, testable claims. If astrology has to be vague, and/or isn't testable or measurable--that's fine, just say so. I'm sure you've read the rules by now and realize that you need to make a specific, testable demonstration that isn't open to interpretation--it must be self evidently apparent that your demonstration is a success (based on the protocol agreed by you and JREF). But you already know that.

[Piggy]

If all of you witch hunters would chill out for a few moments, I will get to it and you will all see what I am saying. <snip> Give me a chance to explain here and you will all have to take note.

<sigh> Well, looks like this thread is over on the paranormal forum now, so we're going to have to put up with this.

I would prefer that there were 2 threads, one here and one on the challenge forum, but so be it.

There are marriage times, astrology cannot predict the day of a marriage. although most Marriages are four months to the day plus or minus 2 weeks from one of the spouses birthday. Like my two marriages I am march 31 st and was married first on Aug 4 and my second marriage was may 26 th that wife was Jan 24 th. But we still have a choice in this. I didn't plan those marriages. I didn't even study astrology till I was ending the second one. These are just the facts.

So what can you do?

Please give a time range.

Given a birth date, time, and place, you can say that a person's marriage happened in a given year?

Within a 6 month range?

How long, exactly?

[Piggy]

What I need is open minds.

You will find open minds, but not empty heads.

This is a skeptics' forum, which means we do not simply start believing things because someone says so.

If there's evidence, then there's reason to believe a thing is true.

If not, there's no reason to.

If there's evidence to the contrary, then there's reason to believe a thing is false.

Which brings us to this....

Stop thinking it is 2+2=4. This is why nobody ever figured it out, and all of you think so narrow minded. My big problem with people is to get you all to think out of the box.

It would help if you would explain what it is that you can do.

If you do not do that, then what are we supposed to believe can be done with astrology?

If it's not 2+2=4 (and I never thought astrology was that) then please, what is it?

Until and unless you do that, then there's nothing for my mind to be open to, is there?


When I win the prize you are going to have to pull you foot out of your mouth and run and hide. I am going to win it. Astrology is running our lives.

You will not win the prize until and unless you tell us exactly what you can do with astrology.

So far you have been disinclined to do so, despite a lot of good, concrete suggestion from other forum members.

I hope you understand that this is very inconsiderate of you.

We also have jobs, families, and obligations.

We're happy to help you in any way we can to set up a test, but we cannot do that if you refuse to be a part of the process.

[Piggy]

I have over a hundred of hours of tattoo work, and I'm an Aeries. The most tattooed man on the planet, Lucky Diamond Rich (over 100% tattoo coverage), was born June 4th, making him a Gemini.

I'm a Sag, and have extensive tattoos.

[volatile]

I'm a Sag, and have extensive tattoos.

Not a Capricorn then?

Astroman - care to comment on this? You said only Capricorns and Cancers have heavy tattoo work... but Piggy, and I, and the most tattooed human being in history, don't have Cancer or Capricorn birthdays? Why might that be?

[Loss Leader]

There are marriage times, astrology cannot predict the day of a marriage. although most Marriages are four months to the day plus or minus 2 weeks from one of the spouses birthday.


Mark -

So far, I am just about the only person you have done a reading for. You guessed 43% of all the years between my 17th birthday and today as being the year of my marriage. And you were still wrong.

Do you have any response to the fact that you were wrong?

Do you have any response to the fact that you picked almost half of all possible years?

Do you have anything else at all to tell me about myself? My birthday is October 3, 1970.

Do you have any way of distinguishing what you do from plain guessing?

Do you have any response to the fact that your prediction of what month people get married covers as much as 1/6 of any given year?

Do you have any response to the challenge that has been made by posting a list of birthdays?

I have not said that astrology does not work. I have said only that the one guess you made so far about me was wrong.

I look forward to hearing some clarification from you.

[Piggy]

So I am a total moron and should go into the litter box for my lunch, just because a bunch of people who have spent 5 minutes all together as a group studying astrology say all hope of ever proving astrology is lost. Come on people. I thought I would find some some form of intelligent life here.

You're crossing the line now, astroman.

No one here has told you to eat ****. Many people have been very helpful.

People on this board, and this forum in particular, are generally interested in the paranormal, and some forum members actively investigate claims.

Astrology is a common paranormal subject, and there are folks here who are quite familiar with it, if not as familiar as you are. So popping up with this "5 minutes" accusation is out of line, I'm afraid.

Let us both try to be civil to each other.

If we thought there was no point in testing astrology, none of us would have spent our time talking with you here to try to determine a test. In fact, you've had volunteers for a preliminary test, and a moderator for that test, who have spent time cooperating with you.

Please meet us halfway and let's move on.

But I would greatly appreciate it if you did not hurl unfounded insults at us. If some forum members have been rude, well, it's a public forum so you're going to get hecklers. Please try to ignore that and focus on our cooperative efforts to find a way to develop a test that can win you a million dollars.

Because, you know, if you start hurling insults, it's going to sound to some people like you're trying to find a way to avoid the test, and nobody wants that.

Let's move on.

[Piggy]

astroman, in case there's any confusion, I'd like to clear up one important point.

When people here say that we don't (yet) care about the explanation, it's because we have to first see that there's anything to explain.

It's like this.... Suppose I say "I can accurately predict the final score of any sporting event a week before it takes place. Now, allow me to explain how I do that. It's going to take a long time."

A resonable person is not going to respond, "Great, let me put on some coffee".

A reasonable person is going to respond, "Wow, that's impressive, but I've got a life to live, so before I listen to you explain how you do that, why don't you show me that you actually can do it?"

If you don't pony up and show us what you can do, then I'm afraid there's nothing to explain.

That is why it is so important that you say exactly what you can do.

Until you do that, explanations don't matter.

[Piggy]

So when I was at Wall Mart the other night and a girl walked up to me and I told here she was a Sagittarius then I said to her Nov 24 th and she said No nov 23 rd that makes me a moron. I have done that a 1000 times.

We have no way of knowing if this is true.

If you can do this type of thing, then please, let us help you to design a test so that you can prove it to everyone here.

I believe that as astrology has been presented to all of you it is false but how do I bring you all up to speed?

Oh, that's easy. You do it by explaining exactly what you can do with astrology, then setting up a test to show you can do it. Several people here have made fine suggestions for just such a test.

I have been here for one day, I can't count the amount of people that have told me I am full of it and all hope is lost in proving anything. Do I get a chance to speak?

No one has stopped you from speaking. You're free to post as often as you like.

We're trying to help you try to prove that what you're saying is true. But you have to cooperate.

Claiming that you have done things in the past doesn't prove anything.

Neither does offering explanations for things we haven't seen you do.

So please, let's cooperate and develop a test that we all agree on.

I need someone who is willing to call me.

You won't get that.

First, actually contacting strangers over the phone who you meet on Internet forums is not safe.

Second, a half-hour chat session will not prove anything. It opens the door to unconscious "cold reading".

You know the rules by now. Let's develop a public test of your abilities. Then you can prove something.

[Ron_Tomkins]

So I am a total moron...

Nah. You're just a troll. And not a very original one either.

[Olowkow]

OK, we now have 14 volunteers, which I think is enough to go ahead with a test.

Here are the 14 birth dates I've been sent:

subject 1: 9th October 1972
subject 2: 21 February 1954
subject 3: 20 September 1949
subject 4: 5 May 1975
subject 5: 20 May 1962
subject 6: 16 February 1970
subject 7: 1st April 1971
subject 8: 2nd November 1970
subject 9: 21st October 1974.
subject 10: 8 August 1962
subject 11: 18 November 1947
subject 12: 11 April 1976
subject 13: 22 January 1969
subject 14: 1st june 1956

astroman: do your stuff. I initially understood you to claim that you could predict the age at which someone married, but if you'd like to predict something different from these dates, e.g. which of the twelve months of the year they married in, that's fine. But it needs to be something specific, which the people concerned can say is either correct or incorrect.

Hey! I'll throw a buck in the pot if he can get the present "ages" of all 14 of the subjects correct.:D

[moon1969]

Astrology is big business. Its just a waste of time. People should be thinking about more important things like is there intelligent life in the universe.

[jimtron]

Astrology is big business. Its just a waste of time. People should be thinking about more important things like is there intelligent life in the universe.

Yes, there is intelligent life in the universe. Not too much, but certainly a bit here and there--sometimes you have to look pretty hard.

[arthwollipot]

who can guess the excuses we'll get IF astroman doesn't get the hit percentage he wants?We don't need to guess - we've already seen it. See what happened when he predicted my marriage/relationship start date. "Oh, Sags are hard to read".

[Piggy]

astroman, I want to make sure that one thing is abundantly clear.

If you're saying that you can have a half-hour conversation with someone and use astrology to tell them some things about themselves which it seems you should not be able to know, no one here is going to be impressed.

Here's why.

James Randi, Penn Jillette, and quite a few other prominent showmen and debunkers can do the exact same thing in a lot less time without any astrological charts or claims of paranormal powers.

It sounds to me as if that's your claim.

Is it?

If it is, it's not testable, and not impressive.

And it won't win the prize.

So please, yes or no, is that what you claim you can do?

If not, then what do you claim you can do?

(Are you sensing a theme here?)

[Jackalgirl]

Howdy, Astroman --

Sorry to repeat myself, but I think my question is fairly important (and I'm working on suggesting a protocol to you), so I'm repeating it in the hopes that you will see it in the flurry of messages on this thread, especially since you haven't responded at all to my other, similar posts:

What information, besides a person's birthdate, do you need in order to do a reading? Please provide a list of typical questions you ask.

[Gmonster2]

So for my marriage date u guessed 19-21 or 27-29 although 18, 22, 26 or 30 would have been oh so close :)

Sorry you're wrong i've never been married... :jaw-dropp

thats 3 wrong from 3 so far in this thread ....I think the million is quite safe.

[yairhol]

Where's that darn cricket when you need it?

[learner]

Tattooed Pisces here. Got em all over the place. Even the old chap.

[fromdownunder]

So for my marriage date u guessed 19-21 or 27-29 although 18, 22, 26 or 30 would have been oh so close :)

Sorry you're wrong i've never been married... :jaw-dropp

thats 3 wrong from 3 so far in this thread ....I think the million is quite safe.

Well, even if you take his claim that most people will marry 3.5 months to 4,5 months (correct me if my understanding of this claim is wrong - it seemed woolly enough for any interpretation) from one of the partners birthdates, this was wrong in my case also. So, another possible failure. I must not be one of the "most"

Norm

[yairhol]

I must not be one of the "most"

Don't feel bad. This only makes you 'special'.

[Giraffe107]

.... Even the old chap.

Ouch! :eye-poppi

[astroman818]

Sorry for not being on here tonight I will get to all the birthdays as soon as I can I have a very busy life. I haven't really read all the posts. I do want to thank many of you for showing interest in what I have to say.

[Kuko 4000]

..I will get to all the birthdays as soon as I can..

That's great news, I hope you can impress us :)

[wahrheit]

Ouch! :eye-poppi
Oh. So, 'the old chap' means what I think it means.

Sorry for not being on here tonight I will get to all the birthdays as soon as I can I have a very busy life. I haven't really read all the posts. I do want to thank many of you for showing interest in what I have to say.

If you have such a busy life, how did you do those 60,000 readings in the past 15 years?

[ddt]

Sorry for not being on here tonight I will get to all the birthdays as soon as I can I have a very busy life. I haven't really read all the posts. I do want to thank many of you for showing interest in what I have to say.


If you have such a busy life, how did you do those 60,000 readings in the past 15 years?

:D At the check-out line of Wall-mart's and 7/11, where else?

It's quite clear you haven't read all the posts, astroman. I read at least two dozen, by Jackalgirl, Piggy and others I forgot, specifically outlining what is expected of you for the MDC.

I only recently began reading threads about this, but I see a distinct pattern here. Someone waltzes in with a lot of brouhaha and vague claims, and claiming they'll earn the million in a pinch. When it comes to questions what they specifically can do, it remains vague, and hammering out a protocol is met with eerie silence. Ah well. The poster who predicted in the begin of this thread that, if there weren't a protocol by post #100, it would never get there, seems quite spot-on.

Colour me sceptic, but after all your posts in the last couple of days, your "I'm busy" now you're called upon Pixel42's experiment seems quite cop-out.

Show it to us it's not!

[sophia8]

I've come to this thread late.
There are marriage times, astrology cannot predict the day of a marriage. although most Marriages are four months to the day plus or minus 2 weeks from one of the spouses birthday.
Astroman, what evidence do you have for this? Bear in mind that astrologers themselves have done studies on this sort of thing for decades and have collected vast amounts of birth data on marriage and married couples. So can you reference one or two of those studies for us?
It sounds to me like you're basing your predictions on little more than the sign of the Progressed Moon. But real astrologers look at a whole lot more than that.
I also doubt your claims to have done 60,00 'readings' in 15 years. That works out at something like 10 or 12 a day, every day for those 15 years. Of course, if each 'reading' consists of simply telling somebody their sign or birthday, that figure is possible (if still unlikely). But a proper astrological reading? No siree.

[Blackadder]

Hi my name is Mark I'm an Christian astrologer a person who never answers any question. But I am good in repeating the same vague babble over and over again

[arthwollipot]

Oh. So, 'the old chap' means what I think it means.Yes, it's that very "british" kind of slang that is incredibly rude while maintaining impeccable politeness.

[RayG]

(over 100% tattoo coverage)

Sorry for the derail, but I'm trying to fathom how that would be possible. How does one tattoo more than 100% of their body?

Ok, and now back to asstrology...

RayG

[volatile]

Sorry for the derail, but I'm trying to fathom how that would be possible. How does one tattoo more than 100% of their body?

Ok, and now back to asstrology...

RayG

You tattoo over the same spot more than once, and you tattoo inside surfaces like the lips.

[Cuddles]

I would prefer that there were 2 threads, one here and one on the challenge forum, but so be it.

If astroman, or indeed anyone else, wishes to start a thread in the challenge section to discuss an application that is fine. However, so far astroman has shown no inclination to actually apply for, or even discuss the challenge, and his attempts at giving readings and excuses are more appropriate in this forum.

This is why nobody ever figured it out

And yet you claim to have figured it out. Which is it? Can you actually do anything, or has no-one figured it out? You'd get a lot less criticisms if you didn't contradict yourself quite as much.

We call it prejudice.

It's only prejudice if you dismiss it before seeing the evidence. Dismissing astrology is just plain old judice.

I am a very intelligent person, I came here to find more of the same.

No offence, but you're really not. If you actually were intelligent, even if you believed in the nonsense that is astrology you would at least realise that the lame excuses and reasoning you have do not actually amount to anything, and are not going to convince even the most gullible person.

So when I was at Wall Mart the other night and a girl walked up to me and I told here she was a Sagittarius then I said to her Nov 24 th and she said No nov 23 rd that makes me a moron.

So someone walked up to you and, completely out of the blue, told you her star sign. Even if we believe that actually happened, what exactly do you think is impressive about someone giving you approximately a 1/30 chance of guessing their birthday and you getting it wrong? That's going to happen 29/30 times. You don't need astrology for that.

I have done that a 1000 times.

Amazing. Of course, it would be a lot more amazing it you actually got it right occasionally.

But I can not do that because astrology was proven wrong by some person who didn't even know what they were doing in the first place.

Well you clearly can't do it, but I don't think you've hit on the reason why yet.

I have been here for one day, I can't count the amount of people that have told me I am full of it and all hope is lost in proving anything.

Really? I can. Perhaps you're not as intelligent as you claimed to be.

I asked someone to call me and all of you are afraid to do so. Are you scared I might be right and you will have to come back here and admit it to the people here? I am still here.

I am still making the same claims. I need someone who is willing to call me. I don't bite!!

Why would anyone want to waste their money on a phonecall just so they can get a poor effort at cold reading? If astrology can do anything you claim, it can do so without any contact between you and anyone else. If you rely on meeting a person and not just on the stars then, whether you can actually do anything or not, it's not actually astrology. Considering that you claim to know astrology better than anyone else, you should really have realise that yourself.

[Denver]

OK, we now have 14 volunteers, which I think is enough to go ahead with a test.

Here are the 14 birth dates I've been sent:

subject 1: 9th October 1972
subject 2: 21 February 1954
subject 3: 20 September 1949
subject 4: 5 May 1975
subject 5: 20 May 1962
subject 6: 16 February 1970
subject 7: 1st April 1971
subject 8: 2nd November 1970
subject 9: 21st October 1974.
subject 10: 8 August 1962
subject 11: 18 November 1947
subject 12: 11 April 1976
subject 13: 22 January 1969
subject 14: 1st june 1956

astroman: do your stuff. I initially understood you to claim that you could predict the age at which someone married, but if you'd like to predict something different from these dates, e.g. which of the twelve months of the year they married in, that's fine. But it needs to be something specific, which the people concerned can say is either correct or incorrect.

Should we also introduce a control group: say, a couple of us send our own (private) predictions here? I'd volunteer for giving that a try.

[Pixel42]

Should we also introduce a control group: say, a couple of us send our own (private) predictions here? I'd volunteer for giving that a try.
Already arranged. In fact, one of two volunteers has already sent me his own guesses. But you're welcome to do so too. We will then have the average accuracy of three random guessers to compare with the accuracy of astroman's calculations. Assuming he ever does them, of course.

[DarthFishy]

Already arranged. In fact, one of two volunteers has already sent me his own guesses. But you're welcome to do so too. We will then have the average accuracy of three random guessers to compare with the accuracy of astroman's calculations. Assuming he ever does them, of course.

Yay! Science! :D

[astroman818]

I did two readings yesterday, one to my new neighbor across the street, the other to an old friends new girlfriend. I went over their adult lives and got it all correct. I just think I am having a hard time putting this info here. Broken up in a forum. There is just too much typing to get into it. I am not used to doing it like this. So I thought I have a video camera and a Youtube account. I can go at my speed explain so much more. I can show what I look at and really get this rolling. I will post the links to the Video's I do for this. If I had recorded my time with Gretchen last night you would all be floored at how accuate all of it was for her.

Remember I am just trying to show that Astrology is effecting all of us. It is doing it on a timed basis. I am just trying to show how those changes make us do things. Some of us act on them with great speed and some of us take our time. We are all so different. This is the fun of being human.

All of us are effected by the changes. I will attempt to show and explain the changes.

[yairhol]

I did two readings yesterday, one to my new neighbor across the street, the other to an old friends new girlfriend. I went over their adult lives and got it all correct. I just think I am having a hard time putting this info here. Broken up in a forum. There is just too much typing to get into it. I am not used to doing it like this. So I thought I have a video camera and a Youtube account. I can go at my speed explain so much more. I can show what I look at and really get this rolling. I will post the links to the Video's I do for this. If I had recorded my time with Gretchen last night you would all be floored at how accuate all of it was for her.

Remember I am just trying to show that Astrology is effecting all of us. It is doing it on a timed basis. I am just trying to show how those changes make us do things. Some of us act on them with great speed and some of us take our time. We are all so different. This is the fun of being human.

All of us are effected by the changes. I will attempt to show and explain the changes.

No, No, No!!11!!1

Don't explain anything...please.
Just state what you said you could do which is the married age of the participants.
No videos and no written explanations are necessary.
We don't care about Gretchen...at all...
Why is it so difficult for you to understand all of this?

[Garrette]

Astroman, if there is one person on this thread you should be reading and following the advice of, it is Piggy. He has explained very clearly several times what you should do to make this clear. The key is to write less but say more.

It's sort of fill in the blank, like this:

I am able to tell people-----------------------when I am provided with information regarding---------------------. I can do this in person/over the phone/via email. I can do it to an accuracy of-----------------greater than that expected by chance, and I can do it when things like cold reading are controlled for. I cannot do it when these things interfere:

That's it. All the rest is simply empty air.

[William Smith]

....
Remember I am just trying to show that Astrology is effecting all of us. It is doing it on a timed basis.
...

You cannot because it does not. (http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/astrology.html)

[Loss Leader]

If I had recorded my time with Gretchen last night you would all be floored at how accuate all of it was for her.


And if I had wings, I'd be the tooth fairy.

Mark - Every time you post, you get farther and farther from making predictions. You say you're having a hard time typing all the information but you haven't even tried. Tell us what you can about the people who have provided their birthdates. Or suggest a better test. Do nothing else.

[Kuko 4000]

astroman, it would be good if you proved your intelligence by reading the posts made by Piggy and Pixel42. Then responding to their points honestly and clearly. They've really helped you here.

Some people are starting to lose interest because you're derailing from the point. I hope you can prove us all wrong. All the best!

[astroman818]

AUGUST 2008

DATE SID.TIME SUN MOON MERCURY VENUS MARS JUPITER SATURN URANUS NEPTUNE PLUTO NODE
Fr 01 20:39:53 09LE07 03LE24 11LE33 23LE38 18VI26 14CP43 07VI44 22PI11 23AQ15 28SG52 19AQ04
Sa 02 20:43:50 10LE05 17LE43 13LE36 24LE52 19VI03 14CP37 07VI51 22PI10 23AQ13 28SG51 19AQ01
Su 03 20:47:47 11LE02 01VI44 15LE37 26LE05 19VI40 14CP31 07VI58 22PI08 23AQ11 28SG50 18AQ57
Mo 04 20:51:43 11LE60 15VI23 17LE38 27LE19 20VI18 14CP25 08VI05 22PI06 23AQ10 28SG49 18AQ54
Tu 05 20:55:40 12LE57 28VI39 19LE37 28LE33 20VI55 14CP19 08VI12 22PI05 23AQ08 28SG48 18AQ51
We 06 20:59:36 13LE55 11LI33 21LE35 29LE47 21VI33 14CP13 08VI20 22PI03 23AQ07 28SG47 18AQ48
Th 07 21:03:33 14LE52 24LI06 23LE31 01VI00 22VI10 14CP07 08VI27 22PI01 23AQ05 28SG46 18AQ45
Fr 08 21:07:29 15LE50 06SC23 25LE25 02VI14 22VI48 14CP02 08VI34 21PI59 23AQ03 28SG45 18AQ42
Sa 09 21:11:26 16LE47 18SC28 27LE18 03VI28 23VI25 13CP56 08VI41 21PI58 23AQ02 28SG44 18AQ38
Su 10 21:15:22 17LE45 00SG24 29LE10 04VI42 24VI03 13CP51 08VI48 21PI56 23AQ00 28SG43 18AQ35
Mo 11 21:19:19 18LE42 12SG17 01VI00 05VI55 24VI41 13CP46 08VI55 21PI54 22AQ58 28SG43 18AQ32
Tu 12 21:23:16 19LE40 24SG10 02VI49 07VI09 25VI18 13CP41 09VI03 21PI52 22AQ57 28SG42 18AQ29
We 13 21:27:12 20LE37 06CP08 04VI36 08VI23 25VI56 13CP36 09VI10 21PI50 22AQ55 28SG41 18AQ26
Th 14 21:31:09 21LE35 18CP15 06VI21 09VI36 26VI34 13CP31 09VI17 21PI48 22AQ54 28SG40 18AQ22
Fr 15 21:35:05 22LE33 00AQ32 08VI05 10VI50 27VI12 13CP27 09VI25 21PI46 22AQ52 28SG39 18AQ19
Sa 16 21:39:02 23LE30 13AQ03 09VI48 12VI04 27VI50 13CP23 09VI32 21PI44 22AQ50 28SG39 18AQ16
Su 17 21:42:58 24LE28 25AQ48 11VI29 13VI18 28VI28 13CP18 09VI39 21PI42 22AQ49 28SG38 18AQ13
Mo 18 21:46:55 25LE26 08PI49 13VI08 14VI31 29VI06 13CP14 09VI47 21PI40 22AQ47 28SG37 18AQ10
Tu 19 21:50:51 26LE23 22PI04 14VI47 15VI45 29VI44 13CP11 09VI54 21PI38 22AQ45 28SG37 18AQ07
We 20 21:54:48 27LE21 05AR32 16VI23 16VI59 00LI22 13CP07 10VI02 21PI36 22AQ44 28SG36 18AQ03
Th 21 21:58:45 28LE19 19AR14 17VI59 18VI12 01LI00 13CP03 10VI09 21PI34 22AQ42 28SG35 18AQ00
Fr 22 22:02:41 29LE17 03TA07 19VI33 19VI26 01LI39 13CP00 10VI17 21PI32 22AQ41 28SG35 17AQ57
Sa 23 22:06:38 00VI14 17TA08 21VI05 20VI40 02LI17 12CP57 10VI24 21PI29 22AQ39 28SG34 17AQ54
Su 24 22:10:34 01VI12 01GE17 22VI36 21VI53 02LI55 12CP54 10VI32 21PI27 22AQ37 28SG34 17AQ51
Mo 25 22:14:31 02VI10 15GE31 24VI06 23VI07 03LI34 12CP51 10VI39 21PI25 22AQ36 28SG33 17AQ48
Tu 26 22:18:27 03VI08 29GE48 25VI34 24VI20 04LI12 12CP49 10VI47 21PI23 22AQ34 28SG33 17AQ44
We 27 22:22:24 04VI06 14CN05 27VI01 25VI34 04LI51 12CP46 10VI54 21PI21 22AQ32 28SG32 17AQ41
Th 28 22:26:20 05VI04 28CN19 28VI26 26VI48 05LI29 12CP44 11VI02 21PI18 22AQ31 28SG32 17AQ38
Fr 29 22:30:17 06VI02 12LE25 29VI50 28VI01 06LI08 12CP42 11VI09 21PI16 22AQ29 28SG32 17AQ35
Sa 30 22:34:14 06VI60 26LE22 01LI12 29VI15 06LI46 12CP40 11VI17 21PI14 22AQ28 28SG31 17AQ32
Su 31 22:38:10 07VI58 10VI05 02LI33 00LI28 07LI25 12CP38 11VI24 21PI11 22AQ26 28SG31 17AQ28

[Garrette]

Got it. Astroman is either a troll or hopelessly deluded.

[yairhol]

AUGUST 2008

DATE SID.TIME SUN MOON MERCURY VENUS MARS JUPITER SATURN URANUS NEPTUNE PLUTO NODE
Fr 01 20:39:53 09LE07 03LE24 11LE33 23LE38 18VI26 14CP43 07VI44 22PI11 23AQ15 28SG52 19AQ04
Sa 02 20:43:50 10LE05 17LE43 13LE36 24LE52 19VI03 14CP37 07VI51 22PI10 23AQ13 28SG51 19AQ01
Su 03 20:47:47 11LE02 01VI44 15LE37 26LE05 19VI40 14CP31 07VI58 22PI08 23AQ11 28SG50 18AQ57
Mo 04 20:51:43 11LE60 15VI23 17LE38 27LE19 20VI18 14CP25 08VI05 22PI06 23AQ10 28SG49 18AQ54
Tu 05 20:55:40 12LE57 28VI39 19LE37 28LE33 20VI55 14CP19 08VI12 22PI05 23AQ08 28SG48 18AQ51
We 06 20:59:36 13LE55 11LI33 21LE35 29LE47 21VI33 14CP13 08VI20 22PI03 23AQ07 28SG47 18AQ48
Th 07 21:03:33 14LE52 24LI06 23LE31 01VI00 22VI10 14CP07 08VI27 22PI01 23AQ05 28SG46 18AQ45
Fr 08 21:07:29 15LE50 06SC23 25LE25 02VI14 22VI48 14CP02 08VI34 21PI59 23AQ03 28SG45 18AQ42
Sa 09 21:11:26 16LE47 18SC28 27LE18 03VI28 23VI25 13CP56 08VI41 21PI58 23AQ02 28SG44 18AQ38
Su 10 21:15:22 17LE45 00SG24 29LE10 04VI42 24VI03 13CP51 08VI48 21PI56 23AQ00 28SG43 18AQ35
Mo 11 21:19:19 18LE42 12SG17 01VI00 05VI55 24VI41 13CP46 08VI55 21PI54 22AQ58 28SG43 18AQ32
Tu 12 21:23:16 19LE40 24SG10 02VI49 07VI09 25VI18 13CP41 09VI03 21PI52 22AQ57 28SG42 18AQ29
We 13 21:27:12 20LE37 06CP08 04VI36 08VI23 25VI56 13CP36 09VI10 21PI50 22AQ55 28SG41 18AQ26
Th 14 21:31:09 21LE35 18CP15 06VI21 09VI36 26VI34 13CP31 09VI17 21PI48 22AQ54 28SG40 18AQ22
Fr 15 21:35:05 22LE33 00AQ32 08VI05 10VI50 27VI12 13CP27 09VI25 21PI46 22AQ52 28SG39 18AQ19
Sa 16 21:39:02 23LE30 13AQ03 09VI48 12VI04 27VI50 13CP23 09VI32 21PI44 22AQ50 28SG39 18AQ16
Su 17 21:42:58 24LE28 25AQ48 11VI29 13VI18 28VI28 13CP18 09VI39 21PI42 22AQ49 28SG38 18AQ13
Mo 18 21:46:55 25LE26 08PI49 13VI08 14VI31 29VI06 13CP14 09VI47 21PI40 22AQ47 28SG37 18AQ10
Tu 19 21:50:51 26LE23 22PI04 14VI47 15VI45 29VI44 13CP11 09VI54 21PI38 22AQ45 28SG37 18AQ07
We 20 21:54:48 27LE21 05AR32 16VI23 16VI59 00LI22 13CP07 10VI02 21PI36 22AQ44 28SG36 18AQ03
Th 21 21:58:45 28LE19 19AR14 17VI59 18VI12 01LI00 13CP03 10VI09 21PI34 22AQ42 28SG35 18AQ00
Fr 22 22:02:41 29LE17 03TA07 19VI33 19VI26 01LI39 13CP00 10VI17 21PI32 22AQ41 28SG35 17AQ57
Sa 23 22:06:38 00VI14 17TA08 21VI05 20VI40 02LI17 12CP57 10VI24 21PI29 22AQ39 28SG34 17AQ54
Su 24 22:10:34 01VI12 01GE17 22VI36 21VI53 02LI55 12CP54 10VI32 21PI27 22AQ37 28SG34 17AQ51
Mo 25 22:14:31 02VI10 15GE31 24VI06 23VI07 03LI34 12CP51 10VI39 21PI25 22AQ36 28SG33 17AQ48
Tu 26 22:18:27 03VI08 29GE48 25VI34 24VI20 04LI12 12CP49 10VI47 21PI23 22AQ34 28SG33 17AQ44
We 27 22:22:24 04VI06 14CN05 27VI01 25VI34 04LI51 12CP46 10VI54 21PI21 22AQ32 28SG32 17AQ41
Th 28 22:26:20 05VI04 28CN19 28VI26 26VI48 05LI29 12CP44 11VI02 21PI18 22AQ31 28SG32 17AQ38
Fr 29 22:30:17 06VI02 12LE25 29VI50 28VI01 06LI08 12CP42 11VI09 21PI16 22AQ29 28SG32 17AQ35
Sa 30 22:34:14 06VI60 26LE22 01LI12 29VI15 06LI46 12CP40 11VI17 21PI14 22AQ28 28SG31 17AQ32
Su 31 22:38:10 07VI58 10VI05 02LI33 00LI28 07LI25 12CP38 11VI24 21PI11 22AQ26 28SG31 17AQ28

As in "look at this people. 15 years of research and 60,000 readings. Impressive isn't it?"

[Hokulele]

If I had recorded my time with Gretchen last night you would all be floored at how accuate all of it was for her.


Or we could have assumed she was in collaboration with you.

Do you have any intention of predicting the age or month of marriage for the volunteers?

[Ladewig]

Got it. Astroman is either a troll or hopelessly deluded.

False dichotomy.

Astroman, please tell us what you can do. I mean what you can do besides string people along on the internet.

[jimtron]

Got it. Astroman is either a troll or hopelessly deluded.

No doubt.

[Hokulele]

As in "look at this people. 15 years of research and 60,000 readings. Impressive isn't it?"


As in, "I can copy and paste an ephemeris from an astronomy/astrology website."

[jimtron]

If I had recorded my time with Gretchen last night you would all be floored at how accuate all of it was for her.



I can't speak for everyone here, but I'm virtually certain that the vast majority of us would not be surprised if you could consistently give readings to people (believers in astrology) that seem impressively accurate to the person getting the reading. We don't doubt that. I believe you can give readings to people and that those people walk away believing that astrology works, and believing that you are a master astrologer. That's not in question. And it won't get you the million.

We know how to give readings that seem accurate too, using cold reading techniques, keeping things vague, etc. Since you've read the rules, you should know that you need a testable claim. Since we've asked you for that 1,000 times and you keep evading, we assume you're either toying with us, deluded, or avoiding the question because you don't have a testable claim.

Uri Geller made people believe he was bending spoons by the power of his mind. Millions did and still do believe this (less so these days). But he can't demonstrate that under test conditions, because he's doing a magic trick that anyone can do. Most of us here could give impressive astrology readings as well (at least, impressive to someone who believes in astrology). What none of us can do is prove that astrology really truly works, by predicting the future accurately and specifically, or in any other testable way. If we could, we'd get the million.

Let us know when you have a testable claim. Until then no one here is going to take you seriously, no matter how many explanations or anecdotal stories you give us.

[Pixel42]

If I had recorded my time with Gretchen last night you would all be floored at how accuate all of it was for her
Did you know that over 90% of people, given any horoscope whatsoever but believing it to be their personal horoscope, will rate it 4 or 5 out of 5 for accuracy? That's a reproducible result. So the fact that you can produce a horoscope for someone which they perceive as accurate is not in the least impressive. Everyone here knows enough about cold reading and subjective validation to realise that it proves nothing whatsoever. Everyone but you, apparently.

So are you going to make an attempt to predict the age at marriage of the 14 volunteers or not?

[GoodGuysEatPie]

What?

[wahrheit]

AUGUST 2008

DATE SID.TIME SUN MOON MERCURY VENUS MARS JUPITER SATURN URANUS NEPTUNE PLUTO NODE
Fr 01 20:39:53 09LE07 03LE24 11LE33 23LE38 18VI26 14CP43 07VI44 22PI11 23AQ15 28SG52 19AQ04
Sa 02 20:43:50 10LE05 17LE43 13LE36 24LE52 19VI03 14CP37 07VI51 22PI10 23AQ13 28SG51 19AQ01
Su 03 20:47:47 11LE02 01VI44 15LE37 26LE05 19VI40 14CP31 07VI58 22PI08 23AQ11 28SG50 18AQ57
Mo 04 20:51:43 11LE60 15VI23 17LE38 27LE19 20VI18 14CP25 08VI05 22PI06 23AQ10 28SG49 18AQ54
Tu 05 20:55:40 12LE57 28VI39 19LE37 28LE33 20VI55 14CP19 08VI12 22PI05 23AQ08 28SG48 18AQ51
We 06 20:59:36 13LE55 11LI33 21LE35 29LE47 21VI33 14CP13 08VI20 22PI03 23AQ07 28SG47 18AQ48
Th 07 21:03:33 14LE52 24LI06 23LE31 01VI00 22VI10 14CP07 08VI27 22PI01 23AQ05 28SG46 18AQ45
Fr 08 21:07:29 15LE50 06SC23 25LE25 02VI14 22VI48 14CP02 08VI34 21PI59 23AQ03 28SG45 18AQ42
Sa 09 21:11:26 16LE47 18SC28 27LE18 03VI28 23VI25 13CP56 08VI41 21PI58 23AQ02 28SG44 18AQ38
Su 10 21:15:22 17LE45 00SG24 29LE10 04VI42 24VI03 13CP51 08VI48 21PI56 23AQ00 28SG43 18AQ35
Mo 11 21:19:19 18LE42 12SG17 01VI00 05VI55 24VI41 13CP46 08VI55 21PI54 22AQ58 28SG43 18AQ32
Tu 12 21:23:16 19LE40 24SG10 02VI49 07VI09 25VI18 13CP41 09VI03 21PI52 22AQ57 28SG42 18AQ29
We 13 21:27:12 20LE37 06CP08 04VI36 08VI23 25VI56 13CP36 09VI10 21PI50 22AQ55 28SG41 18AQ26
Th 14 21:31:09 21LE35 18CP15 06VI21 09VI36 26VI34 13CP31 09VI17 21PI48 22AQ54 28SG40 18AQ22
Fr 15 21:35:05 22LE33 00AQ32 08VI05 10VI50 27VI12 13CP27 09VI25 21PI46 22AQ52 28SG39 18AQ19
Sa 16 21:39:02 23LE30 13AQ03 09VI48 12VI04 27VI50 13CP23 09VI32 21PI44 22AQ50 28SG39 18AQ16
Su 17 21:42:58 24LE28 25AQ48 11VI29 13VI18 28VI28 13CP18 09VI39 21PI42 22AQ49 28SG38 18AQ13
Mo 18 21:46:55 25LE26 08PI49 13VI08 14VI31 29VI06 13CP14 09VI47 21PI40 22AQ47 28SG37 18AQ10
Tu 19 21:50:51 26LE23 22PI04 14VI47 15VI45 29VI44 13CP11 09VI54 21PI38 22AQ45 28SG37 18AQ07
We 20 21:54:48 27LE21 05AR32 16VI23 16VI59 00LI22 13CP07 10VI02 21PI36 22AQ44 28SG36 18AQ03
Th 21 21:58:45 28LE19 19AR14 17VI59 18VI12 01LI00 13CP03 10VI09 21PI34 22AQ42 28SG35 18AQ00
Fr 22 22:02:41 29LE17 03TA07 19VI33 19VI26 01LI39 13CP00 10VI17 21PI32 22AQ41 28SG35 17AQ57
Sa 23 22:06:38 00VI14 17TA08 21VI05 20VI40 02LI17 12CP57 10VI24 21PI29 22AQ39 28SG34 17AQ54
Su 24 22:10:34 01VI12 01GE17 22VI36 21VI53 02LI55 12CP54 10VI32 21PI27 22AQ37 28SG34 17AQ51
Mo 25 22:14:31 02VI10 15GE31 24VI06 23VI07 03LI34 12CP51 10VI39 21PI25 22AQ36 28SG33 17AQ48
Tu 26 22:18:27 03VI08 29GE48 25VI34 24VI20 04LI12 12CP49 10VI47 21PI23 22AQ34 28SG33 17AQ44
We 27 22:22:24 04VI06 14CN05 27VI01 25VI34 04LI51 12CP46 10VI54 21PI21 22AQ32 28SG32 17AQ41
Th 28 22:26:20 05VI04 28CN19 28VI26 26VI48 05LI29 12CP44 11VI02 21PI18 22AQ31 28SG32 17AQ38
Fr 29 22:30:17 06VI02 12LE25 29VI50 28VI01 06LI08 12CP42 11VI09 21PI16 22AQ29 28SG32 17AQ35
Sa 30 22:34:14 06VI60 26LE22 01LI12 29VI15 06LI46 12CP40 11VI17 21PI14 22AQ28 28SG31 17AQ32
Su 31 22:38:10 07VI58 10VI05 02LI33 00LI28 07LI25 12CP38 11VI24 21PI11 22AQ26 28SG31 17AQ28

Wow, astroman, I'm mighty impressed with this crap. Thank you for stealing our time and pulling our legs.

kthxbye.

[Denver]

If you haven't come up with a testable protocol by the end of the second (50-post) page of this thread, previous experience tells me you never will.

Good call.

[astroman818]

This is the format of a standard Ephemeris It shows the movement of the planets in a Calender Month. It is what I read. A day equals a year and we always go forward. I am going to be taking each birthday and going forward with it. So if a person was born August 1 st 2008 the they are 5 years old on the 6 th. 1+5=6. 15 years old on the 16 th of August and so forth till death into the months forward.

If you are born on the 12 th then you just count from there. If you are 15 then 12 +15=27. So if you were born Aug 12 th 2008 then you are at 15 years old progressed to August 27 th. It is called a Progression.

(Day=Fr) Date=01 (Sidereal time=20:39:53) (Sun=09LE07) Moon=03LE24 Mercury=11LE33 Venus=23LE38 Mars=18VI26

These are the planets most used and this is the layout of how they are labeled. It is much harder to read it here. I just want everyone to have a chance to see what I read. I burn through this information, practice lots of practice. I know what I am looking for and right where it is.

There are only five things that change fast. The outer planets Jupiter and on change slowly.

What I am saying is that these five planets constantly changing as we progress, effect our lives and our decisions. The moon changes Zodiac Sign every two days. It actually ends up 27 months on average in every persons life. In the Ephemeris Page I posted above you can see the moon column change signs as you go down every two days. I am going to apply this to all the birthdays. The moon has the greatest effect on our lives because of this. In the Moon changes comes the relationship changes. We often date people who match to the current sign we are going through at that age. If we are in Taurus moon the we would date a Taurus, Scorpio the six month opposite, or another Earth sign like Capricorn or Virgo. Also Because it is a fixed sign the other fixed signs like Aquarius or Leo. But much more likely a Taurus or a Scorpio. We are trying to find a connection. When we feel one we stay, if not we move on. Many people date a new person every 27 months. Some of us can't do more than two weeks, that is just because of who they are. Some marry their High School Sweet heart and last 60 years together.

This is a very complex thing that is why you haven't heard about any of this before. I have a friend Peter that runs a famous web site called the Magi Society He wrote a book called

Astrology Really Works

It is out of print last I knew. His attempt to prove it was a failure at proving anything. It has taken me time to practice and learn more so I don't repeat the mistake he made. It is important to know the science behind what I am doing. I know this is a very public place so give me a chance to explain some before we get rolling here.

[jimtron]

Ok, Now I'm Convinced! Thanks Astroman. YOU'RE RIGHT, WE'RE WRONG!

Now There's No Need For Anyone To Post Anymore To This Thread!!!!!!!!


Million Dollar Check Is In The Mail!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


It's True!!!!!!!!!!!!

I know this is a very public place so give me a chance to explain some before we get rolling here.
On page 6. You're a comedian!

[astroman818]

Don't run away to fast or judge what you are seeing till I have presented everything. Be like a jury of twelve. Make your decision when you have heard all the testimony. Am I the only one born in the United States and has got past the fifth grade level in school people. It is not a fast thing to do and I am in no way waisting your time maybe you are waisting mine and others that have to read your prejudices.

[William Smith]

I'm setting the over/under for pages of this thread at 15.5 - and I am picking the over.

[Hokulele]

It is important to know the science behind what I am doing.


Judging by your posting history thus far, you aren't doing anything.

[jimtron]

Am I the only one born in the United States and has got past the fifth grade level in school people.Yes. What's "school people?" At what grade do they teach that questions get question marks?


Ahh, irony, how I love thee.

[Pixel42]

It is important to know the science behind what I am doing.
No it isn't. How many times do you need to be told this, by how many people?

If you succeed in demonstrating that what you are doing works, then we will be interested in how you did it. Not before. So don't waste your apparently limited time explaining it, just do it.

[Loss Leader]

Be like a jury of twelve.


Ah, finally something I understand.

OK, Astroman, playing by your rules:

The question at bar is: In properly controled conditions, can Astroman make predictions that are significantly more accurate than chance?

Everything that you say which does not answer this question is irrelevant. Thus, except for your first one or two posts, everything you have said so far is irrelevant.

None of the information about how you make your predictions or what ephemera charts look like answers that question. None of it makes it more or less likely that you can make accurate predictions.

It is as if I asked a witness if she saw the defendant's car and she answered me with a lecture about the workings of the optic nerve. It doesn't matter how she saw the car, only that she saw it.

Your last forty posts are excluded and stricken from the record. They carry no weight whatsoever in any deliberation. They do not answer the question.

Now, as you indicate you would like to do, post some evidence. Otherwise, the court will be forced to direct a verdict.

[Hokulele]

This is the format of a standard Ephemeris It shows the movement of the planets in a Calender Month. It is what I read. A day equals a year and we always go forward. I am going to be taking each birthday and going forward with it. So if a person was born August 1 st 2008 the they are 5 years old on the 6 th. 1+5=6. 15 years old on the 16 th of August and so forth till death into the months forward.

If you are born on the 12 th then you just count from there. If you are 15 then 12 +15=27. So if you were born Aug 12 th 2008 then you are at 15 years old progressed to August 27 th. It is called a Progression.


Waiter, there is a numerologist in my astrology.

[Piggy]

Sorry for not being on here tonight I will get to all the birthdays as soon as I can I have a very busy life. I haven't really read all the posts. I do want to thank many of you for showing interest in what I have to say.

Btw, I can't recall, do we have a control?

If not, I'd be happy to take those dates and use a sham method -- say, rolling dice or drawing cards -- to determine marriage years within whatever range astroman defines (e.g., how many years are allowed in one answer).

Then we can see if the sham method does significantly better or worse than astrology.

[Piggy]

Already arranged. In fact, one of two volunteers has already sent me his own guesses. But you're welcome to do so too. We will then have the average accuracy of three random guessers to compare with the accuracy of astroman's calculations. Assuming he ever does them, of course.

Oops, should have read the most recent posts before posting. Sorry. :blush:

[Piggy]

Astrology Really Works

Then why can't/don't you apply it here and make it work?

If I claim my coffee maker works, all I have to do is plug it in and make some coffee to show that.

If I simply go on and on about what a great cup of coffee it made this morning, that proves nothing.

It also proves nothing if I go in the next room and bring out a cup of coffee, because that could be done without using my coffee maker.

And it proves nothing if I show you the owner's manual.

But you are doing all these things:

1. Telling us about readings you've done (tales of this morning's coffee)

2. Asking to perform a free-form session (coffee from the next room, since that can be done with cold reading so we can't tell if you're really applying astrology or not)

3. Ephemeris (owner's manual)

We have to see you make coffee with the coffee maker.

We have to see you get an answer in a way that precludes cold reading, hot reading, etc.

We've even explained how it can be done.

Please cooperate.

[Piggy]

Don't run away to fast or judge what you are seeing till I have presented everything. Be like a jury of twelve. Make your decision when you have heard all the testimony. Am I the only one born in the United States and has got past the fifth grade level in school people. It is not a fast thing to do and I am in no way waisting your time maybe you are waisting mine and others that have to read your prejudices.

Run away from what?

Several of us have been very helpful and cooperative, and you have refused to cooperate with us to test your abilities.

If I were on that jury, I'd have no trouble returning a verdict of "Bogus in the 1st degree".

There's nothing more to explain.

When you get around to making your decisions regarding the marriage years, then we'll move on.

Until then, it's all sound and fury, signifying nothing.

(That's Shakespeare -- we read him in the 4th grade, right before I dropped out of school.)

[Ixion]

This is a very complex thing that is why you haven't heard about any of this before. I have a friend Peter that runs a famous web site called the Magi Society He wrote a book called

Astrology Really Works


This is the website he is referring to: http://www.magisociety.com/

It is full enough of astrology, with a smattering of scripture for good measure, to keep you laughing entertained for a while.

[Nursefoxfire]

This is the website he is referring to: http://www.magisociety.com/

It is full enough of astrology, with a smattering of scripture for good measure, to keep you laughing entertained for a while.

Oh. My. Goodness.

From the section entitled: "The astrological reasons for the tragic crash of John Kennedy, Jr.'s plane." (http://www.magisociety.com/crash.html)

Such events are avoidable. If Kennedy understood Magi Astrology, he could have chosen to not fly that night. Instead, he chose to fly at a time when an accident was most likely. The key was in the declinations. Had he refrained from flying, he would be alive today.


Silly me. As a pilot, I always assumed he crashed due to spatial disorientation by flying VFR into IFR conditions (thick haze, dark night). Little did I know. Someone should notify the NTSB, their crash analysis was totally wrong!

[Nursefoxfire]

By the way, I have to applaud all the rest of you posting on this thread for actually attempting to set up a verifiable challenge for this guy, and meeting his rantings with serious discourse.

I sniffed out that he was a sad, lonely troll from the moment I read his Myspace page. And all his pleas to get people to call him echoes eerily from this thread and his Myspace blog. I also noticed that most of his anecdotes about readings he's done are for women. My guess is these are mainly in his imagination.

I have no patience for sifting through such dross to attempt to find the gold nugget, but almost every poster here deserves a medal for putting up with this.

[ZeroAltitude]

Well, I sent in my predictions on the marriage ages.

Even if I'm not used as a control, I'd like to know how I did.

[ObscureReferenceMan]

astroman,

I am quite interested in this thread. It's been a very educational read so far.

But I must say, I think you are being a little harsh on the forum memebrs here. I don't think people are "bagging" on you. Almost everyone has been helpful, most have been polite. Some have even gone above and beyond (I'm look at you, Piggy!). Also, understand, this is a skeptic's forum. We tend to require evidence before we will believe something. Your claims ("It works!", "I've spent years studying it!", etc.), no matter how enthusiastic, won't sway us. To reiterate what others have said, don't bother us with how it works, or anecdotes. What we want to know is; what do you claim to do? And with what accuracy? Please be clear and specific. Thanks!

One question of my own, though... And you don't have to answer right away, but whenever you have the time. Are you familiar with the following terms?
The Forer Effect (http://www.skepdic.com/forer.html)
Cold Reading (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_reading)
Confirmation Bias (http://www.sciencedaily.com/articles/c/confirmation_bias.htm)
Thanks, again! I look forward to your response (again, no rush - take your time).

[Skeptic Guy]

Waiter, there is a numerologist in my astrology.

Shhh, be quiet or everyone will want one.

[Piggy]

By the way, I have to applaud all the rest of you posting on this thread for actually attempting to set up a verifiable challenge for this guy, and meeting his rantings with serious discourse.

Well, everyone deserves a hearing.

I'd hate for someone to be able to walk away and legitimately say that they got stiffed.

Of course, you can't stop folks from saying that anyway, but at least if they do, anyone who cares to do so can come check here and see that they actually had every opportunity to prove themselves, and even had people willing to help them.

All we can do is keep our end of the bargain.

[yairhol]

Good morning everybody.
Just woke up.
*looks around*...*nothing new*...
I'll come back later.