Christian Magicians

[grayman]

The latest issue of Mother Jones has an article about Magicians teaching the Gospel.

An excerpt:

Laflin agrees that the Bible forbids magic, but says it's a "terminology thing." "The magic that it's speaking of is trying to speak to the dead or cast spells on people," he explains. "What I do is sleight of hand. It's literally optical illusion. It's not what the Bible forbids at all." Gospel magicians regularly assure their audiences that they don't possess real mystical powers. ("I do tricks, just tricks," Laflin tells his audience. "But the power of God is real and wonderful.") Some have eliminated the word "magic" altogether, referring to themselves instead as "gospel illusionists."

As to whether or not Jesus was a magician:

The fellowship's Christian Conjurer magazine recently ran a cover article titled "Jesus—Magician or God?"

That's a trick question, of course. For some gospel magicians, the very fact that their powers aren't supernatural is proof that the biblical miracles were real. "I carry tons of equipment in order to do my shows," says André Kole, a famed magician who consults for David Copperfield and has mastered an illusion where he appears to walk on water. "If Jesus was a magician, you'd have to visualize 2,000 years ago Jesus and the disciples walking through the dusty streets of Galilee wearing sandals, with three diesel trucks behind them carrying all their equipment."


To read more, here's the link (http://www.motherjones.com/commentary/columns/2008/09/witness-do-you-believe-in-magic.html).

[Bob Klase]

I've met Laflin and seen him lecture several times at conventions. He saves the religion stuff for audiences that want it. He also manufacturers and sells magic. Some of it is gospel magic and of course he will demonstrate and sell it even when it's not a gospel magic group of magicians. But he's not heavy handed and he doesn't push the religion in those cases.

I'd have to agree with him (and many other gospel magicians). I don't think any intelligent reading of the bible prohibits tricks for entertainment or education. It prohibits the real thing- so if we ever find anyone doing the real thing then we should stone them or something.

For some gospel magicians, the very fact that their powers aren't supernatural is proof that the biblical miracles were real.

And the fact that computers exist is proof that Jesus used a Mac? How about the fact that many people convince other people that their powers are real? I think that's more than proof that people writing the bible could have been convinced they were seeing real magic when they were just seeing the beta versions of Sylvia Brown or Benny Hinn.

"I carry tons of equipment in order to do my shows," says André Kole, a famed magician who consults for David Copperfield and has mastered an illusion where he appears to walk on water. "If Jesus was a magician, you'd have to visualize 2,000 years ago Jesus and the disciples walking through the dusty streets of Galilee wearing sandals, with three diesel trucks behind them carrying all their equipment."

I also like André and have also seen him more than once. I really respect the fact that in his shows (at least the ones I've seen), the majority of the show is not religion oriented (nor even religious in tone). He saves the preachin' for the end of the show and before it starts he makes it clear that the next part of the show is gospel magic and you have plenty of opportunity to leave if you don't want to stay for it.

On the other hand, when he makes statements like the one above (and I saw him say that on a TV show a couple years ago) it really makes you wonder how someone as intelligent about magic as he is can really swallow that thought. It made me want to scream "Maybe Jesus was just a better magician than you and had better trick methods?" or "Surely you've heard people talking about your show after seeing it and heard them describe miracles that you wish you could do".

[Sherman Bay]

Maybe Jesus just did card tricks and wasn't a David Copperfield.

[Wolfman]

I come from a very conservative Christian background that taught that all such performances were sinful (and in some cases, demonic). It often had little to do with Biblical proscriptions against magic. Some of the arguments used:

* Magic/Illusion by its very nature employs deception to accomplish its goals. Intentionally deceiving people is synonymous with lying, and is a sin.

* Magic/Illusion accomplished by non-supernatural means causes people to believe that all magic is 'just a trick', and is a tool used by Satan to lull people into complacency, not realizing that there are people who do have supernatural powers.

* Many of the things done by these performers, who claim that it is just a simple tricky, are actually done using supernatural powers. Again, this is a deception used by Satan to dupe us, so that we will not believe in him or his powers.

Please note, I do not believe any of these things (although, sadly, I once did). But my parents do. They once watched about 10 minutes of a Derren Brown performance (and Derren actively denies any sort of supernatural powers), and declared that what he did could only be accomplished by means of demonic powers, and promptly stopped watching him (and then did brief prayers over each other to protect them from any inadvertent demonic exposure they may have suffered).

[XBoxWarrior]

Jesus, (pronounced; Hay Zeus) was by far the best magician of his day...

I once hired that dude back in '84 in Los Angeles to work for my landscape
company. He had lost most of his magic tricks over the years....but he
could use a leafblower like Chopin...

I will always remeber that dude.

[this charming man]

I wonder if the Kingdom Klowns, whom appear at a local Chic-Fil-A, do magic...

[ChrisH]

Then there's this bloke, who juggles for Jesus...""Beanbags and bouncy balls are juggled to illustrate how the Resurrection makes Jesus very different from every other religious leader throughout history. (Acts 2:31; 1 Cor. 15:14)" - that's just one of the items in David Cain's repertoire, described on his web here (http://www.christianjuggler.com/routines.htm)

What a tosser...

[this charming man]

There are lots of resurrection stories:
Osiris, Tammuz, Attis, Mithra etc...

Egyptian, Babylonian, etc...

If I recall correctly, Odin, the Norse god, died voluntarily and resurrected. Sounds familiar....

[Bob Klase]

There are lots of resurrection stories:
Osiris, Tammuz, Attis, Mithra etc...

Egyptian, Babylonian, etc...

Sure, but did they juggle?

[Bikewer]

Along the same lines, we have groups of "Christian Martial Artists" (a sort of oxymoron to my mind), large and muscular fellows who perform a variety of cheesy breaking tricks and strongman stunts, all the while invoking the "power of Jesus".

I wonder what Jeebus would think of steroids.....

[Ryan O'Dine]

The official list of Christians Who are Trying Too Hard, in order of increasing scariness...

1. Christian Jugglers, Magicians, Balloon Folding Artists, Other Carny Types
2. Christian Rockers
3. Athletes for Jesus
4. Christian Clowns
5. Televangelists
6. Scarier Christian Clowns
7. Right-Wing-Nutbar-Jesus Senators/Congressfolk
8. Even Scarier Christian Clowns
9. Westboro Church

[Wides]

along The Same Lines, We Have Groups Of "christian Martial Artists" (a Sort Of Oxymoron To My Mind), Large And Muscular Fellows Who Perform A Variety Of Cheesy Breaking Tricks And Strongman Stunts, All The While Invoking The "power Of Jesus".

I Wonder What Jeebus Would Think Of Steroids.....

The Power Jesus Kept Me From Dying, While Two Guys Smash A Block Of Ice On My Chest With Sledge Hammers!!! Whooo Hooo Praise The Lord!

[Beerina]

The fellowship's Christian Conjurer magazine recently ran a cover article titled "Jesus—Magician or God?"

That's a trick question, of course. For some gospel magicians, the very fact that their powers aren't supernatural is proof that the biblical miracles were real.


And the very fact that this guy (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6bu9csQC45c) works out like hell to become the strongest guy on Earth and that his muscles are real is proof that the Action Comics miracles by Superman were real.