Skeptic I Told You So Foundation

[uneasy]

When I'm in an angry mood, I think about forming The Skeptic I Told You So Foundation.

I'm not one that likes to argue with wackos or find ways of proving they are wrong or right or deluded. I just think, "So?" None of their claims actually mean anything, but people get bogged down arguing about mechanisms and terminology without looking at the big picture. The big picture is always that their powers have zero impact on anything. All the "powers" accomplish is to make some guys fall down on a beach somewhere or have a dead grandma say she loves us. It has no lasting positive effect on anything, so it is meaningless.

This was a point that Mr. Randi's made at the end of his Nova special. Science has a proven record of improving human life for thousands of years, but claims of supernatual powers have no lasting effect, even though they have been made for thousands of years.

The Skeptic I Told You So Foundation wouldn't get into arguments, but would just send out a letter something like this.

"You claim you can make toothpicks move around with your mind. If this is true, this is an astounding discovery that will open whole new fields of research and lead to the transformation of society as we know it. People have been making fantastic claims for thousands of years, and yet all those claims have done nothing but generate some temporary excitement. They and their powers are forgotten. You will have the same effect on the world with your claim. You will accomplish nothing. When you are older, you will be visited by someone who will remind you of your claim to move toothpicks around in 2003. They will remind you that your extraordinary claim has had no extraordinarily positive impact on the world."

Youngest members of the Foundation will be given the names of "claimants". Their job is to wait 20 years or so, depending on the claimants age, and then visit them before they die to remind them that they have accomplished nothing. For example, people who claimed they could dowse for gold will be asked why they are living in a dingy nursing home and not in a mansion with private nurses.

Sorry, I know it's a vicious idea.

[renata]

:D

I understand...Sometimes I want to get a scorecard that shows results that paranormal claims contributed to the world, and scientific research contributed to the world. One still shows the smae Middle Ages shtick, the other allows tremendous leaps in every field, things that almost nobody could predict or imagine years ago. So I sympathize entirely.

[geni]

What do you do when you find that they hace perswaded 1000s of people to belive them qnd have stared their own religion based on toothpicks?

[thaiboxerken]

I would definitely support a foundation like that.

[Barkhorn1x]

...here are two from last week;

Ah, the case of the “Blindfolded” Russian girl. She could read the NYT, a book, or tell what color paper you were holding up – just as long as these were only about 6 inches away and at an angle.

This one gets to what, to me, is the heart of the matter when it comes to paranormal abilities – what practical use do these abilities have? The answer is – to date – ZERO!!! (unless you count the fleecing of the credulous).

These “abilities” have existed for thousands of years, right? But none of the practitioners seem to get past a very “basic” level – one would expect a “Super User” or two by now.

and,

Why aren't these people helping us find serial killers - and actually doing it!?! Why aren't these people fabulously wealthy and on the cover of Time and Newsweek? Why aren't these people helping us to unravel the mysteries of the ages? Prevent acts of terrorism? Warn us - accurately - of coming natural disasters?

Why indeed???

My pointless point, you credulous twit, is that instead of reeling off 195 specific facts the best these people can do - in a controlled environment - is itell a friggin' star from a box or a wavy line within 0.0001% of random chance. This FACT renders their "astounding" gift pretty much worthless to anyone who can think rationally.

And, you know, a woo woo will never respond to these comments. To do so would force them to think a bit too much about the absurdity of their beliefs.

Barkhorn.

[Yahweh]

With the formation Skeptic "I told you so" Foundation, I'd also like to see a calendar, and maybe one of those desktop "quote a day" whatsits filled with hilariously insane quotes (try to think Jack Chick's "Evolution is the religion of scientists who LAUGH at God!").

[sophia8]

Another group of people that could be visited in 20 years time are the Free Energy lot, the ones who claim they have a machine in their basement that will run forever on no energy input. They could be asked why they are still paying electricity bills, perhaps.

[Ed]

We could just use my time machine to zip into the future. That way we could have immediate gratification.

[thaiboxerken]

Ahh.. I only wish that particular future was now.

Hey all, please vote in my Flame War poll.

[Vitnir]

My gutt response to whacky beliefs are less sophisticated.

[[Image removed because it was on a secure server and was causing a Security Certificate Warning for some people. Here's the link to the image:

https://infoweb.unit.liu.se/hu/imk/an/arkiv/dilbert_demons.gif ~ Diezel]

So far I have restrained myself but my magic wand is ready just incase ...

[T'ai Chi]

Little old me, being the live human being who evolved over millions and millions of years from non-life somehow, is going to sit in my chair, that is almost entirely composed of empty space, whose elements' positions we can't predict exactly, in this 11 dimensional universe (which we can't test for) with parallel universes that somehow magically started from nothing, and laugh at those with the wacky beliefs!

:arrow:

[Marc]

Hey, here is one for the "I Told You So" Foundation.

I had posted my first draft of a review of Gary Schwartz's book on the FACTS board. Someone wrote to him which started an interesting e-mail exchange. Still have some of the messages.

On Tuesday, March 14, 2000 I made this statement:

> My prediction is your work will not see much, if any, acceptance outside of
> fringe scientists and followers of various paranormal beliefs.

Well Gary, I told you so! :p :D

[Diezel]

Vitnr:

I have removed your image from your post. For whatever reason, the image you linked to was trying to pull up a security certificate from anyone that opened this thread. I'm not sure why it was doing this, but it was making some people uneasy. You may insert another image if you would like, one that doesn't pull up a security certificate.

[xouper]

Diezel: Vitnr: I have removed your image from your post. For whatever reason, the image you linked to was trying to pull up a security certificate from anyone that opened this thread. I'm not sure why it was doing this, but it was making some people uneasy. You may insert another image if you would like, one that doesn't pull up a security certificate.The reason for the certificate notice is because the image was on a secure server. I posted about this last night in another thread

http://www.randi.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=29819

There was nothing to worry about. For those who still want to see the image, I posted the link to it in that other thread.

[Diezel]

Originally posted by xouper
The reason for the certificate notice is because the image was on a secure server. I posted about this last night in another thread

http://www.randi.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=29819

There was nothing to worry about. For those who still want to see the image, I posted the link to it in that other thread.

Thanks for clearing that up. And thanks for reposting the image. I was almost positive it was innocent, but with my limited knowledge, I couldn't be sure. :o

[Splurge]

Originally posted by uneasy

snip

All the "powers" accomplish is to make some guys fall down on a beach somewhere or have a dead grandma say she loves us. It has no lasting positive effect on anything, so it is meaningless.

snip



I agree that the supposedly-psychic powers currently demonstrated have little benefit to the world in general. However, consider the following possibility:

IF a truly psychic phenomenon could be demonstrated, perhaps it could be analysed scientifically?

IF it could be analysed, perhaps the mechanism by which it works could be understood?

IF the mechanism could be understood, perhaps it could be replicated?

IF it could be replicated, perhaps it could be improved?

This process, iterated sufficiently, could perhaps yield psychic abilities that would actually have some major use - for example, levitate a brick today, build a bridge with the power of your mind next week.

I grant that these are all very unlikely "IF"s.

[xouper]

Diezel: Thanks for clearing that up. And thanks for reposting the image. I was almost positive it was innocent, but with my limited knowledge, I couldn't be sure. :o I forgot to add - in Vitnir's defense, he probably had no idea anyone else would be seeing the certificate alert, since he would have already accepted the certificate (probably some time ago). Once you do that, your browser remembers and doesn't ask again.

[Diezel]

Originally posted by xouper
I forgot to add - in Vitnir's defense, he probably had no idea anyone else would be seeing the certificate alert, since he would have already accepted the certificate (probably some time ago). Once you do that, your browser remembers and doesn't ask again.

Thank you for the suggestion. I have changed the text of my edit and included the link.

The text in my edit was my failed attempt at stating that Vitnr did not break the rules, but I need to edit for formatting/forum reasons instead. I guess "corrupt data" was not a good choice of words.

For the record, I never believed Vitnr had any ill intent when posting this link and knew it was just one of those things that happens. I apologize if to Vitnr greatly, if he or others felt I represented this as something he did wrong.

[Vitnir]

:brk:

Yeah, I should have known, sorry.

It was Dogbert waving a magic wand saying "Out out you demons of stupidity"

Maybe it works on me too, I'l have to try later. I bought it from a mysterious man for a large sum of money.

[Yahzi]

I had much the same feeling after watching Andy Vile debate Dr. Rhelman.

At dinner after the debate, I wound up discussing it with a couple at the next table who were very pro-Andy. The woman described him as a path-finder.

I pointed out that, unlike real path-finders, he didn't leave a trail. He never proved anything false. So the next person has to do everything all over again, because the Alternative medicine people never rule out anything.

How is it trail-blazing when the vegetation springs up behind you as fast as you walk?