Another Innocent Victim of the Drug War

[subgenius]

Teen shot by DEA agents dies in hospital
Associated Press
SAN ANTONIO -- A teenage girl, shot and killed by federal drug agents, was a victim of excessive force from law officers who were investigating her father, relatives and friends say.

Ashley Villarreal, 14, died on Tuesday evening after family members requested that she be taken off life support at Wilford Hall Medical Center.

A friend challenged Drug Enforcement Administration officials' account of how agents on Sunday had shot the daughter of Joey Angel Villarreal, a three-time convicted drug offender who turned himself in and was charged with cocaine trafficking a day after the shooting.

Ashley Villarreal had been hospitalized in critical condition since being shot once in the back of the head.

One of the agents at a drug stakeout in plain clothes and unmarked vehicles were watching a house on the city's west side where they believed a suspect was hiding when they saw a man get into the passenger side of a car, San Antonio police Sgt. Gabe Trevino said.

"A girl got into the driver's side of the vehicle, and when they started leaving without the headlights on, and at a high rate of speed, the agents felt certain that this was their suspect and he was trying to escape," Trevino said after the shooting.

When agents boxed the car in and attempted to arrest the man, they said the girl who was driving the car continued toward them and slammed into their vehicle, then shifted into reverse and rammed the DEA vehicle behind her. Agents fired at least four times, and the girl was struck in the head.

Trevino said the man was not the drug suspect agents were seeking, but he was booked into jail on a charge of public intoxication.

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/story.hts/metropolitan/1775795

[fishbob]

A girl got into the driver's side of the vehicle, and when they started leaving without the headlights on, and at a high rate of speed, the agents felt certain that this was their suspect and he was trying to escape," Trevino said after the shooting. When agents boxed the car in and attempted to arrest the man, they said the girl who was driving the car continued toward them and slammed into their vehicle, then shifted into reverse and rammed the DEA vehicle behind her. Agents fired at least four times, and the girl was struck in the head. Trevino said the man was not the drug suspect agents were seeking, but he was booked into jail on a charge of public intoxication.

I am not sure the war on drugs is the cause of this one. It looks more like stupidity and bad judgement by most of the people involved.

[Reginald]

Always tragic.

But I suppose had her father just been a plain law abiding joe then none of the cirumstances that lead to this would have happened.

:(

[kittynh]

Where I grew up you learned early COPS=FREEZE

It was always the kids from the burbs who got in trouble.

I was a very good kid, so were my brothers, but the number of times they were pulled over! My little brother has the total heavy metal look, he could "assume the position" and frequently did. There was never anything to find, and actually once the cops got to know us we were safe until somebody new was assigned to the area. I really hate movies where the inner city kids give the cops lip. It just didn't happen, unless you were totally stoned (which we never were...)

[shemp]

Originally posted by fishbob


I am not sure the war on drugs is the cause of this one. It looks more like stupidity and bad judgement by most of the people involved.

This, of course, presumes that the police are telling the truth, which cannot be taken for granted nowadays.

[subgenius]

Originally posted by Reginald
Always tragic.

But I suppose had her father just been a plain law abiding joe then none of the cirumstances that lead to this would have happened.

:(
And if Adam hadn't met Eve......
a 14 year old is dead.
Who had the last clear chance to not kill her?

[OdderMensch]

Did the full article mention if they were in uniforms? <checks> No, in fact the eyewitness claims they did not ID themselves till after shooting.

"if you have more laws, then you will have more crimes."

It is sad that we have to place our officers in situations like this :( tragic all around really, I bet the guy that shoot feels like ****.

But I suppose had her father just been a plain law abiding joe then none of the cirumstances that lead to this would have happened.

Um, no. For example, Snipers shot a goat herder in the back on the Texas/Mexico border a few years back, the childs parents were plain, hard working folks.

While this paticular death MAY NOT have happened, the agents might have had the wrong house, or the wrong person, ect.

[subgenius]

OdderMensch:
"I bet the guy that shoot (sic) feels like ****."
_______________
No doubt.
He is also a victim in this senseless "war."

[Reginald]

Originally posted by subgenius

And if Adam hadn't met Eve......
a 14 year old is dead.
Who had the last clear chance to not kill her?

Her fathers actions were criminal. Theres a difference. Thats why I said it was tragic. The girl was completely innocent and died, yes the people who put bullets into her killed her. No dispute there.

There is a difference between a random chain of events leading to a thing like this and a set that came into exsistance because the father decided to deal drugs. The father made a choice (and there are far more obvious dangers to kids than being shot if thier parents are dealers) irrespective of his reponsibilities as a parent.

Its terrible that his daughter died.

And before it is said, No I dont think that it serves anyone right, and no I dont think that the penalty for dealing drugs should be the loss of a child.

[subgenius]

Certainly the father has responsibility in this situation. You are correct.

[Ladewig]

Was the 14-year-old girl who was shot the driver of the car? Are 14-year-olds allowed to drive in Texas?

[subgenius]

Originally posted by Ladewig
Was the 14-year-old girl who was shot the driver of the car? Are 14-year-olds allowed to drive in Texas?
No. And apparently its a capital offense.

[Dustin Kesselberg]

Another victim of the war on drugs...

The Human Costs of Drug Testing
Thursday, April 14, 2005


Drug testing is humiliating, costly and ineffective. Lori Brown of Texas knows this better than most—her son was wronged by his school’s random drug testing program. Seventeen-year-old Mike, an upstanding senior at Shallowater High School near Lubbock Texas, had been on a number of medications for allergies as well as some antibiotics—one of which his doctor later confirmed could cause a false positive for cocaine—when his school randomly tested him. The school failed to properly follow their own policies by neglecting to ask Mike to list the medications he was on. To make matters worse, South Plains Compliance, the drug testing company hired by the school to administer the tests, maintained that their procedures were 100% accurate despite the extenuating circumstances.

Like any concerned mother would, Lori had Mike tested several times by their own physician for her own peace of mind. Each test confirmed what she already knew; Mike was not using cocaine. And like any good mother would, Lori stood in her son’s defense, trying to explain to the school what she’d learned from Mike’s doctor. But they refused to listen. For the next six months Mike was mysteriously “randomly” picked for testing several times and Mike, whose focus should have been on graduating, began to feel harassed and stigmatized.

“In my opinion, schools are using the [drug] testing program as a tool to police students, when they should be concentrating on education,” Lori says.

The straw that broke the camel’s back came when a South Plains Compliance representative yelled at Mike for not producing enough urine for his sixth test. Lori and Mike had reached their emotional limit and decided to remove Mike from the drug testing program. The consequences: Mike could no longer participate in extracurricular activities.

Drug testing has recently always been an easy anti-drug sound bite for the White House. But stories like Lori’s cannot be ignored. Their experience is a prime example of how student testing breaks the trust between young people and adults and drives students away from the extracurricular activities that keep kids out of trouble. Their story also illustrates the way in which drug testing undermines parental authority. And to top it off, studies have shown that student drug testing doesn't even work to deter drug use. The bottom line is that the price of using “scare tactics” to discourage drug use in students is costly—emotionally and fiscally—and counterproductive.


http://www.drugpolicy.org/news/041405loribrown.cfm


Despite this and other mounting evidence against drug testing, drug czar John Walters of the Office of National Drug Control Policy (ONDCP) thinks otherwise. He’s traveling around the country on a taxpayer-funded drug war tour to promote student drug testing as the “silver bullet” to adolescent drug use.

The Alliance is encouraging people in Pennsylvania, Missouri, Oregon and Texas—where the summits are being hosted—to attend the summits to voice their opposition to drug testing in schools. The meetings present a perfect opportunity for the media, educators, parents, and John Walters himself to hear firsthand that the public does not endorse this flawed method of deterring students from drug use.

To coordinate and organize these efforts, the Alliance has set up an online meet-up tool, where individuals can link up with others in their city to develop a game plan to fight drug testing. The Alliance’s website also contains information on the many creative ways to educate the public about the harms of student drug testing. Check out the online toolkit to download images to use as posters, for tips on asking tough questions, and for ideas on using props such as home drug testing kits to illustrate that drug testing should remain in the hands of the parent.

It has been a long and stressful battle for Mike and his mother, but Lori is determined to speak out against the student drug testing program. Now is the time to stand in solidarity with her and the other parents and students who have been collateral damage in the “war on drugs.” Now is the time to speak out with Lori, who says she is sharing her story with the hope that parents across the country will not support student drug testing and protect their child and other children from this outrageous violation.

To learn more about drug testing, visit www.drugtestingfails.org.

[Skeptic]

I dunno about you, but I feel much more concerned about the vast number of unpunished drug dealers, thugs, rapists, and murderers than about the far smaller number of innocents punished.

The whole thing smacks of self-righteousness: "Look at me! I CARE about police brutality!"--as if it was that, and not the criminals' brutality, which was the far greater problem. None of you would care for a minute if the same person would have "just" been killed by regular thugs--as they daily are.

[Dustin Kesselberg]

I dunno about you, but I feel much more concerned about the vast number of unpunished drug dealers, thugs, rapists, and murderers than about the far smaller number of innocents punished.

The whole thing smacks of self-righteousness: "Look at me! I CARE about police brutality!"--as if it was that, and not the criminals' brutality, which was the far greater problem. None of you would care for a minute if the same person would have "just" been killed by regular thugs--as they daily are.


That's because it's no supprise thugs kill people who are innocent. But when police do it,The people who are supposed to be protecting us..It's a different matter.

[Skeptic]

That's because it's no supprise thugs kill people who are innocent.

So your amount of moral concern depends on how surprising something is? And if so, why is this case surprising? Mistaken identity in the dark while looking for a drug dealer is not unheard of.

[brodski]

So your amount of moral concern depends on how surprising something is? And if so, why is this case surprising? Mistaken identity in the dark while looking for a drug dealer is not unheard of.

No, in a civilized society the state has a monopoly on the legitimate use of violence (excepting cases of self defence).
With that monopoly, come responsibilities, the foremost of which is that the state uses that violence only against legitimate targets.

If that responsibility is shirked, or otherwise negated, then the representatives state can no longer claim any more legitimacy for their use of force than any other citizen.

Also, just because you don't want the police shooting innocent daughters of criminals, doesn't mean that you condone the actions of the criminals.

No one ever said enforcing the social contract would be easy, but if the police don't have to follow rules to ensure proper conduct towards the general citizenry, then ultimately they run the risk of becoming just another armed gang.

[Kevin_Lowe]

Why are plainclothed police allowed to shoot at people without identifying themselves first anyway? (Obviously excluding situations where the target is attacking the police officer with lethal force).

How is anybody supposed to tell that the person cutting you off on the street and opening fire on you is a police officer rather than a ganster or a nutter?

[casebro]

Why are plainclothed police allowed to shoot at people without identifying themselves first anyway? (Obviously excluding situations where the target is attacking the police officer with lethal force).

How is anybody supposed to tell that the person cutting you off on the street and opening fire on you is a police officer rather than a ganster or a nutter?

Ditto. Sounds to me as if the girl was attempting to defend herself- from police who were acting in an unreasonable manner. While cops have 'assumed authority', citizens have a right to self protection from even 'unreasonable fear'. Under cover cops, unmarked cars, boxing you in? At least I drive a 5,000 POUND TRUCK.

Note, the second amendment doesn't mention guns. Cars can legally be used in self defence too.

[Art Vandelay]

But I suppose had her father just been a plain law abiding joe then none of the cirumstances that lead to this would have happened.

Um, no. For example, Snipers shot a goat herder in the back on the Texas/Mexico border a few years back, the childs parents were plain, hard working folks.

While this paticular death MAY NOT have happened, the agents might have had the wrong house, or the wrong person, ect.Obviously legalizing drugs wouldn't eliminate all deaths. But people dying is a forseeable consequence of arresting people. It should be quite clear to police officers that every time they arrest someone, there's a significant chance that they will kill or be killed, and that needs to be weighed against the benefits of the arrest. If someone's going around killing people, then obviously the risk of death is outweighed by the importance of getting him off the streets. But if someone is suspected of dealing drugs, the police should be more reluctant to risk deaths to arrest him. Furthermore, in this particular case, they seem to have picked the worst possible time to arrest him. It doesn't take much intelligence to figure out that it's generally easier to arrest someone who's on foot, rather than someone who's driving a car. We should all be aware by now that high speed chases are very dangerous, usually involve injury and/or death, and should be avoided if at all feasible. Apparently, they decided that there was some urgency of arresting him RIGHT NOW (which they for some reason didn't feel while he was in his house) which outweighed the added risk of trying to arrest him while he was in a car. I really don't see the justification for that decision.

Kevin_Lowe
Why are plainclothed police allowed to shoot at people without identifying themselves first anyway? (Obviously excluding situations where the target is attacking the police officer with lethal force). If I were to rob a bank, and someone were to shoot me, and I were to return fire and kill him, I'd be charged with a homicide, even though that person was attacking me with lethal force. I think that the police should be held to the same standard: if, through their own malice or gross negligence, they are forced to kill someone in self-defense, they should be charged with a homicide.

Skeptic The whole thing smacks of self-righteousness: "Look at me! I CARE about police brutality!"--as if it was that, and not the criminals' brutality, which was the far greater problem. None of you would care for a minute if the same person would have "just" been killed by regular thugs--as they daily are. You seem to be saying that we can only care about one, so if we care about police misconduct, we obviously don't care about the misconduct of non-police. The idea that none of care about the actions of non-police is absurd. And while the non-police commit more crimes, an individual crime, all else being equal, is more harmful and more important if it is committed by a police officer. The issue here is not merely that a girl was killed, but what should be done about it. With "regular thugs", that's simply not as controversial a subject, which is why it's not discussed as much. Not because people don't care.