Florida: Tampa Getting Downright Dangerous...For Criminals

[Richard G]

"- For the third time this week a would-be victim in Tampa turned the tables on an attacker. Late Thursday night, the 63-year-old victim of an attempted carjacking pulled a .357-caliber Magnum on his assailant and fired, critically wounding him, officials said."

Not only was this the third time this week that this has happened in Tampa, note that this is the third time this guy has had to shoot someone in self-defense.

http://tampatrib.com/MGAZ7S86HMD.html

[WildCat]

Oh, this can't be true. He was probably shot in a dispute over a parking spot, this is what all the gun-grabbers told us would happen when concealed carry became widespread. Everyone knows the NRA is lobbying the states to hide all the "real" figures of concealed carry run amok. :rolleyes:

[WildCat]

But it's not the 3rd time a gun was used for self-defense this week, in one other incident the victim ran over his attacker w/ his Ford Explorer (an SUV!!) killing him, and in the other 2 old ladies used the same trick that Ulysses used on the Cyclops.

[Ralph]

Nice job....though the perp survived. I'm sure he'll wind up suing over a violation of his civil rights or something to that effect.

You have to wonder what might have happened had he not been armed. A 63 year old man against a 30 year old man with a knife doesn't always have a happy ending....

[Zep]

Gee! THREE attempted carjackings in Tampa that got foiled in one week. Out of ... how many all together that succeeded??? Are there LOTS of carjackings in Tampa? Is it a local sport or something? Pardon me if I decide just to walk when I'm there...

[Graham]

Did you read the end of the article?

Late Tuesday night, two Carrollwood women outwitted a man who broke into their house and threatened them with a sawed-off shotgun, officials said.

Cathy Ord, 60, and her roommate, Rose Bucher, 63, disarmed the man with kindness.

They fed him a ham sandwich, complete with pickles, and served up a bottle of spiced rum.

They even offered him their shower and a disposable razor to shave. After several hours, Alfred Joseph Sweet, 42, passed out and Hillsborough County sheriff's deputies were called to remove him from the home, officials said.

If only they'd had guns too - they could've killed the bas****.

Do I need a rolleyes smiley?

Seriously though, I second Zep's comment - what the hell kind of place is Tampa Florida? Why would anyone want to live there?

I also have to ask - is it worth killing someone to save a car? Granted the guy's not dead yet (and I have very little sympathy for his condition, btw) but still - is that all a life is worth? A crappy old car?

How sad is that?

Graham

[Ralph]

Originally posted by Graham
Did you read the end of the article?



If only they'd had guns too - they could've killed the bas****.

Do I need a rolleyes smiley?

Seriously though, I second Zep's comment - what the hell kind of place is Tampa Florida? Why would anyone want to live there?

I also have to ask - is it worth killing someone to save a car? Granted the guy's not dead yet (and I have very little sympathy for his condition, btw) but still - is that all a life is worth? A crappy old car?

How sad is that?

Graham I was watching a show on TV awhile back---something about the "Worlds 10 most venomous animals".

Almost all of them were in Australia. Toss in the funnel webb spiders, the man-eating salt-water crocs, and the sharks and you have to wonder "why would anyone want to live there?"

People live where they live. I've visted Tampa once. I didn't like it either and I've never gone back but obviously a lot of people call it home.

Most of them are law-abiding citizens who just want to live their life without being assaulted by knife-wielding felons.

In most US states it's illegal to defend property with a firearm.
You can only use a gun if your life is in imminent danger.

The problem is----sometimes carjackers/hold-up men----wind up KILLING their victims.......just for "fun" sometimes.

The guy WAS carrying a knife after all. Was he just planning on doing a little wood-carving later on to unwind?? He did have an extensive criminal record.

Instead of feeling sorry for him, be grateful that the guy who was just trying to live his life----was able to succesfully defend himself and walked away unharmed......

[WildCat]

Originally posted by Graham

I also have to ask - is it worth killing someone to save a car? Granted the guy's not dead yet (and I have very little sympathy for his condition, btw) but still - is that all a life is worth? A crappy old car?

How sad is that?

Graham
Most of us don't have your Sylvia Brown-style ability to see into the future. Maybe he wants the car, maybe your life, I wouldn't be willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

[Graham]

Originally posted by WildCat

Most of us don't have your Sylvia Brown-style ability to see into the future. Maybe he wants the car, maybe your life, I wouldn't be willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

Don't you or Ralph get me wrong - I think I mentioned my lack of sympathy for the carjacker in question. Apparently he was a grown adult, with all his faculties intact, he made his decisions and now he's living (or dying) with the consequences.

I have no problem with that.

As for the ability to see into the future, in that situation, if I'd have had a gun, I probably would've used it too.

The only two points I was trying to make were:

(a) Tampa Florida seems like a rough kind of place. I wouldn't want to live there.

(b) It's a shame when a motor vehicle is worth more than a person's life - either to a carjacker who's prepared to risk his life to get one, a car owner who's prepared to kill to prevent him or Richard, who glories in the shooting of another human being.

That's all.

Graham

[xouper]

I lived in the Tampa Bay area for most of the 1990s and it is not as rough a place to live as people in this thread are implying. I never got carjacked or anything else bad. In my opinion, it is far less rough than Detroit, for example. I would like to move back to Tampa. The place mentioned in that article, Carrollwood, is actually an upscale neighborhood near the University of South Florida.

[WildCat]

Here's what can happen (http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chicago/chi-0310290201oct29,1,7575663.story) (registration required) in a carjacking when only the offender is armed:
Dabney was shot in the chest and pulled from the car, which was later found burned, said Cook County Assistant State's Atty. LuAnn Rodi Snow. Jenkins, who has drug and firearms arrests in his background, was identified by witnesses and arrested this week on a separate drug charge.
Handguns have been banned in Chicago for over 20 years, it is now the murder capitol of the US. Even w/o the ban this guy wouldn't have been able to legally buy a gun of any type, yet he had one. Now, tell me another fairy tale about the effectiveness of gun control before I go to bed.

[Tony]

Originally posted by WildCat
Here's what can happen (http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chicago/chi-0310290201oct29,1,7575663.story) (registration required) in a carjacking when only the offender is armed:

Handguns have been banned in Chicago for over 20 years, it is now the murder capitol of the US. Even w/o the ban this guy wouldn't have been able to legally buy a gun of any type, yet he had one. Now, tell me another fairy tale about the effectiveness of gun control before I go to bed.

In such a case, the city of Chicago should be held legally accountable for such an injustice.

[WildCat]

Originally posted by Tony


In such a case, the city of Chicago should be held legally accountable for such an injustice.
Don't worry Tony, all the aldermen have exempted themselves from the ban. And Mayor Daley has 24 hour armed police protection, now do you feel better? We commoners can't be trusted to defend ourselves w/ firearms.

[Tony]

Originally posted by WildCat

Don't worry Tony, all the aldermen have exempted themselves from the ban. And Mayor Daley has 24 hour armed police protection, now do you feel better? We commoners can't be trusted to defend ourselves w/ firearms.

Do you as a Chicagoite have any recourse?

[WildCat]

Originally posted by Tony


Do you as a Chicagoite have any recourse?
Chicagoan. ;)

You cannot vote out an emperor. :(

Living in this city is why I am so suspicious about Democrats (49 of 50 aldermen are Dems), and in this state the Republicans aren't any better.

[Zep]

Originally posted by WildCat
Here's what can happen (http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/local/chicago/chi-0310290201oct29,1,7575663.story) (registration required) in a carjacking when only the offender is armed:
Dabney was shot in the chest and pulled from the car, which was later found burned, said Cook County Assistant State's Atty. LuAnn Rodi Snow. Jenkins, who has drug and firearms arrests in his background, was identified by witnesses and arrested this week on a separate drug charge.
Handguns have been banned in Chicago for over 20 years, it is now the murder capitol of the US. Even w/o the ban this guy wouldn't have been able to legally buy a gun of any type, yet he had one. Now, tell me another fairy tale about the effectiveness of gun control before I go to bed. "...shot in the chest and pulled from the car..."

If it was the usual mugger's approach, this person would not have known what hit them until it was WAY too late. Muggers don't knock on the car window first and ask to come in, do they? Certainly not enough time to find, pull out, aim and fire any handgun anyway. The only reasonable protection would have been a flak-jacket...like the military wear in Iraq these days.

So how is this in any way relevant to Tampa, Florida?

[Zep]

Originally posted by Ralph
I was watching a show on TV awhile back---something about the "Worlds 10 most venomous animals".

Almost all of them were in Australia. Toss in the funnel-web spiders, the man-eating salt-water crocs, and the sharks and you have to wonder "why would anyone want to live there?"Oh look! There's a man-eating salt-water croc now! CRIKEY!

[Agammamon]

Originally posted by Graham
[B]. . .I also have to ask - is it worth killing someone to save a car? Granted the guy's not dead yet (and I have very little sympathy for his condition, btw) but still - is that all a life is worth?. . ./B]

Depends on the car. Seriously though, is it worth risking a life to steal a car? If our attackers can expect us to passively submit to their depredations then what is the incentive for them to leave us alone?

[Mr Manifesto]

Originally posted by Ralph
I was watching a show on TV awhile back---something about the "Worlds 10 most venomous animals".

Almost all of them were in Australia. Toss in the funnel webb spiders, the man-eating salt-water crocs, and the sharks and you have to wonder "why would anyone want to live there?"



I know you're only trying to make a point but, you would have sharks in the US as well, the crocodiles are a problem but only live in certain areas (and, fortunately, tend to eat idiots with the exception of Steve Irwin... but our prayers go out to the crocs that they get lucky one day), and the snakes, venomous as they are, only bite you if you f#$% around with them. I've seen loads of deadly snakes and not one of them has ever attacked me. I have, however, read quite a few newspaper reports about people getting bitten by snakes because they have to show how macho they are by picking one up.

[Ralph]

Originally posted by Mr Manifesto


I know you're only trying to make a point but, you would have sharks in the US as well, the crocodiles are a problem but only live in certain areas (and, fortunately, tend to eat idiots with the exception of Steve Irwin... but our prayers go out to the crocs that they get lucky one day), and the snakes, venomous as they are, only bite you if you f#$% around with them. I've seen loads of deadly snakes and not one of them has ever attacked me. I have, however, read quite a few newspaper reports about people getting bitten by snakes because they have to show how macho they are by picking one up.

Well--I think what was being suggested was that the odds of being eaten by a croc or a shark are so low that it'd be foolish to base decisions like where you live on factors like that.

As unlikely as it is though---I notice some Australien cities still put nets around the beaches----just in case.

I'm sure you read the recent news about that young woman surfer who had her arm removed by a shark. It's not an unlikely event at all to her.

I think the 63 year old who shot the intruder was just taking some precautions against an unlikely--but possible event.

He may not be here today if he hadn't...............