Mythbuster inadvertently debunk thermite at WTC.

[steve s]

In tonight's episode of the Mythbusters, they tried to cut an SUV in half using thermite. Jamie mixed up a thousand pounds of thermite in a cement mixer, bagged it, then placed it along the centerline of the truck. They also used bricks on either side to try to confine it to the middle. They didn't succeed in cutting it in half. Now if 1000 pounds can't cut a 4000 thousand pound SUV in half, there's no way you could bring down a building weighing millions of pounds without completely filling the building with the stuff.

Steve S.

[parky76]

really? oh this is important. where did exactly did they put the thermite? on the roof?

[Doctor Evil]

Hey, I have not seen that yet. Now you spoiled the ending. :mad:





PS :p

[kookbreaker]

But they didn't use magical pixie supernanothermate!!!!

[R.Mackey]

A thousand pounds???

Man, I love that show. :D

[WildCat]

What myth were they busting with that experiment?

[steve s]

really? oh this is important. where did exactly did they put the thermite? on the roof?

They placed it along the roof and hood, right down the center line. Jamie even put a few bags under the hood right on the engine block. I'm not sure if they placed any inside the cabin.

They weren't busting any particular myth. They were out at the bomb range and decided to do it for fun. Those guys love gratuitous explosions.

Steve S.

[Hokulele]

Yeah, but I bet they didn't use thermite paint.

[ElMondoHummus]

Or sol-gel to hold it in place.

Just out of curiosity, did they also place some along the fenders and doors to try to sever the top half of the vehicle from the bottom?

Why am I asking? Why indeed... :rolleyes:

[PhantomWolf]

When they said it didn't even cut through the roof properly I knew someone'd have a thread on this. The episode is back on right now and it'll be on again tommorrow night.

They were testing if it really was better to finish with a bang! (Blowing up a Moped vs cutting an SUV in half)

[Travis]

One will also note how bright it was and that it wasn't still burning six weeks later.

[JoeyDonuts]

Of course the only logical conclusion one can come to is that they didn't make the thermite correctly. Or that the Mythbusters have been infiltrated and are now just another tool of Zionist/NWO propaganda.

After all, their years and years of FX experience, as well as working with top explosives experts in the FBI, pale in comparison with my cursory readings of David Ray Griffin and Alex Jones.

And, in an offhanded reference to a thread that was just moved to AAH...I posit this theory for why they weren't able to bisect the SUV.

They didn't use Mossad-issued Manischewitz brand thermite.

[patchbunny]

What myth were they busting with that experiment?

I think they were busting the myth that they have a steady supply of interesting myths to bust on the show.

[terryfunk4life]

The show is not really about the myths anyway. Its just the excuse to do cool things. (mst3k rox my sox)

[PhantomWolf]

I think they were busting the myth that they have a steady supply of interesting myths to bust on the show.

They were doing idioms, in that case "It's better to finish with a Bang." The idea was to compare the show finishing with a bang (blowing up the Moped) with a flash (setting off 1,000 pounds of Thermite). They have left the conclusion to the viewers to vote on.

Interesting it was pointed out that they were told by the experts to be really careful when mixing it because just the heat of mixing could set it off. Makes you wonder how it could have survived for an hour in a fire....

The Mythbusters often inadvertently bust 9/11 theory. Not so long again they proved that a person with zero flight experience could hit a runway with a jet plane without outside help and could actually land a plane with someone telling them the controls to use.

[Miss_Kitt]

We saw Adam and Jamie live on stage in Seattle earlier this year. Yep, it was fun; no, we had no idea what to expect; and yes, most likely it did NOT come to your city. (Their "tour" was like 6 cities long.) After answering some general questions from a UW physics prof for a while, they took questions from the audience, showed some "this didn't make the air" tidbits, and then ended with what Adam described as "explosion porn." Lots of boom, from different angles, super-slow-mo, look at the shockwave, captions with information and amusing observations, and real recorded sound at severe volumes. We're talking FUN here!!!

Just adding some Mythbusters-related chatter to the page, MK

[funk de fino]

I hope this is being posted on truther sites.

Probably revert to the usual attacks on the programme makers.

Bushie lovers, shills etc

[UNLoVedRebel]

What myth were they attempting to bust? The 1000 lbs of thermite can cut an SUV in half myth? Never heard of that one.

[JoeyDonuts]

I tried to run a lighter under that last post and didn't find anything. I'm only going to assume you didn't use lemon juice.

[CFLarsen]

The "explosion porn" was also shown at TAM6.

Along with the use of a long thick hose in a way that busted the myth that Jamie is unable to fool around in the shop.

The myth that Adam fools around...well, it's hardly a myth, but a fact, which was, more than ever, confirmed. Gee, it must be cold in that place...

[T.A.M.]

Truther response:

Well obviously it did not cut the SUV in half. The carpeting and upholstry inside the SUV would have prevented the thermite from reaching the steel of the chassis at the bottom of the SUV, therefore it could not have been cut in half by placing the thermite only on the roof and hood.

TAM;)

[GStan]

If you fill the SUV with pizza boxes and bathroom scales, the thermite will, in fact, cut the SUV in half.

[Walter Ego]

Sort of... photographed off a tv screen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVPnkxPNLZE

[chillzero]

New word for the day .... tripod.

:p

[JoeyDonuts]

Jinkies, camera guy. Turn on steady shot already. Or here's one...set it on the coffee table.

Maybe he was going for the "Bourne" cinematography look...

[Myriad]

That's no moon SUV, it's a space station wagon!

Respectfully,
Myriad

[Cuddles]

Along with the use of a long thick hose in a way that busted the myth that Jamie is unable to fool around in the shop.

:eye-poppi

[dudalb]

I think they were busting the myth that they have a steady supply of interesting myths to bust on the show.

As long as they show lots of Kari, that is fine with me.

[ElMondoHummus]

As long as they show lots of Kari, that is fine with me.

Well, the sad thing is, they may show her a lot, but they don't show lots of her. :(

[dudalb]

Well, the sad thing is, they may show her a lot, but they don't show lots of her. :(

Agreed.

[dudalb]

Well, the sad thing is, they may show her a lot, but they don't show lots of her. :(

Agreed. The most of Kari we saw was in the "Goldfinger" debunking and the time she wore that Buck Rogers 50's Sci Fi outfit with the really short skirt.

[AJM8125]

Agreed. The most of Kari we saw was in the "Goldfinger" debunking and the time she wore that Buck Rogers 50's Sci Fi outfit with the really short skirt.


Ahem.

(may be a tad NSFW)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykhSLNlx3n0

[Grizzly Bear]

Sort of... photographed off a tv screen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVPnkxPNLZE

Put of curiosity did you happen to catch the title of that episode? Or if you know the season and episode number? I want to see if I an find it... the episodes better than the skit they did with the exploding pants :D

[Donal]

Well, the sad thing is, they may show her a lot, but they don't show lots of her. :(

Well, there was that experiment with the fainting goats.

[Quad4_72]

Can anyone make an educated guess how much thermite it would take to bring down the WTCs/WTC7? I think Jones had made an estimate at one point, but I am willing to bet it was not based on education.

[parky76]

ok folks. the thermite DID not eat through the car. it didnt even eat through the roof!!!!

i think the "thermite" conspiracy is now thoroughly...debunked.

thats..unless...Mythbusters are really....Zionists?????

Hmmmmm...:eye-poppi

what do you have to say truthers? how come the thermite couldnt even eat through the thin steel roof????

[Homeland Insurgency]

One will also note how bright it was and that it wasn't still burning six weeks later.

Well duh! Everyone knows only building content fire can do that.

Now all they need to do is drive it into a small apartment building and watch thermal expansion go to work.

I can't wait! Mythbusters will be bigger then Lost then!

[parky76]

Hey Homeland- how come the thermite didnt eat through the car...or atleast the dang roof?

hmmmmm?

[Grizzly Bear]

Now all they need to do is drive it into a small apartment building and watch thermal expansion go to work.

SHHHH!!!!! You know thermal expansion is impossible! Don't give these guys funny ideas (http://books.google.com/books?id=3OIUo-Po8x4C&pg=PA13&lpg=PA13&dq=thermal+expansion+building++failure&source=web&ots=unrWqyYto3&sig=OlNdjAlfMm8drfCDhbfMzDYpzCU&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=4&ct=result)! :mad:


Hey Homeland- how come the thermite didnt eat through the car...or atleast the dang roof?

hmmmmm?

If thermite can't cut through the car then there just might be a few problems applying it to a vertical column...

[Homeland Insurgency]

Hey Homeland- how come the thermite didnt eat through the car...or atleast the dang roof?

hmmmmm?

When will they be burning the SUV down to something like this...?

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:-ksgeduHDs4OeM:http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/photos/docs/hanger17/meteor3.jpg

Now that would be a show!

Too much for the budget?

[Cl1mh4224rd]

When will they be burning the SUV down to something like this...?

http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/photos/docs/hanger17/meteor3.jpg


That's the result of compression, not melting. Good lord... What the hell's wrong with you?

[Grizzly Bear]

When will they be burning the SUV down to something like this...?

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:-ksgeduHDs4OeM:http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/photos/docs/hanger17/meteor3.jpg

Now that would be a show!

Too much for the budget?

So you want mythbusters to compress reinforced concrete the same way those concrete floors were compacted? I thought you were talking about using thermite to melt steel?? :confused:

[parky76]

Um....the rebar looks like its still in pretty decent shape. no incredible signs of melting there.

Homeland....you fail!!!!

and by the way, why didnt the thermite at the very least eat through the dang roof?

[CHF]

When will they be burning the SUV down to something like this...?

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:-ksgeduHDs4OeM:http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/photos/docs/hanger17/meteor3.jpg

Now that would be a show!

Too much for the budget?

By golly you're right, HI!

Thermite can't crush several floors together!!! And that proves.....what exactly?

[WildCat]

And that proves.....what exactly?
HI has no idea what he/she is looking at...

[PhantomWolf]

When will they be burning the SUV down to something like this...?

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:-ksgeduHDs4OeM:http://911research.wtc7.net/wtc/evidence/photos/docs/hanger17/meteor3.jpg

Now that would be a show!

Too much for the budget?

I didn't know that SUV's were made of concrete (though I know Jeremy gave a Mercedes S Class a concrete floor in Season 8 of Top Gear)

[PhantomWolf]

Ahem.

(may be a tad NSFW)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykhSLNlx3n0

or this one....

RHcDP_Yew-g

[mrbaracuda]

What channel's Mythbusters on? Discovery? :L

[PixyMisa]

Put of curiosity did you happen to catch the title of that episode? Or if you know the season and episode number? I want to see if I an find it... the episodes better than the skit they did with the exploding pants :D
It was the airline toilet myth... The second episode, and Kari's first appearance.

If you fill the SUV with pizza boxes and bathroom scales, the thermite will, in fact, cut the SUV in half.
And it will stop a bullet. ;)

[T.A.M.]

ok folks. the thermite DID not eat through the car. it didnt even eat through the roof!!!!

i think the "thermite" conspiracy is now thoroughly...debunked.

thats..unless...Mythbusters are really....Zionists?????

Hmmmmm...:eye-poppi

what do you have to say truthers? how come the thermite couldnt even eat through the thin steel roof????

1. I think it did eat through the roof, but just not the entire car.
2. The truthers simply need to come up with some patent (I think they showed one a year ago) of some new super technology that will allow for proper application of the super duper thermite.
3. You know better than to think that this sort of thing will deter the infinitely stupid.

TAM:)

[Quad4_72]

1. I think it did eat through the roof, but just not the entire car.


Actually from the looks of the video it did not go through the roof. It DID however cause the roof to sag from the bags weighing down on it when it became heated ;)

[Phaedrus74]

What channel's Mythbusters on? Discovery? :L

Yep... 19:00 CET

[Quad4_72]

This thermite seems to be much more effective on a car:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEmHJORTlqk

[phunk]

It did eat through the roof, just not the whole thing.

http://phunkadelic.org/PB140070.JPG

[Skeptic Guy]

The "explosion porn" was also shown at TAM6.

Along with the use of a long thick hose in a way that busted the myth that Jamie is unable to fool around in the shop.

The myth that Adam fools around...well, it's hardly a myth, but a fact, which was, more than ever, confirmed. Gee, it must be cold in that place...

New word for the day .... tripod.

:p

I thought we were going a whole different direction here, then I watched the video.

Shwww....

[Cuddles]

ok folks. the thermite DID not eat through the car. it didnt even eat through the roof!!!!

i think the "thermite" conspiracy is now thoroughly...debunked.

I have to disagree with this. Not that the thermite nonsense is debunked, clearly it is and has been for a long time, but that this show actually proved anything. I've seen videos of thermite burning a hole right through the engine block of a car and ending up on the ground. If Mythbusters can't even get it to cut through a roof, they're doing it wrong. Thermite demolitions are nonsense, thermite cutting vertically through cars certainly isn't.

[phunk]

The thermite definitely cut through most of the car vertically, just not all of it. I think they were hoping for it to split in two, but there were still parts left holding the two halves together, like the roof crossmembers seen in the picture above.

[jhunter1163]

Google "Kari Byron Maxim". Don't ask why. Just do it. You'll thank me later.

[mrbaracuda]

Yep... 19:00 CET

Hm, I don't get that one with TVU. Thanks though! :)

[Grizzly Bear]

Saw it :D
Best damn fireworks display I ever saw... God I love how they have to go the extra mile XD

[parky76]

I have to disagree with this. Not that the thermite nonsense is debunked, clearly it is and has been for a long time, but that this show actually proved anything. I've seen videos of thermite burning a hole right through the engine block of a car and ending up on the ground. If Mythbusters can't even get it to cut through a roof, they're doing it wrong. Thermite demolitions are nonsense, thermite cutting vertically through cars certainly isn't.

ok. i can accept that.

[Travis]

Google "Kari Byron Maxim". Don't ask why. Just do it. You'll thank me later.

I wasn't aware she posed for Maxim. I know she did for FHM and I have those pics on my computer.:)


I hope they blow up something big again soon because the Carson Hill Quarry where they do the really big ones (like the cement truck) is just a few miles away.

[PhantomWolf]

I have to disagree with this. Not that the thermite nonsense is debunked, clearly it is and has been for a long time, but that this show actually proved anything. I've seen videos of thermite burning a hole right through the engine block of a car and ending up on the ground. If Mythbusters can't even get it to cut through a roof, they're doing it wrong. Thermite demolitions are nonsense, thermite cutting vertically through cars certainly isn't.

I think the difference is that in cases where you see them burn a hole through an engine block, they are just burning a hole straight down. The Mythbusters weren't they were trying to cut something in half. To cut something in half requires the complete separation of the halves, not just putting a single hole right down. What actually happened was that once the first holes opened up and the roof sagged, the molten iron rolled down the roof and through that opening rather than making more openings and cutting the roof in half.

[jhunter1163]

I wasn't aware she posed for Maxim. I know she did for FHM and I have those pics on my computer.:)


I hope they blow up something big again soon because the Carson Hill Quarry where they do the really big ones (like the cement truck) is just a few miles away.

I would have Kari Byron as my desktop background except that I would then face the wrath of Mrs. JHunter1163. You think Khan had wrath? My wife would vaporize him, and Kirk too probably.

[/Star Trek geekery]

[AJM8125]

I would have Kari Byron as my desktop background except that I would then face the wrath of Mrs. JHunter1163. You think Khan had wrath? My wife would vaporize him, and Kirk too probably.

[/Star Trek geekery]

Let's hope she never has access to thermite. That would not be a good thing for you. :eye-poppi

[jhunter1163]

She would surely not make the mistake Lorena did of throwing it where the cops could find it. Assuming there was anything left after the thermite vasectomy.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Let's hope she never has access to thermite.


Or a Genesis Device...

[...] thermite vasectomy.


Ow, ow, ow, ow, ow... :faint:

[Homeland Insurgency]

I didn't know that SUV's were made of concrete (though I know Jeremy gave a Mercedes S Class a concrete floor in Season 8 of Top Gear)

Really....?

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:qvcdV-7OazkzRM:http://farm1.static.flickr.com/27/103896572_235ce3c259.jpg%3Fv%3D0

[Homeland Insurgency]

So what's the debunking here? Thermite/Thermate can't cut through steel now?

Or the guys at Mythbusters don't really know what they're doing or busting?

[Quad4_72]

So what's the debunking here? Thermite/Thermate can't cut through steel now?

Or the guys at Mythbusters don't really know what they're doing or busting?

Honestly I have seen thermite do a much better job than what they did on the show. I think they just didn't know how to use it properly. But one thing's for sure, there is still no evidence that thermite could be used to bring down massive core columns.

[Grizzly Bear]

So what's the debunking here? Thermite/Thermate can't cut through steel now?

Or the guys at Mythbusters don't really know what they're doing or busting?

No, but it more than confirms that the silly claims people make of thermite being responsible for molten metal weeks following the collapse is one of the most idiotic arguments of all time :)

Nice strawman though ;)

[Homeland Insurgency]

No, but it more than confirms that the silly claims people make of thermite being responsible for molten metal weeks following the collapse is one of the most idiotic arguments of all time :)

Nice strawman though ;)

So the debris pile wasn't melting boots 2 months after the collapse?

Or are you claiming building content fire can do something better then thermite?

Nice... I don't know what.

[Grizzly Bear]

So the debris pile wasn't melting boots 2 months after the collapse?
I'm not claiming that... here's a better question for you... what kind of thermite burns ONLY hot enough to do that? I'm sure many would oblige to walking on a surface that roughly 3 times as hot as molten rock, it's only fatal... That strawman made my day! Thanks for the laugh HI :D


Or are you claiming building content fire can do something better then thermite?
You're going to have to determine the criteria you want to define as better... do you mean which burns hotter or which burns longer burns brighter? The mythbusters little experiment showed thermite would burn off in minutes... nothing near an entire day, let alone twelve weeks... your diatribe of sarcam doesn't do you must justice... shame... and your strawmans are getting truly pathetic. Come back when you have something of substance to add.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

So the debris pile wasn't melting boots 2 months after the collapse?


Of course he isn't. Don't be a fool. I'd like to think that even you realize just how quickly thermite expends itself and that it could not possibly contribute to the heat observed weeks after the collapse.

Am I being too generous?

Or are you claiming building content fire can do something better then thermite?


Over the course of a few minutes? No. Over the course of weeks? Most definitely (unless you've got weeks worth of thermite being fed into the debris pile).

[Homeland Insurgency]

I still don't know what you guys are claiming to debunk here.

Could they have cut it in half better by putting down a line of lighter fluid and igniting it?

[parky76]

never try to use a youtube video to try to debunk a truther. it is their domain.

[Grizzly Bear]

never try to use a youtube video to try to debunk a truther. it is their domain.

HI has the lever set on perpetual sarcasm... I don't foresee him offering much in the way of serious points in the near term...

[Travis]

Let's see.......regular building contents can burn in a low oxygen environment for weeks.

Thermite is self-oxidating so it will burn up fast regardless of oxygen availability meaning to get it to burn for weeks you either need to constantly feed more into the fire or simply start off with a ridiculously large amount.

Sure seems like regular building materials sound a lot more plausible for producing heat weeks after the fire than thermite.

[PhantomWolf]

Really....?

http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:qvcdV-7OazkzRM:http://farm1.static.flickr.com/27/103896572_235ce3c259.jpg%3Fv%3D0

Perhaps it's my eyesight, but that's not an SUV.

[PhantomWolf]

So the debris pile wasn't melting boots 2 months after the collapse?

Or are you claiming building content fire can do something better then thermite?

Nice... I don't know what.

The underground coal fire in Centralia was capable of heating stored gasoline up to over 77°C even being quite deeply under the surface of the ground and having burned for 17 years at that point!

Thermite is self oxidising, do you honestly believe that it could still be burning 2 months later?

A building contents fire can do a lot of things better then thermite can, thermite is gravity driven, it burns straight down and cools quickly. Content fires act is a totally different way. If you set a couch on fire in one room and set off a bag of thermite in another, the one that would catch the ceiling, room, and building alight fastest is the couch.

[UNLoVedRebel]

So the debris pile wasn't melting boots 2 months after the collapse?

Or are you claiming building content fire can do something better then thermite?

Nice... I don't know what.

In truther fashion, you were debunked (http://forums.randi.org/showpost.php?p=4206451&postcount=55) even before asking the question.

[finalmessenger]

So some here believed it was what they said it was. I thought it was thermate that was supposed to be used in the W-e T-ried C-opout, which burns much hotter. Someone else did the same thing, except they put the thermite on the hood of a car. Right through the engine block. There is such a thing as incendiary thermite, which doesn't explode. What did they really use?

Some of you people are pretty well informed. The rest are just disinformed dreamers or disinforming deceivers. Such a test is meaningless because demolition companies use themite or thermate all the time.

They were myth making not busting.

[ktesibios]

Some of you people are pretty well informed. The rest are just disinformed dreamers or disinforming deceivers. Such a test is meaningless because demolition companies use themite or thermate all the time.

They were myth making not busting.

So you're prepared to support the claim I've bolded with evidence?

If you've spent some time reading this forum, you should be aware that unsupported assertions copypastaed from conspiracist Web sites won't do as evidence. Statements from companies actually engaging in the demolition business about the materials and techniques they use would be much more convincing.

[dtugg]

Furthermore, people who keep harping on thermite being a fast oxidizer so it wouldn't be molten weeks later must be weewaw in the wigwam. Nobody but you said that. It was molten iron that was made molten by the thermite/mate, whichever was used.

Sorry that doesn't work either. If iron was made molten by thermite, it would cool rapidly. When Mythbusters ignited half a ton of thermite on that SUV, there was nothing molten when they went to examine it.


Flying aluminum beer cans would not carry enough momentum to sever the central columns even if, by some miracle, the plane actually penetrated the building's steel facade without at least the wings and tail tearing away and falling outside.

767s are not flying beer cans. Traveling at 500mph, a 767 has plenty of energy to penetrate steel columns. The plane did penetrate the building without the wings falling off to the ground. I know because I saw it with my own eyes.


I'll postulate it again, since JREF keeps moving and removing my posts: How did Osama da Bomba know there'd be wargames that day? That was the diversion that was supposed to confuse ATCs. Of course he didn't know. He found out that he did it the same way everybody else did. The main stream media told him he did it.

He had no idea that there were wargames. There are wargames all the time, that's what the military does during peace time. That this one was on 9/11 means nothing. Furthermore, it did not confuse ATCs, I don't even believe that they were aware of it. It didn't confuse NORAD either. If anything they were more aware because of it. And all it took them all of a few seconds to realize that it wasn't part of their wargame.

[Slayhamlet]

So some here believed it was what they said it was. I thought it was thermate that was supposed to be used in the W-e T-ried C-opout, which burns much hotter. Someone else did the same thing, except they put the thermite on the hood of a car. Right through the engine block. There is such a thing as incendiary thermite, which doesn't explode. What did they really use?

Some of you people are pretty well informed. The rest are just disinformed dreamers or disinforming deceivers. Such a test is meaningless because demolition companies use themite or thermate all the time.

They were myth making not busting.

No, they don't. Thermal lances, which are sometimes colloquially called "thermite bars", are used all the time, but they are not actual thermite.

[Gaspode]

Derail split to AAH. Keep the thread on topic as per Rule 11