BNP membership ist posted online

[Professor Yaffle]

Apparently, the membership list for the British Nationalist Party has been posted online, complete with addresses. It seems to be thought that it is to do with internal disputes in the party. I hate what they stand for, but I hope it doesn't lead to any violence against anyone on the list (and that's the reason I am not posting a link to it). Members seem more worried about whether they might get sacked if their employers see it.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/11/18/bnp_loses_list/
http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2008/nov/18/bnp-membership-list-leak
https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=32095749&postID=300681785381908982

[Rat]

I saw this on the Reg earlier. Ten in my home town. Couple of hundred in Leicester. I predict they'll be getting some post and phone calls (not from me, of course)

[dudalb]

Internal disputes in a Neo Nazi group?
There is something new......

[Rat]

I have to admit, I was kind of ambivalent when I first saw the story. Part of me was thinking that, however abhorrent I find their views, they are a legal political party, and the idea that its members might be in some way persecuted is just wrong.

Mostly, however, I was thinking "Ha ha ha ha ha ah ha ha ha ha ha ha ha".

[Big Les]

Oh, mercy.

[Fiona]

From "The Telegraph"

"The spokesman said Mr Griffin alleges that publication of his members' details violates both the Data Protection Act and the Human Rights Act, legislation his party has said should be repealed."

What Rat said last :)

[rjh01]

I think they have more to fear from members of their own party than from anyone else. Not sure why.

[Francesca R]

Apparently, the membership list for the British Nationalist Party has been posted online, complete with addresses.It's still online. There is an argument that it is in the public interest to release this information. I disagree.

[Rat]

It doesn't matter. Once it's online, it's there. I think it's right that the media sites don't link to it, but if the original blog post gets pulled, it would still be available at the Pirate Bay and presumably Wikileaks.

[Francesca R]

Yes.

[Professor Yaffle]

It's still online. There is an argument that it is in the public interest to release this information. I disagree.

Yes I know (and couldn't resist checking how many there were in my postcode area etc). But I didn't post the link, as I don't think I want to make it easier for anyone and everyone to find it. I came across it on a forum where the pages are not indexed by google.

[Lothian]

I really don't see what their problem is. They are a mainstream party who don't hold racist views. What have they got to be ashamed of?

[Francesca R]

There may be legal implications (in this case for JREF) posting a link. No idea. Depends on whether this info can at all be considered "in the public domain" from a legal perspective.

[Professor Yaffle]

I really don't see what their problem is. They are a mainstream party who don't hold racist views. What have they got to be ashamed of?

I thought they were a bank?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BNP_Paribas

[Lothian]

There may be legal implications (in this case for JREF) posting a link. No idea. Depends on whether this info can at all be considered "in the public domain" from a legal perspective.I think the fact that it is in the public domain is why legal minds are being asked for their perspective. Human rights offence according to the racist wankers BLP

[Francesca R]

No, it's an airport (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bannu_Airport) in Pakistan

[Professor Yaffle]

No, it's an airport in Pakistan

It's a Canadian newspaper for kids.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brand_New_Planet

[Lothian]

I thought they were a bank?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BNP_ParibasI worked there many yers ago. Dont think the BNP existed at the time. The NF was the hang out for the scum of the time.

[Francesca R]

It's a Canadian newspaper for kids.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brand_New_PlanetWith a bit of tinkering in the lab one day we might have boron nitrogen phosphide too, which would be BNP with some assorted digits to get the electrochemistry right.

[albion]

Could only find 1 from where I live.

Poor little Nazis relying on the 'evil' Human Rights Act to protect themselves. It would take a heart of stone not to laugh.

[richardm]

I think it's shocking and disgusting: it took me ages to find a bloody link. I thought Google was supposed to be an effective search engine?

[Undesired Walrus]

Not many from my town, which is suprising given it is only 45% White. I thought the BNP were supposed to be thriving in those areas?

[Rat]

Not many from my town, which is suprising given it is only 45% White. I thought the BNP were supposed to be thriving in those areas?

Really? Wikipedia says (and I have read similar elsewhere): The Commission for Racial Equality (CRE) had estimated that by 2011 Leicester would have approximately a 50% ethnic minority population, making it the first city in Britain not to have a white British majority.
Although I suppose that you said town rather than city. Anyway, searching Leicester returns about 650 results, but some of those are Leicestershire or Leicester Road or whatever.

[AgeGap]

Quite a few from where I live. Big surprise! Almost exclusively white.
Biggest shock was to see a relatives name on the list.

[Rat]

They sometimes do well in rural areas, though, which are predominantly white. Indeed, those seem to be the areas where they do best: rural areas and inner cities with large "non-white" populations.

[zooterkin]

I think it's shocking and disgusting: it took me ages to find a bloody link. I thought Google was supposed to be an effective search engine?

Well, I just went looking, but wikileaks.org, which I'd not been to before, seems to be overloaded right now: "Wikileaks is overloaded by readers".

Some interesting comments on this blog (http://lancasteruaf.blogspot.com/2008/11/breaking-news-entire-bnp-membership.html).

Curiously, there are quite a number of BNP members abroad, presumably ex-pats or those working abroad temporarily - Australia, the USA, United Arab Emirates, Sao Paulo, Spain and the Netherlands were some that I noticed. Isn't the BNP opposed to foreign workers? I'm sure it was last time I looked.

One final thing (for the moment, because I'm sure this one will run and run): the list appears to include the December rebels. At first, I took this to mean that the membership list was a year out of date but after a good look through, it's become clear that by keeping a running list (as opposed to a clean list each membership year) the party is able to claim a much larger membership than it in fact has. Some of the additions to the list are as recent as September of this year, indicating that some of the members listed - though how many is anyone's guess - are not in fact members at all. The implication is pretty clear (to me, at least) - BNP members are being defrauded when they have been told that the membership is growing exponentially. Take off all the dead members, those who have resigned (many still listed along with their reasons for leaving) and the most recent batch of rebels and the size drops considerably.

ETA: And according to this blog, some members are already suffering the consequences: Lancaster Unity: Radio DJ Rod Lucas axed after appearing on BNP membership list (http://lancasteruaf.blogspot.com/2008/11/radio-dj-rod-lucas-axed-after-appearing.html)

[geni]

Some interesting comments on this blog (http://lancasteruaf.blogspot.com/2008/11/breaking-news-entire-bnp-membership.html).



Maybe but Mark Cotterill (founder of the England First Party) who left 2004 isn't on the list so it must have been purged at some point.

[Big Les]

^the list is only 1 year out of date, so transcription errors aside, it seems unlikely that it would be very inaccurate.

As for where to find it, the original blogspot blog got taken down today, and according to BBC Radio, the list is no longer online. They don't know the internet very well, do they? For one thing it's hosted on a proper website of its own now.

I (reluctantly) won't post the link either. But I will certainly consider giving it out off-board. It's a very obvious URL choice, for those who like slightly more of a challenge.

Incidentally, the wrigglings and conspiracy theories on the relevant sturmfront thread are pretty hilarious. One moron suggests reissuing the list with the addition of personal details of sundry "reds". Yeah, that'll throw 'em off the scent, eh Adolf? It's also clear from said thread that wikileaks is indeed going to be hosting the list. I'll lose no sleep over it.

[Nogbad]

I was unimpressed with the view of a politician who said "I am not embarrassed to be a member of the Labour Party". The fact is that BNP membership will get you fired from some jobs.

Abhorrent as I find their views I can understand why members in the police, civil service and armed forces are angry. Perhaps if the said politician would guarantee their jobs she might have a point. A lot of Labour supporters would keep it quiet if their jobs depended on it too.

Shower of eedjits that the BNP are like.

[geni]

"Ex-Conservative and then Lib-Dem councillor, ex-chairman of local Green Party and UKIP member"

interesting poltical history.

[dudalb]

I think they have more to fear from members of their own party than from anyone else. Not sure why.

Simple. In Neo Nazi Groups, everybody wants to be the Fuehrer.

[Lothian]

I know the ex-Pm was right wing but his inclusion gave me a shock.

[zooterkin]

I was unimpressed with the view of a politician who said "I am not embarrassed to be a member of the Labour Party". The fact is that BNP membership will get you fired from some jobs.

Abhorrent as I find their views I can understand why members in the police, civil service and armed forces are angry. Perhaps if the said politician would guarantee their jobs she might have a point. A lot of Labour supporters would keep it quiet if their jobs depended on it too.

Shower of eedjits that the BNP are like.
In those cases where people are actually banned from being a member of the BNP, for example members of the police and prison services, I don't see that they have anything to complain about, since they must have known they were taking a risk.

[cj.23]

"Ex-Conservative and then Lib-Dem councillor, ex-chairman of local Green Party and UKIP member"

interesting poltical history.


Three members are listed as Parliamentary Candidates, Chairs or members of the Green party actually.

Poor sods the lot of them. I know one person on the list by sight, an elderly and cantakerous war hero pensioner, extremely patriotic, but not actually a racist or bigot. It's depressing that some could lose their jobs over this, and it's worrying that it was leaked in the first place. I hope they have no reason to be worried.

And I say this as a committed socialist, and liberal. BNP members are completely entitled to their views, n matter how much I disagree with them. If it were not for the "RedWatch" site I'd be even more sympathetic.

cj x

[tkingdoll]

It's still online. There is an argument that it is in the public interest to release this information. I disagree.

Seconded. I may disagree with the opinions of the people on that list but that doesn't mean they don't get the same privacy rights as the rest of us.

Hate and intolerance is what racists do. If we hate and refuse to tolerate them, we're no better. Imagine if this was a 'list of known Jews'.

[Big Les]

Three members are listed as Parliamentary Candidates, Chairs or members of the Green party actually.

Poor sods the lot of them. I know one person on the list by sight, an elderly and cantakerous war hero pensioner, extremely patriotic, but not actually a racist or bigot. It's depressing that some could lose their jobs over this, and it's worrying that it was leaked in the first place. I hope they have no reason to be worried.

And I say this as a committed socialist, and liberal. BNP members are completely entitled to their views, n matter how much I disagree with them. If it were not for the "RedWatch" site I'd be even more sympathetic.

cj x

How can anyone who is NOT a racist and/or bigot, align themselves with such a transparently racist and bigoted party? He's naive at best.

As to those with reservations - there's rather a difference between happening to be a Jew, to be black, to be gay etc, and quite another to align yourself with a party based upon hate and intolerance. The BNP are doing/wish to do harm, to society - where does one stop in the tolerance of intolerance?

[geni]

How can anyone who is NOT a racist and/or bigot, align themselves with such a transparently racist and bigoted party? He's naive at best.

Because Nick Griffen is very good at makeing things less than transparant.

[Ivor the Engineer]

Seconded. I may disagree with the opinions of the people on that list but that doesn't mean they don't get the same privacy rights as the rest of us.

Hate and intolerance is what racists do. If we hate and refuse to tolerate them, we're no better. Imagine if this was a 'list of known Jews'.

I don't think anyone should loose their job over being a member of the BNP, but I certainly think everyone should make it clear what their general beliefs are.

I'm a commie-hippy-bastard-fascist of no particular political orientation. (Except I'm never voting for that slimey ****** David Cameron.)

Or as many Americans like to call us: Socialist.

[tkingdoll]

I don't think anyone should loose their job over being a member of the BNP, but I certainly think everyone should make it clear what their general beliefs are.

I'm a commie-hippy-bastard-fascist of no particular political orientation. (Except I'm never voting for that slimey ****** David Cameron.)

Or as many Americans like to call us: Socialist.

I think people's beliefs, like the way they vote, should be their own business. If they want to disclose, great. If they don't, then as long as it doesn't infringe on anyone else's rights or is incompatible with, for example, their employment, then they certainly shouldn't have disclosure forced upon them.

The Data Protection Act as well as a court order about this very list makes it clear that British law doesn't allow for the frivolous publication of private data just because the majority of decent people happen to disagree with the beliefs of the subjects of that data. If you want that Act to apply to you (for example, how would you feel if your bank published your name and contact details?) then you also have to want it to apply to everyone else, however bigoted a jerk they may be.

Many religious people's beliefs are incompatible with my own worldview. However, I wouldn't want the laws of the land not to apply to those people, and I wouldn't want them to not have the same rights and ability to protest when laws are broken against them.

I do not believe that the BNP's existence is in the best interests of the country, but I do believe that prohibiting their existence is worse. Similarly, I don't like that anyone chooses to be a member of the BNP, but riding roughshod over their basic legal and human rights is worse, because it's under the pretence of righteous indignation that such racists want to remove the rights of others based on such things as belief.

[dudalb]

If you belong to a hate group like the BNP , you sort of deserve whatever public humilation and embarassment you get.

[tomwaits]

I am ignorant of UK politics. Is there a reason why someone would become a BNP member? What is the benefit?

[geni]

I am ignorant of UK politics. Is there a reason why someone would become a BNP member? What is the benefit?

It is how they support the party. It also allows them to run under the party name if selected and in theory it may give them some influence on policy.

[gtc]

I am ignorant of UK politics. Is there a reason why someone would become a BNP member? What is the benefit?

If you want to have a say in the running of a political party, its policies and its choice of candidates then you need to be a member of that party.

There is, of course, a social aspect to being a member of a political party.

[tkingdoll]

I am ignorant of UK politics. Is there a reason why someone would become a BNP member? What is the benefit?

You get to say "we won!" when the borders are closed.

[AgeGap]

Regarding serving members of the Armed Forces. Although it is a while ago now, I still remember being told not to shave my head bald, get a punk haircut or join an extreme political party. I can imagine the situation being the same in the police.

[Lothian]

There is, of course, a social aspect to being a member of a political party.Or antisocial in the case of the BNP.

[Rat]

I do not believe that the BNP's existence is in the best interests of the country, but I do believe that prohibiting their existence is worse.
And because prohibiting their existence only confirms the beliefs of many of their members. A lot of people join the BNP (or at least vote for them) because they feel disenfranchised and alienated, for whatever reason, by the current government. Banning it would only confirm that they aren't being listened to, and that they are, genuinely, being oppressed. You only have to read the thread on Stormfront (it's a laugh riot) to see that many of them are extremely paranoid, and this only encourages their paranoia.

I can see some parallels with the truthers, actually. Many of them are convinced that it's not, as everybody else seems to acknowledge, a breakaway faction that have leaked this, but either the reds or the secret services. They really do see reds behind everything. And while the truth seems fairly simple -- someone, probably a breakaway faction, posted this maliciously to create trouble -- they are coming up with the most unreal suggestions as to how it came about. I'd almost be tempted to respond to their bizarre fantasies if they allowed opposing views outside the 'opposing views' section, but it would be pointless even then.

[dudalb]

I am ignorant of UK politics. Is there a reason why someone would become a BNP member? What is the benefit?

The same as joining the Aryan Nation,Stormfront or the KKK in the US.

[geni]

If you belong to a hate group like the BNP , you sort of deserve whatever public humilation and embarassment you get.

For very solid legal reasons you cann't prove that the BNP is a hate group.

And /b/ has enivitably got hold of the list. I tend to feel that that is an unreasonable level of harassment.

[dudalb]

Regarding serving members of the Armed Forces. Although it is a while ago now, I still remember being told not to shave my head bald, get a punk haircut or join an extreme political party. I can imagine the situation being the same in the police.

Seriously, I thought that being a member of a organization advocating racial bigotry would be automatic grounds for seperation in most police forces,for obvious reasons.
No, I am not saying every BNP member should be fired from his or her job, but it seems to be that Police Officer is one where membership should be a disqualification.

[cj.23]

How can anyone who is NOT a racist and/or bigot, align themselves with such a transparently racist and bigoted party? He's naive at best.


Senility.

cj x

[Undesired Walrus]

Really? Wikipedia says (and I have read similar elsewhere):

Yep. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/London_Borough_of_Ealing (Although I guess the 45% number is only for 'White British', not including the 9% of Polish folk. Daft self-identification system anyway, I'm just damn pale, not white!)


Although I believe in the right to secrecy, the right to believe what you will and be able to voice your views yada yada, I can't be the only one taking a large deal of shameful satisfaction from this leak.

[Undesired Walrus]

No, I am not saying every BNP member should be fired from his or her job, but it seems to be that Police Officer is one where membership should be a disqualification.

It's good progress that it was only one after the Police force was declared to be institutionally racist after the Stephen Lawrence inquiry.