A message to everyone

[my ill will]

Fellow human beings, it's time to WAKE UP. This is an extremely serious post.


These are two factual statistics concerning the condition of our current world.
-Around 28.1 million deaths due to poverty related diseases (diarrhea, measles, pneumonia) in 1990
-Around 50% of the global population lives on less than two U.S. dollars a DAY

With massive statistics like this, it is perfectly clear that our current system is insufficient.

People talk every day of the world ending in a Nuclear war. In truth, this is a huge possibility, considering the methods in which
our military and political systems work. How can we possibly let that happen? Everyone needs to grasp the greater understanding
that we must work together, rather than fight. It sounds like a very vague, even cliche statement. But it's what will save the
planet. With wars taking up most of the spending money of our country, we are not focusing on things like preventing global warming,
working on medical cures, researching more and more technology that can better our lives and further our race. That is the greater understanding.
Your culture is not relevant, your race does not matter, your religion is not important. We are all humans living under the same sun, moon, and stars.

And it's time to wake up.

Why are we letting this happen? This doesn't include just you and I, sitting here watching from the side lines, it includes
the men in charge. The word absolutely MUST be spread to wake up and realize that their money and power is not relevant anymore. These men
are not elite. They are, deep down, just human beings. They can be talked to one on one. They need to be told of this greater understanding. I want you
to picture yourself in this man's shoes. You are born. You go to school. You graduate from high school. You join the military.
You are very soon thereafter shipped overseas. You are shot in the face during battle.

Or this one. You are born. You live in a small shack in Afghanistan. You don't go to school. You don't eat very well.
You are in the military at 6 years old. You are blown up by a bomb at age 7.

Your one and only life, gone. Forever. For your country. Your country that helps create these statistics. Now imagine 72 million of
these people and you have one war in human history.


The world will end eventually even if we had the most perfect world possible by nature and humanity, because the sun is a star, and no star
can last forever. It will eventually explode and the earth will be no more.
Your primitive methods of war and depression and violence don't seem so relevant anymore, do they?

This word absolutely must be spread to ensure the survival of our planet until then. War absolutely must stop. It is counter-productive
to our race's survival. It is destructive, inefficient at the cost of MANY GOOD LIVES, and extremely primitive.

We must dedicate our time to promoting working together. Sharing resources. Providing for everyone. People must not be left behind.
Everyone must be educated to the most current knowledge of our societies. They will learn that working together helps everyone,
and you get even more in return. New discoveries will appear all over the place because people are curious. They must not be limited
by this divisionary tactic of "money". It prevents an extremely intelligent scientist from traveling to an exotic location to research
a cure for a deadly disease. That is reason enough to end this. Our world has enough natural resources to provide for everyone, so they must be shared

We must devote our ambitions to researching medical cures, technology, furthering our race into good and better, happy times.

The entire world must grow up and see beyond our divisionary systems. We all can be free and well if we just work together. Our planet must live on
and we are the ones who must ensure that it happens.

You can sit back and watch the countless deaths and violence, crime and corruption, greed and theft, all the injustice across the world.

Or you can open your eyes and see past it.

Yes, there will still be psychos. There will still be "evil" (mentally insane in a slightly lower degree?) There will still be intentional violence. So we promote research into reasons behind these actions, how the brain works, how to reduce these behaviors.
We could solve the problems of birth defects and mental disorders if only we put enough effort into researching it. We could make all humans
born "normal" if only we devoted our time to finding out.

The world must be fixed.

Please. Translate this into every language you know. Spread the word. The world must grow up and work together, we must survive and live on
in happier times for all humans.

[Lisa Simpson]

Do not post this is more than one sub-forum, or you will be banned for spamming.

[1337m4n]

Uh, yes. What solution do you propose? What's your plan?

[my ill will]

Adopt the mindset. Help spread the word. Teach this understanding. If you change one mind you've done enough.

Stop arguing over every little detail of every conspiracy theory that is posted on here. I see intelligent people on here fighting all the time over detail after detail. Rather than argue over theories, understand that the world system is insufficient and put your collective minds together to help create a plan that will work for everyone.

[beachnut]

Stop watching CNN...



Better stop driving, 50,000 Americans will be dead each year, are you including driving lessons and judgment classes in your educate the world fest?

What about pirate eradication classes?

You left out a bunch of serious stuff.

[Madalch]

Uh, yes. What solution do you propose? What's your plan?

The plan is to post the same warning everywhere, so that intelligent people who hadn't noticed the problem before find out about i and come up with a solution.

[tyr_13]

I'm not seeing a real argument here. It is just platitudes and over simplification of sundry complicated issues.

Unless the argument is, 'stop wasting time on skepticism' in which case...no.

[my ill will]

The plan is to post the same warning everywhere, so that intelligent people who hadn't noticed the problem before find out about i and come up with a solution.

Indeed.

Also- join the emerging movements such as the Venus Project and Zeitgeist and stop playing follow the leader with our economic slavery system.

I am not a promoter of all of their ideas and conspiracy theories. However, they both promote a workable, sustainable society that takes care of all people. It is possible but most people are so used to the way things are that they can't think much beyond it.

If you believe it is possible, help spread the word and help everyone to work together. Eventually we will evolve. But if we are ever going to have change in our insufficient world systems, we must start somewhere.

Stop watching CNN...



Better stop driving, 50,000 Americans will be dead each year, are you including driving lessons and judgment classes in your educate the world fest?

What about pirate eradications classes?

You left out a bunch of serious stuff.

I was trying to make a more general statement, everyone knows accidents happen. But sure, there would be research put into developing better judgement and such through education.

[Apathia]

Might it be possible that we could spread about some good will?

[Dymanic]

I don't have solutions to all the world's problems, but here's a tip:

Compose in NotePad. Turn off WordWrap. Copy and paste.

[Eos of the Eons]

I smell a call to communism, but it doesn't work because of corruption and other variables that idealists forget to consider in their model of the perfect sharing society.

[TobiasTheViking]

I smell a call to communism, but it doesn't work because of corruption and other variables that idealists forget to consider in their model of the perfect sharing society.

You called?

[quixotecoyote]

He's right you know.

It's a super serious post.

[Eos of the Eons]

You called?:D Yeah. I'd do anything to get your presence in a thread :D

All bow to the commie and let him explain how things are gonna go down here now.

[Uncayimmy]

I had never heard of The Venus Project or Zeitgeist until CriticalThinking showed up a few weeks ago. And now there's a second new member talking about it. What a co-winky-dink.

[shadron]

Indeed.

Also- join the emerging movements such as the Venus Project and Zeitgeist and stop playing follow the leader with our economic slavery system.

I am not a promoter of all of their ideas and conspiracy theories. However, they both promote a workable, sustainable society that takes care of all people. It is possible but most people are so used to the way things are that they can't think much beyond it.

Why sure. I'll be glad to. If you can get Xcel Energy to accept my hard word programming and intellectual work here on the forum in the name of all mankind in lieu of crass greenbacks for gas this winter, I'll follow you anywhere - uh, make that "walk side by side". For that matter, how do you expect to make your own power bill without the least little bit of following the leader? Tell me your secret.

[godless dave]

I smell a call to communism, but it doesn't work because of corruption and other variables that idealists forget to consider in their model of the perfect sharing society.

Just like all utopias.

There will never be a perfect society. Sometimes we come close, and the closer we get, the more apathetic most of the population becomes, because they take it for granted. Then some resourceful, unscrupulous people manipulate the system to benefit themselves at the expense of everyone else. Eventually enough of the exploited notice this that they are able to reform society into something more fair and just. And then it starts all over again.

[PixyMisa]

Fellow human beings, it's time to WAKE UP. This is an extremely serious post.


These are two factual statistics concerning the condition of our current world.
-Around 28.1 million deaths due to poverty related diseases (diarrhea, measles, pneumonia) in 1990
Diarrhea in particular. Lack of clean drinking water - cheap and easy to fix, but still millions live without.

-Around 50% of the global population lives on less than two U.S. dollars a DAYCite?

With massive statistics like this, it is perfectly clear that our current system is insufficient.What do you mean by that? Representative democracy, rule of law, and capitalism work everywhere. The pestholes you are talking about are the places that lack one or more of these in working order.

People talk every day of the world ending in a Nuclear war.And yet, after 63 years, this has failed to occur.

In truth, this is a huge possibility, considering the methods in which
our military and political systems work.And yet, after 63 years, no more nuclear weapons have been used, by anyone.

How can we possibly let that happen?It hasn't happened.

Everyone needs to grasp the greater understanding that we must work together, rather than fight. It sounds like a very vague, even cliche statement.It is a very vague, even cliched statement.

But it's what will save the planet.It's never worked before.

With wars taking up most of the spending money of our countryWhere do you live, then? Rwanda? Somalia?

we are not focusing on things like preventing global warmingWorking on it already.

working on medical curesWorking on it already.

researching more and more technology that can better our lives and further our race.Working on it already.

That is the greater understanding.Then it's already happening and we can all go home. Yay!

Your culture is not relevant, your race does not matter, your religion is not important.Two out of three ain't bad.

We are all humans living under the same sun, moon, and stars.True, if trite.

And it's time to wake up.Let's see. Upright posture? More or less. Eyes open? Mostly. Dreaming about Sofia Vergara? Yes. Dream also involves giant tapdancing albino cockroach? No. Probability of wakefulness 98%.

Why are we letting this happen?Let what?

This doesn't include just you and I, sitting here watching from the side lines, it includes the men in charge.And women.

The word absolutely MUST be spread to wake up and realize that their money and power is not relevant anymore.Money and power are always relevant, except in chess.

These menAnd women.

are not elite. They are, deep down, just human beings.And on the surface too!

They can be talked to one on one. They need to be told of this greater understanding.Hello? President Ahmedinejad? We all need to, like, be nice to one another and stuff. Yes, even the Jews. No, my parents were not pigs and monkeys. They don't allow pigs and monkeys on the PTA. Yes, and the same to you!

I want you to picture yourself in this man's shoes.Or woman! Though then the shoes might pinch a bit.

You are born. You go to school. You graduate from high school. You join the military.Okey dokey.

You are very soon thereafter shipped overseas. You are shot in the face during battle.Ow.

Or this one. You are born. You live in a small shack in Afghanistan. You don't go to school. You don't eat very well.
You are in the military at 6 years old. You are blown up by a bomb at age 7.Blooie!

Your one and only life, gone. Forever. For your country. Your country that helps create these statistics. Now imagine 72 million of
these people and you have one war in human history.Yes?

The world will end eventually even if we had the most perfect world possible by nature and humanity, because the sun is a star, and no star
can last forever.We will find a new star! Better and shinier!

It will eventually explode and the earth will be no more.Near enough.

Your primitive methods of war and depression and violence don't seem so relevant anymore, do they?Well, let's see. One is not going to be a problem for me at all, because it won't happen until I've been dead a few billion years. The other can kill me today. So I think you have your relevance pointer the wrong way round there.

This word absolutely must be spread to ensure the survival of our planet until then. War absolutely must stop. It is counter-productive to our race's survival. It is destructive, inefficient at the cost of MANY GOOD LIVES, and extremely primitive.No? Really? I thought it was all good clean fun!

We must dedicate our time to promoting working together.Tried that. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulags) Didn't work.

Sharing resources.Tried that. Didn't work.

Providing for everyone.Tried that. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor) Didn't work.

People must not be left behind.Tried that. Didn't work.

Everyone must be educated to the most current knowledge of our societies.Tried that. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_revolution) Didn't work.

They will learn that working together helps everyone,
and you get even more in return.Tried that. Didn't work.

New discoveries will appear all over the place because people are curious.Tried that. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lysenkoism) Didn't work.

They must not be limited by this divisionary tactic of "money".Tried that. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democratic_Kampuchea) Really, really, didn't work. In one small country, a million people were executed and another million starved to death.

It prevents an extremely intelligent scientist from traveling to an exotic location to research a cure for a deadly disease.No. It's money that allows that.

Our world has enough natural resources to provide for everyone, so they must be sharedTried that. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Black_Book_of_Communism) 100 million people died.

We must devote our ambitions to researching medical cures, technology, furthering our race into good and better, happy times.Already doing that. Doing it, mind you, for money.

The entire world must grow up and see beyond our divisionary systems.Tried that. Didn't work.

We all can be free and well if we just work together.Tried that. Didn't work.

Our planet must live on and we are the ones who must ensure that it happens.Already doing that.

You can sit back and watch the countless deaths and violence, crime and corruption, greed and theft, all the injustice across the world.Okay. I was planning to watch House, but that sounds nearly as entertaining.

Or you can open your eyes and see past it.Hang on... We were supposed to watch the evening news with our eyes closed? Where's the fun in that?

Yes, there will still be psychos.The nutcases are with us always.

There will still be "evil" (mentally insane in a slightly lower degree?)Indeed.

There will still be intentional violence.People are people.

So we promote research into reasons behind these actions, how the brain works, how to reduce these behaviors.Oh? What did you have in mind there? Propaganda campaigns? Psychoactive chemicals? Eugenics programs?

We could solve the problems of birth defects and mental disorders if only we put enough effort into researching it.Who gets to determine what is and is not a birth defect, a mental disorder?

We could make all humans born "normal" if only we devoted our time to finding out.Tried that. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust) Had to shoot about five million people to get them to stop trying it.

The world must be fixed.Don't want any little baby worlds littering (hah!) up the solar system, y'know.

Please. Translate this into every language you know.I tried to translate it into C++, but it won't compile.

Spread the word. The world must grow up and work together, we must survive and live on in happier times for all humans.Tried that. That's how we got where we are today.

[Skeptic Ginger]

Repent, TEOTWAWKI is at hand. :rolleyes:

Poverty is self correcting. That's why history is rife with revolutions interspersed with large die offs.

[H3LL]

Assuming for a moment of credulity that your figures are correct without a reference:


-Around 50% of the global population lives on less than two U.S. dollars a DAY


It's lucky that 50% of the global population don't all live in the US of A then.

For some time I rarely spent more than $2 a day and had a very high standard of living thankyouverymuch. $2 bought a great deal. Probably not a great example though, as I was a person earning $6 per day, so "comfortable", not poor.

ETA: If it helps - $2, at the time would have the equivalent buying power for daily goods of about $25-£40.

-Around 50% of the global population lives on less than $40 U.S. dollars a DAYloses some of it's zing. ;)


-Around 28.1 million deaths due to poverty related diseases (diarrhea, measles, pneumonia) in 1990

If a billionaire dies of pneumonia is it still a "poverty related disease"?

Just askin'.

[Ivor the Engineer]

<snip>

Poverty is self correcting.

<snip>

Not when you keep giving the poor $2 a day to live. I say give them an incentive to die, then there will not be any poor people left and more space on this crowded planet for the rest of us. And it will smell better too.

[The_Fire]

:D Yeah. I'd do anything to get your presence in a thread :D
[/snip]

In that case, all you have to do is post a picture of Darat naked........

:bricks:

[paximperium]

It looks like these Venus Project and Zeitgeist nuts are out and about spamming various threads with this nonsense. After Ron Paul failed miserably and everyone ignoring their 9/11 conspiracy BS, it looks like they need some new woo to promote.

[JoeyDonuts]

Repent, TEOTWAWKI is at hand.

Hmmm. Oddly enough, I feel fine.

[my ill will]

It doesn't matter what you say in refute to my post.

The only thing that is important is the preservation of our planet, and the taking care of all people.

All humans have a natural right to exist and follow their own way. It is time to stop the immature ******** and realize this. It doesn't matter how much you want to call it communism, it doesn't matter how much you think it is nothign more than a bunch of ridiculous idealism.

It's what must happen to ensure the survival of the world. Yes, after 63 years, no one has used a nuke. But it could easily happen.

The only reason I promote Zeitgeist and TVP is because I have done research on Jacque Fresco and his work on a "resource based economy" and both of these movements/projects are working towards a more sustainable society that leave no one behind.

I can't stress this enough. It doesn't matter how much you think it can't happen. It must. People have to learn to work together, our world can't continue like this.

It looks like these Venus Project and Zeitgeist nuts are out and about spamming various threads with this nonsense. After Ron Paul failed miserably and everyone ignoring their 9/11 conspiracy BS, it looks like they need some new woo to promote.

I don't believe in the 9/11 conspiracies, I don't pay attention to Ron Paul, and I am certainly not a nut. In fact I am more sane than you are, if you think I'm a nut.

This is not nonsense in the least. It's a message that all humans need to understand in order to preserve our planet.

[paximperium]

It doesn't matter what you say in refute to my post.
Meaning NOTHING can change your mind to your ideology.


The only thing that is important is the preservation of our planet, and the taking care of all people.
And you think we don't? talk about insulting.


All humans have a natural right to exist and follow their own way.
Actually, no. Mass murderers, freeloaders and sociopaths do not have the right to "follow their own way."


It is time to stop the immature ******** and realize this. It doesn't matter how much you want to call it communism, it doesn't matter how much you think it is nothign more than a bunch of ridiculous idealism. It DOES matter. Delusional Utopian Communism is more harmdul than useful, no matter how much your wish it.


It's what must happen to ensure the survival of the world. Yes, after 63 years, no one has used a nuke. But it could easily happen.
Yeah and how does your Utopian delusion solve that problem?


The only reason I promote Zeitgeist and TVP is because I have done research on Jacque Fresco and his work on a "resource based economy" and both of these movements/projects are working towards a more sustainable society that leave no one behind.
Then why aren't you promoting the benefits of this "resource based economy" instead of making unsubstantiated claims?


I can't stress this enough. It doesn't matter how much you think it can't happen. It must. People have to learn to work together, our world can't continue like this.
Really? Why?


I don't believe in the 9/11 conspiracies, I don't pay attention to Ron Paul, and I am certainly not a nut. In fact I am more sane than you are, if you think I'm a nut.
Wow...what a comeback.


This is not nonsense in the least. It's a message that all humans need to understand in order to preserve our planet.
Nope. It is nonsense.

[Twiler]

I don't understand how we can come up with a plan to save the world without discussing the different theories involved.

Good intentions are not the be-all and end-all.

C++ translation of message:

for (int i=0;i<30;i++)
{
Console.Writeline("Bad things! Aargh!");
}

[sol invictus]

Can't we all just get along?

[JoeyDonuts]

How about this - I will, for the 40-50 years I have left on this planet, not give a crap about its future or anyone else on it other than my friends and family. I will leave other societies to either pull their heads out of the sand or wither and die. Of course I will take care of my own, but only those that are putting forth the effort. If you expect a handout, go step on a land mine. I am going to consume and consume and consume and leave nothing in my wake but bad attitude and non-biodegradeable waste. I'm going to put my and my family's immediate interests far above that of my community and those around me. I will not work with people I don't feel like working with. I will become a staunch advocate of nuclear proliferation and testing...say on a pod of Northern Right Whales, perhaps? I'm going to do all of this and more and there isn't anything you or anyone else-even the planet-can do to stop me. Everything I'm going to do is within the law, and I don't see your ilk being able to change that to much effect because there are MILLIONS just like me.

So, where do people like me fit into your Huxleyian world? I'm thinking I'm sitting at a strong Alpha Plus...Beta at worst.

[SisterSmile]

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

[Kuko 4000]

How about this....

*snip*

So, where do people like me fit into your Huxleyian world?


Here's your answer:

All humans have a natural right to exist and follow their own way.

[Kuko 4000]

This is an extremely serious post.


Ok, I'm taking your word for it.



Your culture is not relevant, your race does not matter, your religion is not important.


You must know that this is not accurate at all in the real world. How would you start changing these? And to what extent?

[Eos of the Eons]

It doesn't matter what you say in refute to my post.

The only thing that is important is the preservation of our planet, and the taking care of all people.

All humans have a natural right to exist and follow their own way. It is time to stop the immature ******** and realize this. It doesn't matter how much you want to call it communism, it doesn't matter how much you think it is nothign more than a bunch of ridiculous idealism.


You sound miffed, but we're just trying to tell that this is not a new idea, nor has it not been tried before. Did you not take history classes in school yet? You just sound naive more than anything.

Taking care of ALL people sounds nice on the surface. But your idea of taking care of them may not fit with their idea of how they should live.

[kedo1981]

I used to smoke pot that made one spout BS like this.

[Darth Rotor]

Also- join the emerging movements such as the Venus Project and Zeitgeist and stop playing follow the leader with our economic slavery system.

Have you looked into this slavery issue in detail, or just at the platitude level? If you have some detail to offer us in this thread, discussing the modern day slave trade (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=128680) I'd be much obliged.

DR

[Darth Rotor]

It doesn't matter what you say in refute to my post.
Translation: fingers are in ears, and I chant "lalalalala" as my mantra.
The only thing that is important is the preservation of our planet, and the taking care of all people.
Preserve planet does not necessarily require taking care of all people, or any people. Planet did OK without people for some years, as our scientists can tell us.
All humans have a natural right to exist and follow their own way.
Aha, a natural rights argument that ignores what happens when all those people following their own way run into each other. How quaint.
It is time to stop the immature ******** and realize this. It doesn't matter how much you want to call it communism, it doesn't matter how much you think it is nothign more than a bunch of ridiculous idealism.
I can sing Kumbaya, the version sung by Guadalcanal Diary. Will that help?
It's what must happen to ensure the survival of the world. Yes, after 63 years, no one has used a nuke. But it could easily happen.
Easily? Nope. There are a lot of checks and safeguards on most nuclear weapons. Most, sadly, does not mean all. :(
The only reason I promote Zeitgeist and TVP is because I have done research on Jacque Fresco and his work on a "resource based economy" and both of these movements/projects are working towards a more sustainable society that leave no one behind.
Our socio-economic-proctologic utopia beckons us, lads, so let's all drop our trousers!
I can't stress this enough. It doesn't matter how much you think it can't happen. It must. People have to learn to work together, our world can't continue like this.
Can and must are used incorrectly here. Likewise, it not only can continue, it may very well do so with the result of a global war in which three billion die.

The remaing three and half billion will be left to sort the resulting mess out. (I suggest you check for the century in which the global population was last in the 3-4 billion range. You might be surprised)
I don't believe in the 9/11 conspiracies, I don't pay attention to Ron Paul, and I am certainly not a nut.
Your assertion isn't backed up by the coherence of your argument, but I'll be nice here: maybe you are victimized by having a small amount of understanding of something a bit bigger than a bread box.
In fact I am more sane than you are, if you think I'm a nut.
Not doing well, no, not doing well here.
This is not nonsense in the least. It's a message that all humans need to understand in order to preserve our planet.
Understanding is useless without action.

So, back to the first response to you: what is your proposed course of action? What concrete steps do you suggest be taken to reverse this (in your opinion) requied course change? Who provides the resources to implement the change?

DR

[dudalb]

It looks like these Venus Project and Zeitgeist nuts are out and about spamming various threads with this nonsense. After Ron Paul failed miserably and everyone ignoring their 9/11 conspiracy BS, it looks like they need some new woo to promote.


:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

They are going from one extreme to another ..from Ron Paul's Ayn Randian Lassiez Faire Capitalism to A Totally Collectivist system....but then kooks are well known for going back and forth between extremes on a regular basis.

I seel not one of them have shown how a system without a means of exchange..usually called Money...can work.

[dudalb]

The road to hell is paved with good intentions.

Notice how often when the advocates of Utopia get into power, mass murder on a scale that would make your typical greedy king or dictator sick to their stomach results?

[tomwaits]

I used to smoke pot that made one spout BS like this.


i used to smoke as well...but i was an odd type. i would usually end up talking about why communism doesn't work.

[VespaGuy]

Why is that posts that begin with "WAKE UP" are usually so long and incoherent that I fall asleep reading them?

[T.A.M.]

While as a health professional I honor, and uphold the duty to help those I can, as a realist, I have to come to terms with the fact that we cannot help EVERYONE, and that no extreme, whether it be pure unadulterated capitalism, or Utopian Socialism, is the answer.

TAM:)

[Thunder]

Why is that posts that begin with "WAKE UP" are usually so long and incoherent that I fall asleep reading them?

haaaa!!!!!

:D

maybe its cause in the minds of wackos, you are only truly awake...when sleeping.

[calebprime]

...
Okay. I was planning to watch House, but that sounds nearly as entertaining.



I respect the insect.

So, House is a good show?

I think Lisa Simpson, also, said she liked it.

[Bob Blaylock]

“My ill will”, I think you will find the information at this link (http://www.zapatopi.net/afdb) to be very helpful. Just remember to put the shiny side out. That's very important. Shiny side out.

[moon1969]

So you want to create an utopia? Did you know that people like Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin and Pol Pot also tried to create an utopia?

[Almo]

So you want to create an utopia? Did you know that people like Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin and Pol Pot also tried to create an utopia?

I don't really think Stalin believed he was creating a utopia. I think he was just keeping power for himself.

My impression is that Hitler did in fact think he was going to make the world a better place.

[TheDoLittle]

Repent, TEOTWAWKI is at hand.

...and if you keep doing it, you'll go blind and get hairy palms!

[dudalb]

Repent, TEOTWAWKI is at hand.

Actually you could not get a more appropriate Icon for TEOTWAWKI then Joey Donuts Avatar.

[fullflavormenthol]

Communism...you either end up with Stalin or Jim Jones. Take your pick from my false dichotomy here.

I have an idea! You see I call it Project Safehouse, and what we will do is create a bunch of vast underground vaults to survive the nuclear holocaust....

[1337m4n]

The Venus Project's idea of a "resource-based economy" sounds a hell of a lot like "go back to a barter system".

Am I missing something?

[1337m4n]

Adopt the mindset. Help spread the word. Teach this understanding. If you change one mind you've done enough.


You know what, you're right! I can't believe nobody's ever thought of that before! All it takes to end the world's conflicts is to tell people to just get along. Why, I think I will go over to Israel right now and tell everyone there to just get along, thus ending centuries-old grudges and conflict forever! It's so simple! How could we have missed it?


Stop arguing over every little detail of every conspiracy theory that is posted on here. I see intelligent people on here fighting all the time over detail after detail. Rather than argue over theories, understand that the world system is insufficient and put your collective minds together to help create a plan that will work for everyone.

And how do you think that plan is ever going to get created if nobody's allowed to argue over theories?

I'm all for "peace" and "love"*, but there's nothing inherently bad about arguing. Arguing is usually a GOOD thing, as long as its mutually respectful and you don't go killing the other guy. Arguing is how we learn, grow, and evolve. We learn flaws in our reasoning through argumentation. We learn which ideas are strong and workable, and which ideas are weak and unrealistic. Without argument, how do you expect people to learn the truth?




*No I'm not. I worship Khorne.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Adopt the mindset.


You want us to "wake up" by adopting a single mindset; your mindset?

You don't... see a problem with that?

[petra10]

I had never heard of The Venus Project or Zeitgeist until CriticalThinking showed up a few weeks ago. And now there's a second new member talking about it. What a co-winky-dink.

I love that word co-winky-dink, can I use it?


Oh and ditto what PixyMisa said.

[Cl1mh4224rd]

This word absolutely must be spread to ensure the survival of our planet until then.
The only thing that is important is the preservation of our planet [...]


The planet... was supposedly whacked by a Mars-sized object early in it history. And still life evolved. So, please stop with the "save the planet" rhetoric. The planet will be fine.

ETA: Why is this in Conspiracy Theories?

[fromdownunder]

*sigh* I miss the '60s.

Norm

[tomwaits]

Communism...you either end up with Stalin or Jim Jones. Take your pick from my false dichotomy here.


I'd say communist countries usually end up in one of two forms:

1) It turns into a monstrous oppressive dictatorship, like Stalinist Russia or North Korea

2) They eventually realize that this central planning business doesn't work out too well, so they switch to a market-oriented one (like Vietnam and China).

[fullflavormenthol]

I'd say communist countries usually end up in one of two forms:

1) It turns into a monstrous oppressive dictatorship, like Stalinist Russia or North Korea

2) They eventually realize that this central planning business doesn't work out too well, so they switch to a market-oriented one (like Vietnam and China).
Bingo. I got into this in a round about way in the Addendum thread, but you are absolutely right. Give China more time and they will eventually transistion to a close proximity of the United States economic system. Stalinist Russia dealt with the need for actual pay with the Gulag.

It is just that from my observation that the Venus Project and Zeities that they would put people like us in a "re-education" camp if they were given a choice. I take this from the comments I see on the ol' youtube vids from idiots plugging Loose Change and Zeitgiest after they comment that Penn & Teller need to be re-educated because they made an episode opposed to conspiracy theories.

Good comment.

[Stout]

I respect the insect.

So, House is a good show?

I think Lisa Simpson, also, said she liked it.

Ditto on respecting the insect and his talent for making sense out of "confusing OPs"

Re house..a buddy of mine actually went out and bought the series and it's the first series he's ever bought, let alone rented. I've never seen the show, but my buddy insists I borrow the DVDs when he's finished watching them.

I looked into Z2 and the VP and I've got to say, the economics section is over my head, but hey, every government in the "western" world can't be wrong, can they ?

VP looks like something I was into in the 1970s, I'm thinking Roger Dean ( and a lot of "shrooms ) here and although the message is noble, I'm also aware that it's entirely unworkable. Sheesh, I had a tough enough time living communally with roommates, let alone an entire society.

[Uncayimmy]

I love that word co-winky-dink, can I use it?


I think the writers on M*A*S*H borrowed it from me before I ever said it.

[Hans]

I smell a call to communism, but it doesn't work because of corruption and other variables that idealists forget to consider in their model of the perfect sharing society.

Communism, good theory - wrong species

[my ill will]

Please guys, you are over analyzing this.

I made the post because I'm trying to spread a general message over the internet. I have posted it on multiple sites. Many people are mostly unaware of the tragedies that go on in our world and I am simply trying to spread awareness and activation in some people's minds.

[fullflavormenthol]

Communism, good theory - wrong species
It works better with ants and bees.

[tomwaits]

Sheesh, I had a tough enough time living communally with roommates, let alone an entire society.


I've found out who you are... (http://www.theonion.com/content/node/38517)

[Hokulele]

Please guys, you are over analyzing this.

I made the post because I'm trying to spread a general message over the internet. I have posted it on multiple sites. Many people are mostly unaware of the tragedies that go on in our world and I am simply trying to spread awareness and activation in some people's minds.


You mean, spamming?

[Travis]

The Venus Project's idea of a "resource-based economy" sounds a hell of a lot like "go back to a barter system".

Am I missing something?

Yes, there will be robots.....and no rats for some reason.

Myself and few others have already torn the Venus Project's naive idealism apart in this thread (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=128702).

[Cl1mh4224rd]

Please guys, you are over analyzing this.


Over analyzing? You mean... thinking too much?

So, this utopian future you envision requires that the masses sit down, shut up, and simply listen to your sermons? "Do not think about what I'm telling you. Just do what I vaguely command. Obey. Obey. Obey."

To hell with you.

I made the post because I'm trying to spread a general message over the internet.


You seem pretty naive. My suggestion? Make your message into a LOLcat...

[fullflavormenthol]

Yes, there will be robots.....and no rats for some reason.

Myself and few others have already torn the Venus Project's naive idealism apart in this thread (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=128702).
I read that and it worked out so much better than the CT Addendum thread. Personally my problem is that I am not able to debate any communist theory without being drunk, and so I don't drink enough to debate this nonsense. So I have to wait to long to respond, but the honest reason is that addendum is merely stupid without an acknowledgement of actual human nature.

[JoeyDonuts]

Please guys, you are over analyzing this.

I made the post because I'm trying to spread a general message over the internet. I have posted it on multiple sites. Many people are mostly unaware of the tragedies that go on in our world and I am simply trying to spread awareness and activation in some people's minds.

So you never answered me. In your perfect society, can I continue to be an unpleasant antisocial gun-toting jackass who just consumes and consumes and consumes, not giving two bits about anyone else who shares this planet that isn't in my circle of friends or family or community?

Have fun passing out the flyers on campus, homes.

[Eos of the Eons]

Hmm Yeah. Don't think. Just do as I say and it will work peeps! Not sure HOW we're gonna do it, but this new fantastic idea of mine will save the world! Now, listen to the music and do my bidding (http://www.metacafe.com/watch/939516/hitler_youth/)... no thinking!!!

[Travis]

I read that and it worked out so much better than the CT Addendum thread. Personally my problem is that I am not able to debate any communist theory without being drunk, and so I don't drink enough to debate this nonsense. So I have to wait to long to respond, but the honest reason is that addendum is merely stupid without an acknowledgement of actual human nature.

Yes, and that's what I kept harping on in that thread. Denying human nature is not smart. It just doesn't go away because you want it to and trying to plan something that can be undone by it while ignoring it is a recipe for catastrophic failure. Imagine the worst blue screen of death ever that doesn't just say the system will need to be shut down but that you will get no more food ever!

[JoeyDonuts]

Yes, and that's what I kept harping on in that thread. Denying human nature is not smart. It just doesn't go away because you want it to and trying to plan something that can be undone by it while ignoring it is a recipe for catastrophic failure. Imagine the worst blue screen of death ever that doesn't just say the system will need to be shut down but that you will get no more food ever!

And with that, I feel I have had too many bytes...resulting in a rather unpleasant stack overflow. I'm gonna go take a nice 2-hour physical memory dump.

[Alareth]

Can't we all just get along?


No.

[Stout]

I've found out who you are... (http://www.theonion.com/content/node/38517)

ZOMG....outed ! ;)

We never discussed the socialist, or political ramifications of our situation(s) preferring instead to take a practical approach to not living like depraved pigs by setting up "programs" like the guys in the article did.

But, just like the guys in the article, we had those same pesky human nature problems that brought all our thought out plans to a crashing halt with resulting feelings of ill will toward each other.

Things worked way better when we all had our own sections in the fridge, and paid someone else to clean the place.

[TjW]

Please guys, you are over analyzing this.

I made the post because I'm trying to spread a general message over the internet. I have posted it on multiple sites. Many people are mostly unaware of the tragedies that go on in our world and I am simply trying to spread awareness and activation in some people's minds.

So, basically, you're spamming.

[Pantaz]

Please guys, you are over analyzing this.

No, you under-analyzed it.

[Stout]

No, you under-analyzed it.


I love this forum...:cool:

[Pardalis]

http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a154/perdalis/732g1f7.gif

[my ill will]

So you never answered me. In your perfect society, can I continue to be an unpleasant antisocial gun-toting jackass who just consumes and consumes and consumes, not giving two bits about anyone else who shares this planet that isn't in my circle of friends or family or community?

Have fun passing out the flyers on campus, homes.

Sure... you can do what you like.

Again I'm only trying to spread awareness. Some people don't believe in my ideals and ambitions and that's okay. But many remain unaware of what goes on in the real world and I am only trying to spread a message and help a cause that I believe in.

If you want to yell at me for it, go ahead. It has nothing to do with naievity or stupidity. Promoting a society that better supports human beings and employs teamwork is something that I am devoting my life to.

I do fear for the future of this world considering everyone's attitude towards change, however.

To reiterate my points, the facts ARE that the world is in severe condition, many people are left behind, and I am trying to spread a message and help these people.

[dudalb]

You are not going to help them by promoting a "Kumbaya" program that is totally unrealistic and has the chances of a snowball in hell of suceeding.

[Stout]

Again I'm only trying to spread awareness. Some people don't believe in my ideals and ambitions and that's okay. But many remain unaware of what goes on in the real world and I am only trying to spread a message and help a cause that I believe in.

If you want to yell at me for it, go ahead. It has nothing to do with naievity or stupidity. Promoting a society that better supports human beings and employs teamwork is something that I am devoting my life to.

I do fear for the future of this world considering everyone's attitude towards change, however.

To reiterate my points, the facts ARE that the world is in severe condition, many people are left behind, and I am trying to spread a message and help these people.

A laudable idea indeed however past experiences have shown us that the extreme form of socialism has resulted in a mostly unhappy population and that's the message we're trying to get you to consider.

It might be a "better" or more effective tack to pick an issue. Pick one that's a real challenge like trying to get people to stop flying for vacations or raising awareness of just how environmentally hostile a meat intensive diet is when held up to a vegetarian ( not vegan, too idealistic, or Jain, too psycho ) diet and how those choices relate to the consumption of natural resources outlined in Z2

[my ill will]

You are not going to help them by promoting a "Kumbaya" program that is totally unrealistic and has the chances of a snowball in hell of suceeding.

It's not a kumbaya program or utopia, just a global system and economy that is designed to support human beings, rather than force them into competition.

If you haven't read any of Jacque Fresco's work, I suggest you do. He's been working for many years on the idea of a resource-based economy, and it would in-fact work.

Also, our minds as humans are in a constant emergent state and eventually we will evolve past things such as money and similar things. We will all eventually learn to work together as the human mind continues to expand.

I am trying to start that now.

[fullflavormenthol]

Oh yes....we will evolve past money. Karl Marx beat Jasque Fresco to this, but that plagiarist wouldn't know any better would he? Oh, of course his communist system would work because suddenly the laws of human nature would cease to work. Yes I would just happen to work for free, and volunteer my services for nothing; because by golly communism is just so (rule 10)ing great that I will simply work for absolutely nothing.

We will become ants. We will have no thoughts of our own. HEY EVERYBODY! JUST GO OUT AND DRUG UP AND DRINK A BUNCH OF VODKA AND AFTER A FEW YEARS YOU'LL TOTALLY BE INTO THE VENUS PROJECT.

It doesn't matter the fact that it simply won't work. That people will want to leave. That freaking (rule 10) like Jacque Fresco will be the first to be executed by such a system...no....it will be a paradise and you'll be working your (rule 10) off while people like my ill will will sit around and complain that you are not working hard enough.

I mean seriously. Seriously...SERIOUSLY!!!!!!!!!!! CAN'T WE SIMPLY IGNORE THE MORONS AND STOP ARGUING COMMUNISM? The argument is done, and guess what? They failed. Good day and all my love.

[fullflavormenthol]

A message to everyone....


Communist B.S. failed and everyone moved on.

The Venus...oh hell (rule 10) it B.S is just Marxism with robots, and only morons believe it is anything worht anyones time. Honestly, just ignore this crap it is worthless, and merely proves that the creators of Sheitgeist were trying to push their Communist propadanda all along. (rule 10) them!

[Travis]

Ahhh.....but we haven't got to the part about sex robots that play badminton.

[Stout]

Honestly, just ignore this crap it is worthless, and merely proves that the creators of Sheitgeist were trying to push their Communist propadanda all along. (rule 10) them!

But it is fun though

It's also Star Trek.

I'm in it for the belief that we're all victims of the corrupt system that's withholding the technology to create things like an underground intercontinental railway system that runs on electricity and has trains going 4000 miles per hour. I like being told that I don't have a choice, that I'm somehow being forced to drive around in my car, eat meat, and heat my house.

If I take this tack, I can say things like "global warming, not my problem" and absolve myself from any responsibility "woot, I'm a victim", as I Listen to John Lennon's Imagine over, and over, and over.

[fullflavormenthol]

But it is fun though

It's also Star Trek.

I'm in it for the belief that we're all victims of the corrupt system that's withholding the technology to create things like an underground intercontinental railway system that runs on electricity and has trains going 4000 miles per hour. I like being told that I don't have a choice, that I'm somehow being forced to drive around in my car, eat meat, and heat my house.

If I take this tack, I can say things like "global warming, not my problem" and absolve myself from any responsibility "woot, I'm a victim", as I Listen to John Lennon's Imagine over, and over, and over.
Your right, and you put it in such a better way than I did with my ranting. I should calm down, at least here, and say that it is merely a way for people to say, "hey...ain't my problem, because I am all for secret technology hidden from me." All the time of course being against the whole Toshiba Nuclear Battery system, that could actually allow people to buy 7+ years of clean nuclear power. (Apologize for the rant again, but it is a good system.)

[dudalb]

Also, our minds as humans are in a constant emergent state and eventually we will evolve past things such as money and similar things. We will all eventually learn to work together as the human mind continues to expand.

I am trying to start that now.

Is it just me or does somebody have a Messiah complex really bad.

[Tin Foil Timothy]

A laudable idea indeed however past experiences have shown us that the extreme form of socialism has resulted in a mostly unhappy population and that's the message we're trying to get you to consider.



Well capitalism has also resulted in a mostly unhappy population. Like he says 50% of the world lives on under a dollar a day ( and no I'm not going to cite it because we all know that most people are in poverty in the world ).

The general behavior towards 'my Ill will' is a good indication of why we're in the mess we're in.

Look at yourselves and your reactions to this guy. You are part of the problem.

You are all indoctrinated and nurtured to the "Duck and cover", "Reds an your bed" and "Better dead than Red" mantra. So that every time someone points out a problem with the system the autonomic nervous system in you all bleeps like Robbi the Robot "Communism! Destroy! Communism Destroy! Communism! Destroy! Communism! Destroy! Communism! Destroy! Communism! Destroy! "

Can't you see why you've all been indoctrinated with the "Capitalism is best, everything else is Communism!" message generation after generation?

What seems to get forgotten time and time is human beings themselves.

Forget about capitalism, communism, and other 'isms' Start thinking about human beings.

Capitalism is not the best way if it's profit BEFORE people.
Communism is not the best way if it's Ideology BEFORE people.
Religion is not the best way if it's Scripture BEFORE people.

And in practise those above are always People Second

We need a system that puts ....

People FIRST profit SECOND
People FIRST Scripture SECOND


So instead of mocking my ill will, why not try putting some energy into improving the world.

My ill will's suggestions maybe wacky and unworkable solutions, but at least he's trying. What have YOU done?

[Brainache]

M.I.W. has said that we need to stop forcing people to compete with one another. It has been my experience that people always compete, no one forces them. This Utopia he wants seems to require mass lobotomization to ensure a compliant non-competitive population.

What could possibly be wrong with that?

[Eos of the Eons]

Anybody else smell a dirty sock? *sniffs*

[paximperium]

My ill will's suggestions maybe wacky and unworkable solutions, but at least he's trying. What have YOU done?
I've provided medical care for free to the poor and homeless.

I did it on my own free time and will because I could afford the time to do so since I was being paid a good market rate. Capitalism has done wonders for the the fastest and greatest economic advancement in Asia and East Europe faster than any prior government system.

Why should anyone consider, Communism, a failed system over Capitalism a system that still continues to work despite its problems?

What a huge and useless pile of horse manure and false dichotomy you have there. So people can't oppose terrible ideas and still make the world a better place? Somehow they are mutually exclusive?

What makes you think that MIW utopian ideals is harmless or even good? His beliefs prevent him from actually taking part in reality but living in a delusional fantasy world. His beliefs prevent him from actually proposing real change instead of fantasy.

What have you done to make the world a better place?

[Tin Foil Timothy]

What a huge and useless pile of horse manure and false dichotomy you have there. So people can't oppose terrible ideas and still make the world a better place? Somehow they are mutually exclusive?


You obviously didn't even read my post. Or were you replying to someone else?

[stateofgrace]

Fellow human beings, it's time to WAKE UP. This is an extremely serious post.

:words:



So when you,or somebody just like you,takes control of the planet, your solution is..................


?


What, exactly?

[Stout]

Your right, and you put it in such a better way than I did with my ranting. I should calm down, at least here, and say that it is merely a way for people to say, "hey...ain't my problem, because I am all for secret technology hidden from me." All the time of course being against the whole Toshiba Nuclear Battery system, that could actually allow people to buy 7+ years of clean nuclear power. (Apologize for the rant again, but it is a good system.)


No worries, sometimes ranting can be fun too ;)

Not to mention that it's also a natural reaction when someones trying to sell you and idea or product that's based on the assumption that you're ignorant of what really goes on in the world. ie you're one of the "sheeple" I may not have all the facts at the time, but if I'm interested, I'll run them down, and be might irked if I find those facts are contrary to the idea being sold.

[timhau]

Fellow human beings, it's time to WAKE UP. This is an extremely serious post.


These are two factual statistics concerning the condition of our current world.
-Around 28.1 million deaths due to poverty related diseases (diarrhea, measles, pneumonia) in 1990
-Around 50% of the global population lives on less than two U.S. dollars a DAY

With massive statistics like this, it is perfectly clear that our current system is insufficient.

Definitely. It's a travesty that we have to rely on 18-year-old statistics.

[Stout]

Hi Timothy.

I understand where you're coming from but it's worth noting that all those unhappy people living on under a dollar a day are aspiring to the same things you and I have at our disposal rather than thinking how they can make the world a better place.

I could write a lengthy post about things I've done to to help make the world a better place but I won't bore you with it ( or bore myself writing it out )

Thing is, it's not a knee jerk reaction against "Communism" it's an opinion based on the crappy societies with the resulting unhappy denizens of those societies that drives this approach.

Why is it do you figure, that most far left societies have to keep their citizens "at home" by force ? I'm thinking Berlin wall, Cuban naval patrols, North Korea etc.

I posit it's a natural human drive to improve one's life through profit and the want for "status" has been with us since the dawn of time..

6000 years ago....;):duck:

[doobiedoright]

It doesn't matter what you say in refute to my post.

The only thing that is important is the preservation of our planet, and the taking care of all people.

All humans have a natural right to exist and follow their own way. It is time to stop the immature ******** and realize this. It doesn't matter how much you want to call it communism, it doesn't matter how much you think it is nothign more than a bunch of ridiculous idealism.

It's what must happen to ensure the survival of the world. Yes, after 63 years, no one has used a nuke. But it could easily happen.

The only reason I promote Zeitgeist and TVP is because I have done research on Jacque Fresco and his work on a "resource based economy" and both of these movements/projects are working towards a more sustainable society that leave no one behind.

I can't stress this enough. It doesn't matter how much you think it can't happen. It must. People have to learn to work together, our world can't continue like this.



I don't believe in the 9/11 conspiracies, I don't pay attention to Ron Paul, and I am certainly not a nut. In fact I am more sane than you are, if you think I'm a nut.

This is not nonsense in the least. It's a message that all humans need to understand in order to preserve our planet.



Might I suggest before preaching to us,that you might want to tell this to the nut jobs who are still living in the 15th century!

[CptColumbo]

Please. Translate this into every language you know. Spread the word. The world must grow up and work together, we must survive and live on
in happier times for all humans.
Okay...
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.. . ... .-.-.- - .... . -.-- .-- .. .-.. .-.. .-.. . .- .-. -. - .... .- - .-- --- .-. -.- .. -. --. - --- --. . - .... . .-. .... . .-.. .--. ... . ...- . .-. -.-- --- -. . --..-- .- -. -.. -.-- --- ..- --. . - . ...- . -. -- --- .-. . .. -. .-. . - ..- .-. -. .-.-.- -. . .-- -.. .. ... -.-. --- ...- . .-. .. . ... .-- .. .-.. .-.. .- .--. .--. . .- .-. .- .-.. .-.. --- ...- . .-. - .... . .--. .-.. .- -.-. . -... . -.-. .- ..- ... . .--. . --- .--. .-.. . .- .-. . -.-. ..- .-. .. --- ..- ... .-.-.- - .... . -.-- -- ..- ... - -. --- - -... . .-.. .. -- .. - . -.. -... -.-- - .... .. ... -.. .. ...- .. ... .. --- -. .- .-. -.-- - .- -.-. - .. -.-. --- ..-. .-..-. -- --- -. . -.-- .-..-. .-.-.- .. - .--. .-. . ...- . -. - ... .- -. . -..- - .-. . -- . .-.. -.-- .. -. - . .-.. .-.. .. --. . -. - ... -.-. .. . -. - .. ... - ..-. .-. --- -- - .-. .- ...- . .-.. .. -. --. - --- .- -. . -..- --- - .. -.-. .-.. --- -.-. .- - .. --- -. - --- .-. . ... . .- .-. -.-. .... .- -.-. ..- .-. . ..-. --- .-. .- -.. . .- -.. .-.. -.-- -.. .. ... . .- ... . .-.-.- - 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.-- --- .-. -.- - --- --. . - .... . .-. .-.-.- --- ..- .-. .--. .-.. .- -. . - -- ..- ... - .-.. .. ...- . --- -. .- -. -.. .-- . .- .-. . - .... . --- -. . ... .-- .... --- -- ..- ... - . -. ... ..- .-. . - .... .- - .. - .... .- .--. .--. . -. ... .-.-.- -.-- --- ..- -.-. .- -. ... .. - -... .- -.-. -.- .- -. -.. .-- .- - -.-. .... - .... . -.-. --- ..- -. - .-.. . ... ... -.. . .- - .... ... .- -. -.. ...- .. --- .-.. . -. -.-. . --..-- -.-. .-. .. -- . .- -. -.. -.-. --- .-. .-. ..- .--. - .. --- -. --..-- --. .-. . . -.. .- -. -.. - .... . ..-. - --..-- .- .-.. .-.. - .... . .. -. .--- ..- ... - .. -.-. . .- -.-. .-. --- ... ... - .... . .-- --- .-. .-.. -.. .-.-.- --- .-. -.-- --- ..- -.-. .- -. --- .--. . -. -.-- --- ..- .-. . -.-- . ... .- -. -.. ... . . .--. .- ... - .. - .-.-.- -.-- . ... --..-- - .... . .-. . .-- .. .-.. .-.. ... - .. .-.. .-.. -... . .--. ... -.-- -.-. .... --- ... .-.-.- - .... . .-. . .-- .. .-.. .-.. ... - .. .-.. .-.. -... . .-..-. . ...- .. .-.. .-..-. -.--.- -- . -. - .- .-.. .-.. -.-- .. -. ... .- -. . .. -. .- ... .-.. .. --. .... - .-.. -.-- .-.. --- .-- . .-. -.. . --. .-. . . ..--.. -.--.- - .... . .-. . .-- .. .-.. .-.. ... - .. .-.. .-.. -... . .. -. - . -. - .. --- -. .- .-.. ...- .. --- .-.. . -. -.-. . .-.-.- ... --- .-- . .--. .-. --- -- --- - . .-. . ... . .- .-. -.-. .... .. -. - --- .-. . .- ... --- -. ... -... . .... .. -. -.. - .... . ... . .- -.-. - .. --- -. ... --..-- .... --- .-- - .... . -... .-. .- .. -. .-- --- .-. -.- ... --..-- .... --- .-- - --- .-. . -.. ..- -.-. . - .... . ... . -... . .... .- ...- .. --- .-. ... .-.-.- .-- . -.-. --- ..- .-.. -.. ... --- .-.. ...- . - .... . .--. .-. --- -... .-.. . -- ... --- ..-. -... .. .-. - .... -.. . ..-. . -.-. - ... .- -. -.. -- . -. - .- .-.. -.. .. ... --- .-. -.. . .-. ... .. ..-. --- -. .-.. -.-- .-- . .--. ..- - . -. --- ..- --. .... . ..-. ..-. --- .-. - .. -. - --- .-. . ... . .- .-. -.-. .... .. -. --. .. - .-.-.- .-- . -.-. --- ..- .-.. -.. -- .- -.- . .- .-.. .-.. .... ..- -- .- -. ... -... --- .-. -. .-..-. -. --- .-. -- .- .-.. .-..-. .. ..-. --- -. .-.. -.-- .-- . -.. . ...- --- - . -.. --- ..- .-. - .. -- . - --- ..-. .. -. -.. .. -. --. --- ..- - .-.-.- - .... . .-- --- .-. .-.. -.. -- ..- ... - -... . ..-. .. -..- . -.. .-.-.- I can also do it in American Sign Language, but it's hard to post that here.

[fuelair]

I smell a call to communism, but it doesn't work because of corruption and other variables that idealists forget to consider in their model of the perfect sharing society.
Hey!, some of us are more equal than others!! And don't you forget that, missy!!:)

[Eos of the Eons]

Hey!, some of us are more equal than others!! And don't you forget that, missy!!:)
:eye-poppi Yes sir.



















:D

I loved that book "Animal Farm (http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/animalfarm/)". I suggest the resident idealists here get a copy and read it ASAP.

[A W Smith]

do I have to read pages two and three before I post? ill Will, havent i seen you before? but in black and white (http://www.imdb.com/video/screenplay/vi183566617/)?

[A W Smith]

Well capitalism has also resulted in a mostly unhappy population. Like he says 50% of the world lives on under a dollar a day ( and no I'm not going to cite it because we all know that most people are in poverty in the world ).

The general behavior towards 'my Ill will' is a good indication of why we're in the mess we're in.

Look at yourselves and your reactions to this guy. You are part of the problem.

You are all indoctrinated and nurtured to the "Duck and cover", "Reds an your bed" and "Better dead than Red" mantra. So that every time someone points out a problem with the system the autonomic nervous system in you all bleeps like Robbi the Robot "Communism! Destroy! Communism Destroy! Communism! Destroy! Communism! Destroy! Communism! Destroy! Communism! Destroy! "

Can't you see why you've all been indoctrinated with the "Capitalism is best, everything else is Communism!" message generation after generation?

What seems to get forgotten time and time is human beings themselves.

Forget about capitalism, communism, and other 'isms' Start thinking about human beings.

Capitalism is not the best way if it's profit BEFORE people.
Communism is not the best way if it's Ideology BEFORE people.
Religion is not the best way if it's Scripture BEFORE people.

And in practise those above are always People Second

We need a system that puts ....

People FIRST profit SECOND
People FIRST Scripture SECOND


So instead of mocking my ill will, why not try putting some energy into improving the world.

My ill will's suggestions maybe wacky and unworkable solutions, but at least he's trying. What have YOU done?

It all sounds so romantic. till this

http://downtheroad.org/Asia/Photo/2Cambodia_Pictures/a10killing_field.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pol_Pot

[Cl1mh4224rd]

do I have to read pages two and three before I post? ill Will, havent i seen you before? but in black and white (http://www.imdb.com/video/screenplay/vi183566617/)?


Ooo... Maybe this is viral marketing for the remake (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0970416/) that's coming out soon.

Klaatu barada nikto!

[jhunter1163]

Diarrhea in particular....

Nominated. Brilliant rebuttal. I may save it and quote from it the next time an idealist shows up here.

[dtugg]

Okay...
I can also do it in American Sign Language, but it's hard to post that here.

How 'bout binary
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[CptColumbo]

How 'bout binary
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I'd do it in "Pig Latin" but I got stuff to do.

[WildCat]

No, my parents were not pigs and monkeys.
Evidence?







:p

[Elizabeth I]

I loved that book "Animal Farm (http://www.online-literature.com/orwell/animalfarm/)". I suggest the resident idealists here get a copy and read it ASAP.

...and remember the circumstances that inspired Orwell to write it.