PC to Mac

[Regnad Kcin]

Okay, seems I'm beginning to succumb to the spell of Apple the Magnificent. I'm not sure I can explain it. I see Macs in the stores, I like the fancy interface(s), the glamorous chic-ness of the things, and I'm beginning to think...maybe I will purchase one of my very own. And call it Irving.

Now, all I've ever owned are Windows-running PCs. And the one I'm using is perfectly fine, considering the extent of my needs are word processing and 'net surfing. I don't game. I don't Photoshop. I don't write, star in, and produce my own edgy, independent web-movies. So there's no reason to switch formats. That is, apart from my thinking a Mac might be fun to play with.

So my questions: Is such a move something I should not consider? Is there a downside? Will you stop laughing at my charming cluelessness?

[Wowbagger]

If you switch to the Mac, just remember that closing all the windows of an application does NOT always quit the application. It's still running in the background, even if no windows are open.
Unlike most Windows apps., where closing the window quits the whole application.

[Policenaut]

A downside? No besides parting with more money than is necessary for your basic needs. But if you don't care about the price then by all means get one. They are good machines for graphic design, editing, and such but are pretty much overkill if you are just doing basic tasks unless of course you just like OSX.

[monoman]

Okay, seems I'm beginning to succumb to the spell of Apple the Magnificent. I'm not sure I can explain it. I see Macs in the stores, I like the fancy interface(s), the glamorous chic-ness of the things, and I'm beginning to think...maybe I will purchase one of my very own. And call it Irving.

Now, all I've ever owned are Windows-running PCs. And the one I'm using is perfectly fine, considering the extent of my needs are word processing and 'net surfing. I don't game. I don't Photoshop. I don't write, star in, and produce my own edgy, independent web-movies. So there's no reason to switch formats. That is, apart from my thinking a Mac might be fun to play with.

So my questions: Is such a move something I should not consider? Is there a downside? Will you stop laughing at my charming cluelessness?

All the things that you've mentioned, and more, like graphic design, movies and music can all be done to the same standard on a PC anyway. In fact, these days, new versions of the software are released on the PC first because of the bigger market. (Just look at the irate Mac Cubase owners ;))

Having said that, if you have the spare cash, you should go for it. Maybe some day I will....

[six7s]

If you have more money than god and/or less of a grip on reality than S****a B****e, then go for it and enjoy word processing and web surfing on a machine that costs maybe four (or more) times more to replace what you already have, which does all you need

[skoob]

One thing to remember is that on modern Intel-based Macs it's possible to install Windows (or Linux ;) if you decide that Mac OS X isn't for you.

[HarryKeogh]

Consider an iMac as opposed to a MacBook. Their desktops aren't nearly as overpriced as their notebooks.

And keep in mind that despite what you hear it may very well crash or programs will stop responding just like Windows.

When you're ready to buy check out the buyer's guide (http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/) on Macrumors.com. They monitor the lifecycles of Apple products and tell you if it's a good time to buy based on when the product was last updated and when new product lines are expected to be released.

With that said, I love my Mac. I also love my Windows-based PC. At the end of the day, they both do the same crap pretty much as well as the other (at least for what I use a computer for; web-surfing, e-mail, storing and organizing music and photos, Office).

[El Greco]

You are the only one who can answer this question. Would you buy a Vacheron-Constantin ? If yes, then by all means get a Mac :D

[shawmutt]

Both mac and pcs have IBM processors, so add a two-button mouse to a mac and you have an overpriced, pretty PC.

If you want to try something different, download linux (I recommend Ubuntu) and give that a whirl. You can even download a bootable CD and try it from there.

Disclaimer:I hate macs with a passion, ever since my wife made me get her an iMac.

[Ian Osborne]

That's Intel processors. Macs haven't used IBM processors since the G5 range was discontinued two and a half years ago.

And let's not forget that Macs really annoy Claus Larsen. If that's not a bonus, I don't know what is! :-)

[drainbread]

Both mac and pcs have IBM processors, so add a two-button mouse to a mac and you have an overpriced, pretty PC.

If you want to try something different, download linux (I recommend Ubuntu) and give that a whirl. You can even download a bootable CD and try it from there.

Disclaimer:I hate macs with a passion, ever since my wife made me get her an iMac.

You can also do a live install onto a pen drive, if your pen drive is over 4GB you can do a regualr install and take your OS with you.

http://www.pendrivelinux.com/ubuntu-810-persistent-flash-drive-install-from-live-cd/

[shawmutt]

That's Intel processors. Macs haven't used IBM processors since the G5 range was discontinued two and a half years ago.

I still think in "IBM compatable"

And let's not forget that Macs really annoy Claus Larsen. If that's not a bonus, I don't know what is! :-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks-N4rI_1RUNSFW (f bombs)

Mac killed my inner child.

[uk_dave]

They are good machines for graphic design, editing, and such...


I've often wondered about this. In what way are they considered better?

I mean, is it better hardware? Faster?

Or is it just that Mac software is better than windows based software? Would AutoCad or Photoshop run differently on a Mac?

[Mongrel]

I've often wondered about this. In what way are they considered better?

I mean, is it better hardware? Faster?

Or is it just that Mac software is better than windows based software? Would AutoCad or Photoshop run differently on a Mac?

Mostly tradition and specialisation. Graphic work and DTP was one of the major reasons they stayed afloat in the '90s, most people who worked in those fields weren't technical so stuck with Macs because it's what they knew.

[Ernie M]

Are you thinking of buying a laptop or a desktop?
Either way, I'd recommend a Mac over a PC.

From an industrial design standpoint, Apple makes good use of materials, and they look good. It's the details that make a Mac really nice to own, such as relatively quiet keys when using the keyboard.

From a software standpoint, the Mac OS is reliable, and not prone to crashing. The graphical user interfaces on Mac programs seem to be more intuitive, and easy-to-understand/how-to-use, for a visually-inclined person such as myself.

If you would like help to decide if you want a Mac, you can schedule a Personal Shopping (http://www.apple.com/retail/personalshopping/) session at an Apple Retail Store near you. It doesn't cost you anything, and you get about an hour to talk and review your needs.

If you are thinking of a desktop, I'd suggest buying the latest 24" iMac for the following reasons:

• If you are word processing, the large 24" screen can pretty much view a full-size, 8 1/2" x 11" page without having to scroll to see the whole page.

• You can install Microsoft Word on the Mac if you want, but another word processing program to use instead could be Mac's iWork '09 (http://store.apple.com/us/product/MB942Z/A?fnode=MTY1NDAzOA&mco=MzA3MjU1Nw), "Pages." If necessary, you can export a "Pages" document so it will be able to be read in Microsoft Word if your colleague's use MS Word.

• Depending on how often you use your Mac, you can put it to "Sleep," rather than shutting it down, so when you use it next, just jiggle the mouse or hit a key on the keyboard, and almost instantaneously it will be up and running.

• The iMac 24" display is bright and clear. This screen could be good if you are browsing the Internet, and has the resolution if want to watch TV (including High Definition if you have the HD signal fed into your computer) using, say, an Elgato EyeTV product like Elgato EyeTV Hybrid (http://store.apple.com/us/product/TR374LL/A) or Elgato EyeTV 250 (http://store.apple.com/us/product/TR373LL/A).

Extra items I'd suggest you buy:

• An Uninterruptible Power Supply, known as a UPS, as battery back up. If you are using a desktop Mac, it doesn't have an internal battery like a laptop, so if the power to your home fails, your computer won't shut down properly. Having a UPS will hopefully give you time to properly shut down your computer until the power comes back on.

• An external hard drive. This will back up your computer hard drive to an external drive, so if your computer drive fails, you'll have another copy. What's good about the latest Mac Operating System, is it has a program called Time Machine. Time Machine can automatically back up your files, every hour, without you having to do this manually.

[elgarak]

I am amazed how many supposedly critical thinkers still purport the myth that Macs are overpriced.

They're not. They're expensive. But you get what you pay for. If you add all those things that are included in a Mac to a PC, you'll frequently end up with a machine around the same price, sometimes even higher (there's no cheaper all-in-one compuetr than the iMac). And if lower, I do not count a savings of $100 a significant deal breaker for an investment in a professional tool in the price range of $1k-$2k. In particular not when the company of choice has a great support system with more-or-less local access all over the place.

Now, a lot of people might say that they do not need all those little things that are included in a Mac. I thought so, too. It's pretty nice to have them, though. No need to greatly expand the system after a year or so.

[shawmutt]

I am amazed how many supposedly critical thinkers still purport the myth that Macs are overpriced.

MacBook Pro 17-inch
Specs:

2.66GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB 1066MHz DDR3 SDRAM - 2x2GB
320GB Serial ATA Drive @ 5400 rpm
SuperDrive 8x (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)
MacBook Pro 17-inch Hi-Resolution Glossy Widescreen Display

Price: $2,799.00

PC (Asus priced from newegg (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2034940032%2050001315&name=ASUS))

Specs:

CPU Type: Intel Core 2 Duo T9400 2.53G
Memory Size: 4GB DDR2
Hard Disk: 320GB
Optical Drive: DVD Super Multi
Screen: 17" WUXGA
Graphics Card: NVIDIA GeForce 9800M GS

Price: $1,499.99

Myth my ass.

[HarryKeogh]

I'm in agreement with shawmutt that their notebooks are overpriced (as I said earlier in this thread).

Here's a comparison of a Dell and Mac desktop (http://www.macworld.com/article/52381/2006/08/macproprice.html) that shows their prices in this area are much more competitive. Keep in mind the article's a couple of years old which in the world of computer world is approximately 600 years. But it does make a point.

[six7s]

I am amazed how many supposedly critical thinkers still purport the myth that Macs are overpriced.

They're not. They're expensive. But you get what you pay for. If you add all those things that are included in a Mac to a PC, you'll frequently end up with a machine around the same price, sometimes even higher (there's no cheaper all-in-one compuetr than the iMac). Complete and utter bollocks!

Read the OP

Requirements:
word processing and 'net surfing. I don't game. I don't Photoshop. I don't write, star in, and produce my own edgy, independent web-movies


If you, a supposedly critical thinker, convincingly recommend a Mac to Regnad Kcin, he (?) won't get what he pays for, he will pay for a whole bunch o' gunk and junk he doesn't need

[shawmutt]

Agreed. Ya want something different that meets your requirements, I'll say it a second time--download and install Ubuntu (http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu). The price is right--free! All the free applications you can ask for! OpenOffice, Firefox, pretty interface. You still get to scoff at those sheepish Windows users (which from what I have seen and been through is the only real benefit of owning a Mac.)

[six7s]

The price is right--free! For the software, yep

How any "supposedly critical thinker" can recommend over-priced hardware baffles me

[Zax63]

There is no practical reason for someone with your expressed needs to get a Mac. They are nice machines with some very nice software. Only you can decide if the fun and coolness factors are worth it to you. Let's say it's a $500 difference. To some that is putting food on the table or not. To others it might be a pair of shoes or a night out on the town. I suggest you price out your alternatives, think of other things you might want to use the money for and try to come to an answer that way.
Do you have any interest in taking pictures or movies? You may find that iPhoto and iMovie give you a reason to take more and do more with what you do take. If that holds no interest for you at all then I would recommend that you save your money. I would recommend that anyway but I spend way too much on "toys" to stand in anyone's way when it comes to buying stuff they don't need.

[shadron]

Nobody expects the Spanish Inquisition!

[GreNME]

I am amazed how many supposedly critical thinkers still purport the myth that Macs are overpriced.

They're not. They're expensive. But you get what you pay for. If you add all those things that are included in a Mac to a PC, you'll frequently end up with a machine around the same price, sometimes even higher (there's no cheaper all-in-one compuetr than the iMac). And if lower, I do not count a savings of $100 a significant deal breaker for an investment in a professional tool in the price range of $1k-$2k. In particular not when the company of choice has a great support system with more-or-less local access all over the place.

Now, a lot of people might say that they do not need all those little things that are included in a Mac. I thought so, too. It's pretty nice to have them, though. No need to greatly expand the system after a year or so.

I disagree on the price thing. The Mac Pro line costs an incredible premium for what you get, but what you're paying for in the cost also includes the name branding and the admittedly sleek case for the tower. I've done comparisons to meet the needs of my girlfriend's work (she's a web developer), and the Mac Pro she would need costs between $1000-$3000 more than a PC with equivalent hardware, depending on the manufacturer and whether a lesser-known manufacturer (with equal warranties) can be used. A best equivalent to the Mac Pro line would probably be the HP line of towers for name branding, available components, and style.

On the notebook side of things, I have a Macbook Pro that basically retailed at somewhere between $2300-$2500 without any extra software, while the girlfriend managed to get a Dell XPS notebook with almost point-by-point the same features (except for a larger and faster hard drive), including a built-in biomentric fingerprint scanner and Acrobat Standard, for just under $2100 (3-year full warranty and accidental damage included). Granted, I managed to get my MBP at a serious discount while we paid full price for hers, but hers had a higher priority and was needed more quickly than mine, otherwise I probably could have saved a few more bucks on it as well (or gotten an even beefier setup for the same price).

Does that mean that Macs are overpriced? No, not exactly. It means that Macs do carry a premium over many other brands and the consumer will likely pay more buying Apple hardware than they will from most other manufacturers. Even the Mini line of Macs has increased in price over the last two years, making me lament not getting one sooner. But regardless, that's the way Apple works and most of the Mac owners I know personally have very little problem with it. They consider it similar in concept to buying a BMW versus buying a Toyota-- you might get the same engineering at a lower price, but there might be a difference in elegance of design or comfort of operation that makes a difference to some people... but not everyone. It's that later segment, the ones for whom it may not make a difference, to whom the cost may seem arbitrarily or unnecessarily high. And in all honesty, I don't consider it unreasonable in most cases. For some people it's a matter of needs versus wants, for others it's a matter of justifying even the slightest amount of premiums to any product, and for others it can be other things. I definitely fall into the "needs versus wants" crowd, even though I have enough resources to have afforded one anyway to meet my needs and wants-- I consider it a luxury purchase, though a luxury from which I can still gain value.

As for switching from a PC to the Mac? Wowbagger covered a big one by pointing out that programs on the Mac don't quit by closing the window like they do on Windows PCs. Other than that, it's really going to be a matter of preference and what you normally do with a personal computer that will dictate what you need to be cognizant of. I usually tend to suggest using Firefox instead of Safari and Thunderbird instead of Mail.app, but for some people using Safari and Mail.app is the preferred way to do things. I say go ahead and fiddle around with stuff and try to find what works best for you. If you have any specific questions I'm sure that you can find at least six different answers to any one question here, and probably as many solutions if you run into a problem.

[Rolfe]

Suppose one did want to switch to a Mac. What about accumulated files in Windows-readable formats?

Rolfe.

[elgarak]

Suppose one did want to switch to a Mac. What about accumulated files in Windows-readable formats?

Rolfe.

Not a problem. I am fairly confident that I can read anything in any Windows-related format.

(Apple's TextEdit [comes with every Mac] can read Word 2007 texts, for instance.)

There are two (free) packages called Flip4Mac and Perian that take care of all kinds of video formats.

There are a handful of specialized applications that have no direct Mac equivalent (most notably, Autodesk's AutoCAD). Nevertheless, the CAD program I use on Mac OS X, while no direct replacement for AutoCAD, can read and write Autodesk's formats. Works for me, since I rarely have to make CAD designs myself; I just have to review them.

[Zax63]

Suppose one did want to switch to a Mac. What about accumulated files in Windows-readable formats?

Rolfe.

Most of the common graphic, audio and video formats are easily viewed on either OS. For word processing and spreadsheet type files Open Office(free!) will read most Microsoft Office documents and there is a version of MS Office for the Mac if needed.

[elgarak]

MacBook Pro 17-inch
Specs:

2.66GHz Intel Core 2 Duo
4GB 1066MHz DDR3 SDRAM - 2x2GB
320GB Serial ATA Drive @ 5400 rpm
SuperDrive 8x (DVD±R DL/DVD±RW/CD-RW)
MacBook Pro 17-inch Hi-Resolution Glossy Widescreen Display

Price: $2,799.00

PC (Asus priced from newegg (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2034940032%2050001315&name=ASUS))

Specs:

CPU Type: Intel Core 2 Duo T9400 2.53G
Memory Size: 4GB DDR2
Hard Disk: 320GB
Optical Drive: DVD Super Multi
Screen: 17" WUXGA
Graphics Card: NVIDIA GeForce 9800M GS

Price: $1,499.99

Myth my ass.
I find it kinda dishonest to pick the new aluminum MacBook Pro that features a battery that no other manufacturer can match. How much does Apple overcharge for that when you have no reference point?

Do you think the Acer will get anywhere near the Apple's advertised 8 hour battery life (probably still 7 hours for real life usage, based on my experience with the MacBook battery)? How much are you willing to pay for that extended battery life? You might say you don't need it; I thought I don't either, since I'm pretty much always use the computer near a power outlet. But again, in real life it's extremely nice to have a reliable long battery runtime (battery runtime, BTW, is a feature that most manufacturers hide in the fine print, and they can only match Apple's with bulky optional expensive battery packs).

[elgarak]

How about the aluminum cases of the new MacBooks in general?

It's obviously a feature you have to pay for. Are there other manufacturers that offer full-metal enclosures for significantly less?

(Again, you might say you don't need it. I see a notebook as a portable machine, and one of the features I wanted my notebook to have when I researched for one that ended in me getting a MacBook was sturdiness.)

[six7s]

I find it kinda dishonest to pick the new aluminum MacBook Pro that features a battery that no other manufacturer can match.Yeah... fairy nuff...

Sorta like telling someone looking for advice on hardware to support word processing and 'net surfing software the following:
I am amazed how many supposedly critical thinkers still purport the myth that Macs are overpriced.

They're not. They're expensive. But you get what you pay for. <marketingHypeAkaLiesSnipped/>

[elgarak]

Yeah... fairy nuff...

Sorta like telling someone looking for advice on hardware to support word processing and 'net surfing software the following:

Irving seems to be well aware that Macs (well, pretty much any computer) are overpowered and overfeatured for what he needs to do.

The question only is if he is willing to spend the money on what he wants to do. That's something that no one can answer for him.

[six7s]

Who TF is Irving?
That's something that no one can answer for him.
So what?

My question to you is:

Why do you, presumably one of the "supposedly critical thinkers", wade in with irrelevancies and lies?

[elgarak]

Who TF is Irving?

So what?

My question to you is:

Why do you, presumably one of the "supposedly critical thinkers", wade in with irrelevancies and lies?
Where did I lie?

[six7s]

Where did I lie?Use this simple technique to figure it out for yourself:

eliminate the bits where you are telling teh troof, teh whole troof and nothing but teh troof
the remainder = your lies

Easy, huh?

:)

[elgarak]

Use this simple technique to figure it out for yourself:

eliminate the bits where you are telling teh troof, teh whole troof and nothing but teh troof
the remainder = your lies

Easy, huh?

:)

So, opinion are lies, no?

[jnelso99]

I find it kinda dishonest to pick the new aluminum MacBook Pro that features a battery that no other manufacturer can match. How much does Apple overcharge for that when you have no reference point?

Do you think the Acer will get anywhere near the Apple's advertised 8 hour battery life (probably still 7 hours for real life usage, based on my experience with the MacBook battery)? How much are you willing to pay for that extended battery life?

So an 8-hour battery life is worth the $1300 premium? Are Apple's batteries made out of adamantium or something?

Oh, sorry, forgot the aluminum case in that $1300. And the Apple logo.

[Zax63]

Who TF is Irving?


Okay, seems I'm beginning to succumb to the spell of Apple the Magnificent. I'm not sure I can explain it. I see Macs in the stores, I like the fancy interface(s), the glamorous chic-ness of the things, and I'm beginning to think...maybe I will purchase one of my very own. And call it Irving.


Bolding mine.
Apparently Irving is the potential Mac and elgarak got a bit confused.:)

[GreNME]

I find it kinda dishonest to pick the new aluminum MacBook Pro that features a battery that no other manufacturer can match. How much does Apple overcharge for that when you have no reference point?

Do you think the Acer will get anywhere near the Apple's advertised 8 hour battery life (probably still 7 hours for real life usage, based on my experience with the MacBook battery)? How much are you willing to pay for that extended battery life? You might say you don't need it; I thought I don't either, since I'm pretty much always use the computer near a power outlet. But again, in real life it's extremely nice to have a reliable long battery runtime (battery runtime, BTW, is a feature that most manufacturers hide in the fine print, and they can only match Apple's with bulky optional expensive battery packs).

And, as is typical when brand-fanaticism creeps into a discussion, the shifting goalposts start to come out.

Sorry, but the extra battery is not worth the $1300 difference in the comparison you replied to, nor is it worth the roughly $300 in my own comparison between my girlfriends and mine. An extra battery or an extended battery are both cheaper than the difference.

Also, my MBP does not give me seven hours of run time, so unless you're using the battery life claims of the latest-and-greatest from Apple's recent announcement-- you know, the built-in battery that you will not be able to remove and replace yourself-- then I don't know where your claims are coming from as far as having any basis in fact instead of the RDF.

I like my Macbook Pro (15"). I love it, actually. There's no way in hell I'll touch the new 17" MBP offerings now, though. I can change the oil in my car, the pilot on my stove, the light in my fridge, and a number of other things, so I'll be damned if I can't change the battery in my notebook. That's one of the primary reasons I still refuse to bother with the iPhone.

[six7s]

Oh, sorry, forgot the aluminum case in that $1300. And the Apple logo.

Money well spent?

MacBook Wheel (http://www.theonion.com/content/video/apple_introduces_revolutionary)
I'll buy anything that's shiny and made by Apple

[theMark]

So if you can afford it, why not? If all else fails, install Windows on your mac and enjoy the shiny enclosure :)

Changing from Windows to MacOS takes some getting used to, especially when it comes to the keyboard. "Muscle memory" is the enemy here.

Examples:
"Windows" key is where the "Command" key of MacOS X is, but it behaves differently - on Windows, the Start menu pops up, while on Mac, it's a "modifier" like the shift key. So no accidental menus jumping all over the screen.
And the "@" is at alt-L, not alt-Q.
A program's menus are always at the top of the screen. Conscious design decision. The windows menus are "nearer", but they are a 2-d target, while the Mac menu bar is a 1-d target since the mouse pointer stops at the edge of the screen.

Mouse acceleration is somewhat different. Mouse pointer doesn't jump around that much, compared to Windows. This is totally subjective, of course.
If your planned Mac doesn't come with keyboard and mouse (read: Mac mini, all others come with keyboard and mouse included), then: Buy a multi-button mouse. With a scroll wheel. Any USB mouse will do. Doesn't need drivers, they are included. A Mac keyboard with the symbols printed on "right" makes it easier than a repurposed Windows keyboard.

Keyboard shortcuts (e.g. Command-X, -C, -V and lots of others, e.g. Command-P for print) are rather consistent between applications.
Remember, the command key is where the windows key was. After about a week, your fingers will have learned.



From here on down, anecdotes and nostalgia take over. You've been warned. :)

I like the ultra-flat new aluminium keyboard. Some don't. I type a lot of texts, and I like it. That's all I can say about that.

The supplied software (iDVD, iMovie, iPhoto, iTunes and, to break with the iTheme, GarageBand) goes a long way already. The built-in dictionary and thesaurus based on the New Oxford collection are a nice touch, too. iTunes has kept me busy for quite some weeks when I initially fed it my CD collection, but that was totally worth it. Nothing like a jukebox of all music, neatly ordered and ready to rock at all times.

Some other things you might want to check out or install, since they're free, are:
- OpenOffice (open source, handles most Microsoft Office stuff rather well)
- Perian (an add-on codec suite for video playback of probably more video formats than you'll find)
- "VideoLAN client" (VLC)
- Skype (video chat, cross-platform)
- Text Wrangler (a no-frills text editor),
- Thunderbird/Firefox. Always nice to have a choice of browser/mail software. I don't like the built-in Mail application all that much. Thunderbird's more my thing. I dig the Safari browser, though.

I can not speak for anyone else, but I've been using "both sides of the fence" since Mac OS 7.5 (and 7.6 and 8 and 8.1 and 8.5 and 9 and 10.0) and Windows 3.1 (and 3.11 and 95 and 98 and XP) and I still prefer Mac for just about anything except hired programming for Windows-based exhibition screens. Throw in the odd flirt with Ubuntu some time around 2006, running "faceless" on a mail server ever since) and that's about the extent of my computing history.

I recently loaned one of my elder machines (800 MHz) to a former co-worker since he "wanted to take a look" and "got tired of building his own PCs" (that guy ran a part-time PC shop for a few years). Some weeks later, he bought a Mac mini from a mail-order retailer. Another half year later, the mini's now his daughter's machine (with XP for the occasional video game), and he's moved up to an iMac.

He likes the built-in backup-and-recovery, not only for moving from the mini to the iMac with all settings intact, but even more so when for reasons unknown, Microsoft Excel/Mac Edition from Mircrosoft Office Mac 2008 killed the operating system good after the initial run. Boot from DVD, attach backup disk, up and runnning again.

Yes, crashes happen. Rarely, though. The two worst breakdowns I experienced personally over, say, the last five years were 1) a broken peripheral that would bring my Mac Pro to a total halt ("kernel panic") upon being plugged in and 2) a fried RAM chip that rendered my Mac mini a brain-dead lunch box (kinda hard to diagnose since it started with erratic freezes and crashes, but once I flipped the memory modules back to the original ones, it was back to rock-solid operation. RAM exchanged under warranty. Of course, by then, the data corruption had spread to the hard disk as the cached data in RAM had been written back to the disk. Again, auto-backup restore to the rescue... Oh, and the (turned squeaky) fan of the mini was fixed under warranty, and now it's even-less-than-whisper-quiet again and sitting by one of those fashionable flat screens, tethered to it via DVI-to-HDMI cable. Makes for a very nice DVD player, too :)

Well, that's about it. I wouldn't want to be forced to go Windows any time soon. And I'm willing to pay a little more if it means I can stick with the OS/desktop environment which I very, very much prefer to use for hours each day.

Mmh. Just the clean, crisp font anti-aliasing alone :)

[shawmutt]

Acer is junk. I said Asus.

Big difference.

I'd really like to see how much difference an aluminum chassis makes in sturdiness. Sure it sounds more sturdy, a solid block of aluminum? WOAH! But I'm...gasp...skeptical and would need to see some proof. The case may hold up to bumps, but the internal components would be more susceptible to damage (my thinking is comparing the solid cars of old to the "crumple zone" cars today, correct me if I'm wrong).

The battery does sound really nice, not worth all that extra money for my uses, but I can definitely see the benefits. I just wonder what sort of performance hit I would need to take to get that battery life. Here's the rub--I can buy a couple extra batteries for my laptop at $100 a pop, charge them up, and throw them in my laptop case. They really don't take up that much room, I don't give up performance, and there's my 7-8 hours of battery life.

[geni]

Now, all I've ever owned are Windows-running PCs. And the one I'm using is perfectly fine, considering the extent of my needs are word processing and 'net surfing. I don't game. I don't Photoshop. I don't write, star in, and produce my own edgy, independent web-movies. So there's no reason to switch formats. That is, apart from my thinking a Mac might be fun to play with.


If you want to play with non windows OS running through the open source ones will provide you with far more options than a mac (and cost less too). That said if you end up haveing an option to multi boot linux, BSD, Haiku, GNU Hurd, AROS, LoseThos, Prex and Syllable I refuse to accept responcibility. I will be rather impressed though.

[Blackadder]

I bought my current PC in 2006 (something that was just 1 step below the top of the line, I always do that you get 90% of the performance for 50-60% of the price)

It still does everything I want except running Far Cry 2 on a reasonable speed and it hasn't failed me once. I won't buy a new pc before 2010, maybe 2011

[Rolfe]

Slightly off-topic, but in my ramblings about word processors, I've been saying that the first one I met was Word. (This was in about 1991, for reference.)

In fact the programme in question was on a friend's classic Mac. In retrospect I remember it as being very like Word indeed, and could even have been called Word. But it was a short relationship and my memory may be faulty.

I'm not likely to have met Word on a Mac in 1991, am I? Not really. So can anyone tell me what I was actually using for those few days that summer? Probably a native bundled Mac word processor I suppose - but it did look very very like MS Word to me, as far as I remember.

Actually, I really liked that Mac. When I got Win 3.1 myself a few months later, on what was for the time a pretty cool notebook, I was fairly peeved by the clunky differences. I still remember that ancient Mac as booting faster than my 2009-vintage PC. It's the price, and the thought of problems with file compatibility, that keeps me stuck with Windows. I mean, when you use a PC at work every day, why ask for trouble?

I did think Apple's product placement in Buffy the Vampire Slayer was a neat bit of marketing though. Every time Willow opened her spiffy notebook, we got a flash of that Apple logo.

Rolfe.

[shadron]

Probably Word Perfect.

"At the height of its popularity in the late 1980s and early 1990s, it was the de facto (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/De_facto) standard word processor, but has since been eclipsed in sales by Microsoft Word (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Office_Word). Although the MS-DOS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MS-DOS) and Microsoft Windows (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Windows) versions are best known[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)], its popularity was based in part on the fact that it was available for a wide variety of computers and operating systems[citation needed (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Citation_needed)], including Mac OS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mac_OS), Linux (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux), the Apple IIe (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_IIe), a separate version for the Apple IIgs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_IIgs), most popular versions of Unix (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix), VMS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OpenVMS), Data General (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_General), System/370 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/System/370), AmigaOS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AmigaOS), Atari ST (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atari_ST), OS/2 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/OS/2), and NeXTSTEP (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nextstep)."

[Rolfe]

Nope. WordPerfect is what I use now, and have used since that 1991 Windows 3.1 notebook purchase (don't see why I should downgrade to Word just because MS has better marketing). I was pretty struck by its differences from both Word and whatever that Mac programme was - especially the reveal codes procedure.

One of the major features of WordPerfect is the html-like coding which can be completely viewed and edited in its own viewing window, while the Mac programme had the dots and symbols and so on that clutter up the Word text when you do a reveal codes. That's really the main reason I assumed it was Word.

ETA - the thing it really looked like was the word processor in MS Works.

Rolfe.

[geni]

I'm not likely to have met Word on a Mac in 1991, am I? Not really.

Word 3.1 would have been out at that point so posible. Wikipedia thinks that that is about the time MS word became domiant on the mac platform.


I still remember that ancient Mac as booting faster than my 2009-vintage PC.


Likely. Only fairly recently that people have got interested in boot times and you are effectively running a 2001/2004 vintage OS (depends on how significant you think service pack 2 was)


It's the price, and the thought of problems with file compatibility, that keeps me stuck with Windows. I mean, when you use a PC at work every day, why ask for trouble?


That is traditionaly the core of the MS marketing stratergy.


I did think Apple's product placement in Buffy the Vampire Slayer was a neat bit of marketing though. Every time Willow opened her spiffy notebook, we got a flash of that Apple logo.


Apple do a lot of product placement of that type.

[Rolfe]

Word 3.1 would have been out at that point so posible. Wikipedia thinks that that is about the time MS word became domiant on the mac platform.


OK, that's the answer. I'd just begun to imagine that the two companies were such deadly rivals that a Microsoft product wouldn't be seen dead on a Mac.

Rolfe.

[shawmutt]

Don't overlook OpenOffice (http://www.openoffice.org/). I decided to give it a real try when I bought my new laptop, and it's pretty impressive and robust for a free program.

[ddt]

Slightly off-topic, but in my ramblings about word processors, I've been saying that the first one I met was Word. (This was in about 1991, for reference.)

In fact the programme in question was on a friend's classic Mac. In retrospect I remember it as being very like Word indeed, and could even have been called Word. But it was a short relationship and my memory may be faulty.

I'm not likely to have met Word on a Mac in 1991, am I? Not really.
Yes you are. I did use MS Word on the Mac (the model that was later sold as "Classic") in 1990.

Actually, MS Word first got off on Mac before it got off on the PC platform. The DOS versions of MS Word sucked, and were no match for WordPerfect. The Windows versions of MS Word were implemented after the Mac implementations; remember that the Mac had a graphic desktop from around 1985, whereas Windows hadn't really hit off in 1990.

MS Word has always been the primary word processor for the Mac platform, and Microsoft has also used that as leverage in Apple's "look and feel" lawsuit.

[Regnad Kcin]

Thanks to all for the informative replies.

[Policenaut]

If you are technically savvy or know someone who is you can buy an MSI Wind netbook and install OSX on it. It's a process but there are detailed instructions on the interwebs if you are interested. It's the cheapest fully compatible hackintosh laptop around if you know what you are doing.

[Bell]

Regnad, if you do decide to buy an iMac, take note of Harry Keogh's comment:

When you're ready to buy check out the buyer's guide (http://buyersguide.macrumors.com/) on Macrumors.com. They monitor the lifecycles of Apple products and tell you if it's a good time to buy based on when the product was last updated and when new product lines are expected to be released.

I want to buy a new iMac (and hoped they would be unveiled at MacWorld this month - alas, they did not) but I'll wait for the new models to come out. They are long overdue (according to Macrumor's standards) and I would hate to buy a new toy and find out a week later a new model is released.