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Dr Adequate
29th January 2009, 01:29 AM
I came across this quote by Freeman Dyson ... discuss.

The technologies which have had the most profound effects on human life are usually simple. A good example of a simple technology with profound historical consequences is hay. Nobody knows who invented hay, the idea of cutting grass in the autumn and storing it in large enough quantities to keep horses and cows alive through the winter. All we know is that the technology of hay was unknown to the Roman Empire but was known to every village of medieval Europe. Like many other crucially important technologies, hay emerged anonymously during the so-called Dark Ages. According to the Hay Theory of History, the invention of hay was the decisive event which moved the center of gravity of urban civilization from the Mediterranean basin to Northern and Western Europe. The Roman Empire did not need hay because in a Mediterranean climate the grass grows well enough in winter for animals to graze. North of the Alps, great cities dependent on horses and oxen for motive power could not exist without hay. So it was hay that allowed populations to grow and civilizations to flourish among the forests of Northern Europe. Hay moved the greatness of Rome to Paris and London, and later to Berlin and Moscow and New York.

timhau
29th January 2009, 01:39 AM
I like that quote.

Let me just add that the invention of hay eventually brought pollution problems. Horsie poo was a real problem in Victorian London, for example.

plumjam
29th January 2009, 01:51 AM
It's a fascinating, insightful quote.. and as a hypothesis there's stacks of evidence for it.

Silentknight
30th January 2009, 03:19 PM
I like that quote.

Let me just add that the invention of hay eventually brought pollution problems. Horsie poo was a real problem in Victorian London, for example.

It was a concept that already worked for people by the time horses were domesticated. The harvesting and storage of edible grasses I mean, not the taking of dumps on the ground.

dakotajudo
30th January 2009, 05:12 PM
All we know is that the technology of hay was unknown to the Roman Empire but was known to every village of medieval Europe.
Probably not.

http://www.hayinart.com/2003_11.html

The rest of the quote is equally inaccurate.

timhau
31st January 2009, 02:45 AM
It was a concept that already worked for people by the time horses were domesticated. The harvesting and storage of edible grasses I mean, not the taking of dumps on the ground.

I'm pretty sure the concept of taking a dump on the ground was already worked out at that time.

Slayhamlet
31st January 2009, 04:03 AM
Cato Maior, De agri cultura LIII: Faenum, ubi tempus erit, secato cavetoque ne sero seces. Priusquam semen maturum siet, secato, et quod optimum faenum erit, seorsum condito, per ver cum arabunt, antequam ocinum des, quod edint boves.

"When it is the right season, cut the hay and make sure not to cut it too late. Harvest it before the seed is ripe and store the best hay apart from the rest so that the oxen may eat it during the springtime when they plough, before you feed them clover."

Dr Adequate
31st January 2009, 04:38 AM
Thanks, people. I guess Dyson should have stuck to the geodesic domes.