Whatever happens...

[King of the Americas]

...is God's Will.

The State of Nature of God's most basic will, and Men wrote and continue to act in conflict with most of the Laws of Nature.

Men often act to save that which the Laws of Nature would do away with, and thus rejoice in their increased civility.

Are these acts sincerely in conflict with God?

---

The State of Nature demands a much stronger, independent, capable being. Many whom find refuge and comfort in governmentalized civility would soon see their end, if thye were cast back into the State of Nature...

So where does that leave us, and which direction are we going in?

Have you seen the details in the Terri Schiavo Case?

-------***-------

God, the Collective, not the Singular...

[Peter Jenkins]

Whatever happens...is God's Will.

The State of Nature of God's most basic will, and Men wrote and continue to act in conflict with most of the Laws of Nature.

Men often act to save that which the Laws of Nature would do away with, and thus rejoice in their increased civility.

Are these acts sincerely in conflict with God?

Yup!!
God wants kids to die of measles, tetanus and polio.......that's nature's way.......therefore that's god swill.
God hates air conditioning, computers and electric shavers as well as fags
these are all unnatural and involve defiling mother nature (or father nature, in the case of fags)
god is a god of hate and of fear, let us all rejoice and praise him (or else he might smite us even unto the tenth generation)
P

[King of the Americas]

...you are mistaking God's Will with the Laws within the State of Nature, where only the strongest and best evolved survive.

That Man's Law considers itself increasingly civil in its providing for those who can't...

...or "couldn't" if forced into the State of Nature.

[Psiload]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
...is God's Will.

The State of Nature of God's most basic will, and Men wrote and continue to act in conflict with most of the Laws of Nature.

Men often act to save that which the Laws of Nature would do away with, and thus rejoice in their increased civility.

Are these acts sincerely in conflict with God?

---

The State of Nature demands a much stronger, independent, capable being. Many whom find refuge and comfort in governmentalized civility would soon see their end, if thye were cast back into the State of Nature...

So where does that leave us, and which direction are we going in?

Have you seen the details in the Terri Schiavo Case?

-------***-------

God, the Collective, not the Singular...
As per usual, you're all over the place here... what are you trying to say? That human compassion is contrary to the will of God? That it's wrong to attempt to save that which would be lost without human intervention?

This reminds me of a conversation that I had with a couple of crusty old fisherman in a pub in Northwestern Ireland. They were telling me how, way back in the day, a fisherman who fell out of his boat was as good as dead. One, because the fishermen in the area rarely learned how to swim, and two, because your fellow fisherman would not come to your rescue...

Hey, it was God's will that you went into the drink, and who are they to question His decisions?

Maybe they were just yanking my chain, but they sure seemed serious about the subject... even when I commented, "Not even to ask the poor floundering chump, "Hey Paddy! You won't be needing it, toss us your watch!"? They just answered with a straight-faced, "Nope, we just watched him go under."

[King of the Americas]

Well, this is EXACTLY the point I am addressing.

I've heard similiar stories of blantant incivility.

I say that whatever happens is God's Will, in that We decide how civil We are, in our exercise of Free Will.

I just ask which direction are we going and what will be the result?

[Nyarlathotep]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
Well, this is EXACTLY the point I am addressing.

I've heard similiar stories of blantant incivility.

I say that whatever happens is God's Will, in that We decide how civil We are, in our exercise of Free Will.

I just ask which direction are we going and what will be the result?

For one thing, you presuppose that there is a God to have a will.

For another, may I suggest that you ask your shrink to up the dosage on your meds. You are babbling incoherently.

[King of the Americas]

3 concepts:

State of Nature- only the strongest, most fit, most adapted survive

Man's Law of Civility- that we are constantly amending and changing our standards

Free Will- God's gift to Men, and in their collectivity is God's will decided...

...thus whatever happens, is God's Will.

Does that tie it all up?

[hgc]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
3 concepts:

State of Nature- only the strongest, most fit, most adapted survive

Man's Law of Civility- that we are constantly amending and changing our standards

Free Will- God's gift to Men, and in their collectivity is God's will decided...

...thus whatever happens, is God's Will.

Does that tie it all up? Says everything and nothing all at once. Perfect symmetry. Thanks.
Psiload:

... because the fishermen in the area rarely learned how to swim...Fishermen that can't swim. If that ain't unnatural, I don't know what is.

[Nyarlathotep]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
3 concepts:

State of Nature- only the strongest, most fit, most adapted survive

Man's Law of Civility- that we are constantly amending and changing our standards

Free Will- God's gift to Men, and in their collectivity is God's will decided...

...thus whatever happens, is God's Will.

Does that tie it all up?

Only if you assume that there is a God. Which is a big assumption. I still think that your shrink needs to up your meds.

[Psiload]

King of the Americas wrote:

I say that whatever happens is God's Will, in that We decide how civil We are, in our exercise of Free Will.

Contradictory... if it's God's will, then it is not our own free will, and if it's our own free will, then it is not God's will. Either He is pulling the strings, or He is not.

To bring this out of the realm of the pointlessly philisophical, and into the real world... please favor us with your opinion regarding the current happenings in the Terri Schiavo case. Realistically speaking... save your philisophical meanderings for your book club, or quilting bee meetings.

[King of the Americas]

...I know that 'some men' believe in God, and that they are enough to cause use to LEAVE to the State of Nature and form government/civility.

If Newton was right, and everything has an equal and opposite reaction, then 'something' must have caused Men to 'react' in a godly manner...

---

Terri Schiavo...

...can not swallow, and does not realize when or if she is hungry or thursty.

If you don't know you are dying, then are you actually alive?

Would you force feed a pet if they were unwilling to eat or drink?

I think we should help people who are fighting for life, and I think it is civil disobedence to NOT help someone asking for it.

I think Terri's case is indicative of, or a reminder that there are those who carry the sentiment that one should fight for those who can't fight for themselves.

[Psiload]

King of the Americas wrote:

...I know that 'some men' believe in God, and that they are enough to cause use to LEAVE to the State of Nature and form government/civility.

If Newton was right, and everything has an equal and opposite reaction, then 'something' must have caused Men to 'react' in a godly manner...

So, all civility and govermental organization stems from a belief in a higher power? Then what about the examples of just these types of things occurring in the animal kingdom? Certain animals often display civility, compassion, etc... and there are most certainly example of animals forming rudimentary societies with basic forms of organized governing bodies. Should we take it that these animals are inspired by a belief in a higher power?

Terri Schiavo... yada, yada, yada...

Once again, you've failed to state an unambiguous position on the matter... I'm starting to doubt wether or not you have the ability to do anything besides spout self-contradictory doublespeak.

Yes or No... should Terri Schiavo's husband be allowed to exercise his LEGAL right to decide her fate?

[Starrman]

The State of Nature of God's most basic will, and Men wrote and continue to act in conflict with most of the Laws of Nature.

So the spaceships that you saw defy the laws of physics were piloted by atheists aliens?

[Jocko]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
3 concepts:

State of Nature- only the strongest, most fit, most adapted survive

And wheelchair-bound idiots are left to the wolves.

Man's Law of Civility- that we are constantly amending and changing our standards

And wheelchair-bound idiots are granted a stipend from taxpayers, essentially rewarding their idiocy in getting themselves crippled in the first place by getting drunk and going for a drive with another drunk.

Free Will- God's gift to Men, and in their collectivity is God's will decided...

And wheelchair-bound idiots are ignored and marginalized on the internet. All praise Jesus.

...thus whatever happens, is God's Will.

Fortune favors children and fools, Knabe, which is why you live in a society that favors option #2.... fool.

Does that tie it all up?

Sure does. Off the Prozac, and on the Welbutrin, are we?

[Jocko]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
...I know that 'some men' believe in God, and that they are enough to cause use to LEAVE to the State of Nature and form government/civility.

If Newton was right, and everything has an equal and opposite reaction, then 'something' must have caused Men to 'react' in a godly manner...

Ah, so Newton's 3rd law of motion proves God exists.

Gotcha.

Terri Schiavo...

...can not swallow, and does not realize when or if she is hungry or thursty.

If you don't know you are dying, then are you actually alive?

Would you force feed a pet if they were unwilling to eat or drink?

I think we should help people who are fighting for life, and I think it is civil disobedence to NOT help someone asking for it.

I think Terri's case is indicative of, or a reminder that there are those who carry the sentiment that one should fight for those who can't fight for themselves.

Well, your opinion is, shall we say... biased?

[Ratman_tf]

Whatever happens...

...is God's Will.


A convenient excuse. Totally indistinguishable from there not being a god.

[Yahweh]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
If Newton was right, and everything has an equal and opposite reaction, then 'something' must have caused Men to 'react' in a godly manner...


Sorry, what you just described "something must have caused men to react" is not the 2nd Law of Motion, what you described sounds closer to a type of Causation (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=law%20of%20universal%20causation). The type you are describing states all actions are the totality of all the actions which preceded it (or something like that).

Newton's Third Law of Motion applies to material bodies in motion, it has nothing to do with the cognitive processes that occur inside one's head.

[Yahweh]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
I say that whatever happens is God's Will, in that We decide how civil We are, in our exercise of Free Will.

This is self-contradictory.

"Whatever happens is God's Will" and "we decide how civil we are in our exercise of Free Will" are mutually exclusive. You cannot assess that all actions are the result of Gods Will and claim humans are responsible for their own actions at their own free will at the same time.

Oh, and I dont remember hearing that somehow God has proved his existence, I think I missed the memo...

[The Don]

Originally posted by Yahweh


Oh, and I dont remember hearing that somehow God has proved his existence, I think I missed the memo...

That information was circulated on a "deserve to know" basis :D

[Ceinwyn]

Hi KoA:

Did you mistake this forum for Internet Infidels?

Just wondering...

[Ceinwyn]

I find this helpful...

Let me try a simple analogy here. When you take fine, dry sand, and pour it through a funnel onto a flat surface, you get a cone. No matter how much you pour, you never get a cube, or a sphere, or any other shape. The sand self-organizes into a cone. It requires no external shaping.

Life is like that. When you take the basic elements of the universe, and put them in the right proportions at the proper distance from a sun, they organize themselves over time and come alive. Energy plus matter plus time can form life, with no external guidance.

Although we do not yet have the equations- the Unified Field Theory- describing how time, space, matter and energy create themselves, I am personally confident that these will be found, perhaps in my lifetime.

I see in this consistency, and sensibility, and beauty. It makes me realize that I need fear no hell, for I am made of the same stuff as the stars. It aleviates the fear of death, because though my individual consciousness may cease, the way of the world will sprout forth new, and quite possibly better, consciousnesses. Far from seeing an imperfect and fallen world, I see a world where growth and improvement are simple consequences of existence- why, even if we were to try very hard to wipe this world clean of life, we simply could not. Life is too strong!

I see no cause for overweening pride in this knowledge- for it is a concept any conscious being can grasp, and apply to him, her or itself. Nor is there cause for humility, for I am, my self, a tiny but brilliant facet of the mighty gem which is reality. To me this is the way the world is- and in it is no place or need for the God you say you believe in.

[Powa]

Buki that was beautiful...

*wipes a tear from his eye*

[King of the Americas]

...I'll conceed.

Whatever happens...

...happens.

*Free Will is PARAMOUNT.

[Psiload]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
...I'll conceed.

Whatever happens...

...happens.

*Free Will is PARAMOUNT.

So, free will trumps God? If that's the case, then God is not omnipotent... and therefore no god.

[King of the Americas]

...no "omni-potent God", this does not mean no God.

[Powa]

[food for thought]God is not omnipotent, because he cannot create a rock that he couldn't lift.[/food for thought]

[Psiload]

Originally posted by King of the Americas
...no "omni-potent God", this does not mean no God.

A non-omnipotent God? Well what the hell fun is that?!

[King of the Americas]

It is the realistic kind of fun.

Some things just don't live up to their stories, but they are still interesting all the same.

God may just be 'god(s)'.

[Jeff Corey]

Originally posted by Psiload
A non-omnipotent God? Well what the hell fun is that?!
It could be a lot of fun.
You could arm wrestle her for beers and have a chance of winning, or if she got really mad and decided to set a plague upon you, it just might turn out to be a mild cold.
And then that Georgia judge could post the Ten Suggestions.

[King of the Americas]

...imagine a god, whom you could beat and take his Trident, and then reak havoc on a couple of coastal cities...

...wait. I mean, what about god(s) whom you could pit against one another for control over the world...

I think the 'idea' of god(s) rather than God opens a lot more doors of possibility.

[Jocko]

Originally posted by King of the Americas

I think the 'idea' of god(s) rather than God opens a lot more doors of possibility.

Yeah, right. Here are a few possibilities (http://mentalhealth.about.com/library/drugs/blantipsy.htm) you should investigate on your way to the monastery.