Is what I'm doing legal?

[Deetee]

So I play a tune from spotify, and save it to my laptop. I convert the wma file to an mp3 and copy it into my itunes library.
Surely this can't be right? (as in ethically correct/allowable)

[Tsukasa Buddha]

If you are ripping/recording the stream, then no. It is in violation of the EUA to which you agreed in order to use the Spotify Service.

[quixotecoyote]

What Tsukasa said.

Also, how is spotify going to be different from pandora (http://pandora.com/)or slacker (http://www.slacker.com/)?

[BenBurch]

Depends on where you are, and the legalities are largely not tried in courts.

In the USA, it is legal to record anything you want for personal use from a radio broadcast. This would include digital radio.

Where it becomes unclear is when you record a stream from a station that also broadcasts, or when you record a stream from a station which is internet only. Generally these are thought to be covered by the personal use broadcast exception, but I am not sure that this will EVER be tested.

Because as long as it is for personal use, and you don't pass it on or post it on the net or make and sell mix CDs at a flea market, then there is really no reason to come after you.

Now, as has been observed, if you agreed to limitations when you signed on to Spotify, then you might be breaking their contract and you might be in trouble with them. But again, as long as you never, ever pass any of that on, I doubt they are going to come looking to lock you up!

-Ben

[Kevin_Lowe]

The legal power of EULA's is questionable, and downloading copyrighted content without the permission of the content owner is de facto legal.

Despite all the rhetoric about the evils of downloading, only uploaders have ever been pursued via the courts.

Ethically, if you think you have an obligation to obey the law or EULAs "just because" then you should think it immoral to do this. If weigh the ethics of your actions based on whether they harm or benefit the world, your action harms nobody unless you know you would buy the track if you could not download it for free. Studies that aren't funded by vested interests show that music piracy doesn't affect music consumption overall, although it's a pretty reasonable guess that crappy music is hurt by downloading, good music benefits and the effects mostly cancel out on the national scale.

[Tsukasa Buddha]

The legal power of EULA's is questionable, and downloading copyrighted content without the permission of the content owner is de facto legal.

It is legally binding, and it saying something is de facto legal when it is clearly illegal is an absurdity.

Despite all the rhetoric about the evils of downloading, only uploaders have ever been pursued via the courts.True, but that doesn't make something legal or even ethical.

Ethically, if you think you have an obligation to obey the law or EULAs "just because" then you should think it immoral to do this.Um, it is not "just because". It is because you agreed to it and the contract contains nothing unethical.

If weigh the ethics of your actions based on whether they harm or benefit the world, your action harms nobody unless you know you would buy the track if you could not download it for free. Studies that aren't funded by vested interests show that music piracy doesn't affect music consumption overall, although it's a pretty reasonable guess that crappy music is hurt by downloading, good music benefits and the effects mostly cancel out on the national scale.Evidence?

[Kevin_Lowe]

It is legally binding, and it saying something is de facto legal when it is clearly illegal is an absurdity.

If nobody has ever been sued or prosecuted for it, despite the fact that huge numbers of people do it, it's de facto legal. If you don't understand that you may just be confused about what de facto means.


Um, it is not "just because". It is because you agreed to it and the contract contains nothing unethical.

That's what I call "just because". Your doing what you agreed to do doesn't make the world a better place. You're observing a rule just to be observing a rule.


Evidence?

http://techrepublic.com.com/5208-6230-0.html?forumID=102&threadID=243454&start=0

also

http://www.utdallas.edu/~liebowit/knowledge_goods/stumpf.pdf

[Professor Yaffle]

http://www.spotifyripping.com/?page_id=11

[Deetee]

Must have missed the bit in the small print when I signed up to it.....
Anyway, it's just the odd track, and only for personal use, so I think I'll risk it.

[elgarak]

Regarding phrases like "de facto legal": One has to take into account that the service is based, and currently only offered in western Europe, which is (mostly) governed by civil law systems, whereas the UK and the USA use a common law system, in which disputations of contract terms have to be settled in court, decided by judges and juries, to gain legal status. This does not happen in Europe (excluding UK): The legality is spelled out in the civil and criminal codes.