So we are on the Grey list

[DC]

Switzerland got one year time to fulfill the G20 Dictate.

What exactly do they want from us? To abstain from our Right that secured privacy not only at home but also on your bankaccount?

There are legal ways in Switzerland, for foreign Governments to get the data they request from Bank clients.

[Flo]

But there are many more legal ways of blocking almost any request and making sure bank clients can keep on hiding their ill gotten funds and delinquent fiscal practices ...

I've worked in the Swiss banking system long enough to be absolutely certain of that fact (and it is one of the reasons I've left that field never to return again).

[gdnp]

Switzerland got one year time to fulfill the G20 Dictate.

What exactly do they want from us? To abstain from our Right that secured privacy not only at home but also on your bankaccount?



They want Switzerland to stop dictators, drug lords, warlords, mafiosos, and various millionaire and billionaire tax dodgers from using Swiss banks to hide their ill-gotten gains.

[DC]

But there are many more legal ways of blocking almost any request and making sure bank clients can keep on hiding their ill gotten funds and delinquent fiscal practices ...

I've worked in the Swiss banking system long enough to be absolutely certain of that fact (and it is one of the reasons I've left that field never to return again).

Which ways are those? and How many requests get blocked?

[DC]

They want Switzerland to stop dictators, drug lords, warlords, mafiosos, and various millionaire and billionaire tax dodgers from using Swiss banks to hide their ill-gotten gains.

we have already ways to fight those, and i agree fully with fighting those.
We need harscher laws for that. Banks have to report suspect cases, sure that isnt a good way, to just hope the banks will report their well paying clients. But the solution cannot be that i have to give up my right.

[gdnp]

But the solution cannot be that i have to give up my right.

Cannot or should not?

[DC]

another idea going around atm is that our Bankclientsecrecy will only be granted to swiss people and not for foreign clients.

But what laws should be implemented for those clients? those of theyr home country?

[DC]

Cannot or should not?

cannot out of free will. most propably swiss people are not willing to give up their right.

[DC]

its like seting the US on a grey list and demand them to limit freedom of speach. or scratch the ammendment that allows them to have firearms.

[Flo]

1) Which ways are those? and 2) How many requests get blocked?

1) for example, demanding that any request comply with Swiss fiscal laws (and even cantonal laws) and refusing to consider the requesting country's laws about fiscal evasion.

2) most of them, for as long as possible. For examples, look at the requests for repatriation of funds by the Mobutu or the Marcos families ...



its like seting the US on a grey list and demand them to limit freedom of speach. or scratch the ammendment that allows them to have firearms.

Not at all. Whether the US citizens can or cannot say whatever they like or bear arms in their country doesn't impact other countries politics. On the other hand, whenever Switzerland refuses to cooperate with other countries by helping tax evasion or money laundering does influence those countries politics and economies.

[WildCat]

What exactly do they want from us?
To stop being the money launderers of choice for the world's criminals and dictators.

[DC]

1) for example, demanding that any request comply with Swiss fiscal laws (and even cantonal laws) and refusing to consider the requesting country's laws about fiscal evasion.

2) most of them, for as long as possible. For examples, look at the requests for repatriation of funds by the Mobutu or the Marcos families ...





Not at all. Whether the US citizens can or cannot say whatever they like or bear arms in their country doesn't impact other countries politics. On the other hand, whenever Switzerland refuses to cooperate with other countries by helping tax evasion or money laundering does influence those countries politics and economies.

1) Source?
2) Source?

Mobutu's money was blocked
Marcos money was blocked and send back to the phillipines

and many other cases.
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schweizer_Bankgeheimnis

So the US weapon laws have no influence on the Mexicans and Mexican drug cartells?

[DC]

To stop being the money launderers of choice for the world's criminals and dictators.

For all of them or just those that are not backed by the CIA / USA?

i agree that our swissbanks musst stopp that crap and actively fight against it. But the politics and media keep talking about our Bankingclientsecrecy. And removing that right from us is not the way to go.

What do they want in detail from us?

[Flo]

1) Source?
2) Source?

10 years in accounts management and documentary credits at various banks in Geneva.


Mobutu's money was blocked
Marcos money was blocked and send back to the phillipines

After all the possible recourses in order to block such moves were exhausted. Had Switzerland's banks played fair, that money would have been returned long before.


So the US weapon laws have no influence on the Mexicans and Mexican drug cartells?

Certainly less than the possibility for such cartels to hide their money in fiscal paradises.


ETA: I've lived all my life in and around Geneva, I know how highly the Swiss think of themselves, their political and economic system, and how incensed they can get when anyone merely suggests they could suffer some improvements ...

[DC]

10 years in accounts management and documentary credits at various banks in Geneva.




After all the possible recourses in order to block such moves were exhausted. Had Switzerland's banks played fair, that money would have been returned long before.




Certainly less than the possibility for such cartels to hide their money in fiscal paradises.


ETA: I've lived all my life in and around Geneva, I know how highly the Swiss think of themselves, their political and economic system, and how incensed they can get when anyone merely suggests they could suffer some improvements ...
So you have nothing to backup your claims?
im really interested in it. and i doubt not a second that the banks didnt play fair. And i am pretty sure we need improvements in laws to fight illegal money.

But from politicans and perss i only hear things about "Bankkundengeheimnis".
But that is a constitutional right of us. and i dont see any need to change that.

yeah i think we do indeed often think pretty high of our selves, something we have in common with many ppl in the USA for example. Just that we do not force others to live their live our way.

[Pardalis]

So the US weapon laws have no influence on the Mexicans and Mexican drug cartells?

For all of them or just those that are not backed by the CIA / USA?


yeah i think we do indeed often think pretty high of our selves, something we have in common with many ppl in the USA for example. Just that we force others to live their live our way.

You can't help yourself can't you? It's always about the "bad US", even when it's clearly not.

[Beerina]

But there are many more legal ways of blocking almost any request and making sure bank clients can keep on hiding their ill gotten funds and delinquent fiscal practices ...

I've worked in the Swiss banking system long enough to be absolutely certain of that fact (and it is one of the reasons I've left that field never to return again).

Depends what you mean by "ill-gotten". Drug lord money, embezzled money, other crime money, that's one thing. But hiding cash from confiscatory governments manned by politicians who got their power promising the masses to take your money, nah. More power to Switzerland.

[DC]

Depends what you mean by "ill-gotten". Drug lord money, embezzled money, other crime money, that's one thing. But hiding cash from confiscatory governments manned by politicians who got their power promising the masses to take your money, nah. More power to Switzerland.

i dont want to protect tax cheaters. I think one should pay his tax aslong they are decided democratic. that is not the reason for the Bankingsecret.

[gdnp]

i dont want to protect tax cheaters. I think one should pay his tax aslong they are decided democratic. that is not the reason for the Bankingsecret.

What is, the purpose, then?

[DC]

What is, the purpose, then?

the police will not enter my house without a search warrant.
the same goes for my bank accounts.

[Beerina]

Ya, good point. No link, what is the reason for this? What kind of investigations are being thwarted?

[Flo]

So you have nothing to backup your claims?

You're right, I've got nothing to show, if only because of the confidentiality clauses you have to sign once you leave a bank ...

im really interested in it. and i doubt not a second that the banks didnt play fair. And i am pretty sure we need improvements in laws to fight illegal money.

So why are you complaining about the countries that tell Switzerland exactly that ?


But that is a constitutional right of us. and i dont see any need to change that.

So you admit there's a problem, but you dont see the need to address the problem ? And you dare criticize other countries thad don't play up to your standards ? Cognitive dissonance ?

yeah i think we do indeed often think pretty high of our selves,

nothing to be proud of, or unwilling to change.

something we have in common with many ppl in the USA for example.

"He did it first and harder" is no excuse once you've reached 3 ...


Just that we do not force others to live their live our way.

Mostly because we are too small to do it ... :D

[Flo]

Depends what you mean by "ill-gotten". Drug lord money, embezzled money, other crime money, that's one thing. But hiding cash from confiscatory governments manned by politicians who got their power promising the masses to take your money, nah. More power to Switzerland.


This always amuses me no end. I suppose those people who flout the tax laws of their countries still expect to find functional roads, hospitals, police, the military, firefighters, education, etc., on their way back from their favorite fiscal paradise, despite not wanting to pay their allocated share for it.

Yes, I know, taxation is plain theft ... :rolleyes:

[DC]

You're right, I've got nothing to show, if only because of the confidentiality clauses you have to sign once you leave a bank ...

You claimed the Banks block most of the requests. Now you claim you are not allowed to backup that claim, because you worked for that bank?

then im sure you can tell me what exactly they did to block all those attempt, without releasing secret data.



So why are you complaining about the countries that tell Switzerland exactly that ?

The bankclientsecret is not the problem. Here in Switzerland it works fine.
I asked actually what exactly is expected from us, in detail. Not just give up your bankclientsecret right.


So you admit there's a problem, but you dont see the need to address the problem ? And you dare criticize other countries thad don't play up to your standards ? Cognitive dissonance ?
I never claimed these is no problem. I see alot need to adress the problem. but in what way, not with taking away our rights.


nothing to be proud of, or unwilling to change.

pls quote my post where i showed that im proud of that or unwilling to change......... how do i change my fellow countryman btw?


"He did it first and harder" is no excuse once you've reached 3 ...

.....


Mostly because we are too small to do it ... :D

no Mostly because we respect other people and their way of life...... you learn that after you got 4 years old.....


So because some abuse our laws to avoid paying taxes in their country, we have to change our laws.....
whats next?
Netherlands must illigalize cannabis because to much Germans go there to get their stuff?
the USA bans all firearms because some Mexicans abuse the lax gunlaws in the USA?

btw, what do you think about the USA and Nevada? ar their state laws confirm with OECD? or should Nevada also go on that list?

[Flo]

You claimed the Banks block most of the requests. Now you claim you are not allowed to backup that claim, because you worked for that bank?

I can't obviously give links, names, dates, etc.

then im sure you can tell me what exactly they did to block all those attempt, without releasing secret data.

First trick is to refuse to answer as to whether the persons under inquiry are an actual client or not, because of the laws on bank secrets. This can go on for years. Then there's the denials (about the authenticity of the documents, for example) when presented with documentation, the refusal to accept the validity of the complaints or the right of the complainants to gain information, etc., etc.




The bankclientsecret is not the problem. Here in Switzerland it works fine.
I asked actually what exactly is expected from us, in detail. Not just give up your bankclientsecret right.

As far as I know, nobody is asking Switzerland to to abolish confidentiality clauses towards ordinary banks clients, but to openly cooperate in matters regarding money laundering and fiscal evasion, as well as to stop with the practices that actually encourage them (offshore and numbered accounts, etc.).


no Mostly because we respect other people and their way of life...... you learn that after you got 4 years old.....

Sorry, but as I wrote earlier, I lived and was educated from the tender age of 1 1/2 in Switzerland, and so are my family and friends. Respect for other people and their way of life isn't exactly my main memory of what is taught in Swiss schools ... Arrogance and a sense of superiority towards our less well economically performing neighbors and of course our inferior brethen in poorer countries was and is much more in order.


So because some abuse our laws to avoid paying taxes in their country, we have to change our laws.....

Yes, because some of our laws are what makes those abuses possible !

btw, what do you think about the USA and Nevada?

Lots of things, but I usually concentrate on the defects of my own country(ies - I'm both French and Swiss) rather than criticize others.

[DC]

I can't obviously give links, names, dates, etc.



First trick is to refuse to answer as to whether the persons under inquiry are an actual client or not, because of the laws on bank secrets. This can go on for years. Then there's the denials (about the authenticity of the documents, for example) when presented with documentation, the refusal to accept the validity of the complaints or the right of the complainants to gain information, etc., etc.

ah in a just take your word for it? no thanks




As far as I know, nobody is asking Switzerland to to abolish confidentiality clauses towards ordinary banks clients, but to openly cooperate in matters regarding money laundering and fiscal evasion, as well as to stop with the practices that actually encourage them (offshore and numbered accounts, etc.).

Politicans and press do indeed ask to abolish the Bankclientsecret.
thats why i started that topic cause i hoped someone knows more details, but seems like nobody knows any details.


Sorry, but as I wrote earlier, I lived and was educated from the tender age of 1 1/2 in Switzerland, and so are my family and friends. Respect for other people and their way of life isn't exactly my main memory of what is taught in Swiss schools ... Arrogance and a sense of superiority towards our less well economically performing neighbors and of course our inferior brethen in poorer countries was and is much more in order.

dunno how it is in the rgion of Geneva, but here it is not that way.



Yes, because some of our laws are what makes those abuses possible !
which laws are those?


Lots of things, but I usually concentrate on the defects of my own country(ies - I'm both French and Swiss) rather than criticize others.

i just find it strange that some tax havens fom the UK and USA did not get on any list...

[Tricky]

Please avoid off-topic posting and bickering.

[Flo]

ah in a just take your word for it? no thanks

Fair enough.


dunno how it is in the rgion of Geneva, but here it is not that way.

I've often compared my school experiences with those of friends and family in other parts of Switzerland (Bern, Zurich, Basel, St-Gallen, Delémont, Vaud, ...), teaching programs are essentially the same. And given what I hear people from political parties like UDC, it appears that I'm mostly right in my appreciacion of the light in which other countries are represented.


which laws are those?

The laws that allow banks and financial institutions to refuse open and frank cooperation with countries that try to fight fiscal evasion and money laundering.



i just find it strange that some tax havens fom the UK and USA did not get on any list...

So do I. I was extremely shocked to learn that Jersey and Guernesey weren't on any list, for example ...

[DC]

Fair enough.




I've often compared my school experiences with those of friends and family in other parts of Switzerland (Bern, Zurich, Basel, St-Gallen, Delémont, Vaud, ...), teaching programs are essentially the same. And given what I hear people from political parties like UDC, it appears that I'm mostly right in my appreciacion of the light in which other countries are represented.

i dont know what you mean.
The school in Basel where i went last, out of 20 kids only 2 was actually swiss. And i cannot remember beeing teached that the swiss are superior or the like.
But i did not go to swiss school from 12 - 18, i was in Belgium in that time.
So im not sure what your point is here.


The laws that allow banks and financial institutions to refuse open and frank cooperation with countries that try to fight fiscal evasion and money laundering.

im a bit disapointed, you as a guy that worked for Banks didnt bring up one of the most important points in regard to tax evasion. and there our law is indeed kinda strange.

Tax evasion and Tax Cheaters are not regarded the same, and Tax evasion is just a minor violation in switzerland.


So do I. I was extremely shocked to learn that Jersey and Guernesey weren't on any list, for example ...

yes i find the list very dishonest.

[Flo]

i dont know what you mean.
The school in Basel where i went last, out of 20 kids only 2 was actually swiss. And i cannot remember beeing teached that the swiss are superior or the like.
But i did not go to swiss school from 12 - 18, i was in Belgium in that time.
So im not sure what your point is here.

I and most of my friends and family did all our education in Switzerland. Most of the history and geography teaching is oriented as to show how Switzerland is superior to the rest of the World politically, economically, etc., how we are the first and best and most moral democracy, and of course how other countries are all messed up and their citizens should therefore pnly be allowed to enter Switzerland if they can be shown to be worthy (i.e. have enough money).
I suggest you read on the arguments surrounding the various votations regarding a possible expulsion of some categories of foreigners (Schwartzenbach initiative of 1974, for example) to give you an idea.



im a bit disapointed, you as a guy girl that worked for Banks didnt bring up one of the most important points in regard to tax evasion. and there our law is indeed kinda strange.

Tax evasion and Tax Cheaters are not regarded the same, and Tax evasion is just a minor violation in switzerland.

That's actually one of the first points I had in mind, but maybe I didn't express myself correctly. Tax evasion is a very important point for a lot of countries, because it diverts needed ressources to ensure the development and functionning of said countries, and it allows crooks and thugs to hide the money they can therefore use for their shady/criminal practices. Switzerland refusing to consider tax evasion as an important point makes it an accomplice.

[The Painter]

I wonder how many drug lords and mafia type chiefs have accounts in a Swiss Bank? I wonder how many their are in the entire world? I have always had respect for the Swiss Banks for resisting change and keeping their secrecy policy. I hope they don't cave into the pressure the G20 puts on them. I don't think they will. There is no other place the leaders of the world can hide their money.

[DC]

I and most of my friends and family did all our education in Switzerland. Most of the history and geography teaching is oriented as to show how Switzerland is superior to the rest of the World politically, economically, etc., how we are the first and best and most moral democracy, and of course how other countries are all messed up and their citizens should therefore pnly be allowed to enter Switzerland if they can be shown to be worthy (i.e. have enough money).
I suggest you read on the arguments surrounding the various votations regarding a possible expulsion of some categories of foreigners (Schwartzenbach initiative of 1974, for example) to give you an idea.
lol?
i agree we are pretty proud of our political system, but never heard that it is superior.
Economy? LOL???? we cannot even feed our people without importing food.....
very very superior lol.
Can you name me one or more schoolbooks you and your friends used when you got teached the swiss superior economy? i have to read those books.

you bring up Schwarzenbach? the rightwing populist?
this shows how we think we are superior?
why on earth did the superior swiss people say NO to his racist initiatives?

BTW i remember history class in Basel, we learned alot about WWII and the very unsuperior and moraly very questionable position the swiss had. i must have had one of the very few non superior teachers i guess.


That's actually one of the first points I had in mind, but maybe I didn't express myself correctly. Tax evasion is a very important point for a lot of countries, because it diverts needed ressources to ensure the development and functionning of said countries, and it allows crooks and thugs to hide the money they can therefore use for their shady/criminal practices. Switzerland refusing to consider tax evasion as an important point makes it an accomplice.

We and our banks must accept that tax evasion is not just a minor violation of laws in other countrys and be cooperative with those govenments.
but no need to change the laws that impact us.

[DC]

I wonder how many drug lords and mafia type chiefs have accounts in a Swiss Bank? I wonder how many their are in the entire world? I have always had respect for the Swiss Banks for resisting change and keeping their secrecy policy. I hope they don't cave into the pressure the G20 puts on them. I don't think they will. There is no other place the leaders of the world can hide their money.

I dont respect our Banks, i respect our rights.
and sure we will "cave in" to the pressure put on us, we did actually already before the G20.

[Flo]

lol?
i agree we are pretty proud of our political system, but never heard that it is superior.
Economy? LOL???? we cannot even feed our people without importing food.....
very very superior lol.
Can you name me one or more schoolbooks you and your friends used when you got teached the swiss superior economy? i have to read those books.

That was more than 30 years ago, one was called "Manuel d'histoire suisse", and there was the dreadful "Wir sprechen Deutsch" that was less a German language manual than political propaganda (and a good reason why most Romands were totally impervious to the language ... :rolleyes:).

you bring up Schwarzenbach? the rightwing populist?
this shows how we think we are superior?
why on earth did the superior swiss people say NO to his racist initiatives?

You have to remember by what margin it was rejected, and on the basis of what arguments. Mostly, it had to do with "who's going to dig the holes in our streets if we expell those people", and certainly not "this is no way to treat fellow human beings". I was a teenager at the time and many of my friends would have been affected should the initiative pass.

BTW i remember history class in Basel, we learned alot about WWII and the very unsuperior and moraly very questionable position the swiss had. i must have had one of the very few non superior teachers i guess.

Lucky you, I didn't. Mine were adamant in their belief that Switzerland had shown a perfect moral example of resisting nazism through complete neutrality. One of them has been at the forefront of the fight against the restitution of funds to families of Jewish victims of the Shoah.



We and our banks must accept that tax evasion is not just a minor violation of laws in other countrys and be cooperative with those govenments.
but no need to change the laws that impact us.

OK with that.

[DC]

That was more than 30 years ago, one was called "Manuel d'histoire suisse", and there was the dreadful "Wir sprechen Deutsch" that was less a German language manual than political propaganda (and a good reason why most Romands were totally impervious to the language ... :rolleyes:).

okey 30 years ago :) im born in 75 :)


You have to remember by what margin it was rejected, and on the basis of what arguments. Mostly, it had to do with "who's going to dig the holes in our streets if we expell those people", and certainly not "this is no way to treat fellow human beings". I was a teenager at the time and many of my friends would have been affected should the initiative pass.

true, about 47% said yes :(
and also this was before my time.
But sad enough the rightwing is geting stronger in the last vew years.


Lucky you, I didn't. Mine were adamant in their belief that Switzerland had shown a perfect moral example of resisting nazism through complete neutrality. One of them has been at the forefront of the fight against the restitution of funds to families of Jewish victims of the Shoah.


im not sure what we should have done.
but afaik even Churchill pointed out what a good idea it was that we stayed "Neutral".



OK with that.

[Flo]

true, about 47% said yes :(
and also this was before my time.
But sad enough the rightwing is geting stronger in the last vew years.

which goes to show that teachings about other people and nationalities haven't changed much for a lot of people ...


im not sure what we should have done.
but afaik even Churchill pointed out what a good idea it was that we stayed "Neutral".

I don't think really staying neutral would have been that reprehensible. However, refusing asylum to so many Jews to Germany while retaining the funds they put in our banks (and punishing the bureaucrats who gave them visas), or allowing the use of our railways for the transfer of prisoners from Italy and other zones to the death camps, definitely was ...

[DC]

"who's going to dig the holes in our streets?"

it hurts but i must agree on that one. we still have that mentality.
We have a recyclingcenter, we split up the mixed garbage that comes from building sites. It is a dangerous and smelly, hard job. and in 5 years i didnt find a swiss guy willing to work there. They see it and say, no way i will work here and go home.

[DC]

which goes to show that teachings about other people and nationalities haven't changed much for a lot of people ...




I don't think really staying neutral would have been that reprehensible. However, refusing asylum to so many Jews to Germany while retaining the funds they put in our banks (and punishing the bureaucrats who gave them visas), or allowing the use of our railways for the transfer of prisoners from Italy and other zones to the death camps, definitely was ...

i have troubles with that. do you actually say teachers teach the kids to become racists?
thats impossible, especially when you take a look how many in class are swiss and how many are from other nationality.

[Puppycow]

This is an interesting topic. While I sympathize with the Swiss and their sovereignty and independent streak, I also suspect that all of the world's worst tyrants and crime bosses have zillions squirreled away in secret Swiss bank accounts.

This is no doubt very profitable for the Swiss. I guess we are asking them to choose morality over profit, and I don't want to force them at the point of a gun, but we are free to express our disapproval. Nobody can see it and the Swiss never have to bloody their hands directly, but I think they do profit from being money launderers for anything from people with blood on their hands, to just simple tax evaders.

I wish they would do the right thing voluntarily for ethical reasons.

[DC]

This is an interesting topic. While I sympathize with the Swiss and their sovereignty, I also suspect that all of the world's worst tyrants and crime bosses have zillions squirreled away in secret Swiss bank accounts.

This is no doubt very profitable for the Swiss. I guess we are asking them to choose morality over profit, and I don't want to force them at the point of a gun, but we are free to express our disapproval. Nobody can see it and the Swiss never have to bloody their hands directly, but I think they do profit from being money launderers for anything from people with blood on their hands, to just simple tax evaders.

I wish they would do the right thing voluntarily for ethical reasons.

I do agree with you on the point that our hands are pretty bloody, do to our banks. and i always supported atacks on our banks.
but thats the problem now, now i feel atacked myself. because politics and press keep repeating that we need to remove the bankclientsecret, whish is a constitutional right of us.
I just find that a wrong way to solve the problem.
But im not even sure if that is the case. i read all kind of OECD papers and its not really our right that seem to be a problem here.

i just dont get what is exactly asked from us :)

[Flo]

i have troubles with that. do you actually say teachers teach the kids to become racists?
thats impossible, especially when you take a look how many in class are swiss and how many are from other nationality.

A couple teachers I knew openly did, despite the presence of a number of foreign children. I'm pretty sure some still do, albeit not as openly, in areas where rightwings parties are in the majority.

[DC]

/OT
"She has been the sole international force linking the hideously-sundered nations and ourselves. What does it matter whether she has been able to give us the commercial advantages we desire or has given too many to the Germans, to keep herself alive? She has been a democratic State, standing for freedom in self defence among her mountains, and in thought, in spite of race, largely on our side."
Winston Churchill about Switzerland in WWII

[Flo]

This is an interesting topic. While I sympathize with the Swiss and their sovereignty and independent streak, I also suspect that all of the world's worst tyrants and crime bosses have zillions squirreled away in secret Swiss bank accounts.

This is no doubt very profitable for the Swiss. I guess we are asking them to choose morality over profit, and I don't want to force them at the point of a gun, but we are free to express our disapproval. Nobody can see it and the Swiss never have to bloody their hands directly, but I think they do profit from being money launderers for anything from people with blood on their hands, to just simple tax evaders.

I wish they would do the right thing voluntarily for ethical reasons.


The debate has been raging in Switzerland for decades now, despite all the attempts by various political and financial institutions to silence the critics and to present the country as a victim of an unjust campaign fueled by jealousy and whatever.

[DC]

saw an Interesting Doku.
As i already said, we have legal ways to request data from suspect taxcheaters.

And from Germany we have daily verbal atacks on Switzerland by Steinbrück, the german financeminister.

In 2008 Germany did 1 , ONE, request for data about a suspect taxcheater....

[Beerina]

This always amuses me no end. I suppose those people who flout the tax laws of their countries still expect to find functional roads, hospitals, police, the military, firefighters, education, etc., on their way back from their favorite fiscal paradise, despite not wanting to pay their allocated share for it.

Yes, I know, taxation is plain theft ... :rolleyes:



Can you shut off the robotic regurgitation of meme defense mechanisms? Thx!

Remove the costs of all that stuff, and you still have like 3/4 of the spending to go (and yes, the removed part includes the full-blown military of the US.) Also, much of the taxation for that was built on the punitive nature of politics w.r.t. the common man out there, rather than on any "logical" taxation scheme, let's be honest.


I have no ethical issues with people wanting to free themselves from that whatsoever, any more than I have problems with people hiding Jews during WWII or people freeing slaves in the US in the 1800s. Different levels of evil, sure, but on the same side of the street.

[DC]

I dunno if anyone is still interested but i am :)

The problem seems far more simple than it is showed by the politics and (Private)Media.

The main problem is indeed that in Switzerland we have some unique laws.
Taxevasion and Taxcheating

Taxevasion is not a criminal act according to swisslaw, thus our nor any other government cant get acces to your bankaccounts.

and this will or should be changed, so that foreign governments can get acces to the bankaccounts also in cases of tax evasion. I support that, i even support that inside switzerland. You evaded opaying taxes? no more bankclientsecret for you anymore.

in cases of taxcheaters, nothing has to be changed afaik.

the whole drama has absolutley nothing to do with Corrupt dictator hiding money on swissbanks. the contrary, Dictators have less troubles now geting the money in case some of his opressed citizens is hiding money from that dictator......

btw is Delaware planing to change their laws? what changes do they plan?