Why did God give man intelligence and then forbid it’s use?

[Greatest I am]

Why did God give man intelligence and then forbid it’s use?

Adam and Eve are our archetypal first humans. All humans are to emulate them.

They were not to eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil that gives us our moral sense.
Without this knowledge we would basically be as dumb as cows because without knowledge of good and evil, we would have no knowledge of most of what we know.
Almost no dialog can take place without this knowledge as almost all issues have a good and evil aspect. Intelligence then cannot progress without this knowledge.

Why then would God want more baser animals instead of the intelligent man that has developed thank to Eve eating of the tree of knowledge?

Without moral sense we would not know why we follow God.
Sheeple instead of people in biblical terms.

Why does God want to keep man dumb instead of intelligent?

Why stifle man instead of letting him go to his full potential?

Man chose that route to potential but it seems that some think that God was right.
Was He or was man right to reach for a moral sense?

Would you stop Eve and lose YOUR moral sense?

Regards
DL

[TraneWreck]

He's a dick.

[daSkeptic]

I suppose the simplest explanation is that it's just a poorly thought-out story, which over the centuries has been retconned a few times.

[Hokulele]

Adam and Eve are our archetypal first humans. All humans are to emulate them.


No.

[Fnord]

Adam and Eve are our archetypal first humans. All humans are to emulate them.
.
If your claim were valid, then "all humans" would have been born without a belly-button. A&E were not viviparous - the were created - thus it is reasonable to assume they had no umbilicii or navels. We we all born - placentae, umbilicci, belly-buttons, and everything.

:: All humans are not [required] to emulate them.

[shadron]

Without a brain, how would we ever miss not using it?

[Greatest I am]

Thanks all.

Worthy responses.

Regards
DL

[Cainkane1]

Maybe God enjoys a practical joke now and then.

[Cainkane1]

I feel sorry for the poor talking snake myself.

[INRM]

I thought the apple was symbolized not knowledge, but knowledge of sin...

It's been awhile since I've read a bible since I haven't really given it much value

[Kernel Hapablap]

There is no god.

[paximperium]

He's a dick.
Why did god give humans dicks and vaginas and forbid us to use them except to make little people?

[six7s]

Maybe God enjoys a practical joke now and then.Yep

See epilepsy and rabies

[Ashles]

I've always thought the story is massively flawed.

Biggest problems:
1) God is a liar. The story clearly paints him as a liar. The first character to lie in the bible is God himself
2) The snake doesn't actually say anything untrue
3) God hands out harsh punishments like smarties for events that seem almost bound to happen
4) Why is the tree even there?
5) How does the snake know what the fruit is for?
6) God is omnipotent and omniscient - so how does he not foresee this happening/prevent it happening/undo it
7) The occasional references to gods (plural) belie that the story is nicked from elsewhere
8) Why is being nude in front of your partner a bad thing?

[James Fox]

Why did God give man intelligence and then forbid it’s use?

Regards
DL

He’s mysterious? But I digress, “s/he/god” does not exist therefore has no involvement in human intellectual capacity.

[I Ratant]

...
8) Why is being nude in front of your partner a bad thing?
.
It isn't, it isn't!
Particularly now that summer is a'comin' in!
Just a few more days to the first of May, when outdoor screwing starts!

[MG1962]

Why did God give man intelligence and then forbid it’s use?

Adam and Eve are our archetypal first humans. All humans are to emulate them.

They were not to eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil that gives us our moral sense.
Without this knowledge we would basically be as dumb as cows because without knowledge of good and evil, we would have no knowledge of most of what we know.
Almost no dialog can take place without this knowledge as almost all issues have a good and evil aspect. Intelligence then cannot progress without this knowledge.

Why then would God want more baser animals instead of the intelligent man that has developed thank to Eve eating of the tree of knowledge?

Without moral sense we would not know why we follow God.
Sheeple instead of people in biblical terms.

Why does God want to keep man dumb instead of intelligent?

Why stifle man instead of letting him go to his full potential?

Man chose that route to potential but it seems that some think that God was right.
Was He or was man right to reach for a moral sense?

Would you stop Eve and lose YOUR moral sense?

Regards
DL

I dont know, I guess it depends who's faith we are talking about

Would be the one, that has for the greater part of its history agreed that the Bible is not a science text

Would it be the faith, who's largest order has a motto that encourages the study of the natural world as a way to bring them closer to their God

Would it be the faith that has had various science academies dating back four hundred years. And encourages none believers to become active in these academies as way of broadening understanding

Would it be the faith who in a couple of instances has had clerics make major contributions to the advancement of science.

[MikeSun5]

.
If your claim were valid, then "all humans" would have been born without a belly-button. A&E were not viviparous - the were created - thus it is reasonable to assume they had no umbilicii or navels. We we all born - placentae, umbilicci, belly-buttons, and everything.

:: All humans are not [required] to emulate them.

What, what? Who ever said Adam was a fetus? I thought he grew out of dirt. And Eve was one of his rib bones.

[Wildy]

I thought the apple was symbolized not knowledge, but knowledge of sin...

It's been awhile since I've read a bible since I haven't really given it much value

Actually it was the knowledge of good and evil. But even if it was knowledge of sin you would have to admit that it's knowledge right?

[JetLeg]

I thought the apple was symbolized not knowledge, but knowledge of sin...

It's been awhile since I've read a bible since I haven't really given it much value


You are very wrong. It says explicitly "The knowledge of good and evil". Almost as if god didn't want human beings to have morals.

As far as I remember the gnostics believed that Jehovah is an EVIL god, and the bible is a book written by an evil god that portrayed what an evil god does. Makes sense to me.

[Belz...]

Why did God give man intelligence and then forbid it’s use?

Because He doesn't have any and doesn't wish to look dumb.

[A Christian Sceptic]

Why did God give man intelligence and then forbid it’s use?

Adam and Eve are our archetypal first humans. All humans are to emulate them.

They were not to eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil that gives us our moral sense.
Without this knowledge we would basically be as dumb as cows because without knowledge of good and evil, we would have no knowledge of most of what we know.
Almost no dialog can take place without this knowledge as almost all issues have a good and evil aspect. Intelligence then cannot progress without this knowledge.


Does Knowledge = Intelligence or Intelligence = Knowledge?

How much do you have to Know before you have Intelligence?

[aggle-rithm]

.
If your claim were valid, then "all humans" would have been born without a belly-button. A&E were not viviparous - the were created - thus it is reasonable to assume they had no umbilicii or navels. We we all born - placentae, umbilicci, belly-buttons, and everything.

:: All humans are not [required] to emulate them.

God gave A&E belly buttons for the same reason he planted dinosaur fossils in the ground. To test our faith.

Or something.

[aggle-rithm]

Oh, my gosh; it just hit me.

I was trying to imagine what creating the world must have been like from God's point of view, drawing on my experience as a software developer.

What if Adam and Eve -- and by extension, us -- were the Alpha version of a project that got completely out of control?

What if God abandoned the project long ago, and went on to try again with a better architecture, one that actually made sense?

It explains a heck of a lot! All the inconsistencies in the Bible, the difficulty in reconciling a belief in an all-loving God with all the random misery in the world, the fact that God hasn't been seen around here in eons...all can be explained by the Project Runaway theory.

Supposed that a couple of millenia ago, some well-meaning QA guy named Jesus was poking around, found our old, dusty project, and tried to take it upon himself to fix all the bugs?

The same thing would happen to him that would happen to any of us that tried such an insane feat: He would be nailed to a tree!

I'm definitely onto something here. Assuming the fabric of reality corresponds exactly to what I happen to do for a living, as it should.

[A Christian Sceptic]

I'm definitely onto something here. Assuming the fabric of reality corresponds exactly to what I happen to do for a living, as it should.

I watched a PBS show a while back that explained the fabric of reality was that everything is a bunch of tiny little strings all wiggling and dancing, ok - they said vibrating, as if to some sort of cosmic song/music.

[Pink Booties]

It's one of my main objections, and I would never freely choose to worship such a god.

The Lord our Father is tricksy and confusing.

[aggle-rithm]

I watched a PBS show a while back that explained the fabric of reality was that everything is a bunch of tiny little strings all wiggling and dancing, ok - they said vibrating, as if to some sort of cosmic song/music.

My theory is more testable than String Theory. All we have to do is get an interview with God.

[A Christian Sceptic]

My theory is more testable than String Theory. All we have to do is get an interview with God.

:)

[six7s]

I thought the apple was symbolized not knowledge, but knowledge of sin...Whereas references to the talking snake were literal, not symbolic, right?

[TimCallahan]

One problem with the god of the Bible is that he was origiinally concieved of as a finite god ruling his own turf, who had a wife like any other god, and, like all the other gods of his time, was finite and not always that well disposed toward human beings. This rather limited god lies to Adam ("In the day you eat of it you will die") and has apparently also denied Adam and Eve the right to eat from the tree of life. In fact the reason he drives them out of the garden is to keep them from eating from the tree of life and living forever (Gen. 3:22 - 24).

God as one and only, all-powerful, all-knowing, probably emerged after the Babylonian Exile. At that time the stories ofthe earlier finite god were already in existence and had to be adapted to the new deity. Hence the oddities of Genesis

[Greatest I am]

I feel sorry for the poor talking snake myself.

Me too. They took an icon of wisdom and corrupted it. I, that is he, will rebound watch.http://forums.randi.org/images/icons/icon7.gif

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

I thought the apple was symbolized not knowledge, but knowledge of sin...

It's been awhile since I've read a bible since I haven't really given it much value

Knowledge of sin is the same as knowledge of evil I would think. If we know evil or sin then we would know it's opposite good and not sin.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

There is no god.

I do not agree as my signature indicates but before you ask, no I have no more proof of mine than anyone else has for theirs. Mine is more logical though. No miracles. No popularity either for most religious because he does not punish the way they think any good God would. They love to hate.

Regards
DL

[Hokulele]

Mine is more logical though.


No.

[king catfish]

He's a dick.

Seconded.

[Greatest I am]

I've always thought the story is massively flawed.

Biggest problems:
1) God is a liar. The story clearly paints him as a liar. The first character to lie in the bible is God himself
2) The snake doesn't actually say anything untrue
3) God hands out harsh punishments like smarties for events that seem almost bound to happen
4) Why is the tree even there?
5) How does the snake know what the fruit is for?
6) God is omnipotent and omniscient - so how does he not foresee this happening/prevent it happening/undo it
7) The occasional references to gods (plural) belie that the story is nicked from elsewhere
8) Why is being nude in front of your partner a bad thing?

Good points.

I believe that Genesis originally started out as a coming of age story of young adults. Try seeing the snake as society with it's good and evil aspects as the young leave the garden/home.

It seems to fit as a story of right of passage.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

He’s mysterious? But I digress, “s/he/god” does not exist therefore has no involvement in human intellectual capacity.

The Bible God certainly does not exist but as the only believer here so far, I can state as I have done above that there is a God. A cosmic consciousness. Our next evolution. No choice.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

I dont know, I guess it depends who's faith we are talking about

Would be the one, that has for the greater part of its history agreed that the Bible is not a science text

Would it be the faith, who's largest order has a motto that encourages the study of the natural world as a way to bring them closer to their God

Would it be the faith that has had various science academies dating back four hundred years. And encourages none believers to become active in these academies as way of broadening understanding

Would it be the faith who in a couple of instances has had clerics make major contributions to the advancement of science.

Which religion are you speaking about or are you just on something.http://forums.randi.org/images/icons/icon7.gif

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Does Knowledge = Intelligence or Intelligence = Knowledge?

How much do you have to Know before you have Intelligence?

I would think that knowledge is facts.
Intelligence is the ability to learn.
Wisdom is knowing how to use facts in a smart way.
Believers in a miracle working super God are fools.

Regards
DL

[Greatest I am]

Oh, my gosh; it just hit me.

I was trying to imagine what creating the world must have been like from God's point of view, drawing on my experience as a software developer.

What if Adam and Eve -- and by extension, us -- were the Alpha version of a project that got completely out of control?

What if God abandoned the project long ago, and went on to try again with a better architecture, one that actually made sense?

It explains a heck of a lot! All the inconsistencies in the Bible, the difficulty in reconciling a belief in an all-loving God with all the random misery in the world, the fact that God hasn't been seen around here in eons...all can be explained by the Project Runaway theory.

Supposed that a couple of millenia ago, some well-meaning QA guy named Jesus was poking around, found our old, dusty project, and tried to take it upon himself to fix all the bugs?

The same thing would happen to him that would happen to any of us that tried such an insane feat: He would be nailed to a tree!

I'm definitely onto something here. Assuming the fabric of reality corresponds exactly to what I happen to do for a living, as it should.

He has been here and done as you speculated.

His genocidal flood was a reboot.

Still could not keep the bugs/evil out of the program though.
Needs more training that boy.http://forums.randi.org/images/icons/icon7.gif

Regards
DL

[Darth Rotor]

Why did God give man intelligence and then forbid it’s use?
He didn't.

Next question?

DR

[Greatest I am]

No.

Yep. We think alike. That is somewhat of a prerequisite for contact.

Regards
DL

[Darth Rotor]

My theory is more testable than String Theory. All we have to do is get an interview with God.

Or with Blizzard Entertainment. The bastidges just delayed Starcraft II for another six months.

And talking about an alpha version got out of hand, see Diablo Ii. :p

Before patch 1.07

[Greatest I am]

Seconded.

No, he only has one. http://forums.randi.org/images/icons/icon7.gifhttp://forums.randi.org/images/icons/icon7.gifhttp://forums.randi.org/images/icons/icon7.gif LOL.

[Greatest I am]

I have been gone for a while. Looks like you hard cases have scared all the believers away. No fun left for a heathen like me. Oh well.

Thanks to all for the above

Regards
DL

[Kernel Hapablap]

Oh, my gosh; it just hit me.


What if Adam and Eve -- and by extension, us -- were the Alpha version of a project that got completely out of control?

What if God abandoned the project long ago, and went on to try again with a better architecture, one that actually made sense?

It explains a heck of a lot! All the inconsistencies in the Bible, the difficulty in reconciling a belief in an all-loving God with all the random misery in the world, the fact that God hasn't been seen around here in eons...all can be explained by the Project Runaway theory.

Supposed that a couple of millenia ago, some well-meaning QA guy named Jesus was poking around, found our old, dusty project, and tried to take it upon himself to fix all the bugs?

The same thing would happen to him that would happen to any of us that tried such an insane feat: He would be nailed to a tree!

I'm definitely onto something here. Assuming the fabric of reality corresponds exactly to what I happen to do for a living, as it should.

Excellent! I will sign on to this new way of thinking. What could be more satisfying than knowing the existence of our race was one big f#*k up?

You've inspired me to create a new thread on the "God is a computer programmer" topic.

[Autolite]

Why did God give man intelligence and then forbid it’s use?

Near the end of the movie "The Devil's Advocate", Al Pacino's character addresses similar questions and provides a rather interesting answer as to the "why". The movie is worth a watch just to hear that particular explanation. There are just far too many "explicative deleted" type words in the answer to quote it accurately here on the forum... :D

[aggle-rithm]

Excellent! I will sign on to this new way of thinking. What could be more satisfying than knowing the existence of our race was one big f#*k up?




The sad thing was that he had all of eternity to gather requirements and draw up the specifications.

Typical.

[godless dave]

God doesn't want us to use our intelligence because He hates when people snark on His misuse of apostrophes.

[Belz...]

'tis true.

[INRM]

Why doesn't someone look into the oldest surviving writings about the Garden of Eden and Adam and Eve...

I've often found that biblical passages particular from the King James version are often horribly mistranslated as it comes from a multitude of languages of which they don't all translate exactly into each other.


INRM

[Greatest I am]

Why doesn't someone look into the oldest surviving writings about the Garden of Eden and Adam and Eve...

I've often found that biblical passages particular from the King James version are often horribly mistranslated as it comes from a multitude of languages of which they don't all translate exactly into each other.


INRM

You Tube, Banned from the Bible, or Adam and Eve, and you will have a selection to choose from.

Regards
DL

[godless dave]

"Banned from the Bible" is a History Channel program. I wouldn't trust it as far as I can throw a DVD.

[Greatest I am]

"Banned from the Bible" is a History Channel program. I wouldn't trust it as far as I can throw a DVD.

I don't care.

Regards
DL

[I Ratant]

Why doesn't someone look into the oldest surviving writings about the Garden of Eden and Adam and Eve...
...
INRM
.
The earliest writings of the Garden of Eden etc won't be in Hebrew, but Sumerian!
Genesis 1 and 2 were added to the Torah during and after the Babylonian Captivity, when the influences of Zoarastorian thought was incorporated into the Hebrew mythos.

[tsig]

I feel sorry for the poor talking snake myself.

Thanks

[tsig]

Oh, my gosh; it just hit me.

I was trying to imagine what creating the world must have been like from God's point of view, drawing on my experience as a software developer.

What if Adam and Eve -- and by extension, us -- were the Alpha version of a project that got completely out of control?

What if God abandoned the project long ago, and went on to try again with a better architecture, one that actually made sense?

It explains a heck of a lot! All the inconsistencies in the Bible, the difficulty in reconciling a belief in an all-loving God with all the random misery in the world, the fact that God hasn't been seen around here in eons...all can be explained by the Project Runaway theory.

Supposed that a couple of millenia ago, some well-meaning QA guy named Jesus was poking around, found our old, dusty project, and tried to take it upon himself to fix all the bugs?

The same thing would happen to him that would happen to any of us that tried such an insane feat: He would be nailed to a tree!

I'm definitely onto something here. Assuming the fabric of reality corresponds exactly to what I happen to do for a living, as it should.

Careful many a programmer hs gone down that rabbit hole only to resurface as an ID believer.