The "Indigo Child" Woo Movement

[LightinDarkness]

Over the past few years I've noticed a resurgence in woo that seems to almost be entirely catered to make people feel special or that they have special powers. Of course, I guess anyone claiming paranormal abilities at some level is seeking to be special and feel special, but some of the woo seems to be entirely dedicated to the "look at me, I am so special!" category.

One thing I've run into personally is the "Indigo child" movement. The wiki on it is pretty accurate from the research I've done:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indigo_children#Skepticism


Basically, a new age book writer a few years ago determined that the next stage in human evolution was upon us and that children would be born with special abilities that mark them as "indigo children" (wooist claim the term because that is the color of their aura). Its an ingenious system really, because the "characteristics" of a indigo child will match the personality profile of almost any child:

~ Determined
~ Absolute confidence
~ They rarely need others to tell them who they are
~ Are easily frustrated with routine or ritual
~ They do not accept authority
~ Non conformist
~ They have no trouble telling you what they need
~ May seem anti social if they are not around children like them
~ Sensitive
~ Technologically orientated

Gee, seems like all are characteristics of kids from childhood to adolescence to me. Of course there are some woo ones in there too, like the claiming to have paranormal abilities.

I have a friend who is now absolutely convinced their 10 year old is a indigo, and the kid loves it - she can get away with whatever she wants by claiming she needs to do something to harness "vibrations" or some other woo based excuse. I have tried all the most obvious ways to point out to the parent and the kid that this is total woo and has no basis in reality (like trying to get her to test her so called powers - including weather changing), but conveniently my negativity and skepticism always prevents said powers from working. Any ideas on what to do?

[gelatin]

I'm pretty sure I was in "indigo child", but then reality struck. This damned reality.

[skeptifem]

its cheaper than ritalin!

[wardenclyffe]

Rather than just proposing tests, try coming to them with a (seemingly, at least) real problem for the child to solve. Your grandmother's rhubarb is going to die without rain or something. The problem should easily be solved by the child's weather control or one her other powers. You should not be around when the attempt is made. Then when grandma's rhubarb does die, you need to be devastated so both mother and child can see the harm this is doing.

Also, at least when you are around, they should not be able to pull any of this business, since it's proven that her powers are useless around you, the skeptic. The more you are around, the less they can rely on her powers.

Ward

[PbFoot]

Three words:

Extreme cognitive dissonance.

-PbFoot

[Niobe]

seeking to be special and feel special, but some of the woo seems to be entirely dedicated to the "look at me, I am so special!" category.

It's not just run of the mill brats that get stamped with that label. Generally, it's children with AD(h)D, autism spectrum disorder / PDD-NOS or other that get slapped with the indigo / crystal child label. For some parents it's easier to believe your child is a special project from the universe than accept the gloomy reality that the child is mentally disabled / delayed.

[wardenclyffe]

I think that all kids display characteristics of indigo/crystal children at some point or another. Those with a mental disability/delay perhaps more so, but it's the parent who places the label. If the parent is prone to believe in such things, they will find it in their child if they want to. And what parent doesn't want to believe their child is special?

Ward

[skeptifem]

Three words:

Extreme cognitive dissonance.

-PbFoot


I would say "self fulfilling prophecy". Not that the kids get special, but the expectations of bratty behavior for sure.

This is a lot like the stuff I have seen about children with psychic abilities- their parents basically encourage them to lie and pretend and so they do it. It seems emotionally unhealthy to make children lie or be defiant in order to please their parents, but that is what this boils down to imo.

[gnome]

I love the "crystal" ones... just the thing for people who know too many indigo child parents, and need something even better to pronounce their child superior.

Proposing a test of any kind is almost useless except on general principle or to serve as an example to others. The parent wants to believe their child is special, and the child wants to think they're special or at least enjoy the advantages of manipulating the parent. In order to preserve this they will dismiss all evidence.

[Beth]

I have a friend who is now absolutely convinced their 10 year old is a indigo, and the kid loves it - she can get away with whatever she wants by claiming she needs to do something to harness "vibrations" or some other woo based excuse. I have tried all the most obvious ways to point out to the parent and the kid that this is total woo and has no basis in reality (like trying to get her to test her so called powers - including weather changing), but conveniently my negativity and skepticism always prevents said powers from working. Any ideas on what to do?

Tough situation. Anytime you feel something is negatively impacting a friend's child or their relationship with their child, it's hard not to point it out and equally difficult to mention it in a way that isn't going to end badly for your relationship with them.

I think I would encourage rigorous testing as much as possible. If she can't work with your 'negative vibes' around, help them understand how rigorous testing works and suggest they test her privately, documenting every test and result as it happens.

Good luck!

[Beth]

Rather than just proposing tests, try coming to them with a (seemingly, at least) real problem for the child to solve. Your grandmother's rhubarb is going to die without rain or something. The problem should easily be solved by the child's weather control or one her other powers. You should not be around when the attempt is made. Then when grandma's rhubarb does die, you need to be devastated so both mother and child can see the harm this is doing. The problem with this is that pulling such a deception is likely to be damaging to LiD's relationship with his friends.

Also, at least when you are around, they should not be able to pull any of this business, since it's proven that her powers are useless around you, the skeptic. The more you are around, the less they can rely on her powers. Quite True!

[LightinDarkness]

Thanks for all the suggestions - its so true that this is a walking on egg shells type of problem. I have to balance the need to maintain a positive relationship with the friend in question while trying to project that the Indigo child thing is made of woo and not based in reality.

I am still not sure how in the world the parent fell down the rabbit hole on this. I have never known her to have any woo tendencies, believe in conspiracy theory, or anything else. It sort of all seems out of the blue. Anyways, I'll update if any progress is made.

[steve s]

It's not just run of the mill brats that get stamped with that label. Generally, it's children with AD(h)D, autism spectrum disorder / PDD-NOS or other that get slapped with the indigo / crystal child label. For some parents it's easier to believe your child is a special project from the universe than accept the gloomy reality that the child is mentally disabled / delayed.

Jenny McCarthy was originally claiming her son was an Indigo child before he was diagnosed with autism. She even ran a website called IndigoMoms.com (now defunct.) She dropped the Indigo nonsense in favor of the anti-vax nonsense.

Steve S.

[arthwollipot]

There are kids who need someone else to tell them who they are?

[rjh01]

Looks like you have done as much as you can. You have let them know of your opinion. The rest is up to them. Trying to change a person is putting the relationship on the line.

[wardenclyffe]

Originally Posted by wardenclyffe
"Rather than just proposing tests, try coming to them with a (seemingly, at least) real problem for the child to solve. Your grandmother's rhubarb is going to die without rain or something. The problem should easily be solved by the child's weather control or one her other powers. You should not be around when the attempt is made. Then when grandma's rhubarb does die, you need to be devastated so both mother and child can see the harm this is doing."

Reply from Beth:
"The problem with this is that pulling such a deception is likely to be damaging to LiD's relationship with his friends."

It could be a real problem that an actual indigo child should be able to help with. It need not harm the relationship (even if it's a fake problem). LiD is not really expecting any help, so there will be no disappointment there. The parent and child cannot hold it against LiD that the child failed to have special powers. I just think it's easier and nicer to ask for help rather than put someone to a test.

Ward

[scarlettinlondon]

I am coming across indigo and crystal mothers in my job as an educational psychologist. It's tragic for the children, mostly disabled with autism or other difficuties. Some do not speak and their parents believe it is because they are communicating telepathically and will not allow access to speech therapists. They are telling teachers not to discipline their children in schools as their children are not defiant/naughty, just being Indigo and fulfilling their destiny and their worst offences must be nurtured as evidence of their superiority.
It is particularly damaging for the children and their future self esteem. Especially as when they do grow up they are not likely to fine real life quite as accommodating.

[Foolmewunz]

How much do you value the relationship... as opposed to, say, sanity?

I was not aware upon initial reading that you were saying that they actually believe their little precious has weather-changing abilities. Is this correct?

If true, then this is beyond confirmation bias, which is the usual problem with Indigo parents (no kid I know of ever came up with this on their own - it's mommy and daddy looking for reasons other than their own shortcomings or previously discussed medical/psychological conditions who grasp onto this batch of straws).

Thinking your kid can change the weather is just plain delusional. I've often said that I have no difficulty in letting bygones be bygones for people with harmless woo beliefs (harmless in my interpretation, of course), like cryptozoology, ufology, numerology.... But there's a line that you cross and I think weather manipulation is just to the other side of that line.

[SatanicSheep]

How much do you value the relationship... as opposed to, say, sanity?

If true, then this is beyond confirmation bias, which is the usual problem with Indigo parents (no kid I know of ever came up with this on their own - it's mommy and daddy looking for reasons other than their own shortcomings or previously discussed medical/psychological conditions who grasp onto this batch of straws).


...but boy do the kids run with it! I work with East Asian children and while I have yet to encounter Indigo children I have come across my fair share of littlest emperors. By virtue of being one of some 2 billion+ miracles born with a penis a child is gifted with a higher than average IQ, brain mass, dexterity, atheltic prowess, and musical/artistic ability. So it's perfectally acceptable to bloody the lip of the smaller boys/girls in class.

Wanting special treatment for your kid because you're a bad parent? Not happenin.

[Foolmewunz]

...but boy do the kids run with it! I work with East Asian children and while I have yet to encounter Indigo children I have come across my fair share of littlest emperors. By virtue of being one of some 2 billion+ miracles born with a penis a child is gifted with a higher than average IQ, brain mass, dexterity, atheltic prowess, and musical/artistic ability. So it's perfectally acceptable to bloody the lip of the smaller boys/girls in class.

Wanting special treatment for your kid because you're a bad parent? Not happenin.

I think most over here admit, though, that they're little Princes (and a number of little Princesses), and are ultimately just spoiled brats rather than touched by the hand of the woo gods.

[jhunter1163]

Just this past weekend, Mrs. JHunter1163 and I were visiting with relatives when one of the youngsters announced to us all, "I'm gifted. I'm the smartest kid in fourth grade. I can beat anyone in this room at Trivial Pursuit."

I just smiled and said "Oh really? Let's play."

Mrs. JHunter1163 took me aside and said "Don't do it. Don't crush his ego."

Gifted Boy's mom then took me aside and said "You know, he could use a lesson in humility."

A lesson in humility was duly delivered to Gifted Boy. Afterwards, I told him, "You know, you did pretty good. You should keep reading and keep learning so you can get better. Maybe when we come down here next year you'll be able to beat me."

Gifted Boy just smiled and said "I'll get you next year, Uncle John."

I agree with the general consensus here that telling kids they're gifted/special just leads to a bunch of little narcissists.

[Flo]

One of my "friend" is up to her ears into this kind of woo. It allows her not to discipline (or treat - I don't know whether little Agrippine is just a spoiled brat or has further problems) her little monster and to foist her on innocent bystanders, teachers, friends, and family. I've clearly told her that, should her actually be a future saviour of humankind, I wasn't going to tolerate her ordering me around in my own house, and generally making herself unbearable to my family and guests while her mother is telling us how marvellous she is.

They obviously hate me because I don't fall for their pretenses at being special, but most of all because the other children, and the parents, count on me for protection against their woo and the abuse the little monster would perform on them when I'm not around ...

Most parents don't dare confront them ("I wouldn't want to sever the friendship ..." What friendship ? that pest is using them to feel important and doesn't care about the mayhem her daughter is causing) but are grateful to me for doing so ... cowards and idiots, the lot of them.

[SatanicSheep]

I think most over here admit, though, that they're little Princes (and a number of little Princesses), and are ultimately just spoiled brats rather than touched by the hand of the woo gods.

I dunno about that. Most who are not the parents of the next Mozart/Galileo will admit this, but those who happened to spawn Asian super children flirt with psudeoscientific eugenics woo that rivals the Indigo BS. (Well maybe not that weather manipultion shiz...but more of the "mainstream" crap like "my child always feels like he's in charge/his talents are being sqaundered/flings feces at me. What a gifted and superior lil rascal!")

[jhunter1163]

I dunno about that. Most who are not the parents of the next Mozart/Galileo will admit this, but those who happened to spawn Asian super children flirt with psudeoscientific eugenics woo that rivals the Indigo BS. (Well maybe not that weather manipultion shiz...but more of the "mainstream" crap like "my child always feels like he's in charge/his talents are being sqaundered/flings feces at me. What a gifted and superior lil rascal!")

I don't care how smart my kids think they are (and believe me, they DO think I'm the stupidest person on earth sometimes). In my house, I'm running the show. Well, actually, Mrs. JHunter1163 runs the show, but the point is that it is most assuredly not the child who is in charge.

[Soapy Sam]

Most parents don't dare confront them ("I wouldn't want to sever the friendship ..." What friendship ? that pest is using them to feel important and doesn't care about the mayhem her daughter is causing) but are grateful to me for doing so ... cowards and idiots, the lot of them.

This is the bottom line in all this nonsense; parents who want to be friends with their children because they lack the self discipline to be parents.

[Flo]

This is the bottom line in all this nonsense; parents who want to be friends with their children because they lack the self discipline to be parents.

There's that, but I was thinking of the kind of people who lack the courage to confront nonsense and intolerable behavior because they fear to be called close-minded.

[Belz...]

They are telling teachers not to discipline their children in schools as their children are not defiant/naughty, just being Indigo and fulfilling their destiny and their worst offences must be nurtured as evidence of their superiority.

If that were a good argument, then the mere fact that the universe is deterministic would be used as an excuse for everything.

"Look, I didn't have a choice, right ? My past states made me do it!"

[dudalb]

I think most over here admit, though, that they're little Princes (and a number of little Princesses), and are ultimately just spoiled brats rather than touched by the hand of the woo gods.

I 1000% agree. Some behavior of the Indigo Children might be due to disease or mental problems, but most are kids who realise that their parents buying into the Indigo bullcrap has just given them a licence to be obnoxious without fear of punishment.

[Paul C. Anagnostopoulos]

I have a friend who is now absolutely convinced their 10 year old is a indigo, and the kid loves it - she can get away with whatever she wants by claiming she needs to do something to harness "vibrations" or some other woo based excuse.
I despair for this kid's future.

~~ Paul

[Foolmewunz]

I 1000% agree. Some behavior of the Indigo Children might be due to disease or mental problems, but most are kids who realise that their parents buying into the Indigo bullcrap has just given them a licence to be obnoxious without fear of punishment.

Hmm? While I agree with the outcome, I'm not sure that that's completely right. I'm thinking that the kids probably don't even know they're being obnoxious. They get so indulged that they just think that it's natural that they should be able to reach across the table and take someone else's pudding. (I had that happen once in New York many years ago.)

I'm hungry. Pudding good. Mom always lets me have everything I want. I take. You let two and three year olds get away with this sort of anti-social ineptness for long and they'll continue into their next age groups quite oblivious to the world around them.

I think all parents want to believe that their kid(s) is(are) special. (That's why I started the thread in FC for Annoying Parents.) The problem is that some parents have the inability to understand that they are special and individual and wonderful,... without having to be in some newly coined unique category. They're special unto themselves. Parents should learn to live with it.

[six7s]

There are kids who need someone else to tell them who they are?Only those who don't profess that they are reincarnated souls (aka R Souls)

[LightinDarkness]

How much do you value the relationship... as opposed to, say, sanity?

I was not aware upon initial reading that you were saying that they actually believe their little precious has weather-changing abilities. Is this correct?

The mother does - she's divorced really doesn't have any contact with the father. If I knew the father well enough I'd probably try to bring him in to see if he couldn't talk some sense into them, but he was just an acquaintance.

I am not entirely sure the child really believes this - I suspect she may be making up powers in order to justify to her mother why she needs to do whatever she wants. But the mother does appear to really believe in it - which is why this is so shocking for me, since I thought of her previously as a critical thinker - apparently I was 100% wrong!

I don't know if this is a power the mother mentioned or the child mentioned first though, so it could be quite possible the parent thought of it and then the child latched on to it. I haven't been able to determine the directional relationship of who is thinking of the woo and influencing the other. The child in this case may be a child but she is quite smart for her age (apart from the woo, obviously) and I can see the potential to be manipulative if she thinks her mom will fall right in line with it.

I agree it is insane...

[Orphia Nay]

A 14-year old girl who believed her mum when she told her she was an indigo child was posting at Skeptical Community a couple of years ago. She eventually seemed to renounce her beliefs. Not a bad thread, as far as SC threads go. ;)

http://skepticalcommunity.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=8161

One does fear for these "indigo children" when they grow up. Hopefully, like most teenagers, they start to doubt what their parents tell them and they get some grasp on reality.

[Leviath]

From http://www.indigochild.com/

"just in case you heard otherwise from other "indigo" sources, the designated word "Indigo" has nothing to do with the color of an aura! It is the result of scientific observations by a woman who has the brain disorder called synesthesia"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synesthesia

The proponents can't seem to agree. Typical woo.

[arthwollipot]

I despair for this kid's future.I reckon she'll be a millionaire by age 18.