Craig's List Scammers

[King of the Americas]

I needed to sell my 99 Eclipse, so I posted an ad on a popular website:

http://www.craigslist.org/about/sites

The ad-

https://post.craigslist.org/manage/1300849778/8aqxm

Within a couple of hours, I already had a potential buyer, so I 'thought'.

Here's a general warning to all Craig's List sellers:


Common signs of a scammer if two or more of these are present:
• The name of the item is not mentioned. They just say “your item”.
• The word “advert” instead of ad is used replying to U.S. ads.
• They offer to send a certified check.
• They are from out of town or “on vacation” but can’t live without your item so they want it shipped.
• They did not ask about condition or ask any critical questions but are “satisfied with the price”.
• They offer you extra for your time or convenience or working with their shipper or ask that you use overage to pay shipper.
• They ask you to withdraw the ad.
• Say they will have a “secretary”, shipper, or other representative make the arrangements.
• They ask for name, address and telephone number.
• They express U.S. money with dollar sign at end (500$ instead of $500).
• They are located in Nigeria (always a scam).
• They have terrible writing/grammar skills and their choice of words seems odd.

My potential buyer hit "8" out of 12...

He 'claimed' that his secretary mailed me a check, not for $1750 (the price I listed in my ad), but for $4600. 'I' was supposed to cash this check, and Western Union the remainder to his 'mover' who would then pick up the car.

The whole thing sounded "hinke", and that's when I stumbled onto the Craig's List Forum, where I found the above warning, along with TONS of other posters who are well versed in this scam.

So, I am here, wondering if anyone here has experienced anything like this with C.L., and to pose the question- "Why isn't law enforcement all over this kind of stuff?" Checks and money transfers are 'easy' to track, right?

If someone sends you a check, and you are supposed to cash it, and moneygram the remainder somewhere else, wouldn't it be easy to check the account for available funds? If they aren't there, that's theft by check, and you could easily post an officer at the place they wanted the money transfered to...?

Pick them up, and offer them a plea to roll over on their partners.

This seems like Cop 101 stuff, to me.

[Audible Click]

If you go to this link you'll find out about CL scams and also 419 scams.

http://forum.419eater.com/forum/index.php

[King of the Americas]

If you go to this link you'll find out about CL scams and also 419 scams.

http://forum.419eater.com/forum/index.php

No "CL Scam" threads that I could find, so I started my own.

Thanks for the link, they seem like an interesting group, from several of the threads I read through.

[AJM8125]

CL is pretty much a zoo when it comes to the Nigerian scams. Even if you aren't trying to sell anything, they still mail you the "desparately need help" letters. Nothing you can do but report them to CL.

The only other thing about CL that makes some folks nervous is the armed robberies that have been committed, at least here in CA, by people responding to an ad. There are ways to protect against that too....

[King of the Americas]

CL is pretty much a zoo when it comes to the Nigerian scams. Even if you aren't trying to sell anything, they still mail you the "desparately need help" letters. Nothing you can do but report them to CL.

The only other thing about CL that makes some folks nervous is the armed robberies that have been committed, at least here in CA, by people responding to an ad. There are ways to protect against that too....

I didn't know "Nigeria" was the Internet scam capitol of the world...

CL doesn't even HAVE a 'list of bad buyers', one of the posters/moderators said such a list would be pointless, given that they never use their real names and don't keep using aliases.

How do you keep from being robbed, other than bringing your own muscle- guns, knives, or personnel to the 'meeting'...then it looks like YOU are the criminal!

*What I really can't believe, is how law enforcement would ignore these super easy collars... There HAS to be a 'moneygram' wing to EVERY police district, one or two officers, who's sole purpose is to make arrests on "flagged" money transfers.

OR, is there already such a wing, and these things just happen too fast to do anything about?

If 'I' cash a check from Mr./Ms. X, and my bank gives me money, then that check comes back insufficient funds, who is the criminal?

[billw]

What I really can't believe, is how law enforcement would ignore these super easy collars...

If law enforcement wants to harvest criminals from CL, they typically go for the low-hanging fruit first - hookers and johns. Here's an example from right here in my home town:

http://www.glendalenewspress.com/articles/2009/06/02/publicsafety/gnp-prostitution02.txt

The myriad other CL scams do, however, get attention as needed:

http://www.glendalenewspress.com/articles/2009/01/27/publicsafety/gnp-craigslist27.txt

http://www.glendalenewspress.com/articles/2008/11/08/publicsafety/gnp-scam07.txt

[King of the Americas]

If law enforcement wants to harvest criminals from CL, they typically go for the low-hanging fruit first - hookers and johns. Here's an example from right here in my home town:

http://www.glendalenewspress.com/articles/2009/06/02/publicsafety/gnp-prostitution02.txt

The myriad other CL scams do, however, get attention as needed:

http://www.glendalenewspress.com/articles/2009/01/27/publicsafety/gnp-craigslist27.txt

http://www.glendalenewspress.com/articles/2008/11/08/publicsafety/gnp-scam07.txt

I guess I will make the exchange during a 'party' with several friends over at the time.

[Kaylee]

If the item is small enough, why not make the exchange for cash at a mall (during a very busy time of the day) or someplace similar?

Ideally your bank will have an ATM nearby and you can deposit the cash immediately.

The one time I sold something on Craigslist, the exchange was at a very busy plaza near a subway stop during a very busy time of the day. The buyer (turned out to be a kid!) came with about 4 brothers. I guess he was concerned too.

Too bad we live in that kind of world, but I would say each one of us did the smart thing.

ETA: Oops! I just reread your OP. Nope, a 99 Eclipse is not a small item. I'm leaving my post up in case it helps someone else, with a smaller item. I think your idea of having friends over is a good one. Good luck!

[Audible Click]

No "CL Scam" threads that I could find, so I started my own.

Thanks for the link, they seem like an interesting group, from several of the threads I read through.

They're on there. I think you'll find them in the forum discussion section.

[Bikewer]

I sell all my rebuilt/refurbished bikes on Craigslist. The very first one I put up, an old hybrid I was asking 100 bucks for....I got an offer from the UK wanting to know if I'd ship it....

I must say I haven't gotten any such since.

[King of the Americas]

If the item is small enough, why not make the exchange for cash at a mall (during a very busy time of the day) or someplace similar?

Ideally your bank will have an ATM nearby and you can deposit the cash immediately.

The one time I sold something on Craigslist, the exchange was at a very busy plaza near a subway stop during a very busy time of the day. The buyer (turned out to be a kid!) came with about 4 brothers. I guess he was concerned too.

Too bad we live in that kind of world, but I would say each one of us did the smart thing.

ETA: Oops! I just reread your OP. Nope, a 99 Eclipse is not a small item. I'm leaving my post up in case it helps someone else, with a smaller item. I think your idea of having friends over is a good one. Good luck!

This kind of thing would make a great movie...'both' sides come expecting a 'fraud', both backed by other people, who are mildly 'armed'...both sides mis-understand a look, a movement...both sides start shooting...all but two are dead, one from each side. The peak out from behind the wreckage, "So, do you still wanna buy this 360?"

[King of the Americas]

I sell all my rebuilt/refurbished bikes on Craigslist. The very first one I put up, an old hybrid I was asking 100 bucks for....I got an offer from the UK wanting to know if I'd ship it....

I must say I haven't gotten any such since.

A good friend of mine successfully sold his vehicle within a week, so I put up an ad.

I'm hoping for a good out come.

[King of the Americas]

They're on there. I think you'll find them in the forum discussion section.

I've reviewed "4" new forums in 2 days...I may have missed it.

But they've (the "scambaiters") already inspired me. :)

[Kaylee]

This kind of thing would make a great movie...'both' sides come expecting a 'fraud', both backed by other people, who are mildly 'armed'...both sides mis-understand a look, a movement...both sides start shooting...all but two are dead, one from each side. The peak out from behind the wreckage, "So, do you still wanna buy this 360?"

:D

[Uncayimmy]

I recently started offering a Craigslist Posting Service (http://www.alwayswellwritten.com/Services/Craigslist-Posting-Service.aspx) since I was already doing it for several clients. I don't spam CL. In fact I have turned down several potential clients who wanted me to play cat and mouse with CL. I started doing it for clients (real estate) because they can never remember to do it as frequently as they should.

Anyway, because I do this for a number of clients, I have seen all sorts of scammers respond. Sometimes I get an identical e-mail for multiple clients from different e-mail addresses within minutes of each other. I rarely get them for homes for sale. I get a few for apartments. The worst is vacation rentals. Fortunately, it's not difficult to detect the scammers. The list you quoted is excellent.

[KeyserSoze]

I was in the hobby of scam baiting for a couple of years, so I know a bit about these scams. My answer here is mainly based from my understandings as it was explained in the scam baiting forums over and over again.

If someone sends you a check, and you are supposed to cash it, and moneygram the remainder somewhere else, wouldn't it be easy to check the account for available funds?
Short answer: No. The check clearing process varies between banks and is complicated, so I won't pretend to know exactly how it works, but simply put, it's just not very effective in preventing people from cashing fraudulent checks. The best deterrent for check fraud is the simple fact that the bank won't cash a check unless they know the identity of the person cashing it, but if a scam victim doesn't realize the check is fake then that fact doesn't matter, so he will cash it anyway and suffer the consequences. Also, many scammers create their fake checks with real (stolen) bank account information, so there's no way to detect the fraud until the account owner notices the missing money.


If they aren't there, that's theft by check, and you could easily post an officer at the place they wanted the money transfered to...?
These scams are almost always based abroad, usually in West African countries like Nigeria. That makes it very hard to arrange for police operations, and the problem is so huge now that it is impossible for law enforcement to stop them at the source.

[King of the Americas]

If they aren't there, that's theft by check, and you could easily post an officer at the place they wanted the money transfered to...?
These scams are almost always based abroad, usually in West African countries like Nigeria. That makes it very hard to arrange for police operations, and the problem is so huge now that it is impossible for law enforcement to stop them at the source.

When I was made the offer, I was already suspicious...

First the guy was 'deaf', so he would be unable to speak with me, but then he made typing mistakes. People who can 'only' communicate with a keyboard, do so VERY efficient and effectively.

Again, with the West Africans..."Nigeria" is leading the world in web scams!?

I've seen Dateline take a shot a few of these kinds of scams.

[KeyserSoze]

Yes, I would say that Nigeria is definitely the leader in web scams. One thing I noticed a lot is that even when the scam is based out of another country, it is still being run by Nigerians, especially when it's coming from the UK.

[Almo]

I got this kind of thing with our TV post. Generic gmail address with "uk" in it asking if "the item" was still for sale. I replied saying "yes" and got no response. :)

[RussDill]

This kind of thing would make a great movie...'both' sides come expecting a 'fraud', both backed by other people, who are mildly 'armed'...both sides mis-understand a look, a movement...both sides start shooting...all but two are dead, one from each side. The peak out from behind the wreckage, "So, do you still wanna buy this 360?"

Reminds me of lock, stock, and two smoking barrels.