Pulling out vs. Condoms - Tracy Quan applies some skeptical thinking.

[BenBurch]

s9E9OeQKFdk

This is a video by a old friend of mine, Tracy Quan, in which she does a great job of applying critical thinking to media claims.

[~enigma~]

s9E9OeQKFdk

This is a video by a old friend of mine, Tracy Quan, in which she does a great job of applying critical thinking to media claims.
...this is too easy, gotta be a sting operation :)

[technoextreme]

s9E9OeQKFdk

This is a video by a old friend of mine, Tracy Quan, in which she does a great job of applying critical thinking to media claims.
What retard is saying that pulling out is any form of protection?

[Aitch]

What retard is saying that pulling out is any form of protection?

I think this bloke (http://www.ecorazzi.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/wallpaper1.jpg) might favour it above condoms. ;)

[Darth Rotor]

What retard is saying that pulling out is any form of protection?

I understand that in order to fertilize an egg, a certain fluid must be injected into a certain area. If the injector isn't in there when fluid pressure exceeds atmospheric pressure and restrictor tension, how would an injection take place?

(But condom seems a smarter bet, to me.)

[technoextreme]

I understand that in order to fertilize an egg, a certain fluid must be injected into a certain area. If the injector isn't in there when fluid pressure exceeds atmospheric pressure and restrictor tension, how would an injection take place?

(But condom seems a smarter bet, to me.)
You fail basic health because you actually inject fluids twice which is the reason why pulling out doesn't work all that well.

[I Ratant]

The pre-ejaculation fluid contains some sperm.
And pulling out is an abrupt almost insulting manuver.

[technoextreme]

The pre-ejaculation fluid contains some sperm.
And pulling out is an abrupt almost insulting manuver.
Yay!!! I was right and was not making up some disturbing fact.

[Darth Rotor]

You fail basic health because you actually inject fluids twice which is the reason why pulling out doesn't work all that well.
Elaborate on that italicized bit, if you please. I recall reading a variety of different articles on that particular topic over the years. Interesting material, and not quite "basic health."

Application is where you put book leraning into practice. Here is a note on a single data point: having used both methods, we still only have exactly as many children as we planned to, which is two.

[mazyloron]

I understand that in order to fertilize an egg, a certain fluid must be injected into a certain area. If the injector isn't in there when fluid pressure exceeds atmospheric pressure and restrictor tension, how would an injection take place?

HAWT.

On a more serious note: I'd love to watch that video but, yeah...not even going to click anywhere near it at work. I'll check it tonight.

[I Ratant]

I've wondered about the process Mom and Dad used, as we three are spaced 18 months apart.
When snooping around their chest of drawers as a kid, I did locate a condom way back when, but I kinda lean towards the "rhythm method", due to the spacing and their being Catholic, which would make them what others who used the "method" are, parents. :)

[Darth Rotor]

I've wondered about the process Mom and Dad used, as we three are spaced 18 months apart.
When snooping around their chest of drawers as a kid, I did locate a condom way back when, but I kinda lean towards the "rhythm method", due to the spacing and their being Catholic, which would make them what others who used the "method" are, parents. :)
"Just pulling out" isn't the rhythmn method, if I recall our reading up on that when we were first married. A significant advantage to condoms is that injectors need not be removed from receiving sites at all, which is a Good Thing(TM).

The pre-ejaculation fluid contains some sperm.
Yes. And??

I am sure that you are aware that not every bundle of ejaculate and/r pre ejaculate reaches the correct zone and fertilizes an egg successfully. In other words, not pulling out and not wearing a condom doesn't always result in rendezvous (But it's the way to bet!)

DR

[BenBurch]

HAWT.

On a more serious note: I'd love to watch that video but, yeah...not even going to click anywhere near it at work. I'll check it tonight.

Other than a frank discussion of sex ed matters, its safe for work.

[I Ratant]

Rhythm is another method of conception prevention, which is unreliable if the fertility dates are misjudged.
Any wigglers in the pre-ejaculate fluid have their work cut out for them, but apparently some are up to the task.

[mazyloron]

Other than a frank discussion of sex ed matters, its safe for work.

Bolded contradicts italics, at least at my work. Clinical or not, if someone hears those terms coming from my cube, I will have some questions to answer. So, we watch at home :)

[Darth Rotor]

Any wigglers in the pre-ejaculate fluid have their work cut out for them, but apparently some are up to the task.

Good point.

[Zeuzzz]

What retard is saying that pulling out is any form of protection?


:D

Better than not pulling out at all.

:D

... It is a form of protection .. its just a really crap one.

[bokonon]

What retard is saying that pulling out is any form of protection?
I do.

I also think any WOMAN who regularly depends on it is asking for trouble.

As a man, however, I've enjoyed decades of sex with that as MY only protection, and I've never fathered any unplanned children.

[UncaYimmy]

I am reporting this as a pull-out thread, which, as I understand it, is against the membership agreement!

[Subduction Zone]

The "pull out method" is actually another sin in the bible. Technically it is "Onanism" . Now many people think that onanism is another term for masturbation, but it isn't. Onan's sin for which he was supposedly struck dead by god was to pull out and spill his "seed" on the ground. So some crazy Christian group is advocating one "sin" over another:boggled:

[ImaginalDisc]

I do.

I also think any WOMAN who regularly depends on it is asking for trouble.

As a man, however, I've enjoyed decades of sex with that as MY only protection, and I've never fathered any unplanned children.

I'm gonna stiffle my initial response which was not kind.

May I instead ask how old you are? People educated in my generation had it hammered into our heads that pulling out rather than using a condom affords no protection against sexually transmitted diseases, which is actually supported by medical evidence.

[Ivor the Engineer]

<snip>

Any wigglers in the pre-ejaculate fluid have their work cut out for them, but apparently some are up to the task.

I wonder if children created with such sperm are fitter in some way than those created with sperm given a thrust in the right direction?

[ImaginalDisc]

I wonder if children created with such sperm are fitter in some way than those created with sperm given a thrust in the right direction?

Trying for a bishop, eh?

[zooterkin]

Bolded contradicts italics, at least at my work. Clinical or not, if someone hears those terms coming from my cube, I will have some questions to answer. So, we watch at home :)

Well, anyone who uses their PC speakers rather than headphones in an office environment, regardless of what they are listening to, deserves what they get.

[bokonon]

I'm gonna stiffle my initial response which was not kind.

May I instead ask how old you are? People educated in my generation had it hammered into our heads that pulling out rather than using a condom affords no protection against sexually transmitted diseases, which is actually supported by medical evidence.
I don't claim that it's any kind of protection against STDs, any more than a diaphragm or birth control pills or a vascectomy or "sex without intercourse" is protection against STDs. Obviously, it provides no protection whatsoever against STDs.

I'm saying it can be an effective method of birth control, for a man. I wouldn't advise a woman who doesn't want to risk pregnancy to depend on her partner's promise that he'll "protect" her in this fashion.

I also wouldn't advise a man who doesn't want to risk his partner's pregnancy to depend on his partner's promise that she never misses a pill.

Obviously, if you're having casual sex with people you don't know and may never see again, the risk of STDs is a more compelling concern than the risk of pregnancy, and condoms are good advice.

If you're in a monogamous relationship with a partner you trust is also monogamous, and have satisfied yourself that STDs are not a concern, I think there's room for some flexibility regarding methods of birth control.

[Professor Yaffle]

I've wondered about the process Mom and Dad used, as we three are spaced 18 months apart.
When snooping around their chest of drawers as a kid, I did locate a condom way back when, but I kinda lean towards the "rhythm method", due to the spacing and their being Catholic, which would make them what others who used the "method" are, parents. :)

18 months-ish is the usual spacing you would expect if no particular method of contraception was used, and the children were breastfed. Breastfeeding delays the return of the woman's fertility for some months.

[ImaginalDisc]

I don't claim that it's any kind of protection against STDs, any more than a diaphragm or birth control pills or a vascectomy or "sex without intercourse" is protection against STDs. Obviously, it provides no protection whatsoever against STDs.

I'm saying it can be an effective method of birth control, for a man. I wouldn't advise a woman who doesn't want to risk pregnancy to depend on her partner's promise that he'll "protect" her in this fashion.

I also wouldn't advise a man who doesn't want to risk his partner's pregnancy to depend on his partner's promise that she never misses a pill.

Obviously, if you're having casual sex with people you don't know and may never see again, the risk of STDs is a more compelling concern than the risk of pregnancy, and condoms are good advice.

If you're in a monogamous relationship with a partner you trust is also monogamous, and have satisfied yourself that STDs are not a concern, I think there's room for some flexibility regarding methods of birth control.

Withdrawal is a method of birth control favored, statistically, by parents.

While 85% of heterosexual partners who use chance are likely to become pregnant in a year, only19% of partners who use withdrawal are. Withdrawal does not protect against sexually transmitted infections (STIs), including HIV/AIDS.
Source. (http://www.birth-control-comparison.info/withdrawal.htm)

You'd have to try really hard to come up with a less responsible method of birth control than withdrawal.

[Herzblut]

As a man, however, I've enjoyed decades of sex with that as MY only protection, and I've never fathered any unplanned children.
... you admit to. :D

I actually made my long-term girlfriend pregnant when relying completely on condoms, which was a bad idea in the first place. Looking into this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_birth_control_methods#Comparison_tab le

comparison table, we see that condom failure rates are around 2-15% while pull-out failures are 4-27% (per year). Both of which are bad.

[ImaginalDisc]

... you admit to. :D

I actually made my long-term girlfriend pregnant when relying completely on condoms, which was a bad idea in the first place. Looking into this

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_birth_control_methods#Comparison_tab le

comparison table, we see that condom failure rates are around 2-15% while pull-out failures are 4-27% (per year). Both of which are bad.

It's important to put that failure rate in its correct context. A 2 to 15% failure rate does not mean that 2-15% of the time a condom is use it results in a pregnancy. These are usually measured for sexually active couples using X method of birth control for a year.

[Herzblut]

It's important to put that failure rate in its correct context. A 2 to 15% failure rate does not mean that 2-15% of the time a condom is use it results in a pregnancy. These are usually measured for sexually active couples using X method of birth control for a year.
Right. My "(per year)" was supposed to indicate that. The "per-incident" failure rate is of course much lower. For both methods.

[ImaginalDisc]

Right. My "(per year)" was supposed to indicate that. The "per-incident" failure rate is of course much lower. For both methods.

Yeah. This is why using two methods is a good idea. Condoms for him and birth control pills for her.

Belt and suspenders, people.

Personally, if there were an affordable male birth control pill I'd be in line to get it.

[bokonon]

Withdrawal is a method of birth control favored, statistically, by parents.
We are parents. Our children were born 5 years apart, so we won't be paying for them to be in college at the same time.

You'd have to try really hard to come up with a less responsible method of birth control than withdrawal.
It has worked for us. Sometimes I've worn a condom, when I wanted to finish inside, but most of the time it's been simple withdrawal. My wife has never taken birth control pills.

Maybe it only works for responsible guys.

[Herzblut]

Maybe it only works for responsible guys.
Well, maybe. The "perfect-use" failure rate for a couple is only 4% per year, leaving a 96% chance of not getting a pregnancy in one year.

Just that "perfect-use" is hardly achievable, I believe.

[bokonon]

Well, maybe. The "perfect-use" failure rate for a couple is only 4% per year, leaving a 96% chance of not getting a pregnancy in one year.

Just that "perfect-use" is hardly achievable, I believe.
Yeah, I saw those stats you posted. I guess if you absolutely positively don't want children, and wouldn't consider abortion or adoption if a pregnancy did occur, you should probably take other precautions. If you're just trying to avoid becoming the Dugger family, maybe you can live with that failure rate.

[Herzblut]

Yeah, I saw those stats you posted. I guess if you absolutely positively don't want children, and wouldn't consider abortion or adoption if a pregnancy did occur, you should probably take other precautions.
Yeah. Where, again, I discourage everybody from relying just on condoms!

It's not very much better than practicing coitus interruptus, obviously. An 85% "typical-use" efficiency is pretty poor, I say.

And worldwide, condoms are not readily available neither. Avoiding vaginal intercourse (anal, oral...) are some efficient options then.

[Starthinker]

But why would you have sex if you weren't trying to procreate? Sex without procreation is meaningless.

[I Ratant]

I wonder if children created with such sperm are fitter in some way than those created with sperm given a thrust in the right direction?
.
That is something that cries out for research.
I'll volunteer the fluid. :)

[I Ratant]

:D

Better than not pulling out at all.

:D

... It is a form of protection .. its just a really crap one.
.
That's what I thought the only time I tried it.
Just at -the- moment when you and her should be "cleaving", you have to push away.
Vile!

[I Ratant]

The "pull out method" is actually another sin in the bible. Technically it is "Onanism" . Now many people think that onanism is another term for masturbation, but it isn't. Onan's sin for which he was supposedly struck dead by god was to pull out and spill his "seed" on the ground. So some crazy Christian group is advocating one "sin" over another:boggled:
.
And for not boinking his dead brother's wife into motherhood.
That's pretty common also, yet there's no world-wide smiting going on.

[I Ratant]

but why would you have sex if you weren't trying to procreate? Sex without procreation is meaningless.
.
lol!

[Professor Yaffle]

I wish I could find a video of the Blly Connolly routine on this subject...

ETA: AHA (NSFW)

rBo2xfGBRIQ

"At the point of ejaculation, there isn't a herd of wild ******* horses that could make my arse go in that direction."

[Aepervius]

.
That is something that cries out for research.
I'll volunteer the fluid. :)

Well sorry due to budget contraction , the lack of fund pushed us to find female in the more *extended* homo genus branch, they are just cheaper :). Just imagine it is your sexy long lost cousine. Good luck.

[pgwenthold]

18 months-ish is the usual spacing you would expect if no particular method of contraception was used, and the children were breastfed. Breastfeeding delays the return of the woman's fertility for some months.

As I am well aware now. Our son is now 9 months old and my wife still awaits the return (not like she is anxious for it or anything, though). He is still nursing quite a bit.

Then again, my wife will argue that she is just making up for the post-partum period where she had a 10 week period (that's a little long, especially considering it was a c-section)

[I Ratant]

Well sorry due to budget contraction , the lack of fund pushed us to find female in the more *extended* homo genus branch, they are just cheaper :). Just imagine it is your sexy long lost cousine. Good luck.
.
Hairy, and sweaty, I likes that!
And she'd be a cousin many times removed, so the offspring, if any, shouldn't have any recessive gene problems, unless the distance on the family tree doesn't separate them out.
Be nice if there's D-cup boobs, though.

[Almo]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coitus_interruptus

For couples that use coitus interruptus correctly at every act of intercourse, the failure rate is 4% per year. In comparison the pill has a perfect-use failure rate of 0.3%, and the IUD has a perfect-use failure rate of 0.6%. The condom has a perfect-use failure rate of 2%.

...

It has been suggested that the pre-ejaculate ("Cowper's fluid") emitted by the penis prior to ejaculation normally contains spermatozoa (sperm cells), which would compromise the effectiveness of the method.[10][11] However, several small studies[12][13] have failed to find any viable sperm in the fluid. While no large conclusive studies have been done, it is now believed the primary cause of method (correct-use) failure is the pre-ejaculate fluid picking up sperm from a previous ejaculation.[14] For this reason, it is recommended that users of withdrawal have the male partner urinate between ejaculations, to clear the urethra of sperm, and wash any ejaculate from objects that might come near the woman's vulva (e.g. hands and penis).

This looks like the important bit.

[I Ratant]

Considering the time I need, and amount of coffee I drink, I see that won't be a problem. :)

[shadron]

Here is a note on a single data point: having used both methods, we still only have exactly as many children as we planned to, which is two.

You say data point, I say anecdote (OK, maybe several). :)

[Ivor the Engineer]

<snip>

For this reason, it is recommended that users of withdrawal have the male partner urinate between ejaculations, to clear the urethra of sperm, and wash any ejaculate from objects that might come near the woman's vulva (e.g. hands and penis).

This looks like the important bit.

Sounds messy, but whatever floats your boat I suppose.

[shawmutt]

Pulling out and relying on the rythm method worked so well for my wife and I she got pregnant with our second five months after my son was born!

Yeah, I went the permanent route, used condoms until I got the doc's OK, and now enjoy sex more than ever.

[Starthinker]

Condoms are a must when you've had as many partners as I have. Which was two in the last 40 years. That's .5 every decade. Gotta stay protected.

[brookus]

As a man, however, I've enjoyed decades of sex with that as MY only protection, and I've never fathered any unplanned children.

Dad?

[bokonon]

Dad?
See you on Maury.

[JFrankA]

Wait. Wait. Wait.

The "pulling-out" method of birth control is the one recommended by some religious leaders? Did I hear that right?

Sheesh!!! I think those guys have watched too much porn.............

[Herzblut]

The "pulling-out" method of birth control is the one recommended by some religious leaders? Did I hear that right?

Don't know. Can hardly be the cathols, so who is it?