Cainkane1
14th September 2009, 01:20 PM
example ...
Him
Below Cain and Doc have expressed their understanding and belief that religious people and people who pray to God are somehow inferior and at a disadvantage to so called “informed” atheists. What a crock of horse manure.
Me
I don't feel that way. Just because I have no faith in a theology doesn't mean I feel superior to a person who does.
Him
This post of necessity cannot be exhaustive, but it will serve to portray facts, which clearly lay bare the error of Cain’s and Doc’s false, self-aggrandizing, fallacious straw man reasoning in their unsupported convictions.
Me
If it were possible to do this someone else would have done it long before now. Give me some evidence that would change my mind and my mind will change. I doubt if our reasoning is any more flawed than a theistic line of reasoning.
Him
By way of example, and only by way of example, Mormons are religious people. They believe in and pray to their God. They were driven out of their lands in the 1800’s for no other reason than their religious beliefs and the emergent properties arising out of those beliefs; a dynamic increasing spontaneous economy and government that superseded in capacity and efficiency the then American government and economy. After being driven out their lands for this sin of prosperity and increase they settled in the most undesirable of unsettled territories. In these wastelands, under the most severe cruel conditions and without the help of their government, they alone with their prayers and their God brought forth their abundance.
Me
My heart goes out to anyone persecuted for their beliefs. America was supposed to have freedom of religion and this basic freedom was obviously denied the LDS peoples. This is a stain on American history.
Me
Ok that happened to you then but much of what happened to the mormons in the 19th century is happening to atheists as I speak now in the 21st century. There have been cases of children forced out of schools because their parents were atheists. Atheists get fired because of their non theism and people have been kicked out of their homes and apartments for being non theistic. You caught hell then and we're catching it now. I completely understand what the Mormons went through. I'm going through it now.
Him
That tradition and faith exists today in Utah. Utah’s economy suffered the least of all economies in the US during this recession. Employment is at 4%. Foreclosures are at the lowest. Property values lost in some areas but rose significantly in others. What’s more, Utahans not only took care of themselves with their prayers and faith and their God, but they also proves to be the most charitable people in the nation at the same time, when other states were looking for hand outs.
Me
Well as many of my posts have revealed I admire the Mormon people and their industrious ways. Mormons are educated and hard working and very honest decent people.
Me
Atheists are also generous and have a tendency to commit less crime and be hard working and employed. With no God to forgive us for doing wrong we tend not to get into trouble. Theists say we have no reason to have morals but we do and statistics prove it. There are very few atheists in prison.
Him
posted this earlier. I’ll post it again for your edification since you believe people of faith are helpless and unable to provide and care for themselves.
Me
I don't know who said that because it sure wasn't me.
Him
“Mormons give far more of their income to charity than any other Americans. Mormons reported providing $2.9 billion to charity in, or 5 percent of their adjusted gross income. Nationally, Americans gave an average of 2.3 percent of their income that year — or less than half of what Mormons provided. The average amount they gave to charity was $7,495 (compared to a national average of $4,399).
Me
The Freedom From Religion Founndation encouraged their members to give to charity. They set up food distribution for the homeless and money was given to underpriviledged children. I personally give a sum of money to abused children. This is a charity sponsored by the state. I will not specify the amount but I will say its in line with my salary. I didn't have to donate anything at all.
Him
This was just for your information. The information was compiled from IRS records of a sampling of 1,000,000 Americans compared to Mormons living in Utah”.
Me
I knew this already. I never said Mormons were anything but good citizens.
Him
Mormons not only prayed to God and exercised faith to care for themselves, but they also cared more for others who could not provide for themselves, more so than any other group of people on the earth. The average Mormon not only got out there and earned $55,000.00 but he managed, of his own volition without tax compulsion, to give about $7K to charities. How much did your rebelling against God make for you last year and how much of that rebellion money did you give to help your fellowman in his scarcity?
Me
Well there are many wealthy atheists. We tend to be as good (or bad) as anyone else. Like I said statistics prove we are less likely to commit crimes against our fellow man. How atheism overall compares in generosity to our fellow man is unknown to me. Atheists by their very nature are not joiners. Organizations that cater to atheists are very small as a consequence.
Him
Below Cain and Doc have expressed their understanding and belief that religious people and people who pray to God are somehow inferior and at a disadvantage to so called “informed” atheists. What a crock of horse manure.
Me
I don't feel that way. Just because I have no faith in a theology doesn't mean I feel superior to a person who does.
Him
This post of necessity cannot be exhaustive, but it will serve to portray facts, which clearly lay bare the error of Cain’s and Doc’s false, self-aggrandizing, fallacious straw man reasoning in their unsupported convictions.
Me
If it were possible to do this someone else would have done it long before now. Give me some evidence that would change my mind and my mind will change. I doubt if our reasoning is any more flawed than a theistic line of reasoning.
Him
By way of example, and only by way of example, Mormons are religious people. They believe in and pray to their God. They were driven out of their lands in the 1800’s for no other reason than their religious beliefs and the emergent properties arising out of those beliefs; a dynamic increasing spontaneous economy and government that superseded in capacity and efficiency the then American government and economy. After being driven out their lands for this sin of prosperity and increase they settled in the most undesirable of unsettled territories. In these wastelands, under the most severe cruel conditions and without the help of their government, they alone with their prayers and their God brought forth their abundance.
Me
My heart goes out to anyone persecuted for their beliefs. America was supposed to have freedom of religion and this basic freedom was obviously denied the LDS peoples. This is a stain on American history.
Me
Ok that happened to you then but much of what happened to the mormons in the 19th century is happening to atheists as I speak now in the 21st century. There have been cases of children forced out of schools because their parents were atheists. Atheists get fired because of their non theism and people have been kicked out of their homes and apartments for being non theistic. You caught hell then and we're catching it now. I completely understand what the Mormons went through. I'm going through it now.
Him
That tradition and faith exists today in Utah. Utah’s economy suffered the least of all economies in the US during this recession. Employment is at 4%. Foreclosures are at the lowest. Property values lost in some areas but rose significantly in others. What’s more, Utahans not only took care of themselves with their prayers and faith and their God, but they also proves to be the most charitable people in the nation at the same time, when other states were looking for hand outs.
Me
Well as many of my posts have revealed I admire the Mormon people and their industrious ways. Mormons are educated and hard working and very honest decent people.
Me
Atheists are also generous and have a tendency to commit less crime and be hard working and employed. With no God to forgive us for doing wrong we tend not to get into trouble. Theists say we have no reason to have morals but we do and statistics prove it. There are very few atheists in prison.
Him
posted this earlier. I’ll post it again for your edification since you believe people of faith are helpless and unable to provide and care for themselves.
Me
I don't know who said that because it sure wasn't me.
Him
“Mormons give far more of their income to charity than any other Americans. Mormons reported providing $2.9 billion to charity in, or 5 percent of their adjusted gross income. Nationally, Americans gave an average of 2.3 percent of their income that year — or less than half of what Mormons provided. The average amount they gave to charity was $7,495 (compared to a national average of $4,399).
Me
The Freedom From Religion Founndation encouraged their members to give to charity. They set up food distribution for the homeless and money was given to underpriviledged children. I personally give a sum of money to abused children. This is a charity sponsored by the state. I will not specify the amount but I will say its in line with my salary. I didn't have to donate anything at all.
Him
This was just for your information. The information was compiled from IRS records of a sampling of 1,000,000 Americans compared to Mormons living in Utah”.
Me
I knew this already. I never said Mormons were anything but good citizens.
Him
Mormons not only prayed to God and exercised faith to care for themselves, but they also cared more for others who could not provide for themselves, more so than any other group of people on the earth. The average Mormon not only got out there and earned $55,000.00 but he managed, of his own volition without tax compulsion, to give about $7K to charities. How much did your rebelling against God make for you last year and how much of that rebellion money did you give to help your fellowman in his scarcity?
Me
Well there are many wealthy atheists. We tend to be as good (or bad) as anyone else. Like I said statistics prove we are less likely to commit crimes against our fellow man. How atheism overall compares in generosity to our fellow man is unknown to me. Atheists by their very nature are not joiners. Organizations that cater to atheists are very small as a consequence.