Racist theme in truther arguments

[cornsail]

How many times do you hear truthers say something like "you actually believe the WTC was destroyed by Arab terrorists living in caves?"

First, lets say that the official government story of 911 is correct; Some Middle Eastern men from a cave hijacked some planes
http://www.opednews.com/articles/opedne_jason_vo_070630_beware_the_man_with_.htm

KSM and his band of fellow cave-dwellers were long ago convicted of criminal terrorism sans trial by the neocons and the government.
http://www.wearechange.org/

Members of Scholars have contributed to a new book that analyses the government's official account, according to which 19 Islamic fundamentalists hijacked four commercial airliners, outfoxed the most sophisticated air-defense system in the world, and committed these atrocities under the control of a man in a cave in Afghanistan.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=6133

The official theory of 9/11 -- 19 hijackers, tall fundamentalist bearded guy in a cave -- is, in the strictest sense of the term, also a "conspiracy theory."
http://www.salon.com/ent/feature/2006/06/27/911_conspiracies/

We all knew then we all realized that this was not some group of
unorganized cave dwellers from Afghanistan orchestrating a perfect hit
on American soil. It was impossible.
http://www.v911t.org/SergeantLauroChavez.php

How could these men – Afghanistani cave-dwellers – who were nicknamed “Dumb and Dumber,” miraculously be able to execute moves that were only achievable by the upper Top Gun elite of our Air Force?
http://www.wingtv.net/bell.html


It just occurred to me that I've heard it a lot and that it relies on a racist stereotype of a backwards uneducated people based on their status as Middle Easterners. They may be morally backwards, but they're certainly not the incompetent cave men that they're so often caricatured as. The main people "allegedly" behind 9-11 were college educated and some of them had a successful history of kicking the Soviets out of Afghanistan. So next time you hear a truther talking about "cave-dwelling Middle Easterners" or something, consider calling them out for their racist assumptions.

[TexasJack]

We have a poster on this forum who echoes those statements.http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=5310709#post5310709
They are third world period. They wipe their ass with their hand.

[KDLarsen]

We have a poster on this forum who echoes those statements.http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=5310709#post5310709
For a moment I thought you were thinking of our resident Jew-hater, so I was about to ask whom he was referring to :rolleyes:

[cornsail]

Ah. Yes, perfect example. It's typical how Algebra34 just assumes that they are uneducated and too stupid to carry out such an operation until shown otherwise.

[Thunder]

wait...are you trying to tell me Arabs do NOT live in caves..and DON'T wipe their asses with their hands???

:confused:

....and Arabs get Master's Degrees??? and can pilot airliners???

its just....not...possible!!!

[bluesjnr]

I can't tell the difference between Arab ass wipers and Jews whenever I'm in Dubai Parky. They all sleep wherever they stand and have beards and smell and... and ........AND......and what is it with that bird who keeps saying "whuachh" when she means 1?

Any more stereotypes folks?

[JamesB]

Mohammed Atta was a PhD candidate in architecture, which made him more qualified than Richard Gage.

[CHF]

Note also that these same "third-world, backwards, cavement" jihadi A-rabs that racist truthers always tell us about are the same folks who fought the US military to a five-year stalemate in Iraq.

But they're waaaaay too stupid and to ever hijack a plane. That's impossible!

[MikeW]

It's not just racism, I think. There's also a degree of arrogance in some American truthers, I think, a disbelief that anyone could bypass the mighty US defences so successfully.

That arrogance shows itself in other ways, too. For instance, I've regularly had emails at 911myths from truthers who question why I should care about this issue at all, as I'm from the UK. They appear to think that this is a solid argument that I'm just a "shill". The fact that 9/11 killed many Brits, has been followed by further attacks on UK soil, and subsequent military action is killing a soldier of ours every few days doesn't seem to occur to them (or maybe they're so ignorant and insular that they don't even know).

So: there are racist themes in truther arguments, yes. But there's also stupidity and ignorance: don't rule those out too quickly.

[TexasJack]

I think to some degree racists are in denial. For years many people felt ( and some still do) that African-Americans were dumb and slow. When more and more demonstrated, mainly through the education and professions, that this was not the case, denial kicked in. The same with those of Arab descent, as it is demonstrated to truthers that many are actually even more educated than they are, denial sinks in and they become defensive.That's when cornered, they continue to call them cave-dwellers; third-world people who wipe their ass with their hands.

[Lenbrazil]

One reason for this is that many (no I didn't say most) truthers are racist. Along similar lines Bollyn complained that Hassan Astaneh, one of the 1st engineers to study the collapses, was Iranian.

[cornsail]

So: there are racist themes in truther arguments, yes. But there's also stupidity and ignorance: don't rule those out too quickly.

Lol, I don't think anyone would dream of ruling those out. Of course, ignorance and racism tend to go hand in hand.

All of us have racist biases to an extent, although most of us do not consider ourselves to be racists. Thus, I wouldn't label truthers who make these arguments as "racists", but I would call their argument racist. Many are probably simply unaware of the effects of their prejudice on their thinking. If they refuse to acknowledge it when presented with facts and continue saying similar things, then I think it's fair to call them racist.

[grandmastershek]

Note also that these same "third-world, backwards, cavement" jihadi A-rabs that racist truthers always tell us about are the same folks who fought the US military to a five-year stalemate in Iraq.

But they're waaaaay too stupid and to ever hijack a plane. That's impossible!

I KNOW! It's not like terrorists have been perfecting this practice for over 30 years.

[Travis]

What I think is strange is that you can live in a cave and "wipe your ass with your hand" and still be a genius. Why those two things are supposed to indicate a failing of intelligence is beyond me.

[eromitlab]

For instance, I've regularly had emails at 911myths from truthers who question why I should care about this issue at all, as I'm from the UK. They appear to think that this is a solid argument that I'm just a "shill".

I wonder what the truthers who wrote those e-mails think of the recent event put on by Australian 9/11 truthers with Gage, Jones, Rudkowski et al. By their own logic, why should Aussies care about an American inside jobby job, and why should these prominent truthers travel halfway around the world to speak to them?

[Shrike]

I wipe my ass with my hand.
The paper doesn't fly to my butt, it needs help.

[Brainache]

I wonder what the truthers who wrote those e-mails think of the recent event put on by Australian 9/11 truthers with Gage, Jones, Rudkowski et al. By their own logic, why should Aussies care about an American inside jobby job, and why should these prominent truthers travel halfway around the world to speak to them?

Well obviously, because the weather is so lovely down here at this time of year...

[Algebra34]

I just wish debunkers would stop the campaign of painting these poor humble people as evil geniuses who just want to use their superior brains destroy the great Satan.

http://learnsomethingnewtoday.us/2008/06/30/they-use-their-hand-to-wipe/

[Thunder]

I just wish debunkers would stop the campaign of painting these poor humble people as evil geniuses who just want to use their superior brains destroy the great Satan.

right. cause it would take an evil genius to hijack 3 airplanes and crash then into the three largest buildings on Earth.

[Algebra34]

right. cause it would take an evil genius to hijack 3 airplanes and crash then into the three largest buildings on Earth.

It took more than just that. Why do you keep trying to simplify the well planned and funded mission that was obviously needed to accomplish such a mission? Why does that thought work better for you? The official version just sounds a little too simple to me but is probably a sufficient and convenient story for simple people to buy into.

[AJM8125]

<snip.> The official version just sounds a little too simple to me but is probably a sufficient and convenient story for simple people to buy into.
:rolleyes:

[Thunder]

It took more than just that.

men learn to basically fly planes. men buy plane tickets. men get on plane. men kill pilots with box-cutters and scare the **** out of passengers. men tell passengers "we are going back to the airport". men point plane into building. plane crash.

this is what happened on 9-11. please fill in the blanks.

[Algebra34]

you're correct.

Yeah I know

it took folks who knew how to basically fly a 757. check.

Who paid for the flight school and how? Exactly. That is very expensive and should be traced to the source.

it took folks who could buy plane tickets.

Where did they get the money to buy 19 first class tickets? Where did the hijackers work at their day job?

it took folks who could get into the USA.

It's not easy to get into the US when you are a "member of a terrorist organization"(your words). How did that happen? I hope no one was looking the other way.

it took folks who could bring box-cutters on to a plane.

What exactly was special about how they got Box cutters onto the plane from anyone else who might try the same? They are metal and were deemed not permissible by industry standards at the time. How did that happen at 3 different airports? One of them twice. Overall by 19 individuals. I hope someone wasn't looking the other way.

it took folks who could cut some throats, scare the passengers, and take over a plane.

Why did only one plane fight back? Were the hijackers on that Plane less scary? What happened there? Hmmm, I wonder what was different. How do you know all they had were boxcutters on every plane anyway? Please source your proof if you even bother to answer.

it took folks who could convince plane passengers that their hijacking was a normal average hijacking, and NOT a suicide mission.

Convince? Were they convincing people or slitting throats? Do you really have a coherent version? How could you? There were four planes hijacked that day. The people on the later planes weren't cut off from the rest of the world.

um....please tell me what sophisticated things I am missing here...cause this is all that really happened on 9-11.

I think I already covered that with my answers to your previous questions here. Will you have any answers? How could you?

[Thunder]

start a new thread.

[dtugg]

You know what is really pathetic? That certain people feel the need to troll internet message boards they have been banned from several times. How badly must one's life suck for him to do that?

[Thunder]

You know what is really pathetic? That certain people feel the need to troll internet message boards they have been banned from several times.

I used to do that. But then I got a life...and came to JREF.

:D

[UNLoVedRebel]

I just wish debunkers would stop the campaign of painting these poor humble people as evil geniuses who just want to use their superior brains destroy the great Satan.

http://learnsomethingnewtoday.us/2008/06/30/they-use-their-hand-to-wipe/

I have recently been educated on how people in Iraq wipe their butts!
None of the 9/11 hijackers or plotters were from Iraq.

[Travis]

Did someone just call Al Qaeda "poor" and "humble?"

[Brainache]

Did someone just call Al Qaeda "poor" and "humble?"

Yes, yes they did.
Algebra34 can't seem to get his head around the idea that a group can be well funded and full of intelligent individuals and yet still be enemies of the US.

[TruthersLie]

I just wish debunkers would stop the campaign of painting these poor humble people as evil geniuses who just want to use their superior brains destroy the great Satan.

http://learnsomethingnewtoday.us/2008/06/30/they-use-their-hand-to-wipe/

Can you please explain to me what requires the "evil genius" category of this plan?
1. put 5 people on each jet
2. cut up stewadesses and passengers to get
3. Into the cockpit
4. kill the pilots
5 fly into buildings.

Can you tell me what requires an "evil genius?"

Now the twoof version on the other hand requires numerous "evil geniuses" what with covertly imbedding super secret nanothermite inside buildings, to then either have holographic jets, or pinpoint controlled jets to strike the towers... and that is not talking about wtc7 and setting that up.

Tell me which one follows the KISS rule?

[Debaser]

Can you please explain to me what requires the "evil genius" category of this plan?
1. put 5 people on each jet
2. cut up stewadesses and passengers to get
3. Into the cockpit
4. kill the pilots
5 fly into buildings.

Can you tell me what requires an "evil genius?"



I know what you mean by the 'evil genius' remarks, however, it could be argued that 9/11 required the genius of audacity.

Combining the change in perception of suicide in some Middle Eastern muslims, together with 'thinking big', possibly derived from the IRA's ideas about 'spectaculars', was unique. Which is one of the reasons that, 8 years on, discussion about that event is not just confined to the survivors and relatives of the dead, as it is in so many previous terrorist attacks.

[Thunder]

Can you please explain to me what requires the "evil genius" category of this plan?
1. put 5 people on each jet
2. cut up stewadesses and passengers to get
3. Into the cockpit
4. kill the pilots
5 fly into buildings.


only an evil genius can order the entire US air force to stand down.

only an evil genius can fly a missile into the Pentagon, call it a plane, and plant plane parts and passenger body parts in the Pentagon.

only an evil genius can load the WTC with thermite, and have it detonate 1 hours after the planes hit.

get it now?

[aggle-rithm]

How many times do you hear truthers say something like "you actually believe the WTC was destroyed by Arab terrorists living in caves?"



I always say, "Sure, they're living in caves NOW, after we chased them there...but on 9/11 they lived in houses like everyone else."

[aggle-rithm]

only an evil genius can order the entire US air force to stand down.

only an evil genius can fly a missile into the Pentagon, call it a plane, and plant plane parts and passenger body parts in the Pentagon.

only an evil genius can load the WTC with thermite, and have it detonate 1 hours after the planes hit.

get it now?

Interestingly, the more convoluted their theories become, the more evil genius is required.

[aggle-rithm]

Yeah I know



Who paid for the flight school and how? Exactly. That is very expensive and should be traced to the source.



Where did they get the money to buy 19 first class tickets? Where did the hijackers work at their day job?



It's not easy to get into the US when you are a "member of a terrorist organization"(your words). How did that happen? I hope no one was looking the other way.



What exactly was special about how they got Box cutters onto the plane from anyone else who might try the same? They are metal and were deemed not permissible by industry standards at the time. How did that happen at 3 different airports? One of them twice. Overall by 19 individuals. I hope someone wasn't looking the other way.



Why did only one plane fight back? Were the hijackers on that Plane less scary? What happened there? Hmmm, I wonder what was different. How do you know all they had were boxcutters on every plane anyway? Please source your proof if you even bother to answer.



Convince? Were they convincing people or slitting throats? Do you really have a coherent version? How could you? There were four planes hijacked that day. The people on the later planes weren't cut off from the rest of the world.



I think I already covered that with my answers to your previous questions here. Will you have any answers? How could you?


You really don't know the answers to these questions? If you had any real curiosity, you could have found out for yourself fairly easily.

[BigAl]

Yeah I know

Who paid for the flight school and how? Exactly. That is very expensive and should be traced to the source.

Where did they get the money to buy 19 first class tickets? Where did the hijackers work at their day job?

It's not easy to get into the US when you are a "member of a terrorist organization"(your words). How did that happen? I hope no one was looking the other way.

What exactly was special about how they got Box cutters onto the plane from anyone else who might try the same? They are metal and were deemed not permissible by industry standards at the time. How did that happen at 3 different airports? One of them twice. Overall by 19 individuals. I hope someone wasn't looking the other way.

Why did only one plane fight back? Were the hijackers on that Plane less scary? What happened there? Hmmm, I wonder what was different. How do you know all they had were boxcutters on every plane anyway? Please source your proof if you even bother to answer.

Convince? Were they convincing people or slitting throats? Do you really have a coherent version? How could you? There were four planes hijacked that day. The people on the later planes weren't cut off from the rest of the world.


All of your "questions" indicate that you are clueless about the most basic narrative for what happened on 9/11 and what lead up to it.

If you are going to question that story, it kind of requires that you be familiar with it so you can counter it with logic and/or additional information.

Otherwise you are just a troll.

[twinstead]

Wow. I'll take "people who don't have a clue what they're talking about" for $400, Alex.

[Justin39640]

Wow. I'll take "people who don't have a clue what they're talking about" for $400, Alex.

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