Why don't people have all their teeth removed?

[Dragoonster]

I've never understood why everyone doesn't simply have all their teeth removed at about age 25 and wear dentures the rest of their lives. I'd think this would be better due to the following:

* Much less risk of a serious medical problem from bad teeth

* MUCH less long-term cost to maintain dentures or get new ones every decade than to continually fill, fix, replace, cap, etc. teeth

* Less symptoms that are frequent but not fixable or return--i.e. intolerance to cold foods like ice cream, or heat, or pain, etc. Even if teeth are fixable, many people have to experience stuff like this for a good % of their lives until they are fixed

* Less risk of getting a tooth problem without access to a dentist/ER, such as on a long camping trip, in a third-world country, etc.

Are dentures actually a health risk too, or cause pain in some people? The only groups I can think of that dentures might negatively effect more than the pretty lousy track record of our teeth (particularly with modern sugar-filled foods and such) would be singers or actors who're afraid it'll affect their voices. But why not otherwise?

[Rolfe]

This used to be quite common in Scotland. Girls would have all their teeth out and get a set of dentures for their 21st birthday.

It's not really done now, can't imagine why.... :oldroll:

Rolfe.

[casebro]

Lower plates don't hardly work. Never stay in place. Uppers are better, but dentures are only the lesser of two evils, the other choice being no teeth at all.

Modern 'implants' might be OK. But the cost for a full set is probably $20,000.

But your concept is not new. The day my Dad reported in to the Army Air Corp, 1943, they pulled seven of his teeth. Age of 23.

[GreenLines]

If it were cost affective it would be worth it, but since it likely isn't, there's not much of a point to it.

Some types of implant/dentures, I forget which and how exactly it works, but over time can cause the jawbone to shrink and become brittle, cracking it after a decade or two. If everyone had this in affect, around age 45 people would have to get their jawbone replaced, and I can't imagine that being pleasant. There are types to get around this though, but they likely have their own complications, infection, etc.

[Dragoonster]

This used to be quite common in Scotland. Girls would have all their teeth out and get a set of dentures for their 21st birthday.

It's not really done now, can't imagine why.... :oldroll:

Rolfe.

Well, modern tooth maintenance can make it so someone has few problems, but it doesn't seem often that it's really followed. I wonder what the average cavity filled tooth amount is, and how much just that cost compared to dentures.

Lower plates don't hardly work. Never stay in place. Uppers are better, but dentures are only the lesser of two evils, the other choice being no teeth at all.

Modern 'implants' might be OK. But the cost for a full set is probably $20,000.

But your concept is not new. The day my Dad reported in to the Army Air Corp, 1943, they pulled seven of his teeth. Age of 23.

Hm, didn't know dentures didn't stay in. I wonder though if most of adult dentristy were concerned with replacing teeth with dentures they'd develop better ones, or the cost on something like implants would drop.

Teeth just seem really problematic for a ton of people and the species in general. My mom has been missing a few teeth for years, uses a partial plate, but has to go the dentist a couple times a year to fix/maintain other teeth with not-cheap procedures. I asked her why she didn't just have them all yanked and she said the dentist refused to do it, that her teeth were still "functional". Yeah, except a lot are discolored, her caps fall out, she doesn't remember her plate all the time, and she frequently has pain until the newest tooth that goes bad if fixed, limiting her diet and enjoyment.

[Brian-M]

I've never understood why everyone doesn't simply have all their teeth removed at about age 25 and wear dentures the rest of their lives. I'd think this would be better due to the following:


Here's a few reason's for not doing this:


Removing all your teeth would be extremely expensive.
Surgically removing your teeth would carry a high risk of infection and other complications, just like any other form of surgery.
A painful and prolonged recovery time from the procedure.
Dentures aren't as good as real teeth. You may have trouble eating tough or very sticky foods, for example.
Dentures are nowhere near as convenient as real teeth for day-to-day use.
Potential mates may find you less desirable if they find out you have dentures instead of real teeth.

[Dragoonster]

If it were cost affective it would be worth it, but since it likely isn't, there's not much of a point to it.

Some types of implant/dentures, I forget which and how exactly it works, but over time can cause the jawbone to shrink and become brittle, cracking it after a decade or two. If everyone had this in affect, around age 45 people would have to get their jawbone replaced, and I can't imagine that being pleasant. There are types to get around this though, but they likely have their own complications, infection, etc.

that does sound bad.

[Dragoonster]

Here's a few reason's for not doing this:


Removing all your teeth would be extremely expensive.
Surgically removing your teeth would carry a high risk of infection and other complications, just like any other form of surgery.
A painful and prolonged recovery time from the procedure.
Dentures aren't as good as real teeth. You may have trouble eating tough or very sticky foods, for example.
Dentures are nowhere near as convenient as real teeth for day-to-day use.
Potential mates may find you less desirable if they find out you have dentures instead of real teeth.


Good points, thanks!

[MetalSeagull]

It's not uncommon for people in this area to have healthy teeth pulled so they can get full dentures, but its usually a monetary choice. I work with the elderly and I'd estimate that more than half of my clients have full dentures.

I was planning to use some information from this website, but I found it so interesting, I read the whole thing: http://www.doctorspiller.com/DenturesYesOrNo.htm

[Rolfe]

My father said dentures were like having the grand piano on the top and the chest of drawers on the bottom. Very few people who have full dentures seem to regard them as equal or better than their own teeth.

I think NHS dentistry was what saw an end to the "get your teeth pulled for your 21st" habit in Scotland. OK, it's hardy free any more, but it's not expensive for the no-frills care and maintenance, and since the dentists are liable to throw you off their list if you don't come for these pesky checkups, most people obediently trot up every 6 to 12 months.

I had 7 teeth crowned (on the NHS) in about 1982. One of them is giving trouble, now, in 2010. My appointment to have a new crown fitted (again on the NHS) is for Tuesday. The other six ain't broke, neither are the 4 or so more I've had done more recently. They feel like my own teeth.

I'd have an implant before I had wallies, though I'd have to pay full whack for that.

Rolfe.

[ThunderChunky]

I like my teeth. Getting all teeth removed would cost a ton. Getting my teeth pulled would be painful. If i was stuck on a deserted island i would much rather have teeth than dentures.

[HansMustermann]

Lower plates don't hardly work. Never stay in place. Uppers are better, but dentures are only the lesser of two evils, the other choice being no teeth at all.

Modern 'implants' might be OK. But the cost for a full set is probably $20,000.

But your concept is not new. The day my Dad reported in to the Army Air Corp, 1943, they pulled seven of his teeth. Age of 23.

Actually, probably a lot more than 20 grand.

But you better be prepared to pay that every few years, because anyone who'll tell you that implants are for ever, is really lying his rear off. IIRC on the average, even if you do a really obsessive mouth hygiene, the "half-life" is about 5 years.

And yeah, you're not even getting rid of that chore. It takes a lot less obsessive cleaning your natural teeth to keep them ok, than it takes to keep your implants, umm, at all.

Also, your cells have maximum division counters, including bone cells. At some point, that bone just stops repairing itself around the screw, which is when you lose the implant.

This is important because, basically, you can't just screw in another screw and be done with it. After the first replacement or two, you have to fill the hole with some bone pieces taken from somewhere else (e.g., hip) if you want a replacement screw in the same position.

It's also something that goes from outside to staight in the bone. It's a potential conduit for infections, which is why you end up having to clean those expensive things more obsessively than your natural teeth. Most of the time it just means eventually the bone stops repairing around the screw, but occasionally more severe infections are possible.

Basically I see the point of implants if you had to have your normal teeth removed. But pulling out all teeth to replace them with implants sounds... let's just say about as wise as cutting off a leg so you can get a prosthetic instead.

[bynmdsue]

would it be unwise to go about with stainless steel dentures in all day?

from a health standpoint,i mean aesthetically it'd be cool

edit-okay just read the Dentures Yes or No link.

maybe just a bridge.

[Dragoonster]

would it be unwise to go about with stainless steel dentures in all day?

from a health standpoint,i mean aesthetically it'd be cool

I swear I've seen a picture of someone with something like that. Maybe it was just a temporary over-tooth gag thing though.

MetalSeagull--that website is fascinating and scary! I had no idea dentures could do that to the underlying bone.

[Rrose Selavy]

I've never understood why everyone doesn't simply have all their teeth removed at about age 25 and wear dentures the rest of their lives.

Ok you go first.





If it sounds like such a great idea ask yourself why you haven't you done it already?

-

[Uncayimmy]

Ok you go first.


If it sounds like such a great idea ask yourself why you haven't you done it already?
-

Yeh, that's putting the E in JREF. Somebody says that they don't understand why something isn't done, so you challenge him to do it himself. I mean, it's not like he asked other questions like, "are dentures actually a health risk too, or cause pain in some people?"

[casebro]

Dad did have an intermediate fix. Wahat with the seven pulled in the army, and a couple more that were going bad, the dentist ground down a couple, put studs into the tooth roots, and got a bridge that snapped on and off of those studs. It lasted about 20 years. Don't know the proper nomenclature.

[TheDaver]

MetalSeagull’s link is interesting. Particularly the part where the author describes how with dentures rather than real teeth, your jaw shrinks and deforms your face.

[casebro]

And one point for the other side:

I had a wisdom tooth pulled last year. It was only partially emerged and seemed to trap food. Later that day, I sneezed, and blew the clot out- from the nasal side. Seems the tooth root had penetrated the sinus. I could breathe through the socket with my mouth closed. Socket got infected, from food being forced in while chewing. I could push on my cheek and squeeze burning pus into my sinus and down my throat. Took a couple days to get the dentist to issue a prescription for antibiotics, which took ten days to knock out the infection. Too close to the brain for comfort.

Good thing was that my sleep apnea was much improved by removing the root that must have been blocking my sinus. Perhaps if I pursue that track, pulling the opposite third molar would cure my sleep apnea? But i also think I may have supernumerary teeth, 4th molars? If those bulges in the back of my mouth are fourth molars, then I know they are adding to the apnea, they are way inside of the usual row for teeth.

[Uncayimmy]

MetalSeagull’s link is interesting. Particularly the part where the author describes how with dentures rather than real teeth, your jaw shrinks and deforms your face.

Interestingly, this definitely happened with my mother, who got full dentures in 40s or 50s as I recall. My father, like someone else posted, got his in the army. I don't think it affected him the same way, but obviously it was much harder to tell. One of my sisters has full dentures, and it hasn't seemed to age her all that much.

I'm not disputing this expert's experience, though. Like with most things, it will probably vary by individual. The degree may not be all that noticeable in some, but I think it's obvious that for others it has a large effect. I never thought about the gag reflex. I have a horrible gag reflex (I gag when brushing my teeth), so it's all the more incentive to avoid dentures. Personally, I had resigned myself to that eventuality considering the problems I've had over the years.

[EeneyMinnieMoe]

This used to be quite common in Scotland. Girls would have all their teeth out and get a set of dentures for their 21st birthday.

It's not really done now, can't imagine why.... :oldroll:

Rolfe.

You are messing with us. You have got to be making it up. Please tell me you aren't serious.

Scottish comic Craig Ferguson writes in his memoir that his father had a full set of dentures even as a very young man but that was due to the total destruction of his father's teeth when he was a boy (the elder Ferguson having been a victim of horrendous child labor and having grown up in war torn and air strike-ed out and bomb raid-ed out Scotland during World War Two.)

Maybe this was common way back when war, rationing, poverty and the deplorable state of Scottish and British dentistry had left everyone with permanently wrecked teeth or no teeth to speak of by the time they were 21?

If you have 32 cavity riddled, damaged, crooked and yellow teeth, just getting a set of full dentures would make sense at that young an age. Especially given how much less advanced dentistry was in the 1940s and 1950s and how relatively limited technology was back then; there would have been no other options but having all the teeth removed.

That's the only sensible explanation possible.

Half sensible explanation possible.

[sowellfan]

This thread just horrifies me - especially the part about Scottish girls getting their teeth yanked when they're 21. Let's face it - there's something much less than attractive about somebody pulling a big ol' set of teeth out of their head, and giving you a big gummy smile. Sure, it's necessary for old people, eventually, I guess - but they're old and decrepit anyway, so it's not that big of a deal. For the most part, though, I think tooth problems are solved by brushing your damn teeth, going to the dentist every once in a while, not smoking meth, having flouridated water, etc.

[Yuri Nalyssus]

You are messing with us. You have got to be making it up. Please tell me you aren't serious.
'Tis true I'm afraid - my mum has told me the same story - that several of her contemporaries opted for total extraction of healthy teeth. It was often done as a wedding present believe it or not, the rationale being that false teeth were going to be less of a financial drain on the young couple.

Mind you, she was brought up in Dundee so probably if you hadn't had your teeth taken out they would have been punched out before long anyway :D

Yuri

[Bob Blaylock]

Interesting that this thread should begin on a day that I had a tooth extracted. Not fun.

Having so freshly had the experience of having one tooth removed, I can't imagine having them all removed at once.

Whether an artificial prothesis can be as good or better than a real tooth, I just can't see removing a tooth that hasn't yet become a serious enough problem to warrant it.

[commandlinegamer]

You are messing with us. You have got to be making it up. Please tell me you aren't serious.



Happened to a female relative of mine, though I think she was quite a bit younger. Didn't realise it was so widespread though. I'm quite proud of the fact I'm only missing four of my teeth; If I smile carefully, you won't even notice.

I think it may be due to the fact that dental treatment was only free on the NHS for a short period at the beginning. As the the cost of providing the services rose, they started charging for dental.

[luchog]

'Tis true I'm afraid - my mum has told me the same story - that several of her contemporaries opted for total extraction of healthy teeth. It was often done as a wedding present believe it or not, the rationale being that false teeth were going to be less of a financial drain on the young couple.
As a wedding present?

Perhaps that wasn't the only reason... :D

[Travis]

I had this done when I was 28. It all started when I had some teeth knocked out when I fell off a roof (long story involving heat stroke) which led to an infection that persisted for months which made dealing with the remaining teeth impossible and eventually it seemed medically prudent to just yank them all and start with a clean slate.

But it was expensive. My new teeth were not cheap economy models, they cost me almost $20,000. They have their good and bad aspects like chewing sticky stuff is impossible but I never get ice cream headaches now. Also they require more frequent cleaning but are somewhat easier to clean each time.

[quarky]

And one point for the other side:

I had a wisdom tooth pulled last year. It was only partially emerged and seemed to trap food. Later that day, I sneezed, and blew the clot out- from the nasal side. Seems the tooth root had penetrated the sinus. I could breathe through the socket with my mouth closed. Socket got infected, from food being forced in while chewing. I could push on my cheek and squeeze burning pus into my sinus and down my throat. Took a couple days to get the dentist to issue a prescription for antibiotics, which took ten days to knock out the infection. Too close to the brain for comfort.

Good thing was that my sleep apnea was much improved by removing the root that must have been blocking my sinus. Perhaps if I pursue that track, pulling the opposite third molar would cure my sleep apnea? But i also think I may have supernumerary teeth, 4th molars? If those bulges in the back of my mouth are fourth molars, then I know they are adding to the apnea, they are way inside of the usual row for teeth.



Thanks for sharing. I especially liked the part about the burning pus.

[Baby Nemesis]

Why don't people have all their teeth removed?

Cleaning the teeth twice a day should reduce a lot of problems with them. I, for one, didn't go to a dentist for fifteen years, and when I did go in the end, I was told there was nothing wrong.

Besides, perhaps in a decade, dentistry will be near painless:

Dentist's Drills Could Be Replaced By Painless Plasma Jets (http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/176577.php)

Plasma jets capable of obliterating tooth decay-causing bacteria could be an effective and less painful alternative to the dentist's drill, according to a new study published in the February issue of the Journal of Medical Microbiology.

Firing low temperature plasma beams at dentin - the fibrous tooth structure underneath the enamel coating - was found to reduce the amount of dental bacteria by up to 10,000-fold. The findings could mean plasma technology is used to remove infected tissue in tooth cavities - a practice that conventionally involves drilling into the tooth. ...

Dr Rupf said using plasma technology to disinfect tooth cavities would be welcomed by patients as well as dentists. "Drilling is a very uncomfortable and sometimes painful experience. Cold plasma, in contrast, is a completely contact-free method that is highly effective. Presently, there is huge progress being made in the field of plasma medicine and a clinical treatment for dental cavities can be expected within 3 to 5 years."

[Yuri Nalyssus]

As a wedding present?

Perhaps that wasn't the only reason... :D
Eeooeow! :blush:

This is friends of my mum's and my Granny's we're talking about here; now respectable 'ladies of a certain age' in posession of too many cats and smelling slightly of boiled cabbage.

That image is just too uncomfortable :boggled:. I'm sure no member of the Nalyssus family would have stooped to such a thing :D:D:D.

Yuri

[sowellfan]

Happened to a female relative of mine, though I think she was quite a bit younger. Didn't realise it was so widespread though. I'm quite proud of the fact I'm only missing four of my teeth; If I smile carefully, you won't even notice.

I think it may be due to the fact that dental treatment was only free on the NHS for a short period at the beginning. As the the cost of providing the services rose, they started charging for dental.
Do they have flouridated water in Scotland? As far as NHS coverage goes, that might have an effect, but dental has pretty much never been free here in the U.S., and people still manage to go to the dentist. It just doesn't cost very much to go and get a cleaning/X-ray every 6 months or every year. Now, if you wait until your teeth *hurt* to actually go to the dentist, I'd imagine that could be more expensive.

[Professor Yaffle]

My gran tells me the same thing - that as soon as you had a bad problem with any of your teeth, you would just get the lot yanked out, as repeat visits to the dentist were too expensive.

[Baby Nemesis]

... Now, if you wait until your teeth *hurt* to actually go to the dentist, I'd imagine that could be more expensive.

Then again, going to some dentists all unsuspecting when nothing hurts could land you with a nasty surprise. See, for instance, How The Cowboy Dentists Are Allowed To Ruin Our Teeth. (http://www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/Article/0,4273,4011043,00.html) And then there are horror stories like this: Revealing How Dentists Profit By Abusing Children (http://www.nieman.harvard.edu/reportsitem.aspx?id=100963)

In ‘Drilling for Dollars,’ a local TV reporter presented shocking visual and audio testimony about a situation in which children were being needlessly treated and harmed because of corporate greed.

[bruto]

I realize people are pretty stupid where health and dental care are concerned, but removing all your teeth seems like a pretty drastic alternative to teaching people not to kill their kids with junk food and to take care of their teeth.

I like chewing with the real ones.

[Professor Yaffle]

I think the reason that it was mainly women who had all their teeth removed was because it was fairly likely they would lose all their teeth after multiple pregnancies anyway.

[nathan]

I had 7 teeth crowned (on the NHS) in about 1982. One of them is giving trouble, now, in 2010. My appointment to have a new crown fitted (again on the NHS) is for Tuesday.

Interesting. I had a tooth crowned in (about) 1984 (NHS, porcelain), and had it replaced last summer, because it cracked. I went private this time, to get a glass crown, rather than porcelain-on-metal. Mrs Me was freaked out by the tooth cast I brought home!

Hope your refitting goes ok.

[Rolfe]

Are glass crowns better? I've been perfectly happy with my porcelain ones.

My (NHS) dentist isn't massively ambitious, and never even suggests doing anything privately, and I don't push it on the principle of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".

I think this is something a lot of Americans don't understand in relation to dental care in Britain. Most people have healthy teeth with the cavities filled and the worst misalignment fixed. But cosmetic dentistry just isn't something many peope go in for. The dazzling white Hollywood smile just isn't an ambition - especially if it would involve more time in a dentist's chair.

The actors are getting on the bandwagon of course, but relatively recently - if you look at Gareth Thomas's back teeth, which you can see in the opening credits for the first season of Blake's Seven, you can see a fair number of amalgam fillings.

Rolfe.

[Amapola]

I think the reason people don't have all their teeth removed and then put in fake ones, is because the real ones work better. At least, that's what my dentist says. His advice is "If you've got 'em, floss 'em."

I suppose one could make a case for getting artificial limbs along this same line of argument - after all, most people experience difficulty with arthritis or some other such thing, why not just cut off the real thing and have an artificial limb, then you won't have any more arthritis. And of course, the answer is the real ones work better.

It varies in individual cases. Sometimes it would be exactly the right thing to do.

I had a neighbor who had quite a lot of trouble with her teeth, and she spent several years trying to find a dentist who would pull out all of her teeth and then make up a full set of dentures for her. She eventually found one and had this done. I don't know if it made her all that happy though; she was then upset with the way her teeth looked, and always held her hand in front of her mouth when she was around other people. It was kind of weird.

[epix]

The majority of denture wearers would opt for healthy teeth, if they had the chance to have them. These teeth problems will be history when genetic engineering makes some advances. Not only that anyone would be able to grow a third set of teeth, but "junk gene" prevention would enable to grow toothpaste-ad like teeth for yet undisclosed amount of money.

[Brian-M]

The majority of denture wearers would opt for healthy teeth, if they had the chance to have them. These teeth problems will be history when genetic engineering makes some advances. Not only that anyone would be able to grow a third set of teeth, but "junk gene" prevention would enable to grow toothpaste-ad like teeth for yet undisclosed amount of money.


Wouldn't it be quicker and easier to genetically modify a species of tooth-benign bacteria to displace the acid-producing bacteria that damage our teeth?

[rdaneel]

Wouldn't it be quicker and easier to genetically modify a species of tooth-benign bacteria to displace the acid-producing bacteria that damage our teeth?
It's being worked on (http://www.popsci.com/scitech/article/2008-01/germ-could-save-your-life?page=1).

[Brian-M]

It's being worked on (http://www.popsci.com/scitech/article/2008-01/germ-could-save-your-life?page=1).


Awesome! :clap:

[Astreja]

My mom's side of the family has a predisposition towards bad teeth, and I unfortunately inherited this. I'm having a molar yanked next week in order to deal with an abscess, which will leave me with four missing teeth. I can get a partial plate to put back three of them, but the fourth one is in the opposite quadrant of the mouth and will probably need a bridge.

Initially I thought that implants might be the way to go, but it sounds like they're more trouble and expense than they're worth.

[epix]

Wouldn't it be quicker and easier to genetically modify a species of tooth-benign bacteria to displace the acid-producing bacteria that damage our teeth?
Streptococcus mutans maybe a bit beneficial to your mouth, so the genes that are responsible for thickness of tooth enamel and saliva composition would be the target to mess with. But if it turns out that your mouth can live without the bacteria just fine, then the complete elimination of those cavity-causing bacterias would be a better choice. You can apply bio-nanotech and build a bacteria that cannot live without eating Streptococcus mutans and nothing else. So you go to the drugstore, buy a spray can and mist the hell out of the cavity makers.

[nathan]

Are glass crowns better? I've been perfectly happy with my porcelain ones.

My dentist (who does both NHS and private) told me that you can't get totally porcelain crowns any more -- they are now a metal base with a porcelain crust. The original crown was completely porcelain, with no metal core. A glass crown would be just glass and thus thinner and look more natural -- better matching the translucency of enamel. As it was a front tooth I'd damaged, that was important to me.

If it was a molar, I'd've gone for the cheaper option. If I could have got the same design porcelain as I originally had, I'd've gone for that.

[Rolfe]

Ah. My crowns are the metal-based ones. They look natural enough to me - I suspect it's related to how translucent your natural teeth look in the first place. Mine, not so much.

Rolfe.

[Big Les]

You are messing with us. You have got to be making it up. Please tell me you aren't serious.

Scottish comic Craig Ferguson writes in his memoir that his father had a full set of dentures even as a very young man but that was due to the total destruction of his father's teeth when he was a boy (the elder Ferguson having been a victim of horrendous child labor and having grown up in war torn and air strike-ed out and bomb raid-ed out Scotland during World War Two.)

Maybe this was common way back when war, rationing, poverty and the deplorable state of Scottish and British dentistry had left everyone with permanently wrecked teeth or no teeth to speak of by the time they were 21?

If you have 32 cavity riddled, damaged, crooked and yellow teeth, just getting a set of full dentures would make sense at that young an age. Especially given how much less advanced dentistry was in the 1940s and 1950s and how relatively limited technology was back then; there would have been no other options but having all the teeth removed.

That's the only sensible explanation possible.

Half sensible explanation possible.

I have to say I've always been sceptical of this claim as a sort of 'life were tough in my day!' kind of old wives' tale - no doubt with a kernal of truth i.e. more individuals would have had to get them all removed, or would have lost them all thanks to lack of dental care.

I've collected a fair few quotes in Scottish and other UK contexts, and especially in terms of immigration - Australia for example. But I haven't really been able to find counter-evidence, if you like.

[edit] in fact, there seems little doubt that a number of people would elect to have the lot out (p148/9);

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=vAo-AAAAIAAJ&lpg=PA149&pg=PA149#v=onepage&q=&f=false

I suspect that this reality has been exaggerated somewhat, especially with regard to it being a routine practice virtually for all, and given as a 21st birthday present etc.

[quarky]

When it comes to fellatio, no teeth is better than two.

[SusanB-M1]

My mother-in-law (1907-1982) had all her teeth out in her early 20s.

I just ask the dentist to please make my teeth last longer than I do. I'm lucky to have healthy gums though.

[Dorian Gray]

Yeh, that's putting the E in JREF. Somebody says that they don't understand why something isn't done, so you challenge him to do it himself. I mean, it's not like he asked other questions like, "are dentures actually a health risk too, or cause pain in some people?"
It DOES put the E in JREF. There's nothing like answering your own questions with your own reasons, right? When he realizes why he doesn't do it himself, he'll realize why other people don't do it.

[shemp]

I'd do it if I could get a set of these:

[Dragoonster]

It DOES put the E in JREF. There's nothing like answering your own questions with your own reasons, right? When he realizes why he doesn't do it himself, he'll realize why other people don't do it.

Forgive me for thinking JREF members would have informed and objective opinions on the issue, or that an interesting conversation might break out that could inform others who hadn't ever wondered about the subject. In the future whenever I'm curious about something I'll just google for hopefully objective answers elsewhere, instead of wasting this forum's time.

[bruto]

I think the question, and the motivation for asking it, interesting, even if the suggestion strikes me as odd at best, if not quite silly. I'm glad Dragoonster asked it, even if he's not very happy with the results. That such a question should be asked at all points, if nothing else, to a question of who gets, and who should get, what kind of care in our world.

As a middle class American whose family always put high value on good nutrition and good dental care, my perspective obviously differs from that of some. Preemptive tooth pulling seems a very unfortunate way to solve a problem that I suspect is usually more socio-economic than physical.

[patchbunny]

If it were cost affective it would be worth it, but since it likely isn't, there's not much of a point to it.

Some types of implant/dentures, I forget which and how exactly it works, but over time can cause the jawbone to shrink and become brittle, cracking it after a decade or two. If everyone had this in affect, around age 45 people would have to get their jawbone replaced, and I can't imagine that being pleasant. There are types to get around this though, but they likely have their own complications, infection, etc.

I know a lady who lost her teeth in her 20's. In her 50's, she tried getting implants to replace her dentures, but she's had nothing but bone problems with them and spends most of her time without anything due to constant infections and pain.

[Dragoonster]

I think the question, and the motivation for asking it, interesting, even if the suggestion strikes me as odd at best, if not quite silly. I'm glad Dragoonster asked it, even if he's not very happy with the results. That such a question should be asked at all points, if nothing else, to a question of who gets, and who should get, what kind of care in our world.

I'm very happy with the results and have learned a lot. I had no agenda here and was honestly curious. I've known people with dentures including my grandparents but they all seemed satisfied, so didn't realize there were some pretty serious negative effects for some. Nor the extent of the difference in functional quality.

As a middle class American whose family always put high value on good nutrition and good dental care, my perspective obviously differs from that of some. Preemptive tooth pulling seems a very unfortunate way to solve a problem that I suspect is usually more socio-economic than physical.

For me it's also a question of bad habits, I rarely used to brush my teeth though I do more now, and have always drank a ton of soda, so have been having to go to the dentist quite a bit. Doesn't take much money to afford a toothbrush and toothpaste, but it does take discipline to do it every day.

[rjh01]

I think this thread is another example showing that the body's design is in most part very good. There is nothing that is as good as our natural teeth. The same goes for many other organs.

[Rolfe]

Design?

:boxedin:

Rolfe.

[sowellfan]

Are glass crowns better? I've been perfectly happy with my porcelain ones.

My (NHS) dentist isn't massively ambitious, and never even suggests doing anything privately, and I don't push it on the principle of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it".

I think this is something a lot of Americans don't understand in relation to dental care in Britain. Most people have healthy teeth with the cavities filled and the worst misalignment fixed. But cosmetic dentistry just isn't something many peope go in for. The dazzling white Hollywood smile just isn't an ambition - especially if it would involve more time in a dentist's chair.

The actors are getting on the bandwagon of course, but relatively recently - if you look at Gareth Thomas's back teeth, which you can see in the opening credits for the first season of Blake's Seven, you can see a fair number of amalgam fillings.

Rolfe.
I think your impressions of Americans might be a bit off, as far as lots of people having a huge desire to get a Hollywood smile goes. We do obviously have teeth-whitening places, and cosmetic dentistry, but I figure they have that in the UK, also. The main issue for most folks is to have functional teeth without cavities. I'm just curious if the (perceived) difference in results (between the USA and the UK) is because of water flouridation, or if it's a difference in brushing habits.

[celia44]

Hi I am new here and by coincident found this stream.
Why do we not let all teeth e pulled and avoid dental suffering after having had problems with teeth or to have less dental cost over years.
Thats a good question, but we as species are very different in our mouths and some could wear dentres without any problems and other will have problems through their whole life due to the shape of palate and gums.
I myself did not have straight teeth and it was easy to get cavities. As long as I can remember I wished to have them pulled because of their shapes and that every now and then had to get fillings.
So when I was 20 I asked my dentist to have them all pulled and get dentures. We had a long talk where she told me all about tit and said that I had a very good mouth for dentures and my bone was very good. So the week after I had them all pulled and there was a discomfort periode I have to say.
When the gums had healed and I got the 2nd set of dentures after the immediates I never had any problems with dentures.
In my case I can see that dentures are a very good substitute for bad teeth and for myself I will never go back to my normal teeth. There are so many advantages with dentures as easy cleaning , can get exactly the shape of teeth we want, no pain at all and what was astonishing the very good feeling of bare gums when dentures were out.
The dentist told me that as I had that good bone the gums would not be any problems with them in many years to come and that is right. I have never used adhesives although the gums have shrinked since the extraction day. Now I have had dentures for 40 years and for me it was absolutely the right thing to do.
To get dentures that early many people say that dating would be difficult but for me it was not any problem as the right persons do not mind the partner to having dentures.

What would I tell younger people?
It is very important that the mouth is U shaped and that the bone in the gums are good. Then it should be alright and it should be up to the individual person. But remember that there is a big stigma against dentures. Strangely enough, but not for implants even though the person is equally toothless. Implants require a large extent of cleaning of the dentistwhich is not necessary with denturesother than brushing and soaking every day.
So I cannot be against having teeth pulled when young with my experience and I had 28 healthy teeth pulled

[UnrepentantSinner]

I know I'm responding to a year old post (thanks for the bump celia and welcome to the forum), but I wanted to ask:

But your concept is not new. The day my Dad reported in to the Army Air Corp, 1943, they pulled seven of his teeth. Age of 23.

was that the first time he'd been to a dentist? I'd heard anecdotes that for many WW II draftees (especially), their dental exam and resultant work was their first experience with dentistry.

[Dancing David]

Um, teeth have some benefit over dentures. But I haven't seen a good cost benefit ratio.

The main issue is that most people don't have dental insurance. I pay nothing for my preventative care, quite a bit for the treatments as needed.

[The Don]

In my case I can see that dentures are a very good substitute for bad teeth and for myself I will never go back to my normal teeth.

Well that's good on the grounds that going back to your normal teeth is not an option.

[whatthebutlersaw]

Anyone who has had the misfortune of having to replace real teeth could probably tell you a lot of immediate problems that this would cause.

Another problem is that teeth are actually a more integral part of your body and its general health than previously understood. A very simple - and simplified - example: the enamel in own teeth actually sends information that helps your brain determine the amount of force your jaw needs to apply to the thing you are eating. People with dentures don't get this "free" information but must reason their way to, or remember, appropriate force for different foodstuffs. This in turn can lead to tensions in jaw and neck, causing pains and headaches. Teeth health and heart health are correlated although the causality link between them has not been determined.

It's great that there are such good dentures and implants these days because a lot can happen to teeth that have nothing to do with not taking care of them, but given a choice take care of the ones you have. Some countries that provide free health care do not provide free dental care. Sweden, for example, doesn't while NHS (Britain) does, although lots of people give up waiting for an NHS dentist to get an opening in their area and go private. To my mind those who provide health care but not dental care are very short sighted as dental health really is an integral part of your overall health. Basic dental care ought to be provided as part of basic health care.

Current research is looking into a very exciting prospect: the possibility to manipulate our bodies into growing new, own, teeth. I don't know how far we are from achieving that but the last I heard this is researched in different ways - some researchers focused on the possibility of using stem cell research to this end while others are looking for the answer in the anatomy of the teeth themselves. I wouldn't hold my breath - although that someone finds it viable enough to put researach money into is exciting in itself. I think I read somewhere that we're close to "growing" teeth in labs. The next step either being to grow them in jaws or finding a plausible way of affixing lab grown teeth in your mouth. I don't know how close we are but it is kind of exciting to think about.

[quarky]

I've got some fake teeth. When i got them, i asked the dentist if she could make a few messed-up looking fake teeth. I didn't want them to look too perfect. I was surprised when she told me that it was a common request.

Now I wish I'd asked for "Dondi" teeth. That would be a cool look.

[whatthebutlersaw]

We now have filler materials that "bond" with the actual enamel and aren't expected to need replacing so it is at least theoretically plausible to come up with a way to get an entire, real, homegrown tooth affixed in a person's jaw in a way that makes it bond to the jaw. This in turn does not deteriorate the jaw in the same way metal screws do.

When it comes to the aesthetics of it, these days you very rarely can tell and cosmetically it really doesn't make a difference. I don't doubt that the person upthread who claimed the own ones were only causing pain is relating a true experience - unfortunately some people, through no fault of their own, don't develop what will later become the teeth, in utero, or the embryonic teeth are formed badly so that the teeth cause nothing but trouble when they errupt.

I don't mean to discourage anyone who has had to replace teeth - it's obviously not a disaster that will ruin your life. I just don't see any particular benefits to replacing healthy teeth.

(I have also heard the above re: pulling all teeth and replace with dentures at 21 or as a wedding gift in Scotland. In my case I read it in Pamela Stephenson's book "Bravemouth" - her biography on husband Billy Connolly, where she gives post war Glasgow a bit of colour by relating that same bit of trivia.)

[El Greco]

False teeth are really the thing of the future. At some point it will become high fashion. Carbon fiber teeth, high-tech teeth which will function as wifi spots, teeth in various numbers, colors and shapes (eg 126 diamond-shaped yellow teeth), modular teeth for changing your look on the fly, teeth with OLED screens that can play high definition movies, etc.

[richardm]

Well that's good on the grounds that going back to your normal teeth is not an option.

Nah, I've got a box of teeth. Half an hour's work with a hammer and we can probably get a reasonable approximation.

I've got some fake teeth. When i got them, i asked the dentist if she could make a few messed-up looking fake teeth. I didn't want them to look too perfect. I was surprised when she told me that it was a common request.

Many years ago I fancied becoming a dentist, and spent some time shadowing one. Part of this involved a trip to a dental lab, where they manufactured crowns and dentures. They said that a regular request was for them to be "as white as possible", and it always made them cringe.

Re: the removal of teeth as a birthday present; I've certainly heard this before, and it wasn't unique to Scotland either. The argument was that it was a good gift since it removed the burden on the husband of paying for future dental treatment. Rolfe's probably right that NHS dentistry knocked that on the head.

[Mark6]

If it were cost affective it would be worth it, but since it likely isn't, there's not much of a point to it.

Some types of implant/dentures, I forget which and how exactly it works, but over time can cause the jawbone to shrink and become brittle, cracking it after a decade or two. If everyone had this in affect, around age 45 people would have to get their jawbone replaced, and I can't imagine that being pleasant. There are types to get around this though, but they likely have their own complications, infection, etc.
That's what my dentist told me when several years ago I asked the very same question OP did -- basically, without teeth in it jawbone deteriorates. I also have some personal experience with this phenomenon: my lower left wisdom tooth was removed when I was young, and about 20 years later a sliver of bone poked out of the empty gum. I put it in alcohol and brought it to my dentist. He said this was a small piece of jawbone which separated due to having no tooth to support.

[Zelenius]

Current research is looking into a very exciting prospect: the possibility to manipulate our bodies into growing new, own, teeth. I don't know how far we are from achieving that but the last I heard this is researched in different ways - some researchers focused on the possibility of using stem cell research to this end while others are looking for the answer in the anatomy of the teeth themselves. I wouldn't hold my breath - although that someone finds it viable enough to put researach money into is exciting in itself. I think I read somewhere that we're close to "growing" teeth in labs. The next step either being to grow them in jaws or finding a plausible way of affixing lab grown teeth in your mouth. I don't know how close we are but it is kind of exciting to think about.

I am excited about this possibility too. I can't think of any reason why we can't regrow strong, healthy teeth to replace cavity-ridden ones. I can't think of any reason why it would be impossible. This doesn't mean it's going to be easy, but with advances in biotechnology and nanotechnology, we should be getting closer to this every year.

Don't forget that numerous species regrow teeth indefinitely whenever they lose them, like some species of sharks(to my knowledge anyway).

I am considering having all my teeth removed because of how problematic they are and using dentures. I am dealing with the slight pain of a cracked filling as I write this. This tooth(what little is left of it) will need a crown that I can't afford. My teeth are crooked, weak, chipped, worn-down, very prone to cavities, yellow, my gums are receding and bleeding, and I have periodontal disease even though I brush and floss twice a day. Other than my teeth I am in good health luckily. I'm not as "old" as my teeth. I think the severe sinus problems I used to have were largely due to my mouth problems.

[Belz...]

I've never understood why everyone doesn't simply have all their teeth removed at about age 25 and wear dentures the rest of their lives. I'd think this would be better due to the following:

* Much less risk of a serious medical problem from bad teeth

* MUCH less long-term cost to maintain dentures or get new ones every decade than to continually fill, fix, replace, cap, etc. teeth

* Less symptoms that are frequent but not fixable or return--i.e. intolerance to cold foods like ice cream, or heat, or pain, etc. Even if teeth are fixable, many people have to experience stuff like this for a good % of their lives until they are fixed

* Less risk of getting a tooth problem without access to a dentist/ER, such as on a long camping trip, in a third-world country, etc.

Are dentures actually a health risk too, or cause pain in some people? The only groups I can think of that dentures might negatively effect more than the pretty lousy track record of our teeth (particularly with modern sugar-filled foods and such) would be singers or actors who're afraid it'll affect their voices. But why not otherwise?

Short answer: I already have teeth.

Long answer: Why would I remove them instead of just maintaining them ? Do you get a new car at each maintenance date ? Plus, real teeth cut better.

[Reviresco]

Damn. I really love my teeth. The thought of having any pulled makes me cringe. Toothpaste, toothbrushes, and floss are cheap. Brushing and flossing is easy. We have fluoridated water here that tastes great. All in all, it's a little money, a bit of daily effort, and voila, healthy teeth.

I'm a singer, and I can't imagine trying to sing with dentures. I had a problem a few years ago when I made two front teeth crooked (doing leather crafting - don't use your teeth!) and until I fixed it, my singing was impaired, as if I had a lisp.

[bruto]

I'm sure genetics have something to do with it, but so does early nutrition and a habit of good dental care. But before we get too judgmental, we need to remember that all these things involve some degree of good fortune, which many people in the world do not share. I was brought up as a middle class American, by parents who were well informed about nutrition, diligent about dental care, and even when times were a little tight, able to afford it.

It's a good thing that denture technology has progressed so far that people who, for one reason or another, cannot keep their own teeth, have an alternative, but I would rather see a world in which everyone has the opportunity to get good care and good nutrition and good education, and, in consequence, keep their teeth. Real teeth are nice to have.

I recently had a tooth crack when a 50 year old filling finally went, and needed a root canal and a crown. I'm very lucky to be able to afford this, but the endodontist put it succinctly. She told her assistant "he wants to die with all 32." And so I do, though I'm in no hurry.

[Tomblvd]

Another problem is that teeth are actually a more integral part of your body and its general health than previously understood. A very simple - and simplified - example: the enamel in own teeth actually sends information that helps your brain determine the amount of force your jaw needs to apply to the thing you are eating. People with dentures don't get this "free" information but must reason their way to, or remember, appropriate force for different foodstuffs. This in turn can lead to tensions in jaw and neck, causing pains and headaches. Teeth health and heart health are correlated although the causality link between them has not been determined.


Your explanation isn't quite accurate. The enamel has no "live" tissue in it. However, the root of the tooth is attached to the bone by the periodontal ligament, essentially a hammock of thousands of tiny ligaments that attach from the root (actually the cementum) to the bone of the tooth socket. Within those ligaments are specialized nerves called proprioceptors that give you the ability to tell how hard you are chewing and the general position of the teeth.

But you are very correct in saying that the complete loss of these nerves makes chewing more difficult and is one of the many reasons to keep your natural teeth.

[Lowpro]

I wouldn't like the idea of removing teeth especially if you suffer from bone disease, which you will at a later age. Keep your teeth -.-

I mean let's face it, your whole body is going to suffer and throwing on artificial parts won't fix that, it'll just defer cost to a specialized dentist.

[JJM 777]

I've never understood why everyone doesn't simply have all their teeth removed at about age 25 and wear dentures the rest of their lives.
I have artificial front teeth, I replaced the original ones for esthetical reasons. They look and feel perfect, as the roots are original and healthy. For 1000 EUR apiece, you need to be either rich or totally uninterested in anything what the same money can buy, if you choose to replace all of your teeth just for the fun of it.

[Corsair 115]

I've never understood why everyone doesn't simply have all their teeth removed at about age 25 and wear dentures the rest of their lives.


Uh, I believe there are proven methods of preventative maintenance that can be done on real teeth which keep them in good health and free of most problems. This preventative maintenance is not all that costly nor is it difficult to perform.

[whatthebutlersaw]

Damn. I really love my teeth. The thought of having any pulled makes me cringe. Toothpaste, toothbrushes, and floss are cheap. Brushing and flossing is easy. We have fluoridated water here that tastes great. All in all, it's a little money, a bit of daily effort, and voila, healthy teeth.

I'm a singer, and I can't imagine trying to sing with dentures. I had a problem a few years ago when I made two front teeth crooked (doing leather crafting - don't use your teeth!) and until I fixed it, my singing was impaired, as if I had a lisp.

Uh, I believe there are proven methods of preventative maintenance that can be done on real teeth which keep them in good health and free of most problems. This preventative maintenance is not all that costly nor is it difficult to perform.

Yes. For those of us who are fortunate enough not to be born with poor teeth from the start. There are various conditions and variations that can cause teeth and gums to be problematic even with proper care.

While I completely agree with taking proper care of your teeth, I feel it is unfair to just assume that everyone whose teeth have had to come out simply didn't bother. Apart from the fact that accidents can happen the teeth are surprisingly complex thingamies with lots of stuff that can go wrong with them while they are forming in the embryo. There are people who are born without the makings of teeth at all (is it "agenesis" I'm looking for, does anyone know?), or with the makings of poor teeth. There are also people who get a third set of teeth.

I'm not comfortable assuming that anyone who has great trouble with their teeth have simply neglected them and I would feel flippant to suggest they floss if the problem is genetic.

Trivia: Ed Helms, who played Stu in The Hangover and infamously performs autodentistry by pulling a tooth on camera was born with agenesis of that tooth. It simply never formed and he usually wears a permanent bridge there. For The Hangover his dentist fitted a removable bridge to make it possible to film that scene. Since Helms was simultaneously working on the American version of The Office at the time, he was under contract not to make any cosmetic changes for the duration but no one seems to have noticed if one of his teeth was slightly altered. He told this to Marc Maron while being interviewed for the WTF? podcast.

[The Norseman]

My experience in this arena is limited, but similar to that mentioned above, playing musical wind instruments is far more difficult -- if not impossible -- to play correctly with dentures.

I was facing a similar problem just a few weeks ago, as a matter of fact, where a cavity in my front tooth threatened it and there was a slight possibility that the tooth would have to be removed. I promptly looked into a post and crown type fix rather than a bridge because of the pressure of the top teeth necessary for a clear, full tone with my clarinet.

In this case, the cavity was repaired and any tooth replacement was unnecessary.

[quarky]

I am excited about this possibility too. I can't think of any reason why we can't regrow strong, healthy teeth to replace cavity-ridden ones. I can't think of any reason why it would be impossible. This doesn't mean it's going to be easy, but with advances in biotechnology and nanotechnology, we should be getting closer to this every year.

Don't forget that numerous species regrow teeth indefinitely whenever they lose them, like some species of sharks(to my knowledge anyway).

I am considering having all my teeth removed because of how problematic they are and using dentures. I am dealing with the slight pain of a cracked filling as I write this. This tooth(what little is left of it) will need a crown that I can't afford. My teeth are crooked, weak, chipped, worn-down, very prone to cavities, yellow, my gums are receding and bleeding, and I have periodontal disease even though I brush and floss twice a day. Other than my teeth I am in good health luckily. I'm not as "old" as my teeth. I think the severe sinus problems I used to have were largely due to my mouth problems.

Wanna make-out?

[Corsair 115]

Yes. For those of us who are fortunate enough not to be born with poor teeth from the start. There are various conditions and variations that can cause teeth and gums to be problematic even with proper care.


Fair enough. But do recall the statement made in the OP (emphasis added):

I've never understood why everyone doesn't simply have all their teeth removed at about age 25 and wear dentures the rest of their lives.


The statement made no distinction between those born with 'good' teeth or 'bad' hence my comment.


I'm not comfortable assuming that anyone who has great trouble with their teeth have simply neglected them and I would feel flippant to suggest they floss if the problem is genetic.


I, for one, never stated that assumption (nor do I think I even implied it).

[godless dave]

I don't think my teeth require much more maintenance than dentures would. I've had a cavities in my 20s and 30s but that's it.

[Gazpacho]

My teeth have sentimental value. My mother gave them to me.

[Bill Thompson]

If the technology does not exist for a good replacement for teeth, I woould prefer time be spent on replacing something else. I want a replacement for my hair first. I can stand to brush my teeth everyday and keep them.

[TubbaBlubba]

I expect my teeth to, or at least will not be surprised if they start chipping off (and by that I mean virtually every tooth, all the time, until they are useless) around or before middle age for medical reasons*. Hopefully they'll have invented good implants then... My mother who has the same condition is currently toothless.

*Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome, defective collagen, which the dentin partially consists off. It's one of the least pleasant effects.

[quarky]

Why not abandon teeth altogether? Gumming is a viable replacement for chewing. You can eat your fill at the Country Buffet with no teeth. That's how tender the food is.

[celia44]

Hi tomblvd.
You are right in what you say but having been toothless now for a long time and having dentures I have no difficulty at all with chewing. My gums are good even after this long time. They have of course shrinked which makes it necessary to change the dentures each 5-7 years. It is very important to take care of the gums having good fit to the dentures and ensure that the bite is correct.
For me having dentures have been a very good experience and when touching the denture teeth I can in fact tell which one I have touched due to the vibration to the gum.
To have teeth I can take out and clean thoroughly and rest the gums is good and even the feeling of the round smooth gums is very good.
All in all to have my teeth pulled has been a success on in all aspects for me

[dafydd]

This used to be quite common in Scotland. Girls would have all their teeth out and get a set of dentures for their 21st birthday.

It's not really done now, can't imagine why.... :oldroll:

Rolfe.

That was my mother's 21st birthday present.

[dafydd]

Darling, your teeth are like stars........they come out at night.