Israel now has drones that can reach Iran. Uh-oh.

[Dorian Gray]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100221/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_israel_drones

-snip-
At the fleet's inauguration ceremony at a sprawling air base in central Israel, the drone dwarfed an F-15 fighter jet parked beside it. The unmanned plane resembles its predecessor, the Heron, but can fly higher, reaching an altitude of more than 40,000 feet (12,000 meters), and remain in the air longer.


"With the inauguration of the Heron TP, we are realizing the air force's dream," said Brig. Gen. Amikam Norkin, commander of the base that will operate the drones. "The Heron TP is a technological and operational breakthrough."


The commander of Israel's air force, Maj. Gen. Ido Nehushtan, said the aircraft "has the potential to be able to conduct new missions down the line as they become relevant."


-snip- This will bring some fun times in the next couple of years, huh.

[MaGZ]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100221/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_israel_drones

This will bring some fun times in the next couple of years, huh.


And Iran has missiles that can reach Israel's bio-weapons lab in Nes Ziona.

[WildCat]

And Iran has missiles that can reach Israel's bio-weapons lab in Nes Ziona.
Iran has no missile capable of hitting such a small target except through chance.

[geni]

Iran has no missile capable of hitting such a small target except through chance.

Through enough of them at it and that ceases to be a problem.

More relivant to the current case Iran does in fact have a worthwhile AA system.

[Beerina]

A free nation now has drones that can reach into a nasty, brutish, medieval dictatorship seeking to make nuclear weapons. Good.


Fixed.

[Thunder]

u can't launch a bunker-buster with a drone.

but u may be able to drop a nuclear warhead.

:(

[Skeptical Greg]

...are primarily used for surveillance and carrying payloads.

( scratches chin .. ) Hmmm, payloads - for Iran .. Propaganda leaflets ?

Israel has never confirmed that its unmanned aircraft are capable of firing missiles.

Clue: The ability to carry missiles is sufficient for a drone ..

[MaGZ]

u can't launch a bunker-buster with a drone.

but u may be able to drop a nuclear warhead.

:(

If Israel wanted to nuke Iran they have a few subs they could use.

[Dorian Gray]

A free nation now has drones that can reach into a nasty, brutish, medieval dictatorship seeking to make nuclear weapons. Good.


Fixed.
Don't you mean Foxed?

[theprestige]

Iran has no missile capable of hitting such a small target except through chance.
No missiles capable of reaching an altitude of 40,000 feet? Or no targeting systems capable of detecting and tracking a plane larger than an F-15, with the wingspan of a 737?

Either way, how long is that situation expected to last? It's not like Iran doesn't continuously upgrade their military systems. Maybe Iran doesn't have the capability... yet. I bet the Soviet Union didn't really have anything that could reliably shoot down a U-2 when those were first deployed. But by the late 80s, even Libya had missiles that could threaten an SR-71. So I'm skeptical that Iran's air defenses are so primitive, or that Israel's new drone is so magical, that Iran couldn't hope to hit it "except through chance".

[geni]

A free nation now has drones that can reach into a nasty, brutish, medieval dictatorship seeking to make nuclear weapons. Good.


Fixed.

Nothing to do with Iran. You don't use spy drones against people with non-trivial AA defences. Most likely isreal wants the long loiter time to keep an eye on the gaza strip and west bank.

[Ziggurat]

No missiles capable of reaching an altitude of 40,000 feet? Or no targeting systems capable of detecting and tracking a plane larger than an F-15, with the wingspan of a 737?

Read more carefully. Wildcat's statement was in response to parky's statement that Iranian missiles have sufficient range reach a specific Israeli installation. It had nothing to do with anti-aircraft missiles, it was about ballistic missiles.

[Giggywig]

Read more carefully. Wildcat's statement was in response to parky's statement that Iranian missiles have sufficient range reach a specific Israeli installation. It had nothing to do with anti-aircraft missiles, it was about ballistic missiles.

MaGZ, not parky.

[fuelair]

And Iran has missiles that can reach Israel's bio-weapons lab in Nes Ziona.

And the drones, although unstated, likely have weapons capability so Iran can prepare to take it up their fundamentalism.:D:D:D:D

And, frankly I hope the Israelis actually do have such a lab - the US did - and likely still does (Ft. Detrick was when I was in the Army.)

[Ziggurat]

MaGZ, not parky.

Sorry, my bad. The point I wanted to make was that Wildcat's comment was about Iran's ballistic missiles not being able to hit small land targets, not about their anti-aircraft capabilities.

[MikeMangum]

u can't launch a bunker-buster with a drone.

but u may be able to drop a nuclear warhead.

:(

3 letters: SDB (http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/munitions/sdb.htm)

A small diameter bomb can be used in adverse weather and has a standoff range of more than 60 nautical miles. Once released, the weapon uses its inertial navigation and an anti-jam Global Positioning System to fly to the target. Its guidance is further augmented by a differential GPS system, which provides corrections to enhance accuracy.

Small_Diameter_Bomb
The SDB carries approximately 38 lb (17 kg) of AFX-757 high explosive, yet because of its design it has the same penetration capabilities as the 2000 lb BLU-109.

What was that about "can't launch a bunker buster with a drone"?

Israel has purchased 1,000 SDBs. The SDBs themselves are easily small enough to fit on the Heron.

[MikeMangum]

No missiles capable of reaching an altitude of 40,000 feet? Or no targeting systems capable of detecting and tracking a plane larger than an F-15, with the wingspan of a 737?

Either way, how long is that situation expected to last? It's not like Iran doesn't continuously upgrade their military systems. Maybe Iran doesn't have the capability... yet. I bet the Soviet Union didn't really have anything that could reliably shoot down a U-2 when those were first deployed. But by the late 80s, even Libya had missiles that could threaten an SR-71. So I'm skeptical that Iran's air defenses are so primitive, or that Israel's new drone is so magical, that Iran couldn't hope to hit it "except through chance".

While you were mistaken in your response (mistaking the subject of the sentence) you are right that Iran isn't sitting still when it comes to air defense. Russia has just announced that it will begin sending the S-300 to Iran (http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3851715,00.html).

Unless Israel has some method of dealing with those, the Heron wouldn't last long in Iranian air space.

[Piscivore]

3 letters: SDB (http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/munitions/sdb.htm)

For a minute I thought you were talking about getting an infiltrator in who would start serruptitiously farting.

[WildCat]

No missiles capable of reaching an altitude of 40,000 feet? Or no targeting systems capable of detecting and tracking a plane larger than an F-15, with the wingspan of a 737?

Either way, how long is that situation expected to last? It's not like Iran doesn't continuously upgrade their military systems. Maybe Iran doesn't have the capability... yet. I bet the Soviet Union didn't really have anything that could reliably shoot down a U-2 when those were first deployed. But by the late 80s, even Libya had missiles that could threaten an SR-71. So I'm skeptical that Iran's air defenses are so primitive, or that Israel's new drone is so magical, that Iran couldn't hope to hit it "except through chance".
Try reading my post one more time, with an emphasis on the text I was responding to.

Hint: I never even touched on Iran's ability to shoot down a drone.

[MaGZ]

No missiles capable of reaching an altitude of 40,000 feet? Or no targeting systems capable of detecting and tracking a plane larger than an F-15, with the wingspan of a 737?

Either way, how long is that situation expected to last? It's not like Iran doesn't continuously upgrade their military systems. Maybe Iran doesn't have the capability... yet. I bet the Soviet Union didn't really have anything that could reliably shoot down a U-2 when those were first deployed. But by the late 80s, even Libya had missiles that could threaten an SR-71. So I'm skeptical that Iran's air defenses are so primitive, or that Israel's new drone is so magical, that Iran couldn't hope to hit it "except through chance".

If Iran threw enough missiles at Nes Ziona some would break the containment and the effect would be a biological attack upon Israel.

[MaGZ]

And the drones, although unstated, likely have weapons capability so Iran can prepare to take it up their fundamentalism.:D:D:D:D

And, frankly I hope the Israelis actually do have such a lab - the US did - and likely still does (Ft. Detrick was when I was in the Army.)

The difference is Ft. Detrick no longer produces offensive bio-weapons.

[Ziggurat]

The difference is Ft. Detrick no longer produces offensive bio-weapons.

And your evidence that Israel does? Oh, that's right, you have none. This delusion of yours is no different than your other truther nonsense. And why would they produce offensive bioweapons? Such weapons are far less effective than nuclear weapons in pretty much any scenario one could imagine Israel ever confronting, absent invasion from Mars by aliens without antibiotics.

[Beerina]

If Iran threw enough missiles at Nes Ziona some would break the containment and the effect would be a biological attack upon Israel.

...shortly followed by???

[entrope]

Awesome. Now the MOSAD can kill people from the comfort of home. And no more pesky international incidents about using fake passports.

[theprestige]

Try reading my post one more time, with an emphasis on the text I was responding to.

Hint: I never even touched on Iran's ability to shoot down a drone.
Thanks! Several people have pointed out my obvious mistake. I was totally wrong. My apologies.

[INRM]

I don't even know why they need the drones, they have some of the best pilots in the world, and top notch aircraft, missiles, and bombs.

I think they should just fly in and bomb the living crap out of Iran

[geni]

I don't even know why they need the drones, they have some of the best pilots in the world, and top notch aircraft, missiles, and bombs.

Because while you can dose them on amphetamines pilot's performance tends to drop off over time.

[MikeMangum]

Because while you can dose them on amphetamines pilot's performance tends to drop off over time.

And aerial refueling is hard to manage in hostile air space.

[MaGZ]

And your evidence that Israel does? Oh, that's right, you have none. This delusion of yours is no different than your other truther nonsense. And why would they produce offensive bioweapons? Such weapons are far less effective than nuclear weapons in pretty much any scenario one could imagine Israel ever confronting, absent invasion from Mars by aliens without antibiotics.

Here
http://www.thegreenpapers.com/G10/events.phtml?format=chronological

[Ziggurat]

Here
http://www.thegreenpapers.com/G10/events.phtml?format=chronological

Your response has no connection to my post. Try again.

[gumboot]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100221/ap_on_re_mi_ea/ml_israel_drones

This will bring some fun times in the next couple of years, huh.


Your OP is incomplete. You forgot to clarify whether you believe this latest development is proof that the evil Zionists want to conquer the world, or whether the evil Islamists will use it as an excuse to launch their long-anticipated world-conquering Jihad.

[INRM]

Genie,

Why would they need to be on amphetamines? They'd be flying a couple of hours there, and a few hours back. A few hours there wouldn't do anything significant, as for fatigue on the way back, there are pilots who routinely fly for 8 hrs without stopping. They're called transport pilots. It's well within human capability

[geni]

Genie,

Why would they need to be on amphetamines? They'd be flying a couple of hours there, and a few hours back. A few hours there wouldn't do anything significant, as for fatigue on the way back, there are pilots who routinely fly for 8 hrs without stopping. They're called transport pilots. It's well within human capability

I was talking about loiter time over the likes of gaza. You want to stay there as long as posible so either you dig out the amphetamines (This is your war. This is your war on drugs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Stalingrad)) or you switch to drones.

[INRM]

Geni,

Is a human in the loop when these drones are used?

[geni]

Geni,

Is a human in the loop when these drones are used?

Dends what you are doing with them. And of course there is no requirement that it be the same human interacting with them.

[Dorian Gray]

Your OP is incomplete. You forgot to clarify whether you believe this latest development is proof that the evil Zionists want to conquer the world, or whether the evil Islamists will use it as an excuse to launch their long-anticipated world-conquering Jihad.
I report. You decide.