Maddow hounds FAIR president

[thaiboxerken]

http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.msnbc.msn.com%2Fid%2F3686 2136%2Fdisplaymode%2F1283%2Fref%2F32545640%2Ffor%2 Ffacebookvideo&h=49a7a

I think Maddow has her facts straight, but does go a bit overboard after a bit. However, I believe she does so in reaction to the guy's dishonesty about the facts.

[pipelineaudio]

In the first minute or so she dishonestly called both the new law and prop 200 "anti-immigration"

[thaiboxerken]

Right. Do you think that was intentional? What about the president of FAIR? Do you think he's being honest?

[dudalb]

Just more proff that MsNBC is a Bizarro version of Fox News.

[fullflavormenthol]

Just more proff that MsNBC is a Bizarro version of Fox News.
Totally. My issue with the interview is that Maddow honestly started engaging in some of the same guilt by association tactics that O'Reilly does. Not saying that FAIR is in the clear in my mind either, before that get brought up, but at the same time you can expect people to go through the personal papers of a board member when it deals with personal beliefs. Could it have colored his reasoning on the support of anti-immigration legislation? Of course. Should it be used to convict an entire organization that focused on illegal immigration? Not really.

And again, I am not on FAIR's side here; but I think Maddow went full fledged O'Reilly on him, and it basically made me lose some respect.

[headscratcher4]

Just more proff that MsNBC is a Bizarro version of Fox News.

THat would mean that Fox is "normal" and MSNBC is the opposit of normal? Or do you mean that their both often un-hinged and mirror each other in their techniques?

[thaiboxerken]

I don't agree with that assessment at all. The main person in question is a board member AND founder of the organization. From his own words, I think it's reasonable to say that he simply does not like hispanic people. The FAIR president's rebut to that was that it's a lie propogated by some other organization, when those words actually came from public papers acquired from a university.

I do think, however, that after the two cases of bigots in their organization have been brought up, she could've asked some better questions. She could've asked how many latinos they have in their board, for example. She could've asked if they were responsible for the language that allows for law suits against law enforcement in the bill.

If MSNBC is a Bizarro version of Fox News, does that mean MSNBC is a real news organization?

[pipelineaudio]

Right. Do you think that was intentional? What about the president of FAIR? Do you think he's being honest?

I do think that was intentional. in the media it is extremely common to refer to condemning criminal behaviour as "anti-immigrant"

People would be up in arms if we called anti-rape laws "anti-sex"

I couldnt get far enough past her dishonesty to make it to the FAIR part

[thaiboxerken]

I do think that was intentional. in the media it is extremely common to refer to condemning criminal behaviour as "anti-immigrant"

People would be up in arms if we called anti-rape laws "anti-sex"

I couldnt get far enough past her dishonesty to make it to the FAIR part

Oh, I bet you could if it was on Fox News.

[pipelineaudio]

Oh, I bet you could if it was on Fox News.

While I dont share the same brainwashed idea that fox is anymore biased or counterfactual than the BBC, its not my news of choice. I tend to watch the ticker on the google news component of my phone, and if I'm interested in a topic I go to a real PC and look it up on the net

[dudalb]

THat would mean that Fox is "normal" and MSNBC is the opposit of normal? Or do you mean that their both often un-hinged and mirror each other in their techniques?

The latter.MSNBC and FOX are mirror images of each other.
You do know by use of the term Bizarro was a reference to the charecter and World in Superman comics?

[thaiboxerken]

Right. In the comics, Superman was good..Bizarro (superman's alt) was evil. Which one is Fox News?

[headscratcher4]

The latter.MSNBC and FOX are mirror images of each other.
You do know by use of the term Bizarro was a reference to the charecter and World in Superman comics?

Exactly, and Bizaro superman was the opposite of Superman as Bizaro world was the opposite of the normal world, if memory serves (not so much evil as bassackward) ...so, I was simply wondering if by a Bizaro version of Fox, you were suggesting that fox is Superman/Normal Earth and MSNBC was where everything was backward and wrong.

You see, I suspect that Fox views MSNBC as a Bizaro universe, and visaversa.

I know, I'm over thinking it. ;)

[fullflavormenthol]

I don't really think Bizarro was necessarily evil, just very contrary to Superman. In fact really Bizarro just wasn't very smart and could easily be manipulated.

That aside, I think much of the underlining idea of the comment was that MSNBC and Fox News are just flip sides of the same coin. Meaning one is left wing, and one is right wing; but both engage in many of the same tactics.

[Darth Rotor]

Why didn't she just dress seductively, shake her stuff, and let the earthquakes take care of the rest?





















For those uncertain, this is a semi-humorous reference to another thread/story wherein an Islamic (yes, Iranian) cleric claiming that scantily dressed women, distributing swords in strange aquatic ceremonies cause earthquakes ... or something like that.

[thaiboxerken]

Why didn't she just dress seductively, shake her stuff, and let the earthquakes take care of the rest?


I wish!

[thaiboxerken]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908/#36881928

Maddow clarifies many of the facts she brought up and why she brought them up.

[cornsail]

She's right when she says "This isn't guilt by association. It's just guilt." It's the President, the founder and member of the board of directors, and two other high level employees. The associations are just gravy.

[jakesteele]

Ethnocentrism is the tendency to believe that one's ethnic or cultural group is centrally important, and that all other groups are measured in relation to one's own. The ethnocentric individual will judge other groups relative to his or her own particular ethnic group or culture, especially with concern to language, behavior, customs, and religion. These ethnic distinctions and sub-divisions serve to define each ethnicity's unique cultural identity.


Oh, gee, let’s see; America, the greatest country in the world

Little italy

China town

Little Havana

So that means Americans, Italians, Chinese, Cubans,
are all repugnant racists.

I’ll tell you what’s repugnantly racist – PC liberals who practice hypocritical racism by making it seem that all racism is done by whitey. To a PCer a movie like White Men Can’t Jump is fine and they will laugh at the stereotype and accept is as being in general a true observation. However, if you have a movie entitled Black Men Can’t Swim, then all hell breaks loose. The makers are renounced as racist. That’s ******** and liberals know that deep down in their heart of hearts but they are terrified of being called a racist. Liberals are terrified of the ISM cards (sexism, homophobiaism, racism) and as a result distort reality by pretending the Emperor is wearing kick ass clothes.

MadSow is berating certain white groups as being repugnant racists but she will defend Obama’s associations with terrorists and racists (Ayres and Wright). Geez, objective? She’s not even in the same hemisphere as objective. She’s a hypocritical racist.

[Kthulhut Fhtagn]

I’ll tell you what’s repugnantly racist – PC liberals who practice hypocritical racism by making it seem that all racism is done by whitey. To a PCer a movie like White Men Can’t Jump is fine and they will laugh at the stereotype and accept is as being in general a true observation. However, if you have a movie entitled Black Men Can’t Swim, then all hell breaks loose. The makers are renounced as racist. That’s ******** and liberals know that deep down in their heart of hearts but they are terrified of being called a racist. Liberals are terrified of the ISM cards (sexism, homophobiaism, racism) and as a result distort reality by pretending the Emperor is wearing kick ass clothes.

Nonsequitor. You are aware that the movie "White Men Can't Jump" is about two guys hustling bastketball by relying on the unfortunate nature of people to give more credence to stereotypes then they should by playing up the very apparent whiteness of Billy Hoyle (Woody Harrelson), right? It wasn't a movie about what blacks can do and whites can't, the whole angle of the hustle was that the streetballers always made the assumption on their own and that Billy didn't ever downplay his college-level skill.

If, similiarly, a movie was made called "Black Men Can't Swim" and it was about two guys, one of which is an olympic-level swimmer and happens to be black, hustling streetswimmers at the public swimming pool that would be a beast of an entirely differant nature. You're assuming that liberals in general are far more knee-jerky than you're giving them credit for. I know, I happen to be one.

[elbe]

That aside, I think much of the underlining idea of the comment was that MSNBC and Fox News are just flip sides of the same coin. Meaning one is left wing, and one is right wing; but both engage in many of the same tactics.

I don't think MSNBC's talking heads started out like that, I think they used to be more sensible, but partisan bull sells and they have a market niche to fill.

Still, I still quite like Maddow. When she talked about Pi day (last year, I think), I got the impression she actually knew what that was. But just liking her is not the same as believing everything she says.

[Unabogie]

Nonsequitor. You are aware that the movie "White Men Can't Jump" is about two guys hustling bastketball by relying on the unfortunate nature of people to give more credence to stereotypes then they should by playing up the very apparent whiteness of Billy Hoyle (Woody Harrelson), right? It wasn't a movie about what blacks can do and whites can't, the whole angle of the hustle was that the streetballers always made the assumption on their own and that Billy didn't ever downplay his college-level skill.

If, similiarly, a movie was made called "Black Men Can't Swim" and it was about two guys, one of which is an olympic-level swimmer and happens to be black, hustling streetswimmers at the public swimming pool that would be a beast of an entirely differant nature. You're assuming that liberals in general are far more knee-jerky than you're giving them credit for. I know, I happen to be one.

I get the sense this poster never saw the movie and is only relying on Teabonic mythology for his analysis of the story. After all, and sorry if this blows the ending, Billy does dunk to win the game at the end. Hence, your take on the hustle angle is exactly spot on, and his is borne out of pure ignorance and ideological rigidness.

[johnny karate]

MadSow

Not to presume to tell you how to craft your clever insults, but don't you think MadCow works better?

That way, you still get your hateful misogynistic slur, and the implication that she has a degenerative neurological disease!

[DavidJames]

Is it my imagination but are the number of rational conservatives on this board dwindling to almost none.

[Cicero]

Is it my imagination but are the number of rational conservatives on this board dwindling to almost none.

You rely on your imagination for guidance in all JREF political posts. Why would this instance be different?

[cornsail]

Not to presume to tell you how to craft your clever insults, but don't you think MadCow works better?

That way, you still get your hateful misogynistic slur, and the implication that she has a degenerative neurological disease!

Sounds too much like ManCow, otherwise I'd agree.

[cornsail]

jakesteel, FAIR called the remarks of PAN's leader repugnant and announced they were cutting all ties to the group. Yet their own founder, in addition to other members, has made similar remarks. Who's being hypocritical?

[Cicero]

While I dont share the same brainwashed idea that fox is anymore biased or counterfactual than the BBC, its not my news of choice. I tend to watch the ticker on the google news component of my phone, and if I'm interested in a topic I go to a real PC and look it up on the net

According to funk de fino, the BBC's staunchest defender, the BBC is, and has always been, the paradigm of unbiased reporting.

Get a grip. Fox and MSNBC are a joke. The BBC would be thrown off the airwaves here for being that bias.


Since the BBC is State television operated not directly by the government, but by some nebulous clique, who exactly would be throwing them off the air?

[pipelineaudio]

Im pretty sure the BBC's definition of "youth" being "muslim of any age" is further afield than anything fox NEWS has ever reported. And I mean their news side not their talking heads

I'd be happy to be proven wrong though

[fullflavormenthol]

I don't think MSNBC's talking heads started out like that, I think they used to be more sensible, but partisan bull sells and they have a market niche to fill.

I agree. In fact I have seen a steady transformation over the years towards what they are today.

Still, I still quite like Maddow. When she talked about Pi day (last year, I think), I got the impression she actually knew what that was. But just liking her is not the same as believing everything she says.

Don't get me wrong. I may point out an interview and write that I do not agree with the tactics involved or the form of argumentation, but I do like Countdown and the Rachel Maddow Show.

[thaiboxerken]

Is it my imagination but are the number of rational conservatives on this board dwindling to almost none.

You are asking a question about an oxymoron there.

[thaiboxerken]

Im pretty sure the BBC's definition of "youth" being "muslim of any age" is further afield than anything fox NEWS has ever reported. And I mean their news side not their talking heads

I'd be happy to be proven wrong though

How about you just prove yourself to be correct?

[Cicero]

You are asking a question about an oxymoron there.

You must mean the oxymoron that was posted back on April 13, 2010.

Summary of Thread so far:

Cicero claims that Maxine Waters is hypocritical, corrupt, left-wing nut.

Rational liberals fail to disagree

Isn't that an oxymoron?

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=5826394#post5826394

[NoScotsman]

Maddow sees a racist behind every corner. Glenn Beck sees a communist behind every corner.

Personally, I don't obsess about other people's secret motives. But then, I'm not a paranoiac. I'm a rationalist. I try to limit my intake of information to sources who are at least attempting to be honest.

[Cicero]

Maddow sees a racist behind every corner. Glenn Beck sees a communist behind every corner.

That may very well be their schtick. They, and others in the media, follow the dictum of docu-ganda.

Personally, I don't obsess about other people's secret motives. But then, I'm not a paranoiac. I'm a rationalist. I try to limit my intake of information to sources who are at least attempting to be honest.

Whom might these sources be?

[NoScotsman]

Whom might these sources be?


Myself, I prefer to read source material. Instead of being told what something says/means ... I just cut out the middleman. For example, the recent law in Arizona reads NOTHING like FOX/MSNBC says it does...

Maybe this strategy is tough-sledding for some. I understand not everyone is a legal scholar. And I consume biased sources as well ... for entertainment.

Speaking more generally, politics itself is merely a discussion of personal value assessments--politicians/pundits have an interest in rhetoric. Consequently, I treat political claims the same way as I treat claims of the paranormal; that is to say, skeptically.