Sheriff Strongarms Store to Have Rap CD Removed

[Tmy]

'Anti-Police' Rap CD Targeted in Ariz (http://apnews1.iwon.com//article/20040130/D80D5E780.html?PG=home&SEC=news)

PHOENIX (AP) - Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio has asked a record store chain to remove from its shelves a locally produced rap CD that contains "anti-police" lyrics and a raunchy drawing of the sheriff.

"You can't get much lower than he has with this record about police," Arpaio said, referring to the former inmate who created the CD.

________________________________
I guess the Sheriff didnt take kindly to the drawing of him. HAW!


Geez dont they ever learn. This is exactly what the guy wanted to happen! Nothing sells like contraversy.

The article isn't very good. It doesnt mention the offending lyrics and we dont hear from the rap guy. Thats the type of fair n balanced reporting I expect from FOxNews!

[BillyTK]

Nothing sells like controversy, except when Tower Records pull your cd, then nothing sells, full stop!

This is all so last century though. Anyone remember the fuss that Chuck "From my cold dead hands!" Heston kicked up over Ice T & Bodycount?

[Evolver]

Originally posted by BillyTK
Nothing sells like controversy, except when Tower Records pull your cd, then nothing sells, full stop!

This is all so last century though. Anyone remember the fuss that Chuck "From my cold dead hands!" Heston kicked up over Ice T & Bodycount?

[BAD TASTE]
Does Chuck "From my cold dead hands!" Heston remeber?
[/BAD TASTE]

[Hexxenhammer]

Originally posted by BillyTK
Nothing sells like controversy, except when Tower Records pull your cd, then nothing sells, full stop!

This is all so last century though. Anyone remember the fuss that Chuck "From my cold dead hands!" Heston kicked up over Ice T & Bodycount? That first Bodycount cd is a classic. Who can forget such hits as "KKK B!tch"?

[wollery]

Ah yes, America, land of free speech!

[Monketey Ghost]

It's cool if the Sheriff is a Republican.

[crackmonkey]

"America, land of free speech"?
I suppose so in comparison to, say, England or Germany where you can be arrested for controversial speech as opposed to merely having cds banned locally. In France, the most preposterous and offensive drivel is published about how the US government was behind 9/11, but any publicly worn religious symbols are regarded as divisive and provocative.
I'd say that in comparison US is doing pretty well at fighting the PC nazis.

[Tmy]

This goes back to the now classic NWA CD "Straight Outta Compton". Gangsta rap personified. The notable "F--- Da Police" song grabbed similar attention. Unlike most current rap songs that one really was politcial speech. It was about police brutality in LA. '

That album sold millions even though it got almost no airplay. Thanx to the politicians who made a big deal about it.

[pgwenthold]

Originally posted by crackmonkey
"America, land of free speech"?
I suppose so in comparison to, say, England or Germany where you can be arrested for controversial speech as opposed to merely having cds banned locally. In France, the most preposterous and offensive drivel is published about how the US government was behind 9/11, but any publicly worn religious symbols are regarded as divisive and provocative.
I'd say that in comparison US is doing pretty well at fighting the PC nazis.

Ah, I see. "America, land of freer speech than England, Germany, and France."

[LFTKBS]

What a bunch of cowards. I live in the Phoenix metro area, and I have got to say, we have the worst sheriff in the history of Sheriffdom. His brutality is matched only by his corruption.

Here's one. (http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/issues/2003-12-25/nelson.html/1/index.html)

Here's Joe's treatment of the free press. (http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/issues/2003-05-22/spiked.html/1/index.html)

Another one about McGee. (http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/issues/2003-03-06/nelson.html/1/index.html)

That took me about ten seconds. Imagine what hasn't been publicized.

[Tony]

Originally posted by Tmy
This goes back to the now classic NWA CD "Straight Outta Compton". Gangsta rap personified. The notable "F--- Da Police" song grabbed similar attention. Unlike most current rap songs that one really was politcial speech. It was about police brutality in LA. '


Dont forget that other classic "9-11 is a Joke" (or is that Public Enemy).


Anyway, Phuck Da Police!!!

[Tmy]

What bothers me is that this politician (Mr. Sheriff) is using his office to squash negative speech that is aimed directly at him.

Im sure his letter to Tower didnt comment about Ice T or NWA or other "anti police" records. He just cares about himself.

[Hexxenhammer]

Originally posted by Tony


Dont forget that other classic "9-11 is a Joke" (or is that Public Enemy). That's Public Enemy. Chuck D is way cool.

[wollery]

Originally posted by crackmonkey
"America, land of free speech"?
I suppose so in comparison to, say, England or Germany where you can be arrested for controversial speech as opposed to merely having cds banned locally. In France, the most preposterous and offensive drivel is published about how the US government was behind 9/11, but any publicly worn religious symbols are regarded as divisive and provocative.
I'd say that in comparison US is doing pretty well at fighting the PC nazis.
Congratulations, I see that the sense of humour bypass surgery went well. :)

[Skeptic]

Originally posted by wollery
Ah yes, America, land of free speech!

There is no constitutional right to have your CDs sold by record stores.

[pgwenthold]

Originally posted by Skeptic


There is no constitutional right to have your CDs sold by record stores.

The government does not have the right to prevent the activity because they don't like what is being said.

The constitution says what the government, not the citizens, can and cannot do.

[Tmy]

Imagine GW bUsh sending a Letter to Barnes n Noble asking them not to sell that book written by whats his name. YA know the one that trashes GW.

Its inappropriate, especially of this guy is using his title/letterhead as sheriff.

[Chaos]

Originally posted by crackmonkey
"America, land of free speech"?
I suppose so in comparison to, say, England or Germany where you can be arrested for controversial speech as opposed to merely having cds banned locally. In France, the most preposterous and offensive drivel is published about how the US government was behind 9/11, but any publicly worn religious symbols are regarded as divisive and provocative.
I'd say that in comparison US is doing pretty well at fighting the PC nazis.

My dear crackmonkey,

please get informed before you talk about "limits to free speech in Germany".
The only kind of "free speech" that can get you arrested in Germany is the kind that advocates to resume the gassing of jews.

[LFTKBS]

Originally posted by Skeptic
There is no constitutional right to have your CDs sold by record stores.

If Tower doesn't want to sell the CD, that's their business. If they are pressured into removing a Constitutionally protected work of speech by an ELECTED OFFICIAL, that is clearly an overreach of Sheriff Arpaio's authority.

Simple question: Would you be so comfortable if Mr. Arpaio removed all the books from Prometheus Press from Borders on the grounds that it undermines community morality?

[Grammatron]

Originally posted by LFTKBS


If Tower doesn't want to sell the CD, that's their business. If they are pressured into removing a Constitutionally protected work of speech by an ELECTED OFFICIAL, that is clearly an overreach of Sheriff Arpaio's authority.

Simple question: Would you be so comfortable if Mr. Arpaio removed all the books from Prometheus Press from Borders on the grounds that it undermines community morality?

Well according to the article all he did is asked for it to be removed. So no free speech was violated here since it was the store that actually removed it.

[Skeptic]

The government does not have the right to prevent the activity because they don't like what is being said.

Correct. But as I understand it, the sherrif asked the store to remove it since it insults police officers, not ordered them to do so by law. The store need not obey him. The manager cannot be arrested or brought to trial if he continues to sell those CDs.

It seems to me that in this case the sherrif is more equivalent to (say) a rabbi asking the store to remove CDs that insult jews, not to a political commissar.

Then again, perhaps I'm wrong on the facts.

[Skeptic]

Simple question: Would you be so comfortable if Mr. Arpaio removed all the books from Prometheus Press from Borders on the grounds that it undermines community morality?

He certainly has the right to ASK Borders to do so. He even has the right to organize protestors to picked Borders with sign saying "don't sell Promethues books, the tool of Satan". And skeptics have the right to fight back by counter-picketing, calling 20/20 to expose the sherrif as an idiot or a corrupt man, and so on.

What he doesn't have is the right to pass a law making it illegal to sell those books; but I don't think that's whats going on here.

[pgwenthold]

Originally posted by Skeptic
The government does not have the right to prevent the activity because they don't like what is being said.

Correct. But as I understand it, the sherrif asked the store to remove it since it insults police officers, not ordered them to do so by law. The store need not obey him. The manager cannot be arrested or brought to trial if he continues to sell those CDs.

It seems to me that in this case the sherrif is more equivalent to (say) a rabbi asking the store to remove CDs that insult jews, not to a political commissar.

Then again, perhaps I'm wrong on the facts.

It depends on how you interpret what is meant be "asked." If it was just a request, then I agree, it's no big deal. However, if he asked as a police matter, it is certainly over the line.

The question is, what would happen if they refused. Would they be arrested or anything? I interpreted that as what it was. That he was confiscating the material, as opposed just requesting it.

OTOH, as I think about it, I have a question: who put out the press release?

Remember, most news stories aren't the result of a crack reporter getting the scoop. They come because someone put out a press release. So put this story out, and why?

[Suddenly]

Originally posted by Hexxenhammer
That's Public Enemy. Chuck D is way cool.

911 Is a Joke" is Flavor Flav, not Chuck D, you culturally ignorant Phillistine!!!

(just kidding)

For some reason I posted the full lyrics in this thread:


http://www.randi.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=27337&highlight=public+enemy

It seemed the thing to do at the time...

[LFTKBS]

Originally posted by pgwenthold
It depends on how you interpret what is meant be "asked." If it was just a request, then I agree, it's no big deal. However, if he asked as a police matter, it is certainly over the line.

Anyone who has lived in Arizona for longer than a couple months knows that Sheriff Joe never makes requests as a private citizen; he continually abuses his power and threatens people with the wrath of his office and that of the state.

I guarantee you this: if Tower had told Sheriff Arpaio to engage in intercourse with his own personal self, and that they were going to sell the record anyway, those employees would find themselves arrested for something or other by the end of the week. His own employees will not speak out against him in public, in fear for both their livelihoods and lives.

[LFTKBS]

Originally posted by Skeptic
What he doesn't have is the right to pass a law making it illegal to sell those books; but I don't think that's whats going on here.

Arpaio doesn't muck around with the state legislature. He just does whatever he feels like doing.

[billydkid]

Originally posted by Skeptic


There is no constitutional right to have your CDs sold by record stores.

It is so amazing to me how many people have this exactly ass backward. The Constitution DOES NOT delineate OUR rights. While the Bill of Rights does expressly describe certain rights which may not be infringed by the government. It certainly does not pretend to be a comprehensive list of what we are allowed to do. In it we are not granted the rights to wash our feet or hold lawn sales or sleep in hammocks etc. ad infinitum. The Constitution was contrived to limit the powers of government and not to define the rights of citizens. It is presumed (one would think) that we are free to do whatever the hell we choose to do so long as we are not infringing on the rights of other. A lot of folks don't see it that way, but they are just, plain wrong. As far as the CD thing. Well, the Bill of Rights is pretty damn clear on that. It specifically and expressively prohibits the government from infringing the right to free expression.

[Skeptic]

It is so amazing to me how many people have this exactly ass backward. The Constitution DOES NOT delineate OUR rights. While the Bill of Rights does expressly describe certain rights which may not be infringed by the government. It certainly does not pretend to be a comprehensive list of what we are allowed to do.

Indeed so--that's the whole point of the 9th (and 10th) amendments. In fact, the idea that a consitution does no GIVE rights to people, but merely SAYS what rights they naturally have ("endowed by the creator", as the Constitution has it) goes back at least to the magna carta.

But that's not the point here: the point is that there is no natural right, whether given by the government or by one's birth, to have your CD sold in a store. The government cannot force a store not to sell it, but the store cannot be forced TO sell it.

The point here, it seems, is not government interference but abuse of power by a government official (if the story about the Sherrif is accurate). "Free speech" has nothing to do with this.

[PinkRabbit]

Originally posted by LFTKBS


Anyone who has lived in Arizona for longer than a couple months knows that Sheriff Joe never makes requests as a private citizen; he continually abuses his power and threatens people with the wrath of his office and that of the state.

I guarantee you this: if Tower had told Sheriff Arpaio to engage in intercourse with his own personal self, and that they were going to sell the record anyway, those employees would find themselves arrested for something or other by the end of the week. His own employees will not speak out against him in public, in fear for both their livelihoods and lives.

Ayup. I live in Tucson not Phoenix, but we routinely hear tales of Joe's assorted abuses of power and insanity. The man's infamous in the state. A true loony, but unfortunately one with a great deal of power and none too many ethics to go with it.

Can't say this latest bout of power mongering is much of a surprise. You have my sympathies LFTKBS.

Barb

[crackmonkey]

Chaos - gracious of you to concede my point.

[epepke]

Originally posted by Skeptic
Indeed so--that's the whole point of the 9th (and 10th) amendments. In fact, the idea that a consitution does no GIVE rights to people, but merely SAYS what rights they naturally have ("endowed by the creator", as the Constitution has it) goes back at least to the magna carta.

Um, that's the Declaration of Independence, not the Constitution.

[Chaos]

Originally posted by crackmonkey
Chaos - gracious of you to concede my point.

Huh?

[Mr Manifesto]

Originally posted by crackmonkey
In France, the most preposterous and offensive drivel is published about how the US government was behind 9/11, but any publicly worn religious symbols are regarded as divisive and provocative.


Where did you get that idea from?

[Skeptic]

Originally posted by epepke


Um, that's the Declaration of Independence, not the Constitution.

Yup, my mistake.

[crackmonkey]

In the words of Chirac...

Chirac depicted France as a land in which diverse people joined in a common identity that would be endangered by the release of religious centrifugal forces, by the celebration of distinctions that served to separate and not unite. The danger, he declared, was division, discrimination, confrontation.

[Tmy]

Originally posted by Skeptic
The government does not have the right to prevent the activity because they don't like what is being said.

Correct. But as I understand it, the sherrif asked the store to remove it since it insults police officers, not ordered them to do so by law. The store need not obey him. The manager cannot be arrested or brought to trial if he continues to sell those CDs.

It seems to me that in this case the sherrif is more equivalent to (say) a rabbi asking the store to remove CDs that insult jews, not to a political commissar.

Then again, perhaps I'm wrong on the facts.

Yeah. And its not extortion cause you dont HAVE to pay the mob there protection money!!

Its a freakin shakedown!!! Tower must get letters every day asking for then to stop selling that god awful Britney Spears CD. But they ignore them. What makes sheriff Rosco so special. Oh thats right........HES THE SHERRIFF! Im sure he used office letterhead too.