Pennsylvania to Copycat Arizona Law

[KingMerv00]

Well, well, well...

http://www.aim.org/don-irvine-blog/az-immigration-law-backlash-pa-to-follow-suit/

I expect boycotts to follow.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Just for that, I'm not going to Pittsburgh this year. :mad:

[KingMerv00]

Just for that, I'm not going to Pittsburgh this year. :mad:

On behalf of Pennsylvania, I say "WOOOOT!"

:D

[DavidJames]

I'm going to PA in August and won't cancel my plans. I will however make every effort to appear white while I'm there.

[johnny karate]

Pennsylvania? Really? I wouldn't have pegged them as a state having problems with illegal immigration.

On a related note, it seems Republicans are employing a strategy that ensures they will never get another Hispanic vote again.

[Mark6]

On behalf of Pennsylvania, I say "WOOOOT!"

Every time I see KingMerv00 here say "WOOOOT", I think of Bender's last word here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eHhgnbzFXCM&feature=related

[ShadowSot]

Y'know, it's surprising how many in hatters I see supporting this nonsense.
Seems that they'd be against it, as it seems to violate the fourth amendment.

[KingMerv00]

Y'know, it's surprising how many in hatters I see supporting this nonsense.
Seems that they'd be against it, as it seems to violate the fourth amendment.

As written, it does not violate the fourth amendment. It probably will upon implementation because people can't help but be jerks.

[KingMerv00]

Pennsylvania? Really? I wouldn't have pegged them as a state having problems with illegal immigration.

I heard on NPR that PA has about 100,000 illegal immigrants. That puts it 16th out of 50 states.

I spend a lot of my time in PA and I never see it discussed as a state issue. I am a little baffled.

[Darth Rotor]

As written, it does not violate the fourth amendment. I probably will upon implementation.
Merv, I can't see you violating the Fourth Amendment any time soon. You don't seem to be that type of guy. :cool:

@ShadowSot: Y'know, it's surprising how many in hatters I see supporting this nonsense.
It's the mercury, of course.

[KingMerv00]

Merv, I can't see you violating the Fourth Amendment any time soon. You don't seem to be that type of guy. :cool:

Aww that's nice of you. I should probably tell you where I put the bugs.

[tyr_13]

Migrant labor is responsible for the local grape harvest here just north of Pensiltucky, the only Canadian Provence outside of Canadia.

[ShadowSot]

As written, it does not violate the fourth amendment. It probably will upon implementation because people can't help but be jerks.

Hm.
Yep, gotta agree with you.

I just can't see how people seriously believe this won't end up being abused...

[ravdin]

Pennsylvania? Really? I wouldn't have pegged them as a state having problems with illegal immigration.

On a related note, it seems Republicans are employing a strategy that ensures they will never get another Hispanic vote again.

I definitely would peg Pennsylvania as being overrun with racist wingnuts, however- and politicians who pander to them.

[KingMerv00]

I definitely would peg Pennsylvania as being overrun with racist wingnuts...

Where do you get that notion?

[ravdin]

Where do you get that notion?

I am a Pennsylvania native.

[KingMerv00]

I am a Pennsylvania native.

Isn't that just anecdotal evidence?

[ravdin]

Isn't that just anecdotal evidence?

Yes.

[KingMerv00]

Yes.

OK then. As long as you realize your claim isn't very trustworthy. Not TOTALLY unreliable but not the sort of thing you should base opinions on.

[quixotecoyote]

I know that Massachusetts has a moderate influx around apple harvest season. I wonder if we'll see them adopting it in the fall.

[INRM]

I think there's a connection with the Arizona Law and a bill by Chuck Schumer and Lindsay Graham which will require all Americans to carry a national ID card which will carry biometric data and will use an RFID chip.

This way everybody would be required to have a card, and the cops could make sure nobody wouldn't carry a card by being able to demand "Papers".


INRM

[quixotecoyote]

Naw, that's inconvenient. We'll just implant it in your arm.

[ravdin]

OK then. As long as you realize your claim isn't very trustworthy. Not TOTALLY unreliable but not the sort of thing you should base opinions on.

On the contrary- my claim is very reliable. I just wouldn't expect anyone to take my word for it without confirming for themselves.

[quixotecoyote]

On the contrary- my claim is very reliable. I just wouldn't expect anyone to take my word for it without confirming for themselves.

I'm afraid not. Having lived in PA does not make your claims about PA immigration politics reliable. You need something better than that.

[INRM]

quixotecoyote,

Actually, this would be even more convenient, because by requiring everybody to carry them on them, and the government free to constantly ask everybody for their ID at anytime and free to arrest anybody who fails to comply effectively requires everybody to have the ID card on them at all times, and deflates any attempt to engage in civil disobedience by refusing to carrying the card on them.

Effectively it might as well be implanted in you as you have to have the card on you at all times, and by not forcing people to be implanted with it, well, it doesn't look so ugly.

[Cleon]

On the contrary- my claim is very reliable. I just wouldn't expect anyone to take my word for it without confirming for themselves.

I grew up in Pennsylvania. While there's some racism and bigotry, I don't think it's any worse than most other places. Certainly no worse than, say, Georgia.

[KingMerv00]

On the contrary- my claim is very reliable. I just wouldn't expect anyone to take my word for it without confirming for themselves.

I have worked and lived in Pennsylvania for years and have not seen what you saw. Why is your perspective more valid than mine or Cleon's?

[ravdin]

I have worked and lived in Pennsylvania for years and have not seen what you saw. Why is your perspective more valid than mine or Cleon's?

Cleon's perspective, from what he said, is that Pennsylvania has a lot of racists but is not worse than Georgia. I am not inclined to disagree with him on that.

If your perspective is that there are no racists in Pennsylvania, then mine is more valid because you'd be factually incorrect (as you'd be if you said that about any state). But since that's clearly not where you're coming from, I have to conclude that I ruffled your feathers by disparaging the state in which you live. Sorry about that- but I have roots there too and I'm not entirely clueless about the place. Exhibit A on my claim about the racism would of course be the OP in this thread.

Feel free to mock California anytime, by the way- we're an easy target!

[Skeptic]

(Sigh)

As usual, if state A adopts a law you likes from state B, it shows there is an "unstoppable momentum for change" in favor of similar laws. If it's a law one doesn't like, it's "hate" being spread by "racists", more proof of the fact that 98% of Americans are surely not as smart as you are.

[Cleon]

Cleon's perspective, from what he said, is that Pennsylvania has a lot of racists but is not worse than Georgia. I am not inclined to disagree with him on that.

Your exact words were, "I definitely would peg Pennsylvania as being overrun with racist wingnuts." While there are plenty of racists in PA - as there are everywhere - the idea of the state being "overrun" with them is completely contrary to my experience growing up there.

[Darth Rotor]

Your exact words were, "I definitely would peg Pennsylvania as being overrun with racist wingnuts." While there are plenty of racists in PA - as there are everywhere - the idea of the state being "overrun" with them is completely contrary to my experience growing up there.
I hear it's overrun with Penguins Fans, which is a different sort of social problem to deal with. Not like fans in Montreal ... :jaw-dropp

[ravdin]

Your exact words were, "I definitely would peg Pennsylvania as being overrun with racist wingnuts." While there are plenty of racists in PA - as there are everywhere - the idea of the state being "overrun" with them is completely contrary to my experience growing up there.

My bad. "Overrun" is an exaggeration. But if I were to characterize the place as overrun by rabid pro sports fanatics, I'm 100% prepared to stand by that.

[KingMerv00]

My bad. "Overrun" is an exaggeration. But if I were to characterize the place as overrun by rabid pro sports fanatics, I'm 100% prepared to stand by that.

You'd be standing behind me in that regard.

[Cleon]

I hear it's overrun with Penguins Fans, which is a different sort of social problem to deal with. Not like fans in Montreal ... :jaw-dropp

My bad. "Overrun" is an exaggeration. But if I were to characterize the place as overrun by rabid pro sports fanatics, I'm 100% prepared to stand by that.

Being a Pittsburgher myself, I cannot disagree with these observations. ;)

[KingMerv00]

Being a Pittsburgher myself, I cannot disagree with these observations. ;)

Try Philly.

[pipelineaudio]

Let's hope that pennsylvania can write it in such a way that it has serious teeth, yet can avoid any troublesome wording. Then We here in arizona can modify ours to theirs

[Cleon]

Try Philly.

Oh, please. :rolleyes:

;)

[KingMerv00]

Oh, please. :rolleyes:

;)

*A D-battery strikes Cleon in the head*

[MattusMaximus]

I heard on NPR that PA has about 100,000 illegal immigrants. That puts it 16th out of 50 states.

I spend a lot of my time in PA and I never see it discussed as a state issue. I am a little baffled.

Welcome to an election year where moderate Republicans have been scared ****-less by the Tea Party wingnuts who want to oust them in the primaries.

All this nonsense is the 2010 version of the "defense of marriage" crap put forth by the GOP in 2004. The political strategists probably know that it won't help in the long run, but it's the best they can come up with to a) appease the Tea Party nuts, and b) motivate their base (which they must have or they're screwed).

It may work in the short run for some more extreme idiots in the Republican party, and it might make the difference in a few key Congressional races. But in the long run (think 2012 and beyond), as others have stated, the GOP is destroying itself with the Hispanic vote in this country. The demographic trends already aren't good for the GOP, and with crap like this, they are only making it worse - it's the natural result of them catering to the extremists within their ranks for so long.

I predict that as time goes on, the GOP will continue to get older, whiter... and its ranks will become thinner. And they'll only have themselves to blame.

:popcorn1

[MattusMaximus]

Feel free to mock California anytime, by the way- we're an easy target!

They don't call Cali the Land of Fruits and Nuts for nothing.

You asked for it :)

[MattusMaximus]

Merv, are any PA politicos on record stating how the state plans to pay for implementing & enforcing this would-be law?

Nothing like unfunded mandates :rolleyes:

[KingMerv00]

Merv, are any PA politicos on record stating how the state plans to pay for implementing & enforcing this would-be law?

Nothing like unfunded mandates :rolleyes:

This is the first I've heard of it so I don't know.

I doubt it would cost much though. 100,000 illegal immigrants isn't THAT much and PA doesn't have an international border to patrol.

[MattusMaximus]

This is the first I've heard of it so I don't know.

I doubt it would cost much though. 100,000 illegal immigrants isn't THAT much and PA doesn't have an international border to patrol.

I think it'll be more costly than you think... especially after the inevitable racial profiling lawsuits.

If people want something like this done the right way and have it be constructive, as opposed to it being little more than election year boilerplate, then they're going to have to pay for it. Otherwise, it'll go nowhere fast.

[Myriad]

So far, all I've seen is that one PA state representative (who just happens to be in an eight-way race for Lieutenant Governor) has "introduced legislation."

That and a quarter will get you half a handful of Runts™ candy from a gumball machine. Didn't Arizona actually pass their legislation? That makes it a bit more newsworthy.

Respectfully,
Myriad

[MattusMaximus]

So far, all I've seen is that one PA state representative (who just happens to be in an eight-way race for Lieutenant Governor) has "introduced legislation."

That and a quarter will get you half a handful of Runts™ candy from a gumball machine. Didn't Arizona actually pass their legislation? That makes it a bit more newsworthy.

Respectfully,
Myriad

Thanks for the clarification, Myriad.

[Neally]

I predict that as time goes on, the GOP will continue to get older, whiter... and its ranks will become thinner. And they'll only have themselves to blame.
Party platforms have a way of changing according to the prevailing demands in order to survive. Just as some were hailing the death of the GOP when Obama was elected, or Clinton, the prediction now that they are pandering to an extreme platform that will be the death of them is erroneous.

[DDWW]

Really, Pennsylvania should copy California's illegal immigration law (Section 834b). It is tougher.

DDWW

[MikeMangum]

quixotecoyote,

Actually, this would be even more convenient, because by requiring everybody to carry them on them, and the government free to constantly ask everybody for their ID at anytime and free to arrest anybody who fails to comply effectively requires everybody to have the ID card on them at all times, and deflates any attempt to engage in civil disobedience by refusing to carrying the card on them.

Effectively it might as well be implanted in you as you have to have the card on you at all times, and by not forcing people to be implanted with it, well, it doesn't look so ugly.

Actually, I was reading a story in Reason today where, as a tossaway fact not central to the point of the story, New York police do indeed arrest people for failing to carry ID.

Oh, You Mean Those Quotas (http://reason.com/archives/2010/05/17/oh-you-mean-those-quotas)
Officers were instructed to arrest people for "blocking the sidewalk," for not possessing ID (even while just feet from their homes), even for no reason at all (cops were told to "articulate" a charge at a later time).

[Ysidro]

Try Philly.

Who would want to?

;)

[INRM]

MikeMagnum,

Actually, I was reading a story in Reason today where, as a tossaway fact not central to the point of the story, New York police do indeed arrest people for failing to carry ID.

Now that's kind of disturbing considering what I said earlier. I believe there is a definite connection between the Arizona's "Papers please?" laws and the National Biometric ID card law.

[rjwould]

We're all going to get good sun tans and talk with funny accents just to play with the cops. Conservative Pa lawmakers are about as goofy as you'll find anywhere. Remember Rick Santorum?

[MattusMaximus]

We're all going to get good sun tans and talk with funny accents just to play with the cops. Conservative Pa lawmakers are about as goofy as you'll find anywhere. Remember Rick Santorum?

Well, summer is coming up, and I do know a bit of Spanish :cool:

[rjwould]

Well, summer is coming up, and I do know a bit of Spanish :cool:Good! Get your papers and video cameras ready to join in the fun when it begins. forget about dialing 911 too.

[ponderingturtle]

I grew up in Pennsylvania. While there's some racism and bigotry, I don't think it's any worse than most other places. Certainly no worse than, say, Georgia.

Now all those who are against stereotyping the south as backward and racist will jump on this comment.

[KingMerv00]

Conservative Pa lawmakers are about as goofy as you'll find anywhere. Remember Rick Santorum?

I try not to. His stances on social issues were flat out disgusting.

Flag burning?
Homosexuality?
Intelligent Design?

You name it, he was a dick about it.

[Cleon]

Now all those who are against stereotyping the south as backward and racist will jump on this comment.

...I don't see how or why, but they're more than welcome to try.

[INRM]

Bump

[ZirconBlue]

I try not to. His stances on social issues were flat out disgusting.

Flag burning?
Homosexuality?
Intelligent Design?

You name it, he was a dick about it.

Which is why he now has a disgusting sexual byproduct named after him.