So, it looks like it's back to Vegas...... [Archive]

Brown

6th February 2004, 02:57 PM

Originally posted by Peter Jenkins
......... but not to the Tuscany. Why not? (actually I agree, and have my own ideas why not, but feel free to suggest your ideas)
Where would you choose for the next TAM?
Peter One of our earlier threads compiled our complaints about the Tuscany.

I've heard good things about the Rio... but even though the Rio is off the Strip, it is a "heavy hitter" among the Vegas hotels and might be too expensive.

Brown

6th February 2004, 03:01 PM

Some of the complaints about the Tuscany begin here (http://www.randi.org/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=34147&perpage=40&pagenumber=3) (near the bottom of the page).

kittynh

6th February 2004, 03:13 PM

OK, my mom always worked in the hotel business...so I know good hotel when I see one, and what makes a cheap hotel.

I'm sitting in bed at the Tuscany, and I turn to Pool Boy and say, "Is it me, or are the two pictures on that wall the same?" Sure enough, two pictures, with a few feet of each other on the same wall, were exactly the same. We even tried to see if we could spot any differences...

That, and the loud fan are a bad sign.

On the good side I was told that at the top hotel rooms are kept small, because they don't want you hanging out in the rooms, they want you out of the room gambling. For me, the size of the room was pleasant, and if I hadn't been in the room next to that loud partying Bidlack guy and his equally Party hardy son, we might have found it pleasantly quiet.

6th February 2004, 03:18 PM

NNNoooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

Nearly anything but lost wages. (No, not mine)

Jeff Corey

6th February 2004, 03:49 PM

One thing we like is going places we haven't been to beforeNew Orleans Anybody have any ideas?
Otherwise, NYC.

Paul C. Anagnostopoulos

6th February 2004, 05:29 PM

NYC? Yagh.

~~ Paul

6th February 2004, 09:42 PM

Originally posted by Paul C. Anagnostopoulos
NYC? Yagh.

~~ Paul

Double plus ungood yagh!

The Central Scrutinizer

6th February 2004, 10:21 PM

Has Vegas been decided upon? Did I miss something?

T'ai Chi

6th February 2004, 10:27 PM

Somewhere in CA?

Jeff Corey

7th February 2004, 03:30 AM

Originally posted by The Central Scrutinizer
Has Vegas been decided upon? Did I miss something?
See Friday's Commentary.

BigShoeStu

7th February 2004, 07:57 AM

GO VEGAS!!! Speaking for the finacially strapped, Vegas is the best place to stage this event when it comes to the cost of getting there. Vegas always has the best deals on flights from anywhere in the country, any time of the year. Just do a search on the web for "Las Vegas Vacation Packages" or "Las Vegas Flight Specials". I, for one, would be very happy and much more inclined to go to TAM3 if it were back in Vegas.

kevinsbikes

7th February 2004, 08:20 AM

I not only enjoyed my time in Vegas, but I also enjoyed the Tuscany. The price was very fair and the room was nice. I would have liked more "stuff" in the lobby/casino similar to the big boys, but all the glitter comes at a cost.
I would be more likely to attend TAM 3 if it were in Vegas.

darling

7th February 2004, 08:16 PM

How about instead of a hotel we go to a university campus?

I mean, at least the folks at the back of the room would be in a lecture hall with raised seating and so could see what was going on in front easier. And they'd have most of the AV stuff already set up ready to use.

Plus accomodations might be pretty cheap if it was vacation time.

OK, so you'd have to figure out some kind of catering but again, I'm pretty sure a big university would have that down pat...

But mostly, it's the lecture hall. Works SO much better than a huge conference room...

CFLarsen

8th February 2004, 01:48 AM

Originally posted by BigShoeStu
GO VEGAS!!! Speaking for the finacially strapped, Vegas is the best place to stage this event when it comes to the cost of getting there. Vegas always has the best deals on flights from anywhere in the country, any time of the year. Just do a search on the web for "Las Vegas Vacation Packages" or "Las Vegas Flight Specials". I, for one, would be very happy and much more inclined to go to TAM3 if it were back in Vegas.

Speak for yourself, buddy...Vegas is very hard to get to, if you are not living in the US. And there are actually quite a few of us attending TAM....

Originally posted by budddyh
How about instead of a hotel we go to a university campus?

I mean, at least the folks at the back of the room would be in a lecture hall with raised seating and so could see what was going on in front easier. And they'd have most of the AV stuff already set up ready to use.

Plus accomodations might be pretty cheap if it was vacation time.

OK, so you'd have to figure out some kind of catering but again, I'm pretty sure a big university would have that down pat...

But mostly, it's the lecture hall. Works SO much better than a huge conference room...

I second that. And third. An arena-type of venue is by far the best for this kind of event. Sure, the seats are perhaps not as comfy, but hey....are we there for the comfy chairs or to hear and meet skeptics?

Chaos

8th February 2004, 04:07 AM

I agree with Claus, on both counts.

It took me TWENTY-THREE HOURS to get to Vegas, and twenty-one to get home.

And it was d@mn expensive. I have no idea if I can afford all that again next year. I am pretty sure that if I come, I will have to ask for the skepperson telethon money.

Peter Jenkins

8th February 2004, 05:22 AM

I was one of the non-Americans who voted to go back to Vegas. I Loved the place though, not, the Tuscany. Where ever the JREF is, Annabel has convinced me we've got to stay at the Venetian next time :)
Accomodation was, I thought, quite reasonable. We paid twice as much to stay at a (not very good) hotel near London Gatwick, the day before we flew out - and the meal we had that night would have paid for 3 similar, in LV.
It took us 15 hours including stopover to get there. Personally, I don't think that's too bad for the fantastic time we had there.
Peter

Jeff Corey

8th February 2004, 06:30 AM

It's probably too late for TAM3, but the idea of a large U is great. Scientific societies used to do that. Meetings were held at campuses that were mostly vacated during the summer, and a number of lecture halls were empty. Guests stayed in dorm rooms. It was a no lose situation for all.

BigShoeStu

8th February 2004, 04:16 PM

Originally posted by CFLarsen

...Vegas is very hard to get to, if you are not living in the US. And there are actually quite a few of us attending TAM....
I can certainly sympathize with that. Here's hoping for a future that brings so many Skeptics together we are too big of a worldwide crowd and have to hold several TAM's around the world. Possibly during 2025 we will have TAM XXIII Vegas . . . TAM XVII London . . . TAM XV Sydney and TAM I The MOON! Ya think Randi would live long enough if we planned a TAM for the Moon in 2025?

Zep

8th February 2004, 07:35 PM

Marginal despondancy here in going back to Las Vegas - would have MUCH preferred Norlins or NYC. But hey - if it's already decided then who are we to complain!

I propose that MoeFaux start the official research dept. for scouting LV venues, given the learning curve already travelled plus the comments provided.

Incidentally, it is VERY expensive to get to Las Vegas from Australia, but then again, it's expensive to go ANYWHERE from Australia. Mrs Zep is keen to go to LV, and has already started planning stuff. I can feel my wallet getting lighter already...

Chanileslie

8th February 2004, 08:40 PM

Originally posted by Chaos
I agree with Claus, on both counts.

It took me TWENTY-THREE HOURS to get to Vegas, and twenty-one to get home.

And it was d@mn expensive. I have no idea if I can afford all that again next year. I am pretty sure that if I come, I will have to ask for the skepperson telethon money.

Actually Vegas is a Hub airport. It will take you a long time to get anywhere in the West Coast of the US if coming from Europe.

Ladewig

9th February 2004, 08:31 AM

I would have voted for alternating between L.V. and an east coast city each year, but I can see the advantage of L.V. There are certain speakers who can attend only if it is in Nevada.

budddyh
...a lecture hall with raised seating and so could see what was going on in front easier. And they'd have most of the AV stuff already set up ready to use.

Yes! I had complaints about the hotel but I would have ignored its lack of conveniences if the rooms for the conference had been conducive to our convention. If we can't get a lecture hall, then we need at the very least a higher stage and better lighting.

As for the advantages of Las Vegas, room prices and availablility are significantly better in December than January.

9th February 2004, 09:54 AM

Originally posted by Ladewig
I would have voted for alternating between L.V. and an east coast city each year, but I can see the advantage of L.V. There are certain speakers who can attend only if it is in Nevada.

Yes! I had complaints about the hotel but I would have ignored its lack of conveniences if the rooms for the conference had been conducive to our convention. If we can't get a lecture hall, then we need at the very least a higher stage and better lighting.

As for the advantages of Las Vegas, room prices and availablility are significantly better in December than January.

Speaking as someone who's spent a lot of their life in the last 20 years in hotel "conference" rooms, I have to agree. When we've had (standards) meetings in hotels, the lack of a rake to the floor makes it quite a bit harder to do business (now, in standards meetings, the meetings are a lot more interactive, simply because people are working, sometimes together, to build something). The best meeting venues have been colleges with lecture halls, because both the presense of multiple screens and chalkboards, along with raked floors and built-in desk-like things, make the meetings easier.

The only problem with college lecture halls is that they often lack the necessary power outlets for a standards meeting, i.e. the way for every one of 400 participants to plug in their laptops and get close enough to an airport to get good network connectivity.

That last issue would not affect TAM, I suspect, since most people in the audience aren't following along with or editing documents in synch with the speaker.

Nyarlathotep

9th February 2004, 10:17 AM

Well, on a purely personal level I am happy that TAM3 will be in Vegas again because that means that it will be close enough to me that I will likely be able to attend. I really liked TAM2 and I would be terribly disapointed if I couldn't go to TAM3.

On the other hand, I think moving it around from year to year would have been a pretty fair solution to the expense involved for some people, especially Europeans and Australians if it were held occasionally in held in Europe or Austrlia.

Peter Jenkins

9th February 2004, 11:04 AM

Well, I would have been happy with anywhere new and exciting, to be honest, but i did enjoy LV. We made new friends there and are glad for the excuse to visit again.

When people talk about somewhere in Europe being cheaper for the Europeans.........well, a reasonably cheap flight to USA, plus accomodation and food could work out equal to the cost of a hotel plus food in London, without taking into account the cost of getting there. (although, I realise other European Cities may be cheaper).
Peter

kittynh

9th February 2004, 11:10 AM

And right now with the exchange rate what it is, the US is pretty darn cheap for the Europeans. While for most of us in the US, the exchange rate would really hurt us if we went to Europe!

Marc

9th February 2004, 11:38 AM

Got no problem with Vegas again. Give me a chance to see Lance Burton, missed his show last time. Maybe a couple other shows.

Will also give me a chance to eat at Fatburger again! :D

http://members.cox.net/draft2/t2/fatburger.jpg

good burgers there!

kittynh

9th February 2004, 05:13 PM

Marc, you have to show me and Pool Boy where FatBurger is...

Kitten2 is heavily campaigning to be allowed to attend TAM3 (or else).

SkepticScott

9th February 2004, 05:57 PM

Originally posted by kittynh
(snip) Kitten2 is heavily campaigning to be allowed to attend TAM3 (or else). The nice thing about TAM is that it is kid-friendly. Look at the Beiersdorfer twins that ran "security"!

kittynh

9th February 2004, 07:02 PM

Those twins were junior G-Men!

Lisa and I brought the wrong ticket for lunch, and they wouldn't let us in! Linda said, "Oh, it's ok" and they still said, "Nope you have to have the right ticket!" They scare me!;)

Marc

9th February 2004, 07:47 PM

Originally posted by kittynh
Marc, you have to show me and Pool Boy where FatBurger is...

Kitten2 is heavily campaigning to be allowed to attend TAM3 (or else).

You got it. It is close to the M&M store if I recall correctly

MoeFaux

9th February 2004, 11:17 PM

I can't believe you guys went to Fatburger without me! I've got a wicked craving for a Baby Fat, some onion rings, and a shake....yummmmm....

Slicks girls are so sweet. I loved them being security!

Chanileslie

10th February 2004, 08:38 AM

Originally posted by kittynh
Marc, you have to show me and Pool Boy where FatBurger is...

Kitten2 is heavily campaigning to be allowed to attend TAM3 (or else).

Schizobunny is also heavily campaigning to go to TAM3. She was very disappointed that we left her at home for TAMII. We are considering bringing all our kids, but I am not sure my son would be interested and although my youngest (and most hyper child) would be interested in what was going on, she finds it very difficult to sit still and be quiet for more than 5 minutes at a time. So we shall see. We will probably be bringing Schizobunny to the next TAM. The other two are iffy.

kittynh

10th February 2004, 05:16 PM

Hal may be bringing his youngest daughter( I think), so the girls could pal around together (or get married, wait that's Kentucky....)

Anyway, I bet they would have fun as a group, and could have a teen party in one of the rooms while the parents have their party in the lounge (hhhmmm, maybe USA could babysit their party...I think it takes a sitter who knows all that can go wrong to be a good one) Anyway, good plan!

UnrepentantSinner

10th February 2004, 05:26 PM

Originally posted by kittynh
Anyway, I bet they would have fun as a group, and could have a teen party in one of the rooms while the parents have their party in the lounge (hhhmmm, maybe USA could babysit their party...I think it takes a sitter who knows all that can go wrong to be a good one) Anyway, good plan!

As a man who was once a teenaged boy, my only rule is no teenaged boys within 500 yards. I'll provide my services for free, but I will require the temporary use of a stun gun in case any teenaged boys try and break the perimeter.

kittynh

10th February 2004, 05:33 PM

SEE! I told you USA would be the best big brother! It's a tough job...at least three teenage girls, but I totally trust him. Stun gun at the ready!

Zep

10th February 2004, 05:33 PM

Zeplette will be approaching 18 in 12 months time, so I suspect that a "teen party" with baby-sitter would be ... errrm ... SO lame(?) for her. Although I doubt that marriage will be on her agenda, nevertheless a "REAL good time" might be desired and actively pursued! We shall see...

Note to self: Don't let Zeplette use MoeFaux as a lifestyle guide in Las Vegas. :)

I understand there actually are kid-friendly things to do in LV, even (gasp!) culture! Perhaps it might be an idea to see what can be provided in this manner, to allow family-oriented JREF folk to attend. That is, to dispel the adults-only preconceptions.

UnrepentantSinner

10th February 2004, 05:41 PM

Fine Zep. Chaperone, Bouncer, warder off of pimps and lounge lizzards, whatever phrase works for you and Zeplette. Just remember if she's not yet 18, she can't go into the casino areas.

MacGuffin

10th February 2004, 06:06 PM

Since I moved to Middle Of Nowhere, Arizona last year, the highlight of my time has been TAM2. It was less than four hours drive from my house and my school district was nice enough to foot the bill, so I am quite happy to hear that it is back in Vegas for 2005.

As for the hotel, I couldn't tell you since I didn't stay at the Tuscany. I stayed at a decent place that was about half the price and about a 10 minute drive to the site. So there are always lots of lodging options in Vegas wherever they choose to hold the meeting next year.

As for the hall, yes a college lecture hall would be nice, and I would put in a request for someplace with lots of outlets for laptops and such. But in January UNLV is probably in full-session and I don't know how many hotels have those sort of facilities. If they get some big name guests I imagine we could fill up a showroom on the strip.

Share and Enjoy - Aaron

Nyarlathotep

10th February 2004, 09:05 PM

Originally posted by UnrepentantSinner
Fine Zep. Chaperone, Bouncer, warder off of pimps and lounge lizzards, whatever phrase works for you and Zeplette. Just remember if she's not yet 18, she can't go into the casino areas.

Actually it's 21 and she can go into the casino area if she's younger, she just will get hassled by security if she loiters too near the machines or tables. But passing through on the way to a restaraunt or the bathroom or something is fine.

Zep

10th February 2004, 09:33 PM

Originally posted by UnrepentantSinner
Fine Zep. Chaperone, Bouncer, warder off of pimps and lounge lizzards, whatever phrase works for you and Zeplette. Just remember if she's not yet 18, she can't go into the casino areas.Thanks for your concern and kind offer, US! You're a prince! She also won't be served alcohol, I understand, although she is legal for that at 18 in Australia. Really, Zeplette would more likely be looking for some rock music venue or show.
Originally posted by Nyarlathotep
Actually it's 21 and she can go into the casino area if she's younger, she just will get hassled by security if she loiters too near the machines or tables. But passing through on the way to a restaraunt or the bathroom or something is fine. Tick. She was nine years old the last time we were there (at MGM, actually). The boys-in-black only got tetchy when she got too near the slots, which curious young kids are wont to do!

UnrepentantSinner

10th February 2004, 10:32 PM

Originally posted by Nyarlathotep
Actually it's 21 and she can go into the casino area if she's younger, she just will get hassled by security if she loiters too near the machines or tables. But passing through on the way to a restaraunt or the bathroom or something is fine.

Uhh, yeah, by "18", I meant 21, and by "not allowed" I meant not able to sit at a slot machine with a cigarette and a comped bourbon and soda pumping quarters into it.

Yeah, that's what I meant.

markb

10th February 2004, 10:33 PM

Originally posted by MacGuffin
As for the hall, yes a college lecture hall would be nice, and I would put in a request for someplace with lots of outlets for laptops and such. But in January UNLV is probably in full-session and I don't know how many hotels have those sort of facilities.

Actually, a quick visit to the UNLV web site reveals that this year, they did not start classes until January 20th.