NAWAPA-PLHINO: The Future of the Americas

[CplFerro]

Here is an interesting new video (http://www.larouchepac.com/lpactv?nid=9257) from the LaRouchePAC, narrated by Robert Beltran, covering the idea of the plan for the international megaproject that was developed in the 1960s, that would see North American watersheds rerouted to bloom the Great American Desert and other regions currently or soon to be lacking in fresh water. It also has some insights into the Mexican situation, about how their economy was demolished to the point that millions of Mexicans are willing to brave hostile natives and parching deserts to reach the land of relative opportunity called the US.

[ServiceSoon]

Wow. I've never heard of the North American Power & Water alliance. The video is strange in it's delivery of it's message.

First it suggest that globalization, current economic/monetary policies & planed espionage through the North American Free Trade Agreement are the cause of Mexico's ills. The cure for the evil deeds inflicted by the developed countries is to increase globalization in a large manner by diverting water from Alaska to Mexico.

The world isn't ready for social harmonization (one world gov).

Besides, I'd argue that desalination plants would be a more equitable and economic solution.

[CplFerro]

Wow. I've never heard of the North American Power & Water alliance. The video is strange in it's delivery of it's message.

First it suggest that globalization, current economic/monetary policies & planed espionage through the North American Free Trade Agreement are the cause of Mexico's ills. The cure for the evil deeds inflicted by the developed countries is to increase globalization in a large manner by diverting water from Alaska to Mexico.

The world isn't ready for social harmonization (one world gov).

Besides, I'd argue that desalination plants would be a more equitable and economic solution.

Gigaprojects don't need a world government, they just need international understandings.

Desalination plants need nuclear plants that we don't yet have; more nukes are good, but there's no need to scrimp when it comes to water, more sources of water will be better while we wait for the plants to come online.

[GreyArea]

Quick, someone warn Tank Girl (http://skreened.com/kaptainmyke/water-and-power-tank-girl-vintage-logo-t-shirt).

[Michael Redman]

All Mexico needs is to be free from the corrupting influence of the drug trade. Their economy isn't "destroyed", it's the 12th largest in the world.

[CplFerro]

All Mexico needs is to be free from the corrupting influence of the drug trade. Their economy isn't "destroyed", it's the 12th largest in the world.

And, it's doing so well millions of Mexicans wish to observe its wonderful progress from afar.

[Michael Redman]

And, it's doing so well millions of Mexicans wish to observe its wonderful progress from afar.But the other hundred million don't.

The US is mostly populated with decendents of people who left perfectly funcional states for the lure of freedom and prosperity. There are Americans living all over the world. The fact that there are poor Mexicans who want to work in the US is hardly evidence of a demolished economy. The idea that Mexico just need Alaskan water to prosper is, well, LaRouchian in its insanity.

[CplFerro]

But the other hundred million don't.

The US is mostly populated with decendents of people who left perfectly funcional states for the lure of freedom and prosperity. There are Americans living all over the world. The fact that there are poor Mexicans who want to work in the US is hardly evidence of a demolished economy. The idea that Mexico just need Alaskan water to prosper is, well, LaRouchian in its insanity.

Are you saying Mexico couldn't use extra water?

[Michael Redman]

I'm saying that this idea, as well as the claim that it would be the solution to Mexico's problems, is ridiculous.

[CplFerro]

I'm saying that this idea, as well as the claim that it would be the solution to Mexico's problems, is ridiculous.

So, you're saying that piping water to Mexico is ridiculous? I don't think anyone anywhere at anytime said that piping water to Mexico would "be the solution to Mexico's problems"--can you point out where anyone said such a thing?

[Michael Redman]

So, you're saying that piping water to Mexico is ridiculous?From Alaska? Yes. Quite.

No more of these "so you're saying" posts. If you have somthing to actually say, then you say it. Stop addressing strawmen.

[CplFerro]

From Alaska? Yes. Quite.

No more of these "so you're saying" posts. If you have somthing to actually say, then you say it. Stop addressing strawmen.

So, you're saying Mexico couldn't use the extra water from anywhere. Okay.

Have you read any of LaRouche's other ideas, such as the Eurasian (or eventually worldwide) Landbridge?

[Chaos]

So, you're saying Mexico couldn't use the extra water from anywhere. Okay.

Have you read any of LaRouche's other ideas, such as the Eurasian (or eventually worldwide) Landbridge?

I assure you we are more familiar with Mr LaRouche and his ideas than you think.

I also assure you that our assessment of his ideas ranges from "nonsense" to "insanity".

[CplFerro]

I assure you we are more familiar with Mr LaRouche and his ideas than you think.

I also assure you that our assessment of his ideas ranges from "nonsense" to "insanity".

Is this the polite Chaos or the rude Chaos talking?

[paximperium]

Is this the polite Chaos or the rude Chaos talking?
How is stating facts, rude?

[ServiceSoon]

Gigaprojects don't need a world government, they just need international understandings.

Desalination plants need nuclear plants that we don't yet have; more nukes are good, but there's no need to scrimp when it comes to water, more sources of water will be better while we wait for the plants to come online.
Mexico is in good company regarding fresh water supply shortage. International support to further develop this technology would benefit the entire world. Obtaining the funding from a variety of nations to develop this technology would be a lot easier. Changing thousands of miles of the earths surface is just a crazy expensive idea.

Desalinization plants can extract the energy necessary from a variety of energy platforms including, nuclear, geothermal, solar, wind, coal, oil, etc.

And, it's doing so well millions of Mexicans wish to observe its wonderful progress from afar.
And when other countries try to do business with Mexico (Free trade/NAFTA), they are blamed for Mexico's perils. Right or wrong, not exactly the way to win the hearts and minds of the people who determine your fate. I'm leaning towards Michael's opinion on this matter.

[CplFerro]

How is stating facts, rude?

Chaos insulted me in another thread, and I'm hoping he has amended his ways.

[theprestige]

Are you saying Mexico couldn't use extra water?
Earth to LaRouche: California could use extra water. I think it's a little early to talk about exporting surplus water out of the country, when there's still a water shortage inside the country.

[kevinquinnyo]

The video wouldn't load for me when I tried, so I gave up.

But piping water from water rich locations to deserts isn't in itself a nonsense proposition.

Before the availability and affordability of refrigeration, ice was literally chopped up and shipped to hot climates. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frederic_Tudor)

ETA: I learned about this from a NOVA special called Absolute Zero (http://www.hulu.com/watch/63745/nova-absolute-zero), which is awesome. I recommend watching it.

[/thread highjack]

[Michael Redman]

From Alaska? Yes. Quite.

No more of these "so you're saying" posts. If you have somthing to actually say, then you say it. Stop addressing strawmen.

So, you're saying...:rolleyes:

[Chaos]

Is this the polite Chaos or the rude Chaos talking?

That´s sane Chaos talking... non-LaRouche Chaos, in other words.

[CplFerro]

That´s sane Chaos talking... non-LaRouche Chaos, in other words.

What of LaRouche's work have you read, by the way?

[Chaos]

What of LaRouche's work have you read, by the way?

I have heard and read about his work - and none of that convinces me he is anything other than yet another nutter.

See, for example, the part about him in "Political Paranoia" by Robins and Post.

[CplFerro]

I have heard and read about his work - and none of that convinces me he is anything other than yet another nutter.

See, for example, the part about him in "Political Paranoia" by Robins and Post.

You haven't actually read the man, yet you're convinced he is mad. That, my friend, is the definition of foolishness.

[technoextreme]

You haven't actually read the man, yet you're convinced he is mad. That, my friend, is the definition of foolishness.
Fine then. I've read his stuff. The guy is insane maniac who makes Alex Jones look sane. He thinks that Activision, Blizzard, MIT, Microsoft, and god only knows how many other organizations are a part of a vast conspiracy of the British Empire to cause the downfall of the United States.

[paximperium]

Fine then. I've read his stuff. The guy is insane maniac who makes Alex Jones look sane. He thinks that Activision, Blizzard, MIT, Microsoft, and god only knows how many other organizations are a part of a vast conspiracy of the British Empire to cause the downfall of the United States.
I have to agree.
Only Electronic Arts stand between those dastardly French legion of Ubisoft and those other conspirators to turn the US into a pink foo foo loving country. Where is my Nintendo DS?

[CplFerro]

Fine then. I've read his stuff. The guy is insane maniac who makes Alex Jones look sane. He thinks that Activision, Blizzard, MIT, Microsoft, and god only knows how many other organizations are a part of a vast conspiracy of the British Empire to cause the downfall of the United States.

Aren't they? You may be misunderstanding the nature of conspiracies, agents, and the like. To say that N is an agent of the British Empire doesn't mean N takes marching orders from the Queen. Rather, most simply, N is following the same ideas that are behind the British Empire. In this way, it is possible to carefully connect up chains of influence that are anywhere from incidental de facto allegiances to actual face-to-face conspiracies. The effects on society remain the same.

[paximperium]

Aren't they? You may be misunderstanding the nature of conspiracies, agents, and the like. To say that N is an agent of the British Empire doesn't mean N takes marching orders from the Queen. Rather, most simply, N is following the same ideas that are behind the British Empire. In this way, it is possible to carefully connect up chains of influence that are anywhere from incidental de facto allegiances to actual face-to-face conspiracies. The effects on society remain the same.
Are you claiming that following same ideas are the same as a conspiracy?

[Chaos]

You haven't actually read the man, yet you're convinced he is mad. That, my friend, is the definition of foolishness.

I only need to know his claims, the "reasoning" behind his claims, and what reality actually looks like, in order to determine his is nuts. And I am NOT your friend.

[technoextreme]

Aren't they? You may be misunderstanding the nature of conspiracies, agents, and the like. To say that N is an agent of the British Empire doesn't mean N takes marching orders from the Queen. Rather, most simply, N is following the same ideas that are behind the British Empire. In this way, it is possible to carefully connect up chains of influence that are anywhere from incidental de facto allegiances to actual face-to-face conspiracies. The effects on society remain the same.
Yeah you obviously don't read the craptacular insanity that LaRoche writes then. When he wrote British Empire he means the British Empire.

[CplFerro]

Are you claiming that following same ideas are the same as a conspiracy?

That's the kind of conspiracy that he's talking about. If one is possessed of the same ideas as someone else, one acts as if a face-to-face conspiracy is engaged. It's similar to businesses colluding, from what I can tell. They often don't even need to have secret meetings with each other, they just have the same self-interest, and so they ooze in the same direction as if on cue.

[CplFerro]

I only need to know his claims, the "reasoning" behind his claims, and what reality actually looks like, in order to determine his is nuts. And I am NOT your friend.

Do you disbelieve in the doubling of the square, too?

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Here is an interesting new video (http://www.larouchepac.com/lpactv?nid=9257) from the LaRouchePAC, narrated by Robert Beltran, covering the idea of the plan for the international megaproject that was developed in the 1960s, that would see North American watersheds rerouted to bloom the Great American Desert and other regions currently or soon to be lacking in fresh water. It also has some insights into the Mexican situation, about how their economy was demolished to the point that millions of Mexicans are willing to brave hostile natives and parching deserts to reach the land of relative opportunity called the US.

When did the definition of "interesting" change to mean "loony"?

:dl:

(I didn't even bother watching it)

[Chaos]

Do you disbelieve in the doubling of the square, too?

The what?

[CplFerro]

The what?

Here is the link to the relevant work (http://www.schillerinstitute.org/educ/pedagogy/gauss_fund_bmd0402.html). LaRouche's organisation is founded on Art, Science, and History--whether history is an art or a science I'm not sure, but there you have it. I'm curious if anyone who has read the Scientific aspect, can debunk it. Up until now, all I've confronted are fools who hate LaRouche without reading him.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

[url=http://www.schillerinstitute.org/educ/pedagogy/gauss_fund_bmd0402.html]

tl;dr

[CplFerro]

tl;dr

Indeed, as is why the West fell.

[Red3]

Why should North America drain it's water off and give it to Mexico? I mean to what end? Parts of America are gonna be in the same position in the not so distant future.

[NewtonTrino]

We have larouche nutballs hanging out fairly regularly not far from my office. They stand behind a table that has a picture of Obama with a hitler mustache.

[Chaos]

Here is the link to the relevant work (http://www.schillerinstitute.org/educ/pedagogy/gauss_fund_bmd0402.html). LaRouche's organisation is founded on Art, Science, and History--whether history is an art or a science I'm not sure, but there you have it. I'm curious if anyone who has read the Scientific aspect, can debunk it. Up until now, all I've confronted are fools who hate LaRouche without reading him.

Can you explain, in your own words, what that is about? Or are you only parrotting stuff without understanding it?

Nobody here hates LaRouche... we simply think he is wrong - very, very wrong.

[quarky]

I didn't watch the video, but I'd like to make an observation anyway:

There is an awkwardness about political lines that are drawn across geological lines.
Part of Mexico is short on water because we have sucked up the flow of the Colorado River. It rarely makes it into Mexico anymore. Similar situations exist in the Middle East.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Can you explain, in your own words, what that is about? Or are you only parrotting stuff without understanding it?

Nobody here hates LaRouche... we simply think he is wrong - very, very wrong.

And a complete whack-a-doodle to boot!

[CplFerro]

Can you explain, in your own words, what that is about? Or are you only parrotting stuff without understanding it?

Nobody here hates LaRouche... we simply think he is wrong - very, very wrong.

Ah, but I bring it up because I don't understand all of it, and that is why it is compelling; I'm hoping one day to find someone who wishes to work on it with me. I understand doubling the square, you see, although I've never been given the test per se--the test is to double the square using pure geometry. The point is to locate in your mind the existence of powers--ideas that grant power over the physical and mental worlds. Doubling the cube should be the prime example of this. The ultimate goal is the isolation of the "complex domain". All of this to demonstrate, again, the existence of powers, principles, or ideas which are featured in Art and History.

[NewtonTrino]

Or it's just gobbledeegook.

[Red3]

"Doubling The Square" sounds like some catchphrase from a cheesy team-building guru.

[marting]

I just want people to know that I spent many a fine hour reading LaRouche material. I would pick them up at the airport. Better than the Hairy Krishnas since they offered glossy mags and other handouts while the Hairy's mostly just begged.

The alternate reality was much more entertaining than inflight movies. Still, I could never figure out what the appeal was.