He Wishes He Was At Disney World

[Jedi Knight]

....instead of inside US interrogation centers (http://i.cnn.net/cnn/2003/images/03/02/top.ksmohammed.ap.jpg).

LOL.

No terrorist is safe from the grasp of people that have the will to protect freedom.

JK

Arf...

I'll be glad when every one of those murderous coward rat bastards are in custody or out of action.

Something I've been mulling over... is torturing guys like this acceptable? Not according to laws, but, morally...

[Jedi Knight]

Originally posted by Thorin LungHammer
Arf...

I'll be glad when every one of those murderous coward rat bastards are in custody or out of action.

Something I've been mulling over... is torturing guys like this acceptable? Not according to laws, but, morally...

What is the moral way to deal with monsters? I know of some moral ways, but they would be inappropriate to discuss on the forum.

JK

[a_unique_person]

Originally posted by Thorin LungHammer
Arf...

I'll be glad when every one of those murderous coward rat bastards are in custody or out of action.

Something I've been mulling over... is torturing guys like this acceptable? Not according to laws, but, morally...

if you read between the lines, torture of a kind is expected in US prisons, from the prisoners abusing each other. it is an accepted part of the punishment.

[hammegk]

AAAAAAUP as usual brings a US-bashing non-sequitor. I think he needs to lose a LOT of weight. :eek:



Re torture: unreliable, but the best that could be done if time was a pressing concern, perhaps. Chemicals, maybe?

Given a few weeks and months, how would one define torture? With that much time, do not more certain (and "humane") methods exist to replace cattle prods, electrodes, beatings, drownings, etc?

It's a question I've been asking myself...

I'm angry enough at these nuts to feel that torturing them for information that could save lives is alright... but, say the Taliban had captured a US soldier... and they'd tortured him using the same reasoning...

and what if we torture him and learn nothing? I'm unable to rectify the idea of using torture with my personal pacifism... but I still wouldn't really mind if I heard we had tortured him for info...:confused:

edited to add the word 'torture' again, I used it so much...

[kittynh]

I was listening to public radio, and they said a very successful form of "torture" being used right now is threatening to let the Pakistani or some other nation "question" them. supposedly a lot of them speak right up.

[Ladewig]

is torturing guys like this acceptable?

Torture as a form of punishment is not morally acceptable in my opinion.

Torture as a form of information gathering is so unreliable that possibility of getting accurate information is outweighed by the moral repugnance of it.

The U.S. already has score of examples of faulty information derived from captured enemy combatants.

[Bjorn]

Originally posted by Thorin LungHammer
Arf...

I'll be glad when every one of those murderous coward rat bastards are in custody or out of action.

Something I've been mulling over... is torturing guys like this acceptable? Not according to laws, but, morally... By the same logic, raping a criminal's wife and/or kids would be OK because the criminal did such things to someone on 'our side'.

Great, good luck with your sceptisism and humanism.

What freedoms and rights are we supposed to defend, exactly? :(

Originally posted by Bjorn
By the same logic, raping a criminal's wife and/or kids would be OK because the criminal did such things to someone on 'our side'.

Great, good luck with your sceptisism and humanism.

What freedoms and rights are we supposed to defend, exactly? :(

It's possible you missed this: "I'm angry enough at these nuts to feel that torturing them for information that could save lives is alright... but, say the Taliban had captured a US soldier... and they'd tortured him using the same reasoning..."

I understand there are conflicts. I'm not saying that torture ought to take place for the purpose of retribution. If it might save lives, including my own, I consider the notion of digging for information, which is hardly the same thing. Doesn't seem like the same logic to me.

Some of the freedoms and rights we're supposed to defend have already been stepped on by our own government, sadly...

Good luck with my skepticism? Please elaborate... I haven't said anything unequivocally here. With my humanism? Always needs work...

[Bjorn]

Originally posted by Thorin LungHammer
It's possible you missed this: "I'm angry enough at these nuts to feel that torturing them for information that could save lives is alright... but, say the Taliban had captured a US soldier... and they'd tortured him using the same reasoning..."

No, I didn't miss it. I noticed that if someone was torturing 'on of us' it could, maybe, legitimate us doing the same to 'one of them'.

I understand there are conflicts. I'm not saying that torture ought to take place for the purpose of retribution. If it might save lives, including my own, I consider the notion of digging for information, which is hardly the same thing. Doesn't seem like the same logic to me.

Fine. You are wondering if torturing for information would be OK. Maybe one could save one thousand good guys by torturing one bad guy?

Would raping for information be OK? Would torturing someone's child for information be OK?

We, the supposedly civilized people, have set some limits, and torturing someone, whatever reason, is beyond that limit.

What if next month, say FBI, will torture you, or your wife, because they think they can save some lifes by doing so. Maybe thousands of them. (Oops, wrong guy, sorry. Tell your wife it was an accident.)

Some of the freedoms and rights we're supposed to defend have already been stepped on by our own government, sadly...

Yep, and you seem to be willing to expand?

Good luck with my skepticism? Please elaborate... I haven't said anything unequivocally here. With my humanism? Always needs work...

Sorry. I guess I was too harsh, but willing torturists do that to me. :(

[corplinx]

Originally posted by a_unique_person


if you read between the lines, torture of a kind is expected in US prisons, from the prisoners abusing each other. it is an accepted part of the punishment.

I wonder if this is more myth than substance. We all have heard about "salad tossing" but that is because we are attracted to the goriest and most sensationlistic details. I wonder what the actual rate of sexual and physical abuse is in prisons.

[Doctor X]

Understand the very emotional response to "punish" severly such monstrosities. It seems like a "justice."

No, it does not justify descending to their level. They will receive the trials that their victims will never had.

We can imagine, however. . . .

--J.D.

[specious_reasons]

Originally posted by corplinx


I wonder if this is more myth than substance. We all have heard about "salad tossing" but that is because we are attracted to the goriest and most sensationlistic details. I wonder what the actual rate of sexual and physical abuse is in prisons.

http://www.spr.org/
The few studies that have been done on prisoner rape reveal astonishing rates of abuse. A recent study of prisons in four Midwestern states found that approximately 20 percent of male inmates reported a pressured or forced sex incident while incarcerated. About nine percent of male inmates reported that that they had been raped. Unfortunately, no conclusive nationwide data exist.

[Megalodon]

Originally posted by Thorin LungHammer
Arf...

I'll be glad when every one of those murderous coward rat bastards are in custody or out of action.

Something I've been mulling over... is torturing guys like this acceptable? Not according to laws, but, morally...

Actually, I think you've got it backwards. Wasnt there a bill passed that allowed CIA to torture someone, as long as it was out of US borders? If so, it's legal

Morally, it's wrong. As Bjorn pointed out, if you let it start with the people you don't like, eventually it will happen to someone you like.

Torture is wrong. If A totures B, it's wrong. If, in response, C tortures A, It is still wrong.

No matter what the reasoning, what you have is someone inflicting suffering on an helpless victim.

[The Fool]

Why not read the "regarding Franko" thread to him till he cracks.

[Megalodon]

Originally posted by The Fool
Why not read the "regarding Franko" thread to him till he cracks.

:eek: For Ed's sake man!!! You are a savage!!! :D

[Jedi Knight]

Originally posted by The Fool
Why not read the "regarding Franko" thread to him till he cracks.

lol

JK

[Jedi Knight]

Originally posted by a_unique_person


if you read between the lines, torture of a kind is expected in US prisons, from the prisoners abusing each other. it is an accepted part of the punishment.

Hey Unique, aren't you going to congratulate Americans for taking this monster off the streets? You must admit that this is a great PR thingy for the Bush Administration and just makes Bush even a better president than he already is, even if he was the best president in American history before this guy got captured.

Bush!! Bush!! 8 more years!

JK