The Beer Thread

[Roadtoad]

Just curious here, and seeking scientific input:

The best beer I've had is German Weissbier, which I've always enjoyed with a Schweinerschnitzel, mit pommes frites und salat. (Hey, I'm an Army brat, and a vet...) I've yet to have anything better, (and no, Budweiser is not beer.)

[DanishDynamite]

The best beer I ever tasted was german. I was 16 years old and traveling through Europe on an Interrail ticket (cheap young adult ticket that covers most train operators in Europe). I was at a Youth Hostel in Koblenz, when some rather roudy Germans with the remains of a case of beer, asked me to take a photograph of them. Being a selfish son of a b**ch, I asked if I could have a swig of beer for the trouble.

It was amaaaazing! Clear, foamy, thick to the point of oilyness. Unfortunately, I never wrote down the brand. But, it my memory, it lives on as the greatest beer ever.

[Andonyx]

No Mexican Beer!!?!?!???!

I vote Tecate!

But then I'm a scotch drinker, so draw your own conclusions about that.

[Soapy Sam]

Lager. Cat pi$$. The lot of em.

RoadToad,

Just down the road from me is Eli's, one of the best pubs in the region. (IMO, of course.) It features about 30 taps and over 100 bottled brews. And that is barely representative of the beer world.

So, with all due respect, ya gotta put up far more choices before I'll vote. Where's Blue Moon Belgian? or Blue Moon Pumpkin Ale? How about Sam Smith's Oatmeal Stout?: When I've made the mistake of introducing friends to this, it has often left my house underneath overcoats. How about Tiernen's? I can't find it here in the U.S., but had one of their stouts in Aberdeen. I mean, stout. The damn thing took forever to pour. I think that's what it was. But I had already had a long afternoon and evening of drinking by the time someone asked me if I'd tried it.

The best light beer? Guiness. But nobody seems to know it hasn't many calories.

Then there's a concoction a friend (nicknamed Stout, but that hasn't anything to do with his drinking habits) invented: the Black Cherry.* 1/2 Sam Adams Cherry Wheat + 1/2 Sam Adams Double Bock. In a pinch, substitute Guiness for the Double Bock. Almost as good. I've ordered it so many times, Eli's has put it in their computer.

Buzz. Whirrrrr. Hic.

Cheers,

* Uh, no, that name has nothing to do with that lovely African American lass named Jazz. Why do you ask? No, never met her...

[jj]

You left out Guinness, or I can't read any more.

Oh well, maybe too much Guinness?:D

[Houngan]

Man, you left out all of England and Belgium. Sam Smith rocks the house, as does Fuller's. How come my choice is never on these polls?

H.

[FreakBoy]

Though I cannot for some reason actually drink much of anything that contains alcohol. I do enjoy stealing a sip or two from a good beer. My favorites are the Trappists. Leffe's the best in my opinion, though Chimay blue-label is also darned tasty.

[Michael Redman]

Originally posted by Soapy Sam
Lager. Cat pi$$. The lot of em. While I wouldn't go quite that far (close, but not quite) there are so many great darker beers that I do not understand why anyone bothers with lager when not absolutely necessary.

However, when you're sitting outside in 100+ degree Texas heat listening to a band at an icehouse or having a BBQ, ice-cold lager is damned near necessary. I would give up the internet before I give Guinness, but the beautiful dark stuff will never do in those circumstances.

If you're in a cooler climate, however, there's no need have lager around, unless the ladies want to drink beer, too.

[arcticpenguin]

Root Beer!

My favorite is 1919 root beer from the Schell Brewing Co. Rich & full-bodied. A true draught root beer, not available in bottles and cans.

[SFB]

Best mainstream American beers: Michelob and Miller High Life (NOT MGD or Miller Lite - there is a difference). You'd be surprised how many American bars don't even carry Michelob, yet I'd still call it mainstream.

While I have tasted many other American beers with much smaller names such as Pete's Wicked Ale, I'll stay away from such smaller names.

Among the lesser mainstream, yet very popular, the best American beer is Sam Adams - whatever variety you choose. I prefer stout, but I'd pick their pilsner over any other beer, if offered say in a restaurant.

Beyond the US, among the best are: Australian Sheaf Stout, Singapore's ABC Stout, the above mentioned Sam Smith's Oatmeal Stout, and Guinness.

Budweiser is truly the worst beer in the world (along with plenty of lesser known American brands which could be even worse). I wonder if Bud has much of an overseas market. I'd be surprised to see them making money in say, Europe. But not much surprises me as I get older!

Ugh! Any Mexican beer makes me ill, even the dark ones!

Roadtoad: you've opened up a can of worms here. There are way too many preferences of taste to accomplish any sort of "scientific input" in the matter!!

:D

[shemp]

I order Pilsner Urquell if it is available. I also enjoy a good stout (Guiness preferably). Heineken or Samuel Adams will do. I will not sink so low as to drink Buttweiser.

But the worst beer I ever had was back in college. The local convenience store sold a beer called Fort Schuyler for $1.10 a 6 pack, $4/case. In the mid-seventies, when I had little money, it was the cheapest available. It tasted like someone poured orange juice into the beer. Yeesh!

[Thumbo]

Originally posted by SFB

Budweiser is truly the worst beer in the world (along with plenty of lesser known American brands which could be even worse). I wonder if Bud has much of an overseas market. I'd be surprised to see them making money in say, Europe. But not much surprises me as I get older!


It was in vogue in the UK for a while - maybe still is. It even had a premium price. I guess some people just put fashion ahead of flavor.

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by shemp
I order Pilsner Urquell if it is available. I also enjoy a good stout (Guiness preferably). Heineken or Samuel Adams will do. I will not sink so low as to drink Buttweiser.

But the worst beer I ever had was back in college. The local convenience store sold a beer called Fort Schuyler for $1.10 a 6 pack, $4/case. In the mid-seventies, when I had little money, it was the cheapest available. It tasted like someone poured orange juice into the beer. Yeesh!

Oh, Jeez, Shemp, you've obviously never had Lucky Lager. $2.50 a case. A genuinely cheap-ass buzz, assuming you could finish the case.

Sorry about the lack of choices, all. Obviously a bias is being reflected here on my part, but worst of all, I only had 10 options available to me. Maybe I can edit and fix...

Still, the 411 is valuable. Hey, that's why you can respond here, right?

If you're out here in California, one good choice is Sierra Nevada Pale Ale. They brew it up in Chico. Good stuff. Just stay the hell away from Anchor Steam Beer. Tastes like a sailor yuked into the vat...

[Mark]

Just stay the hell away from Anchor Steam Beer. Tastes like a sailor yuked into the vat...

What?! All barley Anchor Steam is by far and away the finest beer I have ever tasted. A little dark for some people's taste, particularly if they are used to watery American beers like Bud or Coors, but a GREAT beer.

Actually, there is one better: a local Brewery in the mountains here called The Big Bear Mountain Brewery, brews a Red Ale that is awesome. Worth the trip and then some!

[Legallee Insane]

I AM CANADIAN
Yeah, that's right, I drink Molson Canadian beer because that's where I live, and because Canadian beer has a higher alcohol content that the puny weakling beer that the American's have. You guys down in the states are getting ripped off because you have to buy more beer to get just as drunk.

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by Legallee Insane
I AM CANADIAN
Yeah, that's right, I drink Molson Canadian beer because that's where I live, and because Canadian beer has a higher alcohol content that the puny weakling beer that the American's have. You guys down in the states are getting ripped off because you have to buy more beer to get just as drunk.

WELL, NO SH**! YA THINK?

[Ove]

I won't bother to vote on a poll about beer that leaves out Belgium - England- Czechoslovakia - Denmark.

Czechoslovakia is the place where beer as we know it today was invented (Pilzen) and they still makes some of the best beer in the world. I LOVE English Dark Ale (Newcalstle f.eks) and some of the small Danish breweries have cast away the Carlsberg/Tuborg shadow and is producing real quality beer (har i prøvet Thy Classic gutter?).

My alltime favourite though is and allways will be:

[Skeptoid]

The Special Amber from Sprecher Brewery (http://www.sprecherbrewery.com/), Milwaukee, Wisconsin. They also brew an excellent Oktoberfest and a superb Root Beer.


SPECIAL AMBER

A delicate balance of toasted malt and fresh hops give this medium-bodied
German style lager an intriguing complex flavor. A creamy head, deep golden color
and an impressive hop bouquet make this a very special beer.

Best served at 50 degrees F.
Aged: 5 weeks.
Initial gravity: 13.00 P
Malts: Pale, Munich & Belgian Caravienna
Hops: Cascade & Mt. Hood
Available in: 1/2 Barrel, 1/4 Barrel and 16oz. bottles

[arcticpenguin]

When I was in college the local liquor store sold generic beer. They had a sign in the window: Beer - ask for it by name!

[Shane Costello]

IMO beer needs to be divided into two broad categories. The mass produced "vin ordinare" stuff like Heineken and Carllsberg, which by pure necessity you sometimes have to resort to, and the better stuff, such as Gernan Weissbier that's actually brewed in Germany.

Here in Dublin there's too excellent brewpubs with a wide range of top quality brews. Both of them do wicked red ale, although I find the weissbiers leave me a little cold.

The best German weissbier available hereabouts is Erdinger. There's a Belgian beer called Hoegaarden that I'm also partial too. There's a few good microbreweries in Ireland too. Sacriligeous as it may be, I'm not at all partial to Guiness.

Originally posted by Bill Hoyt:
[/B]The best light beer? Guiness. But nobody seems to know it hasn't many calories.[/B]

Are you sure about this Bill? I've read that Guinness has a lot more calories than Lager, and some of the beer guts around here would suggest this is true.

Originally posted by Shane Costello
Are you sure about this Bill? I've read that Guinness has a lot more calories than Lager, and some of the beer guts around here would suggest this is true.
Shane,

In the wonderful world of beer marketing, there is no clear calorie cut-off for "light." It just has to have less alcohol and fewer calories than its counterpart. So, the range of calories (per 100 ml beer) is about 28 to 83. (Yes, 83.) And the overlap between the so-called lights and real beers is high. Guinness weighs in at 43. Contrast that with some of the so-called lights:

Michelob Light : 39
Piels Naturally Light : 40
Wurtzburg Hofbrau Light: 43

So, for the 4 calories over Mich Light, I'd choose Guinness any day. The flavor is far better.

Cheers,

[HILLD]

Money no object my own personal favourites would be Munich's finest...Spaten Pilsner...The ORIGINAL czechoslovakian Budweiser and that black temptress...Guinness, but as anyone in the UK would tell you.
When the beer calls.......accept no substitutes....8 Ace for £1.49!
Loopy juice for the discerning tattoed teenager.

Originally posted by Legallee Insane
I AM CANADIAN
Yeah, that's right, I drink Molson Canadian beer because that's where I live, and because Canadian beer has a higher alcohol content that the puny weakling beer that the American's have. You guys down in the states are getting ripped off because you have to buy more beer to get just as drunk.

Wow! How long has it been since you've been to the states? I know A-B & Coors & others are still peddling their swill, but, man, the microbrew revolution has been here for two decades already. Where have you been?

When you come down, you've got to stay away from the typical bars where A-B has a stranglehold. Hit the brew pubs. There you'll find all the Americans that grew tired of the swill. As I said before, my local pub has about 30 taps running. Only 4 of those carry the same brew week after week. All the others rotate constantly. There are about 100 tap handles on the wall, each one representing one of the types they bring in regularly. Scattered throughout the pub are chalkboards listing each keg that's "on" and the date it was tapped.

Cheers,

[Jon_in_london]

I dont like lagers unless I want to get trashed and do it quickly- cider is even better for this.

If I want to slowly enjoy a beer Ill have a dark, rich ale or bitter made sans chemicals and CO2 like London Pride. Or if I want to drink the whole day Ill drink a lighter session bitter like greene king IPA. Made traditionally and matured in oak casks not in a giant refrigerated steel vat in a factory.

Lager is detestable, and its all I had to drink for around 10 years!! ughhh..

[garys_2k]

http://www.ratebeer.com/BeerImages/kalamazbells.gif

Bell's out of Kalamazoo, Michigan. Have a winter beer that'll knock your socks off, and a taste that is out of this world! YUM! ;)

[Supercharts]

Originally posted by shemp
I order Pilsner Urquell if it is available. I also enjoy a good stout (Guiness preferably). Heineken or Samuel Adams will do. I will not sink so low as to drink Buttweiser.

But the worst beer I ever had was back in college. The local convenience store sold a beer called Fort Schuyler for $1.10 a 6 pack, $4/case. In the mid-seventies, when I had little money, it was the cheapest available. It tasted like someone poured orange juice into the beer. Yeesh!
Pilsner Urquell is like mother's milk. If it was readily available and moderate in price I'd been even more of a drunk that I am currently. It's just a fine, smooth beer from the oldest brewery in Europe. This is why the Chech Republic joined NATO and Slovakia has a lousey economy.
The worst beer I've ever had was Naragansette Lager. Like Shemp I drank a rotten beer because it was cheap back in the late 60's and early 70's. I think they used the water from Boston Harbor or the Merrimack River to make it.
Anyone remember Bert & Harry Piel?

[roger]

Originally posted by SFB
Budweiser is truly the worst beer in the world (along with plenty of lesser known American brands which could be even worse). I wonder if Bud has much of an overseas market. I'd be surprised to see them making money in say, Europe. But not much surprises me as I get older!
Heck, you can find Budweiser being sold in the tea shops dotting the trekking paths all through Nepal. I assume it sells, though I don't recall seeing anyone order one.

[shemp]

Originally posted by Supercharts

Pilsner Urquell is like mother's milk. If it was readily available and moderate in price I'd been even more of a drunk that I am currently. It's just a fine, smooth beer from the oldest brewery in Europe. This is why the Chech Republic joined NATO and Slovakia has a lousey economy.
The worst beer I've ever had was Naragansette Lager. Like Shemp I drank a rotten beer because it was cheap back in the late 60's and early 70's. I think they used the water from Boston Harbor or the Merrimack River to make it.
Anyone remember Bert & Harry Piel?

Pilsner Urquell is an excellent beer with a meal. Would you drink Guiness with fish or chicken? No, I thought not.

Narragansett was garbage. It was available where I went to school (University of New Hampshire) but it was actually a bit more expensive than Fort Schuyler. They actually DO use Merrimack River water to make Budweiser in Merrimack, NH. That is one of the two reasons I don't drink it, the other being that it tastes like urine.

Ah, Piel's Real Draft. I think this was the sludge from the bottom of the Budweiser vats. Do you remember the TV ads they ran about 20 years ago showing a bunch of fat guys and losers in a bar drinking Piels, with the slogan "A Real Drinking Man's Beer!"?

Another one I drank in college was Pickwick Ale. I also downed a lot of Pabst Blue Ribbon, which actually was probably the best of the bad beers.

On our campus, a lot of guys drank Busch because it was heavily advertised. This is watered-down Budweiser. But our dorm once won a video game system for drinking the most Busch. This was back in '75, and it was just a Pong game, but you would put a plastic sheet over the TV screen and could pretend you were playing tennis or hockey. Back then, we thought this was pretty cool.

[DaChew]

There is no best beer. There is no worst beer. There are some pretty damn bad ones though.

The best beer depends on the situation. Like wine, it depends on what your eating, the time of season, and most importantly your tastes.

An important note: Most mass produced beers don't comply with the German Beer purity law of 1516, which you may find here.

http://hbd.org/brewery/library/ReinHeit.html

Both Budweiser and Miller only state that their beer contains "choice grains". That typically means rice and corn and other grains other than barley. Weisse beers also don't comply as they include wheat.

Fortunately, over the last 20 or so years microbrewerys have sprouted up in the U.S. that make inarguably some of the finest beer in the world.

That said, my own preferences are the following (in no particular order):

Britain: Guinness, Bass Ale, Samuel Smiths Oatmeal Stout, Mckewans Scottish Ale.

Germany: Haacker-Schore (sp?) Oktoberfest, Spaten Optimator.

Belgium: Corsendonk (sp?), Chimay.

Japan: Soporo (sp?) (had to mention because in Japan they have beer vending machines right on the street.)

Mexico: ***** Modello, Bohemia Modello, Dos Equis

Canada: Molson Golden, Labatts Velvet Cream Porter Ale, Labatts XXX, Upper Canada Dark.

U.S.: Bells Porter, Big Buck Red Stag, Budweiser, Pete's Wicked Ale and as a homebrewer I have to say that I do brew one heck of a nut brown ale.

I've left out a ton of stuff like specialty beers and mead but usually I just go by the motto: There is no best beer. Just different styles for different situations and moods.

[Mark]

I've left out a ton of stuff like specialty beers and mead but usually I just go by the motto: There is no best beer. Just different styles for different situations and moods.

I agree, except that I can't imagine the situation where I would find Budweiser to be appropriate. Maybe my own suicide. :D

BTW, I have to say, for a mass produced beer, I think Killian's Red is actually quite good. Not as good as The Big Bear Mountain Brewery's "Red Ant Hill Ale", but good nonetheless.

Henry Weinhard's Red Ale is worth a taste, too.

[shemp]

Originally posted by DaChew
There is no best beer. There is no worst beer. There are some pretty damn bad ones though.

The best beer depends on the situation. Like wine, it depends on what your eating, the time of season, and most importantly your tastes.

An important note: Most mass produced beers don't comply with the German Beer purity law of 1516, which you may find here.

http://hbd.org/brewery/library/ReinHeit.html

Both Budweiser and Miller only state that their beer contains "choice grains". That typically means rice and corn and other grains other than barley. Weisse beers also don't comply as they include wheat.

Fortunately, over the last 20 or so years microbrewerys have sprouted up in the U.S. that make inarguably some of the finest beer in the world.

That said, my own preferences are the following (in no particular order):

Britain: Guinness, Bass Ale, Samuel Smiths Oatmeal Stout, Mckewans Scottish Ale.

Germany: Haacker-Schore (sp?) Oktoberfest, Spaten Optimator.

Belgium: Corsendonk (sp?), Chimay.

Japan: Soporo (sp?) (had to mention because in Japan they have beer vending machines right on the street.)

Mexico: ***** Modello, Bohemia Modello, Dos Equis

Canada: Molson Golden, Labatts Velvet Cream Porter Ale, Labatts XXX, Upper Canada Dark.

U.S.: Bells Porter, Big Buck Red Stag, Budweiser, Pete's Wicked Ale and as a homebrewer I have to say that I do brew one heck of a nut brown ale.

I've left out a ton of stuff like specialty beers and mead but usually I just go by the motto: There is no best beer. Just different styles for different situations and moods.

I got some Chimay for Giftmas. Ummmmm! I drank it all in one night.

Bass Ale, ***** Modelo, Dos Equis and Sapporo are all good too. Tecate is good with mexican food, but Corona is the Buttweiser of Mexico. I like to frequent a little Korean restaurant that does great sushi, and just down a few cans of Sapporo with a big sushi platter.

Locally, we have something called Nutfield Ale, which is pretty good. Try it if you can find it.

I must take exception with one of your assessments. I can't stand any beer from Canada. Maybe it's because Molson owned the hated Montreal Canadiens, or maybe because they used to sell watered-down Labatt's at Fenway Park.

[Diezel]

Originally posted by Legallee Insane
I AM CANADIAN
Yeah, that's right, I drink Molson Canadian beer because that's where I live, and because Canadian beer has a higher alcohol content that the puny weakling beer that the American's have. You guys down in the states are getting ripped off because you have to buy more beer to get just as drunk.

Man, I just love busting this myth to Canadians! I still amazes me this Urban Legend is still running around.

Fact - Canadian beer sold in Canada and the US is identical. Canadian beer is does not contain more alcohol in Canada. Canadian beer does not contain more alcohol than domestic US beers.

Oh, and for you European types, Guiness sold there and here is also the exact same formula and the same alcohol content. I've posted all the proof here before. I will do so again, but for some reason, the sites I am trying to pull it from is locked up. I will post all the facts when I can get them.

[Diezel]

I still can't get to the page that has the quotes from the Molson executive stating that they do not brew two different types of beer, one for Canada and one for the US. The only difference between the Canadian version and the US version is the label.

But I did find a good site that explains most of the confusion. The US, having to be different as always, rates are beer by weight. The rest of the world does it by volume. So, when you make the conversion, the seemingly low content in US beer raises to the same as the rest of the world.

Budweiser, for example, is 5% abv, which is pretty high for most massed consumed beers (much higher than Guiness, for example.)

Check it out here: http://www.csulb.edu/~parayner/Alcohol.html

[Michael Redman]

I knew something was missing around here . . .

[DaChew]

I can't stand any beer from Canada. Maybe it's because Molson owned the hated Montreal Canadiens,

I'm sorry, I just can't work up any hatred for any of the original six teams even the Blackhawks and I'm from Detroit for crying out loud.

Tecate is good with mexican food, but Corona is the Buttweiser of Mexico.

I like Tecate also because I'm more likely to be able to get it than any of the Modellos. I ALWAYS run into the same problem with Mexican beers (and I blame the Corona folks for this). You can't order a Mexican beer without someone trying to jam a wedge of lemon into it. If you have to do that to make the beer taste good then I don't want it.

I agree, except that I can't imagine the situation where I would find Budweiser to be appropriate. Maybe my own suicide.

Well maybe, but remember: Nobody makes more beer than Budweiser. If you're looking for something that is absolutely going to be exactly the same every time (not many microbrewers can say that) without any character getting in the way, Budweiser is it. Budweiser is brewed so as to offend as few people as possible so as to sell the millions of liters a year that they sell and it tastes that way. That's the only reason it's on my list.
Still, on a hot day, if I have a choice between Budweiser and the various sugar waters from Coke and Pepsi, I'm taking the Bud.


Diezel
Oh, and for you European types, Guiness sold there and here is also the exact same formula and the same alcohol content. I've posted all the proof here before.
Can you dispel another myth? I'd heard that Guinness stopped shipping by plane because the higher altitude caused the beer to taste different once they got it here. Then I've heard that Guinness switched from ship to plane because the constant rocking changed the taste. All of it sounds like crap to me. On the other hand it would be cool if Guinness had their own fleet of submarines.

[Diezel]

Originally posted by DaChew
Diezel

Can you dispel another myth? I'd heard that Guinness stopped shipping by plane because the higher altitude caused the beer to taste different once they got it here. Then I've heard that Guinness switched from ship to plane because the constant rocking changed the taste. All of it sounds like crap to me. On the other hand it would be cool if Guinness had their own fleet of submarines.

I'll try to find that info, but if memory serves me right, the Guiness in America is brewed in a brewery in New York, but it is brewed to the exact same forumla as its European counter parts. So there would be no shipping over here in the first place.

BTW, have you seen the Michigan Meeting thread? You should come out tonight and drink a few of the thread namesakes with us. :D

Oh, and I will be drinking what seems to be the nasty beer in most people's minds - Budweiser. :D

[Diezel]

One quote from the Guinees website FAQ:

Is it true that you get a much better pint in Ireland?

These days an Irish and US pint of GUINNESS® draught are pretty much the same. The water will be different of course because we always use pure, fresh water from local natural sources. In blind tests though, (with a bunch of highly cynical journalists!), none of our sample could tell the difference. In fact, the only real difference you should be able to spot is the pub that you're drinking in.

Found here: http://www.guinness.com/guinness/en_US/knowing/pearls/faqs/0,6415,12687267_126325,00.html

[Diezel]

Ok, from the Molson website (to clear up the alcohol content myth):

Molson Canadian

Lager, 5.0% alc. /vol.
Molson Canadian truly exemplifies the pride of young Canadians and is Canada's #1 selling beer. Starting with pure crystal clear water, Canadian grown malted barley and the finest hops, Molson Canadian is slowly fermented to produce a smooth, refreshing beer with a genuine taste. Clean and clear, crisp and cold Molson Canadian is a classic lager.

Like I said before, Budweiser is 5.0% by volume also. BTW, some of your microbrews are around 9% and a local brewery puts out a 14% beer.

[DaChew]

I have done highly scientific double blind testing of exactly this issue in the back of my work van when I was employed by one of the local Detroit area school districts.

A person who I will call Canadian John because his name was John and he, in fact, is Canadian. Insisted that not only the alcohol content was different between Canadian Molson Golden and U.S. Molson Golden but also the taste was different.
One of our college summer help kids was immediately dispatched to Windsor to secure authentic Canadian Molson Golden complete with sissy-fied half French labels. A six of U.S. Molson Golden was secured from our favorite deli.

Canadian John was allowed to cleanse his palate between tastes with either pretzel rods or pork rinds, both were his choice. The beer was dispensed into identical numbered paper cups by Shriner Len (same criteria used) and brought to us so that neither I nor Canadian John could know which beer was which.

Canadian John chose the "better" tasting of the two (the one he thought was the Canadian one) as the American brand slightly more than half the time. We only did a few trials because the guys just couldn't contain themselves because he was consitently wrong right from the get-go. Besides, once he realized he was performing poorly, Canadian John started downing the trial samples as fast as we could bring them.

[rikzilla]

Ahhhh RT!

The eternal question! In Frankfurt the best lager was Binding Bier, but alsa, they do not export it. (and I bet you have an opinion on that one eh? So what is it? Henninger or Binding?) I had some fine Budweiser Budvar...was very much like Pilsner Urquel. (great stuff)

The nicest stuff I've tasted lately would have to be "Dominion Lager" the local brew from Virginia. Best DC pick would have to be from the Old Heirich brewery..."Foggy Bottom Lager". Finest thing I ever tasted though come from the local brew pubs here in DC. Rock Bottom Brewery's Porter.....or the tasty IPA from Cap City. (Dollar pints on wednesday nights!! :D :D )

-zilla

[Mark]

Well maybe, but remember: Nobody makes more beer than Budweiser. If you're looking for something that is absolutely going to be exactly the same every time (not many microbrewers can say that) without any character getting in the way, Budweiser is it.

Well, I can't argue with that! Aiming for the lowest common denominator is common marketing technique. But...blecccccch. I'd rather drink Mountain Dew; it's consistent, too, you know. Or even---dare I say it?---water. Budweiser, honest to god, tastes so bad to me it gives me a headache...it has a bizzare metallic aftertaste I just can't stomach.

"Water is unfit for human consumption: it rusts pipes and fish make love in it."--- W.C. Fields

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by rikzilla
Ahhhh RT!

The eternal question! In Frankfurt the best lager was Binding Bier, but alsa, they do not export it. (and I bet you have an opinion on that one eh? So what is it? Henninger or Binding?) I had some fine Budweiser Budvar...was very much like Pilsner Urquel. (great stuff)

The nicest stuff I've tasted lately would have to be "Dominion Lager" the local brew from Virginia. Best DC pick would have to be from the Old Heirich brewery..."Foggy Bottom Lager". Finest thing I ever tasted though come from the local brew pubs here in DC. Rock Bottom Brewery's Porter.....or the tasty IPA from Cap City. (Dollar pints on wednesday nights!! :D :D )

-zilla

Binding, by far, though when I lived in Wuerzburg, I tried the Wuerzburger Hofbrau's Doppel Bock. It does not pour out of the bottle; it sort of oozes. It numbs your tongue!:D

In Schweinfurt, they had a brew called "Rauchbier," which is unusual in that they smoke the hops and barley that go into it. 14% by volume. (Yow!)

In the U.S., we have Sam Adams, of course, which is some seriously good brew. On the other hand, I like Sierra Nevada, too, (see earlier post), which is great with a meal of country spare ribs grilled to perfection, served with a hot baked potato, and a large green salad. (You can tell I'm free of Republican madness: I spelled "that word" correctly...)

American Beer, though, seems to be brewed specifically to be served ice cold, while Europeans seem to prefer their brews served slightly warmer. Any comments from the other side of the pond?

[Mark]

American Beer, though, seems to be brewed specifically to be served ice cold, while Europeans seem to prefer their brews served slightly warmer. Any comments from the other side of the pond?

Probably true for most of the mass produced beers. For many of the micro brews, being too cold ruins the beers' character.

Originally posted by Mark
American Beer, though, seems to be brewed specifically to be served ice cold, while Europeans seem to prefer their brews served slightly warmer. Any comments from the other side of the pond?

Probably true for most of the mass produced beers. For many of the micro brews, being too cold ruins the beers' character.

The good pubs in the U.S. have some kegs in the frig and some at cask.

Did I mention I'm heading down to one of the good pubs in a few hours?

Cheers,

[DaChew]

BTW, have you seen the Michigan Meeting thread? You should come out tonight and drink a few of the thread namesakes with us.

Yeah, I've seen it. I really wanted to meet you and Kodiak, I've read so many posts with your names on them. But, duty calls I'm spending nearly all of my weekends between now and spring up north fixing various bits of farming equipment. I hope everything goes really well so as to encourage another meeting that I WILL be able to attend.
Enjoy though and raise a glass for me to all of the pansies who will attend the big show in Florida. A REAL skeptic doesn't NEED sunshine and warmth and a lecture by Randi and girls in bikinis and... damn, there's just no way to sour grapes it.

[Diezel]

Originally posted by DaChew


Yeah, I've seen it. I really wanted to meet you and Kodiak, I've read so many posts with your names on them. But, duty calls I'm spending nearly all of my weekends between now and spring up north fixing various bits of farming equipment. I hope everything goes really well so as to encourage another meeting that I WILL be able to attend.
Enjoy though and raise a glass for me to all of the pansies who will attend the big show in Florida. A REAL skeptic doesn't NEED sunshine and warmth and a lecture by Randi and girls in bikinis and... damn, there's just no way to sour grapes it. j

I will do that! :)

And there is one way to sour grapes it. I will be in Jamaica instead of the meeting! Ft. Lauderdale is nice, but it's not Negril! :D

[Shane Costello]

Originally posted by Bill Hoyt:
So, for the 4 calories over Mich Light, I'd choose Guinness any day. The flavor is far better.

Wow, are they really as close as all that?
I read in the most august of scientific publications,"FHM" magazine, that a pint of Guinness contains 420 calories, while a pint of lager contains 240.

Originally posted by Diezel:
I'll try to find that info, but if memory serves me right, the Guiness in America is brewed in a brewery in New York, but it is brewed to the exact same forumla as its European counter parts. So there would be no shipping over here in the first place.

I think the Guinness found in the States is brewed in Canada. I'm reliably informed by Americans that this stuff isn't a patch on the real stuff from the St James Gate Brewery in Dublin.

Imagine my suprise to find that liquor stores in Michigan also stocked "Harp" lager, one of Guinness' brands tha's hard enough to find on tap in Ireland any more. It tasted nothing like the Harp lager brewed and sold in Ireland.

[Diezel]

Originally posted by Shane Costello
Originally posted by Diezel:


I think the Guinness found in the States is brewed in Canada. I'm reliably informed by Americans that this stuff isn't a patch on the real stuff from the St James Gate Brewery in Dublin.

Imagine my suprise to find that liquor stores in Michigan also stocked "Harp" lager, one of Guinness' brands tha's hard enough to find on tap in Ireland any more. It tasted nothing like the Harp lager brewed and sold in Ireland.

I'm sure your Americans friends think they are reliable, but they aren't. I still have to find it, but I can prove that there is no difference in either and in a blind taste test they would not be able to tell.

Preconception is a powerful thing! :D

[Shane Costello]

Originally posted by Diezel:
I still have to find it, but I can prove that there is no difference in either and in a blind taste test they would not be able to tell.

I wouldn't be suprised if they couldn't tell the difference. They are Americans, after all! ;)

Seriously though, the quality of beer served, whatever the brand depends most of all on the bar or pub serving it, rather than the country it's brewed in. If you don't believe me then try drinking anything from a students bar.

Originally posted by Shane Costello
Originally posted by Bill Hoyt:


Wow, are they really as close as all that?
I read in the most august of scientific publications,"FHM" magazine, that a pint of Guinness contains 420 calories, while a pint of lager contains 240.

Mama, we gotta slaughter Bessie, Papa's gonna need a new belt.
420! Okay, here's one source:

beer100 (http://www.beer100.com/beerinfo/beercalories.htm)

For a (U.S.) pint, 43 / 100ml puts Guiness at around 200. For an imperial pint, about 250.

Cheers,

[DaChew]

And there is one way to sour grapes it. I will be in Jamaica instead of the meeting! Ft. Lauderdale is nice, but it's not Negril!

Jamaica. Yeah sure, I guess if your the type of person that LIKES that sort of... ah crap. I give up.

[Diezel]

Originally posted by Shane Costello
Originally posted by Diezel:


I wouldn't be suprised if they couldn't tell the difference. They are Americans, after all! ;)

Seriously though, the quality of beer served, whatever the brand depends most of all on the bar or pub serving it, rather than the country it's brewed in. If you don't believe me then try drinking anything from a students bar.

Temperature is everything when it comes to beer, which has already been touched on. A warm American beer will gag a billy-goat. A really cold European beer will gag a billy-goat.

I've been busy as hell today, but if I get a chance, I will post (again ;)) my theory of the why American, European and Canadian beers evolved into what they are today. It is basically an application of when and how we drink beer.

Oh hell, I will do it quickly. It is very common for Americans to consume beer while participating in atheletic activities. Often, it is very hot when doing this. Trying drinking a few pints of Guinness while playing softball in 95F weather! It isn't going to sit very well. But an ice cold American beer goes down just right.

Canadians do the same, but it isn't usually as hot. So there beer, while being close to an American style, has taken a little heavier approach.

Europeans are accustomed to drinking their beer after their sporting events, so thirst quinching isn't the top priority. And they can get much heavier, because they don't have to worry about a heavy stomach while they are participating.

Ok, that was a quick version of on observation I made long ago. It is not scientific, and barely informed, but I have had quite a few people (from all sides of that coin) who agreed with it. :D

[kittynh]

If it's fresh it's good. If you are drinking it right next to where it's brewed in Holland, it's beyond good. I became an alcoholic for one night when I was downing a few (?) next to the Amstel brewery. Smooth is not the word...'
AS for Belgium beer...just be aware the alcohol content can be pretty interesting.

[Shane Costello]

Originally posted by Diezel:
Oh hell, I will do it quickly. It is very common for Americans to consume beer while participating in atheletic activities.

Which explains the incomprehensible (to Europeans) ability of Americans to sit through hours of American Football. :D

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by Shane Costello
Originally posted by Diezel:


Which explains the incomprehensible (to Europeans) ability of Americans to sit through hours of American Football. :D

What makes you think we understand it any better than you? It's GENETIC, dammit!

[kittynh]

Hey, don't even think about the amount of beer it takes to sit through a Green Bay Packer game in GreenBay!
That and you get like an Eskimo and start eating brats which roughly have the same fat content as whale blubber...
But, it's a great town, and they don't set it on fire when the Packers win...

[rockyroad]

Originally posted by Diezel

...

Oh hell, I will do it quickly. It is very common for Americans to consume beer while participating in atheletic activities. Often, it is very hot when doing this. Trying drinking a few pints of Guinness while playing softball in 95F weather! It isn't going to sit very well. But an ice cold American beer goes down just right.

Canadians do the same, but it isn't usually as hot. So there beer, while being close to an American style, has taken a little heavier approach.

Europeans are accustomed to drinking their beer after their sporting events, so thirst quinching isn't the top priority. And they can get much heavier, because they don't have to worry about a heavy stomach while they are participating. ... :D

Oh - this is very good - it really does make intuitive sense (although it does suffer from huge generalizations applied to large countries - parts of Canada, such as the Toronto/southern Ontario region, are notorious for having sweltering hot/humid summers, much more so than large parts of the U.S. - the "Pacific Northwest" for example). But given that - I think there is definite merit here. You might consider however that Canadian beer simply evolved as a compromise in between the darker/heavier British tradition and the lighter U.S. beers - it is so representative of Canada in so many other aspects after all.

I agree with the poll results - microbrewery beer is superior in general. But surely you really have to separate the microbreweries, which hands down tend to make superior brews (especially in the U.S. and Canada I'd say from my experience), from the mass-produced swill.

[Bruce]

If you're ever in Columbia, Missouri, stop by the Flat Branch and try an Oil Change Stout. It's the best beer ever. Makes Guiness taste like.... well, like an oil change.

[KillerX]

There seems to be a lot of ignorance in the world when it comes to beer. There are 2 main classes of beer which are traditionally determined by technique. Ale is one, which is normally brewed with top fermenting yeast at temperatures ranging from 60F-70F. Being brewed at these higher temperatures, the resulting beer tends to have more aromatic and volatile compounds. Lager, which in German means "to store", is traditionally brewed using bottom fermenting yeast at temperatures ranging initially from 40F to 50F for the first week, then it is stored at below 40F for up to 3 months. There is obviously more to brewing than this simplistic explaination but it will have to do for now.

Now, as for the people who say that lager is horse piss, cat pee or any other urinic reference obviously knows nothing about beer. Just a few styles of lager to demonstrate:
Pilsner, Oktoberfest, Bock (no, it is not the scrapings of the bottoms of fermentation barrels), the Munichs; Helles and Dunkel, Schwarzbier and Rauchbier. These few styles demonstrate that lager beer comes in the full spectrum and not just the "American Standard" which has become synonymous with the word lager.

The theory was raised earlier of why American beer is the way it is compared to the rest of the world, simple answer, prohibition, WWII and women. Before prohibition there were literally thousands of breweries in the US, but most had to shut down during prohibition because they couldn't make enough money doing non-brewery things. Prohibition ended and only the larger brewers remained so they wanted to get as much of the market as they could and the easiest way to do that is to market the least offensive thing possible. WWII started and many of the working men who drank this less offensive beer were sent off to war so the brewers lost a large part of their market. Women entered the work force in a larger proportion so who better to target the marketing at? Beer was made less flavorful to appeal to the supposed more delicate tastes of women. So now we are at the point in history where women hate beer because it has no flavor and they have their own stereotype to blame. :p

[efrex]

Oh, sure, start an IMPORTANT thread while I'm away for the weekend! :D

Love the fact that we've got so many Sam Smith's fans in the house... this really *is* an intelligent bunch! I'm personally more fond of the Imperial Stout than the Oatmeal Stout (I like my beer with body, but not so much that I haveta chew it), but both are wonderful stuff.

And, IIRC, Neal Stephenson mentioned a double-blind beer test in one of his books (Zodiac?): "by the time we were finished, we were both blind." :D

I drink the following lagers and in in their ice format when applicable Fosters, Castlemaine, Nastro, Becks, San migel, Guiness, much prefer to drink vodka, brandy or wine.
Then I am a female.

P_I:D

[Ove]

KillerX: Nice explanation. I think you are spot on. Unfortunately American tastebuds have degenerated (probably because of KFC hot wings and mexican food). As a result a lot of americans seems to think Budweiser is beer, which it off course isn't, it's waste disposal. ;)

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by Ove
KillerX: Nice explanation. I think you are spot on. Unfortunately American tastebuds have degenerated (probably because of KFC hot wings and mexican food). As a result a lot of americans seems to think Budweiser is beer, which it off course isn't, it's waste disposal. ;)

Now wait just one moment...

American tastebuds have NOT degenerated due to Mexican food. (See the "I wanted a taco last night" thread). KFC, maybe. (KFC should not be considered food, or for that matter, edible...)

TRUE Mexican food is, indeed, spicy, but not at the expense of flavor, and a good quality beer only enhances the experience. If you haven't tried the real deal, that, my friend, is YOUR fault. You may need to shop around to find a place that serves the good stuff, but it is out there, even in Europe. (Found a great Mexican restaurant in London, England, back in '76. Hope it's still there...)

On the other hand, if what you call "Mexican Food" is what you've sampled at Taco Bell, then, Amigo, you DESERVED WHAT YOU GOT!

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by Passionate_Iniquity
I drink the following lagers and in in their ice format when applicable Fosters, Castlemaine, Nastro, Becks, San migel, Guiness, much prefer to drink vodka, brandy or wine.
Then I am a female.

P_I:D

But the real question is: "Are you a PASSIONATE female?":D

[a_unique_person]

how about a six pack of genuine duff beer (http://www.lardlad.com/assets/articles/article12.html)

My brother has an unopened six pack he bought years ago.

[Ove]

On the other hand, if what you call "Mexican Food" is what you've sampled at Taco Bell, then, Amigo, you DESERVED WHAT YOU GOT!

You know, we don't have any Taco Bell's over here (luckily). My remarks was directed at Junk food in general and much to spicy food.

I do realize that it is more the Brit's that prefer much too spicy food but well then they can turn down the central heating when they get home from their "Curry".

Oh hell, I will do it quickly. It is very common for Americans to consume beer while participating in atheletic activities. Often, it is very hot when doing this. Trying drinking a few pints of Guinness while playing softball in 95F weather! It isn't going to sit very well. But an ice cold American beer goes down just right.

Which just goes to show how close to water(which is what sensible people drink while participating in athletic activities) American beer is. If you take this argument as a recommendation of american beer i can see why you got a problem.;)

[Diezel]

Originally posted by Ove
Which just goes to show how close to water(which is what sensible people drink while participating in athletic activities) American beer is. If you take this argument as a recommendation of american beer i can see why you got a problem.;)

Next time you're in the States, I will invite you to a good game of "beer baseball". It wouldn't be as fun if you were drinking water! :D

(for those that have never played, there is a keg at every base and you must chug a glass of beer before you bat and before you pass every base. It gets interesting around the third inning. I believe there was an episode of the "Drew Carey Show" that highlighted a game :))

Well I like fizzy German stuff, but I thought I might mention what my local brew was called, this being the JREF.

http://www.harveys.org.uk/images/tompaineandglass.jpg

Thomas Paine, before helping to draft the American constitution and writing 'The Rights of Man', was a customs and excise officer in Lewes, which is about 5 miles away from me. Interesting place, Lewes - 17 protestants were burned at the stake there in 1555 and ever since then, every year they march through the streets with 'No Popery' banners and blow up effigies of his Holiness, and whoever else is a popular hate-figure. Last year it was George W. with a nuke through his head and maggots crawling out of his mouth. Delightful!

:D

[Mark]

Last year it was George W. with a nuke through his head and maggots crawling out of his mouth. Delightful!

Ah, the English! The shining examples of civilized behavior. :D

[efrex]

Originally posted by Mark
Last year it was George W. with a nuke through his head and maggots crawling out of his mouth. Delightful!

Ah, the English! The shining examples of civilized behavior. :D

Of course, that would be "civilised behaviour" (durned cretins can't even spell their OWN language right) :)

[Mark]

Of course, that would be "civilised behaviour" (durned cretins can't even spell their OWN language right)

That's "Mr." Cretin to you.

http://kevan.org/blog/blogpics/george.jpg

http://www.thisisbrightonandhove.co.uk/brighton__hove/news_features/lewes_fireworks/images/10.jpg

and back in 2001......

http://www.janeandrichard.co.uk/photos/bonfire_2001/img/regularimg_0828_640.jpg

[Mark]

Well, I gotta admit, they're pretty funny.

[Roadtoad]

Reminds me of Fasching in Wuerzburg, Germany, seeing effigies of certain members of the Bundestag depicted as string puppets of either Nato or Ronald Reagan. Pretty wild, Elephant.

Around these parts, though, the big doings is the annual Jazz Festival in Old Sacramento. Great excuse to get loaded and listen to some damn good Jazz! Care to stop in around Memorial Day? (Last Monday in May...)

[Kimpatsu]

I want to vote on the poll, but where's the list of beers? All I see is a list of lagers. Where's the Director's, Spitfire, Winter Warmer, Wobbly, Dogbolter, Shepherd Neame, IPA, or Guinness? :cool:

[Ove]

(for those that have never played, there is a keg at every base and you must chug a glass of beer before you bat and before you pass every base. It gets interesting around the third inning. I believe there was an episode of the "Drew Carey Show" that highlighted a game )


Chicken!!!!!:rolleyes: We do that(rounders) with Schnapps, now THAT gets interesting. ;)

[The Whether Man]

The best beer I have tasted, or at least the beer that stays in my memory the best, is Young's Double Chocolate Stout. The combination of beer and chocolate is amazingly luxurious.

Otherwise my tipples are Speight's (Gold or Old Dark) or McCashins. As an ex-home-brewer, I prefer to keep my beers as close to unadulterated as I can, without having to spend vast quantities on imported beers.

For those of you that don't recognise the brands, they are New Zealand beers. So is Duff's (http://www.brewing.co.nz/south_island/duffs.htm), for that matter. However, due to a threat of a lawsuit from Groening's lawyers, they were forced to change their name to McDuff's (http://www.realbeer.com/news/articles/news-001628.html). Colonial upstarts throwing their weight around again.:)

[Kimpatsu]

Now you're making me thirsty. I may just have to go get a glass of something tonight. :p

[Roadtoad]

Okay, gang, I admit it. I should have posted a far different poll than I did. I left out the great stuff.

Perhaps we should try this again. If you'll PM me what you think we should include on the poll, we'll rewrite and see if we can get this right. (Geez, what was I thinking? How could I have left off Stout, and Porter? Please, someone smack me a couple of times with a large trout...!)

Originally posted by Roadtoad
Okay, gang, I admit it. I should have posted a far different poll than I did. I left out the great stuff.

Perhaps we should try this again. If you'll PM me what you think we should include on the poll, we'll rewrite and see if we can get this right. (Geez, what was I thinking? How could I have left off Stout, and Porter? Please, someone smack me a couple of times with a large trout...!)

Roadtoad,

Another consideration or two:
- Do you want to stick with categories (stout, lager, porter, etc.) or narrow it down to specific beers (e.g., Sam Smith Oatmeal Stout or Sam Adams Double Bock)? The current poll mixes the two

- Having raised that question, what is the limit on poll choices?

Cheers,

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by BillHoyt


Roadtoad,

Another consideration or two:
- Do you want to stick with categories (stout, lager, porter, etc.) or narrow it down to specific beers (e.g., Sam Smith Oatmeal Stout or Sam Adams Double Bock)? The current poll mixes the two

- Having raised that question, what is the limit on poll choices?

Cheers,

We're limited to ten choices. (I know, I know, a horrid limitation of the subject at hand...)

To tell the truth, I'm not sure... Any ideas, Bill?

Originally posted by Roadtoad


We're limited to ten choices. (I know, I know, a horrid limitation of the subject at hand...)

To tell the truth, I'm not sure... Any ideas, Bill?

Perhaps take Hal's approach and ask for nominations on this thread. Set a closing date & time for nominations. After the close, tally up the top 10 mentions, and build the poll from them.

Cheers,

[Roadtoad]

Originally posted by BillHoyt


Perhaps take Hal's approach and ask for nominations on this thread. Set a closing date & time for nominations. After the close, tally up the top 10 mentions, and build the poll from them.

Cheers,

Perfect idea! We'll close nominations for each category on February 1st, at Midnight GMT. We'll take it from there!

Thanks, Bill! That's a great idea!

Originally posted by Roadtoad
We'll close nominations for each category on February 1st, at Midnight GMT. We'll take it from there!

*bump*

Well, it is getting a bit close to beer-thirty on a Friday, so I'll bump the thread and put in some nominations, in no particular order:

Hardcore Black Cider (yeah, I know, it's a cider.)
Sam Smith's Oatmeal Stout
Blue Moon Pumpkin Ale
Sam Adams Double Bock

Cheers,

[KillerX]

Here are some more nominations in alphabetical order:
Old Peculier.
SkullSplitter.
Young's Old Nick.

[BrotherBluto]

I have to say that the best beer I've tasted yet is made by a good friend of mine. He makes all varieties, from cream ales to an Imperial Stout that you could seal your driveway with. I've always thought of myself as a bit of a beer snob (I know the Europeans here might find that laughable given that I'm an American) and my friend's brew puts just about anything you can get in a bottle or out of a tap to shame in my opinion.

Last summer he provided his beer at another friend's wedding reception, as a form of a wedding gift. In order to prevent people from shying away from a home brew, he made up a fake "menu" of beers under a fictional brewery name. He's seriously considering going into business full time making beer, so if you ever see a keg of "Flatlands Brewing Company" be sure to have a pint.

When I can't get a pint (a proper one, he has the glasses) I'll stick to the following:

Bass
Harp
Guinness
Chimay
Sam Adams
Magic Hat #9 (love the stuff)

There's a microbrew in Easton, PA called Weyerbacher that's damn good as well, but hard to get a hold of outside of eastern Pennsylvania.

When I didn't have any money to be a beer snob, I used to suffice on things like Schmidts and Golden Anniversary (*shudder*)

[Patricio Elicer]

I didn't vote because my favorite beers aren't on the option list. I'm surprised that no one, except Ove, mentioned the Belgian beers. There are literally hundreds of different beer varieties from Belgium. I've tasted a dozen of them, especially the strong "fermented in bottle" ones (10% alc). I haven't tried any other, from any other country, that are better IMO.

The fermented in bottle feature gives the Belgians a unique champagne-like flavour.

This is one of my favorites (10% alcohol)

[rockyroad]

at the very least I think you should take local microbreweries and perhaps beers only locally available off the poll. It really is comparing apples and oranges. The local microbreweries tend to brew relatively small batches and for relatively quick consumption - the chemistry involved is just plain different. Not surprisingly, they've captured >50% on your current poll - but it just isn't the same type of beer.

[xouper]

bump

[Zep]

Oh yeah! This is DEFINITELY PC!

Hahn Light Beer, Australia (http://us.share.geocities.com/trevorgensch/hahnbeer.mpg)

[wildflower1]

Wexford Irish Cream Ale - my favorite "comfort beer."

[Roadtoad]

In addition to being a bump, I thought I'd mention that I've found a great beer.

I'd never heard of Arrogant Bastard Ale, (http://www.arrogantbastard.com) but I've got to admit, it was some pretty kick@$$ brew. Anyone else try it?

[Sloe_Bohemian]

Originally posted by KillerX


The theory was raised earlier of why American beer is the way it is compared to the rest of the world, simple answer, prohibition, WWII and women. Before prohibition there were literally thousands of breweries in the US, but most had to shut down during prohibition because they couldn't make enough money doing non-brewery things. Prohibition ended and only the larger brewers remained so they wanted to get as much of the market as they could and the easiest way to do that is to market the least offensive thing possible. WWII started and many of the working men who drank this less offensive beer were sent off to war so the brewers lost a large part of their market. Women entered the work force in a larger proportion so who better to target the marketing at? Beer was made less flavorful to appeal to the supposed more delicate tastes of women. So now we are at the point in history where women hate beer because it has no flavor and they have their own stereotype to blame. :p

My history teacher (Bartender Dave on College Street at Pour Richard's) gave me a slightly different version of events. All due respect to Rosie the Riveter... I think you're giving too much credit to WW2. The damage was done by then and although many women entered the workplace, they weren't drinking there... and with a lack of men about, they weren't pushing the boundaries of accepted behavior... they were conforming to it so that they could prove they were a better catch than Janice next door.

I was instructed that the changes occured earlier.
Prior to prohibition, women were never to be found in bars. And the women's movement was a major force in enacting prohibition (it was thought that domestic abuse would drop... it did, but arguing the effects of prohibition is a whole new topic). During prohibition, speakeasys came to be in vogue and since the entire scene was anti-establishmentarialist (fancy, eh?), common social rules about women were also ignored. And the same men who provided illegal booze were the kind of men who liked to encourage men to find women. And having women around made men come around, etc. The sudden access to personal transportation (automobiles were new and suddenly common) and other such factors made "going out" to a place that served alcohol a whole lot easier and more acceptable.

So when prohibition was lifted and the few remaining breweries swooped in to dominate a country that use to have a rich history of local breweries... they looked for that all powerful lowest common denominator. And that denominator included women as customers. Whether true or not, (they didn't employ modern market tests) it was believed that women would only drink beer if it was watered down in the fashion we've all come to know and loathe in the U.S.

Same social and economic factors worked on cigarrettes and cigars. Men smoked cigars and women smoked cigarettes (hence the feminine -ette at the end). Any decent tobacco baron might reason that he can charge more for a cigar. But some analysts saw women as the largest rising market in tobacco and advised accordingly. Plus... why collect 5centes a cigar if you can get someone to pay 25cents for a pack of girly smokes, that only have as much tobacco as 3 cigars anyway... more money for less of your product. *I made up the numbers of course. But you see what I'm saying.

[marting]

Wasatch, a Utah* beer with a rather unique, slightly ashy flavor.

Fat Tyre, hard to get outside of Colorado. Delicious wtih food.

Hemp Ale, Humboldt Brewing. Good ETOH content, Rumored to have been served to the press on Air Force One when Bill was flying.

*I know, I know.

marty

[UnrepentantSinner]

I drink to get drunk, so I go as cheap as possible.

http://planetsocksinteractive.com/dcforum/User_files/40b4a8c375c2568f.jpg

[Ove]

Sloe_Bohemian : I think the reason are much more simple : Market forces. We see it over here too. The large breweries, Heineken-Corrs over there, Carlsberg-Tuborg over here, are trying desperately to make a product that is acceptable to as many people as possible. That means it shold taste as neutral as possible : BUD!!!!! And it is understandable, they want to sell as much as possible and they DO.
Fortunately a lot of peolpe are discovering the joys of good beer theese days but sometimes it is an uphill struggle. The large breweries over here also provides equipment for pub's, and when they install it the pub owner usually gets a discount but only if he keeps other brands out of his pub .
These mafiastyle business methods are fortunately being investigated and will probably be outlawed soon but they have led to the state where most draught beer available in Denmark at pub's are from "United Breveries" (Carlsberg/Tuborg).:mad:

[Prester John]

Cider!

[Larspeart]

I prefer other options then are on the list. Sorry. I couldn't vote, as you had no Planet X option, and no 'other' option.

[Larspeart]

Originally posted by Houngan
Man, you left out all of England and Belgium. Sam Smith rocks the house, as does Fuller's. How come my choice is never on these polls?

H.


He also left out Canadian beers as well. The big jerk.

[Frostbite]

I got smashed on la Fin du Monde on saturday. If you haven't had it, stop whatever it is you're doing right now and go buy yourself a bottle.

http://satwww.epfl.ch/bar/bieres/bouteilles/images/fin_du_monde.gif

[heath]

I went for "Australian mate"

Back in the best part of aus (i.e. the Western part) there's a very nice little brewery, Little Creatures (http://www.littlecreatures.com.au/) that do some really nice ales. They're now selling around australia and hopefully in the UK soon.

Next on my list would be Coopers sparkling ale (http://www.beeradvocate.com/beer/rate_results/491/2128) - a very nice and slightly odd beer. A bit of a fruity/wheaty type flavour that's hard to explain but is good from the bottle and superb from the tap.

Sadly living in the UK now I'm deprived of the home ales (don't miss the "bitter" lagers much - well when it's sunny but that' not often here) but do get to drink the nifty English beers regularly.

I'm also an absolute convert to the dark lady, Guinness. After some traveling in Ireland and tasting it as Ed intended there is no turning back. The stuff they sell in Aus, mainland europe, asia and I assume the US is a poor, poor substitute for the bitter silk/cream you get on tap in Ireland.

I'd heard it before but never believed it... but now having experienced it I can say

the closer you get to Dublin the better the Guinness tastes

To steal another beers tag: True. :D

[Oleron]

Bishops Finger from the Shepherd Neame brewery in Kent.
(Spitfire is great too)

Oh, and Guinness - obviously.



Shepherd Neame (http://www.shepherd-neame.co.uk/index.html)

[Hardenbergh]

I'm not an expert on beer but I think the microbrews are a good choice. There's a good one in Maine called Sheepscot Valley Pemaquid Ale. I don't like Sam Adams.

[Dragon]

A short list of some of my favourite British breweries with their beers -

Youngs (http://www.youngs.co.uk/) - Special and Winter Warmer - plus loads of others including "Waggledance" bottled beer (with honey!).

Marston's - Pedigree

Felinfoel (http://www.felinfoel-brewery.com/) - Bitter and Double Dragon

Brains (http://www.sabrain.com/informed.asp) - S.A.

plus the Shepherd Neame stuff that Oleron mentioned.

The Czechs make the best lager beers - didn't they invent it at Pils, hence Pilsner?
My favourite is Budvar Budweiser - many, many times better than the American stuff of the same name (The best thing about which was those ads with the lizards).
Though I don't object to cold Kronenbourg 1664, Stella Artois or Becks on a hot day. Oh and Tiger beer with curry!

[wollery]

Good beers;

Cains bitter, a classic.
Spitfire.
Bishops Finger.
Worthington White Shield. mmmmmmm!
Guinness or Murphys.
Newcastle Brown Ale. (americans please note - Newcastle is all one word!)
Waggledance. (thanks for reminding me Dragon)
Boddingtons is pretty good as far as mass produced bitters go. "'ey Tarquel, are your trolleys on t'right way round?" (the brits will get it!)

British and US lagers are for people with no tastebuds.

Cider is okay, although I wouldn't drink it by choice, unless it's from Normandy and I've gone there to get it!

[aerosolben]

Mmmm....beer.

A number of my favorites have been mentioned already. I'll throw out one I haven't seen:

Middle Ages Brewery

located somewhere in Massachusetts, I believe. I enjoyed their Grail Ale, Highlander and Beast Bitter very much. Their Dragonslayer comes highly recommended, but I haven't been able to find it in my area.