Just how disastrous has Obama's economic management been? VERY.

[Rockingham, AH Deist]

Obama supporters like to blame Bush for the recession. Fair enough, then let us judge him by his "recovery" instead. Below is the GDP growth under each President during economic recovery, sourced from: http://www.americanthinker.com/2010/11/truth_and_science_and_facts_vs.html

Real GDP Growth After 5 Quarters (%):

Truman: 14.8%
Ike Term 1: 19.3%
Ike Term 2: 9.4%
JFK: 8.7%
Nixon: 6.3%
Ford: 7.0%
Carter: 3.1%
Reagan: 9.8%
BushSr: 3.7%
BushJr: 2.3%
Obama: 3.5%

Only one recession recovery even slower than his: George W. Bush's. And we know how President Obama is so hesitant to blame anything on his predecessor.

But I have a few things to say about that particular comparison.

-9/11..
-The 2001 "recession" was not even a recession by many criteria. (The real GDP in that recession was higher at the so-called "trough," or end of the recession, per the NBER, than at its beginning peak.)
-Once Republicans controlled both the House and the Senate in 2003, the final Bush tax cuts were passed. They were signed into law in May 2003, or eighteen months into the recovery. Jobs started increasing that August. In the four years after those tax cuts, virtually all under Republican Congresses and budgets, 7.8 million net new jobs were created. Not just saved, but created. Net.
-You go ahead, Mr. President, and tell us that you have found one post-war recovery even slower than yours in job growth: George W. Bush's.


Hope and change.

[C_Felix]

I'm not (necessarily) an Obama supporter, but, how long does it take for policies to truly affect (effect?) the economy?

I always heard that 4 years was the accepted standard.

Look at the down turn in the late 80's?
That'll be the result of Regeanomics...

Clinton didn't do anything to deserve the good economy he had. He was in the right place at the right time, riding the dot-com bubble.

[TragicMonkey]

What exactly are the specific powers and controls a president has over the economy? Doesn't everything have to go through Congress?

[Aepervius]

What exactly are the specific powers and controls a president has over the economy? Doesn't everything have to go through Congress?

He could declare a war as chief of the army, and make the military complex get money & jobs through that way.

Just kidding :).

As far as I can tell economic bills are voted by congress, and the US president only can propose a draft, nothing else. Maybe I am misled ?

[timhau]

What exactly are the specific powers and controls a president has over the economy?

There's the Presidential Economy Lever. If you turn it to 10, it's boom time. If you crank it up to 11, an economic bubble results. Bush accidentally bumped it to zero before leaving office, and Obama hasn't figured it out at all yet.

[TragicMonkey]

There's the Presidential Economy Lever. If you turn it to 10, it's boom time. If you crank it up to 11, an economic bubble results. Bush accidentally bumped it to zero before leaving office, and Obama hasn't figured it out at all yet.

Maybe each president gets a certain allotment of President Power Points, and Obama's put too many of his in "Destroy America Through Socialist Evil" and doesn't have enough for "Economy Boosting". He should re-spec into the Economy tree. Bush put his points in War tree, but had the sense to allot one point to Pretzel Defense, which came in handy once.

[lomiller]

Obama supporters like to blame Bush for the recession. Fair enough, then let us judge him by his "recovery" instead.

Why would you talk about recovery in isolation of what you are recovering from? If someone was recovering from a cold, would it be fair for them to tell someone revering from cancer that their doctor must be terrible because it’s taking so long?

[drkitten]

Why would you talk about recovery in isolation of what you are recovering from?

Because there are not very many rational criticisms of Obama that one can make. Especially if you're a card-carrying conservative, since that means you can't display rationality on any subject whatsoever.

So if you feel some need to display the twisting, writhing, mass of racist hatred that is your soul, you have to find irrational criticisms of him.

Or simply tell lies. That works, too.

We've seen the opening poster try both techniques.

[The_Animus]

If it takes me 10 minutes to blow up a building, can you rebuild it in 5?

[blutoski]

Because there are not very many rational criticisms of Obama that one can make. Especially if you're a card-carrying conservative, since that means you can't display rationality on any subject whatsoever.

John Rogers' post from 2004 still cracks me up: ["I Miss Republicans" (http://kfmonkey.blogspot.com/2004/12/i-miss-republicans.html)]

[Juniversal]

If it takes me 10 minutes to blow up a building, can you rebuild it in 5?In the OP's world? Yes. ;)

[Juniversal]

Obama supporters like to blame Bush for the recession. Fair enough, then let us judge him by his "recovery" instead. Below is the GDP growth under each President during economic recovery, sourced from: http://www.americanthinker.com/2010/11/truth_and_science_and_facts_vs.html

Real GDP Growth After 5 Quarters (%):

Truman: 14.8%
Ike Term 1: 19.3%
Ike Term 2: 9.4%
JFK: 8.7%
Nixon: 6.3%
Ford: 7.0%
Carter: 3.1%
Reagan: 9.8%
BushSr: 3.7%
BushJr: 2.3%
Obama: 3.5%

Only one recession recovery even slower than his: George W. Bush's. And we know how President Obama is so hesitant to blame anything on his predecessor.

But I have a few things to say about that particular comparison.

-9/11..
-The 2001 "recession" was not even a recession by many criteria. (The real GDP in that recession was higher at the so-called "trough," or end of the recession, per the NBER, than at its beginning peak.)
-Once Republicans controlled both the House and the Senate in 2003, the final Bush tax cuts were passed. They were signed into law in May 2003, or eighteen months into the recovery. Jobs started increasing that August. In the four years after those tax cuts, virtually all under Republican Congresses and budgets, 7.8 million net new jobs were created. Not just saved, but created. Net.
-You go ahead, Mr. President, and tell us that you have found one post-war recovery even slower than yours in job growth: George W. Bush's.


Hope and change.The only thing you could possibly hold Obama in contempt for is increasing the deficit because it's certainly not any fault of his or lack of utility of his economic policies that the economy hasn't rebounded quickly.

I really don't know if there was much he could have done differently to cause the economy to turn around faster besides passing a stimulus that was even BIGGER then the one passed to jump start the economy. You wouldn't like that now would you? :p

[Dorian Gray]

Obama supporters like to blame Bush for the recession. Fair enough, then let us judge him by his "recovery" instead. Below is the GDP growth under each President during economic recovery, sourced from: http://www.americanthinker.com/2010/11/truth_and_science_and_facts_vs.html

Real GDP Growth After 5 Quarters (%):

Truman: 14.8%
Ike Term 1: 19.3%
Ike Term 2: 9.4%
JFK: 8.7%
Nixon: 6.3%
Ford: 7.0%
Carter: 3.1%
Reagan: 9.8%
BushSr: 3.7%
BushJr: 2.3%
Obama: 3.5%

Only one recession recovery even slower than his: George W. Bush's. And we know how President Obama is so hesitant to blame anything on his predecessor.

But I have a few things to say about that particular comparison.

-9/11..
-The 2001 "recession" was not even a recession by many criteria. (The real GDP in that recession was higher at the so-called "trough," or end of the recession, per the NBER, than at its beginning peak.)
-Once Republicans controlled both the House and the Senate in 2003, the final Bush tax cuts were passed. They were signed into law in May 2003, or eighteen months into the recovery. Jobs started increasing that August. In the four years after those tax cuts, virtually all under Republican Congresses and budgets, 7.8 million net new jobs were created. Not just saved, but created. Net.
-You go ahead, Mr. President, and tell us that you have found one post-war recovery even slower than yours in job growth: George W. Bush's.


Hope and change. Is there some nonbiased reason you left Clinton off the list?

[theprestige]

Is there some nonbiased reason you left Clinton off the list?

Now I'm curious: Can you imagine any biased reason for leaving Clinton off the list?

[The Don]

If it takes me 10 minutes to blow up a building, can you rebuild it in 5?

I KNEW 9/11 was a inside job, and here's proof

[Rockingham, AH Deist]

What exactly are the specific powers and controls a president has over the economy? Doesn't everything have to go through Congress?
Democratic policies, Obama policies, liberal policies, whatever.

I'm not (necessarily) an Obama supporter, but, how long does it take for policies to truly affect (effect?) the economy?

I always heard that 4 years was the accepted standard.

Yes. But the current economy is recovering more slowly then under prior presidents.

Why would you talk about recovery in isolation of what you are recovering from? If someone was recovering from a cold, would it be fair for them to tell someone revering from cancer that their doctor must be terrible because it’s taking so long?
Reagan inherited a comparably difficult situation. He outperformed Obama magnificently. Hell, even Carter outperformed Obama.

Because there are not very many rational criticisms of Obama that one can make. Especially if you're a card-carrying conservative, since that means you can't display rationality on any subject whatsoever.

Shut up Obama. How pathetic that the president of the United States is stalking and trolling me on JREF. Go back to Kenya, boy.

If it takes me 10 minutes to blow up a building, can you rebuild it in 5?
Reagan and every other president rebuilt it faster then Obama has.

The only thing you could possibly hold Obama in contempt for is increasing the deficit because it's certainly not any fault of his or lack of utility of his economic policies that the economy hasn't rebounded quickly.

I really don't know if there was much he could have done differently to cause the economy to turn around faster besides passing a stimulus that was even BIGGER then the one passed to jump start the economy. You wouldn't like that now would you? :p
Why not try what Reagan did?

Is there some nonbiased reason you left Clinton off the list?
No recession in Clinton's term, due to the undeserved luck of riding the dot-com bubble.

[tyr_13]

Democratic policies, Obama policies, liberal policies, whatever.

Of course, they're all the enemy, why care to accurately identify them?


Yes. But the current economy is recovering more slowly then under prior presidents.


Reagan inherited a comparably difficult situation. He outperformed Obama magnificently. Hell, even Carter outperformed Obama.

Well if you're going to discredit your line of reasoning yourself it takes all the fun out of it for us. Meany head.


Shut up Obama. How pathetic that the president of the United States is stalking and trolling me on JREF. Go back to Kenya, boy.

Telling other posters to 'shut up' and calling our President 'boy'. Yeah, I predict a fantastic career here at JREF.


Reagan and every other president rebuilt it faster then Obama has.


Why not try what Reagan did?

Well to quote someone recently...
"Reagan inherited a comparably difficult situation."

And besides, Reaganomics? Really suggesting it?


No recession in Clinton's term, due to the undeserved luck of riding the dot-com bubble.

So we can stop crediting the Republican Congress too then right? Right? No?

[daenku32]

LOL. Comparable. Two wars, structured deficits, economy that was shelling jobs..

Yeah, comparable.

And still the Reaganites cannot actually produce an economic theory.

[patchbunny]

Shut up Obama. How pathetic that the president of the United States is stalking and trolling me on JREF. Go back to Kenya, boy.

Back to Kenya? You, um, aren't implying that Obama is from Kenya, are you?

[headscratcher4]

"Why not try what Reagan did?" You mean raise taxes? Hmmm, I thought that was a GOP non-starter.

Also, not that being fair matters here, the recession Reagan "inherited" and which got worse during his first year, was of a drmatically different sort. For example, it didn't involve the near collapse of the financial markets...as most economists recognize, what happened in 2007 and 2008, was as close to the great depression as we've been since the 1930s.

[headscratcher4]

Just to add into the conversation....

Unemployment claims fall to lowest level since Lehman collapse:

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2010/11/10/business/business-us-usa-economy.html?_r=2&hp

GM posts biggest profit in 11 years ahead of IPO (which will pay the country back):

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/11/business/11auto.html?ref=business

[Rockingham, AH Deist]

Of course, they're all the enemy, why care to accurately identify them?

I'm sorry, it's just that I assumed that Obama was responsible for absolutely everything his side did just as Caesar Bush was.

Well if you're going to discredit your line of reasoning yourself it takes all the fun out of it for us. Meany head.

At least I have a head, which you won't when El Presidente Palin decapitates you commie bitches.

Which is why I'm practicing discrediting myself-pretty soon you won't be around to discredit me.

Telling other posters to 'shut up' and calling our President 'boy'. Yeah, I predict a fantastic career here at JREF.
What the hell Barack Obama? You have two accounts with which to stalk me on JREF?:confused:

Thats what you get from a Kenyan Nazi Hippy Commie Muslim-Jew.


Well to quote someone recently...
"Reagan inherited a comparably difficult situation."

And besides, Reaganomics? Really suggesting it?

No I prefer Hitlernomics, being a White Nationalist like all tea partiers.


So we can stop crediting the Republican Congress too then right? Right? No?
Nope. God is on my side and he determines reality. Ergo I am by definition right and consistent.


Back to Kenya? You, um, aren't implying that Obama is from Kenya, are you?
Show me his birth certificate, or I'm right. Heil Hitler!

[Rockingham, AH Deist]

Just to add into the conversation....

Unemployment claims fall to lowest level since Lehman collapse:

http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2010/11/10/business/business-us-usa-economy.html?_r=2&hp

GM posts biggest profit in 11 years ahead of IPO (which will pay the country back):

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/11/business/11auto.html?ref=business

LOL NY times? Why not the Communist Manifesto.

[lomiller]

Lol Poe’s law at work. I can’t tell if he is an idiot or just making fun of idiots.
Anyway the last time the US banking system was threatened with total collapse was the great depression. How quick is the current economic recovery in comparison to that? How we did Obama’s policies work relative to the “fiscal restraint/let it work itself out” approach attempted by Hover?
The US economy went into a deep recession *after* Reagan became president. Unemployment was just over 7% when he was inaugurated and didn’t drop below that for 5 more years despite the massive structural defects he was ringing up and declining global energy prices which were the main driver of difficult economic times in the late 70’s.
The recession itself was caused by the efforts of the fed to fight inflation and these efforts were successful and laid the groundwork for nearly 3 decades of prosperity, but that was the work of Carter appointee (And current Obama economic advisor) Paul Volker. Reagan did keep him in the position, so he gets credit for that.

[keale]

LOL NY times? Why not the Communist Manifesto.


Oh we got another live one here. Please identify who the communists are and why?

[tyr_13]

I'm sorry, it's just that I assumed that Obama was responsible for absolutely everything his side did just as Caesar Bush was.


At least I have a head, which you won't when El Presidente Palin decapitates you commie bitches.

Which is why I'm practicing discrediting myself-pretty soon you won't be around to discredit me.


What the hell Barack Obama? You have two accounts with which to stalk me on JREF?:confused:

Thats what you get from a Kenyan Nazi Hippy Commie Muslim-Jew.



No I prefer Hitlernomics, being a White Nationalist like all tea partiers.


Nope. God is on my side and he determines reality. Ergo I am by definition right and consistent.



Show me his birth certificate, or I'm right. Heil Hitler!

Ah. Poe's law. Sorry I missed it.

[Vorticity]

LOL NY times? Why not the Communist Manifesto.

http://forums.randi.org/imagehosting/45148a44f1ccaf2c.jpg

[Juniversal]

Shut up Obama. How pathetic that the president of the United States is stalking and trolling me on JREF. Go back to Kenya, boy.At least I have a head, which you won't when El Presidente Palin decapitates you commie bitches.Which is why I'm practicing discrediting myself-pretty soon you won't be around to discredit me.Thats what you get from a Kenyan Nazi Hippy Commie Muslim-Jew.No I prefer Hitlernomics, being a White Nationalist like all tea partiers.Nope. God is on my side and he determines reality. Ergo I am by definition right and consistent.Show me his birth certificate, or I'm right. Heil Hitler!

LOL NY times? Why not the Communist Manifesto.This has GOT to be satire. :confused: Greatest example of Poe i've seen in a while lol. I commend you for the sheer hilarity of your post Rockingham, AH Deist. :D

[Rockingham, AH Deist]

Lol Poe’s law at work. I can’t tell if he is an idiot or just making fun of idiots.
Edited for civility.
Anyway the last time the US banking system was threatened with total collapse was the great depression. How quick is the current economic recovery in comparison to that? How we did Obama’s policies work relative to the “fiscal restraint/let it work itself out” approach attempted by Hover?
The US economy went into a deep recession *after* Reagan became president. Unemployment was just over 7% when he was inaugurated and didn’t drop below that for 5 more years despite the massive structural defects he was ringing up and declining global energy prices which were the main driver of difficult economic times in the late 70’s. Nu uh, Hoover's problems were caused by the policies of Wilson, Reagan's by Carter, and Bush's by Clinton. No doubt Palin will soon have problems caused by Obama.


The recession itself was caused by the efforts of the fed to fight inflation and these efforts were successful and laid the groundwork for nearly 3 decades of prosperity, but that was the work of Carter appointee (And current Obama economic advisor) Paul Volker. Reagan did keep him in the position, so he gets credit for that.NO, the Fed always harms the economy. It needs to be ended. Paul Volker is just a stupid Jew that tried to take credit for Reagan's miracle.

Oh we got another live one here. Please identify who the communists are and why?
Anyone who disagrees with Jesus or Glenn Beck

Edited for civility.

[Juniversal]

You're just bundles of fun aren't ya? Your post still wreaks of Poe. :p

[Rockingham, AH Deist]

Moderator, how much is Obama paying you to censor me:mad:?

[The Don]

Nu uh, Hoover's problems were caused by the policies of Wilson, Reagan's by Carter, and Bush's by Clinton. No doubt Palin will soon have problems caused by Obama.
[/edit]

And yet amazingly, Obama's problems are all of his own making.

DonkeyBonnet, MuleChapeau

[timhau]

Moderator, how much is Obama paying you to censor me:mad:?

Not enough...

[Rockingham, AH Deist]

And yet amazingly, Obama's problems are all of his own making.

DonkeyBonnet, MuleChapeau
Some of his problems are of Clinton's making.
Not enough...
Ah hah! They admit it! This will, hopefully, be Obama's Watergate.

[The Don]

Some of his problems are of Clinton's making.

You parody yourself

Of course, that horrible, horrible legacy of the budget surplus that Clinton left his successor.

The eight years between Clinton's departure and Obama's arrival presumably had nothing to do with the situation Obama inherited

BurroBeret, NeddyTrilby

[Rockingham, AH Deist]

You parody yourself

Of course, that horrible, horrible legacy of the budget surplus that Clinton left his successor.

The eight years between Clinton's departure and Obama's arrival presumably had nothing to do with the situation Obama inherited

BurroBeret, NeddyTrilby
The only thing Clinton left behind was an undead Bin Laden, serious stunting of the economy between 1993 and 1995 that Gingrich rectified and Clinton had the nerve to take credit for, and Semen stains all over the Whitehouse carpet.

The budget surplus was based solely on a dot com boom that Clinton did nothing to create.

[TraneWreck]

undead Bin Laden

No wonder we've had such difficulty getting him.

[The Don]

The only thing Clinton left behind was an undead Bin Laden, serious stunting of the economy between 1993 and 1995 that Gingrich rectified and Clinton had the nerve to take credit for, and Semen stains all over the Whitehouse carpet.

....and Bush Jnr did such a great job of finding Bin Laden. I also presume you imagine 9/11 and the woeful response to Katrina are also Clinton and/or Obama's fault too.

Myopia is not a town in Illinois

The budget surplus was based solely on a dot com boom that Clinton did nothing to create.

But presumably the bursting of the tech bubble was.

[godless dave]

Because there are not very many rational criticisms of Obama that one can make.

Sure there are - but not about the economy.

[BobTheDonkey]

Sure there are - but not about the economy.

In all fairness, though, I think most (if not all) of the criticisms really boil down to "political naivete" or at least allowing the appearance of it.

[MarkCorrigan]

People, it's a troll, just poke fun at it like most people do.

Remember:

http://img593.imageshack.us/img593/3775/phpdlofd1am.jpg

[LordoftheLeftHand]

Truman: 14.8%
Ike Term 1: 19.3%
Ike Term 2: 9.4%
JFK: 8.7%
Nixon: 6.3%
Ford: 7.0%
Carter: 3.1%
Reagan: 9.8%
BushSr: 3.7%
BushJr: 2.3%
Obama: 3.5%

I knew when he omitted Clinton, this wouldn't end well :D.

[JonathanQuick]

The only thing you could possibly hold Obama in contempt for is increasing the deficit because it's certainly not any fault of his or lack of utility of his economic policies that the economy hasn't rebounded quickly.

Let's see, what did you hold Bush in contempt for?

1. "Stupid"

Let's apply your contempt standards to Obama:

"I've been to like 57 states, two more to go." - Obama the ignoramus

"Cinco de quatro" - Obama the imbecile

"I don't speak Austrian." - Obama the chimpanzee

(Bush was a "chimp", so Obama is a chimp. Don't even THINK about playing the usual Democrat Race Card)

2. "Shredding the Constitution" and "taking away our freedom"

Obama, Clinton, Reid, and Kerry to name but a few all voted for the Patriot Act, widely cited by Leftists as an indefensible attack on our liberties.

Meanwhile the TSA now engages in unreasonable search and seizure on a scope unprecedented in American history, and the left is silent as to Obama's culpability.

3. Obama has broken his word on waging wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.

4. Obama has broken his word where he promised not to sign bills with earmarks (9000 of them).

5. Obama has humiliated America with his incompetence, arrogance, stupidity, and bowing down before King Fahd of Saudi Arabia.

The list of Obama's incompetence is very long.