Neurochemical reaction or God's Hand?

[Flame]

http://www.psychjournal.com/interviews/Vol_3_03_Newberg_1.htm

I think this interview hits on several different interesting discussion topics, but the first one that really hits me is:

Do you think that meditation and/or religious practice (aside from being conned out of your money & time by the church) can actually be good for your physical well being?

There have been several studies done on the brain regarding 'near death experiences' and the effects that certain practices have on the body and brain.
Forgive me for only presenting one, after the school run I'll put up some others...

[joyrex]

Originally posted by Flame
Do you think that meditation and/or religious practice (aside from being conned out of your money & time by the church) can actually be good for your physical well being?Yes. And it doesn't have to be about money, I would guess most of the practices that are effective (taught for example at retreats) are quite simple and possible to learn without costly guidance.

I have some tendencies for anxiety which arises in a situation when I'm waiting for something, more so when I'm in company of other people; if I compel myself to be more aware of my breath, the anxiety goes away. I suppose this would count as an example how meditation-like practice is good for physical well being.

[Some Friggin Guy]

I think it's a little silly to lump meditation and prayer together unless we are talking about meditation in some mystical sense.

I, personally practice meditation daily. I do it as a form of stress management and as a way to control an anger problem I've had most of my life.

In that regard, meditation is a form of deep, yet conscious relaxation.

Since it is a way to relieve stress, I would think it probably helps (though it does not CURE) stress-related ailments.

I don't know if prayer would work in the same fashion, though the aspect of asking some higher power for assistance would do nothing.

[Flame]

Originally posted by Some Friggin Guy

*snip*
I don't know if prayer would work in the same fashion, though the aspect of asking some higher power for assistance would do nothing.

Well that (IM non-religious opinion) goes without saying -
What I'm wondering is does having the faith that the said prayer will be answered affect people in a positive way?

If you honestly and undeniably belive that a higher power is watching over you, then are you happier/more confident/ etc...?

Toni

[Some Friggin Guy]

Originally posted by Flame


Well that (IM non-religious opinion) goes without saying -
What I'm wondering is does having the faith that the said prayer will be answered affect people in a positive way?

If you honestly and undeniably belive that a higher power is watching over you, then are you happier/more confident/ etc...?

Toni


Interesting question. In my opinion, perhaps you would be happier and/or more confident than if you were unsure, but thought that there maybe one. I don't think that it would make you any happier or more confident than an agnostic or an atheist.

Bear in mind that this opinion comes from a strong atheist, so take it with a grain of salt.

[Chaos]

I suppose that prayer might have a placebo effect.

Also, since AFAIK excessive worrying is unhealthy, I guess that the certainty and peace of mind that faith and prayer might instill in you could have positive effects.

My recommendation as a complete amateur and apathetic atheist: Pray and believe if you like, but still take your medication.

[RandFan]

Originally posted by Flame
What I'm wondering is does having the faith that the said prayer will be answered affect people in a positive way? I can only give anecdotal evidence.

In my case absolutely. There were a number of times where I stood and looked into the abyss (ok, exaggeration for effect) and prayer helped me through it.

I remember one time when I woke up one night and stuck my head into my 2 year olds room to check on him. He was convulsing and vomiting and was turning blue. It scared the hell out of me. I called 911 and they rushed him to the hospital. While I was there I was crying and really upset. I prayed and a calm came over me and I was certain my son was going to be ok. At the time I believed it was god letting me know that he knew that my son was going to be ok.

I don't believe that anymore but at the time it did in fact comfort me believing that my prayer was going to be answered. Of course, had my child died that night then my conversion to agnosticism would likely have been accelerated.

[Wrath of the Swarm]

It's quite reasonable to group prayer and meditation when both use similar practices and techniques. The religious beliefs regarding them are irrelevant.

[hammegk]

Might we say prayer is the supplication end of a spectrum that has invitation at the other end? Both try to "get touched by" something outside the egotistical "self", but one emphasizes ego, the other suppresses it.

Prayer should at least crystalize some want and/or desire by verbalization and contemplation, and perhaps provide 'faith' that something can be achieved regarding the supplication. Then isn't the advice "higher power helps those who help themselves"?


What makes one 100% certain that "neurochemical reaction" is not another name for "god's hand"?

[Dancing David]

Originally posted by Flame


Well that (IM non-religious opinion) goes without saying -
What I'm wondering is does having the faith that the said prayer will be answered affect people in a positive way?

If you honestly and undeniably belive that a higher power is watching over you, then are you happier/more confident/ etc...?

Toni

Yeah , of course you are , it is called a pink cloud in the recovery from addictions field. The problem is that when something bad happens then you think that god is pissed at you...

[Flame]

Originally posted by Dancing David


Yeah , of course you are , it is called a pink cloud in the recovery from addictions field. The problem is that when something bad happens then you think that god is pissed at you...

Well, I understand the connection you are making, but I don't think it quite fits.

With drugs/alcohol, you experience any number of things caused by the body's reaction to the toxins in your system.
With faith/belief or meditation excercises you also (apparently) experience physical reactions which cause any number of different effects mentally and emotionally.

The difference is that drugs and alcohol are detrimental to the body itself in measured and proven ways.

Toni

[Dancing David]

Meditation:
comes in a variety of forms most of which involve a claming of the physical body, which is very useful (as Thich Naht Hanh say , stop, rest and heal).
It like prayer can also induce a sense of calmness if practised on a regular basis. I think that the main benefit of prayer is in learning mindfullnbess or doing only one thing at a time. It is also a useful tool for learning about thought ane emotions.

Prayer:
Comes in an even wider variety of forms from the 'dear daddy, help me please', to 'I am Thor the thunderer' variety. The benefits of prayer are many, and involve many of the same processes as meditation. But most sceptics would find that prayer does require a belief in a higher power to be beneficial. Although that HP can be loose and fast as a defintion.
The main benefit of prayer is that it is a more active process of exploration that meditation. It can be very beneficial to pray for something and NOT have the prayer answerede.