New VAWT [Archive] - Page 5

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 01:09 AM

So what do you do when it's a peak usage time and the wind isn't blowing?

It's advisable to have one's own battery bank for when the wind blows and when it doesn't.

Did you see how small the sweep area was? About 10 inches. And it wasn't that windy when i made the video this morning.

Did you think i had made an upright model as i suggested the other week or did you think i was lying as Adman and Dinwar have repeatedly accused me of?

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 01:25 AM

Allow me to science up some math for all you fine folks.

Baloney + pinwheel + troll / video = ???
(meat) + (spinning) + (internet)

What can I say, I'm just not optimistic.

Can't wait to see how he weasels out of it.

Hey I came up with the proof :)

Should I sit here and press the browser refresh button over and over until bedtime, then?

Wake up Wake up it's somehow happened.lol

I love the instantaneous speed changes...

Me too :)

I'm shocked and appalled. It only took 991 posts to pull that tooth.

Question: At first glance it appears you have invented a simultaneous solar-powered hotdog warmer/wind-powered hotdog cooler. Why that thing I just said?

Evidence? :boxedin:

That's the beginning of the evidence... highflyertoo never gave evidence, did he now ;)

They're not your threads and I'm sick of seeing you jerking these good people around for your own amusement and wasting a valuable online resource with your childish nonsense.

lol

Your response means you are rather impressed :jaw-dropp

It is part of the balancing mechanism...

The dragonfly helps to disable the turbulance thus creating smooth flowing air currents :)

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 02:10 AM

Hey I came up with the proof :)Too bad someone beat you to the punch on patenting this.
http://ip.com/patent/US7811060

And fluid dynamicists at the California Institute of Technology have also beaten you to the punch.
http://news.sciencemag.org/sciencenow/2009/11/24-01.html

There are many more examples.

So what's revolutionary about your "invention"?

Sean84

3rd February 2011, 02:33 AM

<snip>
That's the beginning of the evidence...
I'm pretty sure you just put some red tape on paper towel tubes and made a short video with a camera you already had so that you can keep a few people entertained. That is how little credibility you have.

Especially since...
highflyertoo never gave evidence, did he now ;)
<snip>
...you keep implying that I've lied. That isn't very nice.

But, hey, if you lied when you said you're John Murie of Western Australia then you're better off. That guy is a *********** nutball. Just plain whacked out of his gourd. Hell of a troll though, he could keep a thread like this dragging on for ages with nothing but the delusional fantasy that paranormal influences had destined him to change the world....

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 02:47 AM

New VAWT http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yngITMZbnQgSo what does Professor Jacobson (http://engineering.stanford.edu/research/layout.php?sunetid=jacobson)at Standford think of your revolutionary design?

Since you're on a first term basis with the man, I'd be interested in his views on the effect your breakthrough idea will have on the climate...
I spoke of clusters in previous posts........ I phoned Mark Z Jacobson a few minutes ago and asked him how much money it would be worth if the World was mainly run by Wind and some solar. He couldn't give me figures,yet said the health benifits would be great........ I think he's interested in people's welfare. And I mentioned about one thousand footers,and he said people are already working on high altitude wind machines.

He was honest to tell me that some people would ''not benifit'' if there was a change to a majority of Wind Power. I don't want people to suffer on my behalf by losing their current jobs that maintains their mortgage payments.

If I was to part sell or sell to the international community then for the ''job shift'' and re-training for new jobs associated with Alternative Energy Wind Power transition,then the Governments would HAVE to pay peoples wages. A useful Wind Power BAIL OUT or say REAL INVESTMENT.... Hey they payed the Bankers Billions and got nothing back except for dirt in your face with increased interest rates.

Mark seems convinced to run cars off electricity.

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 03:41 AM

So what does Professor Jacobson (http://engineering.stanford.edu/research/layout.php?sunetid=jacobson)at Standford think of your revolutionary design?

Since you're on a first term basis with the man, I'd be interested in his views on the effect your breakthrough idea will have on the climate...

He from our one and only talk over the phone doesn't know of my revolutionary design.I never describe to him about my completed New VAWT Invention.The motor wasn't dicussed in any detail.

I said to him that I have a new idea to power the world with potential thousand footers,and replied a few companies were looking into''high altitude'' wind power up to a thousand feet.

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 04:08 AM

He from our one and only talk over the phone doesn't know of my revolutionary design.I never describe to him about my completed New VAWT Invention.The motor wasn't dicussed in any detail.

I said to him that I have a new idea to power the world with potential thousand footers,and replied a few companies were looking into''high altitude'' wind power up to a thousand feet.A Likely Story... (http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/A+likely+story)

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 04:11 AM

A Likely Story... (http://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/A+likely+story)

As yet I still haven't seen anyone build me new design.Maybe someone is putting the finishing touches on now. If so then my devices can never eventuate from my hands.

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 04:33 AM

As yet I still haven't seen anyone build me new design.This is probably due to the fact that it is a toy.
Most others in the game are building aerofoil vanes and then TESTING their efficiency. All you have is a pretty pinwheel, with no background testing to see if it is more/less efficient than commercially available VAWT. While there may be a smidgeon of validity on calling this a new design, there is no validity in any claims of it being a BETTER design than anything out there at the moment.... that are actually attached generating electricity.Maybe someone is putting the finishing touches on now. If so then my devices can never eventuate from my hands.But..... yours is such a revolutionary design!?
Completely NEW?!

Are you now saying your design is NOT unique?

ETA: Here's a reminder of your OP boast.

My vast improvement of Wind Technology could meet the Earth's demand for power consumption.

Two pinwheels spinning on a mate's chimney hardly meets this empty boast.

Akhenaten

3rd February 2011, 04:42 AM

As yet I still haven't seen anyone build me new design.

You don't have a new design.

Maybe someone is putting the finishing touches on now.

No.

If so then my devices can never eventuate from my hands.

You have no devices. I don't know for sure what you have in your hands, but I can speculate.

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 05:20 AM

This is probably due to the fact that it is a toy.
Most others in the game are building aerofoil vanes and then TESTING their efficiency. All you have is a pretty pinwheel, with no background testing to see if it is more/less efficient than commercially available VAWT. While there may be a smidgeon of validity on calling this a new design, there is no validity in any claims of it being a BETTER design than anything out there at the moment.... that are actually attached generating electricity.But..... yours is such a revolutionary design!?
Completely NEW?!

Are you now saying your design is NOT unique?

ETA: Here's a reminder of your OP boast.

My vast improvement of Wind Technology could meet the Earth's demand for power consumption.

Two pinwheels spinning on a mate's chimney hardly meets this empty boast.

I said my New VAWT's were incomplete because I have to patent them before building them in their complete form. And es I can modify HAWT's with my New Generator....

The idea is to have slender VAWT's with a small sweep span and small footprint. Can you hear what I'm suggesting. Maybe if you go back you could re-read what I've written to date.

I'm heading up the roof now to take a video with a torch shinning on the spinners. The wind has picked up.

jsfisher

3rd February 2011, 05:40 AM

My secret invention yet to come, will power most of the Earth at a cheaper rate

More evasion. Care to answer my question?

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 06:07 AM

More evasion. Care to answer my question?

What exactly is you're question.Please break it down in small bite size pieces :)

jsfisher

3rd February 2011, 06:23 AM

What exactly is you're question.Please break it down in small bite size pieces :)

I'm sorry. I didn't realize your reading comprehension skills were so limiting. Here's the original question:

Ok, so now what would you guess you could generate in the way of power with one of those if you added a generator?

Here is what it is asking:

Put a generator on one of those whirling things in your video. How much power would it produce?

Your answer should include a number, or perhaps a number range, followed by the word, watts.

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 06:27 AM

I'm pretty sure you just put some red tape on paper towel tubes and made a short video with a camera you already had so that you can keep a few people entertained. That is how little credibility you have.

Especially since...

...you keep implying that I've lied. That isn't very nice.

But, hey, if you lied when you said you're John Murie of Western Australia then you're better off. That guy is a *********** nutball. Just plain whacked out of his gourd. Hell of a troll though, he could keep a thread like this dragging on for ages with nothing but the delusional fantasy that paranormal influences had destined him to change the world....

Paper towel rolls are an ideal start,and very cheap. My New VAWT invention can accomadate this set up for emergency purposes in fair weather. But the ones in the video are made of 75mm by 1m pvc white down pipe from a store here called Bunnings.Cost of downpipe was $6.95.

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 06:37 AM

Paper towel rolls are an ideal start,and very cheap. My New VAWT invention can accomadate this set up for emergency purposes in fair weather. But the ones in the video are made of 75mm by 1m pvc white down pipe from a store here called Bunnings.Cost of downpipe was $6.95.Therefore not patentable as they are neither new, nor innovative.

q_znBxCiR9Q
ETA: Also, previously you claimed that they were 88mm blades made from:
...Plastic signage sheeting made into 88 mm vanes,scored and bent ,then cloth taped for a fairly even curved shape.Which is it?

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 07:03 AM

Therefore not patentable as they are neither new, nor innovative.

q_znBxCiR9Q
ETA: Also, previously you claimed that they were 88mm blades made from:
Which is it?

The diameter of the downpipe is 75mm......... With a straight cut of 88mm plastic vanes made from old signage which were ''scored'' with a Stanley Trimmer (knife) and so bent as a result from scoring (cutting) halfway through the plastic sheeting,and then wide cellotaped and then RED CLOTH TAPED on both of them,except one being the ''small one'' (which I have modified at least twice) which only has red cloth tape with plenty,and I mean plenty of Bostik Liquid Nails. Yippee ;)

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 07:04 AM

I said my New VAWT's were incomplete because I have to patent them before building them in their complete form. And es I can modify HAWT's with my New Generator....

The idea is to have slender VAWT's with a small sweep span and small footprint. Can you hear what I'm suggesting. Maybe if you go back you could re-read what I've written to date.Maybe if you go back and reread my previous posts, you'll see where I pointed out that slim VAWTs and clustered VAWTs are not new, nor innovative.
You have nothing patentable here, let alone breakthrough technology.

Oh, and a question.

How do you rationalise your purpose to overthrow the NWO by creating breakthrough VAWT technology that will enable the "common man" to become independent from government and big business, with your desire to protect your investment via a patent?

Surely making this technology public will bring down the NWO by enabling us all to be free from "the man"?

The old adage, "If you're not part of the solution....." springs to mind.

TjW

3rd February 2011, 07:10 AM

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate?

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 07:18 AM

If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate?At least yours is a solid assertion.

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 07:20 AM

The diameter of the downpipe is 75mm......... With a straight cut of 88mm plastic vanes made from old signage which were ''scored'' with a Stanley Trimmer (knife) and so bent as a result from scoring (cutting) halfway through the plastic sheeting,and then wide cellotaped and then RED CLOTH TAPED on both of them,except one being the ''small one'' (which I have modified at least twice) which only has red cloth tape with plenty,and I mean plenty of Bostik Liquid Nails. Yippee ;)... and not patentable...
btw, you're about 60+ patent applications (http://pericles.ipaustralia.gov.au/ols/auspatbeta/quickSearch.do?queryString=vertical+wind+turbine&resultsPerPage=)behind with your "technology".
And that's just the Australian applications...

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 07:26 AM

Akhenaten

3rd February 2011, 07:56 AM

... and not patentable...
btw, you're about 60+ patent applications (http://pericles.ipaustralia.gov.au/ols/auspatbeta/quickSearch.do?queryString=vertical+wind+turbine&resultsPerPage=)behind with your "technology".
And that's just the Australian applications...

try again ;)

Another way of putting it is that so far your little kindergarten arts and crafts project has cost you $6.95 and what little credibility you had here and it's not worth its weight in snap-frozen cocky cack.

Congratulations.

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 08:02 AM

Another way of putting it is that so far your little kindergarten arts and crafts project has cost you $6.95 and what little credibility you had here and it's not worth its weight in snap-frozen cocky cack.

Congratulations.

You forgot to mention the cost of liquid nails while cracking a coldie :)

Dinwar

3rd February 2011, 08:17 AM

Did you think i had made an upright model as i suggested the other week or did you think i was lying as Adman and Dinwar have repeatedly accused me of?I didn't ACCUSE you of anything. I DEMONSTRATED that you are a lier. The fact that you built two really poorly-designed pinwheels doesn't negate the other lies you told. In fact, I've always said that I thought you'd built them.

I said my New VAWT's were incomplete because I have to patent them before building them in their complete form. And es I can modify HAWT's with my New Generator....

The idea is to have slender VAWT's with a small sweep span and small footprint. Can you hear what I'm suggesting. Maybe if you go back you could re-read what I've written to date.
First, this is backwards--in the United States it's highly advisable to have a workign model prior to application for a patent. As for the second paragraph, there's a reason most wind turbines are big. You should find out what that is. I believe someone has mentioned it in this thread.

Paper towel rolls are an ideal start,and very cheap. No, they are a HORRIBLE start. They're just about the weakest thing you could possibly use. They simply won't survive the stresses generated when spinning fast enough to generate the torque necessary to generate power.

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 08:28 AM

try again ;)Uh, no. My suggestion is that you try again.

Unless your design is new and innovative, it is unpatentable.

ETA: I have some degree of experience in this. My brother-in-law is currently discussing a ground-breaking design of his with patent lawyers for his protection and an multinational engineering firm for R&D, manufacture and marketing.

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 08:33 AM

Uh, no. My suggestion is that you try again.

Unless your design is new and innovative, it is unpatentable.

ETA: I have some degree of experience in this. My brother-in-law is currently discussing a ground-breaking design of his with patent lawyers for his protection and an multinational engineering firm for R&D, manufacture and marketing.

Maybe I should keep delaying the knowledge for my own agenda bender ;)

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 08:40 AM

I didn't ACCUSE you of anything. I DEMONSTRATED that you are a lier. The fact that you built two really poorly-designed pinwheels doesn't negate the other lies you told. In fact, I've always said that I thought you'd built them.

First, this is backwards--in the United States it's highly advisable to have a workign model prior to application for a patent. As for the second paragraph, there's a reason most wind turbines are big. You should find out what that is. I believe someone has mentioned it in this thread.

No, they are a HORRIBLE start. They're just about the weakest thing you could possibly use. They simply won't survive the stresses generated when spinning fast enough to generate the torque necessary to generate power.

You are not understanding twist my persistant responder. lol

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 08:41 AM

Maybe I should keep delaying the knowledge for my own agenda bender ;)It need not be a large one to store the knowledge that we're missing out on...

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 08:51 AM

It need not be a large one to store the knowledge that we're missing out on...

You won't be missing out for very much longer.

So is your bro in law going to do what?

Dinwar

3rd February 2011, 08:52 AM

No, no, I get that. What you don't get is sheer strength, torque, fluid dynamics....shall we just say science and be done with it? :rolleyes: I mean, if you build your pinwheels out of cardboard tubes they'll fly apart before they reach the speeds necessary to generate power. And it takes less torque to sheer cardboard than it does to turn magnets in a good generator.

Akhenaten

3rd February 2011, 08:59 AM

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 09:11 AM

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 09:26 AM

You won't be missing out for very much longer.

So is your bro in law going to do what?Read the post again.

I described exactly what my BiL is doing.

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 09:29 AM

Read the post again.

I described exactly what my BiL is doing.

He has put out what tech for everyone to view?

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 09:31 AM

Skeptics are very much like preachers,telling people of their so called wrongs.

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 09:36 AM

He has put out what tech for everyone to view?What part of my post is confusing you?
My brother-in-law is currently discussing a ground-breaking design of his with patent lawyers for his protection and an multinational engineering firm for R&D, manufacture and marketing.Where did I say anything about it being public?
I was talking about the patent process that you are showing less knowledge of than you do of torque loads on a wind turbine.

It is private because he actually has a new and innovative invention that is patentable, and is in discussion with a manufacturer to develop it.

Dinwar

3rd February 2011, 09:39 AM

You don't really think this half-baked idea is ever going to anywhere near that stage of development, do you? Nope. The first person he shows it to will see cardboard, glue, and plastic strips and start laughing so hard they land in a hospital.

You are living in prehistoric days. New Era coming or unfolding...This has nothing to do with anything. I made some very specific criticisms of your design--criticisms which are easily testable, by the way, if you have a toilet paper tube (simply measure how much twisting force it can handle, and compare that to the torque necessary to generate appreciable power). Care to actually respond to those?

Skeptics are very much like preachers,telling people of their so called wrongs. Prove us wrong. You've yet to do so.

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 09:40 AM

What part of my post is confusing you?
Where did I say anything about it being public?
I was talking about the patent process that you are showing less knowledge of than you do of torque loads on a wind turbine.

It is private because he actually has a new and innovative invention that is patentable, and is in discussion with a manufacturer to develop it.

And you claim to not know about it.Fence sitting Sister In Law.

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 09:44 AM

has your bro in law let you in on the deal?

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 09:55 AM

Nope. The first person he shows it to will see cardboard, glue, and plastic strips and start laughing so hard they land in a hospital.

This has nothing to do with anything. I made some very specific criticisms of your design--criticisms which are easily testable, by the way, if you have a toilet paper tube (simply measure how much twisting force it can handle, and compare that to the torque necessary to generate appreciable power). Care to actually respond to those?

Prove us wrong. You've yet to do so.

You don't get.

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 12:10 PM

And you claim to not know about it.No. It is because I know about it that I have not intention of divulging anything further in public.Fence sitting...What are you blathering about?

I suggest you step away from the keyboard before 2am in the morning. You make even less sense online at that time of day than you usually do.

ApolloGnomon

3rd February 2011, 01:20 PM

New VAWT http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yngITMZbnQg

This thread is not designed to boast about an idea I have of revoloutionary Wind Technology,but rather to state in advance of secret things that I knew prior.

Here's a video showing many ''other'' people's ideas of their wind technology... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEPDkMN71XA

My vast improvement of Wind Technology could meet the Earth's demand for power consumption,The Tech would be so useful to fuel Desalination Plants and purifying drinking water,for heating and cooking and cooling systems. (This seems to sit in my gut fairly well)

I could bring out similar Tech to fuel cars, but how many people are directly affected by New Tech?How many people would loose thier Jobs as a direct result of New Tech or vastly improved Tech. Majority of people don't agree with Oil companies because of their slash and burn policies,but how many people have become Oil Company dependent ?

Does New Tech really produce new jobs for the young only and so throw the Older generation onto the scrap heap? So here I am forecasting my wind machine devices. Should I bring them out to counter the Oil Companies ''couldn't give a care attitude''? I'm not really asking for anyone's approval,I felt like letting people know that the Earth doesn't need to be Oil Dependent.

Nearly a thousand posts later, you finally present a video. Yeah.

Making energy solutions out of light weight readily available materials is commendable. I've seen interesting designs for beer-can based solar collectors that almost make me want to stop drinking expensive microbrews. Your narrow VAWT platform appears ready to apply some scientific rigor. Might I suggest starting with an anemometer and optical tachometer? Next, you should build 2 identical units and add your power-collection technique of choice. Then modify one to see if you get improvements. Keep fiddling with it until it produces more power than the original. Then leave the modified one alone and try to improve the original to produce more power than your modified version. This way you can keep stair-stepping your improvements and have basis of comparison at each step.

Keep notes. Write down wind speed, air temperature and output for each unit.

AdMan

3rd February 2011, 01:25 PM

Your narrow VAWT platform appears ready to apply some scientific rigor. Might I suggest starting with an anemometer and optical tachometer? Next, you should build 2 identical units and add your power-collection technique of choice. Then modify one to see if you get improvements. Keep fiddling with it until it produces more power than the original. Then leave the modified one alone and try to improve the original to produce more power than your modified version. This way you can keep stair-stepping your improvements and have basis of comparison at each step.

Keep notes. Write down wind speed, air temperature and output for each unit.

All good advice, but I suspect you are wildly overestimating ls's desire or ability to apply scientific rigor to his work.

EHocking

3rd February 2011, 01:41 PM

All good advice, but I suspect you are wildly overestimating ls's desire or ability to apply scientific rigor to his work.Yeah, this post of his is evidence of that...
No, too much research is an inhibitor, nothing ever gets done.

As I said my VAWT is the produccer of electricty for the whole Earth. It's like when Tesla's trumped Edison's power stations. So too will mine trump the Oil Giants.

How can I disagree with fact? Remember Tesla.Empty boasts and delusions of granduer.

Oh, and belief in NWO conspiracies thrown in for good measure.

ApolloGnomon

3rd February 2011, 05:47 PM

All good advice, but I suspect you are wildly overestimating ls's desire or ability to apply scientific rigor to his work.

I'm an optimist.

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 08:41 PM

Nearly a thousand posts later, you finally present a video. Yeah.

Making energy solutions out of light weight readily available materials is commendable. I've seen interesting designs for beer-can based solar collectors that almost make me want to stop drinking expensive microbrews. Your narrow VAWT platform appears ready to apply some scientific rigor. Might I suggest starting with an anemometer and optical tachometer? Next, you should build 2 identical units and add your power-collection technique of choice. Then modify one to see if you get improvements. Keep fiddling with it until it produces more power than the original. Then leave the modified one alone and try to improve the original to produce more power than your modified version. This way you can keep stair-stepping your improvements and have basis of comparison at each step.

Keep notes. Write down wind speed, air temperature and output for each unit.

Anemometer is on the priority list. Light weight and sturdy materials is worth pursuing because as you know it's much more affordable and accessible to the general public. Also it is EASY to replace when the wings get damaged and or worn. A bit of cloth tape and or fibre glass cloth ''slapped on'' will do the job just fine. If the unit lasts for five years,then salvage the expensive components and rebuild for next to nothing.

No costly space age material required for the New VAWT :)

And thanks for your supportive amd practical comments ;)

Dinwar

3rd February 2011, 08:54 PM

Light weight and sturdy materialsThe materials you used lack that bit.

Sean84

3rd February 2011, 09:30 PM

To-do list:
Have a dream about windmills.
Tell the internet I will change the world.
Do nothing. Troll until further notice.
Put tape on tubes.
Declare victory over the NWO.
Make new to-do list.

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 11:14 PM

To-do list:
Have a dream about windmills.
Tell the internet I will change the world.
Do nothing. Troll until further notice.
Put tape on tubes.
Declare victory over the NWO.
Make new to-do list.

If you want to make a new to do list for yourself then feel free ;)

likelystory

3rd February 2011, 11:49 PM

Here's a video of my VAWTS from side on

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VPZO-3On1bk

Evilgiraffe

3rd February 2011, 11:53 PM

Still spinning under no load, I see. Come back when they are actually connected to something and there is some torque on the axis.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 01:24 AM

The materials you used lack that bit.

Look how fast they are spinning, they appear to be going backwards, so how's that for more than 120 rpm as you previously guessed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZXranyhG4M

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 01:30 AM

Look how fast they are spinning, they appear to be going backwards, so how's that for more than 120 rpm as you previously guessed.

We'll just add the stroboscopic effect to the list of things you don't understand, shall we?

likelystory

4th February 2011, 01:38 AM

We'll just add the stroboscopic effect to the list of things you don't understand, shall we?

Keep defending your friends guess work if that's ok with you ;) lol

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 01:48 AM

We'll just add the stroboscopic effect to the list of things you don't understand, shall we?

Keep defending your friends guess work if that's ok with you ;) lol

I'm guessing that "non sequitur" can go on the list as well.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 01:53 AM

I'm guessing that "non sequitur" can go on the list as well.

how fast do you think

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 02:02 AM

How much power are your little toys generating?

Craig4

4th February 2011, 02:47 AM

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 02:58 AM

Setting aside for a moment all of the above very reasonable arguments. If you could generate power from these things what makes them better than the existing wind turbines? I'm not really seeing anything special here.

Given that likelystory doesn't know how existing wind turbines work he's hardly going to be able to explain how his toys could possibly be better than them.

Sean84

4th February 2011, 03:18 AM

Setting aside for a moment all of the above very reasonable arguments. If you could generate power from these things what makes them better than the existing wind turbines? I'm not really seeing anything special here.

You could cook whatever else you find in the dumpster you build the VAWT from. It would revolutionize hobo camps the world around by freeing them from dependence on barrel fires.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 03:32 AM

No. It is because I know about it that I have not intention of divulging anything further in public.What are you blathering about?

I suggest you step away from the keyboard before 2am in the morning. You make even less sense online at that time of day than you usually do.

Oh so you know his secret invention......... And yes my post didn't make much sense to me either,sorry about that,was a bit boozed up.

So I paid a visit to Aussie Skeptics and seen you browsing the forum.They appearently want more wind power according to the author Spoons.

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 04:32 AM

Oh so you know his secret invention......... And yes my post didn't make much sense to me either,sorry about that,was a bit boozed up.

So I paid a visit to Aussie Skeptics and seen you browsing the forum.They appearently want more wind power according to the author Spoons.

How much power are your little toys generating?

EHocking

4th February 2011, 04:35 AM

likelystory

4th February 2011, 04:41 AM

How much power are your little toys generating?

What would you like them to generate when they are complete.

Or are you saying my invention won't work that well to replace Coal Fire Power Stations?

EHocking

4th February 2011, 04:46 AM

What would you like them to generate when they are complete.1/100,000,000 of this boast would be impressive:
As I said my VAWT is the produccer of electricty for the whole Earth... So too will mine trump the Oil Giants.

EHocking

4th February 2011, 04:48 AM

What would you like them to generate when they are complete.It's polite to note that you have edited a post after initial submission.Or are you saying my invention won't work that well to replace Coal Fire Power Stations?Your invention won't work well enough to replace a torch battery. All you have are toy pinwheels on a chimney.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 04:55 AM

1/100,000,000 of this boast would be impressive:

I don't believe you.For starters you haven't even acknowledge my VAWT spinning really fast. I haven't got the best bearings,and I put them on a bit crooked,I thumb lined when putting the vanes on, I put the glue on very unevenly, I cut the down pipe on a slant, and the list goes on....... But it spins really fast with all it's faults. woohoo VICTORY ;):cool:;)

here is my latest video I took this arvo http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZZXranyhG4M

Myriad

4th February 2011, 05:04 AM

I don't believe you.For starters you haven't even acknowledge my VAWT spinning really fast. I haven't got the best bearings, and I put them on a bit crooked,I thumb lined when putting the vanes on, I put the glue on very unevenly, I cut the down pipe on a slant, and the list goes on....... But it spins really fast with all it's faults. woohoo VICTORY ;):cool:;)

Since right now the heat from friction in the bearings is the only power the device is producing, it's just as well you didn't use good ones.

ETA: If you made the lower bearing out of wood (like in a bow drill (http://www.wikihow.com/Start-a-Fire-with-Sticks)), maybe it would get hot enough to catch fire. That would generate a lot of energy!

Respectfully,
Myriad

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 05:04 AM

What would you like them to generate when they are complete.

Electricity.

Or are you saying my invention won't work that well to replace Coal Fire Power Stations?

You don't have an invention.

EHocking

4th February 2011, 05:06 AM

I don't believe you.I'm not surprised. It was YOUR posted boast of power generation that I'd quoted.

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 05:06 AM

likelystory

4th February 2011, 05:10 AM

How much power are your little toys generating?

You and I both know from the videos I posted that the VAWT isn't producing any electricity as yet because I haven't made the super duper generator.

I made the video because certain members were calling my bluff, and I came through. ;)

likelystory

4th February 2011, 05:22 AM

I'm not surprised. It was YOUR posted boast of power generation that I'd quoted.

I never quoted that figure,besides I hit extra zeros at times ;)

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 05:24 AM

You and I both know from the videos I posted that the VAWT isn't producing any electricity as yet because I haven't made the super duper generator.

You don't have the faintest idea how to build a generator, much less attach it to one of your spinning toys.

I made the video because certain members were calling my bluff, and I came through. ;)

You've failed utterly. For all your time, effort and expense, not to mention completely trashing your credibility in this forum forever, you've managed to produce is something one would expect to find in a cheap showbag.

EHocking

4th February 2011, 05:33 AM

I never quoted that figure,Neither did I, I merely reposted your empty boast from the beginning of this thread
As I said my VAWT is the produccer of electricty for the whole Earth...besides I hit extra zeros at times ;)All in front of the decimal place, with no other digits in the sequence.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 05:51 AM

You don't have the faintest idea how to build a generator, much less attach it to one of your spinning toys.

You've failed utterly. For all your time, effort and expense, not to mention completely trashing your credibility in this forum forever, you've managed to produce is something one would expect to find in a cheap showbag.

Where can I get that cheap showbag?

Would you like me to be successful with my VAWT to supply cheap electricity for the public local and afar?

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 06:07 AM

Would you like me to be successful with my VAWT to supply cheap electricity for the public local and afar?

Likes and dislikes have nothing to do with it.

You don't have a VAWT and you lack even the basic knowledge required to know how to start constructing one.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 06:14 AM

You don't have the faintest idea how to build a generator,

Of course I don't understand,but I'm still going to build my one which I understand.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 06:18 AM

Likes and dislikes have nothing to do with it.

You don't have a VAWT and you lack even the basic knowledge required to know how to start constructing one.

So how about I construct two,to get over the hurdle of one :)

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 06:27 AM

Of course I don't understand,but I'm still going to build my one which I understand.

No, you aren't. You've already demonstrated that the extent of your abilities is some poorly constructed children's toys.

Electricity and aerodynamics are completely and probably forever beyond you.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 06:29 AM

Likes and dislikes have nothing to do with it.

You don't have a VAWT and you lack even the basic knowledge required to know how to start constructing one.

So ''you'' only know what is,rather than knowing what is to come. Is this true?

I tell you I know what is coming........ My VAWT is to come into being.

EHocking

4th February 2011, 06:31 AM

No, you aren't. You've already demonstrated that the extent of your abilities is some poorly constructed children's toys.I think this generator would suit.
http://amasci.com/amateur/coilgen.htmlElectricity and aerodynamics are completely and probably forever beyond you.Well, he might as well post them publicly, 'cos he's presented nothing so far that is remotely useful (let alone patentable).

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 06:40 AM

I tell you I know what is coming........ My VAWT is to come into being.

You don't have a VAWT.

I think this generator would suit.
http://amasci.com/amateur/coilgen.html

Still too complex, methinks.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 06:55 AM

You don't have a VAWT.

Still too complex, methinks.

Of course I do ;) I can see it and hear it and touch it.

My VAWT will produce masses of electricity, when fully completed. Hey I think your feeling as though your raw nerve is being unnerved. Chill out dude.

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 07:07 AM

Of course I do ;) I can see it and hear it and touch it.

You have a poorly assembled toy.

My VAWT will produce masses of electricity, when fully completed. Hey I think your feeling as though your raw nerve is being unnerved. Chill out dude.

You have no idea how a generator actually produces electricity and you have neither the intention or capability of completing a wind generator anywhere near as efficient as those already in use.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 07:43 AM

You have a poorly assembled toy.

You have no idea how a generator actually produces electricity and you have neither the intention or capability of completing a wind generator anywhere near as efficient as those already in use.

And my toy spins very very very very very fast. It's even a nice color :)

NWO won't stand a chance with my low cost power maker.

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 07:46 AM

NWO won't stand a chance with my low cost power maker.

You don't have a low cost power maker.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 07:51 AM

You don't have a low cost power maker.

The idea is maturing into reality..... There will not be THWART upon the VAWT of any SORT :)

The wheels are set in motion for VAWT POWER.

excaza

4th February 2011, 07:52 AM

You don't have a low cost power maker.

To be fair, he could very well generate power using what he's got now.

It just won't be enough to power anything.

Dinwar

4th February 2011, 07:57 AM

And my toy spins very very very very very fast. It's even a nice color Irrelevant. A set of fins that spins is a pinwheel, not a VAWT. Once you hook it up to a generator, we can start calling it a VAWT; until then, it's a pinwheel. Color is irrelevant, and speed is largely irrelevant (you want TORQUE, not speed).

NWO won't stand a chance with my low cost power maker. You have not made power, and cannot make power with these devices as constructed. You've converted wind energy into spinning energy, which is easy. Converting spinning energy into electrical energy is the challange.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 07:58 AM

To be fair, he could very well generate power using what he's got now.

It just won't be enough to power everything.

Nice post ;)
Do not alter other's posts without indicating what has been done.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 08:14 AM

Irrelevant. A set of fins that spins is a pinwheel, not a VAWT. Once you hook it up to a generator, we can start calling it a VAWT; until then, it's a pinwheel. Color is irrelevant, and speed is largely irrelevant (you want TORQUE, not speed).

You have not made power, and cannot make power with these devices as constructed. You've converted wind energy into spinning energy, which is easy. Converting spinning energy into electrical energy is the challange.

A generator without the pinwheel is dormant.

Now this is where I totally differ from you Dinwar. Speed is what I am after to create ample amounts of electricity. My machines work better with a far lesser sweep area.How is this possible you may ask? It is possible because of an entirely different ''unconventional'' approach.

I already am playing a role model game with myself as to how my VAWT can be ''differed enough '' for other people to make slightly different imitations to then have their own patents. I 've myself got up to about 10 to 15 varients so far....... I can't get a monopoly on my VAWT. Too many look alikes are waiting to fill the ranks.

Oh well such is life

EHocking

4th February 2011, 08:18 AM

... My machines work better with a far lesser sweep area.You have measured absolutely nothing, this statement is false.How is this possible you may ask? It is possible because of an entirely different ''unconventional'' approach..I posted links to other VAWTs that use PVC pipe as vanes. Again, there is nothing unconventional, different, radical, ground-breaking or innovative about your pinwheel "design".

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 08:21 AM

To be fair, he could very well generate power using what he's got now.

It just won't be enough to power anything.

It's certainly possible that a generator of the type suggested by EHocking could be incorporated into a toy like likelystory's, but there has been absolutely no indication that s/he is willing or able to do so, and in any case, as you say, it will still be nothing more than a toy.

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 08:32 AM

A generator without the pinwheel is dormant.

Gibberish.

Now this is where I totally differ from you Dinwar. Speed is what I am after to create ample amounts of electricity.

Your incomprehension of the difference between speed and torque is already on the list of failings from which your ideas suffer.

My machines work better with a far lesser sweep area.

Compared to what? A stick?

Show us your measurements.

How is this possible you may ask? It is possible because of an entirely different ''unconventional'' approach.

It matters not whether such a claim is plausible. What matters is that you are unable to demonstrate that you are capable of satisfying such a claim.

I already am playing a role model game with myself as to how my VAWT can be ''differed enough '' for other people to make slightly different imitations to then have their own patents. I 've myself got up to about 10 to 15 varients so far....... I can't get a monopoly on my VAWT. Too many look alikes are waiting to fill the ranks.

Oh well such is life

More gibberish.

Dinwar

4th February 2011, 08:40 AM

A generator without the pinwheel is dormant.

Now this is where I totally differ from you Dinwar. Speed is what I am after to create ample amounts of electricity. My machines work better with a far lesser sweep area.How is this possible you may ask? It is possible because of an entirely different ''unconventional'' approach.
And a pinwheel without a generator is a toy, which is what you have.

And no, this has nothing to do with convention. It has to do with torque. You need to spin a magnet, and the only way to do that is with torque. You can try gearing up to sufficient torque, but good luck with that.

I see lots of people cross out a word and replace it with their own. And they do that for a laugh....... I was doing it for a laugh....... Don't get all preachy on me,that's why people stay away from James Randi's site. Get the drift,I'm not under anyone's authority here. Got it........ If you want to be a skeptic,then there must be NEUTRAL GROUND Wow, you complain about someone being preachy, by preaching to them. You throw your weight around to tell us to stop being authoritarian. There are so many contradictions in this it's staggering. Here's a thought, though: Try attempting to understand what we're saying beyond just "You don't agree with me"--some very intelligent people have offered some very sound advice in this thread that anyone truly interested in invention would listen to.

Oh, and this isn't your website so you don't make the ruels. This site is whatever the mods and admins want it to be--if they want it to be neutral it's neutral. If they want it to be science-oriented, it's science-oriented. As a member you have to live with it. Thus far, I've seen it being science-oriented. Which is most definitely NOT neutral when it comes to crackpot physics.

And that's it. It's your belief you agree with. Okay, at this point I'd argue that we can no longer even pretend likelystory is honestly trying to learn anything. He's made it about belief, not facts, which means any disagreement will be taken as an attack on HIM, not his arguments/designs. No constructive criticism is possible when someone takes this stand.

A Laughing Baby

4th February 2011, 08:50 AM

What does VAWT stand for again? Value added wind technology? Very awesome wind technology? Very asinine wind technology?

EHocking

4th February 2011, 08:51 AM

This thread is about a new tech,and from the OP,people have disagreed with my intial purposal because of the indoctrinated current availble technology..No. The objections are because no new technology, no technology at all in fact, has been demonstrated by you on the thread.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 08:56 AM

What does VAWT stand for again? Value added wind technology? Very awesome wind technology? Very asinine wind technology?

Very Accurate Wishful Thinker :)

Akhenaten

4th February 2011, 09:08 AM

<polite snip>

Okay, at this point I'd argue that we can no longer even pretend likelystory is honestly trying to learn anything. He's made it about belief, not facts, which means any disagreement will be taken as an attack on HIM, not his arguments/designs. No constructive criticism is possible when someone takes this stand.

+1

Time for a move to R & P perhaps.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 09:14 AM

And a pinwheel without a generator is a toy, which is what you have.

And no, this has nothing to do with convention. It has to do with torque. You need to spin a magnet, and the only way to do that is with torque. You can try gearing up to sufficient torque, but good luck with that.

Wow, you complain about someone being preachy, by preaching to them. You throw your weight around to tell us to stop being authoritarian. There are so many contradictions in this it's staggering. Here's a thought, though: Try attempting to understand what we're saying beyond just "You don't agree with me"--some very intelligent people have offered some very sound advice in this thread that anyone truly interested in invention would listen to.

Oh, and this isn't your website so you don't make the ruels. This site is whatever the mods and admins want it to be--if they want it to be neutral it's neutral. If they want it to be science-oriented, it's science-oriented. As a member you have to live with it. Thus far, I've seen it being science-oriented. Which is most definitely NOT neutral when it comes to crackpot physics.

Okay, at this point I'd argue that we can no longer even pretend likelystory is honestly trying to learn anything. He's made it about belief, not facts, which means any disagreement will be taken as an attack on HIM, not his arguments/designs. No constructive criticism is possible when someone takes this stand.

First learn to use constructive criticism yourself.

As soon as I challenge you back you go all pointing the finger more so......... But guess what Dinwar,you didn't think I already had built my spinning VAWT. lol...... Anyhow you'll see in time I hope ;)

likelystory

4th February 2011, 09:38 AM

No. The objections are because no new technology, no technology at all in fact, has been demonstrated by you on the thread.

Then I'll keep it away from here as seen.

Dinwar

4th February 2011, 09:46 AM

But guess what Dinwar,you didn't think I already had built my spinning VAWT. lol...... You really need to read more carefully. I'm one of the few people who DID believe that you built something. I mean, you still haven't built a VAWT--you need to actually generate power to call it that--but I at least accepted that you built a spinning pinwheel.

EHocking

4th February 2011, 10:06 AM

You and I both know from the videos I posted that the VAWT isn't producing any electricity as yet because I haven't made the super duper generator....In light of this statement, how did you arrive at this conclusion?
...My new VAWT has the potential to power 70% to 90% of the World's electricity requirements for lighting and cooking and heating and air conditioning systems.

A Laughing Baby

4th February 2011, 10:18 AM

But seriously. What does VAWT stand for.

Dinwar

4th February 2011, 10:38 AM

Vertical Axis Wind Turbine.

As opposed to the more commone Horizontal Axis Wind Turbines (HAWTs).

Hellbound

4th February 2011, 10:42 AM

Vertical Axis Wind Turbine.

As opposed to the more commone Horizontal Axis Wind Turbines (HAWTs).

You mean it's not Vertical Axis Wind Twisty-spinny-thing?

likelystory

4th February 2011, 06:34 PM

You have measured absolutely nothing, this statement is false.I posted links to other VAWTs that use PVC pipe as vanes. Again, there is nothing unconventional, different, radical, ground-breaking or innovative about your pinwheel "design".

I had seen those links months ago, yet thanks for posting them, did you find them of great interest?

I recently built a VAWT with pvc vanes about a month ago. It's a real rough piece of VAWT.

Andrew Wiggin

4th February 2011, 06:58 PM

But seriously. What does VAWT stand for.

Vertical Axis Waste of Time

likelystory

4th February 2011, 07:10 PM

Vertical Axis Waste of Time

Hey I showed you the pics....... so it did happen ;)

Andrew Wiggin

4th February 2011, 07:17 PM

Hey I showed you the pics....... so it did happen ;)

I saw what you did there. I didn't post 'pics or it didn't happen' this time. I see that you made something. I also saw that it doesn't have a prayer of meeting the claims you've made for it, so I called it a 'vertical axis waste of time'.

Your time, but especially OUR time.

Sean84

4th February 2011, 07:23 PM

Very Annoying Western-Australian Trollscience (http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/troll-sciencetroll-physics)

AdMan

4th February 2011, 07:32 PM

Very Annoying Western-Australian Trollscience (http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/troll-sciencetroll-physics)

+1 vote for this one. :D

likelystory

4th February 2011, 09:33 PM

Very Annoying Western-Australian Trollscience (http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/troll-sciencetroll-physics)

Why do you call me annoying.Wouldn't have something to do with me showing you part of the Wind Technology which will change the World as we know it?

Think how much better my machine will spin when I have it balanced with high performance bearings....... I understand torque from a different view,that's how it first started :)

AdMan

4th February 2011, 09:50 PM

Why do you call me annoying.Wouldn't have something to do with me showing you part of the Wind Technology which will change the World as we know it?

This is obvious to everyone else, but part of the reason why it's annoying is because you continually tell us you're going to show us your new technology and after more than 1100 posts in this thread all you've shown us are pinwheels.

I see that you don't disagree with the trollscience bit. That's revealing.

likelystory

4th February 2011, 10:01 PM

This is obvious to everyone else, but part of the reason why it's annoying is because you continually tell us you're going to show us your new technology and after more than 1100 posts in this thread all you've shown us are pinwheels.

I see that you don't disagree with the trollscience bit. That's revealing.

Those pinwheels as you call them will power up the people who want to be independent from the grid. You shouldn't be so quick to judge what you don't know. Apollognomon seen some potential with my current whirly woohoo's,Yet you didn't agree with him. Do you know something extra about my thoughts in regards to my ''undisclosed invention''?

AdMan

4th February 2011, 10:11 PM

Do you know something extra about my thoughts in regards to my ''undisclosed invention''?

Yes; take another look at the troll science (http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/troll-sciencetroll-physics) link.

Sean84

4th February 2011, 11:06 PM

Why do you call me annoying.
"Annoying" referred to "Trollscience". It's both annoying and amusing to watch you defend it like it was the word of God (oh, right... it is, in your mind).

If I were annoyed by you personally I'd just read up on reporting sockpuppets. No big deal.

Wouldn't have something to do with me showing you part of the Wind Technology which will change the World as we know it?
It took you two months to put tape on tubes. I'm not worried about your revolution.

Think how much better my machine will spin when I have it balanced with high performance bearings.......
Taped up tubes are not machines, they are toys. Machines do work. Toys are for trolling.

I understand torque from a different view,that's how it first started :)
Yes, I know. We all know. You delight in the fact that you don't comprehend basic science. It's all God and Obama dying of AIDS and statues getting up and walking around with you. Reality is pretty boring, huh?

likelystory

5th February 2011, 12:45 AM

"Annoying" referred to "Trollscience". It's both annoying and amusing to watch you defend it like it was the word of God (oh, right... it is, in your mind).

If I were annoyed by you personally I'd just read up on reporting sockpuppets. No big deal.

It took you two months to put tape on tubes. I'm not worried about your revolution.

Taped up tubes are not machines, they are toys. Machines do work. Toys are for trolling.

Yes, I know. We all know. You delight in the fact that you don't comprehend basic science. It's all God and Obama dying of AIDS and statues getting up and walking around with you. Reality is pretty boring, huh?

My New VAWT is reality. Guess what,only moments ago I came up with a new improved type of battery which can be POWERED BY THE WIND.Yes it's another new invention on my list. woohoo :)

Mashuna

5th February 2011, 12:54 AM

My New VAWT is reality. Guess what,only moments ago I came up with a new improved type of battery which can be POWERED BY THE WIND.Yes it's another new invention on my list. woohoo :)

I don't think you can call that another invention when you've barely started this one.

likelystory

5th February 2011, 01:05 AM

I don't think you can call that another invention when you've barely started this one.

I went back and tried again and only increased the voltage by 1.2 volts... I take back my woohoo :o

Sean84

5th February 2011, 01:45 AM

My New VAWT is reality. Guess what,only moments ago I came up with a new improved type of battery which can be POWERED BY THE WIND.Yes it's another new invention on my list. woohoo :)

Guess what, I came up with a new improved type of battery, too. It's POWERED BY BEING A *********** POTATO. Yes, it's far superior to whatever you "invented". Yee-haw.

Once I tape some kickass fins to it I'm going to call the patent office before those sneaky Irish bastards can steal my revolutionary new design.

EHocking

5th February 2011, 03:57 AM

... Guess what,only moments ago I came up with a new improved type of batteryNo you didn't, you constructed a salt water battery and took the design off the internet after a Google Search. (http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=saline+battery&meta=#sclient=psy&hl=en&q=salt+water+battery&aq=f&aqi=g-c4g-o1&aql=&oq=&pbx=1&fp=f6054a50dc9cf203) which can be POWERED BY THE WIND.No it is not. It is a chemical reaction, nothing to do with converting or storing energy from a wind turbine.

likelystory

5th February 2011, 04:04 AM

No you didn't, you constructed a salt water battery and took the design off the internet after a Google Search. (http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&q=saline+battery&meta=#sclient=psy&hl=en&q=salt+water+battery&aq=f&aqi=g-c4g-o1&aql=&oq=&pbx=1&fp=f6054a50dc9cf203) No it is not. It is a chemical reaction, nothing to do with converting or storing energy from a wind turbine.

I'm only saying I have come up with a new type of battery which can be powered extra by the wind.

The whirlpool battery.

EHocking

5th February 2011, 04:07 AM

I'm only saying I have come up with a new type of battery which can be powered extra by the wind.I know what you are saying. You are wrong. Not only is it not a battery (it's a generator), you didn't invent it and it does not gain extra power from the wind.

Akhenaten

5th February 2011, 04:13 AM

I'm only saying I have come up with a new type of battery which can be powered extra by the wind.

You haven't shown that you have the necessary knowledge or skills required to build an old type of battery, much less create a new type,

The whirlpool battery.

Utter drivel.

Craig4

5th February 2011, 05:08 AM

I fear this latest one is my fault. I should never have suggested that the bigger problem with wind power is storing it for use in low wind peak consumption hours.

Akhenaten

5th February 2011, 05:20 AM

I fear this latest one is my fault. I should never have suggested that the bigger problem with wind power is storing it for use in low wind peak consumption hours.

Not to worry. It's just another opportunity for the readers to see that likelystory has no basis on which to claim any understanding at all of the generation, storage and distribution of electricity.

Dinwar

5th February 2011, 09:24 AM

My New VAWT is realityNo. Your pinwheels are--but I never doubted you built pinwheels. As I've said before, until you hook this up to a generator, all you have is a pinwheel, whatever the design. And seeing as how you've done no calculations, no measurements, and made no attempt to learn how wind power generation actually works, your statements of the amount of power it'll produce are at minimum overestimates.

Want to prove me wrong? Do the calculations.

Think how much better my machine will spin when I have it balanced with high performance bearings....... Look, the issue you're going to have is Newton's Second Law. You simply cannot generate enough torque with cardboard, cheap plastic, and tape to turn a generator. Before you could generate enough torque your materials would catestrophically fail.

I understand torque from a different view,that's how it first started This is basic math--if it takes five pounds per square inch pressure to break a part of your machine, and ten PSI to turn the magnet, your materials will break before they spin the magnet. This is only exacerbated by the addition of fins, which increases torque and necessarily creates multiple failure points.

I fear this latest one is my fault. I should never have suggested that the bigger problem with wind power is storing it for use in low wind peak consumption hours. No, this is a fair criticism--even if the design DID work it wouldn't replace the power grid for precisely this reason. It's not your fault likelystory is intentionally obtuse.

tsig

5th February 2011, 10:25 AM

Maybe I should keep delaying the knowledge for my own agenda bender ;)

A genda bender? VAWTs cross-dressing as HAWTs? :duck:

likelystory

5th February 2011, 10:59 PM

No. Your pinwheels are--but I never doubted you built pinwheels. As I've said before, until you hook this up to a generator, all you have is a pinwheel, whatever the design. And seeing as how you've done no calculations, no measurements, and made no attempt to learn how wind power generation actually works, your statements of the amount of power it'll produce are at minimum overestimates.

Want to prove me wrong? Do the calculations.

Look, the issue you're going to have is Newton's Second Law. You simply cannot generate enough torque with cardboard, cheap plastic, and tape to turn a generator. Before you could generate enough torque your materials would catestrophically fail.

This is basic math--if it takes five pounds per square inch pressure to break a part of your machine, and ten PSI to turn the magnet, your materials will break before they spin the magnet. This is only exacerbated by the addition of fins, which increases torque and necessarily creates multiple failure points.

No, this is a fair criticism--even if the design DID work it wouldn't replace the power grid for precisely this reason. It's not your fault likelystory is intentionally obtuse.

I'll have to build the super duper New VAWT to show you how it works or say I was BS about it...........

Dinwar

5th February 2011, 11:24 PM

I'll have to build the super duper New VAWT to show you how it works or say I was BS about it........... That basically sums up about 90% of the responses from people to your posts, yes. Put up, or shut up.

There's an easier method for combating this specific complaint (again, that the materials you propose to use won't handle the necessary strains)--find out how much torque is necessary to generate an appreciable amount of power (let's say, enough to run one large appliance, just for a benchmark) and apply that torque to whatever materials you propose to use. See if they survive. Simple, cheap, and easy.

Akhenaten

6th February 2011, 01:54 AM

I'll have to build the super duper New VAWT to show you how it works or say I was BS about it...........

That basically sums up about 90% of the responses from people to your posts, yes. Put up, or shut up.

Not actually having anything to put up should make the choice fairly simple.

There's an easier method for combating this specific complaint (again, that the materials you propose to use won't handle the necessary strains)--find out how much torque is necessary to generate an appreciable amount of power (let's say, enough to run one large appliance, just for a benchmark) and apply that torque to whatever materials you propose to use. See if they survive. Simple, cheap, and easy.

I'd suggest that putting one of those silly toys in an electric blender would provide a reasonably analogous result. As a bonus, posting a picture of the wreckage would serve quite well as a summary of the thread.

likelystory

6th February 2011, 02:56 AM

That basically sums up about 90% of the responses from people to your posts, yes. Put up, or shut up.

There's an easier method for combating this specific complaint (again, that the materials you propose to use won't handle the necessary strains)--find out how much torque is necessary to generate an appreciable amount of power (let's say, enough to run one large appliance, just for a benchmark) and apply that torque to whatever materials you propose to use. See if they survive. Simple, cheap, and easy.

I already have shown you the materials required to withstand the torque....

It's time for some time off from here. bye bye

Sean84

6th February 2011, 02:58 AM

I'll have to build the super duper New VAWT to show you how it works or say I was BS about it...........

Did I miss something?

(Tapeytubestm + Waterbucketpatent pending) / Blender* = perpetual motion machine

What's left?

*Assuming you incorporate Akhenaten's idea into your design

tsig

6th February 2011, 06:37 AM

My New VAWT is reality. Guess what,only moments ago I came up with a new improved type of battery which can be POWERED BY THE WIND.Yes it's another new invention on my list. woohwoo :)

ftfy

Akhenaten

6th February 2011, 06:50 AM

My New VAWT is reality. Guess what,only moments ago I came up with a new improved type of battery which can be POWERED BY THE WIND.Yes it's another new invention on my list. woohwoo :)

ftfy

Not quite good enough to be called woo, I think. Too pathetic to even be called trolling. Just noise.

I seen homemade damp or wet batteries where strips of copper,cotton fabric and galvanized sheeting were rolled up saturated in a saline solution.... Could these form a large scale homemade battery bank Apollognomon?

Dinwar

6th February 2011, 10:58 AM

I already have shown you the materials required to withstand the torque....Bull. You've demonstrated that pinwheels, under zero load, can spin really fast. The Easter decorations at my grandmother's house demonstrate the same thing, with flimsier material. I even know of a paper airplane design that demonstrates that. What you have NOT done is provide any empirical data on your materials under load (meaning an actual turbine or the test I proposed), or shown the calculations you were using to determine the point at which your device would fail. I know this reeks of science to you, and you find the odor of understanding to be repugnant (you've openly stated as much in this thread), but that's what you're going to have to do to convince people.

I'd suggest that putting one of those silly toys in an electric blender would provide a reasonably analogous result. As a bonus, posting a picture of the wreckage would serve quite well as a summary of the thread. Yeah, if nothing else likelystory's refusal to do this demonstrates the lack of actual interest in this. I mean, failure testing is the FUN side of engineering. You get to go out and destroy things! You get to turn a machine into rubble! For SCIENCE! And people respect you MORE for this sort of thing (as always, if done properly). I mean, to all the engineers I know it's like asking a kid to play with a puppy, and then giving the kid ice cream for doing such a good job. I mean for crying out loud, that's the entire premise behind Mythbusters anymore.

ben m

6th February 2011, 03:41 PM

I seen homemade damp or wet batteries where strips of copper,cotton fabric and galvanized sheeting were rolled up saturated in a saline solution.... Could these form a large scale homemade battery bank Apollognomon?

Guess what,only moments ago I came up with a new improved type of battery which can be POWERED BY THE WIND.Yes it's another new invention on my list.

This gives a pretty good picture of LS's psychology. He forms a vague mental picture of a homemade battery. Another part of his brain looks at this picture and says "LOOK, I INVENTED IT".

So "I invented a battery" really means "I heard somewhere that copper and zinc can be a battery. I tried it and voltage came out!" "I invented a VAWT" really means "I heard that VAWTs are good turbines. I built something and it spins in the wind!"

dafydd

6th February 2011, 03:51 PM

likelystory

6th February 2011, 06:34 PM

This gives a pretty good picture of LS's psychology. He forms a vague mental picture of a homemade battery. Another part of his brain looks at this picture and says "LOOK, I INVENTED IT".

So "I invented a battery" really means "I heard somewhere that copper and zinc can be a battery. I tried it and voltage came out!" "I invented a VAWT" really means "I heard that VAWTs are good turbines. I built something and it spins in the wind!"

I never said those things,nor thought those things.Your summary is incorrect.

likelystory

6th February 2011, 06:44 PM

Bull. You've demonstrated that pinwheels, under zero load, can spin really fast. The Easter decorations at my grandmother's house demonstrate the same thing, with flimsier material. I even know of a paper airplane design that demonstrates that. What you have NOT done is provide any empirical data on your materials under load (meaning an actual turbine or the test I proposed), or shown the calculations you were using to determine the point at which your device would fail. I know this reeks of science to you, and you find the odor of understanding to be repugnant (you've openly stated as much in this thread), but that's what you're going to have to do to convince people.

Yeah, if nothing else likelystory's refusal to do this demonstrates the lack of actual interest in this. I mean, failure testing is the FUN side of engineering. You get to go out and destroy things! You get to turn a machine into rubble! For SCIENCE! And people respect you MORE for this sort of thing (as always, if done properly). I mean, to all the engineers I know it's like asking a kid to play with a puppy, and then giving the kid ice cream for doing such a good job. I mean for crying out loud, that's the entire premise behind Mythbusters anymore.

If I was to follow the current method of wind tech,then wind energy will never out perform fossil fuels. My application of wind tech doesn't have the same stress loads....... It's New,that's why you can't get it,so you're wasting your personal engery when getting annoyed or upset at me.

ApolloGnomon

6th February 2011, 08:57 PM

Until you explain or demonstrate this "application" that's "New" everyone here will continue to analyze your gizmo with understanding of prior art. Any method of drawing energy off a rotating object will reduce the kinetic energy of the rotating object. This is why HAWT's are freaking huge, so that they can rotate at low RPM and have tremendous kinetic energy. It's also why the flywheel in a car is so heavy -- when the drivetrain is engaged the flywheel has enough kinetic energy to prevent the engine from stalling. There was an experimental bus in France that ran exclusively on a flywheel. When it came to the station at each end of the route a wheel in the station would spin the flywheel back up to speed and the bus would go on it's merry way.

I don't have an axe to grind here, I would love to see your idea developed. But as far as we can tell you're concept is like the pinwheels on the chimney -- light weigh, spinning in the breeze but unconnected to any real work.

So prove us wrong again. You've shown us your narrow-vane VAWT design, now show us how you can apply load to it without bringing it to a complete halt.

Mr.D

6th February 2011, 09:21 PM

I don't have an axe to grind here

A shame really.

A grinding wheel for an axe would be an excellent tool for demonstrating why angular momentum and torque are more important for some applications (like power generation) than rotational speed.

ApolloGnomon

6th February 2011, 09:29 PM

A shame really.

A grinding wheel for an axe would be an excellent tool for demonstrating why angular momentum and torque are more important for some applications (like power generation) than rotational speed.

smartiepants ;)

Dinwar

6th February 2011, 09:44 PM

If I was to follow the current method of wind tech,then wind energy will never out perform fossil fuels. My application of wind tech doesn't have the same stress loads....... It's New,that's why you can't get it,so you're wasting your personal engery when getting annoyed or upset at me. One simple question for you:

HOW?

As I ahve said a dozen times in this thread, assertions prove nothing. You can call it new all you want--that's not an explination. You can whine that we don't get it all you want--that's not an explination. You can insult us and call us brainwashed all you want--that is not an explination. Until you offer an explination, I for one cannot accept that you've revolutionized anything.

Craig4

7th February 2011, 01:30 AM

Akhenaten

7th February 2011, 01:58 AM

likelystory

7th February 2011, 03:16 AM

Having gone to so much trouble in destroying your own credibility you should be little surprised that it's a summary that will be widely accepted, or that there's now nothing at all you can do about it.

rofl harumph

dafydd

7th February 2011, 03:43 AM

What is "engery" ?

excaza

7th February 2011, 04:59 AM

likelystory

7th February 2011, 10:03 PM

One simple question for you:

HOW?

As I ahve said a dozen times in this thread, assertions prove nothing. You can call it new all you want--that's not an explination. You can whine that we don't get it all you want--that's not an explination. You can insult us and call us brainwashed all you want--that is not an explination. Until you offer an explination, I for one cannot accept that you've revolutionized anything.

The explanation of the ''HOW'' is coming soon in the format of a patent. Then you and the crowd can work out how to improve it or accept that it will work well enough to satisfy 70% to 90% of household requirements and wind farms.

Wouldn't it be funny if you were to build my style of VAWT in the future for your cliental ;)

excaza

7th February 2011, 10:21 PM

You seem to be wildly misinformed about what actually goes into a patent. Or that a patent needs to be something new. A pinwheel isn't new.

Dinwar

7th February 2011, 10:23 PM

Considering my clients care about results, I doubt it'll happen.

And again, you're saying "I have this great new device! It'll change the world! But I won't tell you how it works." Petulant.

likelystory

7th February 2011, 11:05 PM

Considering my clients care about results, I doubt it'll happen.

And again, you're saying "I have this great new device! It'll change the world! But I won't tell you how it works." Petulant.

I googled the word Petulant and your name came up ;) You're famous ;)

I'm joking about your name coming up :)

The taller the VAWT, ( here's a bit of the secret ;) THE LONGER THE VAWT IS ) the more power will be produced to power Cities and Towns and large industries.

Stay :cool: Dinwar ;)

Akhenaten

7th February 2011, 11:27 PM

The explanation of the ''HOW'' is coming soon in the format of a patent. Then you and the crowd can work out how to improve it or accept that it will work well enough to satisfy 70% to 90% of household requirements and wind farms.

Looks like we need to add "How patents work" to the ever-growing list of things you don't understand.

Wouldn't it be funny if you were to build my style of VAWT in the future for your cliental ;)

Wouldn't it be funny if there was such a thing as "cliental"?

Akhenaten

7th February 2011, 11:36 PM

The taller the VAWT, ( here's a bit of the secret ;) THE LONGER THE VAWT IS ) the more power will be produced to power Cities and Towns and large industries.

The longer you make your toys, the faster they will break.

Try this at home, kiddies.

likelystory

8th February 2011, 03:29 AM

Looks like we need to add "How patents work" to the ever-growing list of things you don't understand.

Wouldn't it be funny if there was such a thing as "cliental"?

At least I got the Patent Paperwork http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvtBfDue0Ic

Akhenaten

8th February 2011, 04:15 AM

At least I got the Patent Paperwork http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvtBfDue0Ic

As can anyone in the world with a computer and a printer.

http://www.ipaustralia.gov.au/resources/forms_patents.shtml#application
So?

Sean84

8th February 2011, 04:46 AM

At least I got the Patent Paperwork http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvtBfDue0Ic

Look mate (or whatever you people call each other, I don't pretend to know, fair dinkum didgeridoos, it hardly matters), if you're going to PM me with the exact same nonsense you post in this thread and sign it with a jumbled up "highflyertoo" then you're just plain baiting.

We both know there's no reason for this thread to exist but if you're going to troll, do it properly, or not at all. Are you really so starved for attention because I didn't mock you very much today?

As for your newest video: Who cares? Who *********** cares?

EHocking

8th February 2011, 05:02 AM

At least I got the Patent Paperwork http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pvtBfDue0IcAll you need now is something to patent.

As pointed out to you repeatedly, pages ago, you have nothing to patent.

You have not invented something new, so the only option you have is an "Innovation" patent. Unfortunately, nothing about your pinwheels (or salt water battery) is innovative.

As pointed out to you repeatedly, pages ago, you have nothing to patent.

likelystory

8th February 2011, 05:04 AM

Look mate (or whatever you people call each other, I don't pretend to know, fair dinkum didgeridoos, it hardly matters), if you're going to PM me with the exact same nonsense you post in this thread and sign it with a jumbled up "highflyertoo" then you're just plain baiting.

We both know there's no reason for this thread to exist but if you're going to troll, do it properly, or not at all. Are you really so starved for attention because I didn't mock you very much today?

As for your newest video: Who cares? Who *********** cares?

You could have PM me instead of wasting thread space ;)

Fishstick

8th February 2011, 05:05 AM

So it's now almost two months, and you still haven't filled in a form which would patent a billion-dollar revolutionary idea. What's holding you up?

likelystory

8th February 2011, 05:18 AM

So it's now almost two months, and you still haven't filled in a form which would patent a billion-dollar revolutionary idea. What's holding you up?

I want to see if others can get there first and so change the course of me. I really thought people would have cottoned on by now.

It looks like very soon I will be putting the patent through.

I have been altering my invention over the last month to prevent it from shorting out.

Akhenaten

8th February 2011, 05:31 AM

I want to see if others can get there first and so change the course of me. I really thought people would have cottoned on by now.

Of course we've cottoned on.

We both know there's no reason for this thread to exist but if you're going to troll, do it properly, or not at all. Are you really so starved for attention because I didn't mock you very much today?

You don't really think you're fooling anyone, do you?

It looks like very soon I will be putting the patent through.

As pointed out to you repeatedly, pages ago, you have nothing to patent.

And you never will.

I have been altering my invention over the last month to prevent it from shorting out.

No, you've just been trolling, as you do in all of the threads you start, and as sad and pathetic as it seems, you can't even do that right.

dafydd

8th February 2011, 05:38 AM

So it's now almost two months, and you still haven't filled in a form which would patent a billion-dollar revolutionary idea. What's holding you up?

Reality.

likelystory

8th February 2011, 06:18 AM

All you need now is something to patent.

As pointed out to you repeatedly, pages ago, you have nothing to patent.

You have not invented something new, so the only option you have is an "Innovation" patent. Unfortunately, nothing about your pinwheels (or salt water battery) is innovative.

As pointed out to you repeatedly, pages ago, you have nothing to patent.

I won't be able to prove anything to you and all, because Sean84 is having a melt down of some kind and is going to try and get me banned for a sock report.

But I won't let that stop me from upgrading and completing my New VAWT :)

EHocking

8th February 2011, 06:21 AM

I won't be able to prove anything to you all, because Sean84 is having a melt down of some kind and is going to try and get me banned for a sock report.

But I won't let that stop me from upgrading and completing my New VAWT.You do not have a VAWT.

You have a whirlygig on a chimney.

For this to be a VAWT, it needs to generate electricity. That's what the WT part stands for - Wind Turbine.

Fishstick

8th February 2011, 06:43 AM

I'm going to patent rubbing my feet on a shag carpet while holding copper wire. It's a VAST.

Akhenaten

8th February 2011, 06:44 AM

I won't be able to prove anything to you and all, because Sean84 is having a melt down of some kind and is going to try and get me banned for a sock report.

These ridiculous accusations have nothing to do with your ridiculous claims and will be reported as such.

But I won't let that stop me from upgrading and completing my New VAWT :)

You don't have a VAWT.

Akhenaten

8th February 2011, 06:46 AM

I'm going to patent rubbing my feet on a shag carpet while holding copper wire. It's a VAST.

Cool! Van der graaf of your results is posted I'll comment further.

Sean84

8th February 2011, 07:08 AM

I won't be able to prove anything to you and all, because Sean84 is having a melt down of some kind and is going to try and get me banned for a sock report.

Hmmph... Ask a guy a question and all of a sudden you're being accused of reporting this and melting that. Fair dinkum didgeridoo, I say. And I'll keep saying it 'til I figure out what the hell it means!

But I won't let that stop me from upgrading and completing my New VAWT :)

One word: Speed Holes (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=speed%20holes).

TjW

8th February 2011, 07:17 AM

Well, technically, that's two words. But close enough for the mathematical capabilities of the intended audience.

Akhenaten

8th February 2011, 07:39 AM

Hmmph... Ask a guy a question and all of a sudden you're being accused of reporting this and melting that. Fair dinkum didgeridoo, I say. And I'll keep saying it 'til I figure out what the hell it means!

With the greatest respect to y'all, might I suggest that the most appropriate usage in these circumstances is "Get a clue, didgeridoo!"

:)

Dinwar

8th February 2011, 08:04 AM

I really thought people would have cottoned on by now.

30 pages ago we explained what was necessary to convince us. You have outright refused to provide it. Given that and your gross errors in science and engineering, it's safe to assume you don't know what you're talking about. I'm sorry, does it actually surprise you that people don't believe you?

But I won't let that stop me from upgrading and completing my New VAWTYou'd need to build it in order to upgrade it. Pinwheels=/=VAWTs.

likelystory

8th February 2011, 08:11 AM

30 pages ago we explained what was necessary to convince us. You have outright refused to provide it. Given that and your gross errors in science and engineering, it's safe to assume you don't know what you're talking about. I'm sorry, does it actually surprise you that people don't believe you?

You'd need to build it in order to upgrade it. Pinwheels=/=VAWTs.

It's like the years of prior talking about landing on the moon, no one believed it could be done until it actually happened.

So you saying I don't know much about engineering to build my VAWT is sounding quite naive or ignorant OR you believe that Wind Technology has reached it's limits.

TjW

8th February 2011, 08:27 AM

It's like the years of prior talking about landing on the moon, no one believed it could be done until it actually happened.

So you saying I don't know much about engineering to build my VAWT is sounding quite naive or ignorant OR you believe that Wind Technology has reached it's limits.

That's a goofy statement. Landing on the moon was in large part, a political feat. So a majority of people had to believe it was possible. Everyone knew it was difficult. Few thought it couldn't be done. It was called the "space race" for a time, because people were afraid the Soviet Union would do it first.

Saying you don't know much about engineering is based on your comments here.
Many of the posters here are, at least, aware of the current state of wind power, and where it stands with respect to the theoretical limits. Judging by your comments here, you're not.

If you really are serious about pursuing wind technology, even as a hobby, there's an old engineer's saying that you should heed: "A day in the library can save a month in the lab."

Akhenaten

8th February 2011, 08:30 AM

It's like the years of prior talking about landing on the moon, no one believed it could be done until it actually happened.

Except that it's nothing like that at all.

So you saying I don't know much about engineering to build my VAWT is sounding quite naive or ignorant OR you believe that Wind Technology has reached it's limits.

You haven't displayed enough knowledge about anything to even discuss VAWTs, let alone build one.

Dinwar

8th February 2011, 08:59 AM

So you saying I don't know much about engineering to build my VAWT is sounding quite naive or ignorant OR you believe that Wind Technology has reached it's limits.
Neither is true. Specific questions have been raised about your design, questions about fundamental aspects which would essentially determine whether it would work or not. You have openly declared your refusal to answer those questions. This isn't a question of two people looking at the same data and coming to different conclusions, but rather of you expecting (and leaning heavily towards demanding) that we accept your claims, despite the fact that they contradict all experimental evidence that we've seen, without proof.

excaza

8th February 2011, 09:28 AM

It's like the years of prior talking about landing on the moon, no one believed it could be done until it actually happened.

Except this isn't anything like that.

So you saying I don't know much about engineering to build my VAWT is sounding quite naive or ignorant

You have yet to show that you have even the faintest idea of the engineering required to revolutionize wind power generation. You refuse to provide specifications about your 'turbine,' and intentionally avoid any questions designed to assess the operating capacity and performance of whatever you've build. You've been intentionally misleading, obfuscating, and lying. To turn around and call us naive or ignorant is laughable, given that you've made every effort possible to avoid discussing anything relevant to the grand statement made in your original posts of this thread.

OR you believe that Wind Technology has reached it's limits.

Wind Technology has a limit, defined by the fundamental laws of this universe and explained to you multiple times in this thread. Modern technology isn't close to this limit. You have gone a few millennia backwards in time from this limit.

carlitos

8th February 2011, 09:43 AM

New VAWT http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yngITMZbnQg

I have to admit, the phrase "laugh out loud" is overused, but not here. Epic trolling. You should be in contact with the guy with the rabbits in his apartment who sells the coconut electrical thingies.

Akhenaten

8th February 2011, 10:17 AM

I have to admit, the phrase "laugh out loud" is overused, but not here. Epic trolling. You should be in contact with the guy with the rabbits in his apartment who sells the coconut electrical thingies.

:wackylaugh:

ExtremeSkeptic!

I'd almost forgotten about him. Here's a linky (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=176890).

likelystory

8th February 2011, 10:46 AM

Neither is true. Specific questions have been raised about your design, questions about fundamental aspects which would essentially determine whether it would work or not. You have openly declared your refusal to answer those questions. This isn't a question of two people looking at the same data and coming to different conclusions, but rather of you expecting (and leaning heavily towards demanding) that we accept your claims, despite the fact that they contradict all experimental evidence that we've seen, without proof.

I haven't demanded you to believe,but to consider how a new untapped technology is waiting to surface to the heights of the clouds.

The VAWT's will reach to the heavens (skies).

Dinwar

8th February 2011, 10:58 AM

I haven't demanded you to believe,but to consider how a new untapped technology is waiting to surface to the heights of the clouds.

I have considered it. After a careful evaluation of the evidence I have rejected your claims, and have outlined both my reasoning and what you can do to demonstrate that my conclusion is erronious. This is pretty much a textbook definition of considering a new concept. You don't want that, and have insulted us for doing so. Thus, you do, in fact, want belief.

likelystory

8th February 2011, 11:08 AM

I have considered it. After a careful evaluation of the evidence I have rejected your claims, and have outlined both my reasoning and what you can do to demonstrate that my conclusion is erronious. This is pretty much a textbook definition of considering a new concept. You don't want that, and have insulted us for doing so. Thus, you do, in fact, want belief.

I'm not looking for you to have faith in what I'm saying. Belief only comes from evidence.

I'm only saying to you to consider my New VAWT which could work well enough to replace fossil fuels.As said,the New Tech can replace the current Tech. Your style of wind turbine knowledge could become obsolete within months of my New Vawt design reaching the media.

Dinwar

8th February 2011, 11:16 AM

I'm only saying to you to consider my New VAWT which could work well enough to replace fossil fuels.As said,the New Tech can replace the current Tech. Your style of wind turbine knowledge could become obsolete within months of my New Vawt design reaching the media. As I just explained to you, I HAVE considered it. I have also REJECTED it, which is one of several possible outcomes from consideration of a concept (acceptence, tentative acceptance, rejection, partial rejection, etc). You have provided NO data from which the opinions in the quote can be derived, and therefore they are mere assertions and, as they contradict basically everything I know about physics, both from education and from experience, I am forced to reject your assertions.

If you want me to consider it, I have, you should be satisfied. If you want me to agree with your assessment, I've outlined what you must do in order to convince me. If you want me to agree without proof, you want belief and faith.

dafydd

8th February 2011, 11:16 AM

I haven't demanded you to believe,but to consider how a new untapped technology is waiting to surface to the heights of the clouds.

The VAWT's will reach to the heavens (skies).

I hereby dub you Troll Of The Decade.

excaza

8th February 2011, 11:30 AM

Your style of wind turbine knowledge could become obsolete within months of my New Vawt design reaching the media.

There is no 'style' of wind turbine knowledge. Wind power is, to be honest, an extremely simple application of fluid dynamics. Though airfoil design is extremely important in general, it is much more so for VAWTs due to the axis of their rotation. Because of this, cup style blades (like your pinwheel) are not going to be as efficient as a more traditional airfoil design. Turbine design is not rocket science. The current primary limitation for wind turbines is a combination of costs and material selection. You could make an 800 foot wind turbine, but it's either going to collapse under its own weight or shake itself apart. This is a material problem, not an ideological one.

Your repeated attempts to turn this into an ideological argument (erroneously comparing this to the moon landing, for example) does nothing to detract from the fact that you, quite frankly, have no idea what you're talking about and have no intention of learning, either.

likelystory

8th February 2011, 11:48 AM

There is no 'style' of wind turbine knowledge. Wind power is, to be honest, an extremely simple application of fluid dynamics. Though airfoil design is extremely important in general, it is much more so for VAWTs due to the axis of their rotation. Because of this, cup style blades (like your pinwheel) are not going to be as efficient as a more traditional airfoil design. Turbine design is not rocket science. The current primary limitation for wind turbines is a combination of costs and material selection. You could make an 800 foot wind turbine, but it's either going to collapse under its own weight or shake itself apart. This is a material problem, not an ideological one.

Your repeated attempts to turn this into an ideological argument (erroneously comparing this to the moon landing, for example) does nothing to detract from the fact that you, quite frankly, have no idea what you're talking about and have no intention of learning, either.

Giant Hawt's can not spin fast because of stress loads. So the larger a Hawt's sweep area is the more it has to be slowed down, restricted to a docile rotation.

Where as my New VAWT design can go extremely fast the larger (longer/taller) it gets, and so extract more power from the wind. Don't be surprised when my VAWT's reach 200 feet and are rotating on stormy days at 10,000 to 15,000 rpm's

jsfisher

8th February 2011, 11:53 AM

Giant Hawt's can not spin fast because of stress loads. So the larger a Hawt's sweep area is the more it has to be slowed down, restricted to a docile rotation.

Where as my New VAWT design can go extremely fast the larger (longer/taller) it gets, and so extract more power from the wind. Don't be surprised when my VAWT's reach 200 feet and are rotating on stormy days at 10,000 to 15,000 rpm's

And there we have it folks: The secret to likelystory's incredible new design. Torque be damned! He's got RPM's on his side.

excaza

8th February 2011, 12:04 PM

Dinwar

8th February 2011, 12:13 PM

Are you just picking numbers out of thin air? That's been his MO so far.

I'd also like to point out that if these devices DID reach such velocities they'd fly apart. I've posted at least one video showing a much more well-designed VAWT being destroyed by rotating faster than the device can handle. While I didn't measure it, I seriously doubt it was doing tens of thousands of RPMs. At least one perosn has posted videos of HAWTs being destroyed under similar conditions.

Akhenaten

8th February 2011, 12:16 PM

likelystory

8th February 2011, 12:18 PM

And there we have it folks: The secret to likelystory's incredible new design. Torque be damned! He's got RPM's on his side.

Think of the cake mixer... Bamix can do 12,000 to 19,000 rpm's. Need I say more?

Akhenaten

8th February 2011, 12:24 PM

Think of the cake mixer... Bamix can do 12,000 to 19,000 rpm's. Need I say more?

Yes.

What is the mass of the Bamix's impellor and why is this important?

Dinwar

8th February 2011, 12:26 PM

Think of the cake mixer...Are you implying that a cake mixer will generate power?

likelystory

8th February 2011, 12:32 PM

Are you implying that a cake mixer will generate power?

I'm saying a slim New VAWT (stablized with framework) can spin faster without the stress loads compared to giant fan type hawt's.

Dinwar

8th February 2011, 01:15 PM

I'm saying a slim New VAWT (stablized with framework) can spin faster without the stress loads compared to giant fan type hawt's. Ah. Please provide evidence of that. Thus far, all you've shown is that they can spin faster under zero load.

likelystory

8th February 2011, 01:30 PM

Ah. Please provide evidence of that. Thus far, all you've shown is that they can spin faster under zero load.

You keep saying what I know. Can you explain the term load? Load is old school.............

Craig4

8th February 2011, 01:41 PM

You keep saying what I know. Can you explain the term load? Load is old school.............

Have you powered anything off your device yet?

Dinwar

8th February 2011, 02:06 PM

You keep saying what I know. Can you explain the term load? Load is old school............. Okay. Put simply, your pinwheels aren't connected to anything. That lets a small amount of force generate a large amount of RPMs--there's nothing to slow it down. Think about how many RPMs your cake mixer gets. Once you hook your VAWTs up to a generator, that generator is going to slow it down. The friction, the weight, the torque necessary to spin the magnet, all will come into play, slowing down your pinwheel. The goal of a wind turbine is to generate enough force to spin the magnet at sufficient angular veloceties to generate electricity. Once you hook up a generator to your pinwheel they will NOT spin fast enough. For several reasons. First, they're too small. Second, the materials can't handle the strain. Third, it's been demonstrated earlier in the thread that even if your vastly overstated estimates were accurate they're still too slow to work. Fourth, because by the time your pinwheels DID spin fast enough they'd fly appart (a subset of #2).

tsig

8th February 2011, 02:20 PM

Craig4

8th February 2011, 02:23 PM

tsig

8th February 2011, 02:26 PM

Hmmph... Ask a guy a question and all of a sudden you're being accused of reporting this and melting that. Fair dinkum didgeridoo, I say. And I'll keep saying it 'til I figure out what the hell it means!

One word: Speed Holes (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=speed%20holes).

That would be a pretty good one.

The didgeridoo (also known as a didjeridu or didge) is a wind instrument developed by Indigenous Australians of northern Australia at least 1,500 years ago and is still in widespread usage today both in Australia and around the world. It is sometimes described as a natural wooden trumpet or "drone pipe". Musicologists classify it as a brass aerophone.[1]

I have a friend who plays one

tsig

8th February 2011, 02:31 PM

Have you powered anything off your device yet?

This thread.

excaza

8th February 2011, 05:07 PM

I'm saying a slim New VAWT (stablized with framework) can spin faster without the stress loads compared to giant fan type hawt's.

Can you show us this calculation? The calculation showing that the centripetal force of a 200 foot turbine blade rotating at 15,000 RPM isn't high enough to rip the machine apart?

What material is this 200 foot, 15,000 RPM turbine supposed to be made of, anyway? How is it going to be held together?

Craig4

8th February 2011, 06:05 PM

This thread.

Rim shot please.

Dinwar

8th February 2011, 06:08 PM

What material is this 200 foot, 15,000 RPM turbine supposed to be made of, anyway? How is it going to be held together? So far as I can tell, cardboard tubes, plastic, and Gorilla Glue.

Little 10 Toes

8th February 2011, 06:09 PM

I'm not looking for you to have faith in what I'm saying. Belief only comes from evidence.And so far you are batting 1.000. You haven't given us anything. Correction, you have provided us a video of a "pinwheel*".

I'm only saying to you to consider my New VAWT which could work well enough to replace fossil fuels.As said,the New Tech can replace the current Tech. Your style of wind turbine knowledge could become obsolete within months of my New Vawt design reaching the media. So which is it, a design, or power output.

I have more thoughts, but I am too tired to continue.

* I am labeling it a "pinwheel" not because it is shaped like a traditional pinwheel, but because it spins under no load. To me, it looks like a paper towel tube with some modified Venetian blinds attached to it. Instead of the traditional ( shape, it looks like you have a < shape for the blinds.

ApolloGnomon

8th February 2011, 06:31 PM

You keep saying what I know. Can you explain the term load? Load is old school.............

Are you pretending to be this ignorant? I have a hard time believing you're really this innocent of basic knowledge.

ApolloGnomon

8th February 2011, 06:32 PM

Rim shot please.

http://instantrimshot.com/

likelystory

8th February 2011, 11:02 PM

So far as I can tell, cardboard tubes, plastic, and Gorilla Glue.

They are not cardboard tubes.They are PVC plastic tubes,they are water proof.

likelystory

8th February 2011, 11:07 PM

Can you show us this calculation? The calculation showing that the centripetal force of a 200 foot turbine blade rotating at 15,000 RPM isn't high enough to rip the machine apart?

What material is this 200 foot, 15,000 RPM turbine supposed to be made of, anyway? How is it going to be held together?

I retract the statement of 15,000 rpm's, more like 5000 rpm's maximum.

excaza

8th February 2011, 11:30 PM

I retract the statement of 15,000 rpm's, more like 5000 rpm's maximum.

The question still stands.

rdrast

9th February 2011, 03:48 AM

likelystory

9th February 2011, 05:32 AM

I'm still waiting on the generator/alternator design.
It will be absolutely fascinating to see a multi-magnitude improvement of technology that has essentially remained the same since the mid 1830's (not for lack of trying though).

It ain't nothing special.

It's something that has been overlooked because of it's simplicity.

I won't be asking for bragging rights because it not worthy to boast about.

Akhenaten

9th February 2011, 05:43 AM

It ain't nothing special.

Just "It ain't" would have sufficed.

It's something that has been overlooked because of it's simplicity.

And yet you are totally unable to explain it.

And don't start spouting that nonsense about needing to patent the idea first in case someone steals it. It sounded idiotic the first time you tried it and repetition hasn't improved the situation.

I won't be asking for bragging rights because it not worthy to boast about.

Bragging rights? If you had any hope at all of one day trying to establish some credibility you'd be hoping that this thread, and indeed all of your childish scribblings, would somehow magically disappear forever.

skip

9th February 2011, 06:09 AM

It's like the years of prior talking about landing on the moon, no one believed it could be done until it actually happened.

.

(My bold.)

Excuse my intrusion on this lively discussion, and this slight derail.

Are you now saying that you do in fact believe that the moon landings actually happened, and men did in fact land on the moon?

Craig4

9th February 2011, 06:24 AM

Dude, go away, power something with your machine and come back.

Fishstick

9th February 2011, 07:00 AM

Dude, go away, power something with your machine and come back.

If he powers a fan with his wind turbine, he might just invent some form of machine that's in motion. But then perpetually.

Dinwar

9th February 2011, 08:05 AM

They are not cardboard tubes.They are PVC plastic tubes,they are water proof. Okay. What amount of torque can PVC handle? The answer for Gorilla Glue is "Not much"--the stuff bubbles like crazy when you use it, making all KINDS of weak points.

It ain't nothing special.

It's something that has been overlooked because of it's simplicity.

So explain it to us. It's been over 30 pages.

Little 10 Toes

9th February 2011, 09:58 AM

It's a new motor

That's where the extra 10+ fold power comes from.

Remember saying this? You've posted a video of your pinwheel, why not show it connected to the motor?

likelystory

9th February 2011, 10:33 AM

Remember saying this? You've posted a video of your pinwheel, why not show it connected to the motor?

Can't do it as yet,impatience is a virtue when starved :)

phunk

9th February 2011, 11:00 AM

I retract the statement of 15,000 rpm's, more like 5000 rpm's maximum.

I'll assume you meant a 200ft diameter, not radius (it's even worse the other way). By my calculation, at 5000rpm that is an acceleration 240 times the earth's gravity at the tip of the blades. What do you plan on building this out of?

likelystory

9th February 2011, 11:18 AM

I'll assume you meant a 200ft diameter, not radius (it's even worse the other way). By my calculation, at 5000rpm that is an acceleration 240 times the earth's gravity at the tip of the blades. What do you plan on building this out of?

The length is to be 200 ft.

ApolloGnomon

9th February 2011, 12:54 PM

The length is to be 200 ft.

By "length" I'm guessing you're referring to the vertical dimension of your installed item. This creates more problems (engineering challenges) than it solves, solving any of which will lead to further engineering challenges.

1) wind speed is different at different heights, leading to torsional stresses on your vanes, axis, and mounting points between them.

2) lightweight materials such as the fluted polypropylene you are currently using are readily available in 8 foot x 4 foot sheets (metric equivalents outside US). This means you're going to be mechanically joining the sheetgoods into longer strips, or attaching the available lengths to a support piece.

The above two challenges could be tackled by stacking shorter VAWT modules on one pole, each of which rotates separately of the others. Of course, you have to cable down from the top unit and every unit below, leading to a massive bundle of copper inside your mast. You might need to calculate voltage drop for wire and see if 200' gains you more than you lose.

3) 200 feet of any material, even structural steel, has a great deal of flexibility. That thing's gonna bend like cooked spaghetti. Even with guy wires I don't know how you're going to get it to support it's own weight using lightweight materials.

4) Remember the numbers I posted for the bamboo turbine mast you claimed was strapped to the electric recumbent you claimed to have seen? Leverage of a 200' pipe even with out any vanes on it will require some massive support to keep it from falling over in the wind.

You've said something several times about footprint, but I don't think you realize how much footprint guy wires actually require. They seem insubstantial, but if you've ever worked around a guyed mast of any kind (I've dodged the wires for oe 254 antennas - only about 20' tall) you'd know that they spread out to cover quite a bit of landscape.

A Laughing Baby

9th February 2011, 01:08 PM

Dinwar

9th February 2011, 02:01 PM

2) lightweight materials such as the fluted polypropylene you are currently using are readily available in 8 foot x 4 foot sheets (metric equivalents outside US). This means you're going to be mechanically joining the sheetgoods into longer strips, or attaching the available lengths to a support piece.

You can get PVC pipe in 20' lengths (2" PVC is what most monitoring well casings are made out of). Anyone who's ever dealt with these knows that they won't help likelystory out any--they bend WAY too much to be useful in a vertical above-ground structure--but they do exist.

Even with guy wires Where's he going to PUT the guy wires? The thing spins--it's impossible to put a stablization wire on a spinning structure.

excaza

9th February 2011, 03:52 PM

I was ignoring it earlier, but I suppose I should ask how you're going to get the thing moving at 5000 RPM without a motor.

likelystory

9th February 2011, 08:58 PM

That's how he originally left this board. He got fed up when people didn't believe in his magic and demanded that all of his threads and posts be deleted and his account unregistered. When he saw that only the latter was going to happen he wanted his account reinstated and this happened (http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?p=4668332).

Pretty peculiar indeed.

Considering you spent two months trolling and only put tape to tube once people were completely fed up with you there is absolutely no reason to believe you ever even had a concept for your magical new motor to begin with.

And if you do then there is absolutely no reason to believe it is anything more exciting than your pinwheel or "whirlpool battery".

There is every reason to believe that you will only do the bare minimum necessary to keep the farce alive while you get drunk and watch youtube videos, occasionally dicking around in your shed or printing out a form.

Somehow you have managed to be just as incompetent with concepts that have a basis in reality as you have been with delusions that exist solely in your own mind. As such, I probably shouldn't have bothered to write all this and instead said something witty about starving trolls.

Oh well, the damage is done.

I am not a troll as you believe.

I do have the invention in my head to make it happen. Believe it or not,but you have already seen a ''small part'' of my invention.

excaza

9th February 2011, 09:13 PM

I am not a troll as you believe.

I do have the invention in my head to make it happen. Believe it or not,but you have already seen a ''small part'' of my invention.

Keep trying. You haven't invented anything.

likelystory

9th February 2011, 11:13 PM

Where's he going to PUT the guy wires? The thing spins--it's impossible to put a stablization wire on a spinning structure.

No it's not immpossible....... I will draw a diagram to show you how to overcome this minor issue ;).......

I worked it out months ago when thinking how to stablize 1000 footers.I was wandering about the City and sat on a public bench gazing into the night sky and then it dawned on me.

Sean84

9th February 2011, 11:44 PM

I am not a troll as you believe.

I do have the invention in my head to make it happen. Believe it or not,but you have already seen a ''small part'' of my invention.

O frabjous day! Callooh! Callay! I'm all atwitter to have seen such a "small part" of something so undoubtedly "astounding".

No it's not immpossible....... I will draw a diagram to show you how to overcome this minor issue ;).......

I worked it out months ago when thinking how to stablize 1000 footers.I was wandering about the City and sat on a public bench gazing into the night sky and then it dawned on me.

How very trollish.

Just break out the crayolas and do it.

likelystory

10th February 2011, 01:48 AM

You can get PVC pipe in 20' lengths (2" PVC is what most monitoring well casings are made out of). Anyone who's ever dealt with these knows that they won't help likelystory out any--they bend WAY too much to be useful in a vertical above-ground structure--but they do exist.

Where's he going to PUT the guy wires? The thing spins--it's impossible to put a stablization wire on a spinning structure.

I sent this video to you in a PM before posting it here. It's how outer bearings would solve the stability concern ;) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tGhSEfiKSM

rdrast

10th February 2011, 03:55 AM

tsig

10th February 2011, 04:01 AM

It ain't nothing special.

It's something that has been overlooked because of it's simplicity.

I won't be asking for bragging rights because it not worthy to boast about.

Then why did you start this thread to brag about it?

likelystory

10th February 2011, 05:00 AM

I can't post links yet, but this is an example of the lightest windload 200 foot monopole installation I could find. Better stock up on those bearings! (And figure out some way to keep them greased... those aren't 5000 rpm bearings to begin with).

www urbanohio com/forum2/index.php?topic=22887.0

Did you understand the ''outer bearing principal'' to stablize the tall structure?

Of course from the start I have stated I would have to use better quality bearings.

So has my Video shown you how to avoid the use of guy wires? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tGhSEfiKSM

Hellbound

10th February 2011, 05:21 AM

You know, when I first opened this thread to read, I had very low expectations.

Now, I have to say, likelystory has met all of my expectations so far.

Oh, sorry, this was supposed to go into the "Polite Insults" thread in Community...

Akhenaten

10th February 2011, 05:29 AM

Did you understand the ''outer bearing principal'' to stablize the tall structure?

You don't appear to, and it's your idea. What hope does anyone else have?

Of course from the start I have stated I would have to use better quality bearings.

Utterly irrelevant. You'd be said to be gilding the lily, if only you had a lily.

So has my Video shown you how to avoid the use of guy wires?

It's gibberish, so no.

likelystory

10th February 2011, 05:38 AM

You don't appear to, and it's your idea. What hope does anyone else have?

Utterly irrelevant. You'd be said to be gilding the lily, if only you had a lily.

It's gibberish, so no.

Engineer's will disagree against you. The outer bearings are the means for taller VAWT's.

You can't even explain why the outer bearings wouldn't work :)

Mashuna

10th February 2011, 06:04 AM

You can't even explain why the outer bearings wouldn't work :)

That's easy. The outer bearings won't work because you don't have a VAWT and no chance of building a proper one.

Akhenaten

10th February 2011, 06:29 AM

Engineer's will disagree against you. The outer bearings are the means for taller VAWT's.

We engineers often disagree amongst ourselves, but I'm fairly sure you'll find us to be fairly unanimous in our opinion of your silly toys.

You can't even explain why the outer bearings wouldn't work :)

I most certainly can, but frankly I think it would be much more fun to see you actually try and build this misbegotten monstrosity.

likelystory

10th February 2011, 07:37 AM

We engineers often disagree amongst ourselves, but I'm fairly sure you'll find us to be fairly unanimous in our opinion of your silly toys.

I most certainly can, but frankly I think it would be much more fun to see you actually try and build this misbegotten monstrosity.

Then show them the Video I made today describing how outer bearings at 40 foot intervals with steel or metal rods attached to the outer bearings, with framework fasten to those steel rods.

Here's the video to prove my theory based on engineering fact :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tGhSEfiKSM